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- [00:01]
Commercial Announcer
So good, so good, so good.
- [00:03]
Peter Rosenberg
Spring styles are at Nordstrom Rack stores now, and they're up to 60% off. Stock up and save on Rag and Bone, Madewell, Vince, All Saints, and more of your favorites.
- [00:12]
Commercial Announcer
How did I not know Rack has Adidas?
- [00:14]
Peter Rosenberg
Why do we rack for the hottest? Still just so many good brands. Join the Nordy Club to unlock exclusive discounts. Shop new arrivals first and more. Plus, buy online and pick up at your favorite Rack store for free. Great brands, great prices. That's why you rack.
- [00:31]
Don Hahn
This is the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.
- [00:35]
Peter Rosenberg
That sounds like heaven to me.
- [00:36]
Don Hahn
Listen live weekday afternoon starting at 3 on 8 80, ESPN, the ESPN New York app, and your smart speakers. I'll say it for him since he can't be here to say it with us. 403 in the big city. And by big city, I mean Caldwell, New Jersey. That's where we are today. We're at Calandra's Bakery in Caldwell, New Jersey. Galandra's Bakery. Fresh bread, classic Italian pastries. I just. I just enjoyed one right now. And it's heaven baked daily, by the way. Taste of tradition today. Your calls, 800 now a 93776. We will continue to talk with you about that, but we're going to another phone line because the lovely and talented Monica McNutt, who joined the Secret this time, is on the line with us today. Monica, how are you?
- [01:23]
Peter Rosenberg
Sent you a picture of myself. I'm good.
- [01:25]
Jacob
Oh, no, hold. Jacob, hold on. Let me set it up. Monica, congratulations. You made drop Madness.
- [01:31]
Don Hahn
Oh, yeah.
- [01:31]
Jacob
Jacob, what seed is she?
- [01:34]
Don Hahn
Give me one second. Hold on. Yeah.
- [01:35]
Jacob
Do you remember Anthony? What seed? Monica is like an 11 seed. The dangerous Le in the trouble engine.
- [01:42]
Don Hahn
Yeah. Yeah. She is a 10 seed in the 10 seed.
- [01:46]
Jacob
One more time.
- [01:46]
Don Hahn
Here's your. Here's your.
- [01:47]
Peter Rosenberg
Yeah, I sent you a picture of my toilet, by the way.
- [01:50]
Jacob
There you go. Congratulations.
- [01:53]
Don Hahn
You are in the dance.
- [01:55]
Peter Rosenberg
It's my first time in the dance. I'm just really proud of the culture that we've built.
- [02:02]
Jacob
You turned them around quick, man. It's impressive.
- [02:04]
Peter Rosenberg
Yeah, absolutely. I was actually distracted, though, guys. I was distracted, though, because Hans eating pastries. What? What world is this?
- [02:14]
Don Hahn
A sliver. Come on. A sliver. Because, you know, if I had more than that.
- [02:19]
Jacob
Wait, Monica, hold on. This is interesting insight. Monica on the road is Allen, that guy that, like when you guys are letting go and having a good meal, he's still having salad and won't touch the pastry.
- [02:29]
Don Hahn
False.
- [02:30]
Peter Rosenberg
I not. Okay, so here's what I will say. No he's going to enjoy himself if we are having, like, a family moment. Like, we had a great dinner earlier this year. All of us who are repped with. We had some folks in town, like, we had a great dinner after the Knicks game. It was late. Peter, he was eating food and real food late with us. We were there after hours. They kept the kitchen open. But he is influential. I will share that. Both Tyler Murray and Pat o' Keefe have now duplicated the Han breakfast smoothie that is very mindful to only have half of a banana and not a whole because too much sugar. Peanut butter and some other ingredients that I'm not. Like, they're fine. But, like, he's very influential with rigidity.
- [03:11]
Jacob
I want to tell you something, Monica, that you should relay to Pat o' Keefe and Tyler Murray. Allen also has something going for him called incredible metabolism. I pointed. Hear me out, Monica. I pointed out one day, and he knows this is true. He was sitting there eating his Trader Joe's, like, whatever salad. It was tuna salad.
- [03:30]
Don Hahn
It was chicken salad.
- [03:30]
Jacob
Chicken salad. And I'm watching.
- [03:32]
Don Hahn
It was an entire pound.
- [03:34]
Jacob
And Monica, you know, I'm a little bit of a husky fellow. So I'm watching all of the amount of calories in each thing just to. Just to maintain being husky. And I'm watching him, and I see him finish the entire thing. I went, alan, you eat that in one sitting? He's like, yeah. And I'm like, alan, have you ever looked at the total calories in that thing? Yo, Monica, he's having 1200 calories at lunch. He doesn't even know it.
- [03:57]
Don Hahn
But I'm having, like, 20 grams of sugar.
- [03:58]
Peter Rosenberg
100%.
- [03:59]
Jacob
But so. But I was literally special. He's special.
- [04:02]
Peter Rosenberg
I literally. Rosenberg was off to be like, he was all into the protein, I'm sure. And how little sugar.
- [04:06]
Jacob
Oh, yeah, that's what he said. It's all the protein, no carbs.
- [04:09]
Don Hahn
I'm sure nobody cares about this conversation. We care more about talking with you about things like these Knicks. And Monica, how we. We always tend to amplify losses and things we don't like.
- [04:21]
Peter Rosenberg
While.
- [04:21]
Don Hahn
Oh, look, they have the best record since January 21st. Oh, look, they have the best defense since January 21st. Like, all these things that come up. And yet we seem to have this daily anxiety about the team. Did last night, even though, again, another start where a team is hot. And I know it's the Underman Pacers, but they're playing a lot of Underman teams right now. Did last night do anything for you when it comes to at least calming some anxiety as they've won four in a row.
- [04:49]
Peter Rosenberg
Not really. I think the most productive piece of last night for me was a steady version of Jose Alvarado. And to the Josh Hart should not start crowding. Do you see why he's so important? And I know it looks different when JB is available, but those are the two biggest things that I took out of last night. I think, though, Han, because I've been thinking about this a lot lately because I feel like. And you guys are in New York and Han, obviously we're super close to the team, but I feel like people, if I had to explain it to you like you're a fifth grader, right, People would be like, wait, they're winning and like their record's great and their defensive rating is improving and their offensive rating is improving and they're very formidable. But I don't think you could tell the story of where the Knicks fan base is right now with this year in isolation. And I think that's where we keep getting hung up because this to me is a three year chaptered story at this point. And everybody keeps flipping back to, I don't know, chapter three of the first season as this team is beginning to become a team that was formidable around the league. And it does look and feel different, even though the numbers, the stats, the record bear out that this is a really good team.
- [06:06]
Jacob
So I asked you this like a month ago and I'll ask it again. Have your expectations for this team changed at all? Or are we still just sadly in kind of wait and see whether they have that year when we get there mode?
