Hour 2: Judge's Legacy & NFL Binge

Summary

Podcast Summary: Don, Hahn & Rosenberg – Hour 2: Judge's Legacy & NFL Binge

Release Date: June 9, 2025

Hosts:

• Don La Greca – ESPN New York and New Jersey legend
• Alan Hahn – Long-time sportswriter and New York Knicks broadcaster
• Peter Rosenberg – Highly opinionated Hip Hop veteran and WWE personality

---

1. Aaron Judge’s Legacy in the Yankees' History

Overview: The hosts delve deep into Aaron Judge’s stellar performance with the New York Yankees, highlighting his impressive statistics and discussing his place among baseball legends.

Key Points:

• Home Run Milestone:

  • Don La Greca [00:43]: "Judge hit two more home runs in the game, now is 23 on the year."
  • Significance: Judge ties Lou Gehrig for the third-most multi-home run games in Yankees history, trailing only Babe Ruth and Mickey Mantle.

• Comparisons to Legends:

  • Don La Greca [02:00]: "How has Judge better than Jeter aged so far this year? Well, medium, well, very well burnt."
  • Discussion: While Judge's regular-season numbers are extraordinary, comparing him to Babe Ruth is premature given Ruth's unparalleled career achievements.

• Era Differences:

  • Chris Carlin [03:22]: "You might argue that Judge is a superior hitter. You could argue it."
  • Don La Greca [03:24]: "If you put Babe Ruth in the time machine and brought him here, he wouldn't make contact."
  • Insight: The evolution of the game, including pitching styles and training regimens, makes direct comparisons challenging.

• Postseason Performance:

  • Don La Greca [06:09]: "He's going to go down as one of, if not the greatest Yankees of all time."
  • Chris Carlin [06:24]: "That's a different thing. That's a question."
  • Conclusion: While Judge's regular-season performance is stellar, his postseason record remains a point of contention.

Notable Quote:

• Don La Greca [02:15]: "Nobody's ever going to say that Eli's even in the same stratosphere as his brother as a quarterback."

---

2. NFL Updates and Analysis

a. Packers Release Jair Alexander

Overview: The Green Bay Packers announce the release of cornerback Jair Alexander after two injury-plagued seasons.

Key Points:

• Performance and Contract:

  • Peter Rosenberg [25:31]: "He appeared in just seven regular season games each of the past two seasons."
  • Contract Details: Alexander was a 2018 first-round pick with a significant contract, making him the highest-paid cornerback at the time.

• Financial Implications:

  • Chris Carlin [26:00]: "The packers now will pick up more than $17 million in cap space."

Notable Quote:

• Don La Greca [26:23]: "Best availability is your best ability."

b. Colts’ Anthony Richardson’s Injury

Overview: Anthony Richardson of the Indianapolis Colts sustains an injury to his throwing shoulder, raising concerns about his availability for the upcoming training camp.

Key Points:

• Injury Details:

  • Peter Rosenberg [26:34]: "Anthony sustained an injury in his throwing shoulder. Felt some pain in it."

• Team’s Position:

  • Chris Carlin [27:05]: "Sounds like a pitcher."
  • Implications: Richardson is unlikely to require surgery but may miss significant training time.

Notable Quote:

• Chris Carlin [28:14]: "If they're gonna go through this where Anthony Richardson is always hurt, something's always happening to him. DJ Might have signed with the right team."

c. Aaron Rodgers Joins the Steelers

Overview: Aaron Rodgers, aged 41, transitions from the Green Bay Packers to the Pittsburgh Steelers, donning jersey number 8.

Key Points:

• Contract Details:

  • Peter Rosenberg [28:14]: "He will wear number eight like he did in New York. The 41-year-old arrived in Pittsburgh on a one-year, $13.65 million deal."

• Team Strategy:

  • Chris Carlin [29:05]: "The Vikings plan is clear... They can build around him with some pieces. So they're going to go for it without Rodgers."

• Jersey Number Controversy:

  • Peter Rosenberg [29:18]: "Chris Carlin: You don't have to know the number."
  • Chris Carlin [32:10]: "What was the color of the jersey Aaron Rodgers used to wear?"

Notable Quote:

• Peter Rosenberg [29:36]: "He just invented the wheel."

---

3. Golden Tate and Jalen Ramsey Feud

Overview: A heated on-field altercation between Golden Tate and Jalen Ramsey is dissected, revealing underlying personal tensions.

Key Points:

• Backstory:

  • Golden Tate [34:07]: "He was out there ready to go. So I guess he took that personal."
  • Explanation: The feud stems from personal grievances involving family, leading to intensified confrontations during games.

• On-field Incidents:

  • Chris Carlin [35:02]: "Respect the fact that he knew."
  • Discussion: Both players exhibit aggressive behaviors influenced by their personal issues, impacting game dynamics.

Notable Quote:

• Don La Greca [37:30]: "With the information that we have, he's going to have to go see big Bro."

---

4. Knicks Coaching Changes and Ownership Dynamics

Overview: The hosts explore the recent firing of Tom Thibodeau as head coach of the New York Knicks, examining the role of ownership and player influence in the decision.

Key Points:

• Firing of Tom Thibodeau:

  • Don La Greca [41:48]: "The firing of Thibodeau was all on Dolan."
  • Chris Russo on First Take: Blames owner Jim Dolan for the decision.

• Ownership Influence:

  • Chris Carlin [43:00]: "Leon Rose was on the side of continuity."
  • Discussion: Ownership, led by Jim Dolan, appears to have a significant role in coaching decisions, possibly overruling player sentiments.

• Player Opinions and Patience:

  • Alan Hahn [18:05]: "I really don't want to see this core get taken apart."
  • Chris Carlin [49:50]: "When you see your team and you see, like, was this as good as this team can be?"

• Future Directions:

  • Discussion: Among varying opinions, there's a consensus that the team is at a crossroads, debating between maintaining continuity or making aggressive changes to secure a championship.

Notable Quote:

• Chris Carlin [51:38]: "We're trying to do something that hasn't been done here in a long time, and that means being aggressive and taking swings and going for it."

---

5. Closing Thoughts

The episode concludes with a reflection on the challenges facing both the Yankees and the NFL teams discussed. The hosts emphasize the importance of strategic decisions in shaping the future success of these sports franchises.

Notable Quote:

• Don La Greca [52:08]: "What did Wayne Gretzky always say? There's four seasons, there's a preseason, there's the regular season, there's the playoffs, and then there's the final."

---

Highlights:

• Aaron Judge's impressive regular-season performance positions him as one of the Yankees' all-time greats, though comparisons to legends like Babe Ruth remain nuanced due to era differences.
• In the NFL, the Packers release Jair Alexander amid contract considerations, the Colts face uncertainty with Anthony Richardson's injury, and Aaron Rodgers makes a significant move to the Steelers, sparking discussions about team strategies and legacy jersey numbers.
• A personal feud between Golden Tate and Jalen Ramsey highlights the intersection of personal issues and professional sports dynamics.
• The firing of Knicks coach Tom Thibodeau underscores the complex relationship between team ownership, player influence, and the pursuit of championship success.

---

Notable Quotes with Timestamps:

• Don La Greca [02:15]: "Nobody's ever going to say that Eli's even in the same stratosphere as his brother as a quarterback."
• Chris Carlin [03:22]: "You might argue that Judge is a superior hitter. You could argue it."
• Chris Carlin [29:05]: "The Vikings plan is clear... They can build around him with some pieces. So they're going to go for it without Rodgers."
• Don La Greca [37:30]: "With the information that we have, he's going to have to go see big Bro."
• Chris Carlin [51:38]: "We're trying to do something that hasn't been done here in a long time, and that means being aggressive and taking swings and going for it."
• Don La Greca [52:08]: "What did Wayne Gretzky always say? There's four seasons, there's a preseason, there's the regular season, there's the playoffs, and then there's the final."

