Hour 2: Monica McNutt & The List

Summary

Don, Hahn & Rosenberg — Hour 2: Monica McNutt & The List

Date: April 1, 2026
Podcast: ESPN New York
Hosts: Alan Hahn, Peter Rosenberg
Guest: Monica McNutt

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Episode Overview

This engaging hour centers on turmoil and uncertainty with the New York Knicks as the postseason looms, featuring an extended segment with ESPN analyst Monica McNutt. The crew examines coaching controversies, team chemistry and accountability, playoff outlooks, and whether this Knicks’ core truly missed their best title window. Later, the hosts debate the best Yankees and Mets players of the 21st century, with lively banter, fan calls, and some heartfelt personal tangents.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Knicks Crisis: Is It Coaching or Chemistry?

(Start–10:38)

• Current Mood: The Knicks’ recent struggles, including a disappointing outing in Houston, have fans and hosts questioning the team’s identity and direction.

• Is Mike Brown the Problem? Theoretical discussions arise about whether a coaching change is justified, even this late in the season.

  • Quote:
    “I’m not advocating a coaching change, but…if I believe Mike Brown’s a problem, what would stop you from making the move now?” — Rosenberg (01:17)
  • Monica McNutt's View: Lack of trust and chemistry on the coaching staff make a sudden change risky. She reflects on historic examples (Jeff Van Gundy’s ascension post-Don Nelson) showing muscle memory can help, but doesn't see a strong internal candidate now (01:44–02:27).

• Team Accountability:

  • Players like Mitchell Robinson and Josh Hart have publicly questioned the team’s focus and direction. Monica sees this as evidence of “a lack of cohesiveness.”
  • Quote:
    “The real ability to be a good team is to figure out how we pull in the same direction…The games are not actually played on paper.” — Monica McNutt (03:50, 10:06)

• Was Last Year the Real Window?

  • Hahn wonders if the team missed their best shot already.
  • Quote:
    “If I said to you my overall concern is that maybe the window was last year, not this year…what would you say to that?” — Don Hahn (07:20)
  • Monica sympathizes: “But we can’t go back in time — you have to figure out how to make it work with what's in front of you now.” (08:00)

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2. Evaluating Expectations and the Eastern Conference Landscape

(10:38–14:53)

• The team and fan base may have overestimated the Knicks’ chances, basing faith more on others’ injuries (Boston’s Tatum, Indiana’s Halliburton) than on New York’s inherent strength.

  • Quote:
    “Should we be basing our disappointment on a prediction at the beginning of the season that has grossly changed over time?” — Rosenberg (10:53)

• Monica points out that the Knicks are “battling the ghost of their teams of the past,” and that nothing in the East is given — with improved teams like Detroit and Boston’s resurgence (11:22–12:17).

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3. Tonight’s Knicks Game, Playoff Outlook, and Seeding Scenarios

(13:19–17:33)

• Monica just wants to see the Knicks fight: “I expect a win, but I want to see a team compete…get off to a better start.” (13:19)

• Seeding Discussion:

  • Monica prefers a first-round matchup with Toronto, “Toronto is my ask” (15:50), and is wary of both Atlanta and Philly due to their athleticism and up-tempo offenses.
  • She doubts the value of manipulating playoff seeding: “It’s not in me to play with the statistics and lose on purpose to try to get four…Let’s not play around intentionally.” (15:50–16:57)

• Memorable Moment: Banter about accidentally calling hosts by the wrong name — Monica mistakes Han for Rosenberg — sparking jokes about familial name confusion (06:12, 17:46).

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4. Knicks’ Identity Crisis and Radical Moves

(20:42–24:59)

• Don and Rosenberg revisit whether firing Mike Brown would be “too radical,” especially after last year’s firing of Tom Thibodeau right after a conference finals run.

  • “Radical is in the eye of the beholder…but you have to do what you think is the right thing to do at that time…” — Rosenberg (21:30)
  • Don’s Real Take: “Lately, they’ve lost five straight games to teams with losing records. That is concerning.” (21:30)

• The hosts lament the lack of progress despite a new system, emphasizing the shocking lack of late-season improvements.

