Hour 1: Second Guessing

Summary

Podcast Summary: Don, Hahn & Rosenberg – Hour 1: Second Guessing

Podcast Information:

• Title: Don, Hahn & Rosenberg
• Host/Authors: Don La Greca, Alan Hahn, Peter Rosenberg
• Episode: Hour 1: Second Guessing
• Release Date: July 10, 2025
• Description: Don La Greca, Alan Hahn, and Peter Rosenberg discuss New York sports, particularly focusing on the Mets in this episode.

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1. Introduction and Context

The episode kicks off with a lively banter between Don Hahn and Alan Rosenberg, briefly touching on the upcoming Mets game scheduled for 5 PM. They set the stage by discussing the fluidity of the ESPN app and the necessity to switch stations due to the doubleheader.

Notable Quotes:

• Don Hahn [00:00]: "Licking the television screen. Licking it like it's ice cream."
• Alan Rosenberg [00:03]: "Hahn. Oh, the type of music I listen to would make you cry."

2. Analyzing the Mets' Recent Loss

Don Hahn expresses frustration over the Mets' recent 3-1 loss, highlighting the team's consistent inability to hit with runners in scoring position and the reliance on the bullpen. He criticizes Manager Carlos Mendoza's decision to pull starting pitcher Carlos Mendoza after seven innings and limit him to 90 pitches.

Key Points:

• Mets had a 1-0 lead going into the eighth inning but lost 3-1.
• Don criticizes the bullpen's inability to secure wins in close games.
• The offense's underperformance in producing runs with runners in scoring positions.

Notable Quotes:

• Don Hahn [01:30]: "Why am I so hot to get to Stanek? Why can’t I just get another 10 pitches out of Peterson?"
• Alan Rosenberg [03:26]: "For the most part, he's been a problem."

3. Bullpen Issues and Managerial Decisions

The discussion delves deeper into bullpen performance, emphasizing the struggles of relievers like Stanek, who has a 4.5 ERA. Don Hahn questions the rationale behind Mendoza's bullpen usage, especially when starters like Peterson have been reliable yet are prematurely removed from games.

Key Points:

• Carlos Mendoza's bullpen has been inconsistent throughout the season.
• Reliance on pitchers with higher ERAs undermines game stability.
• Mendoza's management decisions are second-guessed due to bullpen failures.

Notable Quotes:

• Don Hahn [05:39]: "I can’t get on the manager for that. But the game is 1-0. Your pitcher is humming through seven innings."
• Alan Rosenberg [09:56]: "They have to get better or they have no chance."

4. Carlos Mendoza’s Response and Fan Reactions

Listeners' opinions and fan sentiments are introduced, focusing on Mendoza's handling of the game and his post-game comments blaming the offense. Don Hahn expresses disappointment with Mendoza's lack of accountability and his reliance on bullpen despite their shortcomings.

Key Points:

• Mendoza attributes the loss to offensive shortcomings rather than bullpen issues.
• Don Hahn feels Mendoza should take responsibility for bullpen failures.
• Discussion on whether Mendoza's decisions align with modern baseball analytics or traditional pitcher management.

Notable Quotes:

• Don Hahn [07:33]: "So, no, he's bailing out his pitcher by saying we didn't hit. Which is the right answer."
• Don Hahn [10:28]: "I just didn’t like the first answer. Well, he did his job, won seven innings, pitched 90 pitches."

5. Historical Context and Pitcher Health Concerns

The hosts compare current bullpen management to historical practices, arguing that despite modern pitching limits, injuries persist. They debate whether pitch count rules truly protect pitchers or if underlying issues remain unaddressed.

Key Points:

• Historical pitchers also dealt with injuries but were managed differently.
• Current pitch count limits (e.g., 90 pitches) may not be sufficient to prevent injuries.
• The need for strategic bullpen management remains critical despite statistical guidelines.

Notable Quotes:

• Don Hahn [36:33]: "They just fought through it."
• Alan Rosenberg [37:17]: "But you take him out early, you baby him, you put him on innings limits."

6. Fan Calls and Community Feedback

The episode features listener calls providing additional perspectives on the game's pitching decisions. Fans discuss the effectiveness of bullpen strategies and offer support for Mendoza while reiterating concerns about bullpen reliability.

Key Points:

• Listeners agree that bullpen performance is a critical issue for the Mets.
• Support for Mendoza is tempered with calls for bullpen improvement.
• Recognition of the tough decisions managers face in high-pressure situations.

Notable Quotes:

• Fan [45:21]: "I've been following baseball since 1968, and I don't remember pitchers getting more hurt than they are now."
• Alan Rosenberg [48:18]: "Wrecker really sounds outstanding."

7. Closing Remarks and Promotions

The hosts wrap up the episode by promoting upcoming events like the ESPN New York Teed Up Golf Challenge and acknowledging sponsor advertisements. They emphasize the importance of bullpen issues while expressing hope for postseason improvements.

Key Points:

• Promotion of the ESPN New York Teed Up Golf Challenge benefiting the Garden of Dreams Foundation.
• Encouragement for listeners to engage with the ESPN app and participate in community events.
• Final thoughts reiterate the central concern of bullpen reliability impacting the Mets' season.

Notable Quotes:

• Don Hahn [35:47]: "The thing I'm concerned about the most is the bullpen."
• Alan Rosenberg [47:24]: "But relief pitching for this Mets team… this is the way they're going to do it."

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Conclusion

In "Second Guessing," Don, Hahn, and Rosenberg provide a thorough analysis of the Mets' recent struggles, focusing on bullpen management and managerial decisions. They express concern over the team's inability to perform in critical moments, emphasizing the need for bullpen improvements to secure postseason success. The episode combines expert insights with passionate fan perspectives, offering a comprehensive look at the challenges facing the Mets.

Overall Takeaway: The Mets' bullpen remains a significant obstacle to their success, with managerial decisions under scrutiny. For the team to advance and compete effectively, addressing bullpen inconsistencies is paramount.

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Connect with the Hosts:

• Call-In: 1-800-919-3776
• ESPN New York App: Available on smartphones and smart speakers
• Upcoming Events: ESPN New York Teed Up Golf Challenge on July 21 at Colonial Springs Golf Club

Subscribe: Listen to "Don, Hahn & Rosenberg" on your preferred podcast platform to stay updated on New York sports and more.

Transcript

[Don Hahn]

Licking the television screen. Licking it like it's ice cream.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Hahn. Oh, the type of music I listen to would make you cry. And Rosenberg, I expect to be called ball coach.

[Don Hahn]

This isn't North Dakota, this is New York.

[Alan Rosenberg]

This is Don Hahn and Rosenberg on 880 ESPN and the ESPN New York.

