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- [00:02]
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- [00:28]
Don Hahn
Don.
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Alan Hahn
I was fighting with obesity. I wore you were losing.
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Rosenberg
Ton, John, Peter.
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Caller or Guest
Thank you, Alan. I hope you make the team.
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Alan Hahn
And Rosenberg, Richard, have you ever heard of brazzers?
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Caller or Guest
No.
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Alan Hahn
This isn't North Dakota. This is New York.
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Don Hahn
This is Don, Han and Rosenberg.
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Alan Hahn
The best threesome I've ever heard on
- [00:48]
Don Hahn
ESPN New York and streaming live on YouTube.
- [00:52]
Alan Hahn
Finally, the day is here. Game one of the NBA Finals, Knicks and the spurs is tonight, not next year.
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Rosenberg
Are you sure?
- [01:00]
Alan Hahn
Not in 11 days.
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Rosenberg
It's in five hours and 30 minutes.
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Alan Hahn
That's right. The countdown is right there on ESPN because of course ABC's got the coverage we've got starting at seven with Pat O' Keefe who will be in San Antonio. So he will be at every game on site. And we'll have 90 minutes of coverage going into the 8:30 tip. Monica McNutt's going to join us a little bit later on for her weekly spot on a Wednesday. Other surprises as well as we're live here at Stout on 35th between 7th and 8th, just down the street from Madison Square Garden. But when you got a team in the NBA Finals, you don't need the team playing to still have a remote. So if you're in the area, you're going to come here to watch the game or you just want to hang out, swing by. Great food, great atmosphere here. We're going to take you right up till 7 o'.
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Caller or Guest
Clock.
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Alan Hahn
But finally, Alan, finally we've got a game. It's still a few hours away, but it feels like we've had to wait so long between series. It's almost like a, a football schedule the Knicks have been on, but now it's for real. It's happening today.
- [02:01]
Rosenberg
Yes, it just does. It does feel like this run has had a lot of breaks in it, which it has because they have made quick work of the last couple of opponents. And so it's been a lot of waiting around. And you know, now it's, it's, it's allowed, I think this city about the market, Knick fans to really just start to enjoy it, celebrate it. And now there's a great anticipation to get back to it because we know, as the players all said after winning Game 4 in Cleveland a million years ago, that there's still four more. And that's really what it's about now. It's about four more. And can they get four more in the next seven games? And if they do, you're talking about a legacy run. You're talking about what would be one of the greatest playoff runs in the history of New York sports. And I don't think that's hyperbole.
- [02:50]
Alan Hahn
No. I mean, we gave the list of the great runs in postseason. My last top five was that. And it'd be right up there with the 86 giants. You just ran roughshod. But again, those. That's one game. Right. You know, when, when you're a 14 and 2 football team, you're supposed to win your first playoff game. But it was against the 49ers, but still they beat him 49 to 3, shut out the Redskins in the championship game, and then doubled up pretty much the score with the Broncos. But that's still 40 years ago. And it's basically three games. This is 11 games. Nobody in the history of basketball has ever won 11 straight games by the margin of victory that they have. There have been teams that have won more than 11 straight, but not as dominant as they've been. And the whole conversation about they didn't play anybody. Well, if you didn't play anybody, which obviously is debatable, then this is what you should do with those teams, just smack them around. That's exactly what they did.
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Rosenberg
Right. You could say these are weak teams, but it's not like these games all went six and seven games.
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Caller or Guest
They.
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Rosenberg
They finished them quickly. The, even the Hawks series, that was over fast. Once they got right. Right after that game, too, once they got right, that series was over quick. And I think that's what, what you can counter with anybody that talks about how they're only here because the east was weak and they didn't really play. They didn't play the first or second seed. And you could argue back that, okay, that's fine. But the teams they did play, they didn't just beat them. They weren't. They didn't bat the bunny, they smacked them. I mean, just completely embarrassed him historically. And so they are a formidable team. They are going to make this a great series with a young spurs team that doesn't know what they don't know. You know, you never see this. A player like Victor Wembanyama, who we all agree is going to be a generational talent. We know this, right? You could just see it. And most of the time, other than, let's say Magic Johnson, can you name me another rookie who stepped into the league as the main piece of a team and has reached the finals this quickly? Like, think about it. Michael Jordan, he had to go through the pain. He had to go. He had to. He got, he got swept by the Celtics, Kobe, like all of them have gone through LeBron, they all had to lose first. It doesn't happen this way. And Magic was a main piece, of course, but he was also on a veteran team in la.
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Alan Hahn
So.
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Rosenberg
So like this is not normal what
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Alan Hahn
we're seeing and even in sports.
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Rosenberg
And you're wondering how at his age, when he gets to this level we. I always like to say that the deeper you go into playoffs, the air gets thinner. It gets thinner and thinner. And when you get to the NBA Finals, man, like catch your breath in the first five minutes of the game because that's, it's, it's. It's a different level of intensity. And you want to see how does he and his team handle it with. Against a nick team that's got a lot of veterans, a lot of guys who have been through wars and they're in their physical primes right now.
- [05:42]
Alan Hahn
You know, you brought up something good because you even branch out away from basketball. Like you said Magic, you know, right away, you know, Ben Roethlisberger in the NFL, what, what pick did he ended up being? Because it was Eli. What was he.
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Rosenberg
He was like 11.