  • “If you’re trying to put in a new system, that would explain a slow start and then eventually beginning to build…It just seems like they’re losing it as the season goes on. That doesn’t make any sense.” — Rosenberg (23:46)

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5. The List: Best Yankees & Mets of the 21st Century

(28:00–39:23)

• Inspired by a fan request, Rosenberg lists top Yankees and Mets since 2001.
• Yankees List: Derek Jeter, Mariano Rivera, CC Sabathia, Alex Rodriguez, Aaron Judge
  • Honorable mentions: Mike Mussina, Mark Teixeira, Hideki Matsui
• Mets List: David Wright, Jose Reyes, Jacob deGrom, Pete Alonso, Carlos Beltran
  • Notably, Mike Piazza does not make the 21st-century cut, based on his post-2000 stats.
• Spirited debate about who should be dropped for Piazza, eventually concluding the current five’s body of work is just too large to bump anyone:
  • “I think you’d have a better chance arguing deGrom off the list than Beltran.” — Rosenberg (38:45)
  • “If you have a player who, in his time, was in multiple seasons considered the best at what he does…he’s on the list.” — Don Hahn (38:59)

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6. Listener Call and Deeper Knicks Analysis

(44:47–49:09)

• Listener Peter calls in, referencing an NY Post article blaming Karl-Anthony Towns for the team’s struggles due to post-play inefficiency and turnovers (45:00–46:37).
• Don breaks down the debate: Is it the player, the coach, or the system? Concludes: “There’s no answer…it’s all three.” (48:34)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On team identity & urgency:
  “The real ability to be a good team is to figure out how we pull in the same direction…This team, to me, has not answered those questions this year. Well, consistently at all.” — Monica McNutt (03:50)
• On missed opportunity:
  “If you were ever going to get OKC, you had to get them when there was some doubt in their mind…Now that they know, if you meet them now, they already know.” — Don Hahn (09:01)
• On radical change:
  “Radical, to me, is just…you have to do what you think is the right thing at that particular time and not be intimidated by, ‘Well, that’s unconventional’.” — Rosenberg (21:30)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• 00:33–01:04: Knicks recent struggles; Monica McNutt joins
• 01:17–02:27: Discussion of potential coaching changes and internal candidates
• 03:20–04:59: Player accountability, team identity, locker room issues
• 05:28–06:36: Radical change debate (Brown vs. past decisions)
• 07:20–10:06: Was last year the team’s best championship window?
• 10:38–12:17: Should expectations shift based on changing NBA landscape?
• 13:19–15:50: What Monica wants to see in tonight’s game; playoff seeding
• 20:42–24:59: Frustrations with the team’s recent performance; new system not working
• 28:00–39:23: “The List” – Yankees and Mets of the 21st century
• 44:47–49:09: Caller Peter breaks down Knicks’ Towns dilemma and coaching debate

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Tone and Language

• The episode is lively, candid, and deeply knowledgeable, with a mix of critical sports analysis, insider anecdotes, and playful banter.

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For New Listeners

You’ll leave with a nuanced understanding of the Knicks’ current tension points: leadership, chemistry, and whether last year’s success masked deeper problems; plus, you get a fun, nostalgia-packed debate on NY baseball icons of the modern era.

Transcript

[Don Hahn]

Protein is now at Starbucks and it's never tasted so good. You can add protein cold foam to your favorite drink or try one of our new protein lattes or matcha. Try it today at Starbucks.

[Podcast Host]

This is the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.

[Rosenberg]

That sounds like heaven to me.

[Podcast Host]

Listen live weekday afternoon starting at 3 on 880 ESPN, the ESPN New York app and your smart speakers.

[Rosenberg]

402 in the big city. Don Hahn and Rosenberg with you till six, seven o'.

[Peter]

Clock.

[Rosenberg]

Mets and the Cardinals tied at one as we move to the top of the seventh inning rubber match of that three game series. Mets head to San Francisco after this one. Getting underway in about 30 minutes will be the rubber match between the Yankees and the Mariners in Seattle. But the Knicks are the major topic of conversation. Really disappointing outing in Houston. They play tonight in Memphis against the Grizzlies. And It's Wednesday, it's 4 o' clock and that means Monica McNutt joins us here on Donjon and Rosenfield Peter list today. Hopefully that's not a problem.

[Monica McNutt]

Hi guys.

[Rosenberg]

How are you?

[Monica McNutt]

I'm. I am cruising around Phoenix so I'm good. I just missed my turn, but it's all good.

