Don Hahn (2:23)

No, but it is. No, I get and listen, I'm not enjoying the Mets, but. But listen, it's intriguing, right? No, what's happening to them is intriguing because we open the show. Because I'll pivot to this. We'll talk about the MVP in a second. But like I use the analogy of Shawshank Redemption, there's hope. But am I read or have I Andy Du Frame, Do I believe or not believe? I'm more read because I don't believe in this team. If they make the playoffs, it's only because the Reds and the Diamondbacks aren't good enough. They can't pitch. Their bullpen is down to one guy then. Now they're kicking the ball all over the place. But I'm a Met fan, so I want to believe Jeff. But there's nothing to believe here, is there?

Jeff Passan (3:02)

Yeah, I think there's still reason to believe. I think the reason to believe is if you happen to get into a playoff spot. I believe in Nolan McClain. I don't know about you, but can.

Alan Hahn (3:12)

He pitch every day? Show me some kid.

Jeff Passan (3:18)

Okay. So fair. But when you get a one nothing lead in a wild card game, it puts a lot of pressure on the other team to go out and win two consecutive and to string together two days of fundamentally sound baseball. And you know you're going to be facing somebody who's a big leaguer and who's got good stuff, and even a bad big leaguer on any given day can go out and look like the best player in the world. So I think the hope for the Mets is not anything that the Mets have done to inspire it. It's in the inherent nature of baseball and just how little we know about what it's going to look like. And that a team that looks like it has been dead for four months, which personifies the New York Mets right now, can suddenly come alive at any given time. And that's the frustration of the Mets. I think we've been waiting and waiting and waiting and waiting, and they just have not shown any signs of life.

Peter Rosenberg (4:14)

And they must be thrilled that at least they're not the only team circling the drain right now. Right. What's happening in Detroit is just epic. And then even what Toronto more recently, what's going on with them and the frustration you mentioned that this is, we are getting into the best time of year when it comes to baseball and seeing the best teams all playing each other. And in New York, it's almost like we desperately need baseball because we have two oh and three football team. So there's Nothing to distract us here. So I think the biggest conversation on the other side of town involves right now, Aaron Judge. And my question to you, Jeff and I have seen what you've said about what, which way you'd go when it comes to mvp. But if the Yankees find a way to complete this and actually come back to win the division, take it back. Does that end any other tiebreaker in your mind that you would have between him and Cal Raleigh? Like you could say team success, both teams won the divisions. Would there be any other argument to make at this point?

Jeff Passan (5:08)

When I voted, I don't vote for MVP anymore, Alan. And the reasons are multiple, but like, mainly it's because I don't think that I should have any sort of effect on the people I'm covering's financial well being. And with all of the awards that are tied to MVP voting, I just didn't want to be a part of that. That being said, I'm perfectly happy to participate in the discourse. And when I was voting, I never took team into mind. Now, maybe that was foolish of me. I understand that, you know, team, like winning matters, winning is all that matters. But I didn't want to penalize great players for being surrounded by bums. It's the Mike Trout corollary. Mike Trout was like the best player in baseball for upward of a decade. And I don't think he won nearly as many MVPs as he should have because. Because his team stunk around him. And that's like, I get why people tie the team in. I just never thought it was fair to penalize a guy for the 24 or 25 other guys in the clubhouse. And so in this case, yeah. Would it be a boon to Judge? Of course it would. I think a lot of voters differ from me in that respect. To me though, it just comes down to who puts up the best numbers. Like, I wish, I wish I were smart enough to understand the impact that Cal Raleigh has inside of that clubhouse and to understand and to be able to measure the impact that Aaron Judge has inside of his clubhouse. Almost see those as a wash, to be honest, because I think both of them are hugely important to their teams and to their teammates. And so in the absence of having an objective way to look at that, the way I've always approached it, is the only objective thing out there is the numbers. What do the numbers tell me? And the numbers right now tell me that Aaron Judge, despite cal Raleigh hitting 60 home runs, leaving the American League and runs batted, et cetera, et cetera, Aaron Judge has had a better season.

Don Hahn (7:22)

You know, what's interesting is I think that when we get caught up in the argument of this, Jeff, and you just articulated it very well, is that, is it the MVP or is it who's the best player? Because to me, Aaron Judge is the best player. And forever the foreseeable future will be the best player in Major League Baseball. But in this situation, isn't Cal the more valuable? Remember, if the Yankees settle for the wild card, that's a disappointing season. They were supposed to win the division. Nobody had Seattle on there. Big bingo card and they might end up with the 1 seed in the American League, a catcher hitting 60 home runs. Now, the reason there isn't two awards, Jeff, is because 90% of the time you'd give it to the same guy. But this might be one of those rare occasions where Judge is the better player with the better numbers, but Raleigh might be the more valuable player.

Jeff Passan (8:11)

So, Don, the way I've always looked at it is the two are interchangeable. One, what is, what is a sign of value other than production? Like, what's the difference between being the best and being the most valuable? Can you elucidate that for me? Because I've never heard a really compelling argument that that convinces me that somebody who produces the most is not the most valuable.