[Don Hahn]

App, 3 o' clock in the big city. Don Hahn and Rosenberg with you here on 880 and of course the ESPN app, it's going to be very fluid today because of the fact that we do have a Met game coming up at 5, so you're going to have to move over to 1050 then. But if you've got the app, you're like, what are you talking about?

[Alan Rosenberg]

I got it right here. Keep it simple.

[Don Hahn]

Keep it simple.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Stupid. Call me Kiss.

[Don Hahn]

No, that's the thing. Keep it simple. Stupid. Speaking of stupid, that's how I feel today with Mets. I'm just, I'm driving in. Peterson's mowing them down. Mets have a one nothing lead going to the eighth inning and thinking all right, nice. Get a couple of wins in a row here and the Mets end up losing three to one. Stanek coughs up three runs in the eighth inning and the Mets lose three to one and they've got the rubber game of the three game set coming up at five o' clock today. It's just such a frustrating loss and you were probably just listening to it on 880 just before is as incredible as the win on Tuesday was. Having that big eighth inning again, you're down 6 2. Oh, you're gonna lose. Awful. But you pulled it right out of your rump and you just hand it right back and it just, it's frustrating. And the biggest thing for me, there's two things that float out there and both are the constant with this team. One specifically with this team and the other about baseball in general. Number one, can't hit with runners in scoring position. Can't do it. Just the one RBI they got on a double with a runner in scoring position. Can't get anything going against a 41 year old starting pitcher, an awful bullpen score, one run on five hits and it's been going on all year long. So when I hear Steve Cohen, when I hear the metapologist going, it's going to turn around. Don't. Well, We've played over 90 games, Allen. Isn't this kind of who you are if you haven't hit with runners in scoring position all year? Why would it turn around if they had done it the first month and a half of the season and then haven't done it the next month and a half, you could say, all right, it's a slump, it'll go back. But when it hasn't happened for 92, 93 games, what makes me think it's going to happen in the final 70 games of the season? Or is this kind of what it's going to be all year? And if it does happen like it did on Tuesday with the big eighth inning, it's more of an aberration than the norm.

[Alan Rosenberg]

I mean, look, the eighth inning giveth, the eighth inning taketh away. All right, that's what you, that's the story of the last two games. Because when you did make the comeback, you did it at least one of those home runs with a runner in scoring position, if I'm not mistaken. And I just think that it's, I'm going to be you for a minute and say that's baseball, Susan, because they, you know, like for the Mets, the most part, the issues have been the bullpen, right?

[Don Hahn]

For the most part, he's been a problem.

[Alan Rosenberg]

He's been a problem. The pitch is starting pitching as is. You're starting to get everybody back. Top of the order is generally good. You still got a couple of hits out of the top of your order. You didn't get really anything out of the bottom. This continues to be the problem. But I mean, again, three to one, an eighth inning where you're, you're a bullpen, it's a one nothing game. And that is never when you have a bad bullpen, that's never comfortable. So your bullpen lost you the game, but your offense didn't give you enough. But I mean, every game your offense got to give you five, six runs a game. Every game.

[Don Hahn]

I get it. But you know what, that's why you've.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Got to get better starting pitching.

[Don Hahn]

You're right. But wait, now we move on to the next.

[Alan Rosenberg]

I mean, I'm sorry, relief pitching.

[Don Hahn]

Right, that's what I meant. Even the starting pitching. Because this is the other thing. You know, put aside the fact that they're in a, an offensive ballpark, all right, you can't score a bunch of runs, but one run on five hits, that's all you can do.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Peterson was good.

[Don Hahn]

A 41 year old Charlie Morton. And then you get one hit of three innings from their relief Wolf, Ram and Batista completely shut you down. All right, this is Batista's 18th save, so. But you can't get to their bullpen. A relief pitcher in Wolfram that had a 5.40 earn run average that went down from whatever it was after, you know, he didn't allow a run in two innings. So you don't score. Okay. You can't expect to win games. One nothing.

[Alan Rosenberg]

I understand, but like, like, done, Peterson gave you 90 pitches. That's that. But like, he gave you a good.

[Don Hahn]

Start, but you pass it on to your bullpen.

[Alan Rosenberg]

And this is just screaming to Stearns, you gotta get a better bullpen.

[Don Hahn]

But. But what? I'm also screaming, I don't have the ins and outs. I don't know if his shoulder was bothering him. I, I wasn't on the mound. I wasn't privy to the conversations in the bullpen or in the dugout. He gave you seven innings, but he. 90 pitches gave you seven innings. Why am I so hot to go to Stanek? You didn't have it. You didn't have anything yesterday, right? You had a day off yesterday.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Yeah.

[Don Hahn]

So you can't tell me. Listen, the bullpen, I'm sure, is beat up. I get that. But like 90, 90 pitches, that's all I can get out of Peterson, is 90 pitches. Why am I so hot to get to this bullpen? Why am I so hot to get to Stanek, who's got a four and a half earned run average? Why am I so hot to get to him? Why can't I just get another 10 pitches out of Peterson, get through the eighth inning, give Diaz the ball in the ninth inning, win the game one nothing. So, yes, you can't expect to win a lot of games when it's one nothing. But why? Who's been my best pitcher? Because there's been no mania. Montas has only made three starts, is coming off the il. Senga is going to pitch coming up in Kansas City, but he's been on the il. They're banged up, canning out for the year. Peterson has been the most consistent and healthy pitcher that they've had. And I want to get a win. I want to build off what we were able to do back on Tuesday. And I can only get 90 and I'm hot to get to Stanek, who's been borderline average, if not below average over the last couple of months. Why am I so hot to do that? Why is it going to have to be that way?

[Alan Rosenberg]

Where are you going?

[Don Hahn]

Can I just get. And I can get the Diaz in the ninth.

[Alan Rosenberg]

So you want one more inning out of here?

[Don Hahn]

Why can't I get it's 90 pitches? Because we're talking about the 100. But now it's 90.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Look, full disclosure, because you and I obviously are preparing for a show and we're like. It's not like we're locked in on every. Everything that was going on in this game because it was a day game in the midst of what we have to do. So I don't know if. If. Was he starting to fade? Like, you know, was it. Were they starting to fade and did they realize, okay, we got to get him out of there? I mean, I don't. I. Those are things that the manager will have to talk about. That there's no post game because it's a double header.

[Don Hahn]

Well, we do have sound. And this is Carlos Mendoza Peterson exiting the game.

[Carlos Mendoza]

You're ready in the eighth inning. You know, 90 pitches. So, you know, he did his part. I mean, we can sit here and talk about it all we want. At the end of the day, we didn't execute offensively.

[Don Hahn]

So, no, he's bailing out his pitcher by saying we didn't hit. Which is the right answer. Because they didn't hit.

