Hour 1: Jets Lose on TNF

Summary

Don, Hahn & Rosenberg – Hour 1: Jets Lose on TNF

Date: November 14, 2025
Hosts: Don La Greca, Peter Rosenberg
Not Present: Alan Hahn (remote technical issues, trying to see son’s hockey game in Albany)

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Episode Overview

This episode centers around the New York Jets’ latest primetime loss ("TNF" = Thursday Night Football) and the dismal state of New York football generally. Don and Peter vent frustration and dissect the continued struggles of the Jets, focusing in particular on the quarterback situation, coaching choices, and the challenge of being a fan when both local teams seem perpetually mired in dysfunction. The conversation also broadens to examine the growing difficulty in staying emotionally invested in bad teams, especially for younger fans, and reflects on what’s changed in the NFL and sports culture at large. Other segments include playful show banter, a dive into media rivalries, and a call-in from a discouraged young Giants fan.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Alan Hahn's Absence and Show Energy

• [00:52] Don opens by explaining Alan's absence due to technical difficulties trying to broadcast from a hotel in Albany, humorously saying Alan “thought you just bring the equipment to a hotel…he was wrong.”
• Jokes about Alan trying to buy obscure technical gear at Best Buy (“cradle point” confusion), setting a light, banterous tone.

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2. Jets' Loss Breakdown: Expectations vs. Reality

• Peter is upset ([02:00])–he thought the 13.5 point underdog Jets were a good bet:
  “Thirteen and a half. It's a big number. I don't know... I didn't like it.”
• Don explains his logic for picking the Jets—pure NFL chaos logic, not football sense:

  “There was no logical football reason to take the Jets last night… and that's the reason why I picked the Jets, because that's the NFL. You can't figure out what's going to happen.” ([03:16])

• Both agree:
  • The early Jets touchdown gave false hope.
  • Ultimately, the loss showed the same old problems: “bad penalties, bad turnovers… another game in which they do not get an interception. Now, 11 straight games without an interception.”
  • Don is adamant: “You’re embarrassing yourself with the quarterback play.” ([04:34])

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3. Quarterback Debate & Justin Fields’ Struggles

• Jets’ QB Situation is “unwatchable” ([05:40])
• Peter shock-defends Justin Fields—calls out “some bad drops for him yesterday,” but Don counters, “Justin Fields has not played at a level where he gets the benefit of the doubt.” ([06:28])
• The Jets’ last three weeks: Don concedes it should have felt uplifting—big comeback, good trade deadline, win after bye—but the ugly performance against New England erases the feel-good momentum.
• Don: “What are we getting from Justin Fields?” Calls for Tyrod Taylor to start: “What are we getting from Justin Fields, honestly?” ([08:41])
• Peter: “Why would you not be looking at Tyrod Taylor? What did you see yesterday that made you think you’re giving your team the best chance to win with Justin Fields?” ([09:29])

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4. Coach Glenn’s Dilemma – Are the Jets Tanking?

• Plays Aaron Glenn’s audio clip ([10:06]), where Glenn is noncommittal and “evaluating everything” (including himself and his staff) regarding the QB decision.
• Don’s analysis: Glenn may just not want to put all the blame on Fields, but it's the only change that would signal real effort to fans.
• Discussion turns to tanking accusations:
  • Don nails the real test: “If Justin Fields is a starting quarterback in Baltimore, you cannot tell me with a straight face you're trying to win again.” ([13:34])
  • Peter’s take: “Tell me it’s that you don’t want to win. Don’t tell me it’s that you…think Justin Fields is the path to winning. It can’t be that.” ([13:16])
• Reference to postgame SNY: “Willie Colon is telling you…he’s not an NFL quarterback.” ([15:06])

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5. Bigger Questions About Talent Evaluation & Quarterback Purgatory

• Don points out: The Jets’ embarrassing passing yard stats are at historic lows, and the common denominator is Justin Fields, echoing his awful 2022 Bears season ([16:21]).
• But both note: When he arrived in the NFL (“when the Jets got him, there was something there… the Jets have to be held somewhat culpable for what’s going on here with Justin Fields.” - Don, [16:47])
• Peter’s reflection: “When Mike Tomlin decides that – with a winning record – he doesn't see it, he's putting in the decrepit Russell Wilson instead. And the Jets go, ooh, ooh, we'll take that guy.” ([17:24])
• Meta point: Backup QB is such a wildly defined role—some could be starters, others “are just so we can field a team…a seat filler.” ([19:00-19:38])

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6. The Wounded Heart of the NY Football Fan

• Don’s concern for a damaged fanbase:
  • “If you’re 20 years old, you were 10 the last time [the Jets] had a winning season. You were five the last time they made the playoffs.” ([28:49])
  • Wonders aloud: With so many entertainment options and bad teams, would he have even become a fan if he was a kid now?
  • “You can't tell me the game is as entertaining as it was 30 years ago, 20 years ago. You can't.” ([31:13])
• Peter agrees, calls it “one of the best points you've ever made in the history of the program.” ([30:26])
  • Changes in the sport and distractions make it harder for young fans to stay loyal to losing teams.

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7. Caller Billy in the Truck – A Young Fan’s Malaise

• [36:26] Billy, nearly 23, expresses being "tired of just rooting for my fantasy team." The Giants’ brief playoff glimmer only highlighted the hopelessness, supporting Don’s point that too many losing seasons break generational fandom.
• Don reflects: The few playoff runs in recent years now “feel meaningless…comes out in the wash like a stain, does it? So what did it lead to?” ([38:38])

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8. Show Banter and Media Talk

• The hosts riff on failed show segments and the odd politics of New York media cliques, referencing Jimmy Traina’s podcast and the long-standing divides between “Michael Kay” and “Mike Francesa” camps.
  • Don: “I'm more than just a hockey guy. I have an afternoon drive show.” ([41:04])
• Playful riffing on song lyrics and in-jokes, showing camaraderie and self-aware humor.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Don LaGreca:

  “There was no logical football reason to take the jets last night…That’s the reason why I picked the Jets, because that’s the NFL. You can’t figure out what’s going to happen.” ([03:16])

• Peter Rosenberg:

