Hour 1: What's The Plan?

Summary

Don, Hahn & Rosenberg Podcast Summary
Episode: Hour 1: What's The Plan?
Release Date: March 4, 2025

In the inaugural episode of "Don, Hahn & Rosenberg," hosts Don La Greca, Alan Hahn, and Peter Rosenberg delve deep into the tumultuous quarterback situation surrounding the New York Giants. The discussion is rich with analysis, critiques, and diverse perspectives, offering listeners an engaging exploration of the Giants' strategic uncertainties and the broader implications for the NFL.

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1. Introduction to the Giants' Quarterback Conundrum

The episode kicks off with Alan Hahn introducing the prevalent frustration among Giants fans regarding the influx of mock drafts as the team approaches the upcoming NFL draft. Hahn expresses skepticism about the utility of these mock drafts, noting their frequency and variability:
[01:28] Alan Hahn: “I don't know how we feel about mock drafts this time of year, but it feels like we're getting one every other day.”

Don La Greca echoes this sentiment, highlighting the overwhelming and inconsistent nature of the mock drafts:
[01:32] Don La Greca: “I was mocked out a month ago because we're all over the place, guys. It just... they all can't be this wrong.”

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2. Analyzing the Mock Draft Chaos

a. Matthew Stafford vs. Cam Ward

The primary focus centers on the Giants' quarterback options, chiefly between veteran Matthew Stafford and emerging talent Cam Ward. Hahn questions the logic behind the Giants' fluctuating strategies, emphasizing the implications of prioritizing one quarterback over another:
[02:14] Don La Greca: “That's aggressive. No, that's not what you're... doing if you're power ranking your options.”

He criticizes the Giants' potential pivot from pursuing Stafford to courting Ward as contradictory:
[02:35] Don La Greca: “If you're convinced that Ward's the guy to the point where you will trade from three to one to get him... then why was Stafford even somebody you were kicking the tires on?”

b. Critique of Giants' Strategy

Don La Greca challenges the Giants' indecisive approach, arguing that their oscillation between draft strategies signals a lack of a coherent plan:
[05:10] Anthony Pusick: “My concern is it's the Giants themselves. That the reason this keeps changing completely is because they really don't have a plan.”

La Greca reinforces this by asserting the improbability of the Giants genuinely committing to either quarterback choice:
[05:48] Don La Greca: “It's way too over the place. So either somebody was completely making something up... or they're just grasping at straws here.”

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3. Potential Moves and Strategic Implications

a. Trade Scenarios

The hosts explore various trade possibilities, debating whether the Giants should pursue Stafford or focus on developing Ward. Hahn suggests that acquiring Stafford would offer immediate credibility and stability:
[14:03] Alan Hahn: “Stafford gives you instant credibility. You got a guy like... so if you have a chance to get him, you go for a guy like that.”

Conversely, La Greca questions the logic of simultaneously considering both Stafford and Ward, labeling it as divergent and contradictory:
[16:09] Don La Greca: “It's not just erase it off the board... it's a completely different roadmap.”

b. Veteran vs. Rookie Quarterbacks

The debate further extends to the merits of signing a veteran quarterback like Stafford versus drafting a rookie like Cam Ward. La Greca posits that committing to a veteran undermines the Giants' draft-centric strategy:
[16:09] Alan Hahn: “It's two different philosophies for a roster that probably looks like it's more built towards the draft than it is built towards getting the expensive free agent.”

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4. Comparisons with Other Teams

The discussion briefly shifts to other NFL teams, notably the Jets and Eagles, to contextualize the Giants' predicament. Hahn points out the Jets' decisive move to part ways with Aaron Rodgers, implying that unlike the Giants, they maintain a clear strategic direction:
[09:26] Alan Hahn: “They wanted a clean slate. Clearly, this is about clean slate and just getting out of the room.”

La Greca contrasts this with the Eagles' more adaptable and forward-thinking approach, suggesting that consistent strategy is key to success:
[17:40] Unknown: “What they should have done was move... they have a bad tendency of staying married to these situations.”