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Alan Hahn
Was he later? You know, first round pick. But you know, right away, because the Steelers were good. You know, Dan Marino, I think was 24 and he was in the Super bowl in the second year. But the fair. The only comp I can think of, just as you threw it out there was, was Sidney Crosby. He was in his third year. They go to a Stanley cup final, veteran team, lose to Detroit, then come back, play Detroit again and then win the Cup. So he was in a final in his third year because he was drafted coming out of the lockout. So he was drafted in 05, so 607 08, final winning in four. So Wemby would be on that same thing, right? In the final in year three. And Nick fans all hoping it goes the same way, lose and then, you know, do whatever you see in the fact. But it's, it's at that level. But you know what's, what's fun because I mean if you're a knick fan, you might be a Yankee fan. So you've seen the team of the World Series, or a Giant fan, you've seen the team in the super bowl. Or Ranger fan, you just saw the Rangers in the Stanley Cup. You know, can't believe it's 12 years ago, but it's still relatively recent. But for people that are just like Nick fans, you know, you're gonna notice it's different. This is different. The Finals are different. It's gonna be. There's gonna be a feel to it. From the anthem to the introduction, everything is just gonna feel like it's on steroids. I always bring up the Wayne Gretzky copies. Like there's four seasons, Preseason, regular season, playoffs, and the final. And I think it's the same in the NBA. Preseason, regular season, the playoffs, and then you get to the Finals and. And it's just a different animal. You're going to sense it, you're going to see it. It's going to be spectacular. You're going to blush, you're going to
- [07:32]
Rosenberg
want to pass out.
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Alan Hahn
It's going to be so amazing to see your team. And the other uniqueness of this, Allen, is if you're of a certain age and don't remember 99, is that, yeah, you've met the spurs in the regular season, but think of this run. You just played Atlanta in the playoffs. You just played the Sixers in the playoffs a couple of years ago. You just played the Cavaliers a couple of years ago. But to play the spurs, like the west, it's a different animal. It is. It's just. It's a different. It's a different feel. It's so cool to be this far, and it's just going to be. You're going to notice it. It's hard to put it in words, but you get it, to notice. It's just that everything is completely amped up.
- [08:08]
Rosenberg
The logos on the court, the Larry o', Brien, they don't put that on the court until you get to that. To this level. Like, you come out on the court as the first thing you see. And that's where. That's the first reminder of, yeah, this is different. This is real. Like, there is coverage wall to wall, and it's strictly about two teams and only two teams. You know that. That's how you know Media day, where they're all sitting there at the podium and it's. It's not like, you know, 15 people, it's 40 people, 50 people, right? All sitting in that room, hanging on every word. You have to say asking you questions, you know, it's. It's real, and that's what you look forward to. And there's a lot of different things. You know what's amazing in the Brunson era, this is only the third time the Knicks have opened a series on the road. That's it.
- [08:53]
Alan Hahn
Yeah.
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Rosenberg
They've twice other. First was the first year against Cleveland. At Cleveland, they won that game. And then last year against Boston, and they won that game, Game one on the next one. So they. Yeah, right. But, but, but this team has really spent a lot of times as the team that usually is playing that game one at home with all that pressure on the home team being, hey, you got to win game one at home. It's so important where now you're that road team. That's just saying, all right, like, let's. Let's. Let's empty the tank. Let's see what they got. And if you lose a game one on the road, it's not so bad because you say to yourself, all right, if I can get the split, it's still there.
- [09:28]
Alan Hahn
That's it.
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Rosenberg
You don't have that panic as a home team that lose a game one. But the funny thing is that when this team plays on the road, they seem to excel. They seem to be better off on the road. So two and oh, in game ones, start a series on the road. Right. 16 and 12 overall on the road in the four years that Jalen Brunson has been on this team. 16 and 12 on the road in
- [09:51]
Alan Hahn
the playoffs, that's pretty amazing.
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Rosenberg
So they playing on the road doesn't bother them. Playing on the road is not intimidating at all to them. And playing the spurs, this is the fourth time now they'll see them. They've played them three times. It's not that mystery. They have played them. They know this team pretty well. And on top of it, I got to throw this out there. Jalen Brunson won a national championship in 2018 with the Villanova Wildcats. That was his second national championship. The last time he won a championship to end a season, that game was played in San Antonio.
- [10:23]
Alan Hahn
They go the Alamo Dome.
- [10:24]
Rosenberg
Right, Right. So, I mean, there's a lot of things here that show you that if you think he and any of these guys are walking into this with some kind of like, you know, apprehension or concern or anxiety, I think this is exactly where they want to be, where they expect to be, and I think they're going to be very comfortable. Win and lose is a different story. You got to perform. But I don't think being on the road, being an underdog, having everybody pick the spurs and not them, none of that matters. They've been waiting for this. I told you the story. They've been waiting for this moment since last year when they were eliminated in the Eastern Conference finals and they got together and they had a party and they said, okay, this time next year we'll be in the finals, we belong there. And here they are.
- [11:09]
Alan Hahn
Yeah, it's a big story and it definitely something that's going to get repeated throughout these finals and certainly if they win. Another thing that I like about playing the game one on the road, I will tell you about. First you have to tell me and everybody else about Amazon.
- [11:20]
Rosenberg
Yes, I do. Because in New York, everybody knows every block is a business. Every minute counts. And Amazon Hub Delivery lets you earn extra revenue from the business you already run. So you and your staff can deliver packages right in your neighborhood on a schedule that works for you. Bryant and the crew at 165 Hardware in Washington Heights delivered during their store's afternoon downtime. So the extra revenue from Amazon Hub Delivery helps their bottom line and delivering has given the business more visibility and connection to their community. And by the way, you're wondering how to get started. It's easy. You have, you don't need any delivery experience whatsoever. No long term contracts are needed here as well. And most important, most importantly, there's no startup cost. It's so simple. So New York local businesses, if you're ready to make your next move, visit Amazon.com hubdelivery that's Amazon.com hub delivery.
- [12:10]
Alan Hahn
Donnie, now you want to be home obviously, but you mentioned all those home game ones. What do we always say at nauseam all this? The Knicks never won a series when they lost the first game at home. So there's a lot of pressure on you and I think there's a lot of pressure to set the tone because remember, their next loss will be their first in over a month, will end the streak and then you'd be interested.
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Rosenberg
3 days, 42 days.
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Alan Hahn
It's great. Way over a month.
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Caller or Guest
Crazy.
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Alan Hahn
But here's the thing. As much as they'll be upset fans, maybe a little panic because you know how things are because it'll be the first loss in a long time. Your objective as a road team is just get the split. Yep, you'd love to win the first two, but the mission could still be accomplished even if you lose game one, of course. But if you're Home and you lose game one, you're right in the thick of it. Everybody's panicking now.
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Rosenberg
The pressure is on.
