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- [00:00]
A
This isn't just another ESPN fantasy football season. It's your shot at greatness. With a refreshed design, the ESPN Fantasy app is sharper than ever. So you can draft like a pro and dominate your league. And introducing Gridiron Gauntlet, a new game mode where the best compete to be crowned the number one fantasy football player of 2025. One app, one shot, one champion. Download the ESPN fantasy app and sign up to play ESPN Fantasy Football today. This isn't Vietnam, it's Radio Hanh. I mean, he had a handful of.
- [00:36]
B
Twig and berries and Rosenberg. Everything about it was pure, unadulterated ass.
- [00:42]
A
This isn't North Dakota. This is New York. This is Don Han and Rosenberg. The best threesome I've ever heard on 880 ESPN and the ESPN New York app. That sounded like a new open. So great job, powers to be. Get that done. How are you, Peter?
- [01:04]
B
Oh, I'm fantastic. And yeah, ever since the other day we mentioned something about new opens. We've been getting new opens galore from the, the powers that be. I think Anthony Pusick putting in, putting in.
- [01:14]
A
They're working. They're trying to make it all happen. I love it.
- [01:16]
B
Well, especially after everything that took place the other day, which was a very un.
- [01:19]
A
Will you let it go? I was the one that was upset about it. You keep it alive. That was like a devious laugh too. Like I, I, I, I got you to admit you're, you're nothing but a big troublemaker. Seriously guys.
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B
See I didn't mean for that to happen. It just happened.
- [01:41]
A
Oh my God. The show today.
- [01:44]
B
A ghost just turned on my television, by the way. So we're off to an interesting start.
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A
Oh, this should be a very, very fun show. Take up till 6:30. And we got Mets, Mariners.
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B
Oh, like you dream of.
- [01:53]
A
That goes, this goes way back. The rivalry. Oh, when the Mets and the Mariners get together, you throw. Batting down the hatches. Big deal. Yankees, Cardinals, they start a series out in St. Louis, but we'll take up until 6:30. And you know, we got lots to do today. We got fraud alert Friday at 4:30 so line them up with the emails and at 6 o' clock we'll have an Anthony Pusick LED ENN. But I'm shot out of a cannon today again because it's, it's the same result, Peter. But it's always something different with the Mets. And the Yankees have the day off so they'll get a reprieve here after their loss to the Twins the day before. But the Mets are just in free fall. 13 out of their last 15. They've dropped 2 and 13 in their last 15 games. Now, only 10 teams in the history of baseball have ever had that kind of a run and still made the postseason. So. But we talked about it yesterday, Peter. You know, making the postseason, what does that even mean, you know, to still be alive? What does it mean? Six of 15 teams make the playoffs. So everybody feels like they're alive. And the teams that weren't alive, you know, sold at the deadline. So it's a, you know, I don't know. When Mendoza says, you know, we're still in the thick of it, what does that mean? What does that mean exactly? You're still in the thick. So everything's okay. That I'm all right to just have my team be awful and lose pretty much every day over the last month, but it's all okay because we're still in the thick of it. I just think that's lame. You're reading from a script at this point, Peter. You know, we kill Aaron Boone for being ultra positive, and that's the reason he has the job. What's Mendoza's excuse? So I know he came from the Yankee organization, but this is the way we do things. Everything's okay. We're going to be all right. We're still in the thick of things. We're still a very talented ball club. When does it become just rhetoric? When does it just become words that don't mean anything? Are we stupid? Are we supposed to just believe everything that we're fed? We watch every day, we watch every play. So what are we doing here?
- [04:09]
B
It's kind of the worst part of baseball, Don, is that you can't just die, you know, with other sports, you can move on with your life. You could say it's done. What's done is done. But no, now you still got to play out this Mariners this weekend. Let's see what happens. Oh, they win two or three against the Mariners, okay. But it's gut wrenching. It's. No, it feels like it's completely done.
- [04:31]
A
But here's why I'll disagree.
- [04:34]
B
Go ahead.
- [04:36]
A
Because you're not done in football, right? We've seen nine and eight teams even. Eight, nine teams make the playoffs even when they're at the 16 game schedule. We saw seven and nine teams make the playoffs, Right. So there's a lot of teams that, you know, aren't very good, but come December, they're still mathematically alive. They're still in the thick of things, as Mendoza puts it, basketball, you're a playing team. 10 was it 10 of the 15 teams in each conference in, in some way shape or form make the postseason? Some is the play in, some as the top six, but 20 of the 30 teams make the playoffs. But if the Knicks next year are settling for the play in where they're like battling between the 8, 9 and 10 seeds in the Eastern Conference, is Mike Brown going to tell you everything's okay, we're still in the thick of things? Or will there be some sort of accountability for a team that's expected to win the conference, that's hanging out with the average teams late in the season? Would that be okay? Would Andy Reid tell you or would Sirianni tell you in the NFL if the Eagles and the Kansas City Chiefs are holding on to the third wild card, hey, that we're okay, we're still in the thick of things. Or would there be a level of accountability from going to the super bowl to now just hanging on? And the same in hockey, you know, was Peter Laviolette when the, when the Rangers, when they were still alive in the playoffs after, after going to the conference final the year before, was Peter Laviolette telling you, hey, we're still in the thick of things, everything's okay? No, he was upset with his team. He was, you could see in the press conference he was seething because of the way his team was playing. But why in baseball is that's all right. Get it's Kevin Bacon in Animals. All is well. Why, why can't both be true? Hey, we're still alive. But I'm not going to tolerate this when, when, when Mendoza says we've got a talented team, but this talented team is not living up to expectations. We're not struggling. We're beyond struggling. It's ridiculous. I'm still, I still believe in this team, but this is unacceptable. Why can't you say that? Why is that off the table? Are they that fragile, Peter? Are they that thin skinned that you can't say it like it is?