[Alan Rosenberg]

No, but you hear the anger in his voice. He knows he's being second guessed. He's probably a little pissed off, too.

[Don Hahn]

But I don't want to hear the answer as if we're supposed to give him a purple heart because he pitched 90 pitches in seven innings.

[Alan Rosenberg]

No, no, that's not what he's doing. I think, like, what you're hearing from him in the way he responded was he's annoyed because he knew he'd be second guessed. Because that's everything for a manager. You make a decision and you know it's going to either hit or not. When you go to the bullpen, you don't know. You don't know. You're hoping the guy comes in. He's got to do his job. If he doesn't, you look like an idiot for taking out whoever it is you took out. Right, Right. Like, you know this is coming, so you just hope. Let me bring in this guy. Now you've said it. Stanek has not been good this year. But you're going to him. You're going to the righty, and you're just hoping that he can get you through it so you can get to your closer. That's the plan. But he knew right away, like, when the question was asked, you could hear it in his voice that he already knew that. I'm going to get second guessed on this. That is a. That is a part of baseball. Tough. But what he's saying about Peterson. His only explanation is in his mind, he did his job. He gave us seven innings. Which, by the way, how many met pitchers are giving you seven innings but.

[Don Hahn]

Forget about the inning, it's 90 pitches.

[Alan Rosenberg]

I'm just saying.

[Don Hahn]

I understand.

[Alan Rosenberg]

They don't get that out of their starters. They got it. And he thought, all right, I'm not pushing this. He gave us seven. He did his job. Now it's just, I need it. Look, you need the setup and then you need to closer. That's how you win the game.

[Don Hahn]

And my setup.

[Alan Rosenberg]

And he couldn't do it over the.

[Don Hahn]

Last seven outings is Owen won with a 4.05 earned run average.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Fair.

[Don Hahn]

All right. In six and two thirds innings, he allowed four hits, three earned runs. He's walked eight, struck out 13. He's got a whip 1.80. You're not. Why are you going to Jeff Reardon?

[Alan Rosenberg]

Okay, I understand, I understand. Why are you going to him? Is your. Is your question. But what he's. I, I could. It's easy for us to second guess that decision because we know the outcome for him. He's like, my starter gave me seven. I'm not wearing. I don't want to wear this guy out. We got seven. Our bullpen's got to do the job. And this is screaming disturbance. The bullpen's not good enough. It's got to get better because they could have won this game. One nothing.

[Don Hahn]

So they could have. But getting on second guessing a manager. What am I supposed to do with. They're not hitting with the runners in scoring position. Winker had to leave because of a barking back. Vientos came in for him and got two of the Mets five hits. They're not hitting with the run.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Seven runs in the previous game. They got four runs in one inning. Like their offense can exploit any moment.

[Don Hahn]

Didn't today. So I'm not going to get on the manager for that. But the game is one nothing. Your pitcher is humming through seven innings, but don't answer it like, well, he did his job. 90 pitches. Like, 90 pitches. Like, oh, my God. He really exerted.

[Alan Rosenberg]

What do you want him to say?

[Don Hahn]

No, I want him. I want to say, you know what? I screwed up. I should have let him pitch the 8th. Why am I now? If I. If he goes 8, let's say he goes 8 with 90 and you hand it to Diaz and Diaz blows the game. I can't get on Mendoza. Diaz is your closer. That's the right thing to do. Why am I hot to get to Stanek. If Stanek is lights out, hey, he's really good coming out of the bullpen. I've got no reason not to go to him. But you go to him, he coughs it up, can't even get out of the eighth inning. I'm sorry, Carlos, I like you, I think you're a great manager. But you're going to get second guessed. And if the way the bail out of it is, oh well, he threw 90 pitches. Oh my God, is he in traction? Is he right now in a hospital bed outside of Camden Yards in Baltimore because he threw. Now if he threw 130 pitches, he's got an answer. But come on now. So that's the problem I have with baseball. This is going back to the Clark Schmidt conversation is that now we've just come up with these magical numbers. Like, oh, I, if he. But Don, if he starts the night, if he starts the 8th inning and gets in a lot of trouble and has to maybe throw 102 pitches, oh my God, he might not be ready for his next start. Why are we just coming up with these arbitrary numbers? My team can't score. Stanek is going through it. So you know what? I want to get to the eighth inning. I'd love to be able now that I got a double header, I got a game later today at 5 o'. Clock. I don't know what I'm going to do in that game. Can I, can I get an extra inning out of Peterson? Now he gives you more on the reason Peterson was out after 90 pitches.

[Carlos Mendoza]

Look, I mean since the seventh inning he was going battered about it, especially with all the riders that were there. Once, you know, he got through the seventh with the lefty leading off, I knew again he was going to be batter to batter. Kousser got him there going the other way. And you know, once you get to the eighth inning, you know, a haspanic ready. It just didn't happen today.

[Alan Rosenberg]

You say you had him going batter to batter even though he was so pitch efficient. Was there a limit coming into the game today? Did you guys want to limit him at all?

[Carlos Mendoza]

No, not really. And again, in understanding that they had the lefties ready to go at any time. So it was the seventh against Brazil, one or the eighth against Stanek, but it was just one of those where, you know, we felt like against the righties there, you know, especially once he gets to the through the seventh and then goes back out for the eighth, you know, we turn it over to our guys and we didn't get the job done today.

[Alan Rosenberg]

So he got. All right, so he gets the first battery, the eighth inning, Right. First the hit, and that's it, you're done.

[Don Hahn]

You're done.

[Alan Rosenberg]

That's it.

[Don Hahn]

Don't want.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Don't want you under stress, don't want you under pressure. And they're going to start throwing lefties.

[Don Hahn]

We don't have SNY here, which really sucks. I'm watching on my phone. Yeah, so, yeah, so he went seven. But he did pitch into the eighth inning, gave up the bat. But I just. You're quick to. But Stanick's just not the answer, because that's the other.

[Alan Rosenberg]

That's a t. That's a stern issue, though.

[Don Hahn]

I don't know. Right, right, right. But I'm. And I look at it and I go, if what gives me the better chance to get through the eighth inning? And he was wrong. So I don't think there's anything wrong to second guess when the answer was wrong. And the other thing you always hear these managers, too, they always give you the. Well, I like the guy to start a fresh inning with nobody on. So then you're bringing in a pitcher that's struggling, right? And now you get there, you bring him in with a runner on. So that's not the ideal situation. I would like to see him face another batter, but I just didn't like the first answer. Well, he did his job, won seven innings, pitched 90 pitches. Well, but sometimes the job. When you're in the middle midst of a double header and you don't have that great of a bullpen to begin with, you've been the most consistent, best pitcher. I'd rather fail with him. If he fails. And let's. Peterson gets beat up in that eighth inning, I can say I understand it because I don't want to go to that bullpen. I don't want to have to go to Stanek. It's a double header. I can understand him stretching Peterson a little bit longer. This I don't get. That's the frustrating thing to me, that's what he explained. Now, let's see.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Stanek being as bad as he was, he walks forward like that's. As a manager, it's like, I got. I gotta use who I can use, and that's it. But that's the problem with these games, is that sometimes you look, well, they only scored one run, but they could have won one nothing. Like you can win one nothing games. It's okay, you don't have to score six runs. Sometimes you're going to get got. And Morton does this. This is a wily vet that seems to be at his best when he plays the better teams. It's just kind of what he does. So you knew like he'd be on his P's and Q's and he was good.