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Alan Hahn
You know, they could sit in San Antonio, be like, all right, let's cool. Let's get back to work. We come back with the split. We now have home court advantage. The objective is still there. When you're home and you lose game one, it's, you know, now the pressure is you got to win game two,
- [13:11]
Rosenberg
conference finals last year, right? Conference finals last year. You lose that stupid game on the bounce and you. The panic set in, and then that game two is. You didn't know. You know, like, you got to win this, and all it takes is one guy on the other team to be red hot. It was Pascal Siakam. He went off in that game. They had nobody to guard him. And now all of a sudden, you're down 02 on the road. And as you know, when you're, when you're in that situation, series is over.
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Alan Hahn
And you know, game one, you'll hear things like, it's only one game. It's only the first game. But you see the stats, right?
- [13:43]
Rosenberg
70% of the.
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Alan Hahn
70% of the time, the team that wins game one wins the best of seven series in the Stanley cup final. We watched that game last night. Great game, by the way. 76% of the teams that win game one go on to win the series. So those numbers mean something. I think history shows you even that winning game one sets the tone.
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Rosenberg
Yeah.
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Alan Hahn
You know, and. And you want to do that.
- [14:05]
Rosenberg
So how do you win game one? Like. Like that's the. To me now, it's. I feel like early in a series like this, where this is. These are two really good teams. Early in a series like this, you're looking at the strategy first. You're not looking at. Because, you know, Wembley could go for 40, 20, like he did in game one against the Thunder. He could do that. And it doesn't mean he's going to average 40, 20 for the whole series. No, because you adjust. You know, Brunson could go for 30 in this game, could go for 40 in this game. He has 61 against this team. A couple of years ago, he could. He could go crazy. It doesn't mean he's going to do that the whole series. What happens, I think, early in a playoff series is you see things and you make adjustments. And the one thing that Mike Brown's been very good at, he and his coaching staff have been really good in this run in game, making adjustments in game Halftime adjustments, third quarter, things change. This team has been really good at. Okay, let's see what they do with this. Let's see how they're going to cover that. All right, we have a counter. Because that, to me, is the chess match that helps you win in the playoffs. And if you can make the correct moves in a game, you could go from being down 22 and then win the game by putting pressure on the team that all of a sudden you're making your comeback. There's little things like that that to me, change everything. So I'm curious to see in the first two games, maybe even first three games, is what are the chess pieces? What are the strategies? Who's guarding who, who's in a rotation? And we're like, whoa, that guy didn't play at all in the play. Why is he playing now? There's all going to be little things like that to watch, especially tonight to see how both teams think they want to try something to see if it'll work.
- [15:42]
Alan Hahn
Well, obviously in the NBA, the perimeter is so important. You're shooting from three, you're defending of three. And I think the ladder is the most important. Allen. Because if. If the spurs are hitting their threes and you've got to go out and defend and you leave. You leave the bottom of the basket open. Like Wemby's gonna have a field day.
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Rosenberg
Yeah.
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Alan Hahn
You know, so I don't think they play that way.
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Rosenberg
They don't play like that. I'm telling you, watch that Thunder series, they really don't play that way. What you want to see that they're going to do a lot is what is the screens that Wemby's part of, and then they get to switch. That's the dangerous stuff. You have to watch him a lot of times on the perimeter because of his ability to take one. Like, you know, Towns has driven a little more in the playoffs, and he's had some success. He's one dribble they can't understand. If he's. If he's in the high post, which is, for those who don't know, the free throw line, like the elbow part, if he's up there, he's one step from a dunk. That's not a jump shot for him. So that's where you got to worry. If there's a slip, there's a movement. It's just. That's two. It's two points. It's already over.
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Alan Hahn
I wasn't prepared for him. Nobody was. Yeah, but one of the first games I Did when I did those seven Knick games a few years ago was. Was Wemby's rookie year.
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Rosenberg
First game.
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Alan Hahn
I think I did that game with Wally. And you know, new to doing play by play for basketball is you anticipate what's going to happen. And when you see somebody that far away from the basket, you're not thinking he's going to dunk the basketball. One motion. And I was like, oh, my God. And that was. He's a kid and he's still a kid, but he's growing. And literally and figuratively. Right. Growing.
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Rosenberg
Yes.
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Alan Hahn
He is going to get bigger as he gets old.
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Rosenberg
I honestly think he's. He's not. I think he stayed listed at 7 4. I honestly think he's either already 75 or he's going to be.
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Alan Hahn
He's going to be 7 5. So he is a special. A special guy and certainly somebody that you've got, you know, circled that you're going to have to worry about.
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Rosenberg
But I just, again, for everybody watching, like, you got to understand he's gonna do things like that. You. You can't overreact if he's doing something spectacular because that's what he does. He does spectacular things because of his size and his agility. You can't get caught up in it. You can't panic. To me, it's the other guys. That's the guys you gotta watch. And don't let somebody like Vassell go off and knock down a bunch of threes. You know, they've got a couple of like, told you about their guards. I love their guards. And they're the ones that you've got to keep in check. You can't let Harrison Barnes get a bunch of open corner threes. You can't let Kelvin Johnson come in the game off the bench. That's a guy you're going to pay attention because he plays a very aggressive, very power type game. And he comes in and he brings a lot of emotion. You can't let him get cooking. Those are the guys you got to keep off balance because then what happens is now they need Wembayama to do everything. Everything that wears him down. That's a huge part of this series. So don't get caught up in his. Oh, my God, he's averaging 35. Who cares what you don't. What you want is for the others to struggle because your defense is so good that it becomes. Wemby's got to do more, he's got to shoot more, he's got to score more. You got to pay attention to his. I followed that team very closely throughout the playoffs. And I remember from game to game, there was one game he only took 15 shots or 12 shots, and Mitch Johnson said, that's not enough. I need him shooting more like called him out, you know, so that's what you want. You want him to feel the pressure of carrying his team because no one else can do anything.
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Alan Hahn
That's it.
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Rosenberg
Let him do whatever he's going to do because it's going to happen. He's going to put up his numbers. It's the others you should be watching as a fan. Just make sure no one else has it going.