---

Conclusion: This episode of "Don, Hahn & Rosenberg" provides a comprehensive analysis of Aaron Judge's burgeoning legacy, critical NFL team movements, intricate player feuds, and pivotal coaching changes within the New York Knicks. The hosts offer insightful perspectives, enriched with notable quotes and detailed discussions, making it a valuable listen for sports enthusiasts seeking in-depth commentary.

Transcript

[Don La Greca]

With a Venmo debit card, you can Venmo more than just your friends. You can use your balance in so many ways. You can Venmo everything. Need gas? You can Venmo this.

[Peter Rosenberg]

How about snacks?

[Don La Greca]

You can Venmo that. Your favorite band's merch?

[Peter Rosenberg]

You can Venmo this or their next show.

[Don La Greca]

You can Venmo that. Visit Venmo Me Debit to learn more.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You can Venmo this or you can Venmo that.

[Don La Greca]

You can Venmo this or you can Venmo that. You can Venmo. The Venmo MasterCard is issued by the Bancorp bank and a pursuant to license.

[Peter Rosenberg]

By Mastercard International, Inc. Card may be used everywhere.

[Don La Greca]

MasterCard is accepted. Venmo purchase restrictions apply.

[Chris Carlin]

This is the Die Rosenberg Podcast.

[Don La Greca]

That sounds like heaven to me.

[Chris Carlin]

Listen live weekday afternoon starting at 3 on 8 80, ESPN, the ESPN New York app and your smart speakers.

[Don La Greca]

Four, two in the big city. Don Han and Rosenberg take up until 7 o' clock and then it's Dan Grasse. Mets off, Yankees off. But a lot of baseball to talk about. We'll get into the Knicks, we'll get. I've got an NFL binge coming up at the top. You know, we get a rundown from Anthony Pusick. Does a great job just talking about like Judge's numbers. Judge hit two more home runs in the game, now is 23 on the year 43rd career multi home run game ties Lou Gehrig for third most in Yankees history behind only Ruth and Mantle. Ruth did it 68 times. Mantle did it 46. They were saying during the broadcast yesterday, like the numbers that he's putting up are just absolutely, absolutely astonishing. So Anthony brought up like Ruth. Now you compare anybody to Babe, anybody to Babe Ruth. Yo, hold your horses now, Styles. Ruth.

[Chris Carlin]

Yeah.

[Don La Greca]

It'S not crazy. It's still a ways away because he still has to put together a whole career. But like you start throwing 700 runs and maze and Mantle and Ruth like the greats of the game. Let me, let me put it to you this way.

[Chris Carlin]

Go ahead.

[Don La Greca]

How has Judge better than Jeter aged so far this year? Well, medium, well, very well burnt.

[Peter Rosenberg]

This is new.

[Chris Carlin]

I'll be that guy. Talk to me in October. I'll be that guy. I'm sorry, you gotta add that.

[Don La Greca]

Understand that. And nobody is gonna talk about the club. I'm just saying the numbers that he is putting up with the regular season, if you want to spit on it, if you're a Yankee fan, that's your prerogative if you want to say he's not putting up the numbers that Jeter put up in the postseason, of course, but come on, man. We are. We are comparing Aaron Judge to the greatest that ever played the game of baseball or ped. Guys like, honestly, I mean, this is what we're doing. Like, you could throw. Connor McDavid's great, right? But you're not. You're not going Gretzky. That's. No, that's too much. You're going too far. But you start throwing the names out with Judge, you're not out of line.

[Chris Carlin]

I might even go this far. If we're just talking regular season and you consider the game today and everything, the advancements of the game today and all that stuff, and you compare it to Ruth back in the day when we know that the league was. Looked a lot different back then, did it not? You might argue that Judge is a superior hitter. You could argue it. You could absolutely argue it. Was Ruth facing the spin rate, honestly?

[Don La Greca]

Well, this is the argument I had the ball move.

[Chris Carlin]

You're gonna tell me the ball moved the Same back in 27 than it does in 25?

[Don La Greca]

I said it on K that I think if you put Babe Ruth in the time machine and brought him here, he wouldn't make contact. Okay, we understand how the game has changed.

[Chris Carlin]

That's a strong statement to make.

[Don La Greca]

No, I wouldn't make contact. He was. This is gonna sound old to a lot of our K audience, but to anybody that's new, look, just look at it. Look at his frame. Look at how he went about these. Eating hot dogs. He didn't.

[Chris Carlin]

Didn't even run that well.

[Don La Greca]

And listen, and the other thing that.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I will go with, we love hot dogs.

[Don La Greca]

And would he have trained better if he was today? Of course things would be different.

[Chris Carlin]

We don't sand the ball didn't. But here's the thing Devers doesn't, is.

[Don La Greca]

That everybody talks about Walter Johnson, Heath, they measure it with a motorcycle. But, oh, he threw 100 mile per hour, but he also threw 200 pitches. By the seventh inning, his arm was hanging by like saliva. All right? He was probably throwing the ball 50 miles per hour. You don't think some of those home runs were off that? The guys in the bullpen were quacks that couldn't make it.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Quacks.

[Don La Greca]

They threw you in the bullpen because you weren't man enough to throw nine innings. So we're going to put you in a bullpen now. You got guys that are specifically made almost engineered to be in the bullpen that throw 95 mile per hour sweepers and make you soil yourself. Back then it was like if you brought in the guy from the bull, if Walter Johnson couldn't go in the 12th inning, they were bringing almost a guy from the, from the upper deck to come down.

[Chris Carlin]

And so you're doing the JJ Redick plumbers and electricians thing.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Oh, in baseball it's more true though.

[Don La Greca]

Honestly, nobody ever talks about that. If a guy, a human being is going to throw 150 pitches and like, oh, Walter Johnson, what through 15 was finally gave up his first hit at the top of the 15th, what pitch was he throwing? It underhand. There's no video footage, there's nothing to go by legend. Yeah, I'm sure Walter Johnson play blue Ruth away on the first three pitches.

[Chris Carlin]

Yep.

[Don La Greca]

But by the 16th inning I pitched 300. Oh, by the way, probably would turn around and pitch the next day and.

[Peter Rosenberg]

How you do the next day.

[Chris Carlin]

So then again, statistical comparisons to history tells you that his numbers match what we've seen in history that no other batter has done since almost 100 years ago. And you could argue then that if you do the same thing, you put Judge, you stuff him in the DeLorean, you hit the flux capacitor and you put in the date June 8, 1927. You're going to tell me that he's not destroying baseballs. Destroying them. Right.

[Don La Greca]

He's crushing.

[Chris Carlin]

If that's the case, he is at a pace right now that you could arguably say best right hand hitter in the history of the sport. And I get, and it's a sport that's been around for almost 200 years.

[Don La Greca]

And I get he hasn't hit in the postseason.

[Chris Carlin]

That's a different thing. That's a different argument. That's a question.

[Don La Greca]

We'll have that argument because that's the Eli versus Peyton argument. Right. Like maybe you take Eli in a big spot over Payton.

[Chris Carlin]

Yeah. Because Peyton because of the clutches.

[Don La Greca]

But nobody's ever going to say that Eli's even in the same stratosphere as his brother as a quarterback.

[Chris Carlin]

Right.

[Don La Greca]

So I'm just, I'm just telling you this. He's going to go down as one of, if not the greatest Yankees of all time. I'm telling you. And then, and as we start to get through three digits away the last time these guys played.

[Chris Carlin]

Yep.

[Don La Greca]

I mean that's the thing about baseball is you can't go that far back in the other sports. You can in baseball. The 27. Do you realize in two years, we're going to celebrate the 100th anniversary of the 27 Yankees. So that was the heyday of Ruth and Garrett.

[Chris Carlin]

Yeah, yeah. You know, murderers, rough.

