← Don, Hahn & Rosenberg
Don, Hahn & Rosenberg
Hour 2: Kendrick Perkins & The NFL Binge
00:51:04
Don, Hahn & Rosenberg on ESPN NY
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- [00:01]
Peter Rosenberg
Monster Energy.
- [00:02]
Don Hahn
Everybody knows White Monster, Zero Ultra, that's
- [00:05]
Peter Rosenberg
the og it kicked off this whole
- [00:07]
Commercial/Announcer
Zero Sugar energy drink thing. But Ultra is a whole lineup now.
- [00:12]
Don Hahn
You've got Strawberry Dreams, Blue Hawaiian Sunrise, and Vice Guava.
- [00:16]
Commercial/Announcer
And they all bring the Monster Energy punch.
- [00:19]
Peter Rosenberg
So if you've been living in the
- [00:20]
Don Hahn
White can branch out.
- [00:22]
Peter Rosenberg
Ultra's got a flavor for every vibe
- [00:25]
Don Hahn
and every single one is Zero Sugar Tap the banner to learn more. This is the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.
- [00:34]
Alan Hahn
That sounds like heaven to me.
- [00:36]
Don Hahn
Listen live weekday afternoon starting at 3 on 880 ESPN, the ESPN New York app and your smart speakers 5 o'
- [00:44]
Alan Hahn
clock in the big city. Don Hahn and Rosenberg hanging out with you until 7 o'.
- [00:48]
Don Hahn
Clock.
- [00:48]
Alan Hahn
We got ENN coming up at 6 as well, but Kendrick Perkins nice enough to join us here on a snowy Monday. And I've got a throw out a thank you because you gave us plenty of content last week with your stuff on the Knicks and Brunson, but it's always fun to have you on. Thank you for joining us.
- [01:05]
Kendrick Perkins
Appreciate y' all having me. Man, look, I feel sorry for y' all lost dealing with the snow up there, man, you know, I mean, I wish y' all was down here in Houston.
- [01:14]
Don Hahn
Yeah, give me the temp right now. Perk. What do we got?
- [01:18]
Kendrick Perkins
It's 62.
- [01:19]
Don Hahn
Yeah. All right. I'll tell you what. I was saying this. When I was shoveling out for the second time in about three weeks, I said I can't wait to complain about humidity.
- [01:35]
Alan Hahn
Yeah. Before you know it, we'll be complaining about how hot it is. And the Knicks, I thought, bounced back nicely. That was a tough loss against Detroit. And that's a problem perk. I mean, they can't seem to get over that hump, but nice. Come from behind, win against Houston, win the second of back to backs against Chicago. How do you, how do you feel about them right now? This gauntlet, 10 games, they're two one coming out of the All Star break. How do you feel about how they bounce back after Detroit?
- [02:01]
Kendrick Perkins
Well, I still got confidence in the Knicks. It's all about though, are they going to continue to cook with the same ingredients? They have the recipe. The recipe is if the big fella is happy in Karl Anthony Towns and he's satisfied, you're going to get the best version of KO Anthony Towns. And I always say this, and I'm going to say it again, Jalen Brunson, yes, we all know is special. He's the best player on the team. Karl Anthony Towns is the Most important player on that basketball squad. He go the Knick goes as far as he takes them. Meaning if he's engaged and he's getting his touches and he's feeling good, he's going to give you everything. And more defensively now his now his head is in the right space. And so what we've seen over these last three games is him get those touches. Him, he's playing with that passion. And all of a sudden we see him rocking the hard hat in the Timbs after the game because they have crowned him with defensive player of the game. If the Knicks are going to continue with this recip and they continue to ride car Anthony Towns and involve him and love on him, then the sky's the limit.
- [03:22]
Don Hahn
Who does that? Whose responsibility is that? Perk? Or maybe who's got the most responsibility for that? Is it Mike Brown or is it Jalen Brunson?
- [03:32]
Kendrick Perkins
It's both. It's 50. 50. It's both, man. I mean, you know, Mike Brown is the one that, you know is his offense, you know, and it's on him to, to let people know it's a pecking order, right? It's Jalen Brunson first, call Anthony Town second. It's not Jalen Brunson first and then call Anthony Towns, Mikhail Bridges and Og Anunoby all on the same page. It's too many times that I didn't watch the Knicks play and I didn't watch Mikhail, Mikhail Bridges and Og Anoby be more offensive, aggressive or have the balls ball in their hands more than Corey Anthony Towns. That should never happen. And then it's also on Jalen Brunson as the point guard to know that, hey, hold on, we done went two, three possessions and I haven't got the big fellow touch in the position that I feel like he needs the ball to put him in position to be successful. So it's 50, 50 because it's one thing for Mike Brown to tell the team, but it's another thing while they're on the floor for Jalen Bronson to have the awareness to say, hold on, we got to get the big fella involved. Because I know if I have him involved, I know he's going to be the best version of himself and that's going to help us win. See, Doc Rivers used to trick me all the time. He used to run the first play of the game for Perk. Not Ray, not Paul, not kg. He ran it for me and he would give me an easy bucket and it will make me feel good. But that was the only touch I would get. But damn it, I felt involved. So now, you know, Purg is going, going to go out there and set hard ball screens. I'm gonna go out there and number defend at a high level. So you got to play those games within the game.
- [05:19]
Peter Rosenberg
How, how scary is the proposition perk in the east of the Celtics doing what they're doing and Tatum somehow finding a way back this year?