- [07:01]
B
But real quick, is it across baseball or does it seem to be something that happens when you get near the Hudson river or the East River? Because, you know, we saw Dave Roberts at least calling out his team last week and they're not having a fall off that even remotely replicates what's happening in New York and he's calling out Shohei Otani. So Don, is it across baseball or is it a here thing?
- [07:26]
A
It's a great or just a baseball thing or Is it just the Yankee thing because Mendoza came from the Yankees and it's really all he knows.
- [07:33]
B
Right, right. And it's just a bizarre situation because I don't understand the benefit for these teams of not saying word one.
- [07:49]
A
It just.
- [07:49]
B
I do not get it, Don. Who ultimately is winning here and why would he. I thought New York is supposed to be. If you can make it there, you can make it anywhere. Now it's the opposite. No, it's not. You can make it there, you can make it anywhere. Now when it comes to baseball, it's like, oh, you can make it there, no problem, because they'll say nothing about you. I mean, it's completely incongruent. So the media is really hard here. You have to fear the New York Post. However, your own team will do nothing and let anything happen and never say a word. It doesn't make sense.
- [08:24]
A
No, it makes no sense. Now, if you don't know what I'm talking about. Here is Carlos Mendoza after another Met loss in which they again blow a lead. And we'll get into that a little deeper, but here is Mendoza last night on the struggles of this team.
- [08:40]
B
We're not playing well, but too much talent.
- [08:43]
A
You know, we're going through a very tough time right now.
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B
There's a lot of good players there.
- [08:47]
A
We got to get through this.
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C
We can be looking at the standing.
- [08:50]
A
You know, we're not where we at. We haven't played well, but we still.
- [08:54]
B
Pretty much riding in the thick of them. So we got to find a way.
- [08:58]
A
No good. I'm not asking him to give up. I'm not asking him to tap out. But when does. When are you beyond struggles? Like, same thing with the Yankees, you know, when you're 19 and 31 over the last 50 plus games. Is that a struggle or is that kind of who you are that we're deep enough into the season now? We are now at the midway point of August. There's what, 41 games left on the schedule? At what point are we struggling? Or this is who we are seven games above.500, a half game ahead of Cincinnati for the final wild card spot. At what point is it beyond struggling? And this is kind of what we are right now. I don't think there's anything wrong with saying like it is instead of dancing around it as if every. Everything's going to be all right. You're in the thick of things because, let's face it, Major League Baseball allows you to be in the thick of things. Adding a third wild card so that means that you don't have to be that much above.500 to still be alive. Now, let's get to the game because I want to hammer the Mets here because the Yankees hear this all the time, but the Mets are in the same boat. All right, the Mets major problem. The biggest problem with this team, Peter, is they don't get any length out of their starters. And we blame the pitchers for not doing their job. But like last night, Kodai Sanga is on the mound. He is your ace. He is your. He's supposed to be your best pitcher. He's not. David Peterson's your best pitcher, but he's supposed to be top. Wrong. Your ace. You're in a rubber match of a three game set against a lousy brave team. But it's a brave team that has your number. You need to get things turned around. You're in the sixth inning. He gives up a base hit with two outs, 93 pitches, five and two thirds. Runner in scoring position, he goes to Rodgers, which is the right move considering how Tyler Rodgers is pitched. So I'm not going to kill him for the strategic decision of it. But Rogers gives up a hit, gives up another hit. Mets blow the lead, lose the game. But what would be so wrong, Peter, as a manager, to skate. Screw these numbers. Screw the whole lanes that my relief pitchers have to be in. You're my ace. You're on the mound in a big game. Go out and get the final out of the inning.
- [11:38]
C
Go out.
