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It was 1982. Police officer Tommy Morris was concerned. Moonlighting as head of security for the Permian Mall, now known as Music City Mall. The Odessa police detective sergeant was the go to for matters involving shoplifting or public safety at his second job, but he was also concerned with the safety of mall employees. That's why on April 19, just before noon, he received a call from Harry Callahan, general manager of the Permian Mall. Harry told Detective Sergeant Morris and Officer Daryl Gilbert that one of the mall employees, a cleaning lady named Velma Nesset, had not shown up for work that morning. Employee tardiness or absence did not fall under the purview of mall security. But Callahan insisted that Velma was never late for work. She showed up for her 5am shift every day she was scheduled without fail. If she couldn't come in, she always rang the office to inform them. Further, Callahan had called the next of kin listed on Velma's employment paperwork. This was Velma's adult daughter, Joyce. Joyce hadn't heard from her mom and was already worried. The two had been supposed to meet for lunch at noon at Velma's apartment. But when Joyce got to Velma's place. Apartment 95 at the Windcrest Apartments, located at 3965 Pembroke, no one was home. The table was set for lunch. But her mom's purse and coat. Things she took with her to work every day, were gone. Joyce called Officer Gilbert at 12:15 and reported those facts. Her mom seemed to be MIA, which was very out of character. She told the security officers that her mom always walked to and from work. As she didn't own a car. She left her nearby apartment to head to the mall every day at 4:30am the two had spoken on the phone the night before around 10:30. And confirmed their plans for lunch on the 18th. Joyce was now very worried and had already called the police. Officers from the Odessa Police Department arrived at Velma's place. And Joyce greeted Officer Dee Johnston. And at 12:02pm gave details needed for the missing persons report on her mom. Then she left. Mall security Officers Gilbert and Morris. Went over to Velma's. But found the door locked and Joyce already gone. They knocked on the door of the neighbors in apartment 97. And they said they hadn't seen Velma that day at all. Nor had the apartment manager. Officer Gilbert and Detective Sergeant Morris started retracing Velma's walk to work. They left the apartment complex and drove to Northwest Drive. Off of the Tanglewood street entrance to the rear of the mall. There was an overpass there with a drainage ditch. And three large drain tunnels or culverts under the bridge. The first two tunnels Officer Gilbert checked contained nothing. The third contained a body. A woman was lying face up about midway through the culvert. After yelling to Detective Sergeant Morris to call an ambulance. Officer Gilbert entered the drainage tunnel. And took a closer look at the body. It was Velma, and she was dead. Let's talk a little bit about who Velma was. Velma Nettie Mackey was born on December 11, 1916. In Bedford, Iowa. To parents Erie Mackey and Nettie Stevens Mackey. Velma grew up in Iowa with two brothers and two sisters. I really don't know much about her younger life. But as an adult, she lived in Des Moines and had a daughter, Joyce. I found an April 1978 wedding announcement for that coming May for Joyce Nesset and her fiance. The announcement made by, quote, Ms. Velma Nesset and Stanley Nesset of Des Moines. But Velma and Stanley had been divorced since September 26, 1957. Oddly, it appears they got married only a few months before that, in early July 1957, with Velma taking the surname Nesset and then filing for divorce within a mere three weeks of the wedding. I don't know what was going on here, whether they got married just during the birth of Joyce, so she would be, quote, legitimate, which was of social importance in the 1950s or what. Joyce married a man from Ector County, Texas, and after her wedding, Velma decided to move down there to be close to her newlywed daughter. She had found work as a waitress and now, four years later, at age 64, was working as a cleaning lady for the Permian Mall. No one had a bad thing to say about Velma. She was described by co workers and her manager as kind, gentle and sweet. She was grandmotherly, a nice little old lady, someone they all doted on like an elderly relative. Person after person reported to the investigators. She always kept the mall office and employee rooms clean, the coffee on and so on. She was meticulous and liked things just so, but approached people with a smile and was generous. A co worker named Sally was very close with Velma and provided some insight into her daily life and routines for investigators. Sally said Velma was very religious, frequently donating any precious extra dollars to Christian charities or her