Hour 1: Best Team in the NFL?

Summary

Don, Hahn & Rosenberg — Hour 1: Best Team in the NFL? (Nov 17, 2025)

Episode Overview

In this episode, Don La Greca, Alan Hahn, and Peter Rosenberg sink their teeth into the highly unpredictable state of the NFL, especially the perennial question: Who’s the true best team? The trio also drills down into New York football, with particular focus on the Giants’ recent shakeup, unstable team culture, and quarterback controversy. Toss in some lively banter about food, John Cena’s last MSG appearance, and chaos at a recent UFC event, and you have a jam-packed, energetic hour that covers the joys and frustrations of contemporary sports fandom in New York.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

The Parity (or Mediocrity?) of Today’s NFL

• The hosts dissect the NFL landscape, agreeing that this year feels unusually “up for grabs.” There’s no dominant juggernaut—every contender is flawed.

  • Don La Greca: “I think it's sloppy. I think it's ugly. I think it's poorly coached. I think in the NFL is a really bad spot.” (05:49)
  • Alan Hahn expands: The era of clear ‘teams to beat’ (e.g., Brady’s Patriots, Mahomes’ Chiefs) feels over. Now? “I think everybody's mediocre. That is that parody. Is that what we want?” (06:14)

• Peter Rosenberg hedges: Despite the chaos, he still believes the Chiefs are the team to beat come playoffs, even as they sit outside the standings at the moment (07:15).

• The hosts agree: Parity is fun for debate but may signal lower overall quality, with even good teams (Eagles, Chiefs, etc.) showing obvious vulnerabilities (06:14–07:15).

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New York Giants’ Tumultuous Season & Culture Shift

• Discussion of the Giants’ disappointing record, coaching shakeups (Daboll out, Kafka in as interim), and what should come next.

  • The coaching change is unanimously deemed necessary, as the on-field “vibe” with Dable had grown toxic.
  • Alan Hahn: "This was a toxic culture that desperately needs a strong leader at the very top to get it back under control." (15:13)
  • Don La Greca: “Making the coaching change was obviously the right move to make.” (16:18)

• The hosts dwell on missed opportunities—multiple close, winnable games lost, which set the team’s culture and momentum back.

  • Alan Hahn: “I'm looking at it if I'm an owner. I can't get over that. We had three, at least three winnable games… Instead, look where it has you right now. It has you in a place that you've been in all too often in the last 12 years, and you're on the hamster wheel.” (23:20–24:19)

• Evidence of leadership issues:

  • Lax discipline (rookie Abdul Carter’s repeated infractions allowed under Dable).
  • Vague “business decisions” leading to poor accountability at both player and management level.

• Tanking? Don is vehemently against it, arguing “losing becomes a disease.”

  • “The only way to cure it, guys, is to win and then make that the habit.” (22:45)

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Giants QB Carousel: Winston, Wilson, and Management Games

• Jameis Winston is praised for competent play but not lionized (“Let’s not make him out to be Tom Brady. He only threw for, like, 200 yards, and he did throw a pick at the end of the game, although I don't think that was his fault.” — Don, 10:04).
• Why did the Giants ever sign (and play) Russell Wilson? Don and Hahn speculate about possible handshake deals or favors, opining that Wilson got more chances than he earned—perhaps as a reputation-repairing “favor” by someone in the building (47:01–50:32).
• Alan Hahn: “Once you saw him [Wilson] play enough to get to a point where it's like, all right, we got to make a change. I guess it was, don't embarrass him by making him a third quarterback. Don't embarrass him by cutting him.” (48:13)

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Who Is the Best Team in the NFL?

• The crew debates which teams, if any, deserve “favorite” status for a deep playoff run.

  • Chiefs? Despite current standings, Don calls them the safest bet: “How do you not say the Chiefs?” (37:50)
  • Ravens? Rosenberg reluctantly takes the Ravens over the Lions, given forced choice (39:47).
  • Lions? Surprise at their mediocrity despite preseason hype; even impressive teams feel vulnerable.
  • Probability stats are mentioned (Ravens 77% chance to make the playoffs, Lions 75%, Chiefs 51%), but as Peter quips: “Religion's not involved. You know what I'm saying? …The Chiefs are with God.” (40:51)

• Alan Hahn: “This year… every team, even the good ones, when you argue them, every one of them, including the Eagles, have flaws… I think everybody's mediocre.” (06:14)

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Around New York: Knicks, John Cena, and MSG Mayhem

• John Cena’s “emotional” last WWE appearance at Madison Square Garden is a recurring, bittersweet thread for Rosenberg (01:03).
• Alan and Peter discuss the pre-WWE buzz at MSG, shifting to the aftermath of a wild brawl at UFC on Saturday night (30:14).
  • Rosenberg describes the scene: “I have never at an event, seen it continue on for that long. I could not believe they couldn't get it under control.” (31:40)
  • The melee resulted in fighter Dylan Danis being banned from all UFC events, per Dana White (32:24).
  • “Looking forward to going back to good old safe, family friendly WWE tonight…” (33:20)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Don La Greca on NFL sloppiness:
  • “I think it's sloppy. I think it's ugly. I think it's poorly coached. I think in the NFL is a really bad spot. But nobody will ever say it because everybody is so in love with football…” (05:49)
• Alan Hahn on Giants’ toxic culture:
  • “This was a toxic culture that desperately needs a strong leader at the very top to get it back under control.” (15:13)
• Peter Rosenberg on NFL parity & fate:
  • “The Chiefs aren't about that. The Chiefs are with God.” (41:04)
• Don La Greca on losing as an organizational disease:
  • “That's what the Giants are right now. They're losers. They don't know how to win anymore. They don't have to get off the mat… You don't see that the disease that losing is for an organization.” (21:27)
• Peter Rosenberg describes the UFC brawl:
  • “I have actual nightmares about that. About, like, you're in a big room and it starts losing control, and you're like, oh, my God, what's happening now?” (31:52)

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Segment Timestamps

• NFL Parity & Landscape: 05:37–08:37
• Giants Coaching Change, Culture Issues: 13:39–16:51
• Daboll vs. Kafka & Locker Room Issues: 15:13–19:34
• Tanking and Organizational Habits: 21:27–23:13
• Missed Opportunities & Ownership’s Dilemma: 23:20–24:19
• Current NFL Contender Debate: 34:27–41:36
• Giants QB Situation (Wilson, Winston): 46:17–50:32
• John Cena & MSG Atmosphere: 01:03–01:46, 28:40–29:59
• UFC Brawl at MSG: 30:14–33:20

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Additional Flavor and Banter

• Thanksgiving food talk (cranberry sauce, dips, Trader Joe’s): Lighthearted opening interplay (02:01–03:23).
• Consistent ribbing and affectionate teasing about each other's picks, record collections, and backstage access at events.
• Shout-out to listener “Stevie Bay” undergoing surgery—adds a personal community touch (29:43–30:02).