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Alan Hahn
You know, it kind of reminded me you just, you know, explained that sometimes you, you don't mind if that one guy is going crazy because you can figure out a way to win that amazing Super Bowl. When the Giants had in Super Bowl 25 against the Bills. Let Thurman Thomas go.
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Rosenberg
Thurman Thomas went crazy.
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Alan Hahn
Let him go crazy.
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Rosenberg
Here's your other example.
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Alan Hahn
Shut those wide receivers down and let, let, let him do what he's going to do. Yeah, and we'll, we'll contain the points because they can't score 50 points with Thurman Thomas running the ball like so. You pick your poison and maybe they sure, your wide receivers are not going to beat us. Rising's not going to beat us, Lofton's not going to beat us, and they won the game. So it' kind of like that. All right, well, Wemby's going to go off if he gets, you know, 35, 40 points and you shut everybody else down, you're going to win the game.
- [20:15]
Rosenberg
Right. And great example is historic. Michael Jordan's famous 63 point game against the Celtics where Larry Bird said, that was not Michael Jordan, that was God disguised as Michael Jordan. Jordan went for 63. They lost that well and the Celtics were fine. We just play them one on one. Let him go crazy. No one else is even doing anything. And that's the most important thing. The best teams that have a great player, but there's always somebody else doing stuff. This Nick run is a great example of it. Jalen Brunson can have a big night, but there's always others that we keep talking about, whether it's OG Anunoby or whether it's Landry Shamut who, who are contributing to the offense. So that when you were paying so much attention to Brunson, now all of a sudden they're killing you. What you can't do is overreact to what Wembanyama is going to do because he is, he is a just a wonderful talent and something we've never seen before. He's going to do things that are going to take your breath away because of his size and his athleticism and you can't get caught up in it. Now all of a sudden, everybody's just staring at him and trying to stop him. No, don't let these other guys feel good for five minutes in this series.
- [21:20]
Alan Hahn
Well, correct me if I'm wrong, I believe the double nickel game. The Knicks almost won that game. They didn't get blown out. That was a close game.
- [21:27]
Rosenberg
You remember what happened though. This is why they lost the game, because they all ran at Michael thinking he's taking the shot. And Michael dumped it off to Bill Winnington for a layup.
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Alan Hahn
Right.
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Rosenberg
That's how they lost the game.
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Alan Hahn
Right.
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Rosenberg
Because everybody ran at Michael going, he's definitely shooting this. They all ran out, overreacted. And Bill Winnington's like, oh, thank you.
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Caller or Guest
Right.
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Rosenberg
Think about it. And that's exactly my point. The point I'm trying to make. A lot of fans get so caught up in stats. This guy's killing us. Let him, let him. It's the other guys. You don't want them getting going. Julian Champagne, the Brooklyn kid who had 11 threes against the Knicks on New Year's Eve. I called that game for msg. Remarkable. He couldn't miss the Knicks couldn't find him. You know why? Because they were worried about everybody else. They weren't worried about him. He's the hot guy. Take him out. Don't worry so much about having to double and send guys and watch with Wembanyama. Can he score 100? Can he beat Wilt Chamberlain? He's going to have to. And by the way, 100 might not be enough to beat the Knicks.
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Alan Hahn
Yeah, because they're going to score.
- [22:23]
Rosenberg
No one else scores. Come on.
- [22:24]
Alan Hahn
They're going to get theirs for sure. No question about that. Programming alert. Today's Mets Mariners game can be heard on 1050. Game 1 of the NBA Finals between the Knicks and the spurs can be heard on 880 ESPN New York tip off is set for 8:30. Pregame will start at 7. All the games can be streamed on the ESPN New York app. And again, thanks to our partners at the Mets for allowing the Knicks to take center stage. And why not? We're talking about, you know, the NBA Finals as the Mets and the Mariners are about to get underway. So again, if you're tuning into 880 for the Mets. Coverage is over at 1050. All right. Big show means big wardrobe. I told you I was over Robert Graham. I wanted to say you like the
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Rosenberg
color, by the way, the blue color is fantastic. Right. And I love that. Like the jacket. It fits you perfect. That the material is wonderful. But everybody's got to take a look at. Look at the blouse. That's. Look at this. Come on. That's next level.
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Alan Hahn
But I got Nick. That's not a shirt.
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Rosenberg
Don't even. Don't dare say shirt. That's a blouse.
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Alan Hahn
This is beautiful. Blouses.
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Rosenberg
Yes.
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Alan Hahn
Game blouses. So it's got Nick colors if you want to see it in person. We're at Stout.
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Rosenberg
Yep. Come on.
- [23:29]
Alan Hahn
35th between 7th and.
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Rosenberg
I'm in team issue today, by the way, before an outdoor performance later. Team issue.
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Alan Hahn
And I know it's really nice and blue as well. Monica McNutt will join us at 4 o', clock, her weekly spot here on Don Hahn and Rosenberg. Other surprises as well, including a curated list at 4:30 that Alan was involved in. This list especially, it is creative. I'll tell you that. 6:00 clock enn with Anthony Pusick might
- [23:55]
Rosenberg
get a little Bill Peto.
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Alan Hahn
I've. I requested Bill.
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Rosenberg
Yeah.
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Alan Hahn
Who would host the parade if there is one. Much to Alan's chagrin. But no, Bill said he might come by.
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Rosenberg
Yeah, he just asked the time. So he's saying, How's 4:45? We like that.
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Alan Hahn
I like it right after the list.
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Rosenberg
Perfect.
- [24:12]
Alan Hahn
After Monica. So we're all set up here, guys. It's gonna be a lot of fun. We're hanging out with you until 7 o' clock and then we will get into our coverage of the Knicks. Want to Hear from you 1-800-919-3776. Just getting started on a beautiful Wednesday from Stout. Getting ready for game one of the NBA Finals. Don Hanna, Rosenberg, ESPN New York.
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- [25:01]
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- [25:33]
Don Hahn
Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg Podcast.
- [25:36]
Alan Hahn
I didn't listen to anything you just said.
- [25:38]
Don Hahn
Catch this show on demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcasts.