- [11:38]
A
Get me through six. Do it. Show me something. And then he gets the. If he gets the out, don't you think that pumps up the dugout? Doesn't that get everybody riled up? Senga went the extra mile. We asked him to go outside of his comfort zone. We asked him to go the extra mile to get us through the sixth inning, get me into the seventh inning. And then the Mets, if you believe in the fallacy of the predetermined outcome, they get the two runs in the bottom of the sixth inning. Senga ends up winning the game because he's the pitcher of record. Don't you think that has value in the room? That our starting pitcher, our ace, sucked it up, got the final out of the inning, set us up for a big win, we win the series, we start moving on. But no, it's got to be. Well, hey, Listen, he's got 93 pitches. We don't want him to break a sweat. Let's bring in Rodgers, who's been good, and we'll get through it. What is so wrong, Peter, to just say, it's gut check time, guys. He's talking about having talented players take advantage of that. You're my ace. Go out and get out of this jam. And you know what? If it doesn't work, then you go in the press conference after the game and say, you know what? I said, screw the numbers. He's my ace. He didn't get the job done, I'd do it again. That's what I want out of these managers. You're living and dying by these stupid numbers. You. You're not trusting your players. You're not asking them to ever leave their comfort zone, Peter. So you wonder why these players act like robots. They act like robots because they're never asked to do anything more than what they're supposed to do. They're never asked to go and check their gut and give just a little bit extra. We're finding excuses. Oh, don't have him play too many days in a row. Oh, don't have him go the third time through the order. Don't have him face that guy because he hasn't got a hit against him in a month. So let's pinch hit for him. Never ask a player to do anything more. And if that gets ingrained into their DNA, then it looks like they're not trying. Because sports is supposed to be about giving more, leaving it all out on the table, giving the fictional 110% to be better than the other guy. Not playing a round of Risk where all you're doing is just going by the sheer math of it. Sports is supposed to be not just going by your gut, but playing into your gut, into your passion, going outside your comfort level, doing something that you're not expected to do and then achieving that. That's what rallies people around. That's what gets fans into it. So mathematically, statistically, strategically, Mendoza did the right thing by going to Rogers. But ultimately, Peter, wouldn't it have been better to. To ask these star players to maybe do something a little bit more and take advantage of these supposed talented players that you have? Am I asking too much?
- [14:29]
B
You're not asking too much at all. But, Don, in terms of likelihood, I might as well say, you know, it'd be nice. It would be nice if tonight, to dinner, I could drive to dinner with Natalie and enjoy a couple drinks and Bear would drive us. That would be nice if Baird decided he was going to put on his driver mitts and get in the car and drive us to and from dinner, because that is the same likelihood of what you're saying. It feels like in 2025 from a manager in this town. We are just not seeing that sort of gut check thing. It does not exist. I don't understand it. I'm not going to Yankee and met splain it and say that it. Oh, well, this is what they're. I don't know what the hell they're thinking, but they're clearly not thinking the way you just express yourself. Because I completely agree. A gut check moment like that, it's a risk. You take a risk. But guess what, Don, you ended up losing anyway. You might as well have taken a swing and see if you actually draw something from these guys that you could build on.
- [15:29]
A
Well, let's, let's call, let's call analytics. What it is, it's having no accountability because the numbers will back you up. It's. It's managing and playing scared. Mendoza played it the way you're supposed to play it. So in the post game press conference, he can say, hey, Rodgers has been good. Senga was, was. Maybe he was being taxed. He threw 93 pitches. He had just given up a hit. He's not going to get destroyed for making that decision because that in the analytic world is the right decision and he's backed up by the numbers. But every once in a while, when your team is slumping and you're telling the media and you're telling the fans we're a talented team, what would be so wrong to say, you know what? I believe in Senga. I believe in the talent of my players. I am going to ask them to go out there and do a little bit extra instead of always protecting them and then taking the wrath after. Because isn't that what it's all about at the end of the day with these analytics is I'm protected. That's my shield. Don't criticize me. Those are the numbers. Those are the way we play it. I would do it again. No part of being a manager standing up there and saying, yep, I decided to go with my star pitcher. It didn't work out. Blame me, rip me, but I. That's how I felt about it at the time. And so when you go back to the Darryl Strawberry comments from yesterday, I want to. I want a manager that's going to coach me. I want a manager that's going to have my back. Those are those moments because even if it doesn't work out, those players go, he trusted me. He asked me to. He asked me to take the responsibility of getting out of my Own mess does. Isn't that somebody you'd want to play for, Peter? Instead of the second things get hard, you pull them out of the fire.
- [17:21]
B
That's. That's absolutely, to me, the kind of guy I'd want to play for, that you think people would want to play for. I cannot understand why this has become such a line you cannot cross. It just doesn't make sense. And by the way, I know I've brought this up many times whenever this topic comes up, Don, but when you go through and look at the World Series winners over the last decade, it's not as if none of them had gut managers. It's like you would think, Don, that because things happen this way, the proof is in the pudding. And every year it's. It's just guys who. Strictly analytic guys. That's who wins. That just hasn't been the case with a lot of these teams.
- [18:08]
A
No, but, I mean, Don, you tell me that.
- [18:11]
B
Tell me the. Tell me the level of gut. I'll go year by year, and you tell me, tell me how much more gut the managers on these teams use than we see here in New York. Dave Roberts and last year's Dodgers.