- [06:21]
Peter Rosenberg
My expectations have not changed. I am still in. Yeah, I still am wait and see. Because by all indications, statistically on paper, right, they should be fine. Like, they should be fine. They should get through the first round, they should get through a second round. Should get through a second round. Like, the second round is obviously where it starts to get a little bit tricky and then you're back to the conference finals. So the talent is there. I think when you get to the playoffs, Rosenberg and Hahn, just last year, the winning happens in the margins, right? It's in the adjustments. Now some of those margins are going to be coaches adjustments, literal game adjustments. And the other part of it is going to be the intangibles that already exist within your unit when the rubber gets toughest. And I think that is where the jury's a little bit out on what this group will look like when you really got to hit it. Because I think last year was a bit of a surprise. I think they thought they were going to be better than the year before, but I don't think people thought they were going to be as good as they were last year.
- [07:36]
Don Hahn
And then once they got to the conference finals, it was like, wait a minute, now you're the favorite. You should do this. And that's when it all kind of fell apart. And with that in mind, I think that's why. So I want to defend now, what I was just sort of mocking, which is why even though this team does continue to stack wins, is, you know, at 45 now closing in on another 50 win season, the fact that you look at different parts of the team, because you're judging it now from the prism of not is this a good team, is this team that could make a run. Now you're judging it from saying, how do they compare to the other teams? That we exactly are the best in the league. One of those. And so one area, because, like Anunobi, for a while with the toe, you were concerned, but boy, he's really come back. Josh had himself last night to remind you of how important he is, Towns. And since the all Star break is shooting a three, the way we remember him, shooting at three, those are all good things. And then Jalen Brunson. Jalen Brunson. So now I bring you to Mikhail Bridges and we talked about on the postgame show a little bit, trying to find the positives in what he's doing while he's going through a shooting slump. But is there a fix for Mikhail Bridges? Because it seems like his frustration on his face and the way he has talked lately about sometimes the ball doesn't find me okay. Last year you didn't love the coach in the system. This year, are you saying it's the same problem? And then, okay, it becomes more of a you problem than it does a coaching problem and a system problem. So how do you fix this, man?
- [09:11]
Rich Eisen
Huh?
- [09:12]
Peter Rosenberg
You preaching, ain't you? I literally have said to people, come on now. I keep being like, I'm gonna get to your question. But I keep being like, as much as things change, they say to stay the same. I can tell you the formula that's gonna lead to winning for this team. And it looks a lot like what Tom Thibodeau did with them last year. No shade to Mike Brown. I think he's doing a great job, but, like, the core of the group remains the same.
- [09:31]
Don Hahn
Anywho, that's a whole nother rant, you're absolutely right.
- [09:34]
Peter Rosenberg
As far as Bridges is concerned, it is personal mirror gut check time. In my mind, the thing that I think would unlock him most is the thing that he has not done historically. You got to go ahead and get into the fight. You got to get physical, right? Like, you have to put all of your energy on the defensive side of the basketball. You got to get a couple free throws in, right? Like, you got to stop fading away from the basket. Like, you know what I mean?
- [09:55]
Don Hahn
Like, are you saying you got to stop trying to preserve yourself to get to 82 games played and just play?
- [10:01]
Peter Rosenberg
I mean, you listen, you said it. Listen, I didn't say that, but I think that's a fair way to summarize what we're looking at, right? And listen, I take nothing away from the street that he's managed. It is a feat for sure. He's remarkable. It's incredible. But I do think what is more important, the other day when Shay Gilich Alexander got the Chamberlain record, he said, and he may have just said this off the top of the Dome because it was the right thing to say, media savvy. But he put it out there that he would have traded the record if it meant that his team got a win. And I remember y', all and I like, great answer. Media trained, like, whatever. But in my head I was like, boy, and y' all already won a championship. You better hold on to that record. Who cares? Like, y' all gonna win another game. But in terms of what you prioritize, there's a reason why he is an MVP and likely to be a two time MVP by the end of this season, right? And I'm not saying that Mikel Bridges is going to become Shay Gildas Alexander. I'm not saying that. But I do think that some of the. If this is now two years under two different systems and you're running into some of the same issues, then how can you change within the system, right? Can you get to the glass more aggressively? Can you lean forward instead of back on attempts? Can you really pick it up on the defensive end, right? Slumps happen. Like, I've lived through them. Like, I get it. Slumps happen and the only way to shoot out of them is to shoot through them, literally. But there are other ways to get yourself going and to be energized. And so to me, it requires a mentality shift. And I will say this, y', all, as I look at Bridges, this probably will not be the first time that this happens to him in his career. And I think. And we've already heard it moving forward, people want to feel your impact on a basketball game, and it's just hit or miss. Like, I've gone back and forth with Knicks fans at this point that are, like, they see him as the X factor in terms of what this team can achieve. Because if he gives you the performance that we saw, you know, Christmas Day a couple years ago, or even prior to the last Pacers game when he was averaging 22 points, the last two Pacers game, when he was averaging 22 points against them, like, that potentially is a swing piece in terms of this team being able to compete with the firepower of other teams in the Eastern Conference. Right. When you get to Boston, Detroit, whoever you want to say might be in the way. So.
- [12:07]
Don Hahn
Yeah.
- [12:08]
Peter Rosenberg
But I don't know the psychology of these pro athletes, the psychologies of humans. I don't want to make it crazy, but, like, in particular, our pro athletes, it's a delicate thing because confidence is so intertwined to who you are. And I don't know, y', all, they always say, you get better during the off season, not during the season. So I don't know if this is the time to be like, hey, just try to get to the free throw line when that's, like, not what he does. I see it that way, but that's also not what he does.
- [12:32]
Jacob
Yeah.
- [12:33]
Peter Rosenberg
Yeah.
- [12:33]
Don Hahn
To me, though, again, how do you impact if you're not getting shots? Because it's today is Towns's day or oh, geez day. Right. How do you do? Stay involved. You can still get it done on the other end of the floor. That's why they went out and got two wings that have defensive backgrounds, because they know, like, you guys have to always bring it at that end of the floor. That's where that's your field goal attempt. To me, like, that's why you're here.
- [12:58]
Peter Rosenberg
Yeah.
- [12:59]
Don Hahn
Because Cat says something regularly to me after games, and it blows my mind because it's become his mantra since after the All Star break. I want to star in my role for this team. And I think that's exactly the mentality that a player has to have.
- [13:13]
Peter Rosenberg
Yeah. But you also have to be honest about your role. And I think that's probably where things get a little musty in the case that we're talking about.
- [13:20]
Don Hahn
Yeah, okay.
- [13:22]
Peter Rosenberg
Right. I mean, go, Rosenberg.
- [13:25]
Jacob
No, no, no, you go.
- [13:27]
Peter Rosenberg
I'm just saying, like, if we go with what you said about Kat, because I think you're absolutely right, but Kat got to New York saying this is JB's team and I'm here to support him. Right. There was a whole different mentality from a guy that is, what is he, a six time all star, five time all NBA? Like number one draft pick? Like there's a different mentality in terms of I'm just trying to win a championship. And even last year when he talked about being sort of revengeful after being traded from Minnesota or fired, however he used to say it, right. But he's very clear on his role. I don't know, and this is just my observation because I think you're right, I don't know that Mikael is clear on his role because to me, I. You. You're supposed to be part of this wingstop tandem, which means that that side of the ball would already be getting more energy more consistently.