[Don Hahn]

Now let's hear what Peterson had to say after the game about being taken out. I mean, I figured because he was.

[Alan Rosenberg]

The lefty and they had some righties coming up, but, you know, I felt.

[Don Hahn]

Like I was in a good spot pitch wise.

[Alan Rosenberg]

I felt great physically and, you know, he kind of just shot the ball the other way. And so I figured maybe give me a chance or come talk to me, see if we can get a double play. But I mean, he made it clear that he was going to be aggressive and so wasn't really surprised when he.

[Don Hahn]

Came out and signaled to the bullpen.

[Alan Rosenberg]

He wanted to stay. He wanted to stay.

[Don Hahn]

He looks at women. Doza did as aggressive. I look at it the other way. I think the aggressive move would have been to leave Peterson in because that bucks the trend, right?

[Alan Rosenberg]

Yeah.

[Don Hahn]

See, that's the problem I have with managers, is that they're never in the community of baseball, are never going to get killed for going to their bullpen because that's what we do. That's what everybody's looking to do. It's all about matchups. It's all, let's get the starting pitcher out of there. Let's get to our bull. You don't want to tax our starting pitcher. You seem to be more criticized sometimes in the, in the scope of baseball for leaving a guy in too long than going to your bullpen. Now, you're right, that how the bullpen pitches ultimately determines whether it was the right move or the wrong move. Now Stanick goes out there, does the job, Diaz closes out in the ninth inning. It's like great job by Peterson massaging the bullpen, knowing his starting pitcher. But when it doesn't work is when you're going to get criticized, of course.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Especially when you know that's a weakness.

[Don Hahn]

Good, Alan. I don't have a kick coming. If Stanek had been lights out, right? But Stanek has not been lights out. So what am I doing in a one run game with a runner on? Why am I putting Stanic in that situation? When Peterson has pitched a gem, let him at least get a chance to get a ground ball, double play, get out of the inning.

[Alan Rosenberg]

This is the point that I keep trying to make with you. This is not a Mendoza issue. This is not even a Stanek issue. This is a Stearns issue. This is what I got.

[Don Hahn]

So I got to work.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Mom like this, to me just keeps screaming to the front office, you gotta do better than this.

[Don Hahn]

But does there.

[Alan Rosenberg]

You know, it's easy to say the offense didn't get it done. And they're gonna say that. And you're gonna hear Mendoza say it. Madonna, the playoffs, you're gonna have games like this where you're gonna need a reliable bullpen. And that's where you're right, that if you. If you knew that you had, you know, Rivera and Wetland. Right, right. And, you know, once we got to the seventh inning, it's like. And it. And then. And then all of a sudden, you know, one of them comes in and just doesn't get the job done. You're like, all right, well, that doesn't happen often. But the fact that the demonstrated performance has been that for the most part, the bullpen has not held up. The Seneca has not been good. So you understand that I can't keep trusting the bullpen, but as a manager, you have to just do what the right thing is. And as a general manager, you have to watch your team and go, all right, this is happening too much. You can't be blinded by. It's the offense's fault. No, this was a bullpen issue, in my opinion, because your offense sometimes is just not going to score because the other team's pitcher was going to have.

[Don Hahn]

It is.

[Alan Rosenberg]

You have to be able to win a game. One, nothing. Every now and then, it's okay. But they couldn't do it here because their bullpen sucks, and that has to get better or they have no chance, not even to make the playoffs or to do anything.

[Don Hahn]

You're right. Then that's something that has to be addressed. But I'm saying, from a Mendoza standpoint, I know Stanek has been struggling.

[Alan Rosenberg]

So if you were in his position and you were. You're aware of everything that you're aware of right now, that you would leave Peterson in the game. I would leave Peterson even after the. Even after the leadoff single.

[Don Hahn]

Even after the leadoff single, you're going.

[Alan Rosenberg]

I'm trusting him more than I trust. Trust those guys.

[Don Hahn]

I'm going to assess my situation. He said he felt good, wanted to be out there. All right, If Peterson said, listen, I was spent, you know, I can complain about why he spent. It's probably humid down there. Whatever. That's not what he said. So he wanted to go. He thought when Mendoza came out that it was going to be kind of like a pep talk or he wanted to stay in the game. With the knowledge that I have about the situation, I would say guys pitched a gem. He's totally invested in this. All right. He gave up a lead off single. Stanek has been struggling. You hate bringing in relief pitchers when there's already guys on base. Right. You rather have them have a clean inning, as they love to say. So I would think Peterson's got a better chance to get out of that inning than Stanek does now. Could end up being wrong. Peterson give up a two run home run. But I'm going to look and say my odds are better with Peterson getting out of this situation than Stanek. And Stanek not only can't get the next out, ends up giving up three runs, can't get out of the eighth inning. You bring in Warren and now the.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Game is walking everybody.

[Don Hahn]

Now you can't. Now you trying to hold on to a one run lead. Forget it. You go down 1, 2, 3 in the ninth inning, you lose the game 3 to 1. You're right, they can't hit with runners in scoring position. But this was a winnable game. You're in the bottom of the eighth inning with a one nothing lead. You're in a dogfight for Philadelphia for first place in the National League East. I want to get this game. I want to feed off of what happened on Tuesday, that great come from behind victory, which they didn't play well. They just happened to have a good eighth inning and won that game, you know, and I want to be able to close out this second half. I want it. There's certain games, there's certain moments, like if you just tell me, oh, Mets lost 3 1. All right, whatever. They gave up three runs in the first inning. Offense didn't do anything. We'll have something to complain about. But when you're up one nothing against a lousy baseball team and I'm listening to the game, drive it in. Sounds like there's more Met fans than Oriole fans in the building. Right? And there's certain moments where, like, I want to get this game. And based on everything that I know, I want Peterson to be the guy to get me out of that jam than go into my bullpen. And I thought he said he was going batter to batter. He was itching to get him out of that game. Even earlier. These. Because managers love to go to the bullpen and the matchups and lefty versus lefty and all that. Instead of just giving that old School. I got one of my best pitchers on the mound. He's firing a gem, he's pitching a shutout. Let's see if he can get out of it. Let's see what he can do.