- [18:25]
A
You have seen times where Roberts would think outside the box. But. But they are analytically driven. But sometimes you would. You would. You would see decisions that would be outside the box. Yes. I can't give you a specific moment, but I do know watching, there were times that that was not your atypical analytic decision.
- [18:46]
B
I didn't know this World Series happened, but the Diamondbacks beating the Rangers in 2023.
- [18:50]
A
Well, there you go. I mean, you're talking about Bruce Bochy. He's one of the old school guys in Texas right now. He uses numbers. But one of the reasons he was out in San Francisco is because they wanted to be more analytically driven. They didn't think Bruce Bochi could handle it. So I think that answers the question there.
- [19:05]
B
Rob Thompson with the Phillies against Dusty Baker and the Astros in 2022.
- [19:10]
A
Well, obviously, you know, Dusty Baker is old school, you know, and again, I do. I can't. I can't, off the top of my head, remember exact decisions. But I do believe that Philadelphia, at least times, would think outside the box. But I don't watch those guys every single day like I watch the Mets and Yankees. And I do believe that they are analytically driven, too. But you can't tell me that it's as rigid as it is here at York. That's.
- [19:35]
B
That's the thing.
- [19:35]
A
And it's Also, not any kind of coincidence, Peter, that the Mets manager is a guy that used to be with the Yankees. So it's not even just the analytics stuff. It's also after the game, it sounds like it's a clone of Boone where everything's okay. We're still in the thick of things. What are you worried about? We're still a talented team, yada, yada, yada, instead of just calling it what it is. Your team has been lousy, and now it's being defined as such. Because if this team ends up missing the playoffs, nobody's going to care about the great start you got off to. Nobody's going to allow you back into the playoffs because you're a really talented team. Peter, you know sports. There's been plenty of talented teams on paper that didn't win because they just come together for whatever reason, and that's what's happening here. So talent's not enough. Numbers and analytics are not enough. Sometimes you've just got to say, enough is enough. Kodai, you're our man. Try to get out of it. If it doesn't work, have the guts to stand up there as a manager, when you talk to the media and say, that's me. I decided I wanted to trust my picture, and I was wrong. But you know what? I still believe in that guy. And it's going to get done. Because actions speak louder than words. Because if truly you believe in your people, then you should trust in those people and not hide behind the easy decision and the decision that's going to go over better in the press conference because I can't kill Mendoza strategically for what he did. Rogers has been good. Sanga gave up a hit in the final batter that he faced in that sixth inning. So I can't criticize it because he'll have an answer to say, well, Rogers has been good. Sanga. It felt like he was losing it, and I decided to go into the lane. That made me feel comfortable. It didn't work, but I would do it again because the numbers say so. Doesn't it hit differently if the answer is, Senga's my ace? This is a big game. I believe in him. I wanted him out there to get that final out because I believe in him. And even if it's wrong, it makes you feel like my manager's got my back, not looking at me to pull out, pull me out of the fire. The second it gets hot.
- [21:53]
B
It'S like the. It's like the anti Terry Matt Harvey moment. Obviously, that didn't play out great.
- [22:02]
A
But you know what? It didn't play out great and he got eviscerated for it. But I respect the guy because he was reading the moment he got it wrong.
- [22:11]
B
But he tried.
- [22:12]
A
But it was, hey, this is the guy that I wanted. I'm going to live and die with this guy. And he wanted to go out there and pitch. It's never always right. You're going to make mistakes. But at the end of the day, are the mistakes righteous? Are the mistakes believing your in your team or just believing in the analytics and just believing in the numbers? Because otherwise then why do we even have a manager? Anybody could push the button upstairs. That's the difference.
- [22:39]
B
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- [23:40]
A
Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.
- [23:43]
B
I didn't listen to anything you just said.
- [23:45]
A
Catch the show on demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcast. Now time of the weekend weather which.
- [23:54]
B
Is brought to you by Wild Fork Foods.
- [23:56]
A
Pretty nice weather weekend tomorrow, Sunday with a high of 82. And Sunday will also be Sunday with a high of 84. That was the weekend weather report brought to you by Wild Fork Foods. Wild Pork foods is your grill season. Go to with over 450 meats and seafoods blast frozen for peak flavor. A visit in store or same day delivery at Wild Fork. So we got a full bank of calls at 1-800-919-3776. So let's dive into them and let's start it off right now with Will in Astoria. You're on ESPN New York. What's Up. Will.
- [24:30]
C
Hey, how are you doing? Oh, wow. This is. This is crazy. Honestly, I love the show, love the station. Been listening forever. I think the last time I called in I actually got. I was talking about like Randy Johnson pitching for the Inc.
- [24:43]
A
I.