- [14:14]
Don Hahn
Right.
- [14:14]
Peter Rosenberg
And I don't know that that's been the case since he's been in the Knicks uniform. In his mind, his role is what does that make him the scorer in his mind? Right.
- [14:22]
Don Hahn
And I'm not saying that he cannot
- [14:23]
Peter Rosenberg
be impactful when he.
- [14:25]
Don Hahn
Right.
- [14:26]
Peter Rosenberg
He can. When he is scoring is great. Of course you're going to seek it. But you're right in terms of where you put your energy is based on how your role is defined in your mind or how it has been clearly defined. And right now I'm not sure which one is winning out.
- [14:40]
Jacob
Do you. Last one I have. Do you. Are you getting a sense as we head down the stretch here that Cat has sort of the focus that is expected of him given the importance of this season and given the conversation that was around him earlier in the year?
- [14:57]
Peter Rosenberg
I do. And I think that he has gotten in better shape as the season has gone, which is not super uncommon. Like I do think guys
- [15:09]
Don Hahn
very good.
- [15:10]
Peter Rosenberg
Yeah, I think, yeah, some guys played themselves into better conditioning and that's fine. No shade. But as long as you get there, right. Listen, I love Cat's approach because I am also one who's very holistic minded and I don't think that necessarily takes away from how bad you want it or how bad you love the game. I think that while he is measured with what he says on the microphone, I do think he gets it. Like the way that David Adelman praised him was really refreshing when we were back in Denver, but it was also a reminder for me that no, it's like in him, like he the dude, he got it. Like I think we went through ebbs and flows this season as he was trying to get it together. But the shooting's back. He's still rebounding. What is he at? 49? Double doubles.
- [15:59]
Don Hahn
Yeah.
- [16:00]
Peter Rosenberg
Or 47. Is it 49 or 47?
- [16:02]
Don Hahn
He got his. What didn't he get his 49th last night or 48th?
- [16:04]
Peter Rosenberg
I thought it was 49th.
- [16:05]
Don Hahn
Yeah. Okay, 48th maybe.
- [16:08]
Peter Rosenberg
But so like he's got. So. Yes. I will also add, I think Mike Brown has said this too, like when he was about his shot attempt. I think that he's learning how to and playing really well in their double big lineup. And so I think it is a different sort of looking cat. The cat of this region of the new Knicks. And I think it works.
- [16:29]
Don Hahn
Yeah. And that'll be interesting too, when it comes to matchups postseason. All right, man. I do want to bring up something though, because we have talked about this on our show and I know you do have a connection to it and I'd love to get your take on the fact that the WNBA and the WNBA Players association at least have reached a verbal agreement to have a new deal in time for the season. And you know, the salaries are going to go up. I think they're talking about there'll be million dollar salaries now in this league.
- [16:59]
Peter Rosenberg
Yeah.
- [16:59]
Don Hahn
What. What does that mean for you and how important was this? Or is it not enough in your mind?
- [17:04]
Peter Rosenberg
Listen, man, I'm trying to work this summer. So I was thrilled, thrilled that we're going to have a season. I think to me, Han, and I said this from the beginning and I'm so glad to be wrong because I really thought this thing was going to head toward a short lockout. I didn't think we would miss a whole season, but I thought we would get some more significant delays. You move the ball forward, it might not be a touchdown on this particular one, but you move the ball forward. There's a lot of good in this verbal agreement so far. I mean, the salary cap going from I think it was like 600,000 a few years ago up to, I believe it's going to be around 7mil. 6mil is a huge deal. Right. I know that the revenue share is not exactly what the players wanted, but they got a lot of what they wanted. They certainly moved the ball significantly down the field. And I just think of the women that I'm privileged to call colleagues now that I loved and adored in the formative years of the wnba. The Cheryl Swoopes, the Lisa Leslie's, the Swin Cash. Like each CBA moves you forward, right? And you can't get to the Next one without the last one. And so while this one is historic, I think it was delicately placed because, yeah, the players have a lot that they have the ability to ask for, but we're also thinking of the future. And in order to move forward, you got to capitalize on the moment and the enthusiasm that's around women's basketball. So there's a lot of good stuff in there. I haven't had a chance today to really dig all the way into it. Just kind of read the headlines, but I'm really excited they got that done. I think Neca McKay could run the United States if she so desired. I think she's a tremendous leader, and I'm just really proud to know a lot of those women.
- [18:33]
Don Hahn
Yeah. The salary cap, according to Shamshirani, is going to go to 7 million, up from 1.45 million just last year. Supermax starts at 1.4 million, which last year it was $249,000. So you're talking about a dramatic difference there for supermax. Average salary, 600,000. It was 120,000 last year. And minimum salary will be 300. Minimum will be 300,000. Last year it was $66,000. So that is significant. But of course, with all these. All the time, these things, it's a step forward. But it's certainly. If the continued investment in this league, if that happens in the Stars and the star power that this league is starting to develop, especially coming out of the women's college game, then, yeah, it is definitely headed in the right direction. And Monica gets to work this summer because she doesn't.
- [19:21]
Peter Rosenberg
Yeah, Don't worry. We get into travel trips in as well, the vacation trips in. What? I'm excited for the W season.
- [19:32]
Don Hahn
Absolutely. All right, well, we're excited to get to the playoffs as well. We're always excited to talk to you, man. Thanks so much for the time. We'll talk to you next week.
- [19:38]
Peter Rosenberg
No problem. I'm good. Enjoy the bakery.
- [19:41]
Don Hahn
All right. Monica McNutt. She is in Drop Madness. Very excited about that. Do we know? So what's her drop going up against?
- [19:48]
Jacob
Yeah, Jacob, you got that? She has the. The monitor.
- [19:50]
Peter Rosenberg
Take it off.
- [19:51]
Don Hahn
Take it all off.
- [19:52]
Jacob
Well, tough day for Monica. Wow, that's just not.
- [19:56]
Don Hahn
Winthrop disagrees.
- [19:59]
Peter Rosenberg
Oh.
- [19:59]
Don Hahn
Oh, okay. Okay.
- [20:00]
Jacob
No, no. Take it off to win the whole thing to me. Am I. Am I. It can't get better than that. It's. It's.
- [20:06]
Don Hahn
That's a tough one, because the essence
- [20:07]
Jacob
of the Drop, to me is all about removing context to make it funny.
- [20:11]
Don Hahn
Yeah.
- [20:11]
Jacob
Trying to figure out what Richard could possibly be saying that would be screaming at someone, take it off. Take it all off.
- [20:18]
Don Hahn
Just, just to be fair, Jacob, play Monica's one more time.
- [20:22]
Peter Rosenberg
I sent you a picture of my toilet, by the way.
- [20:25]
Don Hahn
That's one out of context too, where
- [20:26]
Jacob
you're like, no, it's, it's, it's insane.