- [25:45]
Alan Hahn
Don on a Rosenberg live from stout, 35th between seventh and eighth. If you're going to the watch party and there will be a watch party at the Garden, which is cool, that's awesome. Look like there wasn't going to be one. So if you're heading to that and I can tell you a little bit of traffic today, Wednesdays are always kind of congested because you got the matinees going. It's a beautiful day. Give yourself some time and if you get here early, swing by Stout. We're going to go seven o' clock and we'll have some fun. But want to hear from you the day of the listen, the biggest thing going, man, it is the Knicks in the NBA Finals for the first time in 27 years. So let's hear from you. Start with Sal on Long Island. You're on ESPN New York. What's up, Sal Salvatore. No, no, no, not the first one. All right, we'll try.
- [26:33]
Rosenberg
We got to be ready to pop these up.
- [26:35]
Alan Hahn
All right, Steve in California, we're going to start with you on Don Hanna, Rosenberg.
- [26:41]
Caller or Guest
Hey, guys, thanks for taking my call. I got the chance to speak with you yesterday. It's been a long time because I don't live in New York and don't listen that much anymore. But now, how do you not and
- [26:52]
Rosenberg
so yesterday I was talking with you
- [26:55]
Caller or Guest
guys about how I thought the Knicks would run San Diego, San Antonio. And today I'm beginning to think that San Antonio is going to look to play his own. But the Knicks have too many weapons and all these guys pass. The Knicks are walking into this so well prepared. You look at the way they've changed their offense and their defense throughout the year. I believe they've seen everything and I believe they're prepared to exploit any weaknesses that San Antonio does show. They don't have a lot. They're a good, athletic team. But you started to talk earlier and I mentioned the producer earlier. I would guard Wemby one on one. I would shut down everybody else as best you can and Let Wimby try to beat you itself. It's a team game and that's how I feel. I believe the Knicks will win and I'm really looking forward. I'd love to sit and talk with you. I've met you guys both. Love to get the chance to tell you some of my stories about when I worked TGI Fridays and the Knicks hung out there and lots of stuff. Let's go Knicks.
- [28:01]
Alan Hahn
Well, thanks for the phone call times.
- [28:03]
Rosenberg
I do think like you, you can throw multiple bodies at him. By the way, I think we buried the lead here too. Not that anybody's surprised. Mitchell Robinson will play tonight. Yeah, that's something that Shams did confirm with a report earlier today. But we were feeling this yesterday when we saw him at practice. The fact at first he was visible at practice, they weren't trying to hide him. He was dribbling a basketball. He was showing that he's definitely capable. So he's going to play. So between him, Towns, og, Anunoby, you know, like when many is going to deal with three big strong bodies and we know that's what the Thunder tried to do. Hartenstein did a decent job on him. Just trying to pound him and beat him up and slow him down and wear him down. But I think you're going to see what I think what Steve was talking about was you're going to see the Knicks say we're just going to keep throwing guys at him, but we're not going to overreact to him. I think that's what you're going to see. Make him run, make him work and understand he's going to get his numbers, not overreact to them.
- [29:02]
Alan Hahn
Time for you to shine. 1-800-919-3776 William and Hempstead here on Don Allen Rosenberg.
- [29:09]
Caller or Guest
Yes, gentlemen. Good afternoon everyone. What a good day to be a Knicks fan. I mean yesterday I was counting down the days. Now I'm literally counting down the hours. Who's talking about. So I'm pretty sure it's going to be a long drawn out game series here. But I eventually have one negative concern of min.
- [29:26]
Rosenberg
What is it?
- [29:27]
Caller or Guest
It's a foul calling. It's a foul calling, particularly between Cat and Wemby. Now, I don't know Val, you may know better than I do. I feel that the one who keep each other big men from getting into foul trouble is the one that's going to win the game and then eventually the series. So if you saw these two teams separately with playoffs, who had the bigger edge for keeping the big man into foul trouble. Because I'm still concerned it's going to come down to the ref calling these things during the game. Friends, join raising afternoon.
- [29:54]
Rosenberg
Thank you.
- [29:55]
Alan Hahn
Yeah, thank you.
- [29:56]
Rosenberg
It always does come down to whistles at times. Right? Like that always is. How are they going to call it? Understand this, it is the finals. There's no official that is going to try to take over the game. This is where the officials all know, everybody's watching them too. So you're not going to get like in a regular, in a series earlier on when everything else is going on. You know, there might be some situations where you're like, you know, the officials swallow the whistle, all that stuff. I don't think in the finals you get that. I think in the finals you're just getting calls straight up. What I like is if you were playing the Thunder, you'd really worry about the flopping and all the extra stuff that they do. Spurs play straight up. They don't. They don't really do too much of that. Then again, everybody does it a little, but no one does it to the degree the Thunder do. That really puts pressure on the officials, whether they're going to call it or not. So I think that goes out the window. But it is true about Towns. He can get into foul trouble if he's guarding women. Yama, early in the game, you do worry about him picking up a couple of cheap fouls that could have a huge effect. But, you know, you also have to know that you can get their guys in foul trouble, too. Fouls are part of the game. But I wonder how much they'll allow physicality. Because the Knicks like to defend physically and they're very good when they're allowed to. But guess what? So the spurs, their guards especially, castle physical, tough defenders that if you let them play and don't call the cheap stuff, it's going to be a battle of attrition.
- [31:26]
Alan Hahn
I know we get into the conspiracy theories all the time. Well, they want Wemby to win. He's the next face of the frame of. Of the NBA. And you can't be that unless you have a ring. And I'm sure people in San Antonio going, you know, they want New York to win big market. Great story, tremendous story. Like everybody gets into the conspiracy theories. These are the best of the best. These officials are evaluated all year long so they can be in the position that they're in. And that's why you get the best of the best. Does that mean they're not going to screw up. Of course they're going to make mistakes and there could be questionable calls, but overall, you know, you've got the best guys in there and you just, it's really the style of how they're going to call. Are they going to let them play? Are they going to call everything? But I think it'll. That's more style than it is incompetence, of course. You know what I'm saying?