Don Hahn (8:37)

I will say it this way, all right. What the Yankees are doing is not or really out of the ordinary, right? And what Judge is doing, that's how great a player he is, isn't out of the ordinary. So even if the Yankees win the division, well, they're supposed to win the division. And Judge had numbers that he's supposed to have. But if Cal Raleigh doesn't have this season, Seattle is nowhere. I mean, they are nowhere because we didn't expect them to be anywhere because we didn't expect this kind of a season. So that's how I'd articulate it is, is that by him hitting 60 home runs has literally put them in the. On the map. Now, obviously, you take Judge off the Yankees, they're not going to be the same, but there's a lot of great players there. They might still be able to figure out a way to make the playoffs. It wouldn't be that shocking if the Yankees still made it without Judge. This whole season that Seattle has had, which you tell me is seems like a pretty surprising year that they're going to, that they win their first division since 2001, and it's, and it's happening when we're seeing a catcher do something that's never been done in the history of baseball. I think that's what kind of separates it for me.

Jeff Passan (9:44)

Okay, so I'll hit on a few of these points. I did like Seattle coming into the season. I had them going into the play. I had them go into the playoffs.

Don Hahn (9:51)

Okay.

Jeff Passan (9:52)

But I think, I think the most, the more important points, there are two of them to be made. Number one, I don't think that we should judge a player's value based on our expectations of him or her coming into any particular season. Because we are flawed arbiters. Right. Just because we believe something and something else happens, shouldn't that be the Dom Lagreca doesn't know crap award rather than the Most Valuable MVP like Most Valuable Player award? And Don, I know you know crap.

Alan Hahn (10:25)

So believe me, I know crap.

Jeff Passan (10:28)

Yeah. This is more, though. I've always. Just because a guy exceeds what our expectations were doesn't mean that makes him better than somebody else who is doing what we expected. And that's the thing. I think you're comparing Aaron Judge's numbers to the wrong person. You're comparing him to himself rather than comparing him to his compatriots across the league. Because what Aaron Judge is doing this year might be normal for him, but it is incredibly abnormal for everybody else who isn't Aaron Judge. And so I'm not looking at Aaron Judge through the context of what's he doing, like, based on what he has done in the past. I'm looking at like, what's Aaron Judge doing this year alongside his peers? And what he's doing is he's. As he's done in past years, you just being flat out better than all of them.

Alan Hahn (11:29)

Isn't. Isn't there a stat in baseball, unlike other sports, which basically it should be your mvp. MVP determinant, war, which is war.

Jeff Passan (11:39)

And yeah, I don't, I don't. I do not look at WAR that way. I look at WAR as a tool to help me organize things. But WAR includes things. Things like trying to measure defense and defensive metrics within the span of a single season are just wholly unreliable to me. Like, if I want to get a sense of how good a guy is defensively, I'll look at him over three years. But. But that's always been, to me, the greatest flaw of war. And it's gotten a little bit better as we've gotten better one year defensive metrics. But even with those in play right now, I'm never going to be the guy who's just votes a Straight war ticket. If that's the case, then Kyle schwaber is in 10th place in the National League this year. And I think Schwaber is is number two in the NL MVP ballot right now behind Shohei Otani. And frankly, the only reason Ohtani is ahead of him is because he's got 50 innings of sub 3 RA pitching.

Don Hahn (12:35)

But.

Alan Hahn (12:36)

But it is interesting though, because when you look at it, because you're right, that makes sense that the defensive one is a tough one to measure. But there's. There it is overall in the league. Aaron Judge, 1, Cal Raleigh, 5. I think they're the two tops in the AL. So it does work out in this case.

Peter Rosenberg (12:50)

But I hear what you're saying, Jeff, if we could go macro then with the Yankees, because as I mentioned, with what Toronto is going through this week, and you know, Seattle is a team you're looking at, Houston only looks like a. Like it's the logo. I would think the Yankees would be more Yankee fans would be more concerned about than it is the actual team. Yes, Cleveland has really turned it up, but is the American League. These guys have been telling me all year that the road to the World Series for the Yankees is a much easier road because the American League is not nearly as strong as the National League. Is that the case? Do you look at it that way?

Jeff Passan (13:25)

Yes, I think they're absolutely correct. I think the American League kind of stinks, to be honest, and the best teams, whether it is Philadelphia, Los Angeles, even Milwaukee, I think reside in the National League this year. Now, that that doesn't preclude an American League team from winning because for all we know, one of the American League teams, and I think Seattle, frankly, is probably at the top of the list because of the quality and depth of their starting pitching and their ability to go out and hit home runs. I think Seattle's the favorite right now. But I look at the Yankees and if the Yankees made it back to the World Series, guys, it would not surprise me one bit. We've seen how hot this team can get and how good it can look and the way that Max, Max Freed has been unbelievable for this team. Like, I don't, you know, Aaron Judge is the mvp, I think, of the American League in an odd way. I think Max Freed, my MVP of the New York Yankees, just because when Garrett Cole went down, you needed for Freed to stabilize that rotation, and that is precisely what he's done. Carlos Rodan's been really good. I don't know if they're going to go with Luis, heel Cam, Schlitler, whoever it is in that, in that three spot. If, if they are in a wild card series, I think the Yankees are in a good position right now to succeed.

Don Hahn (14:49)

Can we lose Jeff? I'll reset, hopefully.

Peter Rosenberg (14:55)

All right, we're talking.

Don Hahn (14:56)

All right, Talking to Jeff. Passing here on Don Hahn and Rosenberg back to the Mets for a second. If this goes sideways and they don't make it, or even if they do.

Jeff Passan (15:06)

If.