- [05:29]
Kendrick Perkins
Oh, it's very scary. They're the most dangerous team in the NBA. Imagine this and it, I'm trying to make sense of it, but it really don't make sense. But bear with me. Imagine being number two in the Eastern Conference, having a guy that's up for coach of the year. And Joe Missoula had the best two way player in the game. And Jalen Brown, because no other player in the league is doing what he's doing. He's top five in scoring and he's top five defensively. He's also in the running for winning the mvp. Might be the front runner right now. I believe he is. And having all that championship experience, right? Derrick White Houser, Peyton Pritchard, all of those guys in that system know how to play the game at a high level and win at a high level. And you playing with house money. They have no expectations. The Boston Celtics have no pressure whatsoever on this season to win the championship. Nobody thought that they were going to be here. So imagine a team with all that I just told you that are legit title contenders and still have no pressure and no expectations whatsoever. If they get bounced in the first round, nobody's gonna say nothing. They had a successful season because everybody thought that they were going to be in the play in tournament or out the playoffs.
- [06:54]
Alan Hahn
So Mike Brown takes over for Tibbs. How, how different is it with the coach? Do you feel better with Brown at the helm? How much different would it look if Tibbs kept his job?
- [07:06]
Kendrick Perkins
Well, I think the one thing that we know about Tibbs is that we never questioned a Tom Thibodeau led team whether or not they was going to play hard and compete. I think too many times we turn on the game and watch the Knicks play and they're not competing every possession. That's a problem. I think Mike Brown is a hell of a coach. But again it's about, it's about maxing out guys and having them give max effort on both sides of the ball. We know that they could score points. They had the offensive firepower to do so. But picking up Jose at the trade Deadline was probably arguably the biggest pickup in basketball.
- [07:55]
Don Hahn
Why is that?
- [07:57]
Kendrick Perkins
Well, because he brings a certain type of edge. He brings that tenacity that you, that you want and he brings that life. He's already probably a fan favorite already in New York. He's a, he's the guy. He's a guy that when, when they don't have it, you know, one thing about it, whether he's make or missing shots, he's going to bring that energy that you need him to bring and that's gonna be that spark. Without him, they don't come back on the Rockets.
- [08:27]
Don Hahn
That's right.
- [08:27]
Kendrick Perkins
And we gotta remember, think about that game. I believe it was in Philly that he had. It was kind of his like, welcome to New York moment.
- [08:37]
Don Hahn
Yes.
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Kendrick Perkins
But it was on the road right before the All Star break. He's just a ball of energy, man. And certain players like that you just gotta have when you're trying to compete. We had one that, you know, after we won a championship, we took him for granted and he went on to another destination because we didn't want to pay him. And that was James Posey.
- [08:56]
Alan Hahn
Yep.
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Kendrick Perkins
We saw the Thunder last year. They. They had one in Alice Caruso. And so when you think about what Jose brings to the table, man, it's just some majority of the time, the stuff that he's going to bring is not going to show up in the stat sheet, but it's going to show up in the atmosphere, in the air, if that makes sense.
- [09:15]
Don Hahn
And perk. He also had a, had a game in Boston, Super Bowl Sunday. They also thought was like, impactful. What he did and what you're seeing Mike Brown do is play him Even though he's 6 foot with Jalen Brunson, who's 62 in the backcourt, you know, you're dangerously small, but there's just something about what he brings. The feistiness, the toughness, and the ability to dribble to handle the basketball that frees up Brunson. And that's something that, you know, Don alluded to this and because we talked about it after we heard you say it, I know you've been a fan of Jalen Brunson for years and you have talked him up. And I love when you say big body Brunson. Like, I love that you refer to him as such because he plays that way, but.
- [10:00]
Kendrick Perkins
Right.
- [10:01]
Don Hahn
You said, and just correct us if, if we got this wrong, but you believe that if the Knicks can win a championship with him and he gets that ring that he Would be among. You said the top three all time Knicks.
- [10:18]
Kendrick Perkins
Yeah, no, I said I believe he'd be the greatest Knick of all time.
- [10:22]
Alan Hahn
You think he's top three now and would become the greatest all time if he won?
- [10:26]
Kendrick Perkins
Yo, crazy.
- [10:28]
Don Hahn
All right, so the. So you know, there's guys that have won two championships, including the Great Wall, Clyde Frazier, who's still with us. Yeah, yeah, right. Like, so what would make. I just want to know why you'd say that. Because you must. I know you, and I know how much you know Brunson. Like, there's got to be a compelling argument that you're going to make for it. Give it to me.
- [10:47]
Kendrick Perkins
Well, because it's not. It's not all about what you do, is how you do it. It's how you do it. And name me, maybe outside of stealth, Isaiah Thomas, that, you know, a team has been led by a small guard for us winning the championship. And the last time New York won the championship was in the Month of Neverwear. That's how long it's been. I wasn't even born the last time they even won the championship. Yeah, it did. But what I'm saying is it's how it's getting done. Like, it's who he is. It's the story. It's where you come from, like, you know, being, you know, coming from Dallas, you know, the criticism of the Knicks got when they signed them doing free agency. My. My brother Stephen A. He had to backtrack because he wanted Donovan Mitchell. And all of a sudden they got Jalen Brunson in. And now Jalen Brunson has embodied. You talking about New York, the. Arguably the hardest place in the world to play in with the media. The way that you're under a microscope and you go out and you deliver championship. Him at that size at 6:2, you go and deliver a championship to the Mecca in. In 2026. What are we talking about?
- [12:11]
Don Hahn
Yeah, so you can. The context of what you're saying is less about, like, the greatness of a player versus and the accomplishment of a championship. You would say with the resume.
- [12:22]
Kendrick Perkins
No, the story matters.
- [12:25]
Don Hahn
Yeah, okay.
- [12:25]
Kendrick Perkins
The story. The story matters in everything, Right? Like, you know, we could go down the line to, you know, and it's at a smaller scale, but we could look at the story of a Russell Westbrook, right? We look at him as one of the greatest point guards to ever play the game. Yes, he averaged triple doubles, but we wouldn't talk about that if he didn't have an MVP on this belt. He won the mvp and I believe the, the Thunder was a six seed. And the reason that he won the MVP was because not only did he have a triple double, because James Harden in that year was averaging 36 and the Rockers was one of the top seeds in the east in the Western Conference. But it's the story KD left that everybody thought the Thunder was left for dead. And Russell Westbrook said, hold tight, watch me take over. So sometimes, yes, I get it and I don't never want to disrespect the greats, but it's the story behind it. Jalen Brussel wasn't a lottery pick.