[Don La Greca]

It's 100 years ago. So at some point, you're going to have to kind of reset it and say, guy, there's nobody on earth that saw these guys play.

[Chris Carlin]

Right.

[Don La Greca]

And a lot of the stuff that you're going by are by articles by reporters who like to kind of doctor things up a little bit.

[Peter Rosenberg]

That's all I've ever seen.

[Chris Carlin]

They were having a bourbon on the train with the players.

[Peter Rosenberg]

So what?

[Chris Carlin]

So listen, although I'll tell you what.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Enjoy yourself.

[Chris Carlin]

That feels like that would have been a good time to be a sportswriter.

[Don La Greca]

Oh, my God.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah.

[Don La Greca]

You were almost as big as the players.

[Chris Carlin]

I mean, it was just tremendous.

[Peter Rosenberg]

And not only that, you didn't. You're not fighting with the players, you're hanging out with them.

[Don La Greca]

So last night. So last night, the Yankee, Yankee, Red Sox game is on. And Nancy gets mad at me, but I'm like, I pay enough money for television. I am not watching commercial, not gonna do it. So between innings, I'm flipping over to something else.

[Chris Carlin]

Oh, yeah.

[Don La Greca]

So Channel 11 last night, back to.

[Peter Rosenberg]

The Future was the greatest movie ever.

[Don La Greca]

Watching it. And then Red Sox, Yankees lost the Face off at, like, 11, 6. Whatever. I'm like, all right, I'm gonna stick with.

[Chris Carlin]

I definitely got tired of that. And the NBA game also.

[Don La Greca]

Oh, I tried, but it just never brutal.

[Chris Carlin]

It felt a regular season game awful.

[Don La Greca]

Well, and he kind of felt like the Thunder were gonna bounce back. Yeah. But I want to ask Peter, because Peter thinks it's one of the greatest movies of all time. And I'm not disagreeing.

[Chris Carlin]

Back to the Future. The very first. Very first one. Yeah.

[Don La Greca]

The other ones, you know, they're nice.

[Chris Carlin]

That's. That's in a top 10 for me, for sure.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Go ahead.

[Don La Greca]

I'm ready. And he doesn't want to mess with the future to tell him that he's going to get shot.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah.

[Don La Greca]

The end of the movie.

[Chris Carlin]

Yeah.

[Don La Greca]

So he writes the letter to woman. We all know how it ended. For those who didn't know the ending, you didn't care anyway.

[Peter Rosenberg]

There's not a person listening.

[Don La Greca]

Right. That doesn't get.

[Chris Carlin]

Who doesn't know the end.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Doesn't know the end.

[Don La Greca]

Would it have really affected the future if he said, doc, I'm not telling you what to do. I'm not going to affect the future. Just whatever you do, don't deal with terrorists. It's good advice no matter what.

[Peter Rosenberg]

No, that. That would change the future.

[Don La Greca]

How would it change it?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Because then you wouldn't get the plutonium.

[Chris Carlin]

Right? He needed the plutonium.

[Peter Rosenberg]

He needed the plutonium, but he could have got.

[Chris Carlin]

Where's he gonna get it?

[Peter Rosenberg]

You should have said is. What you should have said was, I'm not gonna tell you anything specific. Just promise me whenever you're doing a deal with people that you don't know, wear a bulletproof vest. I don't know. Maybe there's another way around.

[Don La Greca]

I just think there could have been a way.

[Chris Carlin]

He still got shot in the face, though.

[Peter Rosenberg]

That's a good point.

[Don La Greca]

There could have been a way. But he still took the chance anyway. Even reading the letter.

[Chris Carlin]

Yeah, right.

[Don La Greca]

He had the. Reading the letter. And you needed something better than I just said, you know, Know. So what, after the. Through the whole movie, you couldn't affect it. But is there a way to tell somebody something? You're going to die. So please keep that in mind as you're doing all these things you're doing.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I think the way this whole thing works is invariably knowing anything like that will have an effect. It would change what he does.

[Don La Greca]

Didn't. Because he ended up wearing the bulletproof. Well, because he ended up reading the letter anyway.

[Chris Carlin]

Yeah.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yes, he.

[Don La Greca]

And judging. Judging how? When he almost checked immediately, but he was. Because if you look at how weathered it is and how it was taped.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Up, if it had been, he couldn't resist. He opened it for. Yeah, a long time ago. Wasn't it taped up and stuff?

[Don La Greca]

That's what I'm saying.

[Chris Carlin]

He tore it up right there.

[Peter Rosenberg]

He tore it up on the spot. Right. And then he tapes it.

[Don La Greca]

But the point, I don't think just saying whatever you do, wear a bulletproof vest. I don't think that affects the space.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Continuing. Well, listen, obviously what happened was he was. Doc Brown was so aware of the space time continuum that he said, I'm gonna keep this in mind when it's time and I'm never gonna think about it otherwise. Or wait a second, hold on. Oh, we're getting deep.

[Chris Carlin]

What do you got?

[Peter Rosenberg]

If you remember clearly, he's yelling from through the rain on the night I go back.

[Chris Carlin]

And he can't hear him.

[Peter Rosenberg]

And he can't hear him. But maybe he did hear on the night I go back. And so he did tape it up and he waited. And when that date came, which he knew, he knew what the date was because he said, he went, let me take a Look, does he tell him.

[Chris Carlin]

Though, that you get shot by Libyans because you bought plutonium?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Oh, no, probably because then he wouldn't have done it.

[Chris Carlin]

That's the only problem with it. We almost go too deep into it, where it changes decision making.

[Don La Greca]

Well.

[Chris Carlin]

And so in the end, all I knew is that I would need this bulletproof vest tonight. I don't know why, but I'm gonna wear it because this letter says so. That's all I'd need to know.

[Don La Greca]

Now, thinking about it, he. He taped the whole letter.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah.

[Don La Greca]

It didn't look like he taped just the ripped parts. He taped the whole. Almost laminated.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah.

[Don La Greca]

Which then suggests the fact that it was weathered. He didn't read it until the last minute.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But how do you. How do you know it could have been.

[Don La Greca]

Because if he read it right away and basically laminated, it wouldn't have aged.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Oh, good point.

[Chris Carlin]

What do you go back?

[Peter Rosenberg]

So 25. Maybe it stayed ripped up.

[Chris Carlin]

Do you remember?

[Peter Rosenberg]

No, no, no. It was 85 to 55.

[Don La Greca]

Right. And get ready to get sick to your stomach. More time has passed since the movie.

[Peter Rosenberg]

It's been 40.

[Don La Greca]

It's the 40th anniversary of the movie.

[Chris Carlin]

Don't they need to do another one?

[Don La Greca]

And we still have roads. That's ruined it. Where we're going.

[Chris Carlin]

We don't know.

[Don La Greca]

It's 2015. Plenty of roads. If you're flying around like that, you probably get shot down.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah, it's.

[Chris Carlin]

It's.

[Peter Rosenberg]

We got drones, but it's gonna be.

[Don La Greca]

Another 10 years before they're drones.

[Chris Carlin]

I think we got.

[Don La Greca]

People have reacted to the drones. Seeing a DeLorean fly. Somebody would have shot it out of the sky.

[Chris Carlin]

DeLorean had a moment.

[Don La Greca]

That movie is.

[Peter Rosenberg]

What's. What's the actual release date of the movie?

[Chris Carlin]

The release date? Yeah, I think it was. I don't know.

[Peter Rosenberg]

It's 85.

[Don La Greca]

Summer movie.

[Chris Carlin]

Yeah, that was definitely a summer block because the.

[Don La Greca]

Because that was a big movie.

[Chris Carlin]

That was in the midst of his, like, where he just was making movies every, like, six months.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, no, that's the start of it. It's July 30th.

[Chris Carlin]

Crazy July 30th. Yeah.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Some July 3rd.

[Chris Carlin]

Oh.

[Peter Rosenberg]

So we're coming up right now on 40 years.