Don Hahn (15:09)

Everybody'S telling me optimistic, right? So I threw the if in. That's optimistic for me. And they lose in the first round or they make a run, is Stern's going to see the far through the trees and realize that there's still a lot more to be done here? And does he maybe at least cave a little on his philosophy about starting pitching and that maybe he needs at least to spend some money on one guy or at least kind of just open up to the possibility of paying more than he wants to for pitching?

Jeff Passan (15:41)

The best executives have philosophies that, that are malleable. And I think if you look at where the Mets are right now, what their resources are, what they have the ability to do, I think it pains David Stearns the idea that he needs to move beyond this thing. That worked in Milwaukee, but it was also a necessity in Milwaukee. When you are in charge of the New York Mets and you have by far the richest owner in baseball, and it's not not just that Steve Cohen is rich, it's that Steve Cohen's willing to spend money on this team. When you have a guy like that at your disposal and funding your team, you need to be willing to go outside of your comfort zone and do things that might not be optimal, might not be optimized, might not be what the model tells you, might not be the right thing, quote, unquote, to do, but it's the thing that gets you closer to winning championships and the Mets. This is going to sound weird for Mets fans, who over the last three and a half months have been in a perpetual state of pain. I think the Mets actually have a lot going for them right now. I was talking with the scout yesterday who was telling me that he has been looking at the Mets minor leaguers a lot this season and that what they've got coming is going to be really good. What they've got at AA right now, it's not just the arms that they've promoted this year. And listen, three arms, the quality of Nolan Mcclain, Jonah Tong and Brandon Sproat, you're gonna get at least One, maybe two, and hopefully three rotation pieces out of that going forward. But it's Jett Williams and it's Carson Benge and it's AJ Ewing, and it's the development that they've had, especially among their bats in the minor leagues this year. It's gonna put the Mets really, really high up, I think, in terms of farm system rankings going into next season. Listen, I understand farm systems do not win championships, guys. So there needs to be a balance there between what's coming and what you've got now. But I do think the Mets are on the right track.

Alan Hahn (17:52)

Yeah, that was going to say that is just. While what you're saying is true, it still is a fan. So depressing. Like if you were to. If you were to talk to me at the end of the commander's year and go, hey, I know Daniels didn't play much and McLaurin was out and they did nothing, but they got some great draft picks next year. When you head into a season expecting results, it's still depressing when the upside is farm system next year.

Peter Rosenberg (18:16)

But I'd say I disagree, right, Jeff? Like that actually gives you promise into next season.

Alan Hahn (18:21)

But that wasn't what to be. What this year was. This wasn't one of those.

Don Hahn (18:25)

I think.

Peter Rosenberg (18:26)

Jeff, Jeff, correct me if I'm wrong. In baseball, that's the greater currency, right? Prospects having a future where it's not too far down the line when you already have. Especially if Soto, who's still very much in the early prime and you've already seen these three pitches, isn't that a better currency than A, winning, not having that, and B, just. Well, and also rent?

Jeff Passan (18:47)

I mean, objectively, yes, but sports fandom is not an objective thing. It's an emotional thing. And all we care about is what's going on right now. So as good as the future looks, we've seen great futures in the past generation. K was supposed to bring the Mets another championship. Instead, it just brought more pain. So I don't blame Mets fans right now if they heard that say, I don't give a damn about what the future looks like because my present is depressing, has been so for months, and I just want it to end.

Alan Hahn (19:19)

One more thing for me, Jeff. What were your thoughts of Wrestle Palooza, ESPN's first foray into the WWE ple business?

Jeff Passan (19:32)

I enjoyed the spectacle. There were a couple of good matches. I wish that there were more than five matches on ples. Not gonna lie, man.

Alan Hahn (19:41)

Listen, I said the same thing, especially one that's called Palooza. I felt like what could have made it special was be like, hey, we normally do five. We're doing like 11 or 12 for this one.

Jeff Passan (19:53)

I. I am totally, totally in agreement with you on that. I, you know, I don't like watching Cena get squashed. Like, that's. That's not fun. And I understand gotta build up Brock Lesnar, the character, but I thought there were other ways that that could have been handled. But Stephanie Vacair is. Is a gangster. I'm going to enjoy watching a long title reign there.

Alan Hahn (20:17)

Yeah, she. She is awesome. I also feel you on the Cena thing. Like, I. I don't know who that's for. The, like, the rumor came out this week that, like, that was Cena's idea was to just get crushed by Brock. And I'm like, hey, cool. I. Maybe I don't love John Cena book in the end here. I don't know that if that's the case. I don't know that that's what. What I want to see.

Jeff Passan (20:36)

I wanted. I wanted to see he'll Cena the whole time.

Alan Hahn (20:41)

But even once it started, you still wanted to see it? Because once it started, I did not enjoy it as much as I thought I would.

Jeff Passan (20:46)

Oh. See, I thought that it was tremendous, and I thought that the only reason that people didn't like it is because, again, it went against what their expectations were. But for me, in entertainment, diverting expectations, if not everything, is one of the main things you're trying to do.

Alan Hahn (21:03)

All right, I got to get you on Cheap Heat soon because that is a very interesting. That is a unique opinion on the Cena heel turn that many do not have. Jeff, you're a jack of all trades.

Peter Rosenberg (21:11)

We appreciate you.

Jeff Passan (21:12)

You're a jobber, bro. My pleasure, boys. Later.