  "Why would you not be looking at Tyrod Taylor? What did you see yesterday that made you think you're giving your team the best chance to win with Justin Field?" ([09:29])

• Don LaGreca:

  “If Justin Fields is a starting quarterback in Baltimore, you cannot tell me with a straight face you're trying to win again.” ([13:34])

• Peter Rosenberg:

  "Tell me it's that you don't want to win. Don't tell me it's that... you think Justin Fields is the path to winning. It can't be that." ([13:16])

• Don LaGreca:

  "If you're 20 years old, you were 10 the last time they had a winning season. You were five the last time they made the playoffs." ([28:49])

• Don LaGreca:

  “You can’t tell me the game is as entertaining as it was 30 years ago, 20 years ago. You can’t, you’re—” ([31:13])

• Caller Billy:

  "I'm tired of just rooting for my fantasy team all the time... Now it looks like I have a team. And where's it gone?" ([36:28])

• Don closes:

  “Even the 2016 [Giants playoff run], you got killed in Lambeau. And what did it all mean? What did it all matter? ... So what did it lead to? What did it build towards so I could admit that I'm wrong? I enjoyed it. Yeah. Thank you. I enjoyed it in the moment, but that moment's gone.” ([38:38])

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• [00:52] — Alan Hahn’s technical issues & show opening banter
• [02:00] — Peter gripes about Jets’ loss and his bad gambling luck
• [03:16] — Don explains the psychology behind his doomed Jets pick
• [04:34] — Don’s scathing breakdown on Jets QB and team dysfunction
• [05:40] — “Unwatchable” QB play, debate on Fields and Tyrod Taylor
• [09:56] — Coach Aaron Glenn’s audio clip; hosts analyze his indecision
• [13:34] — Are the Jets tanking? Don’s “courtroom” moment
• [15:06] — Willie Colon on SNY: “Not an NFL quarterback”
• [16:21] — Jets’ passing stats; Justin Fields’ career crater
• [19:00] — Meta QB discussion: backup QB as "seat filler"
• [28:49] — Don on generational fan malaise
• [30:26] — Don & Peter: Has NFL lost its edge and appeal for young fans?
• [36:26] — Caller Billy, the 23-year-old Giants fan, on “fantasy fatigue” and generational disconnect
• [38:38] — Don on “meaningless” NY playoff runs
• [41:04] — Media feuds, Traina talk, playful show riffs

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Tone and Style

The tone throughout is classic New York sports radio: passionate, weary, and self-deprecating, with bursts of humor and calls for accountability. Don brings gravitas as the voice of the frustrated fan; Peter keeps the conversation lively, sarcastic, and is quick to highlight the existential absurdity of rooting for the local teams. The banter is rapid and familiar, punctuated by a genuine sense of commiseration with fans.

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In Summary

This episode is a cathartic venting session for New York football fans, focusing on the Jets' continued struggles and the emotional toll of supporting chronic losers in the modern sports media landscape. The hosts do what they do best: pull no punches on management decisions, debate the legitimacy of quarterback choices, and soul-search about the game's present and future. They invite listeners to consider how much has changed for fans, and whether the cycle of mediocrity is now eroding the very soul of NY football culture.

Transcript

[Announcer]

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[Don LaGreca]

In love with the sex.

[Podcast Producer/Host Voice]

Han Sauce was everywhere.

[Peter Rosenberg]

And Rosenberg if you want to stay up, he's got the energy that matters.

[Don LaGreca]

This isn't North Dakota, this is New York.

[Podcast Producer/Host Voice]

This is Don, Han and Rosenberg.

[Don LaGreca]

The best threesome I've ever heard on.

[Podcast Producer/Host Voice]

ESPN New York and streaming live on YouTube.

[Don LaGreca]

It's Don Hahn and Rosenberg. It is a Friday closing out the week. Talking some NFL, some NBA, some MLB, some NHL. We've got fraud alert Friday at 4:30. We've got a ENN coming up at 6. What we don't have right now is Alan Hahn. Allen's up in Albany because Zach's got a game tonight and he's in the lineup and he wanted to see his son play. Unfortunately, Allen thought that you just bring the equipment to a hotel in Albany and all's gonna be okay. And he was wrong. I'm out. So they're trying to work that out. He's actually gonna go to the Best Buy in Albany and ask if they've got a cradle point or some sort of technology to get on the air. And I told him if he talks to somebody at Best Buy about a cradle point, the only thing he's gonna do is he's gonna point to the bye bye baby across the parking lot where they sell cradles. Confirmed. So I don't think we're gonna have Alan. We're hoping to. We'll have his picks at 5:45. We're still go. Feels good, Peter, to have three points in my pocket. Burning a hole in my pocket, baby.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I'm very, I'm very angry. I'm very upset. And I'll tell you why. I'll tell you why I'm upset. And if you notice I'm being a little bit quiet, it's because I'm doing the show from WWE in Orlando and as of a minute ago, they were shooting a promo right outside my door. So bear with me for a moment.

[Don LaGreca]

So you're saying that you screaming about the jets loss might affect the promo in some way?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah, and I don't think I won't scream at some point. I just want to be clear. But if you paid attention to the show yesterday, I actually liked The Jets. I mean, I think I may have even put the jets in Don's head. When I got to work that day, I said, thirteen and a half. It's a big number. I don't know. And then Ballard's texting me, why do I ever listen to him? I don't know.

[Don LaGreca]

Ballard, Michael's told you that for years.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah, he'll like, mansplain football to me.

[Don LaGreca]

Right.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yesterday, you know, oh, the jets stink. The Patriots are great. And I'm thinking, Ballard, I watch the jets and the Patriots. I don't like this number. It's a huge number. It's a divisional game. The jets have been playing hard enough. It's weird. And I knew I didn't like it. And Don, even though it ended up being 13 on a 13 and a half point line, I felt great about your chances the entire night. You had to feel good all night.

