Hour 2: Hulk Hogan

Summary

Podcast Summary: Don, Hahn & Rosenberg – Hour 2: Hulk Hogan

Podcast Information:

• Title: Don, Hahn & Rosenberg
• Hosts: Don Hahn, Alan Hahn, Peter Rosenberg
• Episode: Hour 2: Hulk Hogan
• Release Date: July 24, 2025
• Description: ESPN New York and New Jersey legend Don La Greca, sportswriter and Knicks broadcaster Alan Hahn, and Hip Hop veteran Peter Rosenberg explore topics ranging from New York sports to broader cultural discussions.

---

1. Introduction and Host Updates (00:30 - 01:37)

The episode begins with Don Hahn and Peter Rosenberg discussing upcoming changes in their show's lineup. Jordan Ronan fills in for Peter Rosenberg during his paternity leave, set to last until August 4th. The hosts touch on the importance of taking vacations and the impact of these absences on the show's dynamic.

Notable Quote:

• Don Hahn [01:04]: “Everybody needs vacation. Now's the time to get it in the summertime.”

2. Frustrations with the New York Yankees (01:41 - 05:37)

Don Hahn expresses his frustration with the Yankees' management, criticizing their approach to maintaining a winning culture without making necessary changes. He compares the Yankees to other storied franchises like the Spurs and the Cowboys, arguing that the Yankees' arrogance and lack of accountability prevent them from achieving sustained success.

Notable Quote:

• Don Hahn [04:01]: “So there's no accountability. So this championship or bus mantra that I hear from the fans all the time, you're farting in the wind.”

Jordan Ronan counters by emphasizing the importance of championships over mere competitiveness, using the Yankees' limited recent success as a key example. The discussion highlights the tension between organizational strategy and fan expectations in major sports franchises.

3. Shift to Hulk Hogan’s Passing (19:00 - 27:04)

The conversation takes a somber turn as the hosts announce the passing of wrestling legend Hulk Hogan. Pat O'Keefe recounts how the news impacted his live show, comparing it to the sudden loss of other sports icons. The discussion delves into Hogan's significant influence on professional wrestling and his cultural legacy.

Notable Quote:

• Don Hahn [19:13]: “Peter Rosenberg is going to join us because we lost a legend today in Hulk Hogan.”

4. Hulk Hogan’s Legacy and Impact on Wrestling (27:04 - 34:52)

Pat O'Keefe elaborates on Hulk Hogan's status as an iconic figure in wrestling, likening his impact to that of global superstars like Michael Jackson. He underscores Hogan's role in shaping the wrestling industry, making it a mainstream entertainment powerhouse. The hosts discuss the duality of Hogan's legacy—celebrated for his contributions to wrestling and criticized for his controversial actions.

Notable Quote:

• Pat O'Keefe [28:28]: “Hulk Hogan was able to have the greatest heel turn of all time because he was the biggest baby face of all time.”

Peter Rosenberg adds perspectives from within the wrestling community, acknowledging the mixed emotions fans and industry professionals feel about Hogan. The conversation reflects on Hogan's unparalleled influence and the complexities introduced by his personal controversies.

5. Tributes and Future Wrestling Events (34:52 - 35:17)

The hosts anticipate how WWE and the broader wrestling community will honor Hulk Hogan's legacy. They discuss upcoming events like Smackdown and SummerSlam, speculating on the nature and scale of the tributes. Pat O'Keefe expects an outpouring of love and appreciation, given Hogan's pivotal role in the industry's growth.

Notable Quote:

• Pat O'Keefe [34:06]: “It's going to be a very interesting time to see just how much do they give it? ... I think it will largely be just an outpouring of love and appreciation.”

6. Personal Reflections and Closing Remarks (35:11 - End)

Don Hahn thanks Peter Rosenberg for his contributions and expresses eagerness for his return. The hosts briefly touch on upcoming topics, including discussions on other sports figures and events. The episode concludes with light-hearted banter, maintaining the show's engaging and personable tone.

Notable Quote:

• Don Hahn [35:23]: “We got Yankees, we got Mets. We got so much to discuss.”

---

Key Takeaways:

• Yankees’ Management Critique: Hosts voice frustration with the Yankees' lack of strategic changes despite consistent performance.
• Hulk Hogan’s Legacy: In-depth discussion on Hogan's monumental impact on professional wrestling and the mixed feelings surrounding his personal controversies.
• Industry Tributes: Anticipation of WWE's tributes to Hogan in upcoming major events, reflecting on his lasting influence.
• Personal Anecdotes: Hosts share personal stories and reflections, adding depth and relatability to the discussions.

Notable Quotes:

1. Don Hahn [04:01]: “So there's no accountability. So this championship or bus mantra that I hear from the fans all the time, you're farting in the wind.”
2. Don Hahn [19:13]: “Peter Rosenberg is going to join us because we lost a legend today in Hulk Hogan.”
3. Pat O'Keefe [28:28]: “Hulk Hogan was able to have the greatest heel turn of all time because he was the biggest baby face of all time.”
4. Pat O'Keefe [34:06]: “It's going to be a very interesting time to see just how much do they give it? ... I think it will largely be just an outpouring of love and appreciation.”

This episode seamlessly transitions from discussing sports management frustrations to honoring a cultural icon, providing listeners with insightful analysis, personal reflections, and a comprehensive look at Hulk Hogan’s enduring legacy.

Transcript

[Don Hahn]

Rated T for teen.

[Tony Hawk]

Each year thousands of adults lose their shred. It's an epidemic simply known as shred loss. But it doesn't have to be this way. Because rekindling your shred is as easy as playing the new Tony hawk's Pro Skater 3 and 4. With new parks, cross platform multiplayer and sick new game modes, we can put an end to shred loss everywhere. Hit the new Tony hawk's Pro Skater 3 and 4 and show the world that the shred's not dead. Get Tony hawk's Pro Skater 3 and 4 available now.

[Peter Rosenberg]

This is the Don Hahn and Rosenberg Podcast.

[Don Hahn]

That sounds like heaven to me.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Listen live weekday afternoon starting at 3 on 8 80, ESPN, the ESPN New York app, and your smart speakers.

[Don Hahn]

404 in the big city. Don Hahn and Rosenberg with you till 7 o'. Clock. And then it's Pat O'. Keefe. His show at 7 as he's filling in for Dan Grassa, who's filling in for Brian. Rick DiPietro. It's called the Summer Man. Jordan Ronan's filling in for two people today, both Peter. What's that?

[Jordan Ronan]

Everyone needs vacation.