Alan Hahn (21:18)

Later, dude.

Don Hahn (21:20)

That's the great Jeff pass. And I love how thoughtful he is, even in argument and disagreement. He. It just. He's. He's so thoughtful with his answers, which is great. And it.

Peter Rosenberg (21:30)

He echoed what you were saying at top of the show too. When it comes to the. The understanding, the thought process of where Mets fans are right now with this team, talking about how right now it's depressing and is what he said. I just want it to end. Like, that's literally how you feel right now, right, Don? So any talk of next year and prospects? You're not interested right now?

Don Hahn (21:52)

Yeah, because that's for after the season. But.

Peter Rosenberg (21:55)

But that's a lot. That's a reasonable hope. I mean, that's tangible hope.

Don Hahn (21:58)

No, but it's it's tangible hope long term, but as far as Hope for the 25 season when there was so much, not just at the start of the season, but you know On January, on June 12th when you're 21 games above.500, have a five and a half game lead, first place. And now we're sitting here on September 25th holding on to a one game lead precariously just trying to make the playoffs as the third wild card. Crazy.

Alan Hahn (22:23)

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Peter Rosenberg (23:20)

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Install by independent contractors. See Associate for details. Contiguous us only thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.

Alan Hahn (24:20)

I didn't listen to anything you just said.

Peter Rosenberg (24:21)

Catch the show on demand whenever you want want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcasts. We all have that one friend.

Don Hahn (24:36)

I'm talking about the Yo Yos who set themselves on fire and bathe in.

Peter Rosenberg (24:39)

Pork and beans or know that one.

Alan Hahn (24:41)

Person, I'm here with, my family who.

Peter Rosenberg (24:44)

Can'T help but be.

Alan Hahn (24:45)

He's not cool. His voice is weird. He's kind of a dork. His brother's a tool. His girlfriend's annoying.

Peter Rosenberg (24:51)

That guy.

Don Hahn (24:52)

I didn't know it was banner night. We won't be out for that.

Peter Rosenberg (24:55)

It's time for that Guy Thursday. Hey, guys, anyone want to play some ball with Don Hahn and Rosenberg?

Don Hahn (25:01)

He's just being that guy. The best.

Alan Hahn (25:06)

It's the best open we have.

Peter Rosenberg (25:08)

Well, that, that Guy Thursday is essentially what, you know, it can be for callers. 800-9377, you want to call out somebody in your life that you thought was being that guy. It happens in everyday life. It happens in sports quite a bit. And we have a candidate for today's show that I think we can all agree. So we know that the, the Blue Jays are another one of these teams that's in a bit of a tailspin right now as they are seeing their division lead, which I believe at one point was six and a half games over the Yankees. Correct. And now that is completely evaporated. Two nights ago, the Blue Jays were in another tight game and Springer hit a ball that, when you look, when you watch, probably was a fair ball, but the umpire called it foul and took, obviously took away what could have been a run scoring double. I believe Springer then ends up striking out. Now he's furious, goes to the dugout. There's some argument going on about it. There was no, you can't challenge it and there's no replay at all. But replays, if you watch it close enough, show you that it should have been a hit.

Alan Hahn (26:24)

Yes.

Peter Rosenberg (26:26)

So the cameras are on Springer in the dugout and he's clearly unhappy. And you give credit, of course, to John Boy. This is what they do. They do a lot of lip reading. And on social media, there was a video put out of Springer and when you watch his lips and you see the audio with it, he appears to say towards the umpires, if they want New York to win, just tell me and give it to them already. Then he goes on to say, how do you miss that? He was very mad at the call. But the fact that the first thing on his mind is that there's a conspiracy by Major League Baseball and it's umpires, by the way, to make sure Toronto doesn't win so the Yankees can win the division is a very bizarre thing in my opinion would be the first thing to come to his mind. He's had a great season. He's been really good. A good, good bounce back season for him. But he's kind of being that guy there. He's, he's, he often is that guy. But you love having it on your team. But for him, this, that's the first thing that came to your mind? Don Peter if they want New York to win, just tell me you really like. That's. You'd be mad about the call. You could be mad. They wouldn't, wouldn't review it. You could be mad about all those things. But the first thing that comes to mind is that tells you in that clubhouse they feel it. They feel the Yankees on their tail also.

Don Hahn (27:49)

It's just so lame. Honestly, I don't know what Major League Baseball is going to do about it. If they can prove that that's what he said because it's the lip reading, you could tell that's what he said.

Peter Rosenberg (27:58)

Oh, you could tell.

Don Hahn (27:59)

If anybody ever said, if he said that in a post game press conference, it's fineable if not suspendable because now you're messing with the integrity of the league. Somebody in the game is claiming that the fix is in. Yeah, all right. And it's just so lame and it's so typical. As much as I love Toronto, love.

Alan Hahn (28:17)

Canada, we love being Canadian.

