Episode Overview

Episode 142: FLASHBACK — AuDHD Burnout City: How Autistic and ADHD Burnout Collide and Compensate
Podcast: Divergent Conversations
Host(s): Megan Anna Neff & Patrick Casale
Date: January 23, 2026

In this reflective and highly candid episode, neurodivergent therapists Megan Anna Neff and Patrick Casale dive into the complex topic of "AuDHD" (Autistic and ADHD) burnout. Drawing on their personal and clinical experiences, they explore how autistic and ADHD burnout co-occur, overlap, and sometimes compensate for each other—and why recovery can feel so elusive for those with both neurotypes. Through humor, metaphor, and vulnerability, they share lived realities, new insights, and tangible self-care strategies that might resonate with anyone navigating the bumpy terrain of burnout.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

Defining & Differentiating Burnout (03:00–08:50)

• Lack of Research & Language

  • There are far more studies on autistic burnout than on ADHD burnout, but both are frequently discussed in ND communities.
  • ADHD burnout often gets less formal recognition but is felt just as intensely ("...for a lot of us who do identify as AuDHD or autistic and adhd, it's a real experience." – Patrick, 02:40).

• ADHD Burnout: Executive Function Breakdown

  • ADHD burnout shows up as a dramatic increase in executive functioning struggles: missed appointments, forgotten tasks, and growing shame spirals.
  • “When our executive functioning struggles, then...everything gets harder because I'm missing things and I've got shame about it.” (Megan, 04:49)

• The ADHD–Depression Loop

  • ADHD burnout often leads down a pathway toward depression, where the collapse of executive function triggers shame and then depressive symptoms.
  • “What we need to help support us getting out of burnout requires energy…” (Megan, 06:21).

The Push-Pull of AuDHD Burnout (08:50–12:42)

• When Compensation Becomes Its Own Problem

  • Sometimes, autistic systematizing comes in to “save” ADHD’s executive functioning issues (building routines, structure), but this overcompensation depletes autistic reserves, creating a push-pull exhaustion:
  • “There’s almost this like...the autistic side comes over and is like, okay, I got you...But most importantly...ADHD burnout leading to depression...you know what you need, but it does not feel attainable.” (Patrick, 07:35)

• Losing Access to Lifelines

  • Megan notices her burnout when she can’t access her curiosity ("The first sign I'm in burnout is that I lose access to my curiosity." — Megan, 10:53).
  • For Patrick, losing movement (sports, activity) signals deep burnout: “When I can’t access movement...it’s not a good place for me to be. I go to a really dark place in those moments.” (Patrick, 11:44)

Navigating the Heaviness: Melancholy and Safe Spaces (12:42–16:38)

• Shame, Melancholy, and Connection

  • Both hosts get candid about the mental load of burnout and depression and the importance of safe spaces to share vulnerabilities.
  • “It’s important...to comfortably talk about how hard the things are that we live with.” (Megan, 13:19)

• Embracing the Slow & Temporary Nature of Burnout

  • A key reframing: seeing burnout as a temporary ‘season’ rather than a permanent state.
  • “Contextualize the experience of my body is communicating to me that it’s a season of slowdown.” (Megan, 15:59)

Burnout as a Signal: Learning to Pause and Adapt (17:12–24:21)

• Burnout as an Alarm, Not a Defect

  • Burnout is often a sign that boundaries have been surpassed or that unsupportive systems are in place.
  • “This is a slowdown message. This is an indication...something’s not working.” (Patrick, 17:21)

• Jumping to Imperfect Solutions & Learning to Pause

  • Megan shares a realization: her “workaholism” is a maladaptive ADHD accommodation for executive function—instead of meaningful support, she just overworks.
  • “Your accommodation...for your executive functioning struggles is just overwork.” (new business partner’s insight, paraphrased by Megan, 18:15)

• Practicing the Pause & Teaming Up

  • Practicing intentional pauses and inviting outside perspectives leads to better solutions than impulsively patching problems.
  • “[My partner] taught me the power of the pause...to get other people's input...way better than this patch I was putting on this leaky roof." (Megan, 22:21)

Living in "Burnout City" vs. “Monotropic Manor” (Metaphor) (19:28–36:20)