[Don Hahn]

Huh? Everybody needs vacation. Now's the time to get it in the summertime. So Alan will be back on Monday. Peter will be back August 4th. That's when I go away.

[Jordan Ronan]

Was that like six weeks off? Peter?

[Don Hahn]

It's a whole like fugazi paternity thing. I say fugazi because he took it after the baby was already born and.

[Jordan Ronan]

It'S kind of delayed. Huh?

[Don Hahn]

The baby's, you know, is gonna be in kindergarten. So just. But no, listen, listen. They offer it and he took advantage of it. But he's gonna be joining us at 4:30 to talk about the death of Hulk Hogan.

[Jordan Ronan]

So that's what I was gonna say. He's jumping on anyway and he's downtime and it's vacation time.

[Don Hahn]

Sure. So we were just breaking down just how frustrating the Yankees are. And listen, I'm one of those people too. Like, hey, you're 10 games above.500, you're gonna probably make the playoffs anyway. You still have a chance to win this division even though they're four back. But technically it's five because the Blue Jays hold the tiebreaker for winning the season series. So. And it's still a lot of baseball left to be played and this team is going to look a lot different once we hit the deadline. But it is frustrating because it's the same thing all the time and it's. They fundamentally believe. And there's a Sense of arrogance around it too, that this is how we believe you win. And because they don't make any changes, tells you that they believe they're winning. I brought this up a couple of weeks ago when he passed away. Frank Layton, okay, executive. He coached the Utah Jazz. Remember he.

[Jordan Ronan]

White hair.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah. When his son was with the Knicks, he came by our studio and sat in with us.

[Jordan Ronan]

And then he was in the 80s.

[Don Hahn]

And he, and we were talking about basketball and I asked him, I said, as an executive, would you rather in a ten year span, win a championship but the other nine years you're not good, or would you rather have ten years of winning? You don't win a championship, but you come close. He said he would take the latter. He would rather be good for 10 years and not win than to win once and be bad for the other nine years. That's the exact opposite of what most fans want.

[Jordan Ronan]

Yeah, I'm the opposite.

[Don Hahn]

Most fans want to see the ring. Especially if you, you know, at the time, you know, Knicks have once in 73.

[Jordan Ronan]

You think any Jet fan would want to be good for 10 years that win one championship.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah, of course. And so there's a championship. Let's face it. The Yankees have won one championship since beating the Mets in 2000. So in, in, in a quarter century, they've won one title, all right, Been to a couple of World Series, been consistently good, but they've won one title. So if you're 20, if you're 30, in your mid-30s, you, you know the Yankees for being like, kind of like everybody else as far as championships are concerned. Next. San Francisco's one more championships than you have. The Cardinals have won more championships, Red Sox have won more. So if you're an older person, then, you know, you remember a lot of the championships and the four championships in five years and all that. But what Layden had told me is kind of what the Yankees are like. What is the issue? We're giving our fans winning baseball every single year. No other team can say that the San Antonio spurs were the actual epitome of what a great franchise was. Well, they fell apart. They started missing playoffs, Right. Oh, the Boston Bruins used to go to the playoffs every single year. When was the last time they won? 2011. Montreal Canadiens. They more championships than any other hockey team haven't won since 1993. Dallas Cowboys, the star. The Dallas Cowboys haven't won in over 25 years. They can look at and say, we're better than all these people. What are you complaining about? That's the problem. And so what do you do as a fan? Continue to beat yourself over the head? Or do you realize, you know what, your franchise is special in the sense that they never have losing seasons, but they don't see there being a problem. You're complaining about the standard, you're complaining about not being the dynasty they used to be. You're complaining about all this stuff. I don't see where they believe there's any issue. And the reason I know that is because what change do you see? You got a manager that just got an extension. You've got a general manager that is never going to go anywhere.

[Jordan Ronan]

He's there for life.

[Don Hahn]

So there's no accountability. So this championship or bus mantra that I hear from the fans all the time, you're farting in the wind. The organization doesn't think that way anymore.

[Jordan Ronan]

That's what's in redemption. See, I do some things. Some things I know.

[Don Hahn]

So you're hanging on the rim for Shawshank.

[Jordan Ronan]

I'm just. Fair point.

[Don Hahn]

So you deserve credit for seeing Shawshank. Even Harvey watch.

[Jordan Ronan]

I'm just saying I'm not completely one dimensional. Pretty close to it, but I'm not completely one dimensional.

[Don Hahn]

Let's go to Christian in wanted. You're on ESPN or want to. Excuse me, you're on espn. What's up, Christian?

[Christian]

Chris, listen, I'm just going to talk against everything you guys have just been saying for the last couple minutes. And I'm a Jets and Mets fan, so I can really just argue it all. Jordan, I'm 1996 jets fan. If the jets for the next 10 years were a competitive team and I got competitive football for 10 years and they were close every single year, guess what? I would sign up for that for one year where they maybe. Listen, I know that's crazy. Again, I'll take a chance on everything but say, like I won't sign up for 10 good years of baseball. Like, I know the Yankee fans are stubborn, but when you're like, I'm a Knicks fan now, I'm expecting a championship. That's what you're supposed to do when you're a winning culture. The Yankees are the pinnacle of winning. Their worst year in 20 years were above.500, still missed the playoffs. That was like World War 3. Being a hater is being a hater and that's what you guys are beating right now.

[Jordan Ronan]

So.

[Don Hahn]

So when the Knicks.

[Jordan Ronan]

So when the Knicks are good for 10 years and it can't get over the hump like the. By the. By the Way where they were in the. In the Ewing era, you're going to.

[Pat O'Keefe]

Be like, okay, it's great.

[Jordan Ronan]

I'm glad they were competitive. I. I guarantee that he will change his tune if he was in that.

[Don Hahn]

I guarantee it.

[Christian]

Jordan, you literally championships with the. With the Giants, and you've been miserable for the last 12 years, but, like, if you gave up one of those championships and got 12 consecutive years of winning because you've had two, you'd sign up for that.

[Don Hahn]

No, I wouldn't.

[Pat O'Keefe]

I don't.

[Jordan Ronan]

Chris, I think you're in the minority here. I really do. I really do.

[Don Hahn]

I respect. I respect your desire.

[Jordan Ronan]

I think you're. I think you're in the minority.

[Christian]

Go ask any. Buffalo Bill said if they don't think the best. The last seven years of Josh Allen is not the best football they've had because they have a chance to win every year.

[Don Hahn]

I think they win. Honestly, I can't speak.

[Jordan Ronan]

Their soul.