Don Hahn (28:19)

It's the tenor of that whole franchise going back to the 90s. Remember when the Canadian flag was upside down for the anthem? I forget. It was the Braves Series, the Philly Series. They always feel like they're disrespected. They always feel like Major League Baseball doesn't want them to win because they won't get any ratings because it's Canada and it's Toronto. It's just the way they always go about it. The Leafs go through the same thing too. The league hates us. They hate the Canadian teams. Batman doesn't want Canadian teams to win. It's the same garbage we hear all the time. It's an excuse, man. It's so lame. You're right, because you're feeling it instead of looking in the mirror and how you're playing. Yeah, it was a bad call. Rip the umpire all you want. I'm all for that. But when the first thing out of your mouth is you think the fix is in, it just tells me you have this colossal inferiority complex that you think going in because you're Toronto, because You're the Blue Jays. That the league is going to try to fix it for you not to win. And not the fact that maybe you have. You've gone 30 years without winning because you, you don't have the stomach for it. You've had some good teams, you got some good players, but you're feeling it. And the first thing is, instead of blaming yourself and pointing yourself or looking in the mirror, it's, oh, the fix is in. And you'll get people up in Toronto to believe that. You'll get the conspiracy theorists to say, well, listen, he probably knows they don't want the Blue Jays, and it makes sense.

Peter Rosenberg (29:34)

Well, it's the same conspiracy about Aaron Judge we just heard earlier in the show. Right. They're not pitching him the same way they're pitching Kyle Riley. Fans hang on to this stuff, but this is. That's fans and fans, I think.

Don Hahn (29:45)

Right.

Peter Rosenberg (29:45)

They're obligated to do these things because you want to find a reason your team isn't winning. You don't want to say, my team's not good enough. They've lost six of the last seven games. They lost to the Rays. They got swept by the Royals. They're. Now they're on the verge of getting swept by the Red Sox. They are in a tailspin. And his first thought is, oh, you want the Yankees to get the division? That's the first he's letting you know. They are in their heads.

Don Hahn (30:09)

Oh, no, they're feeling it. It's a bad look. Listen, I don't want to. You know, in every line of business, but like our business, there are guys that didn't make it. Didn't. You know, they, they couldn't. They, they wanted to make it. They couldn't make it. And instead of saying, I guess I just wasn't good enough, oh, this one didn't like me, or this one had it in for me back in the. Instead of just saying, well, maybe I just wasn't good enough. Like, that's always, I think, salutation. The losers lament. Like, instead of saying, you know, maybe I just wasn't good enough.

Peter Rosenberg (30:40)

Yeah.

Don Hahn (30:41)

Yeah, maybe I. Maybe I needed to try a little harder.

Peter Rosenberg (30:44)

So.

Don Hahn (30:45)

And so that really bothers me.

Peter Rosenberg (30:48)

Right.

Don Hahn (30:48)

He's got to be that guy.

Peter Rosenberg (30:49)

He's that guy today. Anybody else?

Alan Hahn (30:51)

Oh, there are plenty of guys. You kidding me?

Don Hahn (30:53)

Go ahead.

Alan Hahn (30:54)

I went to. When I was in Los Angeles yesterday. No, I had a brief period of like two hours. Between what? Finishing up what I was doing, going to the airport. And my wife and I We don't think we're ready to get back into the small dog game again. But we saw there had been these Malteses that were rescued from Oklahoma. They found some terrible breeder, and there was like 400 Malteses that were available. Malteses are often hard to adopt. So we ended up looking. We applied for one, we didn't get it. But by the end, we were like, oh, maybe we are ready now. Because, you know, once you then try, you kind of start getting. When we did it, we were like, are we even ready to do this? I don't know if we're ready to do it. Let's do it. And then when we found out she wasn't available, we were like, oh, that kind of hurts. So I stopped by the place. They did not have any of the Malteses actually there. They were all in foster homes anyway. But I saw some other dogs. But the point is this. I more than anyone, truly believe that, that when you're adopting a dog, the kind of home they're going to, the situation is important. You should not treat giving someone a dog. If you run a dog rescue, you care deeply about animals, so you're obviously gonna want them to. The people who are applying to adopt the animals, to go through some level of a process.

Peter Rosenberg (32:11)

North Shore Animal League puts you through a process.

Alan Hahn (32:15)

So. And I love North Shore Animal League. I've worked with them a lot. They're great. I went to this place yesterday in la and they're doing a great job. I just wanted to see the dogs. I told them, I said, listen, it's unlikely that I'm going to find a love connection today. And even if I do, my wife's going to have to fly out and interview also. This is a lot, but I'm here. I just wanted to see if they're. Before they would even let me. Guys, look at a dog. What's your favorite color? How much did you weigh? Have you ever watched pornography? What's your middle name? What do you think of the Sopranos finale? You know, did you ever play the game Contra? The amount of questions they were asking me. Just as none of those questions were real. You psychos. Everyone's staring at me like they happened.

Peter Rosenberg (33:05)

They were not real.

Alan Hahn (33:07)

But the point is, it was an endless list of questions. Guys, can I just at least see the dogs? Then we can, after that, run the battery on me. I'm down for it. But they had me just sit standing around, waiting. It was. It was a little psychotic. And as.

Jeff Passan (33:25)

That's.

Alan Hahn (33:25)

As someone who believes you still need to go through the process before it happens.

Peter Rosenberg (33:29)

Feels like, feels like nature was telling you not time.

Alan Hahn (33:33)

I, yeah, either nature or just the weird lady who was at the desk at the place.

Peter Rosenberg (33:37)

But she represented nature.

Alan Hahn (33:41)

Or maybe she was just that guy.

Peter Rosenberg (33:43)

Maybe she wasn't.

Alan Hahn (33:44)

Because maybe it could have been like, hey, you know what, we understand you have limited time. Why don't you meet some dogs and if anything strikes you afterwards, we'll sit down and have ourselves a chat.