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Summary Takeaway:
This episode paints a picture of NFL uncertainty—no favorites, only flaws—and connects that chaos to the deeper malaise in New York’s own franchises, especially the Giants. There’s no shortage of strong opinions, locker-room gossip, and realistic frustrations from the hosts, but always wrapped in wit and brotherly warmth. Whether you want insight, emotional catharsis, or simply a sense of fellow suffering, this episode delivers.

Transcript

[Peter Rosenberg]

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[Don La Greca]

Virgins working in one room together. A lot can be accomplished.

[Alan Hahn]

Han, I just got excited.

[Peter Rosenberg]

And Rosenberg, Alan just expressed theoretical arousal about the Dolly Parton puppet.

[Don La Greca]

This isn't North Dakota, this is New York.

[Podcast Announcer]

This is Don, Han and Rosenberg.

[Don La Greca]

The best threesome I've ever heard on.

[Podcast Announcer]

ESPN New York and streaming live on YouTube.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Oh yeah. Hello, it's. Hello.

[Sponsor Voice]

Hi.

[Peter Rosenberg]

How's everyone?

[Don La Greca]

Hi, friends.

[Peter Rosenberg]

It is 3:01 on.

[Alan Hahn]

You don't know that.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Somewhat blustery Monday afternoon, Don, Han and Rosenberg are here on a day that will live in the minds and souls of wrestling fans forever as John Cena will enter Madison Square Garden for the last time tonight. It's an emotional day for us folks, so everyone just prepare. If I have my moments, feeling a lot of different thoughts.

[Alan Hahn]

Buzzing, buzzing at the Garden when I got, when I obviously I parked here and I went outside the big WWE truck right outside the broadcasting trucks all set up.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Oh, you're going to see an intense.

[Alan Hahn]

And there's a buzz around. You got all kinds of fans already early in the day, people getting ready.

[Peter Rosenberg]

No, it's, it's an unusual one. He's down to three appearances left. This is his third to last appearance. So it's a big deal, which is more than we can say about the teams who play football here in New York. But we'll get to that. Don, how are you, buddy? Good.

[Don La Greca]

How are you, buddy? I hope you're having a good time.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah, I'm in a good space today, you know, dressed nice and warm. I got some cranberry sauce at Trader Joe's to start getting me ready for Thanksgiving.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah, seasonal choice. I like it.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah, I was feeling seasonal.

[Don La Greca]

Not a fan.

[Alan Hahn]

No.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You're not a cranberry sauce guy.

[Alan Hahn]

No.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Really?

[Alan Hahn]

Now, what'd you do, what'd you have it with? What'd you pair it with?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, this is what makes me interested. Some crackers. But hold on. I also got from Trader Joe's some oven roasted turkey breast slices.

[Alan Hahn]

See now that's brilliant.

[Peter Rosenberg]

And I had some turkey slices, by the way, it's in the cold cut area when you walk in, all the way to the right. They got cold cuts and I no idea Got the turkey, had a little bit of turkey, a little bit of cranberry. I was a little disappointed because I thought I had a couple of dips here, but I either brought them home Friday or someone threw them in the garbage.

[Alan Hahn]

They're both pilfered. No, those couple of dips are at home. Or one is at home, one's at msg.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Oh, those are yours.

[Alan Hahn]

Couple of dips that you usually have.

[Peter Rosenberg]

The hummus and the. And the guac. All yours.

[Don La Greca]

Opposed to the dips on in the morning.

[Alan Hahn]

Oh.

[Don La Greca]

Oh, no.

[Alan Hahn]

Excuse me. Oh, we're throwing. What? What happened? It's Monday.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah, but anything happened?

[Don La Greca]

No, nothing happened. I just, I was just trying to be selective. I didn't want to go after the part timers. They. They're too sensitive. Oh, no, I figured I would. Yeah, well, why not? Just. I obviously didn't mean it. It was just having some fun. It's just low hanging fruit on a Monday. Why not have some fun?

[Alan Hahn]

Why not?

[Don La Greca]

Why not? I'm sure.

[Alan Hahn]

Why not.

[Don La Greca]

You know what? Tears in their eyes.

[Alan Hahn]

If the part timers are mad at you because you are holding them accountable for grinding early in your career so that you can grow, that's a lesson.

[Don La Greca]

That's what I like.

[Alan Hahn]

What do you.

[Don La Greca]

That's what I meant it as.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah, exactly. Said about that. That's a you problem.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Was there blowback from what you said last week?

[Alan Hahn]

God, was there blowback?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Is that. Was it really?

[Don La Greca]

Well, Jake went on the air to say he'd be home, but after what I said, he felt obligated to go in. A little snarky, but you know what? That just showed that my message was delivered. It was effective. Absolutely. I'm just saying I'm cut from the cloth of, you know what? You got to pay your dues a little bit. Little bit. And then when you're sitting pretty and sometimes it takes a long time, sometimes you never get there, but you got to pay your dues a little bit.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah, but the reason. But the reason it rings, it's. It's perfect for someone like Jake is like, you know, Jake is gonna get there, but he's still a young man. And even though he's ascended very quickly and he works very hard to. There are still dues to be paid, my friend.

[Don La Greca]

That's all.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You delivered a message. I respect it. General soreness. Yeah.

[Don La Greca]

There's no expiration date on the dues. Sometimes you pay it and it pays zero dividends. You wasted your time. And sometimes, like guys like Washuzen and Eagle come Right out of the womb with a play by play schedule and a headset. They're ready to go. All right. And they had to pay very little dues, if any. Although Ian was a. Was a board op at the fan and was. She was an intern to the Fan. So dues was paid, don't get me wrong.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But different dues.

[Don La Greca]

But it's blind dues. You, you, it's all.

[Alan Hahn]

It's hope.

[Don La Greca]

It's kind of like New York football.

[Alan Hahn]

Oh, boy.

[Don La Greca]

Right. It's hope that you don't know if it's going to pay any dividends at the end, but you just do it because that's what you got to do.

[Alan Hahn]

Look at you. Look at that.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You know what that was?

[Alan Hahn]

Look at him get to stepping.

[Peter Rosenberg]

So with that, with that, a lot of different feelings about the. The New York football that we watch and we're going to dive into also the NFL in general, which is frankly right now, we were discussing it all weekend. The most up for grab the NFL has maybe ever been.

[Don La Greca]

I don't want to give. Maybe I shouldn't say it. Go ahead.

[Alan Hahn]

I think you should do it.

[Don La Greca]

Most of the time when you say that it's a good thing that anybody could win. I don't know if this is a good thing.

[Alan Hahn]

I agree.

[Don La Greca]

I don't think it's coming from a good place. I think it's sloppy. I think it's ugly. I think it's poorly coached. I think in the NFL is a really bad spot. But nobody will ever say it because everybody is so in love with football, myself included, that nobody ever wants to pick at the scabs. They'll do. They'll do that with baseball, they'll do it with hockey, they'll do with basketball. But football is always ascending. It's always fantastic. It's always perfect. I don't think so.