- [20:28]
Don Hahn
It's maybe because the audio isn't as crisp.
- [20:30]
Jacob
Not as crisp. And, and you know, I was there for that one.
- [20:34]
Don Hahn
Took a picture of my insane.
- [20:36]
Jacob
It's an insane thing for Monica to
- [20:37]
Don Hahn
say that at all.
- [20:39]
Jacob
Well, and even in the context that it could be the context, it wouldn't make sense. Like, why would you say anyways, but, but I wasn't there the day Richard said take it all off.
- [20:47]
Don Hahn
Oh, that was some.
- [20:48]
Jacob
And he also. That was the other drop came from that day too when he talked about the two women.
- [20:52]
Don Hahn
Two women. Yeah. Two for one in that day.
- [20:54]
Jacob
And I missed both. So I show up going, what the hell was this guy talking about?
- [20:58]
Peter Rosenberg
Beautiful women died. I'll give you them quickly.
- [21:01]
Don Hahn
I'll give you them quickly. No one had more enthusiasm to talk about two actresses who passed away.
- [21:07]
Jacob
And then he somehow got to take it out.
- [21:09]
Don Hahn
Take it off.
- [21:10]
Peter Rosenberg
Take it all off.
- [21:12]
Don Hahn
He did. He did.
- [21:13]
Jacob
Well, Michael, Michael must be cringing about the old episodes of Center Stage they're showing today. They have been showing one air one episode after another from his Gavon era. He is not gonna love this.
- [21:23]
Don Hahn
Is this Repug K? Are you calling him Repug?
- [21:27]
Jacob
I wouldn't say it's quite Repug K. But I know how he feels about this timeline of episodes.
- [21:31]
Don Hahn
Yeah.
- [21:32]
Jacob
Like 10, 11. That that era. He was just a large faced fellow in that time.
- [21:37]
Peter Rosenberg
Wow.
- [21:37]
Jacob
But guess what? I'm in my large face era right now. So who am I to judge?
- [21:42]
Don Hahn
I'm gonna leave that alone. We have a list coming up now. Don's not.
- [21:45]
Peter Rosenberg
Wow.
- [21:46]
Don Hahn
So we have curated our own list.
- [21:49]
Jacob
Very good one too.
- [21:49]
Don Hahn
And this is one that we feel is very topical for the day because as we mentioned, Judge not coming through. There's a lot of criticism of him being this one of the all time greats who just doesn't get it done in a clutch moment. So who are the top five great players who were never considered clutch?
- [22:10]
Jacob
And since Don is not here to make the list and we did this, I'd love if you want to jump on the phone lines and give us one. Would love your suggestions.
- [22:17]
Don Hahn
We'll play the who you taking out?
- [22:18]
Jacob
Yeah. 1,800-9193776. All time great athletes who were not clutch. That's the list. Next.
- [22:24]
Don Hahn
All right. Donjon Rosenberg live from Calandra's in Caldwell, New Jersey, on ESPN New York.
- [22:29]
Jacob
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- [23:42]
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- [25:11]
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- [25:15]
Don Hahn
Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.
- [25:19]
Jacob
I didn't listen to anything you just said.
- [25:20]
Don Hahn
Catch the show on demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcasts. Just made the list, buddy. This is the list with Don Hahn and Rosenberg. And Don Hahn and Rosenberg. We are live at Calandra's bakery in Caldwell, New Jersey. Fresh bread, classic Italian pastries baked daily. Taste of tradition today. We're actually now trying out the olive oil, A little bit of pepper, a little bit of bread. What do you think, Peter?
- [25:54]
Jacob
I'm very into it. I mean, this is bad because I'm in. I'm in a bad way right now. And I trying to turn this thing around too late. And like the day you're trying to turn it around, I was like, well, you know, it's probably got to be tomorrow.
- [26:05]
Don Hahn
Yeah, it's definitely a tomorrow.
- [26:06]
Jacob
It's a tomorrow situation.
- [26:07]
Don Hahn
You know, you are. You're like the jets, the battleship that just, you know, takes a long time to turn.
- [26:12]
Jacob
But I. I don't know. I don't know if you've ever had a period like this since your non repug days. Oh, I. Oh, I just. I've just had like a two year stretch where I can't pull it together. You know what I mean? It's just I can't. Every time I think I'm gonna pull it together, I don't. And I am one month from Wrestlemania.
- [26:29]
Don Hahn
Oh, no.
- [26:30]
Jacob
So this is the time.
- [26:31]
Don Hahn
Tighten up.
- [26:31]
Jacob
No, I have time to pull it together. It would be right now if I want to do it. It's take when it comes to the weight, Richard. Take it off. Take it all off.
- [26:39]
Don Hahn
That's exactly it.
- [26:40]
Jacob
Right now.
- [26:41]
Don Hahn
Just the weight. Not right now.
- [26:42]
Jacob
Oh, the.
- [26:43]
Don Hahn
Wait.
- [26:43]
Jacob
Close.
- [26:44]
Don Hahn
All right, so normally this is Don's segment, right?
- [26:47]
Peter Rosenberg
The list.
- [26:47]
Jacob
Yeah, we love the list.
- [26:49]
Don Hahn
And he Curates it and then we each have to make guesses, but he's not here.
- [26:53]
Jacob
Top five times Don has gotten sick right before a station event and can't come.
- [26:58]
Don Hahn
Wow. Well, this has got to be what, third? I think it's second. Is it second?
- [27:02]
Jacob
Oh, it's three. Top three. Wow. And then we do another one. Top five times Michael K. Has come to an event of his but is not able to talk. There's only one.
- [27:12]
Don Hahn
No, there's only one.
- [27:12]
Jacob
It's number one with a bullet, though.
- [27:14]
Don Hahn
That did happen.
- [27:14]
Jacob
The Beach Bash.
- [27:15]
Don Hahn
All right, well, all right.
- [27:16]
Jacob
So what do we got?
- [27:16]
Don Hahn
This list, because we were talking about the WBC and Aaron Judge going 0 for 4 with three strikeouts, which forever Yankee fans like. Not again. And then of course, all the social media vitriol that he has received of people that are calling him out for being one of the. One of, if not the best player in the sport right now of his generation, and yet doesn't have a World Series ring, doesn't have a big World Series moment, and doesn't seem to have big playoff clutch moments. Yesterday was unfortunately an example that fed that beast. Yes, it did. So what if we did a list of the greatest players who just were
- [27:55]
Jacob
not clutching great players, but with seemingly without the clutch gene?
- [28:00]
Don Hahn
Talk to me. So the first name, I think is the most obvious one to give in all of sports. This is one player who actually did some winning, but in big moments, we saw epic meltdowns.
- [28:13]
Jacob
Oh, I know where you're going.
- [28:14]
Don Hahn
His name.
- [28:14]
Jacob
Greg Norman.
- [28:15]
Don Hahn
Greg Norm.
- [28:15]
Jacob
Yeah.
- [28:16]
Don Hahn
Like, how do you know? I understand. It's golf. It's different because it's not a team sport, it's an individual. But that makes it even more. He was Tin cup before the movie. There were just times where you were watching or not again. Not again.