- [24:43]
C
It's tough try to keep up when you're sitting on a hold. But you've covered a couple of the points that I was thinking about. So just something that you mentioned just before the break and it leads into a bigger thought. This idea that, you know, that same energy, that same momentum that see everything that that could have been manifested if Mendoza stays the same, then he stays in the game and he gets the out. I kind of also feel is equally, equally happens if he makes the move to the bullpen and then out is made and then the game continues with, you know, and we get that win. You know, sometimes it's really, really, really, really, really frustrating and annoying because you're counting on players to execute. I find it interesting that, you know, baseball, baseball, the head coach of a baseball team is a manager and they're treating him like. They treat them like mid level managers. Where you're stuck representing the organization, where you're stuck, you know, promoting the philosophy of the organization and then managing in this case the players. But you're ranking five employees and you know, there are times just counting on folks to really come through and otherwise you can't win. And it looks like it's you, but you're stuck.
- [25:50]
A
But there are also different levels. Okay. Kodai Sanga is supposed to be your ace. So what? I asked Clay Holmes to do that? No, because Clay Holmes is my fifth starter. He's hanging on by a thread. He's likely going to go to the bullpen in the postseason. Kodai Sanga is supposed to be my guy and he's now healthy. He's been back from his injury a while. So you understand, Peter, it's different because it's Kodai Senga. Now any decision you make can end up being wrong, right? Senga can end up giving up a home run and the media is gonna kill him after for not pulling him out and bringing in Rogers, who's been money since they traded for him. So that's why I said strategically it was the right move. But the message is sent because this is supposed to be my ace. And I've decided in this big game to believe in him. And I think that goes a long way. It sends a message through the rest of the team that I'm going to break through the regular routine here and I'm going to show faith in one of my star players. So when Mendoza tells you we're a talented team, well, I want him to trust in that talent. And so because it's Sanga, because he's supposed to be my ace, is it so wrong to maybe think a little bit differently? Don't look at the result. It really has nothing to do with the result. It has everything to do with. In this particular moment, with none of my starting pitchers giving me any length, he is supposed to be my ace, that I've decided right here to believe in him. And that even if I'm wrong, I just think it sends a message that I thought outside the numbers for you. And I think that's what players rally around and want to believe in. Everybody wants to be believed in. Instead of looking for a life preserver every time something goes wrong, don't you think that hurts the team that they know that no matter what happens, I'm going to get bailed out because somebody's going to come get me. I'm not going to have to worry about exceeding my pitch limit or exceeding my efforts because somebody is going to come and bail me out. What's so wrong with believing in a guy?
- [27:53]
B
I just think the way things are currently being done, it goes against the whole thing that sports is supposed to be. I mean, not to be like that guy and cliche. But isn't the whole thing about heart? Isn't every story we love everything we remember? Don, you know, do it for the Gipper, calling his shot. Rudy, chapter and verse, Remember the Titans, Every single story. That is why you gravitate to sports at some point, is based around heart, gut, whatever the word is you want to use for it. Not. Well, we have a staff, and the staff says that what we do is this. And if that situation comes up, that's what we do. So, like, whether you can show me statistically, Don, that it works nominally better as a fan, is that really what you want? You want. You want it to be nominally better and be completely soulless. That's what you want.
- [28:55]
A
And it just kind of comes across as gutless, doesn't it? Because then at the end of the day, are you. You're doing it because the numbers say that that's the right thing to do, but it also protects you from ever being second guessed because you're doing what the numbers tell you to do. And so at the end of the game, I could stand there and say, well, I made the right decision. Why are you criticizing me for. For that this is what the numbers say I'm supposed to do. Well, I'm sorry, if everybody's going by the numbers, then who's supposed to win? The most talented teams are supposed to win, right? But sometimes it's that manager that just knows when to leave their lane, when to do something a little bit different. Everybody can't win. 30 teams aren't going to win the World Series. They're all doing it the same way. But that little tweak, that little time where I'm going to try to stretch it out and if it doesn't work, then I'll have the guts to stand up there and say, blame me. The numbers said to bring in Rodgers, but I just went with a hunch. I wanted Senga to show me something. We needed to get an extra out from him. And I don't think there's anything wrong with asking my ace to do a little bit more than everybody else on the pitching staff. And you'll get the slings and arrows, you'll get criticized, but hey, that comes with the territory. That's why I think analytics are a shield that. Now, I can't honestly rip you, but I think there's gotta be a difference between a good manager or a bad manager. Otherwise they're all just managers. I'm not. I'm sorry, you're not managing a Walmart. And we're going to go to the book. What Walmart tells me to do, then all the managers are the same. Well, that's not how I grew up with sports. Bill Parcells was a better coach than. Than Joe Bugle. Not. They just happened to both do the exact same thing and it was just a luck of the draw who ended up winning. At the end of the day, that's not sports. That's Monopoly. That's checkers.
- [30:48]
B
And we like checkers, but it's not sports.
- [30:53]
A
Now checkers is something you do just before you're ready to just end it all. If all. If all you're down to doing is playing checkers, you've now ran out of things to do.