- [32:12]
Rosenberg
Yeah. I also think that in the end, I've never remembered NBA Finals where I've blamed the. I've said the winner won because of the officials. It's always playmaking shot making at this level. Those are the two things that matter. The teams that do that the best are going to win. Simple as that. Playmaking shot making.
- [32:30]
Alan Hahn
1-800-919-3776, Matt in Westchester, you're on ESPN New York.
- [32:37]
Caller or Guest
Hey guys, listen, just to echo the last caller, what a time to be a Knick fan.
- [32:40]
It's been.
- [32:41]
I think I was 17 the last time they were in the finals, so it's been a long road and I'm going to tell you, I wasn't really so confident when, you know, the coaching change was made in the beginning between, you know, Thibodeau and Brown. I think Thibodeau was a fantastic coach. But to see what happened throughout the playoffs, especially where they started embracing kind of cat at that point forward as that point center, as that playmaking type of center where you embrace his strengths and say as long as you're passable on defense, we can build another team around you and another team that has another gear. As soon as I saw that and double digit assists were coming up, I was like, oh my God, we reached another gear. Yep, this is another level of play that I hadn't seen before ever. In the last however many years, 50
- [33:29]
Rosenberg
years, like 40 years, whatever offense is reminiscent of the 73 team. For anybody that's old enough to have seen them, it's what Clyde told me. He's like, that's how we played. It was just share the ball. The ball will find, you know, the open man. That's all they care about. And he said I would pass to look for the open man. And sometimes I was the open man. But it was game to game, matchup to matchup, situation to situation. There was always somebody who was going to end up being the open man. And a lot of times it's Josh Hart and he's got to knock down those shots when he is. A lot of times it's Mikhail Bridges. And that's why he's averaging 18 a game during the winning streak, because he finds himself opened by all the cutting and moving. And the Towns thing that he brought up, which is a really good point, is, if you think about this too, Towns doesn't. It's not about how many shots he gets up. It's having the ball, feeling like I'm part of the offense. He loves to be a playmaker. Do you realize that that actually has made him a better defender? Does that make sense to you? No, it does because he feels engaged. And now instead of running back on defense going, I haven't touched the ball, I didn't get the ball right. And, like, feeling frustrated that I'm not part of it. We haven't scored in two possessions, I haven't touched the ball. Now my head's somewhere else and now I get beat, Right?
- [34:42]
Alan Hahn
Yeah.
- [34:42]
Rosenberg
Instead he's. He moves it past the ball and now he's getting back and now he's locked in. He's more engaged because he's part of it. He feels involved. And all year we kept wondering, what is wrong with him? What is wrong with Cat? It was as simple as that. He just wanted to be involved. He wanted to feel part of it. And ever since they've made this change, he's been a different guy, not only personality wise, but on the defensive end.
- [35:06]
Alan Hahn
Oh, we had lots of conversations. What's wrong with Cat? I had speculated, was it because of the possibility of making a trade for Giannis and he being the guy that would go and, you know, am I going to go to another team? I'm in Minnesota, I'm in New York now. I'm going to go to Milwaukee. Am I ever going to finally land someplace and be a part of a team that's trying to make a run to a championship? But maybe it was just that. He just was misplaced. Now you got to find a way to overcome that. But I can understand.
- [35:31]
Rosenberg
Yep.
- [35:32]
Alan Hahn
You know, when things are going your way one way, you're probably going to bring it to the other. Like, it always seems like the guy that makes the big play in the baseball game, in the field, you know, if he's leading off the next inning, he'll hit a home run like he's. He's in it, you know, because things are going well.
- [35:46]
Rosenberg
Right.
- [35:46]
Alan Hahn
You feel like you're involved. And that's such a great way you described it. I'm not getting the ball now. I've got to bust it down there and play defense and My mind someplace else. And you know, defense is. There's a lot of strategy too, but it's also just the effort engagement of lock.
- [36:01]
Caller or Guest
Right.
- [36:02]
Rosenberg
Just be focused.
- [36:03]
Alan Hahn
And that's just another reason why everybody just seems to be on the same page.
- [36:09]
Rosenberg
By the way, when you thinking about the coaching change, it was this day a year ago that they announced they're moving on from Tom Thibodeau. Imagine that.
- [36:20]
Alan Hahn
Yeah, it's.
- [36:21]
Rosenberg
And a year later they're in the NBA.
- [36:22]
Alan Hahn
Well, it's it.
- [36:24]
Rosenberg
Because that was a move all of us, myself included, it was like, what are you doing? That's a risky thing. A coach that gets you. Like he's turned the franchise around, won a lot of playoff games. He's. He brought you right to the doorstep and you were like, nope, it's got to change. It's got to be better. And they made a risky move. And a year later, a year later, Don, they are now playing for the NBA.
- [36:47]
Alan Hahn
I want to dive deeper into that because I've got a couple of things to say about the coach and how that all went down. It is so ironic. Just more symmetry with this team. The one year anniversary, dibs being let go. And here is game one of the NBA Finals in San Antonio. Just unbelievable. Got tons of calls to get to at 1-800-919-3776. Monica McNutt's going to join us at 4. Bill Peto will join us at 4:45. We've got a list at 4:30. We got ENN at 6. Take you right up to 7 o' clock and then it's Pat O' Keefe with the pregame game one. Finally. Here we go. Knicks and the Spurs. We're live from stout 35th between seventh and eighth swing by. We're here till seven, Don on the Rosenberg ESPN New York.
- [37:28]
Rosenberg
So good, so good, so good.
- [37:30]
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- [37:55]
Rosenberg
Study and play.
- [37:57]
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- [38:26]
Don Hahn
Thanks for listening to the Don Han and Rosenberg podcast.
- [38:30]
Alan Hahn
I didn't listen to anything you just said.
- [38:31]
Don Hahn
Catch this show on demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcasts.
- [38:38]
Alan Hahn
We were just talking about this is the one year anniversary of Tibs being let go. And I remember that.
- [38:42]
Rosenberg
Amazing.