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5. Host Perspectives and Final Thoughts

a. Don La Greca's Stance

Don La Greca remains critical of the Giants' lack of a definitive plan, advocating for focusing on either securing a veteran quarterback or committing to developing a rookie, but not both simultaneously:
[22:00] Don La Greca: “I really believe that the Stafford stuff was real... but I don’t believe in the mock drafts because... they're just grasping at straws.”

b. Alan Hahn's Insights

Alan Hahn emphasizes the importance of strategic consistency and warns against the pitfalls of indecision:
[21:35] Alan Hahn: “The draft is one. You better know, because the draft... can set you back five years to even a decade.”

c. Peter Rosenberg's Opinion

While Peter Rosenberg contributes less to the quarterback discussion, he provides a humorous interjection reflecting the growing frustration among fans:
[16:33] Unknown: “I'm getting more gray hairs just listening to this.”

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6. Conclusion

The episode concludes with a unanimous sense of frustration towards the Giants' wavering quarterback strategy. The hosts collectively express skepticism about the feasibility of managing multiple quarterback options and the potential long-term impacts on the franchise. They underscore the necessity for the Giants to solidify their quarterback strategy to avoid further instability and to build a more coherent and competitive team moving forward.

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Notable Quotes:

• Don La Greca ([03:06]): “If you love Ward that much, why were you even thinking about Stafford like that?”

• Alan Hahn ([07:08]): “What do you want? And don’t say, make a good decision. I need you to dig in and say this is what they should do.”

• Don La Greca ([16:09]): “It's not just erase it off the board... it's a completely different roadmap.”

• Alan Hahn ([21:35]): “The draft is one. You better know, because the draft... can set you back five years to even a decade.”

This episode provides a compelling analysis of the Giants' quarterback dilemma, blending expert insights with passionate debate. Listeners gain a comprehensive understanding of the complexities involved in the Giants' decision-making process and the broader ramifications for the team's future.

Transcript

[Alan Hahn]

Burger King has a deal for all.

[Don Legreca]

Burger King's $5 duo and $7 trio are here. Choose from six tasty options to build your own BK deal. Get two for $5 or three items for only $7. What deal will you create?

[Alan Hahn]

You roll your season today at BK. Have it your way.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Prior to participation, we are us only.

[Don Legreca]

No substitutions. Restrictions. Apply additional terms. Apply bk.com terms one day you're not gonna play football anymore. And if there's a God up above, it'll be soon.

[Alan Hahn]

Hahn. Huge. No, but big.

[Don Legreca]

Yeah.

[Alan Hahn]

And Rosenberg.

[Anthony Pusick]

I didn't listen to anything you just said.

[Don Legreca]

This isn't North Dakota. This is New York.

[Alan Hahn]

This is Don Hahn and Rosenberg on 880, ESPN and the ESPN New York app. All right. With Don Legreca and Peter Rosenberg. I'm Alan Hahn. We are getting started a little late here today with Mets baseball that we carried here for you. 800-919-3776, however, is the number and there's a lot on the table again today. We get your calls ready to go. But, fellas, I mean, I don't know how we feel about mock drafts this time of year, but it feels like we're getting one every other day. But every time we get one, there's something different to talk about. When it comes to the Giants in the third pick, the latest one, we'll get to a momentarily. Has the Giants move it up to number one? Are we like, can you get mocked out at this point? We still are over a month away from the draft.

[Don Legreca]

How long here, friends, I am mocked out.

[Alan Hahn]

You mocked out?

[Don Legreca]

I was mocked out a month ago.

[Alan Hahn]

Month ago. I mean, the season just ended a.

[Don Legreca]

Month ago because we're all over the place, guys. It just. They all can't be this wrong. Like, you got one mock draft, and then you get another one, another one, another one. It all changes. And then you get reports all the Giants are interested in Stafford going to give them $50 million a year for the next three years. Oh, they're not going to get. They're not going to get Stafford. So now they're going to pivot, and not only are they going to draft a quarterback, they're going to trade to one to get one. Like, that's a pretty sharp pivot. I mean, that's a 180. That's not a pivot. That's a 180.