[Don Hahn]

I can't speak for Bills fans. Christian. I think they would. They'd wipe their behind with the last seven years if I can guarantee him a championship this year.

[Jordan Ronan]

Don, let me tell you a story.

[Don Hahn]

So let's teach their own. I mean, I'm not saying no. Everyone's agree.

[Jordan Ronan]

Everyone has their difference. I think we're probably in the majority and he's in the minority, but he's certainly not alone in that.

[Don Hahn]

So.

[Jordan Ronan]

I lived in Philadelphia. I was working in Philadelphia when they won the World Series in 2008. And I remember that we were. I was out and everyone's on the street, you know, basically celebrating. And, you know, I remember sitting at a bar that night and all these Philly fans that I'm friendly with, they're. They're ecstatic. And they're like, yeah. And they didn't want a World Series at that point since 1980. So it was 28 years. And they're like, ah, I'm good for life now. I don't even care what they do the next 10 years. I'm like, listen, in two or three years when this team is struggling and you're gonna. You're gonna start complaining about them not winning a champ. They won the next very next year. They were in the World Series against the Yankees, and they complained because they should have won again the very next.

[Don Hahn]

Year, and they just won the year before. No, it's okay to complain. But he brought up the Giants. Now, I'm a Giant fan, so I'm not. I'm not making this up. I'm not trying to look into somebody else's brain. This is me. All right. The Giants have been an embarrassment last decade. An absolute embarrassment. Dysfunctional. It's really been hard to be a fan of them, the way that they play, the decisions that they.

[Jordan Ronan]

But are you giving up the Super Bowl?

[Don Hahn]

But their last super bowl is still on my dvr. And you're telling me if I go home tonight and erase that off my DVR and it disappears forever? It didn't happen. But in the meantime, my organization's not an embarrassment. They've been good since then, but never won. No, no, no. As much as I hate it and am embarrassed by them, thank God that I have 2011. Like, thank God I have 2007. Those things are important now. We don't have a button to push on this. It's all fantasy. But as embarrassing as they've been, and you're not throwing championships away. You're just not.

[Jordan Ronan]

I wouldn't. I have some questions about this, by the way. You have that on your DVR?

[Don Hahn]

Yeah.

[Jordan Ronan]

Same cable company. The cable box.

[Don Hahn]

DirecTV. We've had DirecTV.

[Jordan Ronan]

It just sits there.

[Don Hahn]

It just sits there. Well.

[Jordan Ronan]

Well, I mean, you're talking about 14 years ago.

[Don Hahn]

I'm gonna tell you what happened. We've got. And we really need new DirecTV units because they're. They're a mess right now because they're too old. But we eventually got the Genesis, which. Which had more memory, okay? And that did erase everything that was recorded in the living room. But I recorded the giant super bowl in my basement. And that one still. It's still there in that one. And because I hardly ever use that one, then it's still good. So I still have it. But it doesn't matter. I mean, there's plenty of copies. I can go to YouTube and watch the whole thing.

[Jordan Ronan]

My point, at some point, it's gonna disappear.

[Don Hahn]

But my point is, is that as long ago as it was, there was limitations. There was still technology. There was still a chance to DVR it.

[Jordan Ronan]

No, I understand.

[Don Hahn]

You know, the 86 one is on VHS that I recorded in real time. I'm afraid to play it. I think, first of all, I can't find a VCR to play it, but if I did, I might disintegrate. Like, it's from 86.

[Jordan Ronan]

Yeah, I've done. I've done 94 Rangers on VHS.

[Don Hahn]

Even that's 30 plus years old.

[Jordan Ronan]

I mean, it's been a while. It's been a while for the Rangers.

[Don Hahn]

And it's. This technology is even stupidly old. But you can take all of your VHS cassettes and. And convert them to dvd.

[Jordan Ronan]

Yeah, yeah.

[Don Hahn]

Which I haven't. I. I have a collection of. I have every giant playoff win from like, 1981 until probably the early 2000s. Either I recorded them myself or I went out and bought them. Like, there was a guy. Black market sounds strong.

[Jordan Ronan]

You're saying all on vhs.

[Don Hahn]

All on vhs. So you. What are you gonna do with them?

[Jordan Ronan]

You still have him? Well, you gonna hand them down to your son?

[Don Hahn]

Here's a great story.

[Jordan Ronan]

What's he gonna do with it?

[Don Hahn]

Here's a great story. I was talking about this with Dan Glasser. I would say about 20 years ago, maybe 18. No. Yeah. It was probably like maybe 0607 somewhere around there. So. Yeah, like 18 years ago. What I would do. We had a VHS at. When we were at Tupen Plaza here at ESPN Radio. Mm. And there was a V. There was a VHS. And it was connected to the TVs in the studio. So I could throw it in and One of the TVs in the studio would play the VCR. So I had on VHS the Giants, when they beat the Cowboys. Not in 81. I have that. I brought in the 1980 win, which was like the first time they beat them since, like, 72.

[Pat O'Keefe]

Right.

[Jordan Ronan]

It was a big deal.

[Don Hahn]

That was. It was a big deal. Got.

[Jordan Ronan]

Finally got over the hump. Finally back to respectability kind of deal.

[Don Hahn]

I put it in Michael's. Wherever on the road. I had it on in the studio while we're doing the show. It's there. We had Tony La Russa in Studio. Tony LaRussa did the interview with Michael the entire time staring at the television set watching a 1980 Cowboys, Giants game. So they go to break and he's like, what is this? And I told him. He was like. He was captivated by a then game from like 25 years ago. So, yeah, I throw them in every once in a while. And people.

[Jordan Ronan]

What was the quality? Like?

[Don Hahn]

Good? Not bad.

[Jordan Ronan]

It wasn't bad.

[Don Hahn]

Not bad really. And the old commercials too. You get to see them. Anything better than Madden and Summer all like, seriously?

[Jordan Ronan]

Yeah. I was actually for the book I just wrote, going back and listening to Madden and Summer All. And it was the Summer All. It was a Madden talking about the Gatorade dump.

[Don Hahn]

Do you remember that?

[Jordan Ronan]

It was like a. It's like a famous scene of John Madden talking about the Gatorade dump. And then they did two of them on parcels and he's like breaking it all down.

[Don Hahn]

Oh, yeah, that was.

[Jordan Ronan]

And he's breaking down the color of the Gatorade. I think it was the 86 Super bowl or the NFC Championship game, maybe.

[Don Hahn]

What was the one where Harry dressed up like the security guard? That might have been the Super Bowl.

[Jordan Ronan]

That was the Super Bowl.