[Alan Rosenberg]

But again, Donnie, like, did he maybe see. Okay, it's time now to start monitoring pitch by pitch or batter by.

[Don Hahn]

Well, I think their radar goes up, like, north of 80 pitches now.

[Alan Rosenberg]

But you also start watching, like, is it. Is he hitting the same spots? Is he laboring? Is he. Like, there's a lot of little things you watch in a pitcher, because if he's cruising, you do nothing. But for a manager, if you start to see a little bit of laboring, a little bit of struggle, whatever it happens to be, you know, that's when they start say, okay, we're gonna keep an eye on this.

[Don Hahn]

Right?

[Alan Rosenberg]

You know that.

[Don Hahn]

That's all part. That's all part. I honestly think.

[Alan Rosenberg]

I don't know. I feel like what you're. What you're saying, I understand it, but I also feel like in this particular situation, I don't think this is like, you know, it's game three of the playoffs and it's a series tied at one. Like, those are the types of decisions that make you crazy, right? Like Nestor Cortez coming in. Like, those are the things that make you say, what the hell are you thinking there? Why are you doing that? This feels to me like my starter gave me. He gave me. He gave me six strong, I gave him seven. I let him come in for the eighth, but I was going to have a short hook or a quick hook because I want to get this game and it's only one. Another offense is not good. I want to lock this thing down. And that's what he did. But if I'm David Stearns and I'm watching this game, I'm itching now. I got it. I got to improve.

[Don Hahn]

I just. But right.

[Alan Rosenberg]

That's the Mac Itching.

[Don Hahn]

I think these managers are always just itching to. Let's get this starter out of here. Let's play the whole matchup game. And the bottom of the seventh inning, 1, 2, 3, line out, strike out, strikeout. He struck out the last two batters of the seventh inning. So is he laboring how many pitch he threw? He threw 13 pitches in that inning. You want on average to throw about 15 per inning. So he's under. Clearly under the average. Yeah, 90 pitches and that was enough for him to come out of the eighth inning. But what he's saying, batter to batter, is that even in the seventh, even with 80 some odd pitches, he didn't like the if he had given up a hit at any moment it sounded maybe, maybe he would, maybe if he gave up a hit with two outs in the, in the seventh inning, he would have let him get out of the inning. But if the leadoff batter, Loriano gets a base hit to start the seventh inning, he was going to take him out. He was going to take him out with like 7982 batter.

[Alan Rosenberg]

And they also told you the righty lefty, the righty righty matchup, like all the little things like that, that you know the strategy that kicks in at that point because even, even Peterson said that too, that they had a bunch of righties coming up and he was hoping just to get to them.

[Don Hahn]

But that's, but again, you're going by matchup with a guy that's got an earn run average over 4 and a half instead of the guy that's cruising. Pitch it a five hitter through seven, struck out the last two batters he faced in the seventh inning and he gives up a hit to lead off the 8th and you're that itching to get out of it.

[Alan Rosenberg]

What is Donnie, what is your, you already know mine. What is your greatest concern about the Mets that needs to be fixed this season or it could end poorly?

[Don Hahn]

I will answer that when we come back. Plus more of your calls at 1-800-919-3776. We got lots to do today. Talk a little basketball, talk a little football as well. It's the Thursday rewrite coming up at 4:36 o' clock we got ENN. We'll take you up until 5 o' clock here on 880, but on the app right up until 7 on ESPN New York.

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[Alan Rosenberg]

You can Venmo this or you can Venmo that.

[Don Hahn]

You can Venmo this or you can Venmo that.

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[Alan Rosenberg]

Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.

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I didn't listen to anything you just said.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Catch the show on demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcasts.

[Don Hahn]

Game Time is brought to you by Televardo Irish Whiskey because when it's game time, Alan Mets lose the first game of the doubleheader 3 1. Game 2 is going to begin at you can hear that on 880 starting at 5 o' clock while the Mets usually games that start at 5 usually start at 5 and the Mets close out the Yankees close out their series with the Mariners at 7:05. They got the brooms out trying to get the sweep Tullamore due the original triple distilled, triple blended and triple cast matured Irish Whiskey. Be sure to grab a Tullamore Dew or try the new Tullamore Dew Honey during today's action. Glasses up to enjoying Tullamore Dew responsibly To honor to tease to answer your question, the thing I'm the most concerned about, and it's not just because of what happened today, okay. It's because they're going to need bullpen. When you look at the postseason, even, even before analytics and all that, think of the greatest postseason games in Yankee history or Mets history. You don't even remember who started the game because so many things happen after the sixth inning, right? Games go into extra innings and it's usually the bullpen that's going to win or lose you the game. Listen, their offense is a problem, but they still have really good offensive players. They have Soto, they have Alonzo. Nimmo is a good offensive player. Lindor is a fantastic offensive player. Viento sat a couple of hits. Today was big in the postseason for them. I'd like the offense to be better, but the thing that I'm concerned about the most is the bullpen. They're going to get mania back. Montas is going to get going again. Sanga is going to pitch this weekend against Kansas City. So they're getting healthier there. So I'm not saying it's the only thing they need Allen, but they're going to need help in this bullpen. Everybody can use help. They can use it more than anybody else.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Like we talked about the need for a third basement for the match just like you do for the Yankees and you the bottom of the order has not been strong. See again you want to find some positives. Vientos, is he starting to find it like that? You need to see a big lead.

[Don Hahn]

Off Double, I think it was in the fifth or sixth early in the.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Stayed there.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah, right.

[Alan Rosenberg]

But like those are like the little things. Right. But relief pitching for this Mets team, especially if you consider that they have gotten through the first half of the season mainly without a lot of the start. Right. And they're not like big money starters. This is the way they're going to do it. But if they can get now their five man rotation rolling and Manias gives you, gives you what? A little something. What he gave you last year. I don't know what, what do you expect from an eye? What do you think? Can he give you what he gave you last year?

[Don Hahn]

Well, that's the whole thing.

[Alan Rosenberg]

But you know, he's been out now for a half season.

[Don Hahn]

I know, but at some point, once we get to the postseason, I'm hoping he's going to be, I would think, either my second or third, my, my game two or game three starter. Right? Yeah. Well, maybe if Peterson continues to pitch well, maybe a Game 3 starter, he's going to be pitching in the postseason.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Right.

[Don Hahn]

And I'd like to see him go north of 6.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Montos gave you a good start against the Yankees. That showed you something. Right. So you're, you're.

[Don Hahn]

So he's getting, he's there.

[Alan Rosenberg]

He's probably a third. And then obviously you have Sanga.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah. Just hoping he doesn't just stay healthy, lower body stuff, you know, calf and all that.