- [28:27]
Jacob
That's the Shark to you and me.
- [28:28]
Don Hahn
Yeah, that's true. Now, he was a guppy when it came time to win.
- [28:31]
Jacob
Well, that's the interesting part is he's a.
- [28:33]
Don Hahn
He's a great, great, great player.
- [28:35]
Jacob
But at the same time, he's most famous for. Sadly. Yeah, maybe the nickname, but also the coming up small in big spots. He had to be there. I think.
- [28:45]
Don Hahn
I think it's just if we're going to start the list, it's got to start there.
- [28:49]
Jacob
It's a good starting point.
- [28:50]
Don Hahn
Remember, from the 90s, this is somebody that was just a talented player that year after year would drive you crazy by losing. Another name that I think is just easy to put on this list is James Harden, it's more recent, but James Harden, somebody that is. This has got multiple MVPs. This guy was a scoring champion. Everything that he's done during the regular season, during the prime of his career, even to today, it just screams, this is one of the best players of his generation. And yet whenever he gets to the postseason, head in the sand, it's unbelievable. Since he left okc and that's the one time he actually did get to a Finals. But he wasn't a key player. He was a six man. But we have seen, and nothing bigger than, of course, him and Joel Embiid in Philadelphia a couple of years ago.
- [29:33]
Jacob
Jim Harden.
- [29:34]
Don Hahn
Yes, that's right. That would be Jim Harden to you and me. I think James Harden is an obvious name to add to this.
- [29:40]
Jacob
Well, because. Because, you know, there's a lot of funny headlines kind of around James Harden. He is one of the most talented players ever. Like, he is a. He is a sick player. There's not even a conversation. He's the kind of guy that if you ever got to. If you got to watch him play. You ever think about players like this, that if you ever saw them, like, walk up to a playground, they'd literally be the most disgusting player you ever saw? Yes, that's James Harden. He's that good. And he was on that team, obviously part of that original three with Westbrook and KD in Oklahoma City. And he was a great player and the best player multiple times. But, yeah, he's a guy who kind of shrunk in the biggest spots.
- [30:13]
Don Hahn
All right, I'm going to stay recent.
- [30:15]
Jacob
All right.
- [30:15]
Don Hahn
And I'm going to throw another name out that might be a tad controversial, but I actually think this is a name that for now, if you're going to put judge on this list, which we have not done that yet, but I think LaMar Jackson, multiple MVP. When we get to the playoffs, what happens? I'll tell you what happened.
- [30:38]
Jacob
Yeah, go ahead.
- [30:39]
Don Hahn
Nothing.
- [30:39]
Jacob
Yeah, that's right.
- [30:41]
Don Hahn
And how are you judged as a quarterback in the NFL?
- [30:44]
Jacob
Unfortunately, super bowl rings and playoff performance.
- [30:47]
Don Hahn
Can you win? That's right, Joe. Josh Allen has won an mvp. Josh Allen is also a guy that keeps running into the wall a little bit, but you wouldn't say that he's not clutch. You'd say his team at times, it just hasn't been good enough. Right. Joe Burrow has already shown us that he can slay the dragon when his team's right. So we've seen him do it. We know Mahomes is as Clutch as they come. And so in this era right now, the great quarterbacks, right, Stafford has proven it as well. Lamar Jackson's a guy that probably has as much talent, if not more than anyone else playing the position, as judged by his multiple MVPs, cannot get it done in the playoffs. That has to be a guy who's going to try to play his way off this list one day because he's still playing. But he's got to be on this list.
- [31:29]
Jacob
He does, man. And I feel bad because maybe if Mark Andrews doesn't randomly have Hands of Stone in one moment, maybe we're having a different conversation about Lamar, but isn't
- [31:38]
Don Hahn
that part of it?
- [31:39]
Jacob
But you also can't remove the fact that even with the Andrews, that doesn't change the drubbing in 2019 in the playoffs out of the blue that you didn't expect that he's had a lot of rough performances. There's no way around it.
- [31:54]
Don Hahn
Okay, now the next name. This is going to hurt. I'm going to hurt me personally, be hard for me to say, but I have to admit that this is a player that when you consider the body of work, it's got to be on this list. He is one of my favorite people and favorite players of all time.
- [32:14]
Jacob
Oh, I know. It's Patrick.
- [32:16]
Don Hahn
It's Patrick.
- [32:16]
Jacob
Yeah, it has to be.
- [32:18]
Don Hahn
And if you think about 1995, he has a chance to win the game. Now he the year before came up clutch because he had the put back dunk that sent the team to the finals, won the series. The following year he has a chance with the ball in his hands to make a bucket that will win the game again. And he hits the back rim and it goes out. And then after that, what happens in postseason for him, it's the inability to get past Jordan. Yes. Injuries, injuries in 98, 99, and it just kind of ended really poorly. But I think that 95:1 feels like that's a clutch moment. You got to come through and he didn't. And that was the thing with Patrick every year promising winning a championship, winning a championship. He loved that he set the tone every year. But the problem is never did. Now can you blame him for 94? Can you blame him for 94 when Starks took the shot that was blocked by Elijah 1 instead of passing to Ewing. And then in Game 7, Starks couldn't make it. He wasn't Ewing.
- [33:21]
Jacob
That was Starks owns 97. There's no game seven, game seven and 94.
- [33:26]
Don Hahn
There's no question but in the series against Elijah, one, he was outplayed by Elijah. And so I love the guy. But if we're making this list and we're being fair, as much as it kills me, he's got to be the fourth guy on the. Well.
- [33:38]
Jacob
And the reason he gets it to me in ahead of like a Barkley, for example, they really didn't have that moment. They just ran up against a better Bulls team and lost. Right. In the case of Charles in Phoenix and Carl Malone and anybody that lost
- [33:54]
Don Hahn
to the Bulls, it's like that was one of the greatest.
- [33:57]
Jacob
By the way, Patrick was able to do that, too.
- [33:59]
Don Hahn
Yeah.
- [34:00]
Jacob
Don't forget the Knicks also lost.
- [34:01]
Don Hahn
Yeah, they did. Yeah.
- [34:02]
Jacob
But that's not what we're talking about.
- [34:03]
Don Hahn
And 93 is a great example. It's 60 win team. Couldn't get past him, couldn't beat him. And you were up 20 in the series. Couldn't get past. All right, so that leaves us now with one more on the list. We have options. I want to make this a Democrat.
- [34:16]
Jacob
I like this. I like the discussion of the last
- [34:18]
Don Hahn
because I feel like this, this needs to be one that we all kick around a little bit. So with John here, with Anthony here as well, and Jacob back at the studio can certainly chime in. I'm going to give you three names and you tell me which one of these three from three different sports belongs as the last name on this list that we have given so far. The first name is Jim Kelly. Went to a Super bowl four straight years, never won one. There is Roberto Luongo, who might have won gold medals with Canada, but as a player in the NHL, he got to a Stanley cup final, lost four nothing in a game seven and was considered a guy that was one of the best at his position throughout his career, yet couldn't win the big one. And for a goaltender in the NHL, when you're one of the best goalies, that the kind of next thing is it's like the NFL. If you're one of the best quarterbacks, you got to win a Super Bowl. If you're one of the best goalies in the NHL, you got to find a way to win, if not one. Right. The greats all did it. We just mentioned Brodeur earlier. You know, Hasic, the best ones always do. So that's another one. And then the last name is one we've talked about already today. Aaron Judge put him in the current category along with Lamar Jackson.