[Don Hahn]

Now they dumped Gatorade. Gatorade on him. Or actually in a month, too.

[Jordan Ronan]

He. He also did that at the. At the Giants game because he was wearing the. The. The security at the Giants. It was probably the yellow.

[Don Hahn]

Right. That was the game against the Redskins. Right.

[Jordan Ronan]

The NFC Championship. And he did it again in the Super Bowl.

[Don Hahn]

So you write in a book about what?

[Jordan Ronan]

History of the Giants.

[Don Hahn]

Really?

[Jordan Ronan]

Yeah.

[Don Hahn]

Interesting.

[Jordan Ronan]

Yeah.

[Don Hahn]

If you need anything, you don't even have to credit me. I got. I got a pristine memory when it comes to the history of the Giants. You can ask me anything.

[Jordan Ronan]

It's already in the printer.

[Don Hahn]

Oh, is it really Michael.

[Jordan Ronan]

Michael Socket?

[Don Hahn]

You talked to Michael K. Specifically about Michael K instead of me?

[Jordan Ronan]

He was the one that asked the Eli question. Eli.

[Don Hahn]

Eli Elite question.

[Jordan Ronan]

He asked that question. That's what he's in there about, the Eli Elite question.

[Don Hahn]

Take the date on. Honestly, I'm going to take the date. Yeah, you're that man.

[Jordan Ronan]

I listen back to it.

[Don Hahn]

No. Yeah, I guess it is a part of Eli's history.

[Jordan Ronan]

I mean, the chapter is about Eli being elite, and he asked the question. So it was like, why did you ask that question?

[Don Hahn]

Is Eli Manning an elite quarterback? Are you a top five, top 10 quarterback?

[Jordan Ronan]

Yeah. You didn't ask the question, though. No, but what do you want from me?

[Don Hahn]

Yeah, it's more on me.

[Jordan Ronan]

What do you want from me, though?

[Don Hahn]

I don't know.

[Jordan Ronan]

The part where Michael. The show was needed was based off the Eli Elite question.

[Don Hahn]

Michael K. Is going to be the history of the Giants book. That's what bothers me. And again, I can't get mad at Jordan, but he's part of it because he asked.

[Jordan Ronan]

Asked that question that then sparked the whole Eli Elite conversation.

[Don Hahn]

Is Rothenberg in the book, too?

[Jordan Ronan]

No, he's the only. The only one who's like all. He might be the only. Is he the only broadcaster that I even talked to?

[Don Hahn]

Really? No. Bob Papa Carl Banks. All right, well, Banks played.

[Jordan Ronan]

Yeah, I talked to Bob about some, just to, you know, pick his brain on some things, like, you know, a pain.

[Don Hahn]

Well, that's what I'm saying. You can. Here's what I'm hoping for. Well, now it's in the printer, so I guess it's. I should have picked Is that maybe you could pick my brain, that I can at least be in the acknowledgments.

[Jordan Ronan]

It's a little too late for that.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah. It's a shame.

[Jordan Ronan]

Dave Rothenberger was actually giving me guff for not being in their acknowledgments.

[Don Hahn]

He said I should be.

[Jordan Ronan]

He said no, that's what I said.

[Don Hahn]

Well, just because he's a list super.

[Jordan Ronan]

Fan, he thinks that he should be like, should be like, thank you to my wife, my kids. And then him.

[Don Hahn]

Really? Well, he's the guy that thinks that when he passes, John Mara is going to go to his wake or at least send flowers. He might get, I don't know, he might not get flowers either. But John Barrow is going to like, swing by the. Because, well, they, they, they still, for Jewish people, they still have like, you go to the funeral home, you still have the wake. Right. I know you sit in Shiva, but do you, Is it the same? Yeah, you go to awake and the body's on display. That whole morbid tradition that I don't understand.

[Jordan Ronan]

No, the body that you don't open the.

[Don Hahn]

Because you're human beings.

[Jordan Ronan]

You don't open the cans because you're a human being. Jewish people don't open the can.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah, because that's smart. I don't know what we're doing as Christians. Like, what are we doing? If I was to tell you, like a thousand, you know, let's just display the body. We'll just open it up. What are we doing? My father had the right idea and we didn't do it. We didn't honor his wish of just taking him out with the trash. That's probably illegal. But there's got to be just a better way to just have people just sit and gawk at your dead body. Come on, it's gotta be a better way to do it. No, I agree. The family through that.

[Jordan Ronan]

It's not, it's not my thing. I, I, I've only seen probably a few bodies in my life few times.

[Don Hahn]

No, that's, I mean, that's the way God intended.

[Jordan Ronan]

Yeah, right.

[Don Hahn]

To not have you see, to see as few bodies as possible.

[Jordan Ronan]

If I'm gone, you don't have to see my body.

[Don Hahn]

I'm, I'm good with, I mean, I'd like to celebrate your life and you.

[Jordan Ronan]

Can just shift me, ship me away.

[Don Hahn]

My, my mother's side of the family. I'm Russian Orthodox, which is basically Catholic Chase. But the difference is, is that we would have three day wakes. Like, what are you Doing three days. When nobody's coming from Russia or from Hungary. You know, everybody's local. What three days. You got to put the family through that. It's like, come on man. It's ridiculous.

[Jordan Ronan]

The one last, you know, twist and twist the knife in there. You guys give me a hard time. Three dates.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah, I know we have celebrate me for three days closure for people. But. Yeah, and let's make sure that they sit right up. Get them as close to the body as possible. They haven't suffered enough. Let's get them close. What are we talking about?

[Jordan Ronan]

It always freaks me out when I have to see the body too.

[Don Hahn]

Like traditions from hundreds of years ago when we were like stupid. We were eating rocks and we eat. And that's one of the things that we keep.

[Jordan Ronan]

To keep yourself warm.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah, but it's funny the things that we keep. If you came up with that idea now that'd be like. That's what. Well, because you did it 100 years ago again when nobody tried. I give just frustrates me. I know this is off topic. I mean my wife tells me this would be a good. This would have been a nice Tuesday talking.

[Jordan Ronan]

There you go. Tuesday. Yeah. I'm all messed up. My days. Training camp happens.

[Don Hahn]

No, you're. You're brain.

[Jordan Ronan]

You don't know where you are, what time it is, what day it is.

[Don Hahn]

Speaking of which, what time is it? Brian Dable went after my boy and we got to talk about that. 1-800-9193776. We're taking you up until 7 o'. Clock. But before all of that, Peter Rosenberg is going to join us because we lost a legend today in Hulk Hogan. And who better to have on than Peter Rosenberg? That and the fact that my brother wasn't until 6:30.