[Alan Hahn]

I think you're right. I think you're right. I think this is one of the rare times we've had in the last 25 years. Because in the last 25 years, there's always been the IT team, right? There's always been that, that, that evil Empire or one team or whatever. There are a couple of teams that you just felt like you got to get past them. Oh, you got to get past them. You got to. You got to be able to beat Brady, you got to be able to beat Roethlisberg, you got to be able to beat Rodgers, you got to be able to beat Mahomes, you got to beat Breeze. Like there's always somebody you got to beat him. Well, and this year, that doesn't exist. In fact, every team, even the good ones, when you argue them, every one of them, including the Eagles, have flaws. All of them have flaws that can be exploited in a winner take all game that we'll get to in January. And that's why it's Parity's nice. It's fun to talk about. But what you're saying, Don, it's not great when the level of play isn't raised because everybody's good. I think everybody's mediocre. That is that parody. Is that what we want?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, I don't want to. I don't want to ruin this whole thing because I do think you're mostly right. But that team that you have to beat is. They're still going to be there. And I know if the playoffs started today, the Chiefs are outside looking in. I bet a lot of. I bet a lot of coin, a lot of scratch that they will be safely in the playoffs when we get there.

[Alan Hahn]

But that's fine.

[Don La Greca]

But there's a team in their division right now that's right. That Mahomes can't beat in Denver. And you're three and a half games back. And Mahomes said all the right things after the game. It's just about getting into the playoffs. We saw them win two road games in the postseason. What was it, last year or the year before? You know, had to be the year before and they still got to the super bowl and won it. But now this Denver team, I don't. I'm not in love with them either, guys. But they don't have any problem with Mahomes in their own building. And that's where it looks like Kansas City is going to have to go if they're going to make some sort of a run. So things might be a little bit different. But I'm with you. There's still seven weeks left, six games for some of these teams to still play that we can all kind of work itself out. But right now, Kansas City wouldn't be in the playoffs. Detroit wouldn't be in the playoffs. Like, these are the teams that we were circling as super bowl contenders, and we're in the middle of November and they're not in the playoffs yet.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah.

[Don La Greca]

So it's kind of odd, but at the same time, there's still time. But. So let's. We'll get to all that later.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah, I want to. When we get to it, I want to make this like a Monday. Make your case Monday. Make your case of the team that you think is the one that has the fewest flaws and the ability to win the whole thing. I don't think it's easy to put your money on. On. I think we'll get a number of teams that people will put their money on. I don't think there'll be a unanimous team like we've had, like we've seen in the past.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I agree with that. I think there's one smartest answer, but, yeah, I think you're right. We'll get different ones. Well, we had very different reactions on the group text to the Giants game. And, you know, it's unfortunate in days like today that Anthony is not one of the hosts because he's just so disgusted by this team that no matter what he sees or even hears about cause sees would mean he's watching the game and he's not. In fact, he just walked out of the studio. I've never seen this before. The conversation, the subject came up, the door opened, he is gone. But, you know, Anthony was sickened by everything, and he's just had enough. And I understand that standpoint for Giants fans. But, guys, for me, objectively, I sit there watching and go, I saw some things yesterday. I'm not saying I'm running to the mailbox to get my contract out to Kafka, but, Don, I did see some things that were better about this team. And I'll tell you one thing that I felt great about. I felt very vindicated by every week when I've sat here with you guys and gone, what about Jameis Winston? Where's Jameis Winston? Yeah, he's much better than Russell Wilson.

[Don La Greca]

There's a couple of things at play here. Number one is, did they. Did they do the right thing by letting Dable go? And the answer was yes.

[Alan Hahn]

Definitively.

[Don La Greca]

Definitively, yes. Just the way it looked, the way it felt. And the fact is, where was Jameis Winston? Now, let's not make him out to be Tom Brady. He only threw for, like, 200 yards, and he did throw a pick at the end of the game, although I don't think that was his fault. It looked like a bad route, but.

[Peter Rosenberg]

It'S also not his choice. Jameis Winston has to throw an interception at the end of games. That's how he played, right? Because he got it.

[Don La Greca]

There's a lot of dialogue between him, him and God. And there's just like, there has to be more conversation. There's, like a better help that he has because he's a. He's an NFL player where you can have conversations with God and work.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You know what? And Don, since you brought it up, I just want to say something about better help and add my better this November. Better helps encouraging everyone to reach out, check in on friends, reconnect with loved ones and remind the people in your life that you're there. All right? You know, personally, I know I've gone through hard times and it's meant a lot to have those people that just check in day in and day out. And certainly it means a lot to check in with my therapist. Now. Betterhelp therapists, they work with a strict code of conduct. They're fully licensed in the U.S. also, they have so many over 30,000 therapists are in their network. Alright? They match up with a therapist and they typically get it right. But if you're not happy with your match, switch to a different therapist at any time from their tailored recommendations. Alright? So BetterHelp's one of the world's largest online therapy platforms, having served over 5 million people globally.

[Don La Greca]

All right.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Plus a rating of 4.9 out of 5 for live sessions based on over 1.7 million client reviews is an incredible number. So this month, don't wait to reach out. Whether you're checking in on a friend or reaching out to a therapist yourself, BetterHelp makes it easier to take that first step. Our listeners get 10% off their first month. Just call two five zero and say the keyword timeout. That's keyword timeout. After calling pound two five zero, Don, were you, were you looking, were you actively in the chat? I know me, Anthony and I think Alan were when in the fourth quarter the Giants got the ball back and I said giants drive Winston interception to end the game.

[Don La Greca]

Yes, I saw that.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I mean it was literally like you could have, it was so obvious which stuck because I was rooting for obviously I want to see the Giants get a win yesterday and I, I, I.

[Don La Greca]

You know, I did.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You did or did not?

[Don La Greca]

No, I did. I wanted them to win the game because I want them to be to move forward from what happened. And let's face it, the Giants are rooting for the same thing. They want to believe that Dable was the problem and that they eradicated the problem. And now everything's going to be good. Now, we all know that Shane Bowen's going to be out of a job at the end of the year. We know that. But as far as the whole Shane Dable and do they have enough talent? Listen, they don't have enough talent. To win a Super bowl, but they certainly have more talent than should be 2 and 9. And it just looked different. It looked better. The same issues with the secondary and the same issues with the defense, which, again, will be solved at the end of the year. But I thought it looked better. And Allen may disagree. And I thought Winston played great for a guy that hasn't played in over a year. I think that if Jackson Dart plays in that game, they beat the Packers. And if they beat the packers, the common denominator all day, the conversation is going to be how Kafka got him up and how much better they are with Kafka as the head coach. And I still think that's the theme, because I do think they're better off letting Dable go. Now the question, is Kafka the answer? But we'd have felt a lot different about it had they won that game. And I think they would have a much better chance to win. Not that Winston played poorly, but, you know, Dart is a talent that can make things happen for this offense. And I think they would have scored more than 20 points had he been the quarterback. But that said, I still think it looked a lot better. And I was disappointed they lost the game. I was completely engaged in them trying.

