Transcript

Aaron (0:00)

This Dirt Talk podcast episode is with Breck Goen of Hammer. Breck is the CEO of Hammer, a construction, payroll, HR and OPS platform built specifically for contractors. After spending his childhood growing up around a residential construction business, he moved to San Francisco on a whim to better serve contractors like his parents. After a few years of listening to the industry, he's honed in on payroll as a huge pain point. Breck and I first connected years ago. He was running a Instagram page for home builders. I was running an Instagram page for civil contractors. So, of course, lots in common there. We loved what each other was doing. No mention of software for either one of us at this time. Then, few years pass, we start to go off on similar but totally different paths within the technology space, within the construction industry. He has since pivoted substantially, and we have since pivoted substantially. So it was a ton of fun to sit down with him and talk. The trials, tribulations were similar age in similar industries, serving these industries in similar ways. It's just a blast to sit around and hear about what he has going on. So I. I hope you enjoy this conversation as much as I did. Let's get to it. Being in Nashville has been good, too, because a lot of people, they'll bring, like, their spouse with them for the weekend. So I do a lot of. I'll do a lot of episodes on, like, Fridays, so they'll come in in the morning, and I'll go to dinner with them and their spouse, and then they go out and, you know, they'll stay downtown and have a good time away from the kids.

Breck Goen (1:55)

That hell. It was great last night.

Aaron (1:57)

It was really good. Yeah.

Breck Goen (1:58)

Big fan.

Aaron (1:59)

Yeah, yeah, yeah. There's some good spots. There's some good spots. Not many, but a few.

Breck Goen (2:04)

I mean, you're not a barbecue fan of In Nashville.

Aaron (2:06)

I think it's totally over.

Breck Goen (2:07)

I thought that I was like, I don't know what Aaron's sipping on these.

Aaron (2:11)

Days, but I. I gave it a shot. And then I went to, like, one of the most popular barbecue places, if not the most popular one in town. And when I finally went to it, I was like, it's not that good. I don't know. Like, it's definitely no Austin. I mean, Austin, I feel like, is just the undisputed.

Breck Goen (2:34)

Summary

Dirt Talk by BuildWitt

Episode: Brek Goen w/ Hammr – DT 380

Date: October 9, 2025
Host: Aaron Witt (BuildWitt)
Guest: Breck Goen (CEO, Hammr)

Episode Overview

In this episode, Aaron Witt sits down with Breck Goen, CEO of Hammr, a purpose-built construction payroll, HR, and operations platform. The two entrepreneurs trace their intersecting journeys from construction family backgrounds to tech founders focused on solving real world pains for the Dirt World. The conversation delves into the realities of entrepreneurship, the messy evolution from Instagram community-building to building software, the value and caveats of college, the importance of grit and intrinsic motivation, recruiting the next construction workforce, the social and emotional realities of jobsite life, and how serving the industry means never losing sight of the people at its center.

Insightful, raw, and peppered with humor and unfiltered realities, this episode is ideal for anyone interested in the construction industry, technology entrepreneurship, or the human side of building great things.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Shared Backgrounds and Early Days (00:00–17:00)

Construction Roots:
Both Aaron and Breck grew up around construction—Aaron with family friends in the industry, Breck in a family drywall business in Spokane, Washington.
Breck: "My grandfather was a logger… then into drywall. I was showing up on jobs at six. My dad said, 'If they give you shit, they like you.'" (15:02)
Gym Talk & Grit:
Gym culture at big universities, being the underdog, learning discipline through fitness.

2. College: Value, Pressure, & Alternatives (17:00–29:30)

Pressure to Attend:
Both attended college (“like fifth to sixth grade,” Aaron), but with a sense of inevitability rather than passion.
Benefits vs. Criticisms:
College as time to experiment and grow, but not always for everyone—strong arguments on both sides.
Aaron: “College gives you four years of just risk-free life…to experiment, make stupid mistakes, and to figure out who the fuck you are.” (21:45)
Family Entrepreneurship:
Despite degree paths, both felt pulled toward entrepreneurship due to multigenerational examples.

3. Entrepreneurship: Myth vs. Reality (29:30–46:00)

Ownership Kool-Aid:
The rise in glorifying entrepreneurship parallels society’s previous messaging on college, but isn’t right for everyone. Aaron: “Most people want a nice family, nice house, weekends free... That doesn’t happen here [with startups] for a very long time. And even when it does, it's kind of up.” (29:29)
Sacrifice & Calling:
The founders get raw about personal costs—relationships, family estrangement, apartment-living well into adulthood. Aaron: “You can’t outrun who you’re supposed to be.” (45:10)
Are Entrepreneurs Born or Made?
Blend of foundational personality traits and environmental exposure; execution and the pursuit of being better matter most (46:23–47:21).