- [13:23]
Don Hahn
Right.
- [13:23]
Kendrick Perkins
He wasn't supposed to be here. We're not supposed to be talking about him the way that we're talking about his story matters.
- [13:31]
Alan Hahn
And Burg is somebody who used to come here as an out of town player. What kind of disadvantage are the Knicks in that they've got a target on their back and yet haven't won. It seems like when a New York team is good, seems like there's more pressure on them than in other places that people ratchet it up more. Coming to the Garden, did you feel that way when you played?
- [13:54]
Don Hahn
No.
- [13:55]
Kendrick Perkins
So apparently you haven't, you haven't been in Boston. It's pressure. It's pressure. Look, it's like when you, when you enter that, that, when you enter that, that room of being a title contender in any big market team, but especially in New York, especially in Boston, especially la, is, is you're gonna be under that microscope. It's gonna come with pressure. Right. And it's just part of it. And that's why I say, you know, for a guy to, to carry that weight on his shoulders at 6:2, but he really got the heart of a 6, 8 guy. That's why I call him Big Body Brussels. It, I mean, you know, it's part of the game.
- [14:39]
Alan Hahn
But you did mention, you were talking about Boston though earlier, that there's no pressure because they didn't have Tatum. Right, right.
- [14:46]
Kendrick Perkins
But, but that's, but that's different though. That's different. The Knicks came into the season with expectations. The new, in my opinion, have the deepest roster in the Eastern Conference. The Knicks check all the boxes. When you talk about being having the complete roster, that's not that that wasn't the case.
- [15:06]
Alan Hahn
I know, but my, my opinion, and I could be wrong, but I've lived in New York all my life and I wonder if Alan, who also has lived in New York all his life, would agree the picture you painted about the Celtics that there's no pressure on, they can get bounced in the first round even under the same circumstances. I don't think anybody would ever accept a Nick team getting bounced in the first round because that's the expectation that unfortunately seems to happen here in New York. Maybe it's because of the Yankees or whatever. It doesn't seem like we give a pass to our team.
- [15:39]
Kendrick Perkins
Well, well, well, you. That's. Because when the. When y' all close and y' all have a team that's. That's. That. That really have a legit shot. Because because of the drought of not winning the championship, you damn right people should overreact in New York,
- [15:58]
Don Hahn
and we do. As you've seen the 7th Avenue. I'm saying. I'll tell you what.
- [16:03]
Alan Hahn
Exactly.
- [16:04]
Don Hahn
It's. It's. It's something that no one apologizes for. Perk. I've always said out of the contenders in the east and the West, I've said this year about the Knicks that they have. To me, it's the widest gap between their best and their worst. Right. What they can be, their potential to me, is just the biggest gap. If you're talking about them as a team that can win and you just said they're the deepest team in the east, tell me what it is about them that would be the reason why they could win a championship this year. What is it?
- [16:38]
Kendrick Perkins
Because of the depth. The depth that they have. That was. That was the only knock on them last year, and they wouldn't address those issues. Like, I. I love. I love Mitchell Robinson accepting his role, coming in off the bench.
- [16:54]
Alan Hahn
You. You.
- [16:55]
Kendrick Perkins
We just talked about, you know, adding Jose, what they did at the trade deadline. I believe Jordan Clarkson will have his moment in the postseason. I'm a huge fan of Kohli, and I just think they have the depth now. Well, you're not relying heavy on the starters anymore.
- [17:16]
Don Hahn
It's a big part of it. It's a way to get through a long run.
- [17:21]
Peter Rosenberg
So as we sit at this moment, Perk more than half the season. Done. All Star break is over. Knicks are sitting at 37 and 21. What is the bar for you for a successful season where anything less than that, you got to consider it a failure?
- [17:38]
Kendrick Perkins
Oh, for the Knicks, yeah, they got to get to the NBA Finals. If they don't, it's a failed season. And the crazy part is right now, I got Detroit picked to win the east, but I wouldn't be surprised if the Knicks get there. But from this Sample size, what we've seen in this regular season, if they match up with. Feel like Detroit got their number. But anything could happen in the postseason. But in that locker room, in that city, that fan base, anything short of reaching the promised land is a failed season.
- [18:14]
Alan Hahn
That's just crazy. Do you see what could be different in the postseason for the Knicks to beat the Pistons?
- [18:21]
Kendrick Perkins
There just. I mean, it's going to have to be a mindset. But again, I feel like don't take it for granted. The season. I strongly believe that the Knicks need to, they need to finish second or third. Don't, don't. Don't make it. Well, you know, you have to be in that fourth to fifth spot and see Detroit in the second round. It's a lot that goes into winning four seven game series. And a big part of it is health. Some of. In a lot of it is, look, and who knows, maybe just because Detroit got the Knicks number, that don't mean that, don't mean that somebody else may not have Detroit number.
- [19:05]
Alan Hahn
Mm.
- [19:06]
Don Hahn
That's. That's what you're hoping for, right? Like, and that's why you gotta be in the 2, 3. Avoid that force away from having to see them in the second round. Plus, you know what, you know this from experience. The air gets thinner the deeper you go in the playoffs, Right. And when you're a younger team that hasn't been there, who knows if a conference finals might, you know, just might be a little bit harder to take a deep breath for a team like that. You never know.
- [19:28]
Kendrick Perkins
You never know.
- [19:31]
Alan Hahn
Well, listen, enjoy being in Houston and 62 degrees and all that. We'll ship some of the snow. We can get rid of it. We'll ship it to you.
- [19:41]
Peter Rosenberg
Thank you.
- [19:42]
Don Hahn
Appreciate you.
