DIRT TALK PODCAST SUMMARY

Podcast: Dirt Talk by BuildWitt
Host: Aaron Witt (A)
Guest: Joel McKee, McKee Construction (B)
Episode: DT 404
Release Date: January 1, 2026

EPISODE OVERVIEW

This episode features a candid, wide-ranging conversation between host Aaron Witt and Joel McKee, founder of McKee Construction. Joel shares his journey from Mississippi logging through real estate and into civil construction, emphasizing lessons learned, struggle and growth in business, and the vital importance of leadership, physical discipline, and transparency. Together, they reflect on industry mental health, hard-learned lessons from challenging projects, and why real talk is essential for meaningful progress in the dirt world.

KEY DISCUSSION POINTS & INSIGHTS

1. Personal Discipline, Routine, and Fitness

• 75 Hard & Personal Habits: Both Aaron and Joel value daily routines and personal discipline.

  • Aaron discusses his adoption of daily fitness and mental improvement routines, influenced by programs like 75 Hard.
    • “I’m a big believer in doing work every day...I train every day, and people are like, ‘What are you training for?’ I’m just training for life, man.” (06:22, A)
  • Joel shares his struggle to maintain personal fitness habits during business hardship and how he’s returning to that discipline.
    • “My discipline of working out every single morning...I let my mind, I guess, get the best of me. So I’m just now getting back into it.” (12:39, B)

• Building Mental Resilience: Both relate daily workouts and challenges (running, rucking) to maintaining mental health and leadership ability.

  • “If I don’t get it out, I would be a total piece of... I mean, really, I’d be a terrible person if I wasn’t exercising.” (07:01, A)
  • “The more you work out, you keep that competitive nature. Your mind’s more focused. And so that's where I'm trying to get back to...” (15:25, B)

2. Transparency, Leadership & Mental Health in Construction

• Responsibility Starts With The Individual:

  • Aaron is working on framing leadership talks to focus less on companies and more on the individual.
    • “The success of your company really comes down to you as an individual...if you’re not doing the shit you need to be doing, your company is limited.” (10:23, A)
  • They discuss how caring for oneself physically and mentally is foundational for leading others.
    • “You need to love yourself before you can love your neighbor. Are we loving ourselves?” (12:08, A)

• The “Talk” vs. The Work on Mental Health:

  • Addressing the “suicide epidemic,” both lament that the industry often talks about mental health but doesn’t act.
    • “Everybody’s saying, we need to talk about it, and then that’s it...if you're not going to do anything after that, then it's almost worse to say that.” (16:14, A)
    • The most effective approach is vulnerability and sharing personal stories: “Here’s what I had to do to get out of it...That’s been way more effective in talking with people.” (17:03, A)

3. Joel’s Mississippi Roots: Logging, Real Estate, and Pivot to Dirt Work

• Family Logging Business: Joel describes growing up in the South and spending time in his family’s pine logging business.

  • Memories of learning to run equipment as a child (“dig a hole, then fill it back in”) highlight early exposure and love for hard work. (26:00-28:00)

• Real Estate Lessons: Joel pivoted from logging to real estate, focused on selling undeveloped recreation/hunting land, but disliked the “sales mentality.”

  • “I wasn’t someone that was going to go out there and just push something on people...I didn’t enjoy the sales mentality.” (25:39, B)
  • Side projects developing land rekindled his appreciation for “hard work.”

• Jump to Construction:

  • When an opportunity arose to partner with an experienced dirtwork operator, Joel dove into the civil industry, learning through hands-on experience.
  • “We didn’t say no to nothing...We were just like Tasmanian devil, just blowing through stuff...we were able to pay our bills and just kept on growing.” (43:07, B)

4. Lessons in Business: Tough Jobs, Culture, and Growth

• Early Struggles & Learning Through Mistakes

  • Joel recounts how McKee Construction’s rapid growth meant learning business, estimating, and operations on the fly, especially during the early COVID-19 shutdown (45:00-46:00).
  • When facing a disastrous job (which required redoing completed work under tight conditions), the lack of process, experience, and right people became painfully costly.
    • “We learned that we didn’t have the processes in place...If we had the right people that would have asked the right questions before we ever kicked off, we would have avoided 90% of this.” (55:15, B)
  • The trauma of a bad job and how the experience, though costly, provides the foundation for future growth:
    • “That's just part of the learning curve as a contractor, you’ve got to have a job like that where you lose your ass.” (59:12, A)
    • “We'll always remember that. We're gonna put something up to memorialize this job in our office. May we never forget.” (61:02, B)

• Culture & People First:

  • Discussion of crew dynamics highlights that a high-performing team isn’t about credentials or where you come from, but hard work and the right attitude.
    • “This world is spectacular because it doesn’t give a shit who you are, where you’re from, what your education level is...Here, it doesn’t matter. It just matters how much you put in.” (35:29, A)
  • Joel’s focus for 2026 is on developing his people: “Our goal...is to help them know that when they're talking to anybody, they can say without a shadow of a doubt that we're their biggest fan.” (86:59, B)
  • Challenge: when leaders get stuck in “survival mode,” people suffer from absence and neglect.
    • “Everyone wants to grow, be poured into. When that's not happening, it hurts. And that’s the trap I’ve fallen into.” (88:13, A)