- [31:02]
B
You didn't know, you didn't know where we were going, did you, Anthony?
- [31:04]
A
No, I'm just being honest. Like if I. There's the only thing left to do is checkers. Then we realize that this is the last thing we're gonna do if you got all the things there is to do. If you're on a deserted island, we've got all these great things, video games, different. We've. Now we're down to checkers. It's like, okay, then this is it. If the boat doesn't come. This is.
- [31:22]
B
If the boat doesn't come. Wilson floated away yesterday.
- [31:29]
A
Be prepared for anything.
- [31:30]
B
God, you know, if I. If I get caught in any mini vortex of castaway, I end up getting drawn in and I end up crying every single time. I don't. I can't help myself.
- [31:43]
A
I wouldn't call it a great movie.
- [31:46]
B
It's really good, though.
- [31:47]
A
But really, it's really good. Well, it's a great concept, and you've gotten, you know, one of the great American actors to do it. Right. But I was real quick.
- [31:57]
B
So why. Why wouldn't you call it great, though? What do you think prevents it from great? Because I think it's right there.
- [32:04]
A
I. I just don't. I don't recognize it as being all that great of a movie. You know, I. I don't. I would never. I have no desire to watch it again.
- [32:13]
B
Oh, that goes. It goes.
- [32:14]
A
Right.
- [32:14]
B
Spits right in the face. Spit in your face of what I just said. I've rewatched it many times.
- [32:19]
A
Really? It just not.
- [32:21]
B
I love it.
- [32:22]
A
It's.
- [32:22]
B
It's heartbreaking.
- [32:23]
A
No, it is heartbreaking.
- [32:25]
B
There is something about it. To me, the beginning is fascinating.
- [32:30]
A
The ending is poor. The.
- [32:32]
B
Well, the ending hurts because they don't end up together in particular.
- [32:35]
A
Well, I'm cool with that. But where. Where are we. Where are we going with the. I don't know. What do you call her? The Butterfly Woman. Whatever. I. What happens?
- [32:45]
B
I know it's. Well, but that's. But that's what I'm saying. Here's the thing. You say you're cool with him not ending up with Helen Hunt, and we all. We all feel that way because it's the less cheesy thing to do, right? Like, they really leaned into. Let's be realistic. She had a life. She moved on. And it's gut wrenching that after all that, he doesn't get her. But there's a reason we like cheesy endings. Because you don't get it. You kind of go home feeling miserable, and you're like, wait, so the butterfly woman, he might be with her. We don't know. It's. It's a nasty way to end it. You're right. But that. That moment when it starts pouring rain and she runs after him and they kiss.
- [33:25]
A
Yeah.
- [33:25]
B
And she's like, you're the love of my life. Oh, I could cry talking about it.
- [33:30]
A
But if you want that scene where she passes out and then they Spit. They move the camera to him. Feeding the baby. You have to have that. So at that point that's the big scene in the movie. So there's that whole what do I do? So I'm fine with him. Them. Them not ending up together. Because otherwise you'd have to compromise that scene. And I understand sometimes you leave open ended endings like you did with The Sopranos or 2001 A Space Odyssey. Like what does it mean? This isn't a. What does it mean? It's just that he's. He's going to go. He's going to her. But what's going to happen? It's one of two things. She's not going to be any. They don't. They connect or they do. So they kind of. It's. It's. It doesn't really give you a bunch of different avenues of what could be. It's just did they end up together or not? Right. There isn't really a lot of creativity there to the end. Yeah. It isn't really what is what. So I thought it was kind of a lame ending which I think affected the overall feel of the movie. Sure.
- [34:31]
B
That I'll say that the ending is. That's a credit. Good critic. Fair. A very fair criticism to have.
- [34:36]
A
But that. Thanks.
- [34:37]
B
Hell of an actor.
- [34:38]
A
No, no, listen. And that's why what makes.
- [34:39]
B
And the volleyball.
- [34:41]
A
Right. Wilson, who I lived in real life because he produced one of my shows down at the super bowl. But.
- [34:47]
B
And when you would. And when you would be off of the K show, he would actually take a volleyball and place it in the seat next to him.
- [34:52]
A
And I also felt. And I had no idea we're going to be analyzing Castaway. Is that his friend whose wife dies of cancer is. Is. Is unnecessarily sad. Yeah. To me that was a cheap way to get it. More sad. There was really no connection to really put it in there other than let's make a sad movie even more sad.
- [35:14]
B
Was that. Was that beginning or end?
- [35:17]
A
Well, in the beginning he's talking about how the tumor metastasized. They're gonna watch like his wife has, you know.
- [35:24]
B
Yes.
- [35:24]
A
And then when they find him, you know, she. She passed. And then he's like, you know, I wasn't there. Like, nobody's blaming you for not being there.
- [35:33]
B
You were stuck. You were quite literally stuck on an island.
- [35:35]
A
Right. So it just didn't. It feel like I didn't need that gut punch. It really didn't you think it was kind of gratuitous.