- [19:42]
Alan Hahn
All right. It's always good to talk to Kendrick Perkins. He kind of pulled the plug on our argument about Brunson, where he's just like, listen, I wasn't alive, so I can't, I can't argue about the Fraziers.
- [19:51]
Don Hahn
I get what, you know, you know, I think I get what he was saying. Right. The point I think he was making was, is just consider where he came from to become what he's become for this team in a short period of time. Again, four years. And so to get to be able to be the main player on a championship team. Now, again, he's right. Brunson's not win a championship if Carl Anthony Towns isn't playing at a high level and he's not getting contributions from the supporting cats that they've built with a team that he believes is the deepest in the East. So he, it's not like he'd. He'd be the singular reason they win, but he's. We all recognize him as the best player. Right. So I do think, though, that he sees it as that and how in a new generation, 50 something years later, they'll sort of be this acknowledgment of what he did now compared to, you know, what happened all those years ago. Some people would like we brought the Messier comp.
- [20:54]
Alan Hahn
Right.
- [20:54]
Don Hahn
The last time the Rangers won the cup before him was in 1940. Most people couldn't name one player off that team in 1940.
- [21:02]
Alan Hahn
No.
- [21:03]
Don Hahn
And that's just so. I don't know how many, you know, two generations full of fans who might of course know Clyde because he's on the broadcast all the time, but have very little thought of anybody else that was on those teams. Whether that's right or wrong, it's.
- [21:21]
Alan Hahn
It's unfortunate, but you're right.
- [21:23]
Don Hahn
Yeah.
- [21:23]
Alan Hahn
You know, and I think because of if they ever won the championship, that's the story everybody's going to remember and it'll end. He'll be the most beloved. And by being the most beloved, people will root to say he's the greatest. And unfortunately, those guys won't have a dog in the fight. It's a great way to put it because, you know, the footage is grainy. The people that covered it aren't with us anymore. And in some cases, the guys that we're talking about aren't with us anymore. And that's the sad thing about sports is that, listen, there are a lot of people that worship Messier. They don't remember the times in Edmonton. For all they know, he was a Ranger the whole time. You know, like, because they kind of parachuted in when it happened. And then the story builds and it's like those five Stanley Cups he won in Edmonton don't matter because he did in New York. That's what just hits different about New York. That's what I was trying to tell, you know, perk about, you know, the pressure to be in New York. I don't think there's ever a situation where we give our teams a pass. Like, you know, if the Knicks ever lost Brunson and oh, there's no pressure. But once, once you start to play well down the stretch, I don't know if anybody accepts getting bounced in the first round. The way he was describing the lack of pressure with the Celtics, I just think that you Wear a target on your back as if you're a champion. Because I think there are people around the NBA that are sick and tired of New York getting talked about all the time.
- [22:48]
Don Hahn
Yeah. Of course. They feel like you're only. They're only talked about because.
- [22:52]
Alan Hahn
Because they're in New York.
- [22:53]
Don Hahn
Yeah.
- [22:53]
Alan Hahn
And it's, you know, it's crazy, it's unfair, but it's a. He's a good spot, man.
- [22:58]
Don Hahn
Oh, yeah.
- [22:59]
Peter Rosenberg
I like perk.
- [23:00]
Alan Hahn
He's come all.
- [23:02]
Peter Rosenberg
He's gotten really good, man.
- [23:04]
Alan Hahn
No, he's.
- [23:04]
Peter Rosenberg
Not to mention, not to mention his big body Brunson line.
- [23:07]
Alan Hahn
It is really. It doesn't make a ton of sense, but it may. But the way he says it is big.
- [23:12]
Peter Rosenberg
A lot of it's that.
- [23:14]
Alan Hahn
Especially when he's talking about how. How the fact that he's so small is going to make for a great story if they ever win a championship. And then the way he describes big body, bro. But I know what he means by taking the charges and all that. But yeah, it's still funny to get him on. So it's always a good spot.
- [23:29]
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Don Hahn
Thanks very much for having me, Michelle.
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Peter Rosenberg
We've been hearing a lot lately about cancer rates rising, especially in younger adults, which is obviously pretty alarming. What are you seeing?
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Without question, cancer rates are rising across the board. And concerningly, we are seeing more aggressive cancers in people even in their 20s and 30s.
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Peter Rosenberg
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- [26:48]
Don Hahn
Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.
- [26:51]
Peter Rosenberg
I didn't listen to anything you just said.
- [26:53]
Don Hahn
Catch this show on demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcasts.
- [27:01]
Peter Rosenberg
This is we're gonna rub football all over ourselves today.
- [27:05]
Alan Hahn
I did consume a lot of football back in the day. Pre kids in my underwear.
- [27:08]
Don Hahn
The NFL binge.
- [27:10]
Alan Hahn
You watch every game.
- [27:11]
Don Hahn
You ready?
- [27:11]
Alan Hahn
Are you watching?
- [27:13]
Peter Rosenberg
Oh, ladies and gentlemen, we're binging it up, baby. Sure, I know what you're thinking. We could not be further away at this moment. From an NFL season. Oh, but you'd be wrong. I mean, technically, you're literally wrong. But also, there's so many things happening, folks. You want me to update you with some things?
- [27:30]
Don Hahn
Please do.
- [27:32]
Peter Rosenberg
All right. Well, there's no Tush push ban, folks. The NFL Competition Committee co chair, Rich McKay said Sunday he is not anticipating an attempt to ban the Tush push this year, one year after the debate over the play was very close to passing. But there's no team proposal I've seen from it, so I would envision it. I wouldn't envision it, but you never know now. To me, guys, now would be the least likely time for that for it to happen. Because it seemed like last year there was a lot more progress on stopping the play. That's at least how it felt. I don't know what the statistics tell you, but don't you guys feel like you saw it stopped more, much more than the years before?