[Don La Greca]

Wow.

[Chris Carlin]

Don't you think we need one where, like, I don't know if it's just a new one where you go back to.

[Peter Rosenberg]

And by the way, you still. Everyone's still around.

[Chris Carlin]

Well, you could be hard for. Be hard for Michael J. Fox.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I don't know. He does Stuff, though.

[Chris Carlin]

Yeah.

[Don La Greca]

I think the only one that passed away is his sister.

[Chris Carlin]

Really?

[Don La Greca]

She died of cancer, like 30 years.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Oh, really? Well, respectfully, though. Respectfully.

[Don La Greca]

I think we can get.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I think we can survive without the sister in the film.

[Don La Greca]

Billy Zane did very well. He was just like a. He's just one of the thugs in school. No, the one that hung around with Biff.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Right. That's one who bullied him. Billy Zane did quite well. Well, he's kind of fallen off for being honest, but. But he's the Titanic peak. There's peaks and valleys, and you don't want to know. An underrated zeman. I just gave it away. Underrated Billy Zane classic is Tales from the Crypt. Demon Knight. Have you ever seen Tales from the Crypt? Demon Knight?

[Don La Greca]

No, I've seen.

[Chris Carlin]

Neither of you have seen it? No.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Never seen Demon Knight?

[Chris Carlin]

Not in my wheelhouse.

[Don La Greca]

I saw Tales from the Crypt. I was a big. Tales from the Crypt.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But you saw that. You watched the show.

[Chris Carlin]

Yes.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But you never saw the film Demon Knight?

[Chris Carlin]

No.

[Peter Rosenberg]

With Jada Pinkett and Billy Zane?

[Chris Carlin]

No.

[Peter Rosenberg]

A strong recommendation. You will enjoy it. Okay, so I don't know if you will, Al, if you don't like any sort of, like, spooky.

[Chris Carlin]

It's not. Yeah, it's not.

[Peter Rosenberg]

It's not horror. It's not horror. It's. It's. It's like. It's. It's like from Dusk Till Dawn.

[Chris Carlin]

It's in that category. That's got my attention.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah.

[Chris Carlin]

All right. Now you got my attention. Okay.

[Don La Greca]

All right, let's get back to the phone. [phone]. The grister in Connecticut. You're not on Roseburg. What's up, man?

[Griff]

No, no. Are you. No, no, no.

[Chris Carlin]

Good.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Griff, how are you?

[Chris Carlin]

Hey, Griff.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Nope, no flies. No flies attacking you today.

[Don La Greca]

I hope he was attacked by a fly.

[Griff]

No, no. But it was a horse fly.

[Don La Greca]

Well, that makes.

[Chris Carlin]

Those are huge.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah, he was.

[Griff]

Yeah, we get. We get those up in our pool all the time. So I come back with bite. With bite marks on my legs.

[Chris Carlin]

Some lavender plant, some lavender around the pool.

[Griff]

Have your parents thank you for that advice.

[Chris Carlin]

No, seriously, you just go. Go get some lavender. Even in a pot. Just put around the pool. They don't like the lavender.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I hope you get some other Summer Griftster. That's what I'm going for.

[Don La Greca]

You need.

[Griff]

What I was saying, first off, what about the baseball and then about the switching. The last name that you were saying. Peter Allen. You ripped Carlos her Don for so long.

[Chris Carlin]

And then I was nice. I was so.

[Griff]

And then you were nice. And then he gives up by Ross. How about you keep being mean to him?

[Chris Carlin]

I'm on it. I'm on it. That's why I learned my lesson. I did Griff. I. Because he actually got off to a good start and then all of a sudden fell apart. I'm like, see, this is what I get. This is what I get.

[Griff]

Yep.

[Chris Carlin]

So that's it. He's gonna feel the wrath from now on.

[Griff]

That's good, because then I'll pitch.

[Chris Carlin]

Well, he was what, seven and owners. Last night starts. Everything was rolling well. And then. You get me. I'm the ultimate mush. I know it.

[Griff]

Peter, when you were saying about the daughter for Michelle Obama and I'm switching the last name, I understand why she is doing it. Because you always are under your father. You always be known as. Oh, well, your father was the president. Well, your father was this and that. And I think you. There's currently rahman for the U.S. woman's National Team that plays soccer. She's under her father's shadow all the time. Everybody, when you say Trinity Rahman, they'll be like, oh, you're talking about that. You're talking about Dennis Trauma.

[Chris Carlin]

True.

[Griff]

They always think she got to be who she was because of being under her father's shadow. So I understand why some people like to change their last name so you don't be in your father's shadow.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Although I feel like in the case of Dennis Rodman, it's almost like succeeding in spite of your father.

[Don La Greca]

Yeah, I would think there's parts to.

[Peter Rosenberg]

That, too, you know, Whereas the Obama thing is less the. Although, you know, you could argue with how psychotic our society is. There's also some safety things that may be better without going around with the name Obama all the time.

[Don La Greca]

But she still would get the Secret Service and everything.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Oh, yeah.

[Don La Greca]

People around her would know who she is. That's why I'm wondering, like, she's a writer.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yes.

[Don La Greca]

And they know publishers are going to be like, we need to.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, she. No, no, she's a writer for film and stuff. She's making. But either way, everyone in Hollywood's gonna know who she is.

[Don La Greca]

Yeah. And then it'd be, her name's Malia.

[Peter Rosenberg]

When they say, oh, Malia Ann, who's that?

[Don La Greca]

Well, they're gonna figure it out, too, because Angelina Jolie.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Go ahead. Her dad is Jon Voight.

[Don La Greca]

Jon Voight. She doesn't have Voight in her name. Everybody knows that. That's her dad. Right.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Touche.

[Don La Greca]

So, I mean, people, I know most people can get dumb at times, but collectively we can kind of figure things out.

[Peter Rosenberg]

No, we pull it together.

[Don La Greca]

We do pull it together, Sean. Down in Florida where they're known to pull it together. You're on ESPN New York. What's up, Sean?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Hey, guys.

[Don La Greca]

So, Alan, I need to know.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I'm freaking out about everything I hear with the Knicks and the coaching. It's coaching attached to players who's getting what. I really don't want to see this core get taken apart. Do you think Hart and. And Brunson are going to be able to at least stay together, if not any more of them?

[Chris Carlin]

I'd be stunned if Jalen Brunson's anywhere for the rest of his career. But I would say this. If they make the I'm going to keep going with the Jenga game. We take the wrong piece out, the whole thing could come down. And Jalen Brunson doesn't have to stay here if he doesn't like what he sees around him. I would keep that very much in mind. He has become. I'm saying he has become Patrick Ewing now. And Patrick Ewing several times threatened the organization when he wasn't happy about the direction. One of the reasons why they went and got Pat Riley way back in the day was because Ewing, who was in his prime at that moment, he was thinking about leaving. He didn't want to be around. He didn't feel like they were building a championship caliber team around him. And so this is where I would think Jalen Brunson would be at this point. He has done. All he's done is help you win. All he's done is set record, judge and comparing history. Jalen Brunson has done all these things and more. And so it is something I would make sure that whatever you're doing, he's involved in it.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah, he's showing completely that he actually cares about the Knicks. He cares about what he's doing.

[Chris Carlin]

He loves it here. He wants to win here. But if it's not going in the right direction and the Jenga pieces all fall to the ground, I would not put it past him to be like, you know what? Once my deal is, once I get to free agents, I'm out. Wouldn't shock me.

[Don La Greca]

We're going to talk about the Knicks a little bit later on. Not just the who is going to be the next head coach, but it just seems to be a lot of momentum building that this was a Dolan and Dolan only decision. We want to be able to retort that we've got an NFL binge coming up next, but just want to pass it along because much to chagrin of sometimes our pinhead suits.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Go ahead.