[Alan Hahn]

To get a W. And I'll tell you what, I again, without caring about the result at this point, because does it really matter? You know, I think if you're Kafka, you're trying to prove you can. You can coach and that the job should be yours. And the continuity thing that everybody with the organization is kind of rooting for, mainly because that means some of them will keep their jobs. But that's. That's the reason why you're looking for wins. But I'm just looking at everything else. I always look for the, you know, the bump that I talked to you guys about. And did we see a bump change in a coach? Did you get a different vibe out of the team? Was there a better feel about the team? And we're learning a couple things. The first thing we learned is what you guys mentioned, what you mentioned, Don, is that Jameis Winston was left on the bench under Brian Dabel. And we see a guy that clearly still had the ability to play. When Russ, as a backup, even when he had to go in at times for Dart, just was making business decisions to make sure he didn't get hit, was doing things that were detrimental to the offense and making them look bad. Never mind the games that he started, two of them that he was just awful in and maybe it could have pushed back a little bit on how fast you had to get to dart and get him into the season. Not that, you know, again, the kid showed himself and he did really well. But that's one thing that does make you now look at Dable and ask yourself, like, what was he thinking? And what was, why would he do that? The other one is this stuff about Abdul Carter, right? And the fact that he didn't play in the first series because he slept through a walkthrough. He claims he was getting treatment, but if the, if that's, if that's what the coaching staff's doing, which Dabel apparently, and apparently, as the reports go, this isn't a first time, this has become a trend for this rookie. That blows my mind because that tells me, number one, they always say you either coaching it or allowing it to happen. So Brian Dabell was aware of it and did nothing about it. Number two, the leaders on the team, guys like Dexter Lawrence, you know, Brian Burns guys are supposed to be leaders on that defense. Veterans kind of looked away, did nothing about it, didn't do anything. Like that also tells me that they kind of shrugged it off, like, well, what does it matter if the coach ain't doing anything? What am I going to do? And that tells you that this, this was a toxic culture that desperately needs a strong leader at the very top to get it back under control. Because if you're a rookie and you think you can get away with this and that it just happens routinely. And the fact that he runs to social media to defend himself, I don't like the look of that.

[Don La Greca]

No, it's bad.

[Alan Hahn]

Like, so I'm looking at that. And if I'm John Mara, if I'm Tish, if I'm anyone in ownership above everybody else, I'm looking down at all this stuff going on and I'm wondering, like, wait, okay, so Winston still can play. We got this other thing going on with a young player on the team and thinks he would get away with it. We had a major problem. And the one thing we can say definitively is that making the coaching change was obviously the right move to make. When they did, it might have been the right move to make as well. Just to get things back on track before you get to the off season.

[Don La Greca]

Now, the reason that this all happens and is the mistake that John Mara made, not making one of two decisions at the end of last year, and that is either extending Shane and Dable or firing, okay, you can't be half pregnant because now what happens, he goes into the season and every decision he's going to make is based on, I've got to win games to save my job. So is he going to bench Abdul Carter and maybe hurt the defense, make Shane look bad that his third overall pick is being benched or suspended or fined, and now it hurts the defense to get stops to win games so I could save my ass? Like that's so you, mate. You're making business decisions. You talk about Russell Wilson making business decisions. Dable had to make business decisions all year because it was all about I got to win as many games as possible. Now you got Kafka coming in here. He wants to impress, but at the same time he also wants to lay the groundwork. So is it odd that was it just we fell asleep at the facility and missed the walkthrough? Or is Kafka like, listen, now I can finally do something about this guy because Dable wasn't able to do anything about it because he was fighting for his job. Now, he could have went a step further and not played him, but at the same time, he still has to be as effective as possible. And he doesn't want to kill Shane Bowen, losing a player on his defense to try to help him save his job. So he probably cut the difference and said, all right, I'll just suspend them for the first drive. But then it gets out and now it's the blank show that it always ends up being. He goes to social media, he said, he said, people, liars and all, all that garbage. But at least, at least something was done. But you understood the motivation, guys, why Dable didn't do it because he felt like, I got to win games. Yeah, I can't, I can't do it. Listen, you know, we all love, we all love the past. And Tom Coughlin. Tom Coughlin did the same thing with Lexico Burris in a game against the Seattle Seahawks.

[Alan Hahn]

He did it with Odell too.

[Don La Greca]

Missed the practice. Well, he missed the first series of the game. Why? Because Tom didn't want to lose the game.

[Alan Hahn]

Wasn't that Odell to his last year?

[Don La Greca]

Yeah. And what was in common there, you know, Job was on. Why do you think Odell Beckham Jr. Got away with all the things he got away with? Because Coughlin was up against it. And what ended up happening anyway, Coughlin still lost his job. That's why coaches have to coach, dammit. All right? Because at the end of the day, it's all gonna come out in the wash anyway. So just be Yourself because you try to save your job. And in all walks of life, the guy that tries to save his job is always the first guy that goes because he's already made compromises to his integrity and the way he does the job by trying to keep it in the first place. Just do your job. That's why I thought it looked different yesterday.

[Alan Hahn]

Does it not scream also, though, that whatever the Giants end up doing when it comes to that position, whoever it is, has got to be a strong personality. It's got. You got to have a strong personality. You know what I was looking at? I was looking at one of my terrible L's over the weekend.

[Peter Rosenberg]

How many L's did you have?

[Alan Hahn]

I had two, but I did.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Oh, you mean in the picks in the pics.

[Don La Greca]

It's not you, Peter.

[Peter Rosenberg]

It's almost like.

[Don La Greca]

Peter, you talk about tanking. Oh, yeah, I'm trying. There would be an investigation right now if there was a prize for finishing last in our picks.

[Alan Hahn]

Oh, no, no. He. Yeah, it looks like it feels like I'm tanking. Yeah. The league would probably make a lottery. So he couldn't get the number one pick.

[Don La Greca]

Right, Right.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah, but. But one of them was, was Jacksonville and Rams. And I saw the way Jacksonville finished their game and it was a bad loss to Davis Mills and the Texans and their defense, the secondary got shredded and it's like maybe they're getting exposed because they were a good defense. And I thought, you know, again, you can trust the Chargers and on the road. And they. I'm mad at myself because I was paying attention to it. And Liam Cohen, new coach, first. First year head coach, he had a lot of fire and brimstone all week. And about his team, they were playing home, they were coming off a loss where they felt away. And he was absolutely riding that narrative the whole week with his team. And I mean, did they not open up a can on Jim Harbaugh and company?

[Don La Greca]

They sure did.