[Don Hahn]

Women's final four on deck. Monica. Don, starting trouble today?

[Rosenberg]

I am starting a little bit of trouble and I want to know if you want to, you want to climb a board or not. I, I'm not advocating a coaching change, but what I'm saying is if I believe Mike Brown's a problem, what would stop you from making the move now if you believe that Mike Browning is the problem with this Nick team

[Monica McNutt]

that is loaded. My first thought when you ask what would stop me is that there's not enough confidence down the rest of the coaching staff. I don't know that to be true. But I think if we liken this to the experience or what happened in Denver, Adelman had been with that organization for a while and same thing in Sacramento. Mike's last spot, honestly. Right. Like Doug Christie. Doug was. Yeah. Doug Christie has been with him for a while and so there's a rapport there. Now what is unique and could be considered is Mike Brown melted his staff into the previous staff. Yes, there were some changes, but there have been some holdovers. Assistant assistant coach, interim head coach Rick Brunson, anyone? I don't.

[Don Hahn]

I mean that would be the only right. That would be the one that would. Because he can bring. It's. It's a very like in the history that I connected to was Jeff Van Gundy was on Pat Riley's Staff, Don Nelson kept him. And then when they realized that Don Nelson wasn't the guy at the end of the next season, they gave the team to Jeff Van Gundy as an interim. And. And Jeff just said, all right, everything we did with Riles we're going to do now. And everything just kind of fell into place because it was muscle memory. That's all you could think of. I think the easiest thing if you were going to do it. But as Don prefaced it, if you feel like the team is not being coached well, that's what you do. Or if the team is not responding to the coaching, that's what you do. But all of this is because, Monica, look, we can look at numbers, and I've said that this is one of the best statistical seasons the Knicks have ever had, but the eyes tell you on some nights that just something isn't right. And when you hear Mitchell Robinson last week saying that, you know, we can't keep messing around like we've got a, you know, he was speaking up, warning the team about their attitude and approach to play, and then Josh Hart last night calling out the team again. And when he says, monica, I just think we're not going in the right direction. What are you reading from just those quotes?

[Monica McNutt]

You know what, Han? I'm with you because what do you mean we're not going in the right direction with six games left to go? What does that even mean? Right. And so I think there is. Listen, and I never want to pick apart any particular side, the nature of team experiences that everyone carries and shoulders some of the responsibility, accountability, and in this case, blame. But I'm with you. When you look at the way that this team stepped out on the floor versus Charlotte, the way they stepped out on the floor versus Houston, I actually thought they played well versus Oklahoma City. But there is something that is obvious that demonstrates a lack of cohesiveness right now. Whichever side you are on in terms of who's responsible, the real ability to be a good team is to figure out how we pull in the same direction. And that doesn't mean that we're all best friends, right? But it means that who we are is clear. And we have questioned this team's identity from a basketball standpoint all season long. So that's still a question that's being answered at this point in the season. And then how we go about our business, whether you like it or not, because you. We've all covered the league for a while, and as much as we want to say you guys have a Chance to do something really special. There's still egos at play, right? So we know what we're doing and we know the best formula to do it. And this team, to me, has not answered those questions this year. Well, consistently at all.

[Rosenberg]

And I know it sounds outrageous to do Monica, even though there is precedent in other sports, but is it any more radical than letting Tibs go? I mean, think about it. They let Tibs go after giving them a multi year contract. What? The year before he takes you to the conference final for the first time since 1999. It's all about feel, right? Like, so it seemed crazy they did what they did with Tibbs, but they thought it was the right thing. Is it any more radical than maybe addressing Mike Brown with six games to go?

[Monica McNutt]

It is a little more radical for me, Rosenberg, in that.

[Rosenberg]

Well, wait a minute.

[Don Hahn]

Oh, no, wait. I gotta tell you, Monica, you didn't do it.

[Rosenberg]

Distinctly different human beings. I'm a full foot taller than he is.

[Don Hahn]

Oh, no.

[Rosenberg]

All right, we have.

[Don Hahn]

We're polar opposites.

[Rosenberg]

You know what? Al, take over, man. I gotta take a break. The Mets are playing. I'll talk to you. We'll talk next week.

[Monica McNutt]

Maybe the voices are blending together.

[Rosenberg]

No, you know what? You. I thought in Arizona was the only thing you missed today.