[Don LaGreca]

Especially getting that quick touchdown early in the game. I felt pretty good as well. But no quarterback play does leave it open to getting blown out. But it's a great place to jump off here. And in all fun, one of the reasons I was leaning towards the jets going in and it was performative that I made it my three point play. That's what I do on Thursdays, is that this is the NFL, all right? That just when you think you got to figure it out, the exact opposite happens. There was no logical football reason to take the jets last night. They're getting zero quarterback play. The Patriots are the best defense against the run, the only way the jets can move the football. The Patriots are much better football team and should have won that game by three touchdowns. And that's the reason why I picked the jets, because that's the NFL. You can't figure out what's going to happen. And ultimately, when you look at the jets and you say, well, you know what? They hung in against a team that, hey, I don't know, I wouldn't bet on it. But, you know, maybe the Patriots go to the super bowl this year. They've only lost twice. You know, they're, they're, they're, they're an outstanding football team. And the way that Buffalo's playing, maybe they even win the division. All right? But you look at, oh, you hung with them, you only lost by 13 points. A break here, break there, maybe you lose by a lot less, but that's the NFL and we shouldn't look into that as a way to pat the jets on the back and say, hey, well, listen, you played for your coach and you didn't give up. And after the trade, you've won two in a row. You hung with the New England Patriots. No, it was still the same garbage that we've seen when this team couldn't win a game to start the year. You know, bad penalties, bad turnovers. Another game in which they do not get an interception. Now, 11 straight games without an interception. So I'm not going to buy into all they. They hung with the New England Patriots. Let's pat Aaron Glenn on the back. No, you're embarrassing yourself with the quarterback play. The fact that Glenn today is still debating on who his quarterback should be at this point. Peter, play anybody. Go, go, go sign somebody. Brock Hewitt must be available somewhere, right? He's probably at a. He might be at the Best Buy at Albany. When Allen goes in there to find the cradle point, it might be Brock Hewitt. That points to the bye Bye, baby. Across the parking lot. You're getting zero quarterback play.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Zero.

[Don LaGreca]

And you're sitting there and really, what. What is being debated? Yeah, like, is the next team you're going to play? Like, I wonder if it's going to be Tyrod Taylor or Justin Fields. I'm really. How do I. Game plan for two zeros at quarterback was frustrating. If you're a Jet fan. Even at this point where there's nothing left to be frustrated about, I still think they found a way to frustrate Jeff fans.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Can I just say one thing, that I'm going to shockingly defend Justin Fields for a second?

[Don LaGreca]

Sure.

[Peter Rosenberg]

He's been awful. I mean, we've been saying it night in, you know, night out. It's been bad. No matter how you cut it, man. They had some bad drops for him yesterday.

[Don LaGreca]

No, they did.

[Peter Rosenberg]

They did not help. Like, that line could have looked better for him if they could catch football.

[Don LaGreca]

How much better would it have looked?

[Peter Rosenberg]

50 yards better.

[Don LaGreca]

All right, 50 yards better. You know, 75 yards better. The point is, Justin Fields has not played at a level, Peter, where he gets the benefit of the doubt. No. And I don't even know where you're at as a Jet fan right now. This was actually you. You brought the point that, hey, it was a pretty good three weeks for the Jets. They had a great come from behind victory against Cincinnati. Then they had the buy in which they did all the right things, making the trades, trying to put themselves in a better position for the future. And then you come out of the buy and you win like so. That's a good three weeks for a team that was.07 going into those three weeks. It's a pretty good three weeks. And then it just felt like everything but the final score just looked like a complete failure. And you look at the finals, go, wait, we don't. Come on, man. They were. The score wasn't that. But it. Watching it, Peter, it just looked. It didn't look good at all, if you even bother to watch at this point, Right?

[Peter Rosenberg]

I mean, I imagine everybody watched last night, right? Though. It's. It's. They show it locally. You're not stuck on the prime situation. It's a Thursday night.

[Don LaGreca]

You're playing. No, but you want to see.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You want to see who the Patriots are. But, yeah, you're right.

[Don LaGreca]

Who.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Who's prioritizing this right now?

[Don LaGreca]

And then you got the Giants coming up, you know, playing the packers and the Giants. No Thibodeau. We know that Jackson dart is out. No Slayton, although I don't know if that's that big of a deal. But still, you know, another weapon that Winston won't have in this game. But maybe you watch because, hey, maybe. Maybe they do get a bump from firing the coach. I don't believe that happens in the NFL, but maybe you do. And I think there's going to be a general curiosity to see what Jameis Winston can do. But from a Jet standpoint, the one thing you're looking for is, do we have a coach? We know we don't have a quarterback. We know that we've kind of depleted our team here. And I, you know, some of the. I'm not saying they didn't play hard for Glenn. You know, I'm not saying that they gave up. I didn't see any of that, which I think is a good sign. But, you know, the penalties crept back up again. I mean, too many men on the field coming out of a timeout, that's. That's bad, you know. You know, not touching a player when he's down. I mean, that. Rookies make that mistake, you know, special teams, by keeping drives a lot. Those are the. I think they kind of reverted back. They had cleaned that up over the last couple of weeks, and surprise, surprise, they actually won a couple of games because of it, and they just kind of reverted back. So we'll still keep a. We'll still keep an eye on them for the rest of the season, but stop with the reindeer games. Tyrod Taylor should be the starting quarterback moving forward or anybody else at this point. What are we getting from Justin Fields? Honestly, what are we getting? We had a bump in the fourth quarter against Cincinnati. All right. And God knows where it came from against Pittsburgh at the beginning of the year. And as you and Alan reminded me yesterday, that was two months ago. So what are we doing? Get to Stephan.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah, yeah, I hear you. That's the really hard part, is they are making it completely unwatchable. And I'm a little confused. And this is going to be where we sort of judge Glenn. Don, at this point, why would you not be looking at Tyrod Taylor? What did you see yesterday that made you think you're giving your team the best chance to win? With Justin Field, I am curious about his logic. And we have. Do we have the audio from him today?

[Don LaGreca]

Yeah, we do.

[Peter Rosenberg]

What did he say when he was asked about this? You got that over there, Jacob. When they asked Aaron Glenn about the quarterback situation.

[Aaron Glenn (audio clip)]

And that's. I'm evaluating myself. You know what? I'm evaluating everything, Rich, to be honest with you. And that's. I'm evaluating myself, the players, schematics, coaches. I'm evaluating everything. So I don't want to just place everything on that one situation. You know, I'm just looking at everything because as a head coach, that's my job, right? To make sure that I put this team in the best position to go win games.