[Alan Hahn]

Absolutely. And that's to me, that you need that kind of a leader where the team responds when he's saying stuff and doing stuff like that. That's the kind of stuff you're looking for is a team that responds to its coach. And I saw that in first year head coach. The Giants have got to find somebody that they know players will respond to and respect.

[Don La Greca]

Yeah, they have to. They absolutely have to. And this is why, you know, I roll my eyes when we talk about tanking and it's better off to lose. I'm really surprised Michael had that opinion about the Jets Because. Because it just erodes and you become a loser. And that's what the Giants are right now. They're losers. They don't know how to win anymore. They don't have to get off the mat. Right. So they wait for bad things to happen and it just becomes a habit of losing games all the time because that's all they know. And now the discipline area becomes a problem. And now you start pointing fingers at other people and it, it, you don't see that the disease that losing is for an organization, all for the better pick, but what kind of residue does that leave? And the new pick, the new shiny toy you get from all that losing now has to enter this cancerous body of an organization that's eroded by all the losing and the lack of caring and the business decisions that you end up making. Why do you think guys, that all the teams with losing records are the ones with the most injuries? Because guys aren't fighting through it. Now I'm there with two and nine. I back spot. I'm. Let's just put.

[Alan Hahn]

I don't want to have surgery in the offseason.

[Don La Greca]

Let's get the surgery now.

[Alan Hahn]

Yep.

[Don La Greca]

Let's get it over with. We stay.

[Alan Hahn]

Absolutely.

[Don La Greca]

You know, that's why all these injuries pile up in the last second. You know, he's going to be a game time decision. Oh, look, he's not playing. If they were 9 and 2, he'd drag his broken leg onto the field to play now and again. I'm not being critical of it because sometimes that is the right decision for your career, but you're forced to make that right decision because what are you playing for? You're going to lose anyway. You're going to find a way to lose and the only way to cure it, guys, is to win and then make that the habit.

[Peter Rosenberg]

And again, it's so frustrating because with this Giants team, there are a few times in which they could have won and then maybe everyone's approach is different. You get a completely different look.

[Alan Hahn]

That's the magic at the team.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But they were, they were right there in what, three games? Four games.

[Alan Hahn]

That's. Again, I can't get over that. Again, I know John Mara is in a battle right now and we're all thinking of him, but I just know that I'm looking at it if I'm an owner. I can't get over that. I can't get over that. We had three, at least three winnable games. You could say four, because again, the Saints aren't trying to win. They're terrible. And you still lost that game. But you had three games that every analytic, every probability told you that you should have won those games, and you didn't win them. And it turned your season into one of hope and anticipation and the ability to try to make the playoffs or at least just show some growth. And instead look where it has you right now. It has you in a place that you've been in all too often in the last 12 years, and you're on the hamster wheel. And now I got to find a new coach, all because three games we should have won. We didn't.

[Peter Rosenberg]

So, so, so maddening. If you're a Giants fan, this message is sponsored by BetterHelp. Shorter days don't have to be so dismal. It's time to reach out and check in with those you care and to remind ourselves that we're not alone. This month, don't wait to reach out. Whether you're checking in on a friend or reaching out to a therapist yourself, BetterHelp makes it easier to take that first step. Our listeners get 10% off their first month. Just call 250 and say the keyword timeout. That's keyword timeout after calling pound2.50.

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[Podcast Announcer]

Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I didn't listen to anything you just said.

[Podcast Announcer]

Catch the show on demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcasts.

[Alan Hahn]

Hey you know guys, it's only been one segment of the show. And you know what I've yet to tell you about?

[Don La Greca]

What's that?

[Alan Hahn]

The favorite thing for me to talk about. Bath Fitter.

[Don La Greca]

Oh, yeah.

[Alan Hahn]

You know what I mean? Because it's like this is the time of year where you have people over and they're going to use a guest room. They're going to need to take a shower in your house. You're embarrassed. If you're embarrassed of the guest room shower or a shower that everybody uses when they come over and stay over for the holidays, this is right now why you need to pay close attention to me. Because I was able to remodel a bath in my house. In fact, they ripped out the bath and they put in a full, beautiful shower. So now holiday season, everybody comes over. I know that they're going to use not only a shower that is brand new and beautiful, but also one that is functioning a lot better than the old one. That's for sure. My sister liked it so much she had her bathroom done as well by Bath Fitter. BadFitter offers all types of custom bath renovations, including their unique permafit solution for a watertight fit. It takes one day, everybody. That's it. That's why you can do it right now, right before the holidays. It's durable, easy to clean, no demolition, lower cost than a replacement. And how about this lifetime guarantee so you get no money down, no payments, no interest for 18 months. No interest till April of 2027. That's one part of it. But right now, if you act, you can save up to $800 on a complete Bat Fitter system. That's why I'm telling you now's the time to do it. Go see their website or call for details on this Black Friday savings I just told you about. You can trust the Bat Fitter team just like we did. So start designing your bath today. @batfitter.com, there's only one Bath Fitter.

[Don La Greca]

Ah.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, before we got into Don Allen's big bath talk, I was thrilled that not only did Jacob, who does his job so well and always knows the theme, come back with John Cena, a John Cena song. But he came out with bad man too. You didn't even come out with Time is Now. You came out with the B side earlier on the subway. I was looking at how much the record is for that. I think I have it. But the problem is over the last 20 years, like my record collection, Don, like for the first 20. For the first 15, 10 years of my record, Collecting life. It was all very. It was with me and organized. And then as I moved out of dorm rooms and moved, now it's like everywhere. And it's kind of become a long term forever project. So I don't know where certain things are. This, the John Cena single goes for like a hundred bucks. It's very. It's a very rare piece of vinyl.

[Alan Hahn]

Popular.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Wait, oh, wait. Anthony, you just said all of you guys have the cd.

[Alan Hahn]

Anybody in the studio, I believe, has the cd.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You bought the cd?

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You guys are part of the platinum. You're part of the platinum status.

[Alan Hahn]

We feel proud about it.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You guys should have asked to be in the suite tonight for John Cena. What are we doing?

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah, what are we doing?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah, you guys should be there, you know? You know? Yeah. By the way, Alan, you know, you know, Anthony doesn't believe that he deserves to set foot in the suite.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah, well, it's because he was probably told that once or twice. Those are the kinds of things that stay with you, especially with Anthony when you're given that look, when it's like, hey, Peter, hey, don't. And then you get, what are you doing here? Look. Yeah, Anthony already thinks.

[Peter Rosenberg]

And Anthony already thinks people are thinking that even when they're not.

[Alan Hahn]

Well, that's ridiculous. He's. He produces the best show on radio.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah. Don't write dare.

[Don La Greca]

Sit down.

[Alan Hahn]

And our show to suck music.

[Don La Greca]

You're allowed one wing. You're a napkin. Hey, La Cracker. Open your mouth.

[Peter Rosenberg]

By the way, you got to go.