[Don Hahn]

Don told you that Peter's not here today.

[Monica McNutt]

He.

[Don Hahn]

He. Actually, I didn't hear that part.

[Monica McNutt]

I missed my turn. Sorry.

[Don Hahn]

I wish you could have seen Don's face when you said Rosenberg.

[Monica McNutt]

I'm sorry.

[Rosenberg]

How do you tell somebody you don't matter without telling you, bro.

[Monica McNutt]

It's not like that. I get called Malika all the time and I have to be like. That's actually not my name, but thank you for your support. So, you know, I support. That's all I'm saying.

[Don Hahn]

What was. What was the point you were making, Rosenberg? What was the point you were making now?

[Rosenberg]

The point. She was answering the question.

[Peter]

No.

[Monica McNutt]

Okay. And here's the thing. I think it's a great question. I feel like it's a little bit more radical because you just hired this guy. He had ample time to wear on you. Right. What I will say is it would demonstrate a level of urgency which I think everybody that is about this team and supports this team wants to see them have a chance. If they did decide to go that route, it would demonstrate a level of urgency. But, you know, between that and the noise and the chatter around the Bridges thing, and I still say, similar to what happened last year, Bridges has a chance to prove himself if he can make it happen when it matters most. That's a lot of, like a lot of whiff on the front office. I think if it were to go

[Don Hahn]

down that way, actually bringing up bridges is a great, great example of a player who was supposed to have really, you know, benefited from a coaching change. And really all you're getting the same regular season result. That's, that's certainly part of the problem. But Monica, if I told you that my concern, my overall concern, not, not a more direct one, but more of just the overall. If I said to you my overall concern is that maybe the window was last year, not this year. We all went into this year going, this has got to be the year this has got. Maybe we didn't realize that it was actually last year. Once you got past Boston and they didn't get there. What would you say to that?

[Monica McNutt]

I understand. I totally understand that. But I would also say we can't go back in time.

[Don Hahn]

No, I know, I know.

[Monica McNutt]

You know what I mean? Like, you got to figure out a way to make it work with what's in front of you now. But I do. Like, I think we all will think of that high bouncing shot in game one as we continue to archive our experience and our history as a part of Mixed Nation. But I wouldn't argue with you that. And Han, like, as thrilling as the last couple years have been, the feeling of getting out of Boston, when similar to the way this team has looked versus Detroit this regular season or Oklahoma City this regular season, we roll into that series like, okay, like, all you could do is play and see what happens. But it had not. You had no reason to believe that what was going to happen last year should have unfolded. Now, I will say that I think when we look back at it in the big basketball context, apart from New York City, that Pacers team obviously was better than people thought.

[Don Hahn]

Yes.

[Monica McNutt]

But you know, that first bounce on

[Don Hahn]

in game one, that still really, that was the moment.

[Monica McNutt]

And wonder.

[Don Hahn]

It's amazing how much bigger that moment has become as we get further away from it because like I probably overthinking all this, but that I'm a classic overthinker. And it tells me you're supposed to win that series. You're supposed to win that game one. And that changed everything. They changed the fortunes. It changed how you had to play. Everything changed at that moment. And then you think if you were ever going to get okc, you had to get them when there was some doubt in their mind of whether or not they could do it like they went to. They went to seven games. It wasn't as if the Thunder rolled to the championship. They had moments, you know, moment of truths a couple of times, even in that series, let alone the one before it. So that's when, in my mind, I'm like, if you were gonna get them, you had to get them while a young team was still not sure they. They had it. And now that they know, if you meet them now, I mean, they already know. They've already been there. And so when I think about windows, that's the stuff I worry about is, was that window last year? That's all.

[Monica McNutt]

Yeah.

[Don Hahn]

No, I want to be wrong.

[Monica McNutt]

I don't think that's a fair. Yeah, that's a totally fair thing to assess in my mind, but. But I will. And there is a glimmer of hope and optimism in that. That team had no business beating Boston the way they did last year either. So if you could figure it out in this short window, as much as we all deduce and look at stats and watch the tape, the games are not actually played on paper. So you gotta get in there and give yourself a chance. That's all you got.

[Rosenberg]

Malika McNutt with her weakest spot here.

[Don Hahn]

You got your back.

[Monica McNutt]

Fair.

[Don Hahn]

Fair.

[Monica McNutt]

Totally fair.