- [35:37]
Jacob
Well, if you. Lamar is there, though.
- [35:39]
Don Hahn
You know what I mean? So because the reason is the fifth name.
- [35:42]
Jacob
The reason Lamar is there is not because of the level of the failures. The reason he's there is because of the level of the player that he. He is with the failures.
- [35:52]
Don Hahn
All right. Which is what makes Judge multiple MVP multi time. That's what Aaron judges.
- [35:57]
Jacob
Because those two players.
- [35:59]
Don Hahn
Record books. Aaron, Judge.
- [36:00]
Jacob
Judge is better than every other player you mentioned.
- [36:02]
Don Hahn
Yes. Yeah, I would.
- [36:03]
Jacob
None of, none of the ones you just mentioned.
- [36:05]
Don Hahn
Kelly and Luongo. Right.
- [36:07]
Jacob
Kelly's close. Kelly was really good.
- [36:08]
Don Hahn
Kelly was really good. Hall of Famer, but really good at his time. He was one of the best quarterbacks. Never the best, but nobody ever said, like, that's the pinnacle.
- [36:15]
Jacob
No. And Judges the pinnacle. Lamar has two MVPs. He is. Lamar is on one hand. He's there. There four guys basically were always there. One of them is Lamar. So I, I say Judge is probably the guy out of the only because of how good he is.
- [36:28]
Don Hahn
Anthony. All right, John.
- [36:32]
Jacob
No, you don't. I don't have to be right on this.
- [36:33]
Don Hahn
No, but it's. It's how good he arguments.
- [36:36]
Peter Rosenberg
Yeah.
- [36:36]
Don Hahn
It's the game of who you taking out and. And Jake. I got Judge.
- [36:40]
Jacob
Wow.
- [36:41]
Don Hahn
Jake is the fake Mets fan because he also likes the Dodgers. That's crazy. So
- [36:47]
Jacob
that was a good drop.
- [36:48]
Don Hahn
That's a really good drop.
- [36:49]
Jacob
I'd like you to mark your. That's crazy there.
- [36:51]
Don Hahn
Yeah, we need that.
- [36:51]
Jacob
And also we haven't gotten enough. Don I sucks today. I think we need some of those as well. Every time we mentioned Don not being here.
- [36:58]
Don Hahn
Yeah, that's right.
- [36:59]
Jacob
Which, by the way, you notice he's writing that in our text group.
- [37:01]
Don Hahn
He keeps texting it. He keeps texting that too.
- [37:03]
Peter Rosenberg
I suck.
- [37:04]
Jacob
Yeah, Don feels really bad.
- [37:05]
Don Hahn
It was such a sad moment too, when he said it today. It was like, oh, don't. So of course, instead of like saying, I don't feel bad, it's like, it's like, hey, get back in the bubble.
- [37:14]
Jacob
Yeah, he pulled the pusick right there.
- [37:16]
Don Hahn
It just.
- [37:16]
Jacob
It just brought us down instead.
- [37:18]
Don Hahn
Right. All right, well, that's the list then, if that's what we're doing.
- [37:20]
Jacob
I love what you've done.
- [37:21]
Don Hahn
Greg Norman, James Harden, Lamar Jackson, Patrick Ewing, Aaron Judge.
- [37:28]
Jacob
Five best players without.
- [37:30]
Don Hahn
Seemingly without greatest players who just never were able to come through in the clutch.
- [37:36]
Jacob
I love what you.
- [37:37]
Don Hahn
Now again, the Ewing one. You could argue the put back dunk was a clutch moment, but it was a put back dunking. It wasn't like, give him the ball and make something happen. Right? Is that fair?
- [37:48]
Jacob
Yeah, yeah.
- [37:49]
Don Hahn
Because again, it's the who you taking out of it. Jim Kelly did get to Super Bowls, but man, he had some untimely interceptions.
- [37:56]
Jacob
He did.
- [37:57]
Don Hahn
I mean, the big comeback that the Bills had that year against Houston, the Oilers, do you admit.
- [38:02]
Jacob
Yeah, that's right.
- [38:03]
Don Hahn
In 93, he got hurt. Frank Reich came in the game second. If he's the one that led the comeback. That's your new jets offensive coordinator.
- [38:10]
Jacob
That's your.
- [38:10]
Don Hahn
That's exactly so he was even part of what would have been one of the epic comebacks in playoff history.
- [38:14]
Jacob
Now listen, the Scott Norwood game, you can't put that on Jim.
- [38:16]
Don Hahn
That is not on him.
- [38:17]
Jacob
He put them in position, but you
- [38:18]
Don Hahn
could argue, however, they did not get down the field. Remember, that field goal was 47 yards,
- [38:23]
Jacob
which at the time, 47 to 43.
- [38:25]
Peter Rosenberg
47.
- [38:26]
Don Hahn
47.
- [38:28]
Peter Rosenberg
Yeah.
- [38:28]
Jacob
They only scored 19 points. And that's a great offense. That was a really, I mean, Andre Reed, James Lofton, that's a really good Thurman Thomas, that's a hell of an offense.
- [38:37]
Don Hahn
But it was also a great defense. So, you know, they got neutralized. So anyway, that's the list. Agree or disagree with any of the names, including Judge being on that. We'll take your calls at 800 now. A93776.
- [38:49]
Jacob
Let's do it.
- [38:50]
Don Hahn
So we'll get to calls. We got more to get to, of course, with you. And a lot more fun happening right now here at Calandra's Bakery in Caldwell, New Jersey. Don Hahn and Rosenberg, ESPN New York.
- [39:01]
Rich Eisen
Rich Eisen here. The tax deadline will be here before you know it and you just want to know your taxes are actually being handled. But the old way, you hand everything off and then silence. Days pass, weeks pass. You start wondering, should I send another follow up email? It feels like you're chasing updates and getting nowhere. But now taxes are different because your taxes are done for you by a TurboTax full service expert. With Intuit TurboTax, you can match with your dedicated tax expert and hand off everything right in the app. And while your expert checks for every deduction, you'll see real time updates on your phone. So you always know exactly where things stand. Suddenly you're not refreshing your inbox. You're going for a run, grabbing a coffee, scrolling anything other than a just checking in message because your TurboTax expert is handling it and keeping you in the loop. So this tax season, get your best possible outcome and every dollar you deserve without the guesswork visit turbotax.com today to learn more. Real time updates only in iOS mobile app only available with TurboTax full service
- [40:07]
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Rich Eisen
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- [41:47]
Don Hahn
thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.
- [41:50]
Jacob
I didn't listen to anything you just said.