- [28:16]
Alan Hahn
Yeah, it felt like they were starting to figure it out, but now this comes across even more like, well, we were just jealous of the Eagles because now, like, they're not as good and not as big a threat. So let's leave it alone.
- [28:29]
Don Hahn
And also other more teams are trying it and they're not nearly as good at it. So you're seeing it stop because they're not as good at.
- [28:40]
Peter Rosenberg
Now, this is interesting. Mike Florio is reporting that there's a current belief in league circles that the jets will eventually apply the transition tag to breece hall. The 2026 transition tag for running backs expected to land in the range of 11.5 to 11.9 million. If accepted, it becomes fully guaranteed and it puts the player under contract for the upcoming year. If the team applies the transition tag and doesn't match an offer sheet, the player's departure doesn't count towards the next year's slate of compensatory draft picks. If you follow that, congrats on you. Now, if hall simply exits as a free agent, then it does count towards that slate of compensatory draft picks.
- [29:24]
Alan Hahn
Am I wrong to feel sorry for him?
- [29:27]
Don Hahn
No. Feel sorry for Breece?
- [29:29]
Alan Hahn
Yeah, because it just feels like he got denied his parole. That's what it feels like. You know he wants out and you know the team's in a rebuild. He's really good. Running backs have a short shelf life to begin with, and he's going to be stuck there another year.
- [29:43]
Don Hahn
Yeah, I know what you're saying. I don't think he wants out, per se. I think he just wants Like, I don't want a one year future. Like, I want to know what and like, what am I part of? What am I, what am I going to be? And he started last year thinking that he's out. That's the problem. Right.
- [30:01]
Alan Hahn
So, yeah, it's been a weird, it's
- [30:03]
Don Hahn
been a weird year for him, but
- [30:04]
Alan Hahn
it's not, it's not a reflection on the jets as much as the jets situation. I'm just saying that now it's another year of being on a team that's not going to be very good. Maybe not trying to win games and, and you don't have that much of a shelf life as a dominant running back.
- [30:20]
Peter Rosenberg
Yeah, no, I feel for him a bit too. And he's been a pretty good soldier, done his best, played well, and it's just the rewards have not been there. The Falcons planning to place the franchise tag on Kyle Pitts, which would then of course keep one of the top tight ends in the league under contract for at least another year. And the Cowboys, according to Steven Jones, are leaning towards using the franchise tag on Pro bowl receiver George Pickens.
- [30:51]
Don Hahn
That. Yeah, that's not nothing.
- [30:53]
Peter Rosenberg
Yeah. However, they're also aware of the fallout. Fallout of that potential decision. Pickens, I guess, would not be pleased with that.
- [31:00]
Don Hahn
No, he would not.
- [31:00]
Peter Rosenberg
So now you have him under the franchise tag and he's there but now unhappy. Not ideal.
- [31:04]
Don Hahn
Which Pittsburgh learned when he's not happy, like things go the wrong way.
- [31:10]
Alan Hahn
Yes, they go.
- [31:11]
Don Hahn
He was last, last season he was working for a scholarship. Right. Like that's what it felt like. And, and he was, I mean, he was great. They, you could argue, argue at least that they have the best wide receiver tandem in the league. And that seemed like an obvious thing to keep both and to pay Pickens. But you also know with Pickens, like you don't always get him on his best behavior. So you got to be that. You got to tread carefully there. It's not an easy decision. Talented, but you know, that's a guy that once he gets comfortable, you stop getting the benefits of his talent.
- [31:50]
Peter Rosenberg
Speaking of the Cowboys, they did lock up another key piece of their offense, agreeing to a three year deal with running back Javante Williams. 16 million guaranteed according to shefty total deal, $24 million, including a $6 million signing bonus. The biggest football story over the weekend, unfortunately, was one of tragedy. Former Purdue star and NFL wideout Rondell Moore died on Saturday at the age of 25 years old. Police in his hometown of New Albany, Indiana, told the AP that he was found in a garage with a suspected self inflicted gunshot wound wound. The death remains under investigation. Vikings put out a statement. We are deeply saddened by the passing of Rondell Moore. While we are working to understand the facts, we have spoken to Rondale's family to offer our condolences and the full support of the Minnesota Vikings. We have also been in communication with our players, coaches and staff and will make counseling and emotional support resources available to anyone in need. Our thoughts are with Rondale's family and friends during this devastating time.
- [32:59]
Don Hahn
25 awful injuries, man. Like, it's just been through some injuries and you know, like, and I say this all the time. You don't know what people go through.
- [33:12]
Kendrick Perkins
Yeah.
- [33:13]
Peter Rosenberg
And this, this is just like over the last decade and change, guys. What are two decades really? We've just seen the amount of suicides related to NFL players, just at least that we've been aware of, just increase year by year. It feels like that's true,
- [33:33]
Alan Hahn
but it feels like sometimes a disservice, Peter, when we just chalk it up to cte. Listen, people have issues and I think sometimes professional athletes, for whatever reason, they don't. They don't seek help on mental issues the way they do when other physical things are happening to them. So this could have happened to him if he was a doctor, lawyer, plumber, whatever.
- [33:58]
Peter Rosenberg
That's true.
- [33:59]
Don Hahn
That's the male stigma.
- [34:00]
Alan Hahn
Alan said, you just don't know. You just don't know what he was going through. But you just, you have to feel for anybody that can see that as a way out.
- [34:11]
Peter Rosenberg
Now, a Harvard football player's health study attributed the increase to cte. There was a large increase relative to other athletes suicide rates between 2011 and 2019 according to a study. But to your point, Dom, no. No one knows exactly what's going on, but it certainly is a disturbing trend that's been on the rise over the past many years. That is it for your NFL binge on this Monday. Can I throw February, no, 23rd? Yeah, please.