[Jordan Ronan]

What you see? Go see Hulk's body.

[Don Hahn]

No, no. I'm sure his family will. I guess that he's probably not going to be in a suit and tie. Right. They're probably going to have the Hulkamania T shirt on him. Right. I mean that would just that that's the only way it would work.

[Jordan Ronan]

That's actually a good question.

[Don Hahn]

We'll ask that Peter, when we coming up next here on Don Hunter Rosenberg on ESPN New York.

[BetterHelp Ad]

This is an ad by BetterHelp. Workplace stress is now one of the top causes of declining mental health. With 61% of the global workforce experiencing higher than normal levels of stress. To battle stress, most of us can't wave goodbye to work. But we can start small with a focus on wellness. With over 30,000 therapists, BetterHelp is the world's largest online therapy platform, having served over 5 million people globally. And it works with an App store rating of 4.9 out of 5 based on over 1.7 million client reviews. It's convenient, too. You can join a session with a therapist at the click of a button, helping you fit therapy into your busy life. Plus switch therapists at any time. As largest online therapy provider in the world, BetterHelp can provide access to mental health professionals with a diverse variety of expertise. Unwind from work with BetterHelp, our listeners get 10% off their first month at betterhelp.com timeout. That's betterhelp.com timeout.

[LifeLock Ad]

This episode is brought to you by LifeLock. Between two factor authentication, strong passwords, and a VPN, you try to be in control of how your info is protected. But many other places also have it and they might not be as careful. That's why LifeLock monitors hundreds of millions of data points a second for threats. If your identity is stolen, they'll fix it, guaranteed, or your money back. Save up to 40% your first year. Visit lifelock.com podcast for 40% off. Terms apply.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.

[Don Hahn]

I didn't listen to anything you just said.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Catch the show on demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get.

[Don Hahn]

Your podcasts on your own show.

[Jordan Ronan]

Peter.

[Pat O'Keefe]

This is my, my second time in the last few weeks. Last time was under more positive news. Don getting the big, the big job. But I'm, I'm happy to be on with you guys today in spite of it being for a sad story.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah, it's crazy. It's been a crazy week just, you know, losing Ozzy and we, we did some stuff on that earlier and even though you're not a metal guy, I'm sure you appreciate Ozzy, who's also, I believe in the WWE hall of Fame as well. So there, there is a little bit of crossover there. And we also lost Chuck Mangione today and John Arch Gene Mark Archer tweeted that said he was a kid. WWF midnight show on Saturdays on War used the Chuck Mangione song as the theme song. I don't know if you remember that we lost him today.

[Pat O'Keefe]

Wow, I didn't know that.

[Jordan Ronan]

Peter, scale of 1 to 10, how bad is it? I didn't know who Chuck Mangione is.

[Pat O'Keefe]

No, it's not that bad. If you're not like a hardcore music guy, I think. Well, I'm unaware But the thing is, I mean, in some ways neither of us are the best one to ask because Don's going to have a bias his way. I'm going to have it mine. To me it's like a music guy will know who Chuck Mangione is, but I think the average person does not. I know Don will disagree, but I.

[Don Hahn]

Was just getting on him. But just quickly, before we get to the topic at hand, you've gone to three concerts in your life.

[Jordan Ronan]

Three concerts.

[Don Hahn]

Tell Peter the three concerts.

[Jordan Ronan]

Peter might have actually been at one of them. Okay, so the first one was a Grateful Dead concert. The second one, no, the second one was Wu Tang Clan at University of Maryland. I. They got arrested. One of them got arrested afterwards for smoking.

[Pat O'Keefe]

I was there.

[Jordan Ronan]

Yeah, see? Yes, Peter was there. I think.

[Don Hahn]

I didn't.

[Jordan Ronan]

Did it dirty mind of you yet didn't one of them jump off like the rafters? Maybe Old Dirty.

[Don Hahn]

Something. Something like that.

[Pat O'Keefe]

I think. I think Old Dirty was also the guy who got arrested. I'm pretty confident.

[Jordan Ronan]

So he was there. And then I went to Zach Brian the other day.

[Don Hahn]

How, how eclectic is that list? First of all, it's disturbing. It's only been three for a 47 year old man, but those three.

[Pat O'Keefe]

But it could be, it could be. It could be worse. He could be. He could be John Winthrop who's been to one concert and it's like Celine Dion.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah. So wow. Not exactly a standard, but you are better than that. But, but just tell us your reaction because this kind of came out of nowhere. I know there was some conversation, I guess about questions about his health, but I don't think anybody had this on the table. What was your reaction when you saw that it happened?

[Pat O'Keefe]

Well, yeah, no, there was stuff about his health last week and that was sort of put to bed as, you know, folly. And I kind of stopped thinking about at that point when I read the statement from his wife. She said, oh, well, he had surgery, but he's fine now. Everything's just sort of regular dealing with post surgery, which by the way may have in fact been true, but I'm floored by it. You know, I think you don't always know how you're going to feel when these situations present themselves. And since you and I are like such radio nerds, you'll appreciate this. I'm traveling tomorrow for the weekend. And so I was doing my show today that will air tomorrow or was going to air on Pro Wrestling Nation 24. 7 and I was going to pre do it because I said you know, wrestling is really essentially on tv Monday, Tuesday and Wednesday. Thursday is not a crazy night for wrestling. So I can record on Thursday and all will be good. And I have 10 minutes left in my two hour show and I see a text from a friend and the beginning of it's cut off. And all I read is, I know he was problematic, but man, such a big part of my childhood, no part of me was thinking when I opened the text it was going to be Hulk Hogan and I would immediately be taking the two hours I just recorded and throwing it the trash can. But that is exactly what happened. Because Don, I'm sure, as you can imagine, I mean, I know this may sound crazy, but it would be like recording a two hour hockey show and then Wayne Gretzky, God forbid, died that night.

[Jordan Ronan]

Right?

[Pat O'Keefe]

And you know, tomorrow there's only one topic obviously, and that will be the career and complex legacy of Hulk Hogan.

[Don Hahn]

I was just talking to these guys. You know, I'm limited with my wrestling, but we've talked about it many times before that battle with Iron Chic, whatever year that was in the very early 80s in our household with my dad and my brother, you know, my brother with the wrestling. But even for me and my dad, we treated that like any other sporting event. That, that was a big deal and they were masters of, you know, we were involved with Iran at the time, so it kind of just made sense and he pushed all the buttons. And I've told you the story about, you know, seeing him come in, bailing out Bob Backlin one time, like he's been a part of my life as somebody that's not a wrestling fan for, for 40 plus years. So this transcends just the wrestling fan.