[Don La Greca]

This show is all about the music sometimes too. And we just found out that we lost Sly Stone of Sly in the Family. Stone really, really just passed away.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Just how old?

[Don La Greca]

82.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Wow.

[Chris Carlin]

So 82 is a run.

[Don La Greca]

No, it's a nice run, but still. And he was in a documentary recently and I was like, I didn't, I, I didn't remember, like, because you don't hear much about him. Like, was he still alive? And he ends up still passing away today at the age of, of 82.

[Peter Rosenberg]

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[Chris Carlin]

Race the sails.

[Don La Greca]

Raise the sails.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Captain, an unidentified ship is approaching.

[Chris Carlin]

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[Peter Rosenberg]

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[Chris Carlin]

Get started today at LinkedIn.com results.

[Peter Rosenberg]

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[Chris Carlin]

Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I didn't listen to anything you just said.

[Chris Carlin]

Catch the show on demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcasts. This is the NFL Binge.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Coming to you live from the studios here in the West Village, surrounded by everyone.

[Don La Greca]

Is that what this technically is? It's not Soho, whatever.

[Peter Rosenberg]

This.

[Chris Carlin]

This is SoHo. No.

[Don La Greca]

Well, you said West Village. I just want to know where I am.

[Peter Rosenberg]

It's. No, I mean, a block over is the West Village. I don't know.

[Chris Carlin]

What are you officially calling this, fellas? I thought this was Soho. I think it's Soho. It's south of Houston.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah, but south of Houston. A block west of us here, and that's called the West Village.

[Chris Carlin]

Isn't that more like northwest, north, west of us? West Village.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Maybe it's northwest, you know, right above Houston. Is that what you're saying?

[Chris Carlin]

Yeah.

[Peter Rosenberg]

So right above Houston, it becomes the West Village. Yeah, Right below it. It's immediately soho.

[Chris Carlin]

Yeah. I could be wrong. Those who know better than.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, either way, no matter.

[Chris Carlin]

Correct me.

[Peter Rosenberg]

No matter where we are, this is where you feel. You can feel the thrill when we're in here.

[Chris Carlin]

Oh, you just.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You feel the palpable. But look, take a look around.

[Chris Carlin]

If you think about it, we have the glass partition.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yes.

[Chris Carlin]

It's like at a hockey game where they just pressed up on the glass.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I know.

[Chris Carlin]

Waiting to hear every word.

[Peter Rosenberg]

They love having us here.

[Chris Carlin]

And the binge.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Oh, you kidding me? When they know about the NFL binge, people are visibly excited. All right, guys, let's get right into it. There's a lot happening in the world of foosball. Packers releasing Jair Alexander. Yeah, a guy surprising that they were very excited about. Two straight injury filled seasons have spelled the end for the once highly touted cornerback with the Packers. Packers informed Jair Alexander today that he.

[Chris Carlin]

Would be released for a minicamp.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah, that's right. He appeared in just seven regular season games each of the past two seasons and did not play after November 17th last year. But yeah, man, 2018 first round pick. He had two years remaining on his deal. $84 million contract extension that made him the highest paid cornerback in the NFL at the time that he signed it. The packers now will pick up more than $17 million in cap space.

[Chris Carlin]

You have packers president Mark Murphy, what he had to say.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I'd like to hear it.

[Chris Carlin]

And this is what we don't. I don't have audio, but I can tell you what he said. And this is. This is said about a lot of players the last four years. For Jair, it's about half the games he's been able to play. So we've kind of been used to it.

[Don La Greca]

Yeah, there you go.

[Chris Carlin]

And that's when you know our team has run out of patience with you.

[Don La Greca]

Right. And best availability is your best ability. You have the ability to get out of these bad.

[Chris Carlin]

Yeah, that's right. Yeah.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You guys want to hear the Colts head coach on Anthony Richardson?

[Chris Carlin]

Yeah.

[Peter Rosenberg]

And how about this? Either of you tells me the coach is the actual head coach of the Colts, I'll give you a crispy $20 bill.

[Chris Carlin]

It's not Shane Steichen anymore.

[Peter Rosenberg]

There you go.

[Chris Carlin]

You almost maybe guessed.

[Don La Greca]

I'm like, you gotta set us up.

[Chris Carlin]

Make a coaching change. Did they?

[Peter Rosenberg]

No. It's Shane Steichen still. Why would that be a trivia question? I wouldn't have. I didn't remember that.

[Chris Carlin]

Okay.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Don, you remember Shane Steichen? Of course.

[Don La Greca]

Because I was thinking of Saturday and then that was gone. And then it was Reich and then he. Like, I was just doing the math.

[Peter Rosenberg]

That's what I'm saying.

[Don La Greca]

Like, they go through them so quick.

[Peter Rosenberg]

It's not a legacy.

[Chris Carlin]

Reich was what, three years ago, Jeff did like the second half of the season just to close the deal. And in Steichen, they grabbed from what? Philly.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Oh, Stichen like you dream about. Here he is on Anthony Richardson. Last week in practice, Anthony sustained an injury in his throwing shoulder. Felt some pain in it. Doctors, trainers checked it out. He's got some aggravation in his AC joint. So we're gonna set him out this week. Obviously, he'll sit out for many camps. We'll see when he comes back. Not gonna put a timetable for training camp on it, but when he does come back, we'll ease him into throwing and then we'll go from there.

[Chris Carlin]

The good news is, sounds like a pitcher.

[Peter Rosenberg]

He's not gonna need a procedure right now.

[Chris Carlin]

This is also one of those things that if you're the Colts, you're probably starting to get impatient. And what does that mean for Daniel Jones? Right.

[Don La Greca]

Opportunity.

[Chris Carlin]

Isn't he the backup there?

[Peter Rosenberg]

That's right.

[Chris Carlin]

All right. So he can start.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah.

[Chris Carlin]

And if they're gonna go through this where Anthony Richardson is always hurt, something's always happening to him. DJ Might have signed with the right team.

[Peter Rosenberg]

All right. The glorious career of Aaron Rodgers takes its next stop in Pittsburgh. He will wear number eight like he did in New York. The 41 year old arrived at the facility in Pittsburgh two days after agreeing to terms to join the Steelers. And it's going to be a one year, $13.65 million deal. But let's hear from Jeremy Fowler on SportsCenter saying that Rodgers was actually interested in going to Minnesota.

[Chris Carlin]

Rodgers definitely had interest in playing for the Vikings. He was looking at playing for one of those elite type play callers like Kevin o' Connell. But the Vikings plan is clear. From what I'm told, they saw this as a three year window right now to win a championship with a really good quarterback they like on a rookie deal. They can build around him with some pieces. So they're going to go for it without Rodgers.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Officially. Now, isn't it funny? You wanted. You really would have wanted to do the exact farve.

[Don La Greca]

Yeah.

[Chris Carlin]

And yet they didn't. What do you think of this, by the way? He is wearing 8 like you said.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Sure.

[Chris Carlin]

12 is not officially retired by the Steelers. You know who wore 12? Terry Bradshaw, you know who just basically said we don't need Aaron Rodgers. That'd be if you're Rogers and you really wanted to troll. No, I want 12.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah. I'm feeling 12 these days. Guys.

[Chris Carlin]

I want to go back to 12.

[Peter Rosenberg]

It's not retired.

[Chris Carlin]

No. Unofficially retired, but not. Which is weird. Isn't that weird? I thought it was retired.

[Peter Rosenberg]

He was.

[Don La Greca]

Why wouldn't it be?

[Chris Carlin]

Like why would maybe. Do they not. They have a thing where they don't have.

[Don La Greca]

They might have like a ring of honor thing.

[Chris Carlin]

Like they don't retire numbers or something. I don't know. But. But from what I've seen, it is quote unquote, unofficially, they might.

[Don La Greca]

They must not retire numbers there's no way. Yeah, they've retired numbers and Terry Bradshaw's number wouldn't be retired.