- [35:44]
B
I never Thought of it that way, but I hear you fine. I hate the movie. You happy, Don? Is that what you wanted?
- [35:50]
A
See, no. This is your fault. I'm going to tell you why. Because you know how I analyze things and I don't let stuff go. So if you thought that you were gonna throw. You were gonna throw Castaway out there and then it was just gonna be a throwaway line, then you don't know me at all.
- [36:04]
B
I know. I thought for a second I could like great movie and we could keep it moving.
- [36:09]
A
Well, then that's on you now.
- [36:11]
B
It's on me. You're right.
- [36:12]
A
Because you know I get with movies and how I get with analyzing stuff. This is why I was put on this earth to do this. I can't do it because in every. Because we've seen this with my lists that you guys recorded me doing the top 100 movies and you guys were making fun of me that if I did this in any other walk of life, I'd be the most irritating person on earth and nobody would be my friend.
- [36:35]
B
No one Worse.
- [36:36]
A
Imagine me being a police captain. And this is what I did all the time is analyzing stuff and having an opinion on everything. You'd be like, just shut up. But it works for what I do for a living.
- [36:46]
B
It really does.
- [36:50]
A
That was me analyzing my fact that I analyzed too much, which kind of figures out. It kind of takes. Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.
- [37:02]
B
I didn't listen to anything you just said.
- [37:03]
A
Catch the show on demand whenever you want.
- [37:06]
B
Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcasts. All right, let me give you something here. The leaderboard update brought to you by our friends at Schweppes. Don, I know you're a big Robert McIntyre guy. He's currently 14 under and leading the pack at the BMW Championship. Scotty Scheffler, if you're wondering, tied for third at seven under Tommy Fleetwood right behind him. I'm trying to think of Don's favorite. Cameron Young is even. I know you're a big, big fan. Patrick can't lay one over as well. And yeah, that is it. So your. Your guy Scotty Scheffler in contention, but back a couple of strokes, to say the least.
- [37:55]
A
Damn.
- [37:56]
B
The leaders up to 14. I don't know who McIntyre is. I'm not. I'm not familiar with Robert McIntyre, but he's seven currently six strokes ahead in the BMW Championship. And that would be your leaderboard update presented by Schweppes. Schweppes Offers a hole in one refreshment experience and is proud to sponsor PGA of America. Enhance your summer with Schweppes Seltzer or Schweppes ginger Ale leaderboard.
- [38:20]
A
Chomp Chom 1-800-919-3776. Let's dive back into the phones and talk to Eric out on Long Island. You're on ESPN New York. What's up, Eric?
- [38:34]
C
Hey, guys. How you doing?
- [38:35]
A
Good, man.
- [38:37]
C
But before I get to the baseball thing, Don, I really have a lot of respect for your opinions, especially about film and music, but you're kind of wrong about the castaway one, especially with the ending. I'm not going to nerd out about it, but.
- [38:49]
A
No, but first of all, it's just opinion, so I don't know how I'd be wrong. But what did you like about the ending?
- [38:57]
C
Okay, here's why I will disagree with you. When he gets back from the island, everything he did was part of his old life, right? He was kind of tying up all the loose strings of his old life.
- [39:07]
B
Okay.
- [39:08]
C
That was the first time in the whole movie after his whole ordeal, whole coming back, where his. It's starting a new life, and there's completely unknown and you don't know, but it's the first time he has his whole future ahead of him. He realizes he could start a new life. And the mystery kind of emphasizes that. Hey, you know what? It's unknown, but now he's starting his new life officially, you know.
- [39:27]
A
Okay. No, I like that.
- [39:29]
B
That's an interesting angle.
- [39:30]
A
I like that a lot.
- [39:32]
B
But you can also see where Don's coming from, that it's not super satisfying.
- [39:37]
C
I get it. But the ambiguity is kind of what makes it. To me, that's the emotional kind of response. Because it's a little ambiguous.
- [39:45]
A
Right. Because you look back to the beginning of the movie when he's in, what is it, Moscow, and he sends out the FedEx package with the time. Like, he's so regimented that everything has to be perfect, and now he's just throwing caution to the wind and just going to follow the. No idea what's going to happen. Yeah, I. I think that's good. Maybe I'm also. And also, I didn't love. Clearly, FedEx invested a lot of money in the product placement, which I think cheapened it a little bit, but still. No, I think, Eric, you make a great point. I love this.
- [40:17]
C
And I never. And honestly, I didn't want to. I didn't want to fly again after that movie for quite Some time. But anyway.
- [40:21]
A
Okay.
- [40:22]
C
That was a terrifying scene.
- [40:24]
B
I will say one thing in last comment in defense of the FedEx placement. It is a Memphis movie, and FedEx is an overwhelming presence in. In Memphis, I'll give them.
- [40:36]
A
But it is product placement. It's not. It wasn't for continuity. I'll say that.
- [40:40]
C
Yeah.