[Pat O'Keefe]

Well, that, that's, that's one of the things that I've just been so sort of taken by and thinking about throughout the day is just like, you know, the level of icon status. It's, you know, I am someone you, you often say I'm a big event guy. And I, I am. And I have a big appreciation for stars, right? Like the biggest stars. Like, like, you know how I feel about Michael Jackson. The people who are just bigger than life, where you, even if you weren't around for this, then you don't really know what big is. And I think in a lot of ways Hogan is that, you know, like we can talk about how big this, we can talk about how big Roman Reigns is today, you know, or you could talk about how big John Cena is today. But the bottom line is My parents couldn't pick either of those people out of a lineup. You see that bald in the front, stringy blonde hair on the back with the mustache, the, you know, 18 to 80, wherever you are in the world, you know, that's the silhouette of Hulk Hogan. So, yeah, he was just absolutely larger than life. And I think that it's really safe to say that the wrestling business that exists, that I. That me and your brother get to make a living in, I just don't think it would exist. You talk about a Thursday rewrite. I just don't know that that business exists the way it does without Hulk Hogan.

[Jordan Ronan]

So, Peter, you're actually. You're in that business, right? You're in that world, in that wrestling world. I'm wondering what do they think of Hulk Hogan in that. Within that world, right?

[Don Hahn]

Because he.

[Jordan Ronan]

Obviously you just said he. He made that business into kind of what it is. But what. What do they think and what do you think the reaction is to that, him within those walls?

[Pat O'Keefe]

I think it's very complicated. I think. I think people have really mixed feelings. I think there are a lot of people who are just heartbroken. You know, everyone. Everyone sort of has a different way that they deal with the separation of character and performer, you know, whether that's in sports or whether that's in. In pro wrestling. So I think for a lot of people, the things that he was caught saying on tape, I mean, listen, there are a lot of people listening right now who just don't know. And I'm not going to say it exactly specifically.

[Jordan Ronan]

He's a very complicated legacy. Let's just say that.

[Pat O'Keefe]

Yeah. And no, and to be blunt of all, like, the sort of tapes we've heard that have come out in the last 15 years and people get, quote unquote, canceled or whatever happens, I would say that what Hulk Hogan was caught saying on tape may be the worst I ever heard. I don't know if I ever heard worse. It was so unequivocally bad that there was like, kind of no way to be like, ah, don't worry about it. I mean, if you're someone who cares about racism. So it was really, really bad and hurt people really bad. And. And a lot of people were upset because they felt like, I want to forgive this guy. Can he just give a good apology, for God's sake? And I think a lot of people felt like they just never got that, you know. And for example, sadly, guys, his last television appearance was being booed out of the building on. On an up on the debut Netflix episode of Raw, he was booed out of the building in LA. And when he went on McAfee afterwards to talk about it, he made it. He acted as if it was because he endorsed Donald Trump. But as you guys can imagine, there are lots of former great wrestlers who endorse Donald Trump, and they don't get booed out of the building. Okay, that was intentionally simplifying something that was much more complicated. And I think those sorts of feelings from Terry Bolaya really complicated people's feelings about him. They just really. No one wants to. No one wants to have negative feelings towards their childhood hero. So I think that was really hard for a lot of people. And I think today on the day he's gone, there are a lot of people who go, man, I loved him when I was a kid, but I wish he hadn't hurt my feelings so bad. For me, it's a mixed. It's a mixed bag. I know that people are complicated. I try not to judge them by their best or worst. He's the most iconic professional wrestler who's ever lived, and he was also a complicated, problematic guy at times.

[Don Hahn]

Talking to Peter Rosenberg, on the day that we lost Hulk Hogan at the age of 71, just looking through social media, I noticed a quote from Jim Ross, who said, he's the greatest baby face of all time. Do you agree with that?

[Pat O'Keefe]

Absolutely.

[Jordan Ronan]

Yeah.

[Pat O'Keefe]

He is the greatest good guy there ever was. I mean, you see the reaction of kids when he walked through the curtain. Go back and watch an old thing on PEACOCK Go on YouTube. You won't believe that people reacted that way. I mean, now it's impossible, right? Because everyone's looking through their phone. No one reacts to anything. But to see how people reacted when that derringer, real American, hit the speakers, it's unlike anything ever. And you know, your brother was just saying this. I was listening to your brother on the air, who I'm going to be joining in the next hour. And he made a great point. You know, he said Hulk Hogan was able to have the greatest heel turn of all time because he was the biggest baby face of all time. So because he was this incredible good guy who was so loved by kids, when he turned on Macho man in wcw, it made it that much more impactful. And so when I judge. When I judge wrestlers, I judge them by a metric that I have made up in my head. It's. It's how. How. How good are they as a good guy? How good are they as a bad guy? Can they have matches with every type of wrestler. Big guy, small guy, every. How are they on the microphone, how are they in the ring? Hogan just rates extremely high on all of those things. I mean, his mic work is whatever. I don't think it's great. If you really go back, guys, and look at all those promos of him standing there next to mean Gene, you realize there was a lot more, you know, say your prayers and eat your vitamins, brother, than there was any like real substance and sort of character building in any way. But it. He didn't need more than that, you know, And a lot of people will kind of talk down on his in ring ability, but I think growing up as a wrestling fan is realizing that Hulk Hogan was actually better in the ring than he gets credit for.

[Jordan Ronan]

So what's next? Like, what's the next big event for wrestling and how would you like to see Hulk go, Hogan honored?

[Pat O'Keefe]

Well, there's a couple of things, Jordan. I mean, first of all, there's Smackdown tomorrow and there will be a huge tribute in some way, I'm told tomorrow. I don't know exactly what it will be, but there will be some sort of massive tribute on Smackdown tomorrow. And then a week from Saturday, the end of my endless paternity leave, as Don Windsher described, it will be will be night one of SummerSlam at, at MetLife Stadium. So SummerSlam is in New York at MetLife next Saturday and Sunday. I'm sure they'll do.

[Jordan Ronan]

Those tickets are going to be huge.

[Pat O'Keefe]

Oh, they already were and now it's gonna be off the charts and it's a whole weekend here in New York. We have, we'll have next Friday in a Prudential center, the weekend at MetLife Stadium and the Monday at Barclay Center. WWE all weekend. So it's going to be a really interesting time to see just like how much do they give it? You know what I mean? Like, how do you, how do you in 2025 honor someone who is frankly the Babe Ruth of your sport, but then also has this sort of complicated legacy as well? It's going to be very interesting to see, but I, I think overwhelmingly given what he did for WWE and what they are as a company because of him, I think it will largely be just an outpouring of love and appreciation.