- [41:52]
Don Hahn
Catch the show on demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcast. Oh, Jersey Zone.
- [42:03]
Jacob
Oh, I like what you've done. I like what you've done.
- [42:05]
Don Hahn
Yeah. What was that?
- [42:07]
Peter Rosenberg
Say that again.
- [42:09]
Don Hahn
The Queen's birthday.
- [42:10]
Jacob
Latifah's birthday.
- [42:11]
Don Hahn
Is she 55?
- [42:15]
Jacob
I. I'd say she maybe 58.
- [42:17]
Don Hahn
You think she's older than me? I thought we were the same age.
- [42:20]
Jacob
Oh, if you knew.
- [42:21]
Don Hahn
56. What? She's 56. All right. She's a year old. Okay, so she's a seven.
- [42:26]
Jacob
One of the craziest experiences I had when I first got to New York in 07 around some time that within that first year there was a charity softball game between like Hot 97 and the Newark, like, fire department or something. The whole thing in retrospect, like an episode of a TV show about my life that, like, no one could have ever believed this. Like a year earlier. I'm just a jamoke in Mary.
- [42:55]
Don Hahn
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [42:56]
Jacob
And now I'm on a softball team with like, Funk Master Flex, Angie Martinez, Queen Latifah. No, it was a crazy for me at that time, having just been plucked out of obscurity.
- [43:12]
Don Hahn
Right.
- [43:12]
Jacob
It was. And I had a terrible throw to flex. I played third and I had a terrible throw to flex that led to him when he reached out to make the catch. It was a bad enough throw that like, he fell over flat on his face making the catch. Oh, man. Angie and Queen Latifah had like a flask in the dugout.
- [43:31]
Don Hahn
Oh, it was a. Oh, yeah.
- [43:33]
Jacob
It's a charity game, for God's sake.
- [43:34]
Don Hahn
Of course it is. Yes.
- [43:35]
Jacob
Oh, it's a time. Happy birthday, Latifah.
- [43:38]
Don Hahn
Absolutely. Hey, let's do a game time here.
- [43:40]
Jacob
Why not?
- [43:41]
Don Hahn
Everybody can join in if you know what you're supposed to do.
- [43:43]
Jacob
Or don't. Or don't let the drop play and move on. Just call it a day.
- [43:46]
Don Hahn
Sure.
- [43:47]
Jacob
As my wife likes to say. Good.
- [43:48]
Don Hahn
Call it a day. Call it a day.
- [43:49]
Peter Rosenberg
Yeah.
- [43:50]
Don Hahn
She had a lot.
- [43:50]
Jacob
My wife will use.
- [43:51]
Don Hahn
She says that a lot to you.
- [43:52]
Jacob
She uses. Call it. Whenever she wants to sum anything up. I'll be. We're deciding on food. It's like, how about order some sesame chicken?
- [43:59]
Don Hahn
Let me just call it a day. That's her. I'm all set.
- [44:02]
Jacob
It's.
- [44:02]
Peter Rosenberg
It's always.
- [44:03]
Jacob
It's her. All set. Is we're gonna call it a day.
- [44:05]
Don Hahn
Well, we're gonna call it game time. Brought to you by Tullamore. Do Irish whiskey. Because when it's game time, It certainly is. It's also why we're here at Calandras in Caldwell, New Jersey. Why? Rangers Devils coverage immediately follows us on 880 at 6:30. Note the start time. And we will have a watch party here at Calandras with you, ken Danico, Rick DiPietro, Peter Rosenberg.
- [44:34]
Peter Rosenberg
That's right.
- [44:35]
Don Hahn
And Mio.
- [44:37]
Jacob
That was the worst dad joke. And yet I loved it. You know, that's how you know it's bad. It just worked. That's how you know I'm there, that I'm a dad, that I thought that was legitimately funny.
- [44:44]
Don Hahn
We're just efforting things right now. Also, if you care to watch some basketball. The Nets host the Thunder.
- [44:52]
Jacob
Wow. That's going to go. What's the line on that?
- [44:55]
Don Hahn
Talk about two extremes.
- [44:57]
Jacob
Let me get on the duel.
- [44:58]
Don Hahn
That's a 7:30 tip off in Brooklyn. Tullamore Dew, the original triple distilled, triple blended, triple cast matured Irish whiskey. Be sure to grab a Telemurdo or try the new Tullamore Dew. Honey, during today's action, glasses up to enjoying Tullamore Dew responsibly.
- [45:13]
Jacob
It's only. The line is only 18 and a half.
- [45:16]
Don Hahn
18 and a half. Boy, pretty close to Liu's line against Arizona.
- [45:24]
Jacob
I'm ready for Liu, baby. Friday. Friday, 1:30. Fins up, baby.
- [45:29]
Don Hahn
So, checked out, by the way, on our show Friday.
- [45:31]
Jacob
Oh, yeah, we're going to be in that.
- [45:32]
Peter Rosenberg
Come on.
- [45:33]
Don Hahn
800 now at 93776. Let's get some more calls in here. Mark in New Jersey has some clutch recommendation. Mark.
- [45:43]
Peter Rosenberg
Hey, guys, I just want to chime in on your clutch list, okay? I think Tony Romo belongs on that list. Anytime there was a big game, he
- [45:52]
Don Hahn
choke horrible, not terrible. And you remember that playoff game where he went to, like, Cabo with Jessica Simpson? They all got mad at him for that. Came back and couldn't play. You wonder why. You remember what Mickey said?
- [46:04]
Peter Rosenberg
Yeah.
- [46:06]
Don Hahn
You don't know.
- [46:06]
Peter Rosenberg
He was one of the best quarterbacks in the time. I mean, he wasn't putting up like MVP numbers, but he always had Dallas in position.
- [46:13]
Don Hahn
He's. He's taking some. All right, so who are you taking out? If we're. If we're putting Romo in, who are you taking out?
- [46:18]
Jacob
Who are you taking out?
- [46:19]
Peter Rosenberg
I would say take Lamar right now.
- [46:21]
Don Hahn
Take Lamar out.
- [46:23]
Peter Rosenberg
Give Lamar a little bit of a pass because he's still playing. So he still has time to get off of that schneide where he can say he's got that clutch gene. But Tony Romo, in my opinion, he was probably. He was one of the biggest choke artists in the game of the NFL.
- [46:37]
Jacob
Wow.
- [46:38]
Don Hahn
Gotcha, Mark. Thank you, Mark. Probably clearly a Giants fan.
- [46:42]
Jacob
By the way, though, it was the first one that came to my mind was, no, Romo's a good.
- [46:46]
Don Hahn
Rom was a good one. But was he ever the best? The best. When I say the greatest players, I'm talking about MVP guys. Like, Romo was never that.
- [46:55]
Jacob
No, right. That's why Jack is closer.
- [46:59]
Don Hahn
But even Dak doesn't have, like, you gotta have trophies on your shelf to be in this conversation. Who are we talking about? We're talking about vezina winners and MVPs and like, like scoring champions. Who.
- [47:09]
Jacob
Does Patrick have an mvp?