[Alan Rosenberg]

So, so. But what I mean is, is like you have that and you know, your offense for the most part has clutch ability and has a lot of talent. Right. They put a lot of pressure on opposing pitchers. You know this. They had a bad game today, but still, for the most part, you're getting. They have to just get a couple of guys that you could put in the game that can just lock it down. You need. That's all you're looking for. Give me a lefty, give me a righty. Two guys. I can rely on that. I know I can get to Diaz because most of your starters ain't getting out of the fifth inning. It just doesn't. They don't do that.

[Don Hahn]

Right. But, but when you do get that outing like you got today, you got to take advantage of it. And I just feel, I just feel like I get it. Oh, seven's enough. We can't ask for more than that. We can't ask for more than 90 pitches. We can't ask to try to get out of a jam in the eighth inning. And again, if Stanek was lights out lately. I'd say, you know what? Why not? You know, this is what he's here for. I would not criticize this if it was the eighth inning, if it was the ninth inning. Excuse me. He brought Diaz. All right, we're going to let you try to get the complete game. You give up a single. I'm bringing Diaz in because Diaz is your closer. I get it. But this has been. And Waddell's going today, so how much is he going to give you? It's probably going to be deep into the bullpen again today. And then you hop on a plane, you go to Kansas City, and you got a series there. No days off until you get to the All Star break. I don't know, it just. It is frustrating.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Rafael said on Twitter. Also, it's a good point. This is Peterson's last start before the All Star break, Right. So he gets. Yeah, he gets a break.

[Don Hahn]

He felt good. But Artie in Brooklyn disagrees. What do you got, man?

[Alan Rosenberg]

I disagree.

[F]

I love you. Congratulations on the Devils.

[Don Hahn]

Oh, thank you, man.

[F]

Here's the thing. If. If he took him out and didn't give him the hit, or they got the hit, he left him in there. Peterson is not fever. I mean, and I know Stanik's been having a problem from the beginning of the year. He was our infinite guy. And I believe you could check the last time out, it was the formula. They put Stanick in. They put Diaz in. Lights out, 1, 2, 3, game over. Nobody said Eddie was starter in there. Look, Peterson was struggling until his last start. I guess he wanted to even giving him the extra batter in the ace. Once he said that and you found out that I think you've got a chance, you say, all right, he gave him a chance.

[Alan Rosenberg]

No.

[F]

All right, thanks, guys.

[Don Hahn]

I appreciate it. What do we hear all the time from that?

[Alan Rosenberg]

Was that was the. The formula against the Yankees? No, I came in motem down.

[Don Hahn]

Right. But. But overall, he's working to a four and a half earned run average. We always hear or we want our relief pitchers to get clean innings. So if you're itching to get him out, then you could add Stanek, start the eighth. But you gave Peterson a chance to go into the 8th. Thing. But he said he was batter to batter. Which means I think even if he had given up a hit in the seventh, he was going to take him out.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Seems like it.

[Don Hahn]

But he closed out the seventh strong, already gave up a hit, didn't give up a home run, didn't give up an extra base Hit. He gave up a single. Right. But I can't let my guy who's right now, let's face it, he's my ace. He's not supposed to be, but right now he's been my best starting pitcher.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Yeah, I.

[Don Hahn]

Is it fireable? No, but I just didn't. I just. This is what I. This is what set me off. Honestly, I wasn't even going to go here.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Oh, boy.

[Don Hahn]

But this is what set me off.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Where are you going?

[Carlos Mendoza]

You're already in the eighth inning. You know 90 pitchers, so, you know, he did his part. I mean, we can sit here and talk about it all we want. At the end of the day, we didn't execute offensively.

[Don Hahn]

So what bothers me is he put it on it. It's the eighth inn put it on the off 90 pitches. Like you're making it sound like that, that he's. He's Walter Johnson throwing his like 200th pitch of the inning. Come on, guys. I'm sorry. I'm never going to let this go. I'm never going to let this go the way we baby pitchers and what ends up happening, like, Artie's a good fan, but we brainwash the fans to think, well, these guys can't give you more than that. He's thrown 90 pitches. He lucky, doesn't have a stroke. Get him out of there. And I'm like, no, man, not when I got a first game of a doubleheader. I don't have a day off until we hit the All Star break. I want this game. I want this game. Bad Peterson was a dog today. A dog. And just because Stanek pitched well against the Yankees, he has not pitched well of late. He's walked a ton of people. Even the game against the Yankees. He lost the strike zone. So I've already got a guy on. All I know is he's going to walk the ballpark again. I want to see the guy that's out there, that's given my all, let him find a way to work out of it. And we've lost that in baseball now. We've lost that. I built something here. Let me try to finish it. We've taken the dog out of baseball. We really have.

[Alan Rosenberg]

The only problem with, and I don't disagree with you, but most recently we just saw Clark Schmidt not finished a no hitter, right? And we all lost our minds for the same reason. Guys pitching well, he deserved to stay all the things. And then what happened?

[Don Hahn]

See, he got hurt. He's got.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Because they're not built for this. Let's ask you this.

[Don Hahn]

Let me ask because I asked the group chat when it, when the news came down. I know my opinion that he should have at least tried to pitch the eighth inning of that game. Did him getting hurt make my point age poorly or did it age like fine wine? Because it could go either way. Think about it. Well, Don, he just got hurt. That's why he didn't push it.

[Alan Rosenberg]

He could have hurt it in that game.

[Don Hahn]

But the point is, is the reason it could have aged well is the fact these guys are going to get hurt anyway. You tried to protect him and he still got hurt. You got him out so he wouldn't get hurt. Guess what?

[Alan Rosenberg]

He still got hurt. Well, you could argue that they probably should have taken him out sooner, but.

[Don Hahn]

They didn't want to get a no hit. There is no evidence that I've seen that tells me that this arbitrary number of 100 pitches is damaging. When guys don't throw 100 pitches and they still get hurt. Show me the formula that keeps these guys healthy. When does it happen? We, we, we baby Jabba Chamberlain and he got hurt. We know why, but it doesn't work.

[Alan Rosenberg]

It's what they're throwing, but it doesn't. That's what's changed everything.

[Don Hahn]

But you take him out early, you baby him, you put him on innings limits, you start a six man rotation to have guys skip starts and they still get hurt.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Okay, so there is one person to blame. And he knew it the minute he made the decision. And that of course is Mendoza. It's him. Like that's it. There's no one else to blame. The manager made a decision and it blew up in his face like before he even got back to the dugout. It was a mistake. The starting pitcher wanted to stay in and the manager said he had done his job. I made a decision and he had to stick to it. And so what you want that probably will make you feel better. And we've talked about this. The whole podium thing with a lot of these coaches and managers is instead of what you heard, he sounded like he was. I told you, he sounded pissed off. He knew the question was coming. He knew he was going to get second guessed and it bothered him and it should because he's a competitor. But you're right. In that moment, what he's got to do is say so on me. I should have left him in. I made a mistake, but I was trusting my guy and our offense didn't look like it had it and I wanted to get this game bad. And I just felt like that was the right move to make and it wasn't. But he didn't say that, did he? He blamed the offense.