[Alan Hahn]

Do you know what that feels like? That feels like plan B.

[Don Legreca]

No, that doesn't. No, no, no.

[Alan Hahn]

It has to do.

[Don Legreca]

No, Plan B. Like that.

[Anthony Pusick]

That's a serious plan.

[Don Legreca]

That's aggressive. No, that, that's, that's not what you're.

[Alan Hahn]

Doing if you're power ranking your options. Okay, Stafford's number one. Clearly Aaron Rodgers is not number two. Right. Number two is. What are we, what is it going to take to get Cam Ward? Because to get Stafford is a lot easier when it comes to. It's just money, Right.

[Don Legreca]

Yeah.

[Alan Hahn]

Than it is to get Ward, which would be. You'd got, you probably got to, you know, use some draft capital and get to. Which is what Jordan Reed has on ESPN plus on his, his latest mock, which has the Giants a projected trade jumping up into the one spot, trading with Tennessee. So that's like the harder thing to do. So you power rank that is. Okay. If we can't get a guy like Stafford, Ward's the guy we want. So Rogers is clearly not the second best option. Darnold's clearly not the second best option. It's Ward.

[Don Legreca]

Wait, wait, no, no. I, I, you might be right. And if that's the case, then they're morons. Because, and here's why I say it, if you're convinced that Ward's the guy to the point where you will trade from three to one to get him.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah.

[Don Legreca]

Then why was Stafford even somebody you were kicking the tires on? You weren't gonna, you weren't gonna sign Stafford or trade for Stafford and keep the third pick overall and then take a quarterback because you're gonna think he's 37 years old. I'm gonna have him for two, three years. I think I got more talent than people are giving us credit for. I'm going to go for it. That's what you're thinking. And now you're going to go for it. And you know what? No, we're not going to get it. We couldn't get them. So now we're going to trade up to one to get Ward. If you loved Ward that much, why were you even thinking about Stafford like that? That's my problem, is they're so far.

[Anthony Pusick]

Away from each other, you think they're.

[Alan Hahn]

All over the map.

[Don Legreca]

That's all over the map. Now. I understand that. Hey, I'm lukewarm on these guys. Not really interested in either of them. I might trade the pick. I might get a weapon if I'm going to trade the pick. Well, then maybe I find a quarterback a little bit later on in the draft. Maybe Dart's going to be there if I could trade down something like that. Or I'm going to draft a weapon and get a veteran quarterback. And I agree. If I'm going to get a veteran quarterback, Matthew Stafford is the best available veteran quarterback. But if you're telling me you are in love with Ward or Sanders, whoever the two are, that you feel like you get a trade up to one, I don't understand why you're even considering a veteran. Now, if you're considering Rogers, maybe that's your guy to mentor the young quarterback. But I just don't know how. It's polar opposites, guys. A veteran. Think I can win now? Oh, I can't. All right, now I'm going to trade up to one and then completely do a 180. That makes no sense.

[Anthony Pusick]

Can I make a suggestion, please? Desperate people who don't know what they're doing. Grasping at straws.

[Don Legreca]

Well, are you talking about the reporters that are reporting on this or guessing what the Giants might do or the Giants themselves?

[Anthony Pusick]

Well, my concern is it's the Giants themselves.

[Don Legreca]

That's what I'm concerned about.

[Alan Hahn]

And you should.

[Anthony Pusick]

That the reason this keeps changing completely is because they really don't have a plan. They're trying to figure out anything that could save this next year or two.

[Don Legreca]

Now, please, I'm not trying to kill these guys. I love Mel Kuiper. I love all the guys that do the mock drafts. Mock that in the definition of the word. It's meaningless. It's pretend. It's just what I think at the moment. So I think we put way too much stock in that. But it does come with an educated guess of, here's where I rank these players. Here's what I've been able to. Information I've been able to garner from talking to people. And then the people that are saying they were in on Stafford. I mean, I trust those reports that they were in on that.

[Alan Hahn]

No, they absolutely were.