[Don LaGreca]

Now, I don't expect him to make an announcement immediately, but like after and the Cleveland game, listen, the Browns have a really good defense, and New England's got a good defense that stops the run. And you got no Garrett Wilson. Receivers are dropping passes. The only logic I can think, Peter, by at least debating who the quarterback would be is he doesn't want it all to be blamed on Fields. Like you said, there were dropped passes. I don't want to give those guys a pass. I don't want to give the offensive line a pass. I don't want to give the defensive pass. Changing the quarterback kind of makes it seem, because it's so high profile, that, hey, that's all his fault. He wants to evaluate. Maybe that's a good thing. I want to evaluate everything. Maybe there's other guys on this team that shouldn't be playing either. But we always focus on the quarterback because at this point, after the trade, it's one of the few known commodities they have on the roster. At this point, it's the only change that would give anybody any kind of movement. But for his standpoint, we just look at it and says we're focused on the quarterback. Did you watch the rest of the game? There's a lot of the guys that probably don't deserve to be out there playing the minutes that they're playing. So we'll see as we get closer and closer to midweek what the decision will be as far as who the starting quarterback is. Not that I think it makes much of a difference at this point, but I think it's really hard to trot him out there after what's happened the last couple of weeks and expect anybody to feel like you're even trying to win, which might be on the table, too. Peter. Right. You know, obviously it's not a priority for them, so I'm not saying they're tanking, but is it. Are they thinking, is it the worst thing in the world that we lost this game?

[Peter Rosenberg]

See, now we're having a conversation. Don't have.

[Don LaGreca]

But I get what you're saying. Yeah.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I mean, no, but that. That's got to be on the table, right? At some point here. It's.

[Don LaGreca]

It's.

[Peter Rosenberg]

If you're going to keep trotting out a guy who simply cannot play NFL football, maybe you're doing that with. With purpose.

[Don LaGreca]

Yeah. Because he's not going anywhere. As much as the Jet fans want to see change and want him to be one and done, he's not going anywhere. So if you know you're not going anywhere, you know you got ton of picks right? You're evaluating players. All the players are going to go out there and try. But it's been made known at this point that even the best college effort that they can give, the. The old college try is not going to be enough to beat the Ravens in Baltimore next week. So really, I'm wondering if it's in the back of their minds that, hey, listen, I want to win the game, but if we don't, it's cool. I'm not going anywhere. Muji's not going anywhere. Hey. Hey.

[Peter Rosenberg]

By the way, Don, I would feel better. I hope it's that. Tell me it's that you don't want to win. Don't tell me it's that you're the future head coach here and you think Justin Fields is the path to winning. It can't be that.

[Don LaGreca]

I would say. And listen, this is a serious allegation.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Go ahead.

[Don LaGreca]

That unless there's something physically wrong with Tyrod Taylor's knee, which. Which was in play earlier in the season, that if Justin Fields is a starting quarterback in Baltimore, you cannot tell me with a straight face you're trying to win again.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Right.

[Don LaGreca]

When he says, I'm going to start the quarterback, that Gives us the best chance to win. That answer cannot be Justin Fields. Can't be. So why would it not be on the table if I. If I'm in a court of law and I'm trying to prove their tanking, wouldn't that be my. My gasp moment where. Where the. Where the court starts to murmur like, I just. I just, you know, did you. Did you order the code red? You're damn right I did. Right. Are you trying. Are you trying to tank? What are you. I'm not trying to. Are you trying to tank? Who's your starting quarterback on Sunday? It's Justin Fields. Damn right you're tanking.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Can you imagine? I just want to say, I personally, nothing would make me happier than if Justin Fields plays the next game. And the following Monday, Rich Samini goes, aaron, I need you to admit that you're tanking. Can you imagine, of all people, if Aaron Glenn were to get pushed on this? He might have to prove the point, Don. He might have to lift the podium over his head and throw it. I mean, he would absolutely derail if the questions said, hey, so if you're trying to win, why would you continue to put a quarterback out there who experts all over television are saying doesn't play NFL quarterback anymore?

[Don LaGreca]

Well, that's the thing. You know, I'm glad you brought that up, because you pop on SNY after the game and Willie Colon is telling you, not an NFL quarterback. He's not an NFL quarterback.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yep.

[Don LaGreca]

The post game, your own televised postgame show. The Giants have theirs on msg. The jets have theirs on sny. This is not coming from Dan Orlopsky on espn. This isn't Colin Cowherd on Fox. Right. This is Willie Colon on your postgame show saying he's not an NFL quarterback.

[Peter Rosenberg]

By the way, should we. Maybe we should call Willie because it is an interesting conversation. It's such a curious thing, Don. I mean, that stat that was in our group chat earlier that Anthony sent us.

[Don LaGreca]

Right.

[Peter Rosenberg]

The last time a team's. Which was. It wasn't qbr. Right. It was. Capacity rating was this low as a team was the 2022 Bears. With who at the quarterback? Justin Fields.

[Don LaGreca]

I'm going to. Yeah, that's. That's scary. The exact thing is punch up because we get so many messages during the.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Course of most of them about Alan trying to do the show with an abacus.

[Don LaGreca]

Yeah. The jets are averaging A League Low 139.9 passing yards per yards. Okay. That would be the lowest in the NFL since 2022, which was 130.5 common denominator Justin Fields at quarterback. Now, there are a lot of extenuating circumstances. I don't think. We don't know football, Peter. We both shared the opinion that there might be something to Justin Fields. Now, Pittsburgh wanted him back, so let's not make him out to be complete damaged goods. When the jets got him, there was something there that it was extinguished by the jets because whether it's the lack of weapons, whether it's the inexperience at the OC or whether it's just the fact that this is where quarterbacks go to die, I, I have to hold the jets somewhat culpable for what's going on here with Justin Field. There was something there, Peter. I'm not saying he was a Super bowl quarterb. I'm not even saying he was a playoff quarterback. But you know what? I don't think there was any doubt he was an NFL quarterback before he got here.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Listen, I thought the guy had a ceiling still. I thought I saw Don when I first saw the kid play. It looked like he was on a very average to poor football team, but he had a pretty big arm, he was stout, he could take off and run, but had, you know, had some meat on his bones. He seemed to be somewhat poised. To me, I thought it was there. They just needed to come together. He goes to Pittsburgh, he wins some games, obviously. And here's the biggest telltale sign. When Mike Tomlin decides that with a winning record, he doesn't see it. He's putting in the decrepit Russell Wilson instead. And the jets go, ooh, ooh, we'll take that guy. We should have gone with the Steelers. They generally have the better read.