[Don La Greca]

To the eighth floor to use the toilet.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah, yeah.

[Alan Hahn]

Zip. And I'll tell you, no napkin. Hey, while we're doing this, can we shout out Stevie Bay?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Sure. Please.

[Alan Hahn]

Big Steve's going for second round. He's got, you know, he got a cervical nerve block procedure.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Okay.

[Alan Hahn]

Neck. It's like a four round procedure. He's in round two today. Okay, so he's in the hospital. He's getting his procedure done. He listens every day. You know, he sounds like crazy.

[Peter Rosenberg]

All right, man.

[Alan Hahn]

So we just want to wish him the best.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Oh, absolutely. Sending him all the love, man. Good luck with it, dude. I'm sure you'll be fine. We look forward to getting to the other side of it. Now, while we mentioned the Garden, I do have to tell you guys one thing. Did you guys hear anything about the. The melee at the Garden on Saturday?

[Alan Hahn]

Yes.

[Peter Rosenberg]

So do you want. Can I tell you about it for a second?

[Alan Hahn]

I. I want to hear everything you know about it because it. It Was insane.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Don, did you hear about it?

[Don La Greca]

I did not hear about it. Alan had told me he wanted to talk ufc. I instantly. Because you glazed over to be happy. No, I said, of course. And I'm thinking about the fight. Why are we doing that? But if Alan's passionate about it, sure.

[Alan Hahn]

This wasn't in. This wasn't in the Arctic. This was in the. In the. In the. I don't know where.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, it was. It was the cage size scenes. It was the floor. No, it was the floor on the.

[Alan Hahn]

Floor, but it was. Yeah, it was off this. There were cops involved in this.

[Peter Rosenberg]

No, listen, I'm. I'm standing. I'm in the suite, enjoying. By the way, they changed the. They changed the wings. They're no longer Korean barbecue. They're an updated wing now. It's a spicy honey wings again. Yes. A spicy honey glazed barbecue. I like them. I like them better than the Korean ones, honestly.

[Alan Hahn]

But.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But. So I'm sitting there talking to a couple people sort of it towards the back of the suite, and one of the people I'm talking to, like, beelines to the front of the suite and to start staring over. I'm like, we're between matches. And then I look over, and then I see everybody standing there, and I go, what the hell? Including my wife. And I'm like, what the hell's going on? I run over there, guys. I look down to the floor, and you know when you see a bra, you just see moving, like, just a crowd moving. I have never. I have never at an event, seen it continue on for that long. I could not believe they couldn't get it under control.

[Alan Hahn]

And by the way, what was your level of, like, fear? Because. Right. You get that sense when you see a fight like that.

[Peter Rosenberg]

No, you're such a. Great question, Alan, Because I legitimately find those things to be terrifying.

[Alan Hahn]

Of course, I have.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I have actual nightmares about that. About, like, you're in a big room and it starts losing control, and you're like, oh, my God, what's happening now? Fear wasn't high because we were up in the suite, but I was just like, oh, this is bad now. It became clear after a little bit that it was kind of specific and contained. It wasn't just everyone in the crowd. The problem for the cops who busted their asses and did their best was that they were dealing guys with members of these fight teams. These are not regular dudes.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah, these are.

[Peter Rosenberg]

These are dudes who are training with fighters and they're going at each other. So, Dana, White did the right thing today. The guy, Dylan Danis, whose team got into it with the champs team Dennis, has been banned from ever attending anything UFC ever again. So Dana White did the right thing. But I will tell you guys for a moment, as someone who, not as much as either of you two, but has been to the Garden at this point, I don't know, over a hundred times, I've never seen anything like that ever. It was, it was a, it was an iffy moment.

[Alan Hahn]

Now, Peter, for those who might not know, who is Dylan Danis, like, what's his relationship with, with ufc? Why would he be there? Why would he have that kind of location?

[Peter Rosenberg]

He's a, he's a fighter. He's a famous boxer and like fighter and social media guy and trash talker. He's listed officially as a mixed martial artist. But he, for there. He was probably there because he wanted something like that to happen.

[Alan Hahn]

Didn't he also used to, like what? Didn't he train with Conor McGregor?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Oh, did he? Yeah, I forget. I remember him from fighting Logan Paul.

[Alan Hahn]

Okay.

[Peter Rosenberg]

He. And he was really nasty in the lead up to the fight with Logan Paul. But they, But Dylan Danis is a real fighter. So yeah, that's. That, that sounds logical, Alan, but like, he's a real fighter. His team is a bunch of goons also. And then. So it's just. I don't know what, I don't know enough about what the storyline is between them for what happened. My guess is there's no real sense to be made of it, but, man, it was a scary scene momentarily. Dude, it was. I'll tell you one thing, looking forward to going back to good old safe, family friendly WWE tonight. Gonna be. It's gonna be a time at the guard. All right, we're talking to you guys. 1-800-919-3776, your thoughts on the Giants and of course, just who the teams are to beat in the NFL right now. Because we wake up today and we look at, after you see Kansas City loses to Denver, they're out of the playoff picture right now. Guys, there really is no one that you can say is the absolute cream of the crop in the NFL. At some point, Alan, you want all of us to make our case for one team.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah. Like I'll give you, obviously the two teams with the best record. Like this is what you have right now, by the way. In the top five in the league, the Broncos and the Patriots are nine and two. The Colts and the Rams and the Eagles are eight and two. So there's your top five. I didn't mention Bills, I didn't mention packers, who everybody was, you know, coronading at the start of the season. I didn't mention Lions, I didn't mention Chiefs, Bucks. At some, at one point earlier this season, remember, everybody thought Tampa really had it going on with, with Baker. Like I'm naming you, like these are names. These are teams right now where the Eagles are the defending champs and the Rams have recently won a Super bowl and have been, you know, they've been good every year, but Broncos, Patriots and Colts, I don't know if anybody had that on the bingo card as top five teams in the league before the season started. How much are you buying them?

[Don La Greca]

Well, at least the Broncos made the playoffs last year. The Patriots I think everybody thought would take a step up. But to this level.

[Alan Hahn]

This level.

[Don La Greca]

Crazy.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah, they won five in a row.

[Don La Greca]

Crazy. But, but it also tells you another thing too, that while football is no different than any other sport, that there are dead times in the regular season. You know, obviously not for the jets and Giants. They buried themselves already.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah.

[Don La Greca]

But our producer, Roland Dratch with the, with the Devils, a huge Dolphin fan. And we were on the bus going wherever we were coming back from Washington, going to the airport and he's like, Dolphins are making the playoffs. And I kind of laughed about it. And then I thought about it. Well, listen, they beat Washington. I think they've got like the jets coming up. They've got like a game against the Raider. Like they can win three, four in a row here and find their way into the playoffs. A team that just fired their general manager.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah.

[Don La Greca]

Still have time. Can still take advantage of a weak schedule to get their way in there. And with that third wild card, it's always kind of a, a middling team that makes it anyway. And, and you can't say there's a.