[Don Legreca]

It's too all over the place, guys. It's just way too over the place. So either somebody was completely making something up. And to me, since I don't believe reporters make things up, the mock drafts tell me that they're just grasping at straws here. That's where I think the true fallacy is. The Giants trading up to one, to me, is more of a myth than them being interested in Stafford. I believe Stafford was true, which leads me to believe that they aren't interested in these two quarterbacks. So the fact that they would trade up the one is complete folly to me.

[Alan Hahn]

You're the Giants fan, Don, so I'm going to ask you, and I want to ask everybody at 800-919-3776 because this is really. Now we're reaching this point point. And, and it. We can't like, like the franchise tag day and everything else. Like we're at that point now where the business is starting to kick in. Now we're starting to see teams making moves. We'll talk about what the jets are doing in a few minutes. The Eagles did something that I'm sure if you're a Giants fan, it's going to take note. But when it comes to the Giants, because there's all these random options, go with a young guy, go with an aging veteran, go with a 40 year old, all these things seem to be on the table. So Don, you need to plant your flag right now. What do you want for your team? What do you want? And don't say, make a good decision. I need you to dig in and say this is what they should do. Which is it?

[Don Legreca]

Based on the feeling that I have and the reports that are out there, I believe they're not in on either of these quarterbacks in the draft. That's if that's the case and now that Stafford's off the board, I bring in Aaron Rodgers.

[Alan Hahn]

Oh my God, you reached that point.

[Don Legreca]

And I. And then if the quarter. And listen, if they don't like the quarterbacks, don't take a fly. You don't take a flyer at quarterback at three.

[Alan Hahn]

And they proved that last year when they didn't take J.J. mcCarthy.

[Don Legreca]

Right. So they didn't say. And everybody seems to believe that J.J. mcCarthy would be, if he was in this draft, would go ahead of Ward and Sanders.

[Alan Hahn]

Well, think about it. They're going to move on from Sam Darnold to, to keep J.J. mcCarthy in Minnesota. So that's how much they like him there.

[Don Legreca]

Or that people just don't believe either of these two quarterbacks have a future. So if, if, if I'm the Giants and I don't love either of these two quarterbacks, I'm not taking a chance at three to take them. So what I would then do is I'd bring in Aaron Rodgers and I'd either trade the three down to maybe get a quarterback that Rodgers can mentor, or I get him a weapon and say, let's see what we can do this year, let's get back to respectability and then we will either draft a quarterback a little bit later on or we'll figure out what we could do at quarterback in 2026. I can't take a quarterback. I don't believe in at 3. I just can't do it. Now. If you tell me they believe in one of these quarterbacks, then do everything you can to get that quarterback. That's why I didn't kill Gettleman for taking Jones at 6. Hey, it's his job on the line. If he loved the guy that much, by all means, do it. Didn't work out right, but you're the guy that's supposed to be in the know. You're the guy that did the work. He was dead wrong on it, but I would think general managers know more than I do about these quarterbacks. So if you love them, take them. If you don't, go in a different direction. But they've Got only Tommy DeVito, signed for 2025. Need a quarterback of the quarterback. And Kirk Cousins doesn't do anything for me. I'm intrigued by Rogers. I am. So it's not. It's not a great. It's not a great feel, but that's what I would do. If they don't love the quarterbacks, doesn't.

[Anthony Pusick]

That make you think. Sorry, Allen, real quick. Doesn't that make you think also, we'll get into this later. If that's a possible option that you'd consider, and I think it's one that you would. Why the hell were the jets so desperate to get away from Aaron Rodgers? It's so bizarre to me.

[Alan Hahn]

They wanted a clean slate. Clearly, this is about clean slate and just getting out of the room. Somebody that you could tell that Woody Johnson was tired of seeing his face. Like, clearly there's just something going on there. No doubt about that. But, you know. All right. Other resident Giant fan is Anthony Pusick. Anthony, what do you want? Like, it's got to be about that. Like, if you could choose all the options that you're hearing about, what's the one that you'd be most satisfied with? If they get to that point, I.