[Don LaGreca]

Well, but they wanted him back from what we hear. Like, listen, it didn't age well for Justin because of the way Wilson's played here in New York and certainly the way he's played in New York. But, you know, it was just, it was a bad situation with Eber Fluss in Chicago goes to Pittsburgh. Pittsburgh thinks they're going to go to the playoffs. Pittsburgh's trying to make the playoffs. And they realized, you know what? I don't think can get us to the playoffs, which is fine, but I don't think anybody thought it was going to be at this level bad. I mean, there's legitimate questions around Justin Fields on whether anybody would even have him back up at this point. That's how bad it's been. Because when you say you're not an NFL quarterback, You're not just suggesting you're not a starter in the NFL, you're saying you don't belong in the NFL. And when you look at some of the backup quarterbacks in the NFL, that is a bold statement.

[Peter Rosenberg]

By the way. Is there a more broad definition or a more broad set of talents than the backup quarterback? Like, you can go to the tippy top of backup quarterbacks, and those are guys you'd consider as a starter. Like, no, this guy's pretty good. Could win you a game. Maybe win you a couple games to the bottom end. Don, where you go, if this guy's in the game, it's just so we can feel the team. We just need 11 on the field.

[Don LaGreca]

He's a play sitter, you know, he's. He's like, yeah, he's a seat filler for when you want to see him.

[Peter Rosenberg]

We can't snap to the running back every play. So we gotta have someone.

[Don LaGreca]

We're not, we're. Yeah, we're not really prepared to play, to play that game, you know, so we gotta have to have a quarterback.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But at the top you go these guys. It's bizarre. Think about the quarterback position, how hard it is. This is the most desirable position in sports. You're paid an astronomical amount of money and you can, you cannot find 30 in the world at one time that are great at it.

[Don LaGreca]

Now it's 32, but no, no, but you can.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You can't get to 30. You can get to what, 12, 15, maybe 15 that are really good.

[Don LaGreca]

Oh, my God.

[Peter Rosenberg]

This message is sponsored by BetterHelp. Shorter days don't have to be so dismal. It's time to reach out and check in with those you care about and to remind ourselves that we're not alone. This month, don't wait to reach out. Whether you're checking in on a friend or reaching out to a therapist yourself, BetterHelp makes it easier to take that first step. Our listeners get 10% off their first month. Just call 250 and say the keyword timeout. That's keyword timeout. After calling 250.

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[Peter Rosenberg]

So good, so good, so good.

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[Don LaGreca]

Because there's always something new.

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[Podcast Producer/Host Voice]

Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I didn't listen to anything you just said.

[Podcast Producer/Host Voice]

Catch the show on demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you your podcast.

[Don LaGreca]

Game time is brought to you by tele or do Irish whiskey. Because when it's game time, guys, get it out.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Get it out.

[Don LaGreca]

I like when he holds it.

[Peter Rosenberg]

It's totally time.

[Don LaGreca]

I don't want to exaggerate because I think that would dilute. The point that I'm trying to make is that it clearly has been extended by, I would say at least three to four seconds. Now, if I were to say. If I was to say 10 seconds. Well, now you're exaggerating, Don. It's probably no truth to it, right?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Don't.

[Don LaGreca]

There's no way that is as long as the original one that I did. I.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Believe that it. That it is. I don't think anything's been done.

[Don LaGreca]

So. So if that's the case, then maybe we need to move on. Because if it feels that long, then I don't think that's a positive thing. It's. The other two are perfectly fine, especially the Fred Flintstone. Well, that's the thing.

[Peter Rosenberg]

No, no, I think. But Don, here's the truth. I truly, in my heart of hearts, 100% believe that that's just what it is. And so if you feel that way, that means you just want to move on.

[Don LaGreca]

Yeah, that.

[Peter Rosenberg]

That's what I'm telling you.

[Don LaGreca]

We'll have that conversation at some point, but privately or publicly, we're having it now. Maybe we'll run up the poll at some point. NBA cup group play games tonight, the Knicks host the Heat with coverage immediately following us right here on 880 at 6:30. The Nets visit the Magic at 7. And the Islanders are in Utah, facing the Mammoth at nine. Islanders had a big overtime win in Vegas last night against the Golden Knights. Tullamore Dew. The original triple distilled, triple blended and triple Cast matured Irish Whiskey. Be sure to grab a Telemore Dew or try the new Tullamore Dew. Honey, during today's action, glasses up to enjoying Tullamore Dew responsibly. I was going to bring this up on Talk about a Tuesday, but for the fourth consecutive week, we ran out of time. So I kind of feel. I feel like. I feel like Matt Damon on Jimmy Kimmel. They just never.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But it's your own segment. That's the weird part. It's your own segment and you're still.

[Don LaGreca]

Like, no, no, talk about it. Tuesday's yours.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, I mean, but it's all of us.

[Don LaGreca]

But. But these things were. It was. The list was mine. Talk about it. Tuesday was yours. And Alan originally had the. The. The Thursday rewrite, which then pivoted to, I think, a much better one in the. That guy. Let's be honest.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Let's be honest. We killed the rewrite dead.

[Don LaGreca]

Yeah, Well, I think it killed itself. It just. No, but it was, by the way.

[Peter Rosenberg]

The rewrite killed itself. But it didn't, like, jump off the Empire State Building. It like. You know how it died, Don? It died the way that they were, like, killing people in the Sixth Sense. Like poisoning over months and months. You know what I mean? A slow. Remember when you found out the mom was actually poisoning the daughter in Sixth Sense? That was the death of rewrite.