- [47:10]
Don Hahn
No.
- [47:11]
Jacob
I mean, he's close. He floated, he floated around there.
- [47:14]
Don Hahn
But he was always considered one of the best players in the league. 100% during, during his, his, his best era. Let's see. Keith in the car has a. Brings up a name that someone here also brought up with us.
- [47:25]
Jacob
Keith.
- [47:27]
Peter Rosenberg
Henrik Lundquist. How you doing, guys?
- [47:29]
Don Hahn
Interesting. King Henrik.
- [47:31]
Peter Rosenberg
Yeah, they always seem like a softball at the wrong time.
- [47:35]
Jacob
Anthony. Anthony the Ranger. The resident Ranger fan is vetoing your call, saying that it was not Hank's fault. Like they don't have the championship. But you can't pin it on Hank.
- [47:44]
Don Hahn
He did take him to a final and in that like that run, he was the reason why.
- [47:50]
Peter Rosenberg
I know, but it just.
- [47:53]
Jacob
He's supposed to be the best goalie of all time.
- [47:55]
Peter Rosenberg
One of the best ones.
- [47:58]
Jacob
Thank you for the call. We appreciate it. But the problem is it's about whether the person themselves came up small in those situations.
- [48:06]
Don Hahn
Like if he got lit up or he got beat on a penalty shot. Like if there was something that happened where it was clearly. Yeah, thank you, Keith. If it was clearly something that, you know, like, like it's his fault, it's a totally different story. But I don't know, you, you lead your team to a run to the final. I, I gotta feel like he cannot be on this list now.
- [48:26]
Jacob
Bet now about best goaltender who never won a Stanley cup is a different conversation. Hank might be right there, but that's not this.
- [48:33]
Don Hahn
How about Muhammad Muhammad on Long Island Mo.
- [48:39]
Peter Rosenberg
What's going on, guys? Man, thanks for taking my call. Both of these might be a little, I don't know, out on the edges, but TMac was one of the best in the league in his prom, as good as anybody. And he never got out of the first round even when he got Yao. I mean, he ran up against Jack and Kobe, but I mean to not make it out of the first round. I don't know how clutch we can call you. And then my second one, now this one is controversial. I want to go. Peyton Manning, the best. He's my favorite quarterback ever. The best. But in these clutch moments, man, he. He does some head scratching things. I mean, I don't know if you remember. I think the first, the first, the first year he was in Denver and he threw like a cross body interception for the game against Baltimore. And I was like, what was that? You know what I mean? So. And in both his championships he got a gimme against Brett Grossman. And then the defense, I Love this call.
- [49:26]
Don Hahn
This is.
- [49:27]
Jacob
I. I love your call.
- [49:28]
Peter Rosenberg
He's great.
- [49:29]
Don Hahn
Second one, too. He was kind of a passenger in
- [49:32]
Jacob
the second, so he was the first one. Let's not forget, though, Brady owned him in the rivalry in the playoffs.
- [49:37]
Don Hahn
Yep.
- [49:38]
Jacob
That's the thing. The. The Rex Grossman year where they went on to play the Bears and win the super bowl, that was the year they got past them. But in general, the reason Keith's call is so good is that as great as Peyton was in the big spot, he was generally owned. So I like that. That's a. That's a different play on it.
- [49:56]
Don Hahn
Don Lagreca has chimed in, I suck. No, Don, he did not say I suck.
- [50:00]
Jacob
What did he say?
- [50:01]
Don Hahn
He said, and I quote.
- [50:03]
Jacob
All right, I'm very curious about where
- [50:05]
Don Hahn
this could go because there was also someone here in the audience that brought up Henrik Lundquist to us as well. And I said, okay, that's. That's. We. We argued it about.
- [50:13]
Rich Eisen
Yeah, I saw you having a spirited conversation.
- [50:15]
Don Hahn
Response. Is that Hank Take is God awful.
- [50:22]
Jacob
You mean the idea that he'd be in it?
- [50:24]
Don Hahn
Yeah.
- [50:24]
Jacob
Okay.
- [50:25]
Don Hahn
So he's. He does not believe Henrik should be in this conversation again at all.
- [50:29]
Jacob
Best goaltenders to never win a cup. Put Hank in the conversation.
- [50:33]
Don Hahn
Oh, yeah. But don't say he wasn't.
- [50:35]
Jacob
That he's not the reason they didn't get a Cup.
- [50:37]
Don Hahn
Best players, meaning you had to be at the pinnacle of the sport who just couldn't come through when it mattered most.
- [50:43]
Jacob
And again, that's why I'll say it for the third time. But Keith's call is so good because it doesn't have to be someone who never won, but Peyton should have won more. That's the thing.
- [50:53]
Don Hahn
That's for how good.
- [50:54]
Jacob
Yo, Peyton. For those of us who were really watching the NFL at that time, like hardcore watching the NFL. I'm sorry, Week to week, Peyton was better than Brady. No question. I'm not even. Not even the same category, if I'm being honest. Peyton at his best is on a
- [51:07]
Don Hahn
completely different level than Brady, talent wise.
- [51:10]
Jacob
Not even close.
- [51:10]
Don Hahn
Yes.
- [51:11]
Jacob
Like, so the fact that Brady owned him speaks to the fact that and Peyton had. You're talking about two of the great receivers of the era.
- [51:18]
Don Hahn
But that's what.
- [51:19]
Jacob
One of which. Of all time.
- [51:20]
Don Hahn
And that's what we're saying about Aaron Judge, talent wise, does anyone come close to what he can be? Right.
- [51:26]
Jacob
Only one guy.
- [51:27]
Don Hahn
No one comes close when it comes to what he can do in the field and obviously at the plate. But has he had that moment at the biggest spot? And yesterday was another opportunity and we watched and said we've seen this before and that's why it's part of the conversation today, right or wrong. We'll get more into that coming up. And everybody here at Calandras, by the way, if you're looking for a new beer to try, Calandras has a devil's themed beer on tap right now from Tom's River Brewing. It's called Stick Toss. Ask for it now. So if you want to get a new beer, try it out right now. We will be here at Calandras with you for the rest of the night. Watch Party Rangers, Devils. Coming up after our show, come on down, hang out with us. We got more to do with you, including Aaron. Judge the criticism fair or not. We'll discuss that and more coming up. Don Han, Rosenberg, ESPN New York thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.
- [52:21]
Jacob
I don't want to know how the
- [52:22]
Don Hahn
sausage is made, man. I just want to know it's good. Hear more of Don Allen and Peter weekday afternoon starting at 3 on 8 80, ESPN, the ESPN New York app. And you, your smart speakers, Monster Energy. Everybody knows White Monster Zero Ultra, that's the og. It kicked off this whole Zero sugar energy drink thing, but Ultra is a whole lineup now. You've got Strawberry Dreams, Blue Hawaiian Sunrise and Vice Guava. And they all bring the Monster Energy punch.
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Jacob
So if you've been living in the
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Don Hahn
White can branch out.
- [52:57]
Jacob
Ultra's got a flavor for every vibe
- [52:59]
Don Hahn
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