church. Money was tight for her and Velma saved by walking to work and going home for lunch every day. She generally arrived early for her 5am shift when, which is why when she was late and then a no show, the alarm was sounded so quickly. Velma did not generally go out and she did not have a boyfriend. Sally said to police, who would do this to such a sweet person? Okay, let's return to the crime scene. Police dispatch was informed that at 12:58pm the body of a missing woman believed to be Velma Nesset, was found in a drainage culvert beneath the northwest entrance to the mall, located at 4101 E. 42nd St. In Odessa. Arriving officers parked in the rear parking lot off Tanglewood street and observed the culvert, which was measured to be approximately 55ft long, 10ft wide and approximately 5ft high. The body lay at the approximate halfway point of the culvert. Ambulance number 73, driven by ENT's Robert Ortiz and Bill Griffin, arrived and quickly determined nothing could be done to help Velma. They put a sheet over her body and Officer Gilbert preserved the scene until detectives Ken Allaire, Jerry Smith, Larry Holly and Rodney Casey arrived. Holly and Allaire Homicide detectives took the call even though they were under the impression from the radio call that they had a natural death on their hands. A heart attack or some such thing. But when they arrived, they found that was not the case at all. Right away, Detective Holly noticed two drops of blood on the floor of the culvert tunnel about three feet inside the opening. Further in, Velma lay on her back, partially on her right side, with her left arm across her stomach and the right arm extended outward and up. Her left shoulder was wedged against the eastern wall of the culvert. Her head was turned to the right and lying in a 6 inch, still wet pool of blood and vomit. There was quite a bit of blood around her neck and chest area. A smear of blood was on the east wall of the culvert near the victim. Investigators noticed that Velma was wearing a navy blue long sleeve coat and a navy blue blouse. Her blouse was opened and both upper clothing items were pulled up to her chest area. And her black pants and pink underwear were pulled down to near her knees. It was noted that Velma's blue and white sneakers were covered in mud, consistent with mud in the culvert. And mud was splashed on the bottoms of her pant legs. Eyeglasses were on the ground next to the body. Velma's blue and white purse was lying on the ground next to her feet and was sitting open with a stick of gum lying on the ground as though someone had rifled through the purse and spilled the gum out. A cough drop on the ground next to Velma appeared to have been partially sucked on. Detectives Casey and Holly took control of the crime scene. A Justice of the Peace, Judge Jimmy Harris, arrived and pronounced velma dead at 1:50pm he ordered an autopsy to be performed and requested that Dr. Richard Cohen come to the scene to make a preliminary investigation. When Dr. Cohen arrived, he felt Velma's foot and arm, moved them about, and declared that she'd been dead for just about six hours. Just a guess, he said. When the doctor moved Velma's blouse away from her neck, he saw the stab wound in her throat. He noted the pool of blood and posited that she'd been stabbed and bled to death. Although it was curious that the pool of blood was so small. The doctor tried to take a blood sample from her head and neck, but said she didn't have enough blood left in those areas and he would try to get one later. The CSIs bagged Velma's hands and at 3:05pm her body was Picked up to be removed to Easterling Wilson Funeral Home. When they moved, her, blood dripped from her body onto the ground. But that was not the surprising thing. When they lifted her onto the gurney, a small knife that had been tangled up in her clothing clattered to the ground. It was a folding fishing knife with a yellow handle. Glove wearing CSIS collected it into evidence. So Velma's body was removed to Easterling Wilson Funeral Home to prepare her for autopsy. When her clothing was removed, something shocking happened. An off white plastic handled four and three quarter inch serrated steak knife fell out of the right side of her clothing. This was the second knife that had basically fallen out of Velma's garments. This knife too was collected and retained in evidence. Rather than proceed immediately with the autopsy, it was decided to remove Velma to the medical center hospital morgue to process her body with lasers, looking for possible fingerprints. This was done by E. Roland Manzel, a professor of physics at Texas Tech University. He scanned Velma's entire body. But the laser failed to illuminate any latent fingerprints on her skin. Then the autopsy by Dr. Cohen got started. On April 20th at 4:30pm the pathologist noted a 1 1/4 inch knife wound in the left anterior neck area