Don, Hahn & Rosenberg – "Less For More" (Hour 2)

Date: October 13, 2025
Podcast: ESPN New York
Hosts: Alan Hahn, Peter Rosenberg, Don La Greca

Overview

This episode revolves around the ongoing struggles and decision-making surrounding the New York Jets' coaching situation, the franchise's cyclical search for stability, and the broader difficulties NFL teams face in finding the right head coach. The hosts debate the value of patience versus the urge for rapid change, discuss the merits of retread (experienced) versus first-time coaches, and look at franchises across the league grappling with similar dilemmas. The episode then transitions to wider NFL topics: player leadership, the unpredictability this season, memorable games, and weekly NFL highlights.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

The Jets' Coaching Carousel: Patience, Panic, and the Case for Experience

• Cultural Context

  • The Jets are infamous for quickly cycling through coaches (Judge, Shermer, McAdoo—all out after two years each).
  • Ownership’s historical aversion to hiring established, successful coaches is scrutinized.

• Patience vs. Impatience

  • Don: "Six games is not enough to judge whether he's the guy or not...you've got to at least ride this out to see where it goes. That's how you find coaches." (03:11)
  • Alan: Reminisces that coaches once got more time to figure things out and asks why Jets ownership won't pursue experienced, proven leaders—implying some fear of ceding control or “oxygen” to a dominant coach. (08:38)
  • Consensus: It's hard to win consistently in the NFL, and even acclaimed coaches often struggle without the right roster or time to build.

• The Retread Dilemma

  • "Retread" is addressed as an unfair pejorative. The hosts cite how experienced coaches can bring needed order and stability to perennial losing franchises.
  • Alan: "There's nothing wrong with it if the guy gets you organized and gets you right. When you're a bad franchise, that's what you need. Not a guy who's over his head..." (09:08)
  • Noted examples: Mike Keenan, Pat Riley, Tom Thibodeau, Mike Brown (in New York); outside: Mike Vrabel, Pete Carroll.

• Why don't Owners go after Star Coaches?

  • Don: “I might not want to chase the hot girl. I don't want to be told no. So I'm going to go after the inexperienced coaches because they have...more apt to say yes.” (10:00)
  • Discussion that Woody Johnson (Jets owner) prefers less established hires to avoid being rejected by top coaches.

Fan Perspective & The Jets' Attractiveness

• Caller Jimmy from LA (14:00): Long-time fan voice laments that the franchise isn’t an enticing landing spot for top coaches because of ownership’s reputation and the general dysfunction.
  • Jimmy: “My theory is...I don't think the jets are an attractive place given the owner, given the franchi a destination for an experienced head coach.”
  • Consensus among hosts that big names like Mike Vrabel, Ben Johnson, Jim Harbaugh, and Pete Carroll wouldn't actually choose the Jets at this stage.
  • Alan jokes only Rex Ryan would take the job now.

The Art of In-Game Management

• Coaching Mistakes
  • Inexperience leads to errors in clock management, timeouts, and critical play calls.
  • Don: “There is an art to two minute drives and making decisions on timeouts and whether to go for two...an inexperienced coach would probably screw that up. Right. So Rex, having coached in this league...I think experience alone...wins them that game yesterday.” (16:03)
  • Discussion of coaching growing pains: young coaches need reps and patience like players do.

The Justin Fields & Garrett Wilson Saga

• Discussion on whether to stick with QB Justin Fields

  • Rosenberg calls the relationship a "Vegas wedding"—fun, impulsive, likely not to last, but worth the shot.
    • “It was a. Hey, we're having fun. This could work out. Why not give it a shot?...If it doesn't work, guess what? We'll sober up and get divorced.” (18:46)
  • Alan notes lack of apparent trust in Fields from coaching staff, especially in critical moments.
    • “The plan showed you the lack of trust in what he had on the field. He did not trust Justin Fields in that moment.” (20:51)

• Player Frustration

  • Garrett Wilson audio clip: expresses confusion and frustration with end-of-half playcalling. (20:30)
  • Don & Alan analyze whether Fields' presence is to appease Wilson or if coaching decisions are being undermined by organizational politicking.

NFL Parity & Team Identity

• Who are these teams, really?

  • The hosts declare this year’s NFL particularly unpredictable—with supposed bottom-feeders beating favorites often.
  • Peter: “Just when you think you're starting to figure out who these teams are, guys, the Panthers looked like the absolute worst team in the league. The Cowboys looked like...going the right direction and they end up getting outscored by the Panthers yesterday. Weird league, guys." (28:02)
  • The NFC is “wide open," with teams like Detroit, Washington, and Tampa Bay in conversation alongside fading favorites (Eagles, Cowboys, Packers).

• Player Leadership Issues

  • Segment on Tua Tagovailoa's comments about team discipline in Miami (24:31): Tua criticizes teammates for missing or being late to player-only meetings, possibly signaling deeper locker room dysfunction.
    • Tua: “We have guys showing up to player only meetings late. Guys not showing up...Like there's a lot that goes into that...” (25:04)
  • Dialogue continues about where ultimate leadership must come from—a franchise QB, and whether Tua is effectively taking that role, or signaling problems larger than coaching.