[Rosenberg]

Monica, I've been saying it. I think we sometimes lose where we're at. This team was predicted to go to the Eastern Conference final based mostly on the situation with the Celtics and the Pacers.

[Don Hahn]

Right?

[Rosenberg]

Not so much, because we really had belief that this team was all that good. It was just that. Yeah, listen, they went to the conference final last year. They beat Boston. Boston doesn't have Tatum. No. Halliburton, who beat him in the conference final. They should cruise. Well, now Tatum is back with Boston. Detroit's much better than we thought. Like, if we analyze it now, should we be overly surprised where they are? Should we be basing our discipline on a prediction, the beginning of the season that has grossly changed over time, that you know what?

[Monica McNutt]

And that. That you nailed it. I mean, you nailed it. Golly, Don. Like, I think the. And I said this the other day on a pregame show, and I said it to you guys. This team is battling the ghost of its teams of the past. Right? But if we stop, all things considered right here, right now, I mean, the asterisk might be the Cade Cunningham injury currently to Detroit, but if we stop right here, right now, it's a battle for this team. Nothing is given. Because you look at the two teams at the Top of the conference. I mean, we haven't even talked about Cleveland, which historically the Knicks have performed well again. But that's a little bit of a different animal with James Harden, given all of his playoff success or lack thereof. Right. If you. If we just looked at these teams that had no context to your point, no expectation, if we just looked. I don't know that you would. Matter of fact, you wouldn't. You would probably lean Boston, right? Like you would say Boston, it's Boston's year again, which. Because they have been sort of the painful reality of sport, right?

[Don Hahn]

Yeah, yeah. They. They have been sort of a feeling all year of this, this team with a chip on its shoulder and a little bit of a team of destiny thing with the Tatum return that surprised everybody, the 50 wins, the fact that they were, you know, they. They didn't have the gap year that we all thought it was going to be like. They have been that Celtic pride kind of season. So that's what the story is. As Don likes to say in the championship dvd. This is. This is the story that they'll tell, is how this was supposed to be a gap year. Tonight they play Memphis and it's almost like the perfect opponent you needed after a night like last night, right? Like, you had to. You had to have. It's almost like play right away, get it out of your system. After being angry about what happened last night, Don and I talked about what we expect to see tonight. Now, I know you're in Phoenix, you're there for the final Four. You won't really be on a broadcast or like you normally are with this, but what are you, like, what do you need to see tonight to at least feel better about something? What do you need to say?

[Monica McNutt]

You know what? I. And I gotta put an ashes on that because who's playing?

[Don Hahn]

I know.

[Monica McNutt]

You know what I mean? Like, you gotta navigate the injury piece of it. I want to see a team fight. I want to see a team compete. I want to see a team that gets off to a better start. Which on, to be fair, are some of the same things we talked about when we started talking about the last dozen games of the season, the last 15 games of the season. Like, what can this team do over this stretch, right? And look, I can't. I was walking and talking with one of the players and he said to me, we almost had to get on a call with the league because why would they schedule all of these teams that are so bad at the same time? And he acknowledged the human nature of it. All right. To me, the way we talked about this team coming into this season and even as you look at the terrain, they still have veterans and you're supposed to have a head coach that has been experienced deep into June, the personal accountability to be able to turn, rev up the engine despite the opponent finding the consistency of not favoring who you're playing. Like some of those things were supposed to just be there. They were just supposed to be there. And so when I look at tonight's matchup, Charlotte and Houston are teams that are fighting for playoff, legit playoff aspirations. Memphis falls into the category of the group when they had that seven game win streak, but they also are going to be without some key guys tonight. Right? So I expect a win. Like let's full stop. I expect a win, but I don't know how much to put on the performance that I see out of t from that. Because now we're not talking about beating the teams that you're supposed to be. We're talking about your fight and your ability to adjust and to compete as we are about to turn the corner to postseason.

[Don Hahn]

Didn't we see this though during that stretch where even these teams that you said on paper you're supposed to dominate. These teams at those first quarters, they look like a Nick team, right? It took them too long to finally take control of the game. That's what I want to see is like out of the gate throwing not the first punch, but the first five punches and make this thing a laugher from the start so that there isn't like this. You have to make a push to win a game over a team that has a lot of guys, a young guy is their centerpiece and a lot of guys that are just happy to be in the league right now. Are you scoreboard watching? Are you trying to angle for who you play? You're seeing Atlanta make a push. They've got the five seed now, Toronto sitting in the six seed. That would be the matchup right now if they get three. Do you care about that stuff? If you're the Knicks, are you concerned about who you play in the first round? A Toronto team you've dominated versus an Atlanta team that we know has had a great second half. Or is it, hey, I got to play whoever I play and that's it.