of Velma's throat. The left external jugular vein was lacerated horizontally at the level of the clavicle. The knife had penetrated three inches which with the width of the cut gave minimum measurements of the blade. At 3 inches in length and 1 1/4 inches wide. Dr. Cohen observed a small punctuate contusion on the right upper quadrant of Velma's front abdominal wall. She had also suffered a blow to the back of her head, although there was no laceration to the skin of the scalp and no evidence of a skull fracture. At the conclusion of the autopsy, Dr. Cohen listed the cause of death as exsanguination secondary to the stab wound in the neck. Her death certificate reflects a puncture wound to the left anterior neck with laceration of the left external jugular vein and massive internal hemorrhage. There was so little blood at the scene because Velma had bled internally. Dr. Cohen, of course, inspected Velma's body for signs of sexual assault. Given that she'd been found with her pants down, he observed no evidence of trauma to her sexual organs. He collected vaginal, anal and oral swabs. And when he examined them under a microscope, he observed no sperm on any of the evidence swabs. He later said that he could not determine whether Velma had been raped. But if she had, there was no evidence of ejaculate. I'd like to interject here that the determination that there was no sperm on the swabs was was made by the pathologist using a microscope. It's unknown whether had these swabs been retained and examined using modern equipment, the observations would have been different. As for the time of death, the official autopsy report lists time of death as between 5 and 8am Remember that at the scene Dr. Cohen had observed a level of rigor mortis indicating Velma had been dead about six hours. She was found at 1pmthat would put her time of death at around 7am but investigators came to believe it was actually significantly earlier. They knew based on talking to Joyce and all of Velma's coworkers and the mall manager that she always got to work before 5 in the morning on April 19. She never made it to work. Based on that information and the assumption that just as she did every day, Velma set out to work around 4:30 in the morning. The time of death was established at between 4:30 and 5am I'm happy to announce that DNAID will be on podcast row at CrimeCon again this year. Last year I met so many amazing listeners who stopped by my booth to say hello and I met several incredible members of law enforcement, two of whom brought me cases that I ended up covering in season four. CrimeCon 2025 is taking place in Aurora, Colorado on September 5th, 6th and 7th and I really hope to see you there. Please make sure you use my voucher DNAID all one word at checkout when you purchase your badge to save 10%. That's real savings. Again, DNAID all one word in the voucher box at checkout to save 10% on your badge. See you in the Rockies. Hi DNAID listeners. I'm thrilled to welcome a new sponsor to the show, Mint Mobile. I live in a town with notoriously bad cell service from the Big three providers. So when Mint Mobile approached me about changing it up, I was more than happy to sign on the dotted line because for a very affordable 15 bucks a month for three months of premium wireless service, I can save money and have uninterrupted service with my same phone number. 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My dad, a lifelong journalist and author, will get so much out of the writing and communications classes. I think he'll really enjoy watching his former colleague Bob Woodward's class on investigative journalism. As for my husband, he will love John Legend's class on songwriting. Since he aspires to quit his day job and focus on his band, this class is a gift that will really resonate with him. A Father's Day gift of A Masterclass subscription is way better than another tie or set of grilling tools because it won't get stored in a drawer or forgotten in a closet. Instead, it will last a lifetime. Masterclass is the only streaming platform where you can learn and grow with over 200 of the world's best for still only $10 a month billed annually, a membership with Masterclass gets you unlimited access to every single instructor. It's an amazing deal. Plus every new membership comes with a 30 day money back guarantee. Our listeners always get great discounts on Masterclass of at least 15% off any annual membership@masterclass.com DNAID See MasterClass's latest deal at least 15% off@masterclass.com DNAID that's masterclass.com DNAID Odessa Police Officer Gilbert and Detective Casey attended the autopsy and collected several items into evidence besides the knife that had clattered out of Velma's clothing collected from Velma's person and the pockets of her clothing was a pink coin purse, a black lady's neckerchief and several cough drops. Then there was her