[Don LaGreca]

Do you know what? I have not seen the Sixth Sense since I had children. I'm thinking that whole scene hits different now with kids now. It was just. It was deplorable. You know, you didn't have to have kids to know just how bad. Yeah, it's bad.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Poison your children.

[Don LaGreca]

You're poisoning your kid. That's never. You know. But not what you want. But, oh, my God, it just.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, you know. And I'll tell you what. Don't. Because I'm a deranged individual. We are in the process of looking for a nanny as we speak. And we just started a show on Peacock called All Her Fault.

[Don LaGreca]

Okay?

[Peter Rosenberg]

It is literally, Don, a show about a nanny abducting a child. And we started the show Saturday or Sunday, and then Wednesday, we started looking for a nanny in earnest. I'm like, what are we doing? Why? And then I said, you know what, though? Maybe this is good. Maybe it's good we're watching this show about the scariest thing ever happening because it'll make us be that much more crazy and diligent about the choice we make. By the way, hell of a program. I would reference who it's starring. It's the woman who played Shiv on Succession. But Don hasn't watched a new show since Breaking Bad. He doesn't know Succession from a hole in the wall, but it's a hell of a program there on, on Peacock. I watch a bit, a bit disturbing.

[Don LaGreca]

But not at the clip that you guys do. But I was going to bring this up on Talk about a Tuesday.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Go ahead.

[Don LaGreca]

I'm going to bring it up now and I want to get calls on it. 1-800-919-3776. So, rich and Gilbert, we'll get to your Jet calls. Still, the main topic of conversation here is that when I was growing up, the Giants were God awful, all right, and like, really bad. But I still fell in love with football because my dad watched every Sunday and it was still my thing. The Mets were bad, too, but my dad was a Met fan and I stayed a Met. I didn't have anything else to do. Peter, what else was I going to do? There was one TV in the house. It was in the living room. It wasn't until I got a little bit older that we had the old black and white TV that took 30 minutes to warm up. We'd wheel into my bedroom to watch and that didn't have cable. There was no video games when I was growing up. You went outside and you played. And by the time, you know, winters happened a little earlier now, earlier then than they do now, so you weren't, you know, in November, you weren't playing outside when it was 25 degrees. You watch football. And I just, I just wonder for a certain generation of fans, not only you, are you out on the jets and Giants because they've been so bad so long, especially the jets, no playoffs, 15 consecutive years, one winning season. And that was a decade ago. Ten years ago, 2015, where they were 10, five and needed to beat the Bills in Buffalo to advance through the playoffs and lost that game. But you still finished 10, 6 and still had a meaningful game the final week of the season. But that was a decade ago. For you and me, old people, 10 years is nothing. But if you're 20 years old, you were 10 the last time they had a winning season. You were five the last time they made the playoffs. You do the math for 25, 30 and all that. I'm just wondering, not only has it done damage to the locals, does it do damage to your love of the sport? Because when the Giants would lose when I was a kid or even when I got older in college and you Know, really living and dying with the Giants. Like if the Giants had a bad loss, I didn't watch NFL Prime, I didn't read the paper the next. I didn't want anything to do with football. Was like disgusted. The Giants lost. Like if that was my philosophy then, then I wouldn't watch anything. Cuz it's always been nothing but bad. And I'm, and I'm just wondering that if as don Lagreca, a 10 year old don Lagreca was alive now with the beat with the team being as bad as they've been or the jets being as bad as they've been. If you're a Jet fan and you have all these other things to do in your life to entertain yourself, would Don Lagreca have been in love with the game of football the way I am now?

[Peter Rosenberg]

I know.

[Don LaGreca]

Or would I have said, you know what? The game's not that great and I don't want, I'm not even going to defend it. I am the old guy in the room. I am. Get off my lawn. The game is not as good as the game that I grew up with. I'm sorry, it's just not. And a lot of it has nothing to do with anything other than they finally woke up and they wanted to protect the players. So the big vicious hits that were entertaining been taken out of the game and they don't have the two A days and killing guys in training camp. All of it was done for the exact right reason, Peter. But the one thing we can't ignore is it is definitely disturbed the quality of the game. It's not as good as it used to be. It's just not. So I'm just wondering, is there a generation of fans that like are falling out of football? You can't tell me you're loving it even more when your team embarrasses you every single weekend. So I just, I had that conversation. I was thinking just like to myself, like if I grew up in this era, would I have fallen in love with football? And I'm not sure I would.

[Peter Rosenberg]

It is. It's one of the best points you've ever made in the history of the program.

[Don LaGreca]

Well, thank you. Well, because it's true.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Because it's true. There are so many things going on. I mean, number one, you're talking about an era when your team is better. Number two, you're talking about a time when there are less things to do. Number three, you're talking about a time when the game itself was better and more compelling and violent. And all the things. And to your point, Don, I'm glad you said that. It's not that you're saying it shouldn't have changed. It should have changed, but it still made it less compelling. There's no way around it.

[Don LaGreca]

So you made you. They made an R rated movie, PG 13. They did it for the right reason, but it's. Sorry, the R rated version was more entertaining.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah.

[Don LaGreca]

Now, thank God players, you know, we're getting, you know, the cte. And so again, it was done for all the right reasons. But from an entertainment. You can't tell me the game is as entertaining as it was 30 years ago, 20 years ago. You can't, you're.

[Peter Rosenberg]

It's. You've really tapped into something special here, Don. This is what makes you great.

[Don LaGreca]

Now, I don't know.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I don't know if I'd be there. What else was I doing? Although, you know what, I was talking to my cousin today and I was. His son is really into sports. His son's like eight or something. Really, really hardcore, plays sports, watches them everything. And he was saying that he has the NBA ticket and his son watches every night. Just loves any random NBA game he's in. And I was that way as a kid. And I have the ticket every year for the Celtics. And I never sit around watching random games during the regular season. I end up having. I'm like, why do I have this? I don't want to watch random games. So I wonder how much of it, Don, is a built in part of being a kid and the excitement of sports when you first get introduced to it.

[Don LaGreca]

But you still have to be introduced to it and not have it again. I didn't have any competition. I mean, when I was growing up, you know, the 1979 Stanley Cup Final was on pay per view. The only reason we got it in New York was because the Rangers were in it.