- [34:43]
Don Hahn
Just, just one more thought on a binge. Binge back, if we could. Binge back is next week. You know, you'll get some. This. The date starts to kick in for whether or not some players are cut to save money to save cap and all that stuff. Right. Well, the Vegas Raiders have a decision to make on a very interesting name, Geno Smith. They have the number one pick. You know, they want to give the job to Fernando Mendoza out of the gate. Right. They're going to draft him and they don't want to really cause any, you know, any question at all about who's going to be the starter. They're going to build with him. Now. They could keep Gino and roll with him as sort of a mentor type backup quarterback. Not sure that's what he wants, but he could do that. He certainly isn't in his prime anymore. But if he's. If he's cut and let go, like, the jets have zero options at this point. Right. Is that somebody that the jets should even think about? The former Jet draft pick who found his way just like Sam found his way once he left. But is he like, would you look and say, I'd take a year at Geno Smith versus some of the other options that we know. You know, again, Derek Carr, who's already thrown his hat in the ring, if he does come back, I mean, these are the types of choices you're gonna have.
- [36:06]
Peter Rosenberg
He becomes, to me, he jumps up to number two in terms of appealing.
- [36:13]
Don Hahn
Number two.
- [36:14]
Alan Hahn
Yes.
- [36:16]
Peter Rosenberg
I still. I still think my man. Why am I blanking on his name on a cousin? Packers. Packers backup.
- [36:21]
Don Hahn
Oh, oh. Malik Willis.
- [36:23]
Peter Rosenberg
Yeah, Malik Willis. Well, I still think Malik Willis is the most intriguing.
- [36:27]
Don Hahn
I agree. But you know Jeremy Fowler, a good friend of mine who does a lot of NFL for us at espn, very smart guy who knows a lot of things. When I brought that up, he immediately said to me the line that the jets are in a situation where it's quarterback musical chairs and they're always going to be the one. They're always going to be the last chair, always. So Malik Willis will have better options than the Jets.
- [36:54]
Peter Rosenberg
So assuming that's correct and Jimmy Fowler
- [36:56]
Don Hahn
might be the one, but for those wondering, Miami might be the one.
- [37:01]
Peter Rosenberg
And that would make sense. That would make sense. And assuming Jeremy Fowler is right about that, I think immediately, then. So you're talking about just finding someone who can steady the ship.
- [37:12]
Don Hahn
Yeah.
- [37:12]
Peter Rosenberg
I think Geno immediately becomes the most appealing option you have.
- [37:16]
Don Hahn
Like, just give me capable quarterback play.
- [37:18]
Peter Rosenberg
He will give you. If you want to worry about developing other players, gaining a little bit of stability and at least putting on a semblance of a professional operation, I think Geno, because we don't know what Derek Carr's current situation is, a year remove from a really bad injury, didn't play last year. I think Gino's the best choice.
- [37:39]
Alan Hahn
He's certainly up there. I would definitely put him on my list of potential quarterbacks if I'm the New York Jets. Great job with the binge, Peter. You know there are a lot of reasons why people buy at Ramsey Mazda. It's their selection, it's their customer service and it's their savings. Lisa do 2026 Mazda CX 52.5s select with all wheel drive for $219 for 33 months or buy with 1.9% APR financing for 36 months. Start shopping now at ramseymazda.com choose wisely. Choose Ramsey Mazda. Call 833-853-2970 for lease details. Then TN 466016 MSRP $32,010 0 security deposit APR at $28.60 per month per $1,000 financed ends 3226 so Gino will
- [38:25]
Don Hahn
be 36 during next season be October when he turns 36 and his numbers again like he's, he's been decent last couple of years. I mean he had a 4,000 yard season with Seattle his last year there before they moved on from him and I mean, you know, played 15 games with the Raiders. The Raiders weren't very good, but he, he did throw a ton of interceptions.
- [38:49]
Alan Hahn
No, but bad team. Oh, the jets are going to be
- [38:51]
Don Hahn
a bad team, but sacked a ton as well. Which you throw interceptions when you're getting sacked a lot, by the way. We all know that one does go with the other a lot of times,
- [38:59]
Alan Hahn
but Willis obviously would be number one because you're thinking about somebody that potentially can be the guy. You know, Carr is somebody that maybe if it works out, he might be my guy for a couple of years. But if we're just playing the role of disposable quarterback, you know, a guy that's going to be here for a year, a gap until we figure it out. I think that Geno Smith is as good as any of the other options that are out there and might be a lot cheaper than some as well.
- [39:26]
Don Hahn
That's true.
- [39:27]
Alan Hahn
I think that's just another name you certainly want to throw on the hopper.
- [39:32]
Peter Rosenberg
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Peter Rosenberg
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- [41:07]
Don Hahn
the Don Hahn and Rosenberg Podcast.
- [41:10]
Peter Rosenberg
I didn't listen to anything you just said.
- [41:11]
Don Hahn
Catch the show on demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcasts.
- [41:19]
Alan Hahn
See us live from the Irish Exit in Moynihan train hall, Friday, March 13, before the semifinal round of the Big East Tournament. Stop by before heading into the Garden or before your commute home. Don Hahn and Rosenberg live from the Irish Exit at Moynihan Train station starting at 3pm Friday, March 13. Steps away from Madison Square Garden and Penn Station. Brought to you by Schweppes above the Rim Refreshment. Feel the madness and refreshment. Or refresh your game with a Schweppes Seltzer or Schweppes Ginger ale. Sam Adams and Sun Cruiser Vodka iced tea available and the Rutherford must be 21 years or older to purchase. Please drink responsibly. All right, let's get back to the Busy phones on 1-800-919-3776, Dove in Boston. You're on ESPN New York. Hi, Dov.
- [42:10]
Don Dove
Hey guys. How are you today?
- [42:12]
Kendrick Perkins
Good.