[Peter Rosenberg]

World in which they can't catch the Jaguars.

[Alan Hahn]

It is possible.

[Don La Greca]

Unless you're God awful like the jets and the Giants.

[Alan Hahn]

The New York teams.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Commanders. I'm there.

[Don La Greca]

And the commanders now because they lost their starting quarterback.

[Alan Hahn]

Saints, they're done. Yeah.

[Don La Greca]

But everybody else, like, so you say, you know, September into October, what does it all mean? And then you got to go. They're going to eventually add an 18th game. So the NFL so sacrosanct in their regular season. How every game matters. But to, to 75% of the league does the first month matter. The games can be thrown away. You could still get up off the mat. That Kansas City be three and a half games out in the division with Denver and you're still not ruling them out. To possibly still win that division for a 10th consecutive time tells you that there are still even in the NFL, meaningless times during the course of the regular season for some teams.

[Alan Hahn]

I'm going to give you each six teams, three on the AFC side, three on the NFC side. And they're all out looking in right now on the bubble. And you tell me out of these teams, if you could only put all your money on one of them, which one is it? Okay, the Texans, the Chiefs and the Ravens on the AFC side. The Lions, the Panthers and the Vikings on the NFC side.

[Don La Greca]

If I had to be all in on one all in.

[Alan Hahn]

You had all your money. So it's them who you think.

[Don La Greca]

How do you not. How do you not say the Chiefs?

[Alan Hahn]

Chiefs.

[Don La Greca]

How do you not say it? The same team.

[Alan Hahn]

They played Denver on Christmas Day, man. How big is that game?

[Don La Greca]

At least the game will be in Kansas City. So it gives them a decent. And. And you and I. Michael and Peter had fun with me all last year, and I said Kansas City be had. I was right. Not in the sense that Philadelphia eventually beat them. They could be had. There just wasn't any teams good enough to do it. And so I think the Chiefs were not as good as they've been, but the only team that was better than them finally beat them in Philadelphia right now. They. But they were still trending down, so they're continuing to trend down. But of all the teams. Texans a mess, right? Ravens, they barely beat Cleveland yesterday. I mean, I watched a lot of that game and I'm like, I thought the Ravens. You know, I've been high on the Ravens, and I still think they're going to win that division. But they needed a couple of breaks and Henry finally carried them the victory. I know whose game was in Cleveland. The Browns. Defense is good, but still, you know, you know, Sanders was in the game and all that, so I don't know about the Ravens. Vikings seem to be a bit of a mess.

[Alan Hahn]

J.J. mcCarthy's. He's not having a great, like a rival performance as a quarterback there where they thought he was the next one. They let Sam go and they're gonna. They might regret it.

[Don La Greca]

They might regret it because it just doesn't look like he's ready. So if Texans, I would probably say Chiefs in the afc and I. And I guess the Lions.

[Alan Hahn]

That's a good call. All right, so Peter, you. Because I'll give. I have. I have probabilities. Percentages that I know you guys can't stand, but I'm going to use them anyway. Peter, if you got one of the six, you can't take the Chiefs. Now, who'd you take?

[Peter Rosenberg]

All right, from the starting with the afc.

[Alan Hahn]

Yep. Texans, Chiefs, Ravens. Texas Ravens, Lions, Panthers, King, Vikings.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Wait, these are all teams that are not in, you're saying?

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah, they're on the bubble. One of them's gonna get well, well, well.

[Peter Rosenberg]

If the Chiefs are taken, you take Ravens, right?

[Alan Hahn]

You're going Ravens.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yes.

[Alan Hahn]

Okay. Over Lions.

[Don La Greca]

Yes.

[Alan Hahn]

The Lions are right there, too. Like.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah.

[Alan Hahn]

You know what I mean?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah, totally. The Lions are right there and I.

[Alan Hahn]

Want to talk you out of it. I don't want to talk. Yeah, I'm just saying, like. So no NFC team really gives you that kind of confidence, but the Ravens do, because again, Rogers injury in Pittsburgh, it's going to. Going to mean a lot. And the Ravens just always figure it out once they get healthy.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Although I don't love. The problem is I don't love the Ravens once they get to the playoffs.

[Don La Greca]

No.

[Alan Hahn]

Well, who cares? It's getting there.

[Peter Rosenberg]

So from a, getting their standpoint, they're.

[Alan Hahn]

Outside looking in right now and they're already close.

[Peter Rosenberg]

They're at 5 and 5.

[Alan Hahn]

Yes.

[Peter Rosenberg]

They're already hanging out. I mean, right now the Jaguars are at 6 and 4 in the 7.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah, they came back, so they're right there. Okay, so give me the Ravens. Okay, you got the Ravens. So the Ravens, out of all the six teams I gave you, have the highest probability of making the playoffs? 77%.

[Peter Rosenberg]

That's right.

[Alan Hahn]

Probably because of the division, of course. The Lions are at number two at 75%. The Chiefs, Donnie. 51%.

[Don La Greca]

Wow.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But these stats, the problem is these stats don't. They don't. They don't. Religion's not involved. You know what I'm saying?

[Alan Hahn]

Well, it's all based off of.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Spirituality is not involved.

[Alan Hahn]

Strength of remaining schedule.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah, but that's. The Chiefs aren't about that. The Chiefs are with God.

[Alan Hahn]

With God. And, and Taylor.

[Peter Rosenberg]

That's right.

[Alan Hahn]

And Taylor, which really are the same. But yeah, I found that to be amazing. Like, like the, like the Lions. And out of all those teams, the most surprising to me is the Lions, would you say?

[Don La Greca]

Yes.

[Alan Hahn]

I'm really surprised that they are as mediocre as they've been this season. Although I don't. Campbell, I, I. That, that Eagle, that game against the Eagle, that's a bad offense against an aggressive defense. That was, I don't want nothing to do with that game.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I don't, I don't want to beat them up too much for an ugly game with terrible wind like it was against a great football team that doesn't, you know, them losing in Philadelphia.

[Alan Hahn]

They run the ball, though, don't they?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah, they do. I mean, Jameer Gibbs should give you the option.

[Alan Hahn]

That's what I mean.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But, like, I'm just not willing to throw them away because of a tough loss against the world champs, against the team who. I think when you have the conversation of who's the cream of the crop, to me it's Philadelphia. Philadelphia to me is the cream of the NFL.

[Don La Greca]

But we're, but they're coming off a loss to Minnesota. Who he just said they, they don't look right. Something, something's wrong with the vi. And yet they still beat the Lions. Listen, the Lions haven't accomplished anything. They're good because they've been good in the regular season. But, you know, do they have the pedigree that the Chiefs have? Because that's what it's going to come down to, right, is that we're going to get, we're going to get to the nitty gritty of this thing, all right? And even though that game is in Denver on Christmas Day, do the Broncos have the stomach to beat the Chiefs when it matters?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Just like the Bill Jones, if you will?