- [40:42]
B
You know, that FedEx paid. I'm gonna look into this.
- [40:45]
C
I had a baseball point. So the analytics. Here's what bothers me. They treat it like, you know, if you ever go to Vegas or whatever and you're playing blackjack and you have that stupid little card that tells you, you know, hit, stay, whatever, right? It's just. You don't even have to think. You could just use the card and you could just, you know, make the move, whatever it tells you to do, right? But baseball is different, you know, because, you know, like, unlike blackjack, like, a seven is going to be a seven in blackjack. It's not going to have a bad day and be a Nate accidentally, you know, I mean, you have to know your players. You have to know who's, you know, who you can. You can, you know, lean on and who you can push and who you shouldn't use, even if the card tells you to use it. You know, it's. It's a. It's a people game.
- [41:25]
A
Yeah. And. But. Yeah, but what I do like, though, and Eric, thank you for the phone call, is, is that then you might as well just hand out a card to everybody before they watch the game and say, here's how it's going to get. It's going to play itself out because it's as easy. As simple as that. You hit on 16, you hold on 17, right? That's just the way that it is. So afterward, if you. If you bust out, hey, listen, you're supposed to hit on 16 and you're supposed to stay on 17. So there's no easy. There's no reason to have a press conference because that's what you're supposed to do. But every once in a while, maybe to just break it up, hey, I'll stay on 16. And then they kill you and think outside the box every once in a while when things aren't working and things have not been working for the Mets and you've got your ace on the mound like so. Peter, there's gotta be a little wiggle room. And I think the better managers, the more gutty managers are ones that will think outside the box every once in a while. It can't just it can't be that regimented. Otherwise, what are we doing? Why are we even having press conferences?
- [42:34]
B
Why are we even having managers?
- [42:35]
A
Remember the card that the NFL coaches had on, when to go for two and when not to go for two when they first put into the league? Then don't even ask. Why'd you go for two? Because the card told me to. Well, then, now we're taking. Now we're now really taking the fun out of sports, aren't we? You all right?
- [42:59]
B
Yeah, except I just noticed.
- [43:01]
A
Apparently not.
- [43:02]
B
Sorry. Yeah, Bear hurt himself.
- [43:04]
A
Oh, my God.
- [43:05]
B
His eye is like. He has a cut above his eye. I literally just touched him and noticed it. So I'm a little concerned, actually. But apparently he's okay.
- [43:16]
A
Okay.
- [43:17]
B
Robert Zemeckis has stated, by the way, that no money was exchanged with FedEx, but they did agree to collaborate on the film. There was concern about some issues. FedEx at first was concerned about being in it because of what the movie's about, but in the end they agreed to be a part of it. And they, like, collaborated, let them use their facilities, etc, etc, but there was no money paid to FedEx.
- [43:43]
A
But FedEx still benefited, I guess, from getting that.
- [43:46]
B
I would think so.
- [43:47]
A
A long commercial. Although, yeah, their plane crashing, I could see isn't exactly a great selling point for the company. But that was just interesting. I really did think there was a heavy FedEx presence in that movie. Let's go to a. Jose is in the Lower east side. You're on ESPN, New York. What's up, Jose?
- [44:07]
C
Hey, gentlemen. How you doing? Now, Peter, you catch a lot of flack, and I just want you to know I started listening to the show just because you were on it. All right.
- [44:15]
B
I just want you to know I appreciate you. Thanks, man.
- [44:18]
C
That's all right. You were talking about analytics before, and I'm just curious, because you hear a lot about analytics, but they never tell you what the sample size is. Like, what sample size are they using? Is it 100 at bats? Is it a thousand at bats? Another thing is, don't players with good coaching and stuff eventually get it?
- [44:37]
A
You know, like, if you couldn't hit.
- [44:39]
C
Lefties when you first came up, if you never play them against lefties because the numbers say they're not good against lefties, then you never have to coach them up against lefties. They'll never be good against lefties. But if you. How do you know if you don't let them do it? Because what is the sample size of the numbers? I'm just curious because they never, I'm sure.
- [44:59]
A
Listen, I don't know if there's a steadfast rule, but I will say that obviously the larger the sample size, the more prudent I think it is to go there. But I don't know what the exact number is, but I don't know if Jose was a Yankee fan or not. The perfect example of that is Paul o'. Neal. The Yankees are able to get Paul o' Neal from Cincinnati because he couldn't hit lefties, and he becomes one of the great hitters in the history of the organization. So he's right. He sometimes you've got to have guys think outside the box, do other things to just learn if they can get better. If all you do is ever stay in your lane, then that's all you're ever going to be as a ball player. So sometimes you're right. You got to kind of open it up just a little bit. Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.
- [45:41]
B
I don't want to know how the.
- [45:42]
A
Sausage is made, man. I just want to know it's good. Hear more of Don Allen and Peter weekday afternoon starting at 3 on 88 80, ESPN, the ESPN New York app, and your smart speakers.