- [42:14]
Don Dove
Oh, well, I wanted to call in. I originally called in towards the beginning of the show when it was getting a little heated. You know, the tension was ratcheting up a little bit. I said I want to call in and have everybody take a deep breath for a second. I want to try to articulate this in the right way. I know this is the Candy Store. I know that, you know, we're here to talk about, you know, the fun stuff to turn off reality for a while. I totally get that. I also understand it's not the responsibility of a 24 year old hockey player to stand up for the rights of millions of people. It's not his job, it's not his thoughts.
- [42:45]
Peter Rosenberg
I get it.
- [42:46]
Don Dove
Right. At the same time, I just. I think it's also kind of privileged for me as a white man in America or for, you know, people in privileged situations to say, let's just turn it off and enjoy the hockey. Because I think there's a lot of people in our country who don't get that choice. They don't get to just turn it off and enjoy the hockey. So I just. We need to be really careful to acknowledge that, I guess, and just understand that there is a responsibility. The reason that 1980 was so important, part of that was the political context. Part of that was what it meant for a political reason.
- [43:21]
Alan Hahn
But it was something we were all on board for. Dove is that we were going through what we were going through with the cold war. And the feeling was this was the distraction to just be proud to be American again. We were going through some very difficult times.
- [43:35]
Don Hahn
There was a depression in the country.
- [43:37]
Alan Hahn
Let's turn it off and let's watch a hockey game. That's where I take exception. Why can't anybody. Whatever you're going through, whether you're the left, whether you're the right, whether you're the privileged, whether you're the underprivileged, whatever, take a moment to just say it's just about being proud to be American in some way, shape or form. And just watching some kids go out there and accomplish something that we can all get on board for, why does it have to mean anything?
- [44:06]
Don Dove
I so agree with your sentiment and I so agree with what you're saying. And I'll say this. I think that there are times in our political history where that can totally be true. There are totally times where what we're talking about is tax, you know, tax structure. And we're talking about, you know, like the community parks and we're talking about stuff like that. And I'm not tipping my cap. It's the candy store. We're talking about people getting dragged into cars and with the families.
- [44:32]
Peter Rosenberg
I listen, I appreciate you. What's caller's name?
- [44:34]
Kendrick Perkins
Don Dove.
- [44:36]
Peter Rosenberg
Dove, I appreciate you because frankly, you're. You're braver today than I feel like being based on how much over the years I've dealt with being Mr. Political. But I agree the times are different. This. It's it is a position of privilege for us to just go, hey, let's just enjoy our hockey. For some people, it's not that. For some people, it's deeper. That doesn't change, though. Your guys feeling that some people are just being that guy and being yo yos online to be ridiculous and get clicks and get engagement. I think that part is completely valid
- [45:06]
Don Hahn
and you have the right things to enjoy it.
- [45:08]
Peter Rosenberg
Yeah. Both can be true.
- [45:09]
Don Hahn
Both can be true. Both can be true. And what Dove said can be true. That in the back of your mind, you still remember, you know, keep in mind the fact that there are things going on that are unsettling. But I. And Don, I think was trying to say this. And this is. I feel this way again about it, because in the moment. In the moment, not a couple hours later. Let's remind everybody, though, that there's still things we got to be better at, which we all, I think would be aware of. It's the fact that I don't like that there are megalomaniacs in our world that watch something great happening and say, how can I make this about me? Because rather than just sitting back, those who are doing something that everyone's allured by, it's almost like I need the attention. How do I get the attention back on me and what I want to talk about versus someone else who just happens to be stealing the moment. That's what I think happens way too much. We are not motivated by trying to open the eyes of people. We are. We are motivated by opening the eyes. So people look back at me because you're not looking at me anymore. And I need to make noise to make you to look at me again. And that, I'm telling you, is the root of what Most people. Most. 99% of the people that do stuff like that to go viral with some type of just a. Whataboutism crap in the middle of something that we're just trying to. Just for five minutes, can I have fun?
- [46:36]
Alan Hahn
Right? And also
- [46:40]
Don Hahn
that.
- [46:41]
Alan Hahn
And I'm getting this on social media, too. Well, it's always political. It's always about politics. No, because you choose to make it about politics. I don't think Jack Hughes scored that goal to support Donald Trump or to support this or that. He did it because he's an American and he's proud to be an American. Both could be true.
- [46:59]
Don Hahn
People just wanted to hidden.
- [47:01]
Alan Hahn
You could be sickened by things that are going on in this country and yet still be proud to be in this country. Because you know what country's perfect. And there's a lot of things going on that you. Nobody can agree 100% with everything that's going on. All right? But just for a moment, just to say, hey, we're here. We're all on the same page. We're all Americans. We're all proud to be Americans. And if you're not proud to be American, then don't be proud to be American. But don't put that on Jack Hughes. Don't put it on Warinski. Don't put it on Auston Matthews. They're just hockey players representing their country and proud to represent their country. And if you don't want to be a part of it, you didn't have to watch it. Nobody told you to have to watch it. No, but you know what? I'm not making it a political statement by loving to be a man. That's the thing. The bottom line to me, Alan and Peter, is that I'm proud to be an American should not be a political statement.
- [47:51]
Don Hahn
No, no, it shouldn't. It just is. It's just a statement.
- [47:55]
Alan Hahn
No, it should and it shouldn't. And I'm not going to force somebody to make it. So that's like that. So if you decide that you want to make it political, that's on you. But don't drag me into the conversation and don't decide for me what I should and shouldn't feel about it, all right? And don't pigeonhole me into a certain side because I say it, you know, and that's. I'm proud to be from this country, but that doesn't mean I'm proud of everything that happens in this country. Okay, well, no, both could be true,
- [48:28]
Peter Rosenberg
and I think both can be true, that you can both be proud of the Olympians, who at the beginning of the Olympics got up, gave critical statements about how they feel, their relationship with America is complicated right now, but they still want to represent the country. And you can also be okay with someone like Jack Hughes who just says he's proud to be American. Both of those people are being American. They are both doing their version of being American.