- [38:43]
Alan Hahn
Like, what are they doing? It doesn't make any sense and it's not unprecedented and we're seeing it happen now. I mean, it's what the Islanders tried to do with Patrick Waugh and they made the move and it didn't, obviously didn't work for them to be able to make the playoffs, but if they did sneak into the playoffs and made a run, we'd be praising Dars for making the deal and bringing DeBoer in. But you brought it up during our group chat. We're watching game one of the Stanley cup finals last night. Vegas and Carolina and Golden Knights come back from two nothing down to win that game. You know, crazy game. And they made the move to bring in John Tortorella. And just like Tibbs, nobody's saying that Bruce Cassidy, who was the coach that was let go, is a bad coach. Matter of fact, they're lined up to hire him. It's just that right now, Vegas isn't granting permission to certain teams because they know how good a coach he is.
- [39:35]
Rosenberg
Right.
- [39:36]
Alan Hahn
But he wasn't the right coach for them at that particular moment. And it looks like John Tortorella may be because they win that game. They're up north. Well, nothing. They're three wins away from winning a cup.
- [39:44]
Rosenberg
Right.
- [39:44]
Alan Hahn
And the Knicks are four wins away from winning their championship. And you saw how Joe Torre changed things. Buck Showalter is a hell of a coach. Yes, but Joe was just right for that. Period. So just like we talk about free agency, it's not the best player, it's the right player. It's the same with coaches. You could be a great coach and you get us a lot of wins. But we believe we need something different. Now. Where the Knicks lucked out is that what if Jason Kidd had taken the job? What if. But Johnny Donovan had taken. Not Johnny Donovan, Billy Donovan. Johnny Donovan was somebody who used to be our imaging guy way back in the day. Yeah, but the point is, is that, would this be happening with them? Because that takes credit away from Mike. And I don't think that's fair because I think Mike brought. All right, he's not Tibbs. Remember the whole. Anybody but Tibbs. There may be something to that, but he's brought something Allen, that has contributed to this, not just the fact that he's not Tom Thibodeau.
- [40:37]
Rosenberg
It's amazing, right? Because the conversation at the time was like, Mike Brown wasn't their first choice is what people say. And it was because of. They were first reaching out to teams, asking about the availability of current coaches, and the team said no. So you went one by one through different teams and was told no. So Jason Kidd certainly, famously was one. You know, like we just go down the line. But there were several coaches they reached out for and it almost became kind of comical because they were just. It was. It almost became like they're going to ask every single coach in the league. Right.
- [41:15]
Alan Hahn
That's what it felt like. And that's where he came up with anybody but Tip just sound like, just give me somebody else, give me somebody.
- [41:19]
Rosenberg
But Mike Brown ended up being the right guy. Exactly what they needed. And what I, I like the, the, the symmetry between him and Tortorella having successful is that Tortorella, last time he was in the Stanley cup final was 2004. I covered that final.
- [41:37]
Alan Hahn
I was like seven of that series.
- [41:38]
Rosenberg
Yeah. Myself, I was there too. And like to think about it, he. It's 20, 22 years, right? 22 years in between appearances. And for Mike Brown, his last time as a head coach in the NBA Finals in 2007. So it's 19 years. So the two of them have gone like a long time in between coaching in the ultimate series. And so the fact that both of them are back in it right now at the same time, there is an interesting symmetry to that. And it's, you know, it'd be interesting to see if they both can win, you know, but it's just, it just shows you, though, that sometimes a coach is just the right time. And that's Joe Torre. Everybody mocked the Yankees for that. The Clueless Joe headline will go down in history as one of the freezing cold takes in.
- [42:28]
Alan Hahn
Right.
- [42:28]
Rosenberg
When it comes to tabloid back pages.
- [42:29]
Alan Hahn
Right.
- [42:30]
Rosenberg
But it's, it sometimes is just about the right time and the right fit and the right coach with the right group. And that, I think is what we're seeing like towards that. He came in, he said, I didn't change anything. I didn't touch anything.
- [42:45]
Caller or Guest
Right.
- [42:45]
Rosenberg
This is a good team.
- [42:46]
Alan Hahn
Yeah.
- [42:47]
Rosenberg
You know, you saw him call. I believe we called it early. Time out.
- [42:49]
Alan Hahn
He was getting on his bench earlier down to 11.
- [42:51]
Rosenberg
Yeah, he just. He kind of, like, got into him and they got him. Right? And from there, they were great. And I think for Mike Brown, it was tinkering all year, figuring out his team, learning his team. I didn't know Josh Hart was this. Right? That was one of his first things. He had Josh Hart coming off the bench. He's. And then he realized, like, what am I doing? I didn't know he was like this. And then he starts comparing him to Andre Ugadala, who won a Finals mvp. Don. Right. Like, that's when he. When you start throwing around compliments like that, you're realizing, whoa, I didn't know we had this. Okay, that guy. I like what he can do. We can use him here. So it took Mike Brown a better part of three quarters of the season to figure out, what do I got? And then after that, it's, what do they want? I'll give them some what they want. But they also got to understand that I know what's best for them because I've been in situations. He's coached LeBron James. He's coached Kobe Bryant. He's coached Steph Curry. He knows how to coach stars. He's been there. And I think that's also part of this, too, where the team had his stop and start trusting him, and it was no longer. He's not Tibbs. This is what we used to do. And Mike Brown was saying, that's great, but I'm here for a reason, so we've got to start doing things different. And they all kind of figured it out together. It just so happened to happen in the first round of the playoffs, which. When does that ever happen?
- [44:05]
Alan Hahn
Yeah. Right. But it's come together, and they have not looked back since. Let's go back to the busy phones. Bill in. Troy, you're on. Don, Han and Rosenberg.
- [44:15]
Caller or Guest
Oh, Alan, Don.
- [44:17]
Rosenberg
Love you guys.
- [44:18]
Caller or Guest
You know, usually I catch the show in podcast format, but I'm home today, so I get to listen to you guys.
- [44:23]
Alan Hahn
Awesome.
- [44:23]
Caller or Guest
Thank God. Love you, fellas. I got three quick points for you because I know you got Monica coming up soon. I was born in 2000.
- [44:31]
The last time I saw the Knicks
- [44:32]
in the finals was never.