[Frank]

Kind of agree with a little bit of what Don said. I would prefer not to trade up to take either Ward or Sanders. I like Ward better than Sanders, but that might not happen. You may not be had the opportunity to do that. If you like either of them, I'd say try your luck at three, hope that nobody takes them at one. And two, Sign a veteran. I don't know if I'm in love with Aaron Rodgers, but he is probably the best veteran available. Justin Fields, Russell Wilson. Okay, but if you're talking about signing Rogers and drafting a quarterback, whether that be Ward, Sanders, or waiting until the second round for somebody like Ewers or Darts, and he could teach that quarterback. I'd probably be on board with that.

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[Don Legreca]

You've talked about the order of things, Alan many times. I I I'm I'm going to get no matter how I feel about the Quarterbacks. I'm picking up Rogers because I don't know if I'm not going to trade up. And I agree with Anthony, I wouldn't trade up is that there's a possibility that these two quarterbacks go 1, 2 and I'm empty handed.

[Alan Hahn]

Yes, very good.

[Don Legreca]

So I could have, I could have Rogers no matter what. If I draft the quarterback, I still would want Rogers to start the season and mentor the young kid. And if I miss out on these two quarterbacks, well, then I draft a quarterback late or I, you know, or trade down or draft a weapon for Rodgers and then hope that maybe there's something in the second round to take a chance on from a quarterback. I hate not having a quarterback, guys, and you just can't not have a quarterback. But I just can't draft a guy that I don't love. And it doesn't sound like they love either of these.

[Alan Hahn]

Well, here's the thing. If they love Ward and not anyone else, just like last year, they loved Drake May and not anyone else, they actually loved Daniels as well, of course, but they, they couldn't get him either. But they, they loved May, thought they might have a shot, didn't, tried to trade up, couldn't, and so that was it.

[Don Legreca]

If they love Ward, then you do what you got to do.

[Alan Hahn]

Okay? All right. So that's because I do believe they love Ward. I've been telling you they've put a ton of time in on this kid. A lot. So it does tell you that Stafford's the obvious because Stafford gives you instant credibility. You got a guy like. So if you have a chance to get him, you go for a guy like that, you could clearly see that they're not interested in Sam Darnold, who's probably the best available, right? When it comes to free agency. He'd be the best available quarterback.

[Anthony Pusick]

Well, you mean non Stafford?

[Alan Hahn]

Well, Stafford wasn't quite a free agent, right? He was. They had to rework his deal. Right, but, but you know what I mean. Like, like Stafford's off the table now, but once he's on the table, everybody's in. Whoever needs the quarterback should have been in on it, but they weren't. And maybe some people knew he's not leaving and he didn't. So that's the only reason why I'm trying to put it in that order, because it feels like Ward is a guy. If there's a quarterback to be gotten in this draft, he's the one. Not Sanders, not Dart, not yours or anybody else. So the Sense is. So then you would say then by any means necessary.

[Don Legreca]

Right, Right.

[Alan Hahn]

So that is the trade up then.

[Don Legreca]

So.

[Alan Hahn]

But.

[Don Legreca]

But let's get back to Stafford for a second.

[Alan Hahn]

Yep.

[Don Legreca]

You love Ward now it sounds like Tennessee would be willing to make a deal.

[Alan Hahn]

Sounds like you're open for business.

[Don Legreca]

More so than New England was last year.

[Alan Hahn]

Oh, way more. Right.

[Don Legreca]

So. And we're not. We're not to draft day yet. So you still have a chance, if you really love Ward, to go out there and make the deal with Tennessee to get him in one. And I've always believed, like I just said with Gettleman, if you really love a quarterback, do what you got to do. Like Ernie. Of course he did with Eli. He was in love with Eli, didn't care. I'm making a deal with San Diego. I'm getting Eli Manning. All right, so then why go after Stafford? Because. What if you got Stafford, you're still going to try to trade up to one to get Ward?

[Alan Hahn]

No, because you had Stafford for multiple.

[Don Legreca]

Years, but you love the Ward. That, that's, that's the. That's the computer level.

[Alan Hahn]

There's levels of Ward, there's levels of love.

[Don Legreca]

Well, no, there's not levels of love. If I'm trading up to one to get them, that. That's full bloom.