[Chris Carlin]

But it's kind of funny that Bradshaw is the one that. That spoke out against Rogers coming to the Steelers and that's. That's his old number.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You know, it's one thing we didn't mention last week. Not or didn't really mention it.

[Chris Carlin]

Okay, what's that?

[Peter Rosenberg]

That the NFC east will have the distinct honor of having the mid season hard knocks this year. Should be pretty interesting.

[Don La Greca]

I'm good. The mid season ones.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, you. You say that because.

[Don La Greca]

I don't know.

[Chris Carlin]

I think we're so much going on that it's hard to find follow it. Right.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But don't you think part of it is we have been accustomed after 25 years or whatever it is to believing the preseason one that we know is the one. But when you think about it, the. The true point of interest is the mid season one.

[Don La Greca]

Well, that's like if your team's good.

[Peter Rosenberg]

If your team's good and competing at that point, that's not like must see tele.

[Don La Greca]

I. I guess so are you probably cringe watching it, just hoping something isn't said that's going to derail your season.

[Peter Rosenberg]

By the way, it never happens.

[Don La Greca]

No.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Like how often does hard knocks really mess up a team's.

[Chris Carlin]

No. Well, I mean it. There are.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Made the Giants look foolish.

[Chris Carlin]

Can I go back to the retired number thing? Because I just got curious enough to go down the rabbit hole.

[Don La Greca]

Yeah. I looked at myself.

[Chris Carlin]

Three numbers have been officially retired in Steeler history. Can you name at least two of them? Two.

[Peter Rosenberg]

32.

[Don La Greca]

Yes.

[Chris Carlin]

Frank.

[Don La Greca]

Oh, very nice.

[Peter Rosenberg]

And Bobby Brister. 6.

[Chris Carlin]

Famous commercial.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Famous commercial. Lip Swan.

[Chris Carlin]

No, no, they're bigger. This is a way bigger commercial.

[Don La Greca]

Think nickname.

[Peter Rosenberg]

No, I know, great nickname. It's. It's. It's. Is it a. Is it a nickname? Is it a commercial for Coke? Coke commercial.

[Chris Carlin]

Right. Wasn't it Coke? Yeah. Little kid. Little kid. Toss him a jersey. Oh, thanks. Says his nickname.

[Don La Greca]

This is troubling.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I don't. I'm having.

[Chris Carlin]

Listen, people are screaming at the ring. A color. Oh yeah. Or name a color.

[Peter Rosenberg]

What do you mean?

[Chris Carlin]

What was the color of the jersey Aaron Rodgers used to wear?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Oh, green.

[Chris Carlin]

There you go.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But I don't remember the number.

[Chris Carlin]

You don't have to know the number.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Okay, but that doesn't help. 75. Okay, 75 was gonna be my first guess. And yet I wouldn't remember.

[Don La Greca]

I know, but sorry we didn't trust you on this Subject.

[Peter Rosenberg]

All right, so mean Joe Green, 75.

[Chris Carlin]

Yep.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Frank O' Hara's 32.

[Chris Carlin]

Yes. And the last one. He was the last number retired in 2022. There's only three Ben's. No, no.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Why would they have retired one of the.

[Chris Carlin]

And it's somebody from way back in the day. Don, do you even know who Ernie Stauntner is?

[Don La Greca]

No, because he retired in 63. Before the Steelers were a thing. Steelers were like one of the most embarrassing franchises until the 70s came. And then they kind of found it.

[Peter Rosenberg]

They kind of did.

[Chris Carlin]

So they have jersey numbers that they aren't reissuing, but for some reason, they just won't retire. Roethlisberger is one of them. Bradshaw is one of them. Which. How does that mean? What is it, about 12? Really? You're not going to officially retire?

[Don La Greca]

I don't.

[Chris Carlin]

Terry Bradshaw.

[Don La Greca]

Listen, I'm sure if we looked at it, they probably just decided, and rightly so, because there's only so many numbers and it's 53 man roster, is to say we're just going to do the Ring of Honor.

[Chris Carlin]

Yeah, I guess.

[Don La Greca]

But if you already have three retired, then retire the rest of your hall.

[Chris Carlin]

Of fame in 2022. It's not like this was a thing we did back in the 70s and we realized we can't keep doing this like, big in Roethlisberger, Bradshaw, Jerome bettis. The bus 36. Palomalu.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah.

[Chris Carlin]

Lambert. Come on.

[Don La Greca]

Oh, they're Ward. Their names.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Chill on Heinz Ward. I don't know if Heinz Ward's getting.

[Don La Greca]

His number, but you know, you know, one that will surprise. There is one that might surprise you just because of the position. Gary Anderson. Oh, yeah, it is.

[Peter Rosenberg]

And it's.

[Don La Greca]

They have not.

[Chris Carlin]

Not.

[Peter Rosenberg]

They haven't reissued.

[Don La Greca]

They haven't. They haven't retired, but they haven't reissued.

[Chris Carlin]

Yeah. All right.

[Don La Greca]

More linebacker.

[Peter Rosenberg]

All right. Golden Tate was on busing with the boys.

[Don La Greca]

How about this?

[Peter Rosenberg]

And he relived his beef that you may remember when he was here with Jalen Ramsey.

[Golden Tate]

It was during the game, it was after the game. He was out there ready to go. And I was with the smoke, too. He ended up getting fined. I didn't get fined, but, man, that was a heated battle. And so, like, just so you guys have the backstory, him and one of my twin sisters have two children together. They went to the same high school. And we have two beautiful, beautiful, beautiful nieces, Brooklyn and Breland. And they were together. Now things happen within that relationship where I don't think my sister was done or treated the way she should have been treated. And when that happens, who you got to come see? You got to come see big bro. Right. I think I might have, like, made it public. Like, you know, he going to have to see me at some point, but it wasn't to the point where I was about to, like, fight him on the field or anything. And so I guess he took that personal. It could be we scrapping or we going to talk this out like two men, but I'm going to be ready for whatever happens.

[Chris Carlin]

Yeah.

[Golden Tate]

So he took that, and, you know, the media ran with it, like the big matchup. You know, we get to the game, and I'm like, I really don't know what's about to happen. But anyway, so we get out there, and right away, like, first one, he's, like, overly jamming me, and I'm like, okay, that's how we're going to do.

[Chris Carlin]

All right.

[Golden Tate]

I ain't cut. Block somebody in a minute. I start. I don't even like the block like that, but I end up, like, trying to cut his knees out, like, within the game. Completely legal.

[Chris Carlin]

Yeah, y' all just.

[Golden Tate]

And then I'm cutting him, and he's mushing my head into the dirt. But, like, at the same time, like, I'm mentally prepared. Like, whatever I do, I cannot cost my team a penalty or cost myself any money. So let. That's in my back pocket. I'm not going to do that.

[Chris Carlin]

Wow.

[Don La Greca]

I don't know what I would do.

[Chris Carlin]

How do we feel about this now? Because there are times. First of all, respect the fact that he knew. I can't take a. I can't take a penalty for my team ended up being a 17 9. Final score, Giants lost. But how do we feel about. Some of these beefs that you have between players are sometimes just silly, stupid.

[Don La Greca]

That's not silly.

[Chris Carlin]

This one is different. How do we feel about Golden Tate saying, you're going to have to go see big Bro. You treat. Treat my sister like this, and we happen to meet on the field. That's the next time we see each other. So. All right. Wherever. Wherever. Whenever.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, there's a lot.

[Chris Carlin]

How do we feel about.

[Peter Rosenberg]

There's a lot to think about. First of all, this is 2020.

[Chris Carlin]

Yeah.

[Peter Rosenberg]

So there's no one there for it.

[Chris Carlin]

Yeah.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You don't even have the energy of a stadium. Right. This is just. All the teams are there.

[Chris Carlin]

Okay.