[Don La Greca]

Because the Bills, the Bills beat the Chiefs four or five of the last six times they played him in the regular season. That's right. In the postseason. They can't do it because these teams know. The Eagles know. The Chiefs know that when it really, when the rubber hits the road, they're gonna be ready.

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[Peter Rosenberg]

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[Alan Hahn]

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[Podcast Announcer]

Thanks for listening to the Don Han and Rosenberg podcast.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I didn't listen to anything you just said.

[Podcast Announcer]

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[Don La Greca]

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[Peter Rosenberg]

I love what you've done.

[Don La Greca]

See, Bashel, the head coach of the Chicago Blackhawks was talking about like his depth at defense. He's like, yeah, you know, you like to have six or seven and then can't do it. Then he laughed and his hands were going up and down like it's even. It's everywhere.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, no, now, now it. Because it took long enough and now the kids have lost it.

[Don La Greca]

Yeah.

[Peter Rosenberg]

And now every old boomer loser like us, we all know it too well.

[Alan Hahn]

How do you ruin something that's annoying? But kids love it.

[Don La Greca]

Have the adults start, have adults start.

[Alan Hahn]

Using and the kids will hate it. So it's a great point. We did our job. Salute everyone.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah, it's a great point. You know what, it's a great call by you. Thank you for. To all the old people who ruined this entire thing.

[Alan Hahn]

Fastest way to kill a trend that's annoying.

[Peter Rosenberg]

The most creative one I've seen so far of, you know, and I'm using older loosely because this guy's in his late 20s. But the other day, Carmelo Hayes, this wrestler, you know, he was doing the bit where like you go up where a wrestler is holding another wrestler and they have him up against the ropes and then they against the turnbuckles and they keep punching them. And the crowd counts along, you know, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6. And when it gets to 6, he just looks up at the crowd and does the thing with his hands that I thought that was, it was a dad joke, but I enjoyed it. But guess What? I'm a dad. 1-800-9193776 let's start off with Vinnie in Staten Island. Hey, Vinny. What's going on, guys? How you Doing bud.

[Don La Greca]

All right. I like the. Like, I love the way Mike Kafka looked on the sideline yesterday. He looked like he really knew how to. He just really looked like he knew how to.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Coach.

[Don La Greca]

And Joe Shane, why did you bring Russell Wilson in when you had Jameis Winston? I mean, everybody knew Jameis Winston could play. He throws a lot of interceptions, but he will keep you in the game. The guy could throw the football. Listen, I think there was two things at play with Russell Wilson. One, trying to catch lightning in a bottle, thinking that maybe the whole Denver thing, he was humbled. This guy's a borderline hall of Famer. But the other thing in. And Alan kind of brought this up. I think it was on a different subject. Alan.

[Alan Hahn]

What's that?

[Don La Greca]

That sometimes, as wacky as it is, you do do favors for people. And I wonder if there was some sort of connection somewhere. Agent. Somebody in the organization crossed paths with somebody with Wilson who said, do me a favor, give this guy a chance. And I still also believe that once Wilson came here, there was some sort of unspoken guarantee he'd get a legit shot. I. I think that's why he back. That's why he got the chance to start. That's why he backed up Dart. I think that it wasn't just coming here and signing. There must have been some sort of handshake deal. We will give you a legitimate look. That's the only thing that makes any sense to me. Guys really happened in sports.

[Alan Hahn]

People don't like it.

[Don La Greca]

But doesn't it happen, Alan? And it happens more often than you think.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah, it absolutely. It does. It absolutely does. But there does have to come to a point. Point where you just, you know, if you wanted to start the season with him, because that was part of your. Your agreement, why he came to you rather than maybe going somewhere else or whatever, it was fine. But because, remember, I believe they signed Jameis first.

[Peter Rosenberg]

It was. It was Jameis first.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah. And that's. And then they did Rush, and because they didn't draft yet, so they didn't know if they'd get the quarterback they wanted. And at that point, it was, now what do we do? But that does happen, Don. It does happen. Where it's like, you know, the handshake, the wink of, you know, don't worry about it. We'll take care of you. We'll do the right thing by you. But once you saw him play enough to get to a point where it's like, all right, we got to make a change. I guess it Was. Don't embarrass him by making him a third quarterback. Don't embarrass him.

[Don La Greca]

Right.

[Alan Hahn]

By cutting him. It had to have been that.

[Peter Rosenberg]

It's just. It was such a. It's. I don't see in what world you. After you saw Wilson play for guys. I'm not trying to exaggerate. Maybe a half of football, you go, oh, this is as bad as it's ever looked. He does not have it.

[Don La Greca]

That.

[Peter Rosenberg]

That's the funny thing for me is, you know, listen, Winston, you know, can do what he did yesterday, which is be really good and then make some mistakes. And Alan, we can discuss whether the last pick was his fault or not, but he certainly had his moments through to the spot.

[Alan Hahn]

Hyatt didn't get there, but he certainly. Two different things, but no, no.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But he certainly had his moments where it was his fault. It wasn't.

[Alan Hahn]

He wasn't great. He was fine.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But he was markedly better than Wilson.

[Don La Greca]

Yeah.

[Alan Hahn]

God, yes.

[Peter Rosenberg]

He gave them a chance to win.

[Alan Hahn]

No question.

[Don La Greca]

The only thing that Wilson gave you was that regulation in Dallas, which now it appears anyone. Which was just a complete aberration. We've seen Dallas's defense not be good, and he still ended up costing the game with the way he played in overtime. But you can understand, okay, maybe. Maybe we've tapped into something. Maybe he can do that again. And he never did it again. And it wasn't even the inability to play, but you could just see his heart was not in it to do it. But I'm sure. And this is the way the favor goes down is, listen, Russell's a really good guy, and unfortunately, it didn't work out at the end in Seattle, and Denver was a complete mess. Give him a chance somewhere with a real professional organization, help his reputation out a little bit. Remember, this is a guy that's really going to, I think, have to work. Work hard to get into the hall of Fame. I think there. There's enough case that he'll be a borderline hall of Famer, but he needed a place to land to kind of clean up what happened in Denver.

[Alan Hahn]

Yep.

[Don La Greca]

And I think. I think somebody in the Giants organization gave him that opportunity. Yeah. And they just didn't know when to stop it. So.

[Alan Hahn]

No, it's a good theory. It's a good theory. Oh, look. Because you hear how they were. Great teammate, like, what a leader he's been. You know, like, they're. They're. They're definitely trying to launder his. His rep.

[Podcast Announcer]

Thanks for listening to the Don Han and Ro Rosenberg podcast.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I don't want to know how the.

[Alan Hahn]

Sausage is made, but I just want to know it's good.

[Podcast Announcer]

Hear more of Don Allen and Peter weekday afternoon starting at 3 on 8 80, ESPN, the ESPN New York app, and your smart speakers.