[Alan Hahn]

Okay.

[Anthony Pusick]

I'm with Don. I don't see a world in which you were at one point in on Stafford, but also in now in love with Cam Ward. Those things are divergent. It doesn't make sense.

[Alan Hahn]

800 now with 93776. That's why we're discussing it, because there's a lot of. It feels like they're all over the map when it comes to what they're going to do at quarterback. Frank is in Hoboken with a thought on this. Hey, Frank.

[Unknown]

Hey, guys. How you doing? It's. I'm getting more gray hairs just listening to this.

[Alan Hahn]

Just hearing that reaction, Frank.

[Unknown]

Well, I'll say it like this. You don't. You don't stay married to bad decisions. If the decision was to move on from day ball and Shane, instead of giving him the extra year, I mean, they gave him the extra year for what? So you could. You could have your taste, your. Your try at the wet at the word. A bad. A bad quarterback class this year and decide the future of the franchise, I mean, it's. It's an ongoing circle. Unfortunately, the Giants have a bad tendency of staying married to these situations. If it doesn't work out, it doesn't work out. You cut your losses and you move on. I mean, I hate to say talk about the Eagles, but the Eagles seem to do that quite well.

[Don Legreca]

Oh, they should have cut bait. They should have moved on. They didn't though. So now what do we do?

[Unknown]

Now what do you do? What, what, what this. What they should have done was move. You know what at this point we, the f. The marriage don't seem like they have a lot of patience for them trading down and getting more assets to build the more of a better. A better roster.

[Don Legreca]

I was saying this from the beginning, Frank, because I think we're on the same page and I don't know if Alan ever had a chance to chime in on this that if they were going to bring back Shane and Dable to me, the logical thing to do was to extend the two of them and say I'm full in on them, I believe in them. I'm going to extend them. Because why would you want them both at the end of their contract after year one of a young quarterback unless there's no intention of drafting a young quarterback and they want to win now and if they don't, then he'll hit the reset button. So that's why I feel like this organization doesn't intend to draft these quarterbacks because would it make any sense? Allen, when after John Maris said things better get better if I. I'm going to really be upset if we're in the same place. Well, you're probably going to be in the same place if you draft a young quarterback and play him. So. So if you really believe in Shane and Dable and you are going to draft a young quarterback, shouldn't they have extended their contracts? They didn't. Which means they can make a change at the end of next year. And if you're going to make a change at the end of next year, then aren't you telling the world we're going to try to compete in 2025 and then I'll decide whether I'm going to keep these guys or not.

[Alan Hahn]

That as an owner is what you should be most worried about. It's something that, that Joe, Joe Shane did say at the end of the season in his exit interview with the media when he was asked like, you know, will you make decisions based on trying to win immediately because you know your job could be on the line. And he said, I will absolutely not do that. Now he said that he gave his word publicly but that doesn't mean that there'll be moves made that'll make you scratch Your head. I think what he's doing is every option has to be available because you're a desperate franchise that needs a quarterback. So you have to look into everything. And a guy like Stafford is something that I think you should. I'd be. I was surprised the jets weren't in on that. Right. Because that's a guy that. But somebody of that caliber becomes available, you do what it takes to get him. Because all it is is cap space. The draft. You're right, Don. The draft is one. You better know, because the draw a mistake at at three, just like we saw a mistake at two and a mistake at seven or six. Whatever it was with. With Jones can set you back five years to even a decade. And that's the part where if you're the owner, you've. You've got to really make sure. Are you sure this is the guy? If we're going to make a trade up to 1, which is what the latest mock suggests. And again, all it is is speculation. But still there, you could just see they're. They're grasping at straws. I don't even think that Rogers is a real thing, and I don't think Sam Darnold's a real thing. I think the draft is a real thing. I think that's how they're going to get the next quarterback.

[Don Legreca]

All right. And you might be right. So you're John Mara. You're letting things cook. You're letting Shane and Dable decide what they're going to do. And they're telling you, we love Ward. We're going to try to get Ward. We might even trade up to get Ward. John Mars. All right, sounds good to me. We need a good young quarterback. Oh, also, we're going to try to get Matthew Stafford. I'll be like, excuse me. What?