[Don Hahn]

They blamed the offense. And it's all, it's 90 pitches.

[Alan Rosenberg]

And then he just said, well, I can't make him throw anymore. So he threw up excuses. That's an experience for a manager. He'll learn from. He's got to learn from it. You're annoyed because of his answer. You're not annoyed for what he did. You're more annoyed by the way he did.

[Don Hahn]

Because I'm annoyed because that's the drop the mic moment for them as well. He went seven innings through 90 pitches. What more can you expect?

[Alan Rosenberg]

You know, he doesn't believe that. He knows I should have left it.

[Don Hahn]

Wrong to just say he was a dog. He was a starting pitcher. He was doing his job. I wanted to see him finish it.

[Alan Rosenberg]

How many do you get in trouble.

[Don Hahn]

For that and say, well, hey, hey boss Stearns, maybe the reason I go to Stanek is because you know what? I don't have faith in him. Give me some arms. I have faith in and then I won't do that. But again, it's not even mad at him. It's just mad at the situation where you are just mad at the fact that a guy goes seven plus innings throwing 90 pitches and we're supposed to carry him off like he won something because. Give me a break. You know, I get it. There's pitchers and I'm not even talking about Walter Johnson or Cy Young. I'm talking about like recent pitchers. You know, the Randy Johnson's of the world's, the Doc Gooden's of the world. They laugh at that. Give me a break.

[Alan Rosenberg]

I totally understand.

[Don Hahn]

Come on. I can't. I'm. And listen and I as a fan.

[Alan Rosenberg]

You look at it and you see a game that was winnable.

[Don Hahn]

I'm not even gonna listen. I'm not. But the one position I played when I played baseball, as a pitcher.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Yeah.

[Don Hahn]

So I know even from the high school level that when you're pitching well, you want to finish what you start. And because I give up a leadoff single in the eighth inning after 90 pitches and I feel good that my manager is quick to go to the bullpen. How does that make me feel that they don't have faith that I can't finish this job. So that's what I would worry about if I'm Mendoza is you want to have faith in people and why not have faith That a guy that allowed five hits over seven plus innings in a one nothing game.

[Alan Rosenberg]

You heard Peterson. He was hoping. He was going to talk to him. He was hoping like, yeah, he was hoping. Give me a chance. I want to do this.

[Don Hahn]

This guy has been the one guy that's been able to stay healthy. This guy has overachieved in his career. He's worked his ass off to get where he is now. Is it that terrible?

[Alan Rosenberg]

You think there's a part of. You think there's a part of Mendoza that thought this? I'm finally getting my, my starters healthy. You think there's a part of him that's like I'm finally getting my guys. I don't want to stretch this guy out. I don't want to. I don't want to risk it. The, the game plan says I got my eighth inning guy and I'm my closer. That's enough. I don't want to risk it. You know what I mean? Like, is there a part in the back of his mind where he realizes that that means like my starting pitching games had banged up all year, we finally have everybody together. I don't want to. I just don't want to push it too far where now all of a sudden we lose him?

[Don Hahn]

Well then that's, that's no way. That's no way to manage. That's no way to do anything.

[Alan Rosenberg]

But you're going to tell me that he's not being a little.

[Don Hahn]

I'm sure because just like you said, these guys are fragile. But you said it. He's probably being cautious because he's probably told from above.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Maybe get him out of there. Maybe.

[Don Hahn]

For all I know, Mendoza probably bucked the trending and he's right now getting reamed out by Stearns. That he had him start the 8th might be the other way.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Like how.

[Don Hahn]

Why did you bring. Why didn't you bring Stanikin to start the eighth inning? We like him to go with a clean inning.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Right.

[Don Hahn]

So I'm sitting here killing Mendoza. Maybe I should be complimenting the guy. Or maybe he got himself in trouble for even having him start the eighth inning to begin with.

[Alan Rosenberg]

You don't know.

[Don Hahn]

I don't know. More to this, there's one thing I don't know.

[E]

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[Don Hahn]

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[Alan Rosenberg]

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[Don Hahn]

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[Don Hahn]

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[Don Hahn]

See mint mobile.com thanks for listening to.

[Alan Rosenberg]

The Don Han and Rosenberg podcast.

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I didn't listen to anything you just said.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Catch the show on demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcast.

[Don Hahn]

Give me a second. I love them. Sabbath. Clubby Sabbath. 1973, I believe it was 1973. Great time. I wish I could have gone to that concert in Birmingham. Oh, the tribute. Yeah.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Everybody was. Everybody was there.

[Don Hahn]

It was such a, such a.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Even Guns N Roses showed up on top.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah, right. It was great. Ron Wood from the Rolling Stones was there. Tom Morello. I watched a little bit of it on YouTube and I'm still kind of catching up on it all.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Nice.

[Don Hahn]

But Sabbath, that's. That's my jam.

[Alan Rosenberg]

That's right there for you, right? That's wheelhouse for Don McGregor. It is. Love it. Hey, everybody know it's wheelhouse for everybody here. The ESPN New York Teed Up Golf Challenge. That's right. It's presented by Jake's 58 Casino Hotel. I've been telling you about this. If you're a golfer and you want to be part of it. It's Monday, July 21, at Colonial Springs Golf Club in Farmingdale, New York. That's out on Long Island. Of course, we have teams that are gonna battle it out for amazing prizes and bragging rights. So you can lock in your foursome. Now. Just go to the ESP New York app. You can join me and Don and Rick and Dave Carlin and Bart as well. And Bart, by the way, not a great golfer, but there's something about having them in your foursome that just makes the day go faster and better. Because he's that guy that is just. He keeps you. He just keeps it moving. You're laughing the whole time you're playing golf. You don't even realize that he hasn't even taken a swing. Doesn't matter because it's part Scott, he's just like, just walking entertainment. But we also have other special guests like Larry Johnson, John Starks, Justin Tuck, and who knows, maybe even some more. All proceeds, of course, support the Garden of Dreams, foundations of the near and dear to the hearts of myself and Don as well. The ESPNY AR Teed Up Golf Challenge is presented by Jake's 58 Casino Hotel, and it's brought to you by London Jewelers, Verizon, Wild Fork Meat and Seafood Market, and Infinity. For more details, find the Teed up tile in the ESPN New York app that you have on your phone. Right. Get it. If you don't, today's the day to do it too, for sure.