Peter Rosenberg (33:52)

You see what I'm saying?

Alan Hahn (33:53)

It was just very intense.

Don Hahn (33:55)

I just don't want to scare people off from wanting to get animals adopting dogs.

Alan Hahn (34:00)

Right, right.

Don Hahn (34:01)

Because you know what happens to these dogs when they don't get adopted.

Alan Hahn (34:05)

Well, this was, thank God this was a no kill show. Okay, Right, but that's. And by the way, and it's really important, you know, my friend who I was with was like, why is this so intense? And I went, well, think about it. These, they saved these dogs lives. They're not going to then hand them off to someone who's not going to take good care of them. I truly believe in that. But we could have the talk once I've. Do you have a dog here? Are there any dogs here? That's the funniest part too. I walked in at least this, at least let me walk through the dogs. So I see the dogs are there and then we have it. You might not even know that dogs.

Peter Rosenberg (34:38)

Exist in this place.

Alan Hahn (34:40)

And then I saw them and God, they're all. I really wanted to adopt every single one of them. They were all wonderful. But alas, not yet. Bear is still an only, an only doggie for this moment.

Peter Rosenberg (34:51)

But at least you started the process. At least. Yeah, yeah, that's making that move.

Alan Hahn (34:55)

Although you know what I realized guys? Apparently with these small dogs, some of the places you adopt are going to be very particular about us having a young child. Because young children can be dangerous to small dogs. If you're, if you're not a super observant parent like you'd have to be, you have to be a super observant parent when you have a small dog.

Peter Rosenberg (35:14)

Yeah, of course.

Don Hahn (35:16)

A bond that could be formed. I know how important that is. I think should outweigh the possibility of the child treating a dog or just do your job to know. Listen, I'm never gonna leave the child alone. So, so I don't have to worry about the dog being in any kind of trouble because if I'm allowing the dog to babysit my three month old, he's got problems. Then the kid should be taken away, nevermind the dog.

Alan Hahn (35:38)

Exactly. Again, I get the concern, but, you know, every parent's different, so you just gotta be mindful when you do these things. By the way, I hadn't seen the video of. Speaking of. I don't know if this fits for that guy, but I hadn't seen the video of David Frye getting smashed.

Don Hahn (35:53)

Yeah, that was in the face. And the effect that it had on school. Yeah, he couldn't see.

Peter Rosenberg (36:00)

His immediate reaction was like he just took his hat off. He didn't want to look.

Don Hahn (36:06)

No, it was awful.

Alan Hahn (36:07)

Well, I mean, is it. Is David Fry okay?

Peter Rosenberg (36:10)

I believe there was a. There was an update. It's.

Alan Hahn (36:14)

But so it's too soon for me to. I can't place him on that guy. It's too soon. No, but that is very rare.

Peter Rosenberg (36:20)

It was an update on him. I saw it just recently.

Alan Hahn (36:23)

God, can you imagine guys in a baseball game turning around and squaring up fully to a pitch that fast and just hoping that you put your bat on the bat?

Don Hahn (36:33)

That's really scary, man. Real scary. So I got one. I guess it's towards Major League Baseball.

Peter Rosenberg (36:42)

Facial fractures out six to eight weeks.

Alan Hahn (36:44)

Six to eight weeks. But that was it. I mean, all things considered.

Peter Rosenberg (36:48)

All things considered.

Alan Hahn (36:49)

Worse.

Peter Rosenberg (36:49)

Pretty freaking amazing.

Don Hahn (36:50)

Andrew Marchand's reporting from the Athletic that Netflix, who will have a baseball package next year, is going to air Giants Yankees opening Day as an exclusive.

Peter Rosenberg (37:05)

Okay, so we just have to get used to.

Don Hahn (37:07)

So just like last year or this, this year where ESPN took the opener.

Peter Rosenberg (37:12)

Right.

Don Hahn (37:14)

Netflix is taking the opener. And by the way, so not only is it on national television and taken from. Yes, it'll also be no Michael K, no Mike, whoever is going to be announcing that first series against San Francisco to open the year. And again, it's not a big deal. Netflix is a partner. And let's face it, Major League Baseball doesn't have, like, a lot of attractive things to offer national television. Like Opening Day is something probably Netflix. I'm paying. I think it was like, what are they paying? Like $550 million for the rights. I want, I want. I want. Giants have a huge fan base. Yankees obviously have a huge fan base. I want to get the opener. I want people to know that it's on Netflix, but I know Yankee fans are going to get apoplectic hearing this because not only is their game not going to be on locally, the first game of the season, who knows, they might be raising a banner that. Where is that game? Is that game home I didn't even look. I shouldn't even have said that. Is. Is it. Because I haven't even looked. Anthony, is the game is a Yankee game or Giant game? Is that in San Francisco or New York? Because it just came down. It just. I'm reading the story in San Francisco. Okay. So it doesn't matter as far as concerned. So that doesn't matter. But. And it's not the home opener, but Yankee fans still get ticked off. They're not going to get their local announcer on opening day. And, oh, by the way, it's going to be another app. But Netflix is an app that everybody has.

Alan Hahn (38:32)

That one is more manageable.

Don Hahn (38:34)

So Netflix.

Peter Rosenberg (38:35)

Netflix and prime feel a little bit more of like a. It's become more and more into what people do on a regular basis.