- [44:34]
Rosenberg
Wow.
- [44:34]
Caller or Guest
So I can't tell you how excited I am. I'm almost sick to my stomach about seeing JB Cat and everybody out there playing, but I'm so excited. On top of that, we got to give props to the old Knicks man, especially Julius Randle, a guy who came when it was not orange and blue. Skies and slowly turned around the thought of the Knicks and the NBA, along with Leon Rose and everybody. You know, you got to give those guys props. I love those fellows for coming, banging with us, playing, playing hard, winning playoff series, even though they weren't the best team every time. And then my last point for you, more so for Don. It's a fraud question.
- [45:11]
Rosenberg
Okay?
- [45:12]
Caller or Guest
Now, I'm not a huge hockey fan. I recently got into it, and recently, I would say 2018, and my buddy was a Cane fan then, so I, at the time, became a Canes fan. Once the Kraken got into the league, I thought it was right to become a Seattle Kraken fan.
- [45:27]
Rosenberg
So that's who I put my.
- [45:29]
Caller or Guest
My rooting basis in. Don, would you call me a fraud to say I am a King fan for the.
- [45:35]
For the.
- [45:35]
For the Cup?
- [45:36]
Alan Hahn
Oh, listen, you were very late to the sport. You've only been a fan of the sport for the last eight years. But you got to pick somebody, man,
- [45:44]
Rosenberg
so you got to put a ring on it.
- [45:46]
Alan Hahn
But are you a Kraken fan now? I guess. He hung up.
- [45:51]
Rosenberg
Yeah.
- [45:51]
Alan Hahn
Well, listen, he asked, I answered.
- [45:53]
Rosenberg
Yeah. No, no, no.
- [45:54]
Alan Hahn
He's a Canes fan. Did he say Kings or Canes? I couldn't really.
- [45:57]
Rosenberg
I thought he said Canes.
- [46:00]
Alan Hahn
He was from Troy. Either way, it was another team. And now the Kraken. So you're bouncing around, and we call that a fraud in this business.
- [46:07]
Rosenberg
That's what it is. Mind. You can't make up your mind. You're just going with whoever's good at the time.
- [46:11]
Alan Hahn
We still love you.
- [46:12]
Rosenberg
Oh, no, absolutely.
- [46:13]
Alan Hahn
You know, and. And we appreciate you listening to the podcast now, listening to us live. But you ask a question. I answered. So let's go to Edwin in Bushwick here on Don. Ana Rosenberg.
- [46:25]
Caller or Guest
Hey, guys. How you doing?
- [46:27]
Rosenberg
Good.
- [46:29]
Caller or Guest
Good. Hey, I'm always at the live show. I'm sorry I can't make it today, but I'll be next time. But, you know, I. I agree that, you know, in the beginning when they fire Tibbs, you know, everyone was, you know, skeptic about what's gonna. What's gonna happen, how this team's gonna look with Wilson. But you could see in the playoffs, you could see the difference. You know, he comes from. Remember, he came from the warriors background, right? You know, Draymond Green, you know, controlling point forward. Right? And now. Now, you see, that's where Cat is excelling at. He's playing that point forward. The team is telling the people, you know, we could play ISO Ball, but we could play a different type of ball as well. And with, with Woodson, you see that. You know, with Tibbs, sometimes the offense was stagnant. You know, we get down to big leads, right. But with Woodson in his offense, we could get down 10 points. And with that offense, we can. He could catch up.
- [47:16]
Right.
- [47:16]
Rosenberg
You might be a little nervous. It's Mike Brown.
- [47:18]
Caller or Guest
With Brown.
- [47:19]
Rosenberg
I'm sorry, we're Brown. Mike Woodson was a decade ago. He's a good man. But you're showing, you're showing your Knicks. You're showing your Knicks depth, though.
- [47:28]
Caller or Guest
Yeah.
- [47:28]
Rosenberg
By saying that, by that slip, it tells me you've been around. You've been around.
- [47:32]
Caller or Guest
Yes, I've been around. I'm 50. I seen the 94 team, I saw the 99 team and I see this team and, you know, 94. We knew that Houston was a great matchup because both veteran teams, Right. We knew it was going to be a tough series. And we unfortunately, we lost that series in 99. We was big on the dog. We knew once you went down, once you went down, we knew we weren't
- [47:53]
Rosenberg
going to beat them once. Larry Johnson also lost him too. That, that, that was vital because he had played so great in that run.
- [48:02]
Caller or Guest
And this year's team. Mature. We have a mature team.
- [48:06]
Rosenberg
Yep.
- [48:06]
Caller or Guest
We have a team that if you look at the four of the five starters, they played in the Final Four, they won championships in ncaa, they played and, you know, they're a mature team. And I think that's what's going to be a difference in this series, the experience.
- [48:19]
Rosenberg
Yeah. Well, we're going to, we're going to find out. Definitely. Because you thought that against the Thunder, that the spurs, when was this going to stop? Because they're just too young. Like, you don't see this, a team this young with zero playoff experience from majority of their players, none whatsoever. You just don't see it, that they go on a run like this. So, you know, whatever it is they got, you got to respect it.
- [48:43]
Alan Hahn
Coming up next, Monica McNutt, live from San Antonio. She'll have the call with Tyler Murray.
- [48:49]
Rosenberg
Right.
- [48:49]
Alan Hahn
We love tonight. Our coverage begins at 7 o'.
- [48:52]
Monica McNutt
Clock.
- [48:52]
Alan Hahn
We're live at stout 35th street between 7th and 8th. Swing by here until 7 o'.
- [48:56]
Monica McNutt
Clock.
- [48:56]
Alan Hahn
Don Han and Rosenberg, ESPN New York.
- [48:59]
Don Hahn
Thanks for listening to the Don Han and Roosevelt Rosenberg Podcast.
- [49:02]
Rosenberg
I don't want to know how the sausage is made, but I just want to know. It's good.
- [49:05]
Don Hahn
Hear more of Don Allen and Peter Weekday afternoon starting at 3 on 880 ESPN, the ESPN New York app, and your smart speakers.