[Peter Rosenberg]

That's what.

[Don LaGreca]

Now I didn't know that even the 80s like the Stanley Cup Final was on Sports Channel. There was a time where the NBA playoffs were on tape delay. Games weren't on tv. And they were probably played at a different time. It was different world. It's a different way. Baseball games when I was growing up, not every one of them was on television. Right. So you, you, you loved and adored anytime you got a chance. But now there's an over saturation. There's always something going on. There's always something to distract me. Not to mention the fact that you can have the NFL Sunday ticket and say screw it. I'M not watching the jets and Giants. I'll watch somebody else with no question they've eroded the fan base. No question there are young kids that could be Giant Jet fans that have decided to go root for another team. And one of them may be my own son. Yeah, who who wants to be like his dad and wants desperately to be a Giant fan and doesn't want to disappoint me. But at the same time, he doesn't want to disappoint himself every Sunday by watching bad football when his best friend's an Eagle fan and he could put the Chiefs on and watch them go to Super Bowls. Their big red, bright red colors and you know, Taylor Swift involved. My it's it's just something to talk about, man. Like this is how bad it is. This is how bad it's been and how bad it might be moving forward if the Giants don't get their head the right head coach in here. If the jets don't find all these picks and find their quarterback, it's not going to change anytime soon. The Giants don't have a coach. The jets, you're still wondering if they have one. And right now, if you had to make a decision, you probably would say they don't. It's bad, man. It's bad.

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[Don LaGreca]

Extra value meals are back.

[Peter Rosenberg]

That means 10 tender juicy McNuggets and medium fries and a drink are just $8 only at McDonald's for a limited time only. Prices and participation may vary. Prices may be higher in Hawaii, Alaska and California.

[Don LaGreca]

And for delivery.

[Podcast Producer/Host Voice]

Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I Didn't listen to anything you just said.

[Podcast Producer/Host Voice]

Cat on demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcasts.

[Don LaGreca]

Don Hanna, Rosenberg. With the old 6:30, then it's Knicks basketball. Allen had some issues in Albany, but he's going to see his son play hockey. We'll probably have him maybe a little bit later on. Definitely to make his picks at 5:45 as he's got a full slate of.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Because you don't want to miss our picks.

[Don LaGreca]

I've only got one. Peter's got two, but we got that coming up. 545. Need to line up the emails and the calls for fraud alert Friday at 4:30. We should have something interesting at 4:30 as well. A little extra to fraud alert Friday. Today at 4:30. 1.800-919-3776. Let's dive into the busy phone calls. Let's go to Billy. He's in the truck to get us started here on Don on Rosenberg. How are you, man?

[Caller Billy]

Hey guys, I appreciate you taking the call.

[Don LaGreca]

No problem. Don.

[Caller Billy]

You make, you make a great point. It's, it's like I'm tired of just rooting for my fantasy team all the time. And like, like the beginning of the year, I'm sick of it. I have, you know, I mean, I, I do love football and all that, but for, you know, I'll be 23 on Tuesday and you know, I have little bits and pieces of 2011 and all that. And you know, me and my dad, we go back and back and forth on this all the time. The worst thing that has happened to the Giants was the postseason in 2022 and it not. And that was, you know, because, you know, with the, with the whole bolt thing and all that stuff. Yeah, I was, you know, I was all, I was all mad about that then, but this, you know, that, that was like the first time like in, you know, adult or teenage life.

[Don LaGreca]

I was like, wow, like, I got a team.

[Caller Billy]

Now it looks like I looks like I have a team. And where's it gone?

[Don LaGreca]

No, it's gone nowhere. And you know, I've always pushed back Billy. And thank you for the phone call on the whole worst thing to happen to The Giants was 2022. And Peter said, you know, the way they lost to Philadelphia, like, why even bother making it anyway? I mean, it's really hard to fight you guys now seeing how things have gone the last three years now, do I think if they had finished 7, 9 and 1 would things be any better right now? I do believe that Shane and Dable probably would have been gone at the end of last year because that would have been three consecutive losing seasons. What are you holding on to? But would they be any better? They'd be. Would they have gotten the next coach right? I don't know if they'd be in any better shape. But the one thing I can't really push back on anymore, Peter, is what did it all mean? Like, if. If I had a chance, like, I'm going to take the train to D.C. tonight after the show to do the Devil game in Washington. If I had access to rewatch Giants Vikings on my laptop on the way, would I bother. Would I bother watching that playoff again, knowing everything that happened since then? Probably not. So I don't like throwing playoff appearances away since it's literally the only one that they've had since 2016. But even the 2016 one, you got killed in Lambeau. And what did it all mean? What did it all matter? McAdoo got fired the next year, so it does, at the end of the day, become meaningless. Comes out in the wash like a stain, does it? So what. What did it lead to? What did it build towards so I could admit that I'm wrong? I enjoyed it. Yeah. Thank you. I enjoyed it in the moment, but that moment's gone. That feels like a song. That felt like a song lyric. Peter, we need to find out what song. But doesn't it feel like a song? Had the moment, the moment's gone.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Ah, it's beautiful. Had the moment, but the moment's gone.

[Don LaGreca]

Help us out. 1-800-91937.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I don't think it's a real thing. I don't think it's a real thing.

[Don LaGreca]

Oh, by the way, Kofi, who again? I got to pay him out of my own pocket. You should. He's a big. Stop saying it and do it, because he's dust in the wind. That's right.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Good.

[Don LaGreca]

See? Good. Jacob, was that you, or did somebody feed that to you? Good job. Only for a moment. And the moment could.

[Peter Rosenberg]

God.

[Don LaGreca]

You know what, Jacob? You know what? Give yourself a raise.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Give. How does that work?

[Don LaGreca]

No, it wasn't coming from me.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You mean pay it yourself?