clothing, which told investigators a lot about what had happened to Velma. The specific locations of bloodstains on the outside of Velma's coat pointed to her coat being done up fastened around her when she was stabbed. Detectives notes say, quote if the jacket was open, it is reasonable to believe that the stains were would be on her blouse and not her jacket. End quote. Further, the trajectory of the bloodstains told the investigators that Velma had been stabbed while standing upright. The blood stained drop and run patterns showed a downward direction to the drops. Velma's clothing told the investigators a lot about what had happened once she'd been stabbed. Her coat had been opened and her lower half clothing removed altogether. Velma's pants and underwear were found inside out. Her pants were also on backwards and the whole thing was weird. The pants were of a baggy fabric material with an elastic waistband. The bottom of the pants had been hemmed by hand with a light colored thread. The inside of the pants, worn on the outside and pulled up past the knees of the dead woman was relatively clean. But when the investigators turned the pants right way out, they noted something important. This from a report by Odessa police detective Justin Cade. Quote, I found that the outer front of the pants had what appeared to be dirty impact marks where Nesset's knees may have been located while wearing the pants. Additionally, I observed muddy drag marks that went upward toward the crotch of the pants. Nesset's shoes were muddy and the drainage culvert was also muddy. End quote. And this from Texas Ranger Jeff Strain's report. Quote it is reasonable to believe that during the course of the incident that Nesset's pants were removed from her legs. I believe that her shoes remained on her feet and while her pants were removed they were turned inside out. As they were being removed and being turned inside out, the toes of her muddy shoes caused the mud transfer marks up the front of her pants. I believe that her pants were placed back onto Nesset after they were fully removed. So as you heard, Velma was stripped nude on her bottom half with her muddy light blue tennis shoes still on and then redressed with the pants inside out. For some reason, her killer didn't pull her pants all the way up but left them down at her knees with her genitals exposed. Why bother to redress her if you aren't going to do it all the way? Velma's purse, which appeared to possibly have been rifled by her killer was dusted for fingerprints. However, they were unable to obtain any useful prints off the purse or its contents. Surprisingly, the same was true for the knives. The killer might have wiped the handle or handles down to be sure he left no prints. The crime scene area was thoroughly searched by CSIS who noted a patch of footprints in the mud south of the tunnel in the ditch, a scarf which proved to be Velma's was also found on the ground. It appeared that Velma had been stunned by a blow to the back of the head. Probably forced or dragged at knife point off the sidewalk into the ditch and then the culvert and then stabbed, pulled by her assailant. The smear of blood on the culvert wall near Velma's body was at first believed to have been made when Velma was attacked and her head struck the wall. But that theory was discarded when the autopsy revealed that Velma's scalp had not been lacerated. Police came to believe the smear was possibly left by the suspect as he wiped blood from his hand. Unfortunately, no samples of this blood smear were collected. Detective Mike Davis was instructed to talk to witnesses and lead a canvas of apartment buildings near the crime scene. So Detective Davis, Detective Field and Detective Martin went to the Cimarron Station apartments abutting the mall. They started knocking on doors and asking questions, but no one had seen or heard anything. Ms. Leo Box said she usually saw a woman walking east across the drainage ditch around 4:50am but she had not seen her on the 19th. However, it was noted that it was foggy that morning and Mrs. Box might not have been able to make out Velma's figure in the mist. Then they went to Velma's apartment building, the Windcrest Apartments, and talked to the neighbors there. They didn't learn much. No one had seen anything. One woman, E.J. williams, said Velma, her friend, usually left before 5 in the morning. They had learned from Joyce and some of Velma's co workers that she didn't have a car and walked but the two blocks from her apartment building to work. Every morning, rain or shine. That day, her walk was interrupted. I'd like to say here it's not clear from the original case file materials whether Odessa police took official statements from all Velma's co workers who were at the mall that morning on June 9, 1980, two months after the murder. This statement was taken from Sally Smith. Sally was an employee in