[Peter Rosenberg]

The. I just watched an early play in the game. Oh, no, this is the four, actually. No, it's late in the fourth quarter, man, they threw a screen to Tate, and he just got absolutely rocked by Ramsey.

[Chris Carlin]

Yes.

[Peter Rosenberg]

The interesting part to me watching this.

[Chris Carlin]

And thinking, like, man, this is getting personal, because I didn't know the backstory at the time.

[Peter Rosenberg]

The part that I find interesting is that Ramsey had so much of a problem with Tate.

[Chris Carlin]

Yeah.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I. I guess there's part of the story we don't know.

[Don La Greca]

Yeah. See, there's always.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You never know. You never know what else exists there because you think it would really go one.

[Chris Carlin]

The brother towards Ramsey. Ramsey did talk about it previously, and he. His whole thing was. I get it. It's personal for him, and I understand he goes, but sometimes you got to mind your damn business. So I think he probably said, you're getting into my business, and this has nothing to do with you, which is family. It does.

[Don La Greca]

Yeah, but. But it's your sister, and you're gonna side with your sister. So I would think you do everything you can during the course of the game because you don't want to cost your team the game.

[Chris Carlin]

Right.

[Don La Greca]

But then after the game, oh, forget.

[Chris Carlin]

All bets are off.

[Don La Greca]

Let's go.

[Chris Carlin]

Yeah. So we side with Golden Tate on this.

[Don La Greca]

Well, with the information that we have.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, you know, we should do. I just want to send one of our guys here. Will just go scan through Jalen Ramsey's entire hour that he did on the Pivot a couple years ago. I'm sure it came up, but it's in the title. Jalen Ramsey on Super bowl win, Golden Tate feud, blah, blah, blah. So I'd be curious to. Now maybe at some point we can hear a clip from Ramsey back on it. If looking back, if all he says.

[Don La Greca]

Is, mind your damn business business, then I'm gonna side with. With Tate. I got one more information.

[Chris Carlin]

One quote where he said Ramsey said in that podcast, your Pivot podcast you're talking about.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah.

[Chris Carlin]

On site. We knew what we was gonna do. I mean, that's his sister. That's what he's supposed to do, too. But you mind your business, too. This is me too, now. So that's the key quote out of that interview. Your sister.

[Don La Greca]

It is your business.

[Chris Carlin]

Yeah.

[Don La Greca]

What was the drop? Golden State or Golden State?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Warrior was Golden Tate, comma warrior. That is what that came from, right?

[Chris Carlin]

I think it did. Yeah.

[Don La Greca]

I've not heard that in a long time. I'm probably not in the system.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Michael was very proud of that, of coming up with the phrase Golden Tate, comma warrior, and that will do it for your NFL.

[Chris Carlin]

Really good.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You know it's a fun. That's a really good we covered news, we covered drama. We give you what you want here on Don Han and Rosenberg.

[Chris Carlin]

All right.

[Don La Greca]

We want to comma warrior say it this way. He said it too. Was like he just invented the wheel.

[Peter Rosenberg]

He's very proud.

[Don La Greca]

1-800-919-3776. Want to talk a little Knicks? The game last night I just saw in baseball. We got a fun show taking up until 7 o' clock, 6 o' clock. We've got what I'm assuming is an amazing Ian and the first of them.

[Chris Carlin]

You can only assume like you dream about it.

[Don La Greca]

It's all happened here on Don Han and Rosenberg on 880 ESPN New York and the ESPN New York.

[Chris Carlin]

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[Don La Greca]

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[Chris Carlin]

Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I didn't listen to anything you just said.

[Chris Carlin]

Catch the show on demand with whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcasts.

[Don La Greca]

I gotta ask Alan because, you know, he's in the know. All I get this weekend was a big turn of events with a lot of reports that this. The firing of Thibodeau or Thibodeau was all on Dolan. Overreaction by Dolan. Dolan doing the same thing he always does, overreacting and went over everybody's head.

[Chris Carlin]

The Yahoo Report.

[Don La Greca]

The Yahoo Report really fueled it. But there's a lot of people that just their opinion. Chris Russo was on First Take screaming about this is all Dolan.

[Chris Carlin]

It's just the way everybody goes.

[Don La Greca]

I mean, it's a great way to.

[Chris Carlin]

Bet if you look at the history, of course.

[Don La Greca]

But I just. So all weekend, I'm like, I want to get on the air on Monday. I want to talk to Alan on, you know, how much is true, how much is false, how much is just assumption of how it went down. I mean, if you had to give me one person that had something to do with his firing.

[Chris Carlin]

One person.

[Don La Greca]

Yeah, because I know it's. Everything's collaborative, but if there's a point man, if there's somebody that generated the conversation, somebody that was in the room that wanted it more than everybody else, is it Dolan? Leon Rose seemed like he. He was totally on Tibbs side.

[Chris Carlin]

Leon Rose was on the side of continuity.

[Don La Greca]

Right. So he wants to keep.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But he also loves Tibbs, but.

[Chris Carlin]

Well, he does. Yeah, that's his guy, of course. But he also knows what comes with Tom Thibodeau as a coach. It's five years now. You do hit that sort of shelf life. That's just been the thing. So I think there's a lot of things that when you're around it every day, like these guys are the stuff you see every day. It just starts to build up. And I. Like I said I've told you guys, like, there has been this building up when it comes to Tibs and how far he can take a team and all that. Stuff. And it's like, there are some people in the organization that, like, I could give you that one name. It's not Dolan, but I'm not gonna give it to you because it doesn't do me any good to give you that name.

[Don La Greca]

Okay?

[Chris Carlin]

It's not a name anybody really would know.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Okay.

[Chris Carlin]

But it's somebody that has, you know, has influence. And to me, it starts there, and it's somebody has the ear of the players or. I'm sorry, it's somebody. The players have his ear. Okay? So with that in mind, I think I said this last week. I will steadfast stand on business on this. The players ultimately decided this. Those exit interviews that the owner was involved in, Dolan sat in on these. He asked the questions because he wanted to know. Tell it to me straight. And, you know, a lot of times when you talk to the boss and the boss asks you about somebody you were. Are you really going to go unfiltered with the. With the ball? You're going to do that? Or are you going to be like, no, no, he's fine. Oh, he's good, right? Like you're.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Or. But I could go the other way with it. I don't look at the other way, though. Point is, when you get the sense the boss already has an inkling of something, unless you feel incredibly convicted to fight the other way.

[Chris Carlin]

Remember, though, you might roll with them.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Like, ah, here.

[Chris Carlin]

It's not like a typical place where if I say the wrong thing, I get fired. Because this is the NBA. You got.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You have a contract. Right?

[Chris Carlin]

It's. It's more or less like, you ask a question about coaching, you're getting an honest answer from several places. And if the majority rules, you understand. All right, well, I don't want to fire this guy mid season. Like, if we go into next year and the same problems come up and now we're starting to get the malaise of. Towards the end of the year, were they losing them? Did the playoffs cause it? And then we go into next season, and yet the players are sort of going like, here we go again. And now it's like December, and I got to make a coaching change mid season, which is always the worst time to do it. Then what the hell are we doing? Do it now.

[Don La Greca]

Right?

[Chris Carlin]

And I truly am telling you, that seemed to be the greater motivation than. I can't stand this guy. I hate his face. Get him out of here. I don't care what anybody tells me. I don't think it's. I don't care what anybody tells me. It's. Listen, if this is going to just be a problem, why are we going to wait till midseason? Let's just do it now and start fresh.

[Don La Greca]

The thing is, Jim Dolan, the players.

[Chris Carlin]

Had a lot to say about it.

[Don La Greca]

But that answers the question right there, because the idea that it was all Jim Dolan. Well, Jim Dolan doesn't have to talk.

[Chris Carlin]

Like acting by himself.

[Peter Rosenberg]

He can do.

[Don La Greca]

He could do whatever he wants. The owner of the team, he's the one eating the $30 million.