[Don Hahn]

Peter, we miss you terribly and we can't wait for you to get back. Unfortunately, when you come back, I'll be on vacation, so it'll be a while before I've seen you. But we do miss you and I want you to really enjoy all the time you have with the family. You're not going to be able to get it back to be able to spend that much time with the family the way you have now. So certainly take advantage of it. And we'll see you when I feel.

[Jordan Ronan]

Like that was a little bit of a dig.

[Don Hahn]

No, no, it always is. But I appreciate it.

[Pat O'Keefe]

But I appreciate it.

[Jordan Ronan]

No, it came off that way a little bit. Like, you know, you're, you're away that long.

[Don Hahn]

No, I. Jordan is a. Listen, underrated bad guy. Jordan Ronald. I mean, when you start where you're like, it's nice when he comes on for the 20 minute spot here and there, whatever, you know, to do four hours of radio now a couple of times a week.

[Jordan Ronan]

Bad guy. You didn't hear me argue?

[Don Hahn]

Not arguing, but what I'm saying because we had a text back and forth during his time away. And as somebody that has kids, not as young as Maya, but I did at one time. You don't usually get like a whole month to be able to be with them. So I was emphatic because that's it. This is not gonna happen again. As gracious as Disney is with the paternity leave, they don't give me another one unless he has another.

[Pat O'Keefe]

No, I have. Well, yeah, exactly. Now listen, don't get me wrong, I do have a few more weeks. Don't save those for the winner. But no, I don't take, I don't take it for granted. I thought about. Was actually harder than you would think for me to make the decision because I, I've never missed work like this in my life. So to be gone this long has been weird. But yeah, it has been. It has been amazing. And I, But I will tell you, Jordan, when I was just listening to you guys in the car and I flipped it on for a moment because I'll, you know, I was listening to Dave legreca talk about wrestling. I said, let me just see what Don and Jordan are talking about. And I flipped it on and the first sentence out of Don's mouth is like, well, you know, the frustrating part is the Yankees think that, that this is a way to play baseball. I went, okay. I've missed absolutely nothing.

[Don Hahn]

No, you're good. That's exactly what you said was I'm good.

[Jordan Ronan]

We've come full circle.

[Don Hahn]

Totally good. And I'm going to. How about this little gift for you? I know you're going to go on my brother, but you can multitask. NFL Network right now is showing Lions Commanders from the playoffs last year, all.

[Pat O'Keefe]

Like you dream of.

[Don Hahn]

You're welcome. All right, we'll see you soon, man. That's Peter Rosenberg on the on the passing of Hulk Hogan. He's going to be back with us coming up on August 4th, but he's enjoying a well deserved vacation. Eric Church is coming to Barclay center on Saturday, September 20th. ESPN New York has your chance to score tickets on the ESPN New York app and ESPN New York.com just find the contest tile and submit your entry. Tickets are on sale now. Head to ericchurch.com for more information. All right, D1 after my guy. We'll talk about that more. Your calls at 1-800-919-3776. Don Han and Rosenberg with Jordan Ron on right here on espn.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Thanks for listening to the Don Han and Rosenberg podcast.

[Don Hahn]

I didn't listen to anything you just said.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Catch this show on demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcasts.

[Don Hahn]

But this is a back and forth the Brian Dable, head coach of the New York Giants had with our very own Jordan ran on just today.

[Jordan Ronan]

What is your plan with, you know, putting guys in pads? Putting guys. When are you going to have padded pads?

[Don Hahn]

As soon as we can.

[Jordan Ronan]

Yeah, as soon as we can. Soon. So now you got to ease into it. And as soon as we can, we'll be in pads. So you say. I assume you mean Sunday.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah, first day we can be in pads.

[Jordan Ronan]

We'll be in pads. And also got off to slow start the last couple years. Do you change up your approach to training camp in regards to putting guys in pens, the amount you're having them work? Like how you, I know you always say we make changes every year.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah. I think that you asked that question.

[Jordan Ronan]

Yesterday so not much different than I answered you. We make changes every year and we'll.

[Don Hahn]

Do what we think is best for the team. Did you ask it? Yes.

[Jordan Ronan]

He wasn't looking at me. He was looking at somebody else at the, at the saying you. He's looking at the guy over the other side and said us looking at that guy. And then he gave him an answer but he, the thing is he didn't give an answer. He still didn't give an answer there. Right. Like yeah, I'll make changes but like you're supposed to like give us some examples of how you making changes. Not saying yeah, you know we look at it every year. Like he doesn't give me none of them. He gives you nothing. But you know what that was? I don't know did you see the Patriots thing recently?

[Don Hahn]

No.

[Jordan Ronan]

Mike Vrabel.

[Don Hahn]

Oh, Mike Vrabel. Yeah, I heard about him.

[Jordan Ronan]

What, have you been in a coma, like for the last five minutes? That was, that was like a, like slightly, you know, lesser version of that. Like, hey, I answered this question yesterday.

[Don Hahn]

Oh, but Jordan, Jake, we have it right, let's hear it.

[Pat O'Keefe]

I mean, whether you were in a coma when I answered Tom's question or.

[Don Hahn]

Typing on your phone or tweeting, I don't know.

[Pat O'Keefe]

But I spent five minutes answering that.

[Don Hahn]

Question and I can go back through.

[Pat O'Keefe]

It, but I'd rather not.

[Don Hahn]

Again. I'm not in the room. Was he trying to be funny?

[Jordan Ronan]

Vrabel or Vrabel? I think he was trying to bury him. He was just ticked off. Now look, I'll be honest. You've been in enough press conferences. I'm not going to hold the reporter, you know, say, that's a terrible thing to re. Ask a question. I've done it before, many times. I've done it before.

[Don Hahn]

I don't know the circumstance.

[Jordan Ronan]

Yeah, it happens. You're busy, you're doing other things.

[Don Hahn]

Right.

[Jordan Ronan]

You're not fully listening. You're tuned out.

[Don Hahn]

It happens.

[Jordan Ronan]

It happens.

[Don Hahn]

And. But it also happens sometimes. Again, I don't know what the atmosphere was. It's just a scrum. Is this, is he standing at a podium for a specific timed press conference? But some people walk in a couple of questions in. Like you like to say, you might have answered this already because I want to ask it again. I just got here. Usually that's for like post game when you're in scrums and you get there late.