[Alan Hahn]

Well, that wasn't an also. That was a. Wait a minute. Matthew Stafford might be available. We need to look into this. And it's like, yeah, we should. And then you don't have to worry about getting the quarterback in the draft. I don't think they were getting. They were doing both.

[Don Legreca]

I. I don't get that. You might be right.

[Alan Hahn]

There's options you put on the grease board and then you just wipe them off. The ones that don't work.

[Don Legreca]

No, that's not that. That's the way it works when you're deciding what veteran to get. But true, it's a completely different direct. It's a different roadmap.

[Alan Hahn]

Oh, you're absolutely right.

[Don Legreca]

Taking the quarterback. So it's not just erase it off the board. And like you said, the plan B, this is a completely different direction. It's not even a pivot. It's moving in the opposite. We're going to go for it because we believe we've got talent and we want to win now. So we're going to be in on Stafford. But if we don't get Stafford now, all of a sudden, we're going to believe in the quarterback and go in a completely different direction.

[Alan Hahn]

It's two different philosophies for a roster that probably looks like it's more built towards the draft than it is built towards getting the expensive free age.

[Don Legreca]

You just said it. If it's a roster that's built better for the draft, then why are you kicking the tires on Matthew Stafford?

[Alan Hahn]

Absolutely.

[Anthony Pusick]

That's my point. That's why I don't get. It doesn't go no, it.

[Don Legreca]

Maybe.

[Anthony Pusick]

Maybe they're really keeping everything close to the vest. And the truth is nobody knows what they want.

[Don Legreca]

Right? So the answer is somebody's full of, you know what, Right. Like, obviously these report like. But I really do believe, I really believe that the Stafford stuff was real. And I believe what John Maris said last year when Shane and Dable came back. Those are things that I believe. What I don't believe are these mocks by I. The thing that is less believable are the mock drafts because not to. Again, I'm not criticizing these guys. That's not journalism. Like the mock draft is not journalist.

[Alan Hahn]

It's speculation based on information.

[Don Legreca]

About the thing.

[Alan Hahn]

Yes, that's exactly what it is. It's all based on, you know, whispers at the Senior bowl and whispers at the, at the Combine and what everybody's saying. I'm at St. Elmo's, I'm at the bar and two executives walk by and I overheard him talking about. That's all that stuff is. And it's for fans. It's, it's content. It, it's, it rarely is it something that you put a lot of stock into. But Mel Kuiper does know some stuff. And when Mel Kuiper does it, you know, you kind of listen, you pay attention.

[Don Legreca]

Well, Mel, what I trust Mel in is telling me the order in which these guys should be drafted because he's done the work. He knows these guys. But does he know who's going to trade up where or what each NFL team's specific needs are or their way of thinking? No. But as we're going to break though quick, we got to bring the jets into the conversation. I don't know what the heck's going on there either.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah, I'm teasing that. Exactly that the jets suddenly a couple of things that they're doing as business starts to boom and the Eagles do something that it just makes, you know, it tells you right away. There's chess and there's checkers and we know what Harry Roseman is playing. So more to get to your calls. 800 now with 93 7. The Dierks Bentley broken Branches Tour is coming to Madison Square Garden on August 28th. ESPN New York has your chance to score tickets on the ESPN New York app. Just scroll down to contests and submit your entry. It's brought to you by Live Nation. Tickets are on sale [e-mail] thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast. I don't want to know how the sausage is made, but I just want to know it's good. Hear more of Don Allen and Peter Weekday afternoon starting at 3 on 8, 880, ESPN, the ESPN New York app and your smart speakers.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I don't just stand on business. I live it 247 because you don't become a young entrepreneur by staying stagnant. Whether I'm chasing deals, networking, or taking calls from behind the wheel of my Toyota Crown, I'm always in motion. You may think launching a successful startup is enough to be satisfied, but me, I'm just getting started. It's a new day at Toyota, led by a new generation of drivers, and we want you to know one thing. You can't stop my drive Toyota. Let's go places.