Don Hahn (38:43)

Yeah. It's just.

Peter Rosenberg (38:44)

It's all the other stuff that you get now, which, like, again, the NBA is going to go through this and NFL's going through it where it's. It's all of the networks, streaming services that you got it now. This one's on Peacock. Is that what this one's on? This one's on Paramount. Like, where's this gate? Like, that's the ones where you really start fumbling around. But I think at this point, Netflix and Prime feel like, you know, if 242457, then it's Netflix and Prime.

Don Hahn (39:10)

And you can't say. And they're gonna be like, well, make it available on. Yes, as well. Well, no, that defeats the purpose. Netflix is like, you're gonna take 80% of my audience. Because they know the Giant fans and Yankee fans are gonna watch Netflix. They want that, you know, so they don't want. They're not gonna do like, the NFL is so monstrous. They can offer ESPN games and Amazon games to the local market because they know people are still going to watch even though.

Peter Rosenberg (39:34)

Outside of the market.

Don Hahn (39:35)

Outside the market. But that's not going to happen in baseball.

Peter Rosenberg (39:37)

And we've learned in New York that a lot of fans prefer to watch the national broadcast over the local broadcast. But I don't know about opening night or opening.

Alan Hahn (39:46)

See you.

Don Hahn (39:46)

You mentioned that to me.

Peter Rosenberg (39:47)

That's the thing, man.

Don Hahn (39:48)

I want to push back on that. When we come back, they got Willa.

Peter Rosenberg (39:52)

They got my daughter.

Jeff Passan (39:53)

I need to find her.

Peter Rosenberg (39:54)

Willa. From acclaimed director Paul Thomas Anderson.

Don Hahn (39:58)

You can save that girl.

Peter Rosenberg (40:00)

On September 26, experience what is being called the best movie of the year. This is the end of the line. Not for you. Leonardo DiCaprio, Sean Pan, Benicio Del Toro, Tiana Taylor Chase infinity let's go one battle after another.

Don Hahn (40:14)

Only in theater September 26th experience it in IMAX.

Peter Rosenberg (40:17)

Rated R. Under 17 nine a minute.

Don Hahn (40:19)

Without parent I'm Christian McCaffrey, pro running.

Peter Rosenberg (40:23)

Back and Abercrombie is an official fashion partner of the NFL.

Don Hahn (40:27)

I'm not kidding when I say NFL by Abercrombie. Broke the Internet last year and I.

Peter Rosenberg (40:31)

Think this season's lineup is even cooler. And so does my wife, who keeps stealing all my hoodies.

Don Hahn (40:37)

Stay fit for the season and Abercrombie's newest arrivals. Shop NFL by Abercrombie in the app, online and in store.

Peter Rosenberg (40:53)

When did making plans get this complicated? It's time to streamline with WhatsApp, the secure messaging app that brings the whole group together. Use polls to settle dinner plans, send event invites and pin messages so no one forgets mom 60th and never miss a meme or milestone. All protected with end to end encryption. It's time for WhatsApp message privately with everyone. Learn more@WhatsApp.com thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.

Alan Hahn (41:23)

I didn't listen to anything you just said.

Peter Rosenberg (41:25)

Catch this show on demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcasts.

Don Hahn (41:33)

Golf's greatest rivalry tees off at Beth Page Black and the guys are going to bring you all the action, energy and passion straight from the course. Domestic Dpietro and Rothenberg tomorrow morning only on esp. Brought to you by Michelob Ultra. No matter what you're playing for, make it superior with Michelob Ultra. 2.6 carbs, 95 calories, a superior taste worth playing for. Official beer sponsor of the Ryder Cup. You mentioned it just in the last break and you said something to me before we even went on the air about people locally will watch the national broadcast. Expand on that.

Peter Rosenberg (42:09)

Well, I'm saying it, not I have to be clear. Season opener especially, you know, for the Yankees. You are trained to go to. Yes. So I don't necessarily think it's the case in this one, but a lot of times side by side, the national actually wins in New York, which only.

Don Hahn (42:30)

I believe happens in the NBA and the NHL.

Peter Rosenberg (42:34)

Now there's now we don't get a lot of side by sides in any other sport. Obviously you don't get it in football, so we don't get to see it. But there is something about the national broadcast which a lot of viewers are interested to see. What are the national guys saying about my team? And that's why they'll go there rather than the regional sports network. So I don't know if on opening night that would happen. I don't. I probably guess it wouldn't. Especially because it's a streaming service. It's Netflix. If it was going to be the game was on ESPN and also side by side. But yes, I think a lot of times in certain sports you're trained to know this is a national game. You go to the national broadcast, you assume it's not on the local. So that's what like to me a side by side with Netflix. I because it's a streaming service versus cable. I don't know if I'd be the same thing, but I do. The sense I get now, I could be corrected, but I've seen it. NBA and NHL, the majority of New York viewers, if they know it's on both, will watch the national.

Don Hahn (43:40)

But here's why. Here's why I disagree. Number one, it just seems like all the New Yorkers hate watching the national because they think the national is biased. Right. Joe Buck hates the Yankees. Back in the day it was, oh, Morgan hates the Yankees. It always just seems like.

Alan Hahn (43:59)

Well, there's also basic. They don't know they're talking about things that are generic.

Peter Rosenberg (44:03)

Right.

Don Hahn (44:03)

But is there a curiosity. But for the reigning standpoint, I'm sure you're basing it off of the NBA when they're evidence.