- [48:56]
Don Hahn
And though, again, how you react, that's a you problem, that. That's not. That's how you react to it. That's your decision. That is not. This is what they're doing to me. You. You have a choice in life, on everything that's said, especially on social media, to decide whether or not you want to react or you just want to move on in life. Because whoever it is, they're not in your life. They're gone in an instant the minute you scroll to the next thing. So that's a choice you make if you want to be mad or not.
- [49:29]
Alan Hahn
And there are. There were athletes that use the podium, use the platform to be political, and that's their choice. And that's what they decided to do.
- [49:36]
Don Hahn
Yes.
- [49:36]
Alan Hahn
Whether it's representing this country or maybe not representing this country. There was a few that did that as well. Free to do that.
- [49:43]
Don Hahn
It's the best part, Don.
- [49:44]
Alan Hahn
But I don't think free to do it. And even though. But I don't. And I'm sure I'll be corrected on social media. I don't remember any of the NHL athletes using the game, using the platform of competing for a gold medal to make any kind of political statement. There were people that assumed things that were said were political statements, like, I'm proud of my country, always making a political statement. Or that I hate that. I'm gonna go visit that. I'm taking the call from Trump. Apparently, they've been invited to the State of the Union address, and that'll be the sort of statements made if they go there. The women of the women have already said they can't go because of scheduling conflicts. So there are people that are taking the leap and saying that they're not going because of protests. That's not what they said. Don't make things into your agenda. Well, I'll say this is. This is the.
- [50:29]
Peter Rosenberg
This is the last thing I'm going to say on this. We have enn like you dream about coming. And I'll say it again. Cash Patel absolutely knew when he was there it would become something. And to avoid it becoming something, he should have loved the team and cared for them so much. To say, not a great look, we don't need to all do this.
- [50:49]
Alan Hahn
I'll see you guys afterwards.
- [50:50]
Peter Rosenberg
That would have been the way to not make it what it was. He went into business for himself. As we say in the business. He shotgun beers. He partied like he's 16. And now these guys all have to live it down. I think the president call. Like I said earlier, presidents call teams who win gold medals. You can despise Trump or love him. Trump didn't say anything particularly political in the conversation. He did what most presidents do. Congrats. That was amazing. The goalie was good. Yada, yada, yada, blah, blah, blah, blah. So I think there was a moment there that could have been avoided.
- [51:20]
Alan Hahn
Right.
- [51:20]
Peter Rosenberg
But someone by.
- [51:22]
Don Hahn
Well, no, you know what it was someone Took a video and decided, well,
- [51:25]
Peter Rosenberg
that, too, but that. But, you know, there's media, all right?
- [51:28]
Alan Hahn
And there would have been the same. Same thing. Had there been video of him denied access to the room. The point is, is that the players were not.
- [51:36]
Peter Rosenberg
They should have been denied. He shouldn't have put them in the.
- [51:38]
Alan Hahn
That's on him. It's according to. On him, But I'm saying that's not on the players. I don't think the players are making any sort of a statement. Half of them may. They. They may all be maga. They may all. I don't know. But I'm sorry, Judge. Based on them waking in the head of the FBI into the room, good luck trying to deny him access.
- [51:57]
Peter Rosenberg
I doubt most of the players were like, guys, we can't party without cash in here, bro. Like, I don't think that was top of their mind in that, but that
- [52:06]
Alan Hahn
now is on them. And I think that's unfair because again. But again, by both sides. By both sides, this great American moment has been hijacked into whatever your political beliefs happen to be. And meanwhile, I think these kids were just happy to be American and win a damn hockey game. And now, all of a sudden, they are in the middle of a firestorm, and there are people on social media that I respect that I'm, like, sickened by some of the things that they're tweeting on both ends, because I just think people can't help themselves.
- [52:39]
Don Hahn
Fill me in, Luis. I'll hit the lead if you hit the lead.
- [52:41]
Peter Rosenberg
I want to see you guys do it, because that owns. I'm not. I'm not saying I'll do it.
- [52:44]
Don Hahn
It's file, though, Peter. It's three or it's none.
- [52:48]
Alan Hahn
Let's see.
- [52:48]
Peter Rosenberg
Oh, come on.
- [52:49]
Alan Hahn
No, I've already asked. I've already asked Anthony a series of questions on what my last tweet can be, and both of them, he told me, would not be a good idea.
- [53:00]
Don Hahn
No. Oh, I need this offline, because I've got.
- [53:03]
Alan Hahn
I've got certain emojis that I want to send out as my last tweet that would probably get me fired.
- [53:08]
Peter Rosenberg
Yeah, don't do that.
- [53:09]
Alan Hahn
Don't be a double whammy.
- [53:10]
Peter Rosenberg
That's not. We're not. Thelma Louisiang that one with you, buddy?
- [53:13]
Alan Hahn
Yeah. No, no, no, no. These are all. No, no, no. But I do think there should be one last tweet, and I just go quietly into that good night.
- [53:20]
Don Hahn
Right, Right.
- [53:21]
Alan Hahn
You guys know me. I'm not. That's not me.
- [53:24]
Don Hahn
Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast. I don't want to know how the sausage is made. Know it's good. Hear more of Don Allen and Peter
- [53:32]
Peter Rosenberg
weekday afternoon starting at 3 on 8 80, ESPN, the ESPN New York app
- [53:38]
Don Hahn
and your smart speakers.
- [53:41]
Commercial/Announcer
This week, the PGA Tour's best players go prime time with TGL, presented by
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Don Hahn
SoFi in doubleheader action.
- [53:47]
Commercial/Announcer
Atlanta Drive takes on both Boston Common Golf and Los Angeles golf club, plus
- [53:51]
Don Hahn
two primetime matchups on Tuesday. Keep up it's golf.
- [53:53]
Commercial/Announcer
Tune in Monday and Tuesday at 5pm and 9pm Eastern only on ESPN, ESPN2
- [53:59]
Don Hahn
and the ESPN App.