Around the NFL: Highlights and Anecdotes

• Baker Mayfield's MVP-caliber season

  • Fun anecdote: Tez Johnson mishearing MVP chants after his score, only to realize they were for Baker.
    • “When I score and I hear MVP chant, I'm thinking, they talking about me...I was like, I ain't do nothing this year. And then he was like, they talking about Baker test.” (32:00)
  • Speculation that Mayfield's resurgence might not have happened in larger, more contentious markets like New York or Dallas.

• Backup Quarterback Value

  • Don, Alan, and Peter wax about backup QBs like Sam Darnold, Joe Flacco, and Aaron Rodgers, underlining that teams must have capable backups or risk catastrophe.
    • Rosenberg: “If you don't have a backup that's like, reasonably good. It's professional malfeasance, as Michael K. Might say.” (44:00)

• NFL Binge Segment

  • Recap of compelling games (Lions-Chiefs SNF, Cowboys' collapse vs Panthers, etc.)
  • Colorful acknowledgment of team inconsistency: “Week six already, guys. Week six.” (37:40)

Who Makes the Super Bowl?

• Roundtable—who represents each conference?
  • Alan: “I'm putting Buffalo in. I'm. I'm buying Buffalo.” (46:25)
  • Don: “Right now, I would say because it's wide open, that we'll get that matchup that we almost got two years ago. I'm going to go Buffalo, Detroit.” (46:56)
  • Peter: Agrees with Buffalo-Detroit; caveats that Kansas City can always “piece it together” and make AFC Championship weekend, while Washington is a dark horse but needs to show more. (48:31)
  • Hosts agree Bills vs. Lions would be a beloved neutral-fan matchup due to both teams' tortured histories. (49:01)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the need for coaching patience:

  • Don: “You don't find these guys and they win right away...but even the coaches, we think are great, can't rub two super bowl championships together.” (03:37)

• On retread coaches:

  • Alan: “There's nothing wrong with it if the guy gets you organized and gets you right when you're a bad franchise, that's what you need.” (09:08)

• On Jets ownership’s avoidance of star coaches:

  • Don: "Do I want the embarrassment of going after a big name coach and being told no? I'm not one coach there." (10:15)

• Jimmy in LA (fan call):

  • “My theory is...I don't think the jets are an attractive place given the owner...No way...Mike Vrabel was not coming to the New York Jets.” (14:00)

• On QB/WR dynamics:

  • Peter (on the Fields/Wilson partnership): “It was a Vegas wedding...If it doesn't work, guess what? We'll sober up and get divorced.” (18:46)

• On NFL’s unpredictability:

  • Peter: “The Panthers looked like the absolute worst team in the league. The Cowboys looked like they were going...right direction and they end up getting outscored by the Panthers...” (28:02)

• On player leadership (Tua saga):

  • Tua Tagovailoa: “We have guys showing up to player only meetings late. Guys not showing up...” (25:04)
  • Alan: “He's not talking about coaching. He's talking about player leadership. He's talking about the locker room. They got problems with that roster.” (25:43)

• On backup QBs:

  • Peter: “If you don't have a backup that's...reasonably good. It's professional malfeasance...” (44:36)

Notable Timestamps

• Jets coaching patience debate: 01:43 – 07:47
• Why avoid experienced coaches? 07:47 – 10:16
• Fan caller ‘Jimmy’ on the Jets: 14:00 – 16:03
• The art of in-game management and coordinator struggles: 16:03 – 17:23
• Justin Fields/Garrett Wilson dynamic: 18:34 – 22:07
• Player leadership, Dolphins drama (Tua): 24:31 – 27:39
• Cowboys lose to Panthers, NFL unpredictability: 28:02 – 30:32
• Baker Mayfield MVP talk & Tez Johnson moment: 31:30 – 33:40
• Backup QB value, Flacco & Rodgers: 43:07 – 45:05
• Super Bowl picks: 46:11 – 49:10

Tone & Banter

• Camaraderie: The hosts tease each other about their fan loyalties, decision-making, and travel stories. The tone is passionate and sometimes self-deprecating, reflective of their decades-long fandom and experience.
• Real Talk: No pretense—honestly appraising their own teams, calling out owner mistakes, and poking fun at their own rooting pain.
• Humor: Regular jokes (Vegas weddings for Fields/Wilson, Mayfield’s cereal, NFL’s “weirdness”) and friendly ribbing keep things light despite the frustrations aired.

In sum:
This episode delivers a candid, knowledgeable, and wide-ranging take on why coaching changes are so hard—especially for cursed franchises like the Jets. The hosts blend expertise, humor, and hard truths about football, giving listeners both a therapy session and an insider’s look at the league’s challenges in coaching, leadership, and team-building.