Peter Rosenberg (44:10)

We have.

Don Hahn (44:10)

Right.

Alan Hahn (44:10)

But.

Don Hahn (44:10)

But in the side by side when the Knicks are on national tv, let's say if they're on ESPN because it wouldn't be a side by side with abc. So if it's on ESPN and also on msg, there's a. There's a possibility that the ESPN might be Breen.

Peter Rosenberg (44:24)

Yes.

Don Hahn (44:25)

And the Nick Fan might watch espn. Cause it's Breen. Right. So is that they'd rather prefer the national cast or hey, it's Mike Breen.

Peter Rosenberg (44:31)

Well, no, because there's also everything leading up to it. There's the pre. There's all the other stuff that goes on with it. Right.

Don Hahn (44:37)

I do think there's a curiosity to see what they're saying.

Peter Rosenberg (44:39)

That's why I brought it up.

Don Hahn (44:41)

They want the option back.

Peter Rosenberg (44:43)

Was I'm curious to see what they say about my team nationally and they want to hear that there's something different about it when it's your team being talked about.

Don Hahn (44:53)

I feel like when I hear from fans and when I was doing Rangers and the Rangers would be on tnt, which is funny, they get Kenny. So it still felt like the Rangers, but Whenever they were on national television, they were pissed off because they didn't get. They didn't get Sam. They wanted Sam, especially towards the end because there was only a few games with.

Peter Rosenberg (45:11)

I get it.

Don Hahn (45:11)

I think Nick fans want Breen. I think Yankee fans want K. I think Met fans want Coma. I. I just think that's the way they feel more comfortable, you know, football. We don't have that luxury because we always get national guys.

Peter Rosenberg (45:23)

I always believe this. Don, There's a reason why I'm telling you this. This is not coming out of my ass. I'm telling you. I used to ask this question all the time is because I'd see the numbers and I'd say, why. Why would the. And a lot of them. Mike Breen was doing the Golden State game. He wasn't doing the Nick game. And I would say, like, why does that game get a better rating then the broadcast? If Nick fans all hate the fact that the national broadcast never says anything nice about your team? And they all. The response I would get time and time again was, well, I just like to hear what the national guys say.

Don Hahn (45:58)

Maybe even because maybe they're getting ammunition.

Peter Rosenberg (46:00)

Would it be different in baseball? I think it would be because it's streaming versus cable. You wouldn't want to sit on Netflix if you could watch it on. Yes.

Don Hahn (46:07)

I just wonder because when I was a kid, I'd love when the Mets run NBC.

Alan Hahn (46:12)

No, it's exciting to see on the National.

Don Hahn (46:14)

There was something about, like, just how, hey, my team must be important. Graziola and Vince Scully calling my game. Didn't get caught up in it as much. But now I. The feedback I always hear is that they don't like it. And I would also wonder from an NBA standpoint, when the Knicks and when we say side by side, meaning MSG and the national have it at the same time.

Peter Rosenberg (46:36)

Right.

Don Hahn (46:36)

There wasn't an exclusive to the network. I would say the overwhelming majority of the time that happens, you weren't getting Breen on msg because if it was a Wednesday and it's a Nat brain somewhere, probably. So if you're not getting Breen, I could see somebody saying, you know, I'm going to watch. Even if it's not Breen calling it nationally, like, no offense to Kenny or I guess Tyler's going to be doing TV this year. Tyler Murray just, I'm not getting Breen, so I might as well go check out the Nationals. I think if you're. There's no way you can convince me that if I'm getting Breen on nix on msg that I'm going to miss him and go watch TNT or espn.

Peter Rosenberg (47:13)

Tell me what the numbers said. And then I would talk about this.

Alan Hahn (47:16)

It's weird.

Peter Rosenberg (47:18)

That's the feedback I would get when I would ask. I would ask it on my shows because I was curious.

Alan Hahn (47:23)

But I do think when it comes to tnt, people would be, they'd want to hear what they're saying on inside at halftime before, I mean, you're curious, like you said, to hear what the.

Peter Rosenberg (47:31)

National voices say about your local team inside the NBA. I could understand that.

Alan Hahn (47:35)

Right?

Peter Rosenberg (47:36)

But the broadcast is still especially Latia, you know, it's Reggie Miller.

Alan Hahn (47:39)

Who wants to see a Reggie Miller during the Knicks broadcast. But once they're already there, if they're, if they go check out, you know how it is.

Peter Rosenberg (47:45)

It's weird.

Don Hahn (47:46)

But listen, you got the numbers. But I just, the reaction I get from fans is they'd rather get the local than national.

Peter Rosenberg (47:53)

Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.

Alan Hahn (47:57)

I don't want to know how the.

Peter Rosenberg (47:57)

Sausage is made, man. I just want to know. It's good. Hear more of Don Allen and Peter Weekday afternoon starting at 3 on 8 80, ESPN, the ESPN New York app, and your smart speakers.

Jeff Passan (48:10)

This isn't just another ESPN fantasy football season, it's your shot at greatness. With a refreshed design, the ESPN Fantasy app is sharper than ever, so you can draft like a pro and dominate your league. And introducing Gridiron Gauntlet, a new game mode where the best compete to be crowned the number one fantasy football player of 2025. One app, one shot, one champion. Download the ESPN fantasy app and sign up to play ESPN Fantasy Football today.