[Jordan Ronan]

Yeah, you throw in, hey, I'm not sure if you answered this yet, but.

[Don Hahn]

I've done it on this show where my co host will ask a question. Then in five minutes into the interval, I asked the same one because maybe you didn't hear it or I was checking something out or whatever. He didn't have to be that negative to the guy.

[Jordan Ronan]

Right. But in.

[Don Hahn]

I don't think Dable was that bad.

[Jordan Ronan]

In Dable's case, it's more like, no, you. He thinks he addressed the question just by giving a non answer. But that's not actually addressing the question. Just because, just because somebody asked it. You said, yeah, we make changes every year. That doesn't just say, oh, I can't, I can't. Then not come back and ask, I can't, I'm not, I'm allowed to come back and ask you, what changes are you making? Are like, what are you doing to, you know, not have that slow start again? Like, you can't just be like, oh, no, I answered that. No, you didn't answer.

[Don Hahn]

He. He hasn't been around that long, but I've gotten to know Dable's. You could tell he just doesn't like having to do. He doesn't like dealing with the media.

[Jordan Ronan]

Yeah, definitely.

[Don Hahn]

But what I would say to him is, you know, get over it. I mean, you don't have to do it nearly as much as the other sports. It's in a controlled environment most of the time, you know, because you get coaches and managers sometimes, like, you're surrounded by Aaron Boone in his. Like, in the Office at the SkyDome in Rogers center, you know, like, it's. It's. It's. It's a tough spot. Like hockey and basketball. Coach, you're like, in hockey, I can't speak to basketball as much, but, like, these guys walk into a hallway, they gather around them. Especially on the road at the Garden, Mike Sullivan will. Will come to a podium, and it'll be a little bit more organized, but, like, on the road, he'll come out of the dressing room, everybody's just gonna gather around him, and the camera's there, and they ask a bunch of questions. You know, it's kind of unorganized at times. Football, you're always at a podium. It's always controlled. The PR director standing right next to you. You know, you're not getting really hardcore questions. You know, Come on, just lighten up a little bit, man. I know it's. I know you're all football. I wonder Jordan sometimes, is it he doesn't like to do it, or has Bill Belichick and Greg Popovich set the standard of how to deal with the media and just be. Just be an absolute jerk? And that'll kind of minimize the questions. You won't have to do it as long, and it kind of sets a standard that shortens it up a little bit and kind of sends the atmosphere, like, I don't play. I'm just about football. I'm just about basketball. I'm just about hockey. I don't want to mess around with you. Yo, yos, I got to get back to work. I think that works for Belichick and Parcells, and, you know, I won.

[Jordan Ronan]

They won championships.

[Don Hahn]

But I feel like. And we're seeing a little bit. We're seeing it with Dable. You know, we saw it with Mangini. We saw with Joe Judge. You know, we're seeing it now with Aaron Glenn, they come in wanting to do that to kind of like, set the tone. Like, it's gonna matter. You're gonna be judged on wins and losses, dude. Not how you handle press conferences and not how you rip into, like, you want to set. Change the culture. Changing the culture is not, you know, talking down to people and being curt and trying to play the role of tough guy. Yeah, that might impress some people early on, but if you go out there and start the year 06, it's gonna mean nothing. And I saw with Eric Mangini. Eric Mangini wanted to be Bill Belichick in the worst way. He came in and he changed a bunch of things the way Bill would. He didn't give you anything. The great line that I always would use that I heard one day, is that he wouldn't tell you the price of a hot dog if you're standing next to the sign. Right. And as if that's going to make you Bill Parcells or Bill Belichick. No, it's going to make you. Nobody winning is going to make you those guys. And then when he won his first year with. With the Jets, Mangini to go to the playoffs, everybody loved it. And then when they started losing, it was like, this guy's a jerk. Because they're not a jerking.

[Jordan Ronan]

They was not a jerk. He's a nice enough guy. Just his goal is to not give you any. Like, why can't you just say when you. How, like you're gonna. When you're gonna put your team in pads or how many? Or like, if you plan to go more padded practices this summer than last year, like, where's the downside?

[Don Hahn]

He doesn't want to ride.

[Jordan Ronan]

It's just like, I'm not gonna tell you anything. That's the goal.

[Don Hahn]

Dable just feels like a guy doesn't want to do it. But I'm talking about the. I'm just talking about, like, setting the tone of acting like tough guy. It all doesn't matter. Just win. You, you, you. You set the tone of winning. All right? Bill Parcells was not Bill Parcells when he was 312 and 1. Then you went 9 and 7. Then you go 9 and 7 again, go to the playoffs the second executive year, then you win a Super Bowl. Then he became Bill Parcells. And then as he started winning, he was never really mean to the media, but he definitely knew how to play the media and play the game. And, yeah, sometimes he would, you know, rip Peter King every once in a while or whatever. But when you got rings jingling and jangling, you can do that for the book.

[Jordan Ronan]

They told me that Bill Parcells used to come down to the media room on like Thursday. You had to stay late or Thursday or I think it was Thursday or Friday and just talk off the record and basically tell you everything that was going on.

[Don Hahn]

Right? He was a little. He was a different creature, but he was based on his winning. So.

[Jordan Ronan]

But that's how you bring guys in then, right? You do that, then you keep everybody happy.

[Don Hahn]

And then it was a different era and all that stuff.

[Jordan Ronan]

That's how you get. That's how you get the phony guffaws.

[Don Hahn]

All right. All I would ask any of these guys, you know, the Mike Vrabels of the world, the Aaron Glenn's of the world, listen, Vrabel's going to try to act like Belichick because that's where he learned how to become a coach. And Glenn's going to, you know, learn from Parcells and we get it. But how you do on the field is ultimately how you're going to be judged. Nobody looked at Bill Parcells and his handling of the media or anything as part of his greatness. His greatness was that he was one of the greatest coaches in history, no matter what.

[Jordan Ronan]

Rebuild. You know what's going to help Brian Dabo rebuild? Abdul Carter.

[Don Hahn]

We got to talk about that because you were at camp today. Some good news, hopefully out of Giants camp. We got Yankees, we got Mets. We got so much to discuss. It's Don Hanna, Rosenberg. Take you up until 7 o' clock and then it's Pat O' Keefe here on ESPN New York.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.

[Don Hahn]

I don't want to know how the sausage is made, but I just want to know. It's good.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Hear more of Don Allen and Peter weekday afternoon starting at 3 on 8 80, ESPN, the ESPN New York app and your smart speakers.