[Don LaGreca]

Yeah. You know what this is? Next time you cash the check, just know that you did a good job. This. This. You earned this one for sure. That was. That was good. Oh, so Kofi, text me, okay. That he was some. He was listening, or somebody was listening to the Jimmy Trainor podcast. And I guess somebody asked him, what's your problem? With the K show. Like, why don't you follow Don? And why do you not like Michael K. Now we know he likes you because he actually was trying to have you on the show. He may not like you anymore because you had to cancel. But we don't know that for a fact. No. And that Jimmy said he's got no problem with me and matter of fact, that I did treat him nice at Sports Phone, but he doesn't follow hockey people on social media, which I. I feel insulted by because I think I'm more than just a hockey guy. I have an afternoon drive show. But.

[Peter Rosenberg]

So wait, that was the whole answer?

[Don LaGreca]

That no. And that he doesn't not like Michael K. He just doesn't enjoy his play by play.

[Peter Rosenberg]

And did I get mentioned at all?

[Don LaGreca]

Not that I'm aware of. That's unfortunate, because I don't think there was any question about how he felt about you since he invited you on the show.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, invited is loose. It didn't happen.

[Don LaGreca]

I mean, but he did. You were booked on the show.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah, but if the person Then never. If you're booked on the show, but then it never. You weren't able to do it because you were legitimately seriously ill, and then you never go back. I mean, it may be worse than even not being booked in the first.

[Don LaGreca]

Place, but that's fine. But then we'd know the reason. Like, there would be no mystery why he doesn't like Peter. Well, because Peter canceled on him and that's it.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Once you cancel your debt.

[Don LaGreca]

Well, why. But I'm not saying it's a legitimate reason, but it's a reason. I'm saying I didn't know why he didn't follow me on Peter.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, but hold on. But we really didn't gain very much here because I just be honest with you, it's a fugazi response. I don't follow hockey people. Is not a thing. That's not a thing.

[Don LaGreca]

It is if you don't like hockey. I think he was being nice because if I remember his time at sportsphone, he just. He did not like hockey. So he's. Yeah, but Don.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But Don, you're not just a hockey guy and you follow him.

[Don LaGreca]

But. But I get that. But he may not know I follow him. And the other thing is, is that he may. He may not know because if he doesn't listen to the K show. May not know that I'm anything more than or less than a hockey guy. I'm insulted by it, but I'm not gonna get mad at him because I don't know.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But also, I think it's. Also I think we will. We have to live with is there are certain older school New York media people who never really gave us a shot. They were either Francesa people.

[Don LaGreca]

Yeah.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Which they didn't like Michael for whatever reason.

[Don LaGreca]

Right.

[Peter Rosenberg]

And they were out. Like they just, they, they know there's an ESPN channel. They don't turn it on. They're not doing it. And I think they're. My guess is he's in that category because he would probably be down with both of us if he ever actually gave the show a chance. And my guess is he didn't. You know, there's a whole community of people who literally, I always make this joke, but it's true and Jimmy's a part of it. If Chris Russo has flatulence, there's an article about it. If Mike Francesa has any sort of slip saying anything on a Sunday afternoon podcast, it gets written about. Meanwhile, Don could do a show with his hair on fire and they'd never know. So I do think that's a built in thing. The thing that could solve this all though is some help. Maybe by betterhelp, I have an ad for betterhelp guys this November. Better help. What they're doing is they're encouraging everyone to reach out, check in on friends. You know, like for example, if you're watching us right now on YouTube, you're seeing me in this dark, scary room and you should be concerned. Now, I would tell you I'm fine when you check in, but your instinct.

[Don LaGreca]

Should be something's wrong, but your instinct.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Should be, why is he in a place like this? Has he been taken? Is this a Liam Neeson situation for Peter Rosenberg? But here's what you do. You head over to BetterHelp and you take advantage of the experience. They have the industry leading match fulfillment rate. They get it right, they'll match you with the right therapist. If you're not happy, you could switch it anytime. Alright. They have 30,000 therapists and they're the world's largest online therapy platform. 4.9 out of 5 stars. That's out of 1.7 million client reviews. So this month, don't wait to reach out. Whether you're checking in on a friend or reaching out to a therapist for yourself, BetterHelp makes it easier to take that first step. Our listeners get 10% off their first month. Just call two five zero and say the keyword timeout. That's keyword timeout. After calling pound two five zero.

[Don LaGreca]

Now, Kofi did reach out again because he listens, and we appreciate that. He said that Jimmy did mention Peter on the pod. He said that he understood why Peter had to cancel his interview due to losing his voice. He would rebook Peter again in the future.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Oh, well.

[Don LaGreca]

Well, then.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Then when that happened, Don, should that happen, you know, I'm gonna really get to the bottom of, right?

[Don LaGreca]

Because it is odd. I don't follow hockey people. Well, I'm not just a hockey guy. And you were somebody that you worked with at Sports Phone. You couldn't. You couldn't break the rule just once. You know. You know, you're not following Chris Chelios. Okay? It's. It's. It's Don legreca. I mean, I do. I listen. I am a hockey guy. Don't get me wrong.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah. I'm not demanding you follow Ed Belfor. Okay.

[Don LaGreca]

It's Don Puck.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah, this is Don legreca. No one's saying I'm not making you read Brian Trottier's autobiography, Follow Dog.

[Don LaGreca]

But there. But there was value to it because I thought maybe I. I insulted him or Something happened at SportsPhone, which was like 35 years ago. And then maybe it was a day. But no, it had nothing. He said I treated him nice so he can follow me. Not follow me. It really doesn't matter. Mike Madonna on Twitter. It sounds fugazi to me because I think I do other things, but I think so, too. But Don Leggra, sidekick to Michael K. But I do. I do agree. Now, he says he has no problem. Mike just doesn't like his play by play. But I think I'm with you. I think he was a Mike and Chris guy, didn't listen to our show. And on the surface, it looks like I'm only a hockey guy, so whatever. But I just. I didn't want that. There might have been an incident at sportsville. Now that I found out that I treated him nicely, it was good. So go about your business.

[Podcast Producer/Host Voice]

Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I don't want to know how the.

[Podcast Producer/Host Voice]

Sausage is made, man.

[Don LaGreca]

I just want to know.

[Podcast Producer/Host Voice]

It's good. Hear more of Don, Alan and Peter weekday afternoon starting at 3 on 8 80, ESPN, the ESPN New York app, and your smart speakers.