[Monica McNutt]

I. I'm not as in depth, a scoreboard scenario watcher as my colleague and good friend Tyler Murray, but I do get up and check the standings. I would like the Knicks to see Toronto in the first round. Other than that, I Can give you a scenario for doom any other way. And so Toronto is my ask. I personally, it's not in me to sort of play with the statistics and lose on purpose to try to get four like the all of that. I don't want to see Atlanta. So now four or five doesn't look the way it once did. But I understand the thought of maybe trying to avoid Boston. But at the same time, Han, like, I just. I just don't. Like, we've seen enough of this team play around with the game. Like, let's not play around intentionally. Let's try to continue to get better each time you step out on the floor as you move forward. But yeah, listen, Atlanta, historically, as of late regular season, the Knicks have had a pretty good run with them the last couple of seasons. But when I think of postseason and I think of this revamped team, like, they got some things that give me pause for sure. Length, speed, defense. Yeah. Like that. That. I'm not excited about that Philly. I don't really think Philly can get out of a series. But the speed of Edgecombe and what's my guy Maxi like? I don't. Right. I don't love that either.

[Don Hahn]

Right.

[Monica McNutt]

Who else? Charlotte. Well, we saw what happened the other day, and as much as I want to say that Charlotte was a fluke, the nature of a team that's poised to run up and down in a series, I just. The problem when I think of Charlotte is will the Knicks. And we get to see Charlotte one more time in this regular season. If that game matters. We'll see how that plays out. Do the Knicks have enough continuity to slow a game down versus a team like that? Because what I'm watching from Charlotte is the same thing that you watching from Detroit. Just guys that want to hoop together and are having fun. And sometimes that is what I'll give that. What, three field goals? Maybe six points.

[Don Hahn]

Four.

[Monica McNutt]

Six points. But in the playoff, that's a lot of points that matters.

[Don Hahn]

Yes. Yes. So good, Don. Don. She's so good. Like, that's such a great point which you just made.

[Rosenberg]

Listen, that's why it hurt. Because these are the people I want to be in with. You know, These are the people that I was hoping that.

[Monica McNutt]

No, no, no. You're looking at it wrong, Don. You're looking. You're looking at it wrong. See, in my community, you're not in until I mess up your name a couple times, and I'll be like, you know who I'm talking about. Come on. Don't do that like my parents. So that was love.

[Don Hahn]

Actually, wait a minute. I'm not buying that.

[Rosenberg]

Well, listen. No, no, I see.

[Don Hahn]

I see what you did there. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. I see what you did. You're trying to make it like I don't love you until I screw up your name. That's a thing.

[Rosenberg]

Exactly.

[Don Hahn]

And Don's going to say, oh, it is. Oh, that's great.

[Rosenberg]

And I'm going to tell you.

[Don Hahn]

No, it's not. It's not. That's not a thing.

[Monica McNutt]

Han, come on. My parents have called me my sister a number of times. My aunt has rattled through all of our names.

[Don Hahn]

Well, that's different.

[Monica McNutt]

She meant that's different. No, no, it's the same.

[Don Hahn]

That's different. My mother in law has called. My mother in law has. Has said when they're. When she's trying to ask for one of the kids. Call one of the kids. She will go through every other child's name and the dog before she gets to him.

[Rosenberg]

My grandmother heard the same thing, so.

[Monica McNutt]

Okay. Exactly. Also, are these not people that we love? It's the same concept.

[Rosenberg]

I know.

[Don Hahn]

Monica's letting us know that she's probably. She's probably now in the onset of. Of Alzheimer's. And we hope you. We hope it gets better.

[Rosenberg]

Well, keep fighting. Swing by, get some ginkgo biloba, and we'll talk next Friday. Next Wednesday.

[Monica McNutt]

Okay, sounds good, y'.

[Don Hahn]

All.

[Monica McNutt]

I'll talk to y' all later. All right.