• Burnout City Metaphors

  • Living with AuDHD is likened to residing in “Burnout City” where you’re constantly patching leaks with the wrong solutions.
  • “If you were in, like, monotropic manor or that...ideal city and scenario, you kind of have this team around you that you delegate to, and you ask for support and accommodation.” (Patrick, 23:06)

• Crater Building: How ADHD Fuels Its Own Burnout

  • ADHD’s tendency toward novelty-seeking and growing “Frankenstein businesses” without structure builds a deep hole of burnout over time.
  • “ADHD is great at building craters for burnout...a Frankenstein business is a great crater to crawl in for ADHD burnout.” (Megan, 27:04)

• The Key: Structure + Playful Novelty

  • The most resilient AuDHD setups have sturdy autism-driven structures, but enough novelty and flexibility for ADHD fulfillment.
  • “Let the autism lead in building some kind of structure or frame and then letting the ADHD play within it.” (Megan, 28:45)

• Finding Harmony: Accepting Needs

  • Acceptance that autistic structure may need to lead (70–80% of the time), with ADHD novelty finding its place within.
  • “I think I also have to have acceptance that the autism side needs like 70 to 80% of the container.” (Patrick, 33:37)

Practical Framework: Feeding the “Overexcitability Critters” (37:04–39:36)

• Introducing a Visual Self-Care Model

  • Megan introduces a model (from her work with Kaylin at Neurodivergent Insights) using “overexcitabilities”—sensory, physical, intellectual, emotional, etc.—likened to little critters that need “feeding.”
  • “Thinking through, okay, which of my overexcitability little critters, like, could use some nourishment today and which ones are maybe overbearing?...” (Megan, 37:04)

• Building Visual & Playful Associations

  • Patrick loves the idea of associating each “critter” with a favorite animal and feeding them as a playful, visual reminder of self-care.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On ADHD Burnout’s Shame Spiral:
  • “That fear of, like, dropping all the balls or plates that are spinning...how much energy goes into executive functioning just to constantly feel like you're coming up short.” (Patrick, 05:37)
• On Burnout’s Solution Paradox:
  • “Often what we need to help support us getting out of burnout requires energy.” (Megan, 06:21)
• On Melancholy:
  • “There is something about embracing the melancholy...that can be aligned, that can be supportive.” (Megan, 14:50)
• On The Temporary Nature of Burnout:
  • “Remind ourselves that it’s a season, I think becomes...so helpful...my catastrophic mind wants to be like, it's always going to be like this. It's always been like this. Which is...not true.” (Megan, 16:15)
• Metaphor of “Burnout City”:
  • “Standing on this roof with, like, a bucket trying to catch the water as it's, like, coming in. But in reality, it's like, hey, maybe if we tried this thing.” (Patrick, 20:12)
• On Structure + Novelty:
  • “Folks who have found a way to let the autism lead in building some kind of structure or frame and then letting the ADHD play within it...have a bit of sustainability to work with.” (Megan, 28:45)
• On Playfulness as Self-Care:
  • “The ADHD kind of helps you find the life sparks or the energy sparks and the life sparks. And the autism helps create some containment.” (Megan, 33:26)

Timestamps for Key Segments

• (02:59) - Introduces AuDHD burnout & the challenge of separating autistic and ADHD burnout.
• (03:45) - Executive function failure as an ADHD burnout hallmark.
• (07:35) - Systematizing autism compensating for ADHD struggles (at a cost).
• (10:53) - Burnout signaled by loss of curiosity (Megan) and movement (Patrick).
• (14:50) - Embracing/containing melancholy in a healthy way.
• (18:15) - Workaholism as maladaptive “accommodation” for ADHD executive function.
• (20:12) - “Burnout City” metaphor: patching leaks with the wrong material.
• (22:21) - Discovery of the power of the pause and collaborative problem-solving.
• (28:45) - Effective structures: Building solid “containers” that allow for novelty.
• (33:37) - Acceptance that structure needs to lead, novelty plays within.
• (37:04) - “Overexcitabilities” model and animal “critter” metaphor for self-care.

Conclusion

This episode weaves together honesty, useful metaphors, and actionable guidance for those navigating the tangled burnout unique to those who are both autistic and ADHD (“AuDHD”). Through their candor, Megan Anna Neff and Patrick Casale affirm that while burnout may often feel like “Burnout City,” there’s hope in learning to honor both neurotypes: accepting the need for structure, giving space for play, and not forgetting to occasionally “feed your critters.”