5. Industry Pain Points: Estimating, Cash Flow, and Contracts

• Bid/Win Ratio & Estimating: Both voice how demoralizing and relentless the bid process can be, estimating far more work than won.
  • “You work like four weeks on something...you get third, and then you throw everything in the fucking trash can and Monday starts over.” (52:26, A)
• Cash Flow Stress: GC and owner payment practices mean small contractors like McKee often front project costs, essentially financing work for powerful clients.
  • “As a contractor, you’re also a banker...you’re sitting there waiting for a pay app to go through. Like, you’re what, 90 days in at this point.” (47:00, A)
• Contracts as Legal Minefields:
  • “I mean, this one right here was a 298-page contract...they just hide every little thing in there.” (67:12, B)
  • The legal environment means blame often flows “downhill” to the subcontractor who signed, no matter how unreasonable.
• Healthy Relationships in Construction:
  • Joel notes how prompt, fair-paying GCs earn loyalty: “When you come to [this contractor], you turn in your payout in 15 days, you’re paid...everybody’s beating down the doors to work for that contractor.” (47:26, B)

6. The Value of Transparency and Real Storytelling

• Rejecting the “Perpetual Success” Facade:
  • Both Aaron and Joel critique the LinkedIn culture of only sharing good news. They argue for more honest accounts of struggle and failure as both necessary and cathartic.
    • “Everybody’s making it seem like everything's just awesome all the time...Am I the only jackass here? Like, am I the only guy that can't figure this out?” (75:19, A)
    • “Whenever I do post something, it'll be just something real...I don't want everybody just to think I'm falling into the trap of everybody else just posting just what good goes on.” (76:46, B)
• Summit/Conference Takeaways:
  • Both men praise talks by other contractors (esp. Ryan Schmidt) who openly shared business failures and recovery.
    • “Ryan was most helpful for me for the stage that I was in...There is life on the other side of this thing, and we're past it now.” (80:05, B)
    • “He’s a great example...because they have the mentality that we’re all in this together.” (82:08, A)

MEMORABLE MOMENTS & QUOTES (WITH TIMESTAMPS)

• “If I don’t do something every day, I’m gonna go insane. I’m gonna be an absolute animal.” (06:22, A)
• “Your neighbor is first in that phrase...but it’s no, no, no, no, no. You need to love yourself before you can love your neighbor.” (12:08, A)
• “It’s the actions that matter. Well, instead, what are you doing with your time?” (16:49, B)
• “We didn't say no to nothing...We'll figure out how to do it later. That's how we just grew.” (43:05, B)
• “We learned lessons. Understatement.” (54:01, B)
• “If we would have asked the right questions, that would have been a huge start...now we ask it on every job.” (55:15, B)
• “We’re back. We’re back. We’re back in the saddle, man.” (69:02, B)
• “Everybody is kind of like a child. Like, we all want to feel important...when that's not happening, it hurts.” (88:13, A)
• “We're so transparent with it...We're not, we don't have anything to hide.” (83:02, B)

TIMESTAMPED SEGMENT GUIDE

• 00:09-03:00 – Fitness & 75 Hard; Discipline and routine, impact on travel and hydration
• 04:06-07:34 – Mental discipline, daily training, how working out affects leadership and focus
• 11:01-13:16 – Leadership starts with individual discipline; mental health as company foundation; Joel’s struggle to maintain discipline in tough times
• 16:08-18:35 – Industry talk on mental health vs. real action; importance of vulnerability
• 19:46-31:02 – Joel’s background; Mississippi roots, logging, and learning about hard work
• 31:02-34:00 – Real estate to dirt work; discovering value of “hard work” through land development
• 43:00-47:00 – Starting McKee Construction; learning by doing, bidding, and growing fast
• 46:43-55:45 – Cash flow, contract pitfalls, breakdown of disastrous job (“turkey job”)
• 55:45-61:13 – Lessons learned: poor processes, asking right questions, value of transparency
• 69:00-74:26 – Recovering post-bad job; restoring culture, “roller coaster” of leadership emotions
• 75:17-78:33 – Social media inauthenticity; need for real talk about struggle
• 80:05-84:49 – Summit/conference takeaways; practicing people-first leadership
• 86:59-91:02 – Looking forward: developing people, appreciating crews, staying focused on growth

FINAL NOTES

The episode is a masterclass in honest, boots-on-the-ground leadership in the civil construction field. Both Aaron and Joel model vulnerability, advocate for self-discipline as essential for effective leadership, and stress that real talk—not polished LinkedIn feeds—drives the industry forward. Their stories of mistakes, recovery, and the everyday grind offer encouragement and practical wisdom for anyone working to build something real, in dirt or otherwise.