the maintenance department at the Permian Mall and a good friend of Velma's. On April 19, she arrived at work a little earlier than usual around 4:30 in the morning. As she turned off 42nd street onto Tanglewood, her headlights illuminated a white male, approximately 18 or 19 years old, fairly short, maybe 5 foot 4, with dark hair that was wavy and worn a little longer, but didn't quite come down to his collar. He was wearing a light colored shirt and Levi's and a bowler Hat. When her headlights illuminated him, he looked back at her. He was walking north on Tanglewood by the east curb line, moving briskly away from the spot where Velma would later be found. Police came to believe that Sally likely saw Velma's murderer leaving the scene. Sally went on to lay out the timeline of the morning on which Velma was killed. She said Velma usually arrived to work around 4:40am but of course we know that morning was a different story. Around 4:45am Sally and Velma's co workers at the mall, Gail M. Johnny Ray Foot and his cousin Wayne drove up. The three typically carpooled to work together in Gail's car and they did so on that day as well. Sally started her workday but around 7:30 began really to worry about Velma. So she called her home and got no answer. Around 8:30am Sally and Wayne had to go run an errand on behalf of the mall. So they stopped by Velma's house and knocked on the door and again got no answer. When they got back it was around 11 and there was still no sign of Velma. So Sally called Velma's daughter Joyce at Zales where she worked and said, your mom didn't come into work. Is everything okay? Joyce said, that's odd. I have an extra key so I'll go over there. Then Sally went to lunch with a co worker and when they got back, there were police cars all over the mall. I have no idea who would kill Velma, Sally told detectives. Police didn't either. After all, who would have it out for a 64 year old cleaning lady just walking to work in the pre dawn hours? There were some early suspects in this case. Let's discuss them. On the afternoon of the murder in the mall office, Officer Gilbert discussed Velma's murder with assistant mall manager Danny Young. A mall maintenance employee named Johnny Foote overheard the conversation in the office and volunteered something. He said when Velma had not shown up to work, he and a few other guys had been asked to go walk her route to work from her home at the Windcrest Apartments to see if they saw anything. Johnny said as he was checking places along Velma's route, he walked under the drainage bridge located on the northwest corner of the mall property at about 12:15pm and Velma's body was not there. Detective Br Myrick heard Johnny say this and knew this could not be right. Police suspected based on the blood drops, the muddy footprints and Velma's typical route that she had been waylaid and taken into the culvert where she was killed. And she had been dead for several hours before Officer Gilbert located her body in the culvert. If Johnny had looked in the culvert at 12:15 and said he didn't see her, it really didn't add up. And frankly, we was suspicious. Detective Myrick and Officer Gilbert started to question Johnny. The report says, quote, the foot subject at first wanted to argue that point and again stated he had gone under the bridge, but then just looked at both officers and said nothing else, end quote. Johnny's adamant arguing about whether Velma's body had been in the culvert at 12:15 raised investigators eyebrows. Quote, no one realized that because of the position of the sun and the shadows inside the culvert, the body was not visible. Although Johnny stood only 20ft away. His defense attorney, Cynthia Clack later wrote, Johnny felt the mall officials and the police were accusing him of being lazy or sloppy. He didn't get that. It made him look like he was hiding something. Now is probably a good time to disclose that Johnny Foote was mentally challenged. We will come back to him shortly. A second mall employee who piqued the interest of the Odessa investigators was M. Hensley. Hensley was the trash truck driver for the Permian Mall and was a reservist in the National Guard. He also lived in Velma's building and in his interview with police said he considered Velma like an aunt. They sometimes walked to work together. Hensley told the police that Velma had complained about obscene phone calls and mysterious knocks on her door. But police couldn't verify any of that, and Hensley himself drew their suspicions pretty quickly because they learned that he was in the habit of carrying a knife, and he had an extensive knife collection. Furthermore, boots that Hensley owned had a similar pattern to the boot prints found in the mud at the crime scene. As Velma's trusted neighbor, of course, he would be aware of her walking patterns to and from work. Hensley and his results were deemed inconclusive.