[Don Hahn]

All right, let's buzz through these phones. A lot of people have an opinion on this. Rich in Rockville, you're on ESPN New York. What's up, man?

[F]

Hey, boys. So I want to touch on two points here. Wrecker was doing the color, I think on radio, and he nailed it. He called it like a mile away, saying that as soon as they were to double switch, as soon as they're gonna bring in Scandic, they're gonna double switch the shortstop into Gunner Henderson. And I mean, we all saw what happened there. Yeah, but I'm all for leaving Peterson. Like you said, like, hey, here's the ball. Go get him. You know, he gave up the hit. All right, fine. But what happens when closers, like, closes the closest? They're their own being. It's, it's, it's what they do takes a special mindset. But every now and then you need them to be your firefighter. We need wins. Why couldn't like, we, like, have Peterson go so he couldn't go anymore. Have Diaz up knowing that Gunderson was going to probably get double switch. I love Mendoza, but he might have been out foxed on this one.

[Don Hahn]

Well, here's the thing which you bring up a great thing with Henderson. They have treated Diaz with kid gloves all year, so I don't think they had any appetite in that situation, especially with the second game of double header to use Diaz for more than three hours. And I, and I agree with that.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Yeah, absolutely.

[Don Hahn]

As much as I wanted the game.

[Alan Rosenberg]

It'S, you're not making him get five, six outs.

[Don Hahn]

And he is going to the all star game too. So it's not like even if he doesn't pitch, he's going to have to go to Atlanta and all that. So I got no problem with that. And I gotta tell you, Wrecker has been terrific. I don't know how much you've got a chance to hear because Howie doesn't travel, so. And McCarthy's wife had a child.

[Alan Rosenberg]

I was listening.

[Don Hahn]

So they've been using Anthony Recker. He's been good.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Yeah, I was listening. On the way home.

[Don Hahn]

Was it Tuesday?

[Alan Rosenberg]

No, Tuesday was the pouring rain, right?

[Don Hahn]

No, Tuesday. Well, Tuesday was after the Micheletti you probably heard on the way home.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Yes, that's right. Yes. In Baltimore, right?

[Don Hahn]

Yeah.

[Alan Rosenberg]

No, no, he was very good. And you know what the best thing about him is, is you could tell he put in the work. Like he knows everything. He was told. He was telling you about the Orioles pitchers and what they're about, the guys they were bringing in. Like it was. It's. It's the way it should be. There was a very good job.

[Don Hahn]

There was a moment. It was, oh, it was so good. Where. Because what was the cause? Rad. Nailed it. So it's a. They throw a fastball to Vientos and he's all over it, bombs it, foul and record goes, oh, if, if I'm him, I'm sitting on a curveball because he's not going to want to throw that pitch again. Curveball rips it into the. For the double. And it was like on cue.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Like it.

[Don Hahn]

Because he's a, you know, a former.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Player, you got a feel for catcher.

[Don Hahn]

So he kind of know, he can see, he can analyze both sides, right. Hitter and pitcher and all that. He's. He's really outstanding.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Yeah, no, he did a great job.

[Don Hahn]

Because play by play in baseball is really hard in the sense that because you work especially on radio, like 162 games and nine innings a long way, you usually don't really get a traditional former player analyst like you do in the other sports.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Right, I have noticed that. And it's mainly probably because you have to do so much describing. Right.

[Don Hahn]

Because you need to. Because usually you like to have someone be able to do play by play to spell the regular player. I play. So, like how we will do six innings and take turns and then Keith Rattle come in. But since John Sterling did all nine, they brought in Susan and now Susan works with Dave Sims. But if you go around baseball, it's usually two play by play guys, you know, doing it to have a former player in there, you don't get it any other sports like I work with Dave or I'm going to work with Kenny on tv. But it is kind of interesting that you do have that in radio. Not as much as the other sports. And I thought Wrecker really sounds outstanding.

[Alan Rosenberg]

You're right about that. I was thinking the same thing, because I remember saying to myself, who is this? Yeah. And then I was like, he's really good.

[Don Hahn]

And a good voice, too.

[Alan Rosenberg]

He just storyteller, relatable, like. Yeah, very nerd.

[Don Hahn]

Very nerd. Michael in Connecticut. You're on ESPN, New York.

[F]

Good afternoon, Don Allen. Two points.

[Don Hahn]

Yes.

[F]

I've been following baseball since 1968, and I don't remember, except for maybe the last 10 years, so many injuries with these pitchers when they started inserting all these rules of 100 pitches. Seems like pitchers get more hurt more now than they did then. So, you know, in the first 47 years that I was following baseball, and it's a different.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Do you remember? So if you've been following it that long, you remember it was, it wasn't ucl. It was always rotator cuff. Am I right?

[Don Hahn]

Yeah, well, ucl, you started to hear a little bit. Yeah, but. Yeah, a lot of rotator cuff.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Yeah, but, but I remember the old, in the old days for a pitcher was always a rotator cuff issue. Always something in the, in the shoulder. Not the elbow, the elbows, because of the snap.

[Don Hahn]

You know what they'll tell you, Michael, is those pitchers got hurt back in the day, too.

[Alan Rosenberg]

They just didn't know it.

[Don Hahn]

They just fought through it. And they've invested so much money in these pitchers now, they don't want to do that. So the second anybody feels something's barking, they'll pull him out, they'll get it checked out, make sure he's okay. I'm sure back in the day, because, you know, I'm 57 years old. I'm not as old as you, but I go back to the 70s. I'm sure guys, you know, guys that pitched 150 pitches, whatever, they probably had bad elbows, bad shoulders, bad knees, and just never said anything about it, or.

[F]

They just said, go out there and give me nine innings, fight through it, or something like that. But you didn't hear about it as much then as you do now. But, but still, with the, with the new rules, pitchers are still getting hurt as much as much as they're, you know, they're trying to protect them. And it's just. And the other thing I wanted to mention today, it seemed to me like that that was not a Carlos Mendoza move. That was a move from upstairs. You don't bring a pitcher in that hasn't pitched well lately. You know, Stanek hasn't pitched well lately. So you don't, you don't bring them in. It's what the analytics tells you what to do.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah because Michael, these games are kind of played over and over before the first pitch is thrown. What are we going to do in this situation? That situation? What are we going to do If Peterson throws 90 pitches it's a one run game. Are we going to have him start the 8th inning? Are we going to have somebody else come in like there's nobody's calling down to the manager saying do this but they know in all the meetings and all the work that they do in preparation of how they're going to handle every possible scenario and that's why he's right about the analytics.

[Alan Rosenberg]

Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast. I don't want to know how the sausage is made, man. I just want to know. It's good. Hear more of Don Allen and Peter weekday afternoon starting at 3 on 8 80, ESPN, the ESPN New York app and your smart speakers.