[Chris Carlin]

Right.

[Don La Greca]

So you can just tell everybody, listen, he's gone. Yeah, but he obviously valued the opinions of the people around him. So obviously Wesley had. Something was in his ear. Maybe that's how it all started.

[Chris Carlin]

Well, all right, so that's the, that's the, that's the name William Wesley.

[Don La Greca]

Well, you, because you had said that he, that there were reports that he was.

[Chris Carlin]

He's the guy that the players confide in. Players confide.

[Peter Rosenberg]

That's a big name.

[Chris Carlin]

And there's a guy that, when you hear enough from the players, like, you just start going like, you know, the guys aren't really thrilled. Well, they haven't said anything publicly. Well, then I say, they're telling me. And then when it gets to a point where it's like, the more it starts to happen, the more it's like, I told you, guys aren't really happy.

[Don La Greca]

And that was on the rail.

[Chris Carlin]

Start to listen more.

[Don La Greca]

Now the question is, when did that conversation happen? For all we know, it could have happened after the Pacer series last year. Right. It could go like. So the idea is that for people out there to understand it was in the air, just like it was in the air for the fans, because every time, oh, and they lose when they lost game five to the Pistons, man, if they lose, if they blow this series, then he's going to be fired. You know, when they, when they won the first two games against Boston, then Boston wins big in game three. Hey, if they blow this man, he's.

[Chris Carlin]

Going to be out.

[Don La Greca]

That was probably the conversations. But if Dolan was acting like a lot of fans say, well, typical Dolan flying off the handle, then there would have been no conversation with the players. He would have just been gone. Yeah, but he. Because the other thing was, is that he was never a big fan of Tibbs to begin with. I don't know that. Who knows? But the point is he was open to it. And it wasn't like the players went to. Dolan said, boss, can I Talk to you. We got to get rid of the head coach.

[Chris Carlin]

No.

[Don La Greca]

Dolan asked them, and they're like, all right, yeah, I think we could do better. I think it would probably be a good idea to let him go.

[Chris Carlin]

It's pretty amazing how honest the players were.

[Don La Greca]

Not as people make it out to be. Like, it was just typical Dawn. He's out of a job. There was a lot to it. Nobody demanded it. It was collaborative. Everybody contributed. And it sounded like maybe the only person that had Tibbs back was Leon.

[Chris Carlin]

Rose and Jalen Brunson.

[Don La Greca]

Yeah, most likely, but. And just think about how powerful I.

[Chris Carlin]

Would put Josh Hart in that category. Mitchell Robinson, I would put in that category.

[Don La Greca]

You're naming a lot of pretty important people that had Tibbs back and yet still wasn't enough. So that's why it creates the old Dolan acting rogue. It sounded like Dolan did his due diligence now and made a call.

[Chris Carlin]

I will. I think there's more to this story that will start to come out that has nothing to do with Tibbs and has nothing to do with the decision there. It has more to do with the direction and what. What they want to come next.

[Don La Greca]

Right.

[Chris Carlin]

And that's the big swing for the fences, for Giannis, for all of it. Like, can I?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Can I.

[Chris Carlin]

Being a runner up, getting the. Hey, we had the best season 25 years, and everybody that's involved knows, you know, last 25 years, that's not saying much. So I think it's more like, what are we playing for? Are we playing to just have the best season 25 years, or are we trying to actually get the Larry o' Brien in this freaking building and raise it up finally? And that's, I think, where the frustration started to mount. Do we just want to be an also rank. Hey, you finished, right? Do you want to be a place finisher, or do you want to win the damn thing? And that takes a lot of, like. That reaches a point where you kind of run out of the patience of the continuity part of it. If this is as good as it's ever going to get, then we need to do better.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I asked the question last week, and I think it's even looking more now. Like, there is an unpleasant answer to that question. And the question I asked Don was, is Dolan becoming that guy again? Are we going from, oh, Dolan's out. He has people who are controlling everything. He's not involved. It's like the Rangers now. He's not involved with basketball decisions. And you guys know I Have a lot of experience with ownership like this and how these guys tend to be. What scares me about this whole thing, whether it's that he wants Giannis or whether. I'm hearing. I'm hearing they don't like Tibbs, I think we should move on there. It sounds to me like we're teetering on. Dolan wants to have his hands in things a bit. That is a scary proposition, Potentially terrifying.

[Chris Carlin]

If you're a Nick fan, I get what you're saying, but wants his hands in it, I'm telling you, is something that he has several times on the record said. He doesn't want to say it.

[Peter Rosenberg]

They all say it.

[Chris Carlin]

But there are times where you see something and realize, you know, we're not here to just stay afloat. You know, like, it's. It gets to a point where it's like, hey, this is the best it's ever been. Shouldn't we be satisfied? And I'm the one who said, enjoy this time, because this is the best of times right now. But just like Pre Dolan 30 years ago, it was the same approach that Dave Check it's had. We're not here to finish second. We're trying to do something that hasn't been done here in a long time, and that means being aggressive and taking swings and going for it. And if we don't feel like this is the right way to go, we know we gotta move on or we gotta make changes. That's the urgency that I think I'm talking about. That goes to what I'm saying. The metaphor of the Jenga game. One false move and it all falls down.

[Don La Greca]

But my biggest problem with this whole thing is, are they really that kind of. I know conference finals suggest you're close, but that's only halfway. You got to win that, and then you got to go and win in the finals. What did Wayne Gretzky always say? There's four seasons, there's a preseason, there's the regular season, there's the playoffs, and then there's the final, like. So, yeah, it looks like you're close. The jets thought they were close in 09 in 2010. Hey, we went to the championship game. We're one step away from the Super Bowl. You got to win that game, and then you got to win the Super Bowl.

[Chris Carlin]

Right? But what they also do. False move, right? After that year, they had to replace a lot of older players, and they did not. They didn't draft well. Like, they were mistakes.

[Don La Greca]

They made mistakes, but they realized that we're not as close we got to make, we got to make moves. They made the wrong moves. But, you know, that's not like you just lost the NBA finals in game seven.

[Chris Carlin]

No, but that's a long way to go, right? 94, you lost in game seven. The problem was, is that sometimes when you look at your team and you see, like, was this as good as this team can be? That's what you're trying to figure out, or was there more in this team? And that's when you look at the coach and say, the coach didn't get enough out of what we had.

[Don La Greca]

Okay?

[Chris Carlin]

And that's what I think some of the players felt.

[Don La Greca]

And. But the players start asking them enough.

[Chris Carlin]

Out of this team.

[Don La Greca]

But here's the problem. You start asking players, you don't ask coaches, right? Because coaches are gone.

[Chris Carlin]

Oh, they're always tell you, right?

[Don La Greca]

But the players, they're not going to say, we're not good enough. Don't we always have that conversation? Why they always say, oh, we didn't bring it tonight, man. They wanted it more than we did. Because no player ever wants to say, it's on me. I'm not good enough. So you're asking, but the players could be part of the problem. We don't have a good enough roster to win a championship. You ask the players, they're not going to say that. They're not going to go say, get rid of Kat. He's not good enough. Or Brunson's going to say, get me a better bench. They're all going to be one for all for one. The Kumbaya, right?

[Chris Carlin]

That's all they say.

[Don La Greca]

The point to the coach, what I'm saying is, is the roster good enough? And then that points to Leon Rose. Is he good enough to be able to create a roster? I believe he is. But all these people, he. And how, no matter how you slice it, Allen, he, Tibbs is the scapegoat because the next coach might come in here and it could get worse or stay the same. And then you realize players again. The Rangers were just saying that just the other day, right?

[Chris Carlin]

Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast. I don't want to know how the sausage is made, man. I just want to know it's good. Hear more of Don Allen and Peter weekday afternoon starting at 3 on 8 80, ESPN, the ESPN New York app, and your smart speakers.