4. Early Career, Social Media, and Building Community (78:08–94:09)

Instagram Origins:
Both started with niche construction-focused Instagram accounts (Builders of Insta for Breck, Daily Construction for Aaron).
- Used resharing to create value and spark conversations.
- Led to in-person events and deeper networking.
Solving Real Industry Problems:
Breck leveraged the following to build a job-matching platform for tradespeople—learning firsthand about platform distribution, audience overlap, and the challenge of building a business model in a fragmented industry.
- Importance of “domain expertise” and truly understanding your end-user.

5. Pivot to Payroll & Y Combinator (106:51–116:26)

Discovery Mode:
Downfall of prior model led Breck and Hammr to discover payroll pain as a widespread, acute issue, surfacing during a deep dive with a contractor’s overwhelmed office manager. Breck: "One conversation kind of changed everything... She was doing prevailing wage paperwork by hand–her mom was helping weekly. I asked, ‘Do other people have this problem?’"
Focus on Solving the Mundane:
Transitioned Hammr to focus on streamlining payroll, prevailing wage, and the operations headaches unique to construction.
- Pre-sold 5–7 customers before building product—vital for both YC acceptance and business validation.
Lessons Learned:
The value of transparency, iterative learning, and putting customer need and feedback above ego.

6. Making Construction Better (126:09–127:35)

Unchanged Mission, Messy Methods:
Both founders have shifted tactics and products, but maintained the core goal of improving the industry.
- “Have we made mistakes? Sure. But we’ve always been 100% dedicated to making the world better.”
Advice:
Fall in love not with the product or idea, but with serving the customer and industry’s needs.

7. Jobsite Culture: Recruiting, Pride, and Mental Health (50:35–147:00)

Work-Life Integration and Growing Up in the Trades:
- Jobsite daycare, intergenerational pride, and how young exposure shapes future careers.
Overthinking Recruiting:
The industry is struggling to recruit the next generation, but Breck and Aaron recall that just getting kids around jobsites is often enough to inspire passion. Aaron: "It's not hard. That's how I got into it. That's how a lot of people got into it." (54:06)
The “Safety Regime” and Modern Barriers:
Societal, legal, and social trends have made it harder for kids to have the early access prior generations took for granted.
On Tough Love Culture vs. Toxicity:
Camaraderie and play make hard labor tolerable, but tradition can tip into destructive hazing or exclusion.
- “Do we have to treat people like shit while doing hard work?” (61:00)
Ownership, Humility, and Supporting Workers:
The importance of employers addressing employees as whole humans—mental health, financial literacy, family stresses—rather than cogs on a payroll.
- Call out to companies like K&L Industries and Sergeant for meaningful, practical support of team members.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

Entrepreneurial Reality Check
Aaron (29:29):
“Most people want a nice family, nice house, weekends free... That doesn’t happen here [with startups] for a very long time. And even when it does, it's kind of up.”
Pride in Hard Work
Aaron (64:13):
“You don’t walk into the country club and feel a sense of pride... In construction, you get it. On average. Which is amazing.”
On Building Something Meaningful
Breck (130:56):
“You get an email...‘I got my nights back.’ That’s freaking cool to us.”
On Being True to Yourself
Aaron (35:50):
“If you’re really behaving in accordance to who you are, it’s not a choice. You have to find it. Once you find it, you’ve got to run with it.”
Parenting & Legacy
Breck (50:35):
“My dad worked weekends, still picked me up from school, never missed a basketball game. That’s something I want to carry into my future family.”
Mental Health in Construction
Aaron (136:32):
“If a guy comes to the jobsite and his wife said, ‘We’re getting a divorce,’ is he in a productive, safe mental state? Probably not. Should there be room for that conversation? Absolutely.”

Timestamps for Key Segments

00:00 – Episode intro; Aaron and Breck’s backgrounds, Nashville & food talk
15:00 – Family construction business stories, learning the trades young
17:10 – Debate: College’s benefits and pitfalls, family expectations
29:30 – Entrepreneurship: reality vs. myth, sacrifices, and finding “your thing”
46:00 – Are entrepreneurs born or made?
78:08 – The rise of construction Instagram, networking, and real-world problem-finding
94:09 – Transition to Hammr: learning from failed job-matching and Instagram as distribution engine
106:51 – Pivot to payroll: discovering the pain point and building iterative solutions
126:09 – Sticking to the mission of serving the industry even as the company pivots
133:42 – Mental health and support: how companies can create environments where workers thrive

Conclusion

This episode is an unvarnished deep dive into what it takes to build something that matters for the Dirt World. Breck and Aaron don’t sugarcoat the pain, loose ends, or the pressure to look the part; they focus on real service, finding your lane, and putting grit and humility to work. With plenty of laughs, stories, and practical philosophy, it's an invigorating listen for anyone wrestling with purpose and progress in the trades, construction technology, or entrepreneurial life.

Find Breck and Hammr:

Hammr (no "e")
Search "Bred to Build" podcast
@buildersofinsta

Find Aaron and BuildWitt:

buildwitt.com
@buildwitt on Instagram

For more discussions like this, check out the full Dirt Talk podcast archive.

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Brek Goin w/ Hammr – DT 380