[Rosenberg]

That's Monica McNutt. Did have that feel, Alan. Like, you know, you cheat on your boyfriend. It's like. No, no, I. I cheat on all my boyfriends. Only the ones I love.

[Don Hahn]

I cheat on only the ones I cared about that I cheat on.

[Rosenberg]

But yeah, so my grandmother there was me and David.

[Don Hahn]

Right.

[Rosenberg]

My cousins were Donna and. And Patrick.

[Don Hahn]

Right.

[Rosenberg]

And the dog's name was Mo. So she would want to call me and she would be like Donna, Patrick, David, Mo, and Donnie.

[Don Hahn]

Donnie.

[Rosenberg]

I'm sorry. Yeah, yeah, it was. It was a running thing. Whoever she was calling it would be the fourth time would be the charm.

[Don Hahn]

Yes.

[Rosenberg]

And then as she got older, now. Now the fifth time, because now the dog would get thrown in.

[Don Hahn]

The best is when the dog gets thrown.

[Rosenberg]

Yeah, but no, it's all good. But that's. That was a little jarring.

[Don Hahn]

That's all I could see that it definitely affected you. And instead of letting it go, I thought the best thing I could do was, was put shine Light on it so you both could be embarrassed. The best I could do is finish it.

[Rosenberg]

It's not any shade at Peter. It's just there were two distinctly different human beings.

[Don Hahn]

Very different, you know, so you have hair, he doesn't.

[Rosenberg]

There were people. And I. I never heard it, but there are people to this day that think Ian Eagle and Bob Washusen sound alike. I never heard that.

[Don Hahn]

I. I've never heard that.

[Rosenberg]

But a lot of people have, like. So there's certain people you don't mind being confused with because maybe they have similar voices or. Or something like that, similar styles. Peter and I go about things completely different and. But she was distracted and she's driving and she's got a lot going on. She's got, you know, the Women's Final Four. She's. She's all over the place. We're lucky to have her.

[Don Hahn]

But she. She absolutely nailed it when it comes to the. The Nick conversation, which is why, of course, it's a valuable guest to have. But it's. It's like she's kind of said the same thing I said, right? That, like, we have seen enough from this team to know that if they put their mind to it, there's enough talent, like, they can make a run. But lately we have not seen enough evidence consistently of that team. And that's why it's been frustrating. And that's why it's concerning. Because, look, your most recent thought of a team, like, what have I seen recently? That's who you are. Until. Until you change the next thing I've seen. And. And just lately, they have lost five straight games to teams with a losing record. That is concerning.

[Rosenberg]

Exactly. And Monica disagreed. She thought that letting go of Brown would be more radical. But what they did, letting go of Tibbs was very radical. Just giving him a contract extension the year before they go to the conference final for the first time. 25 years. And it. So, I mean, but radical is in the eye of the beholder. But radical. To me, just, you have to do what you think is the right thing to do at that particular time and not be intimidated by. Well, that's unconventional. Letting a coach go with only six games remaining.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah.

[Rosenberg]

Again, I'm not advocating doing. I'm just saying that if you think he's an issue, do something about it. But it's probably not going to happen.

[Don Hahn]

More than likely not happen. But it's not that you.

[Rosenberg]

Honestly. They lose tonight.

[Don Hahn]

Well, that's a different story altogether.

[Rosenberg]

Is it that radical a move?

[Don Hahn]

No. No. Because if I tell you, I'm telling you that they what they're put what the Grizzlies are putting on the court might struggle to win a G League.

[Rosenberg]

And that's why I get. I've been just going at it with a lot of different people on social media today. It's all in Fun. Please call 1-800-919-3776. It's a lot easier than oh, you

[Don Hahn]

getting killed stuff out.

[Rosenberg]

No. Some people agree, some people disagree. But the thing I take except you to that it's just some hot take trying to get clicks. That's not what it is. I really honestly believe if it's the right move, you do it. But you know the thing I hear from, from, from people is well, Mike Brown's got the same record as the Knicks had last year. Is that a good thing? When Indiana was out of it, Boston was in trouble early in the season. You've got teams all over the place tanking in the eastern. Like I don't, I don't, I don't look at that as a badge of honor that you've got the same record as last year. You should be much better.

[Monica McNutt]

Right?

[Rosenberg]

You shouldn't be in third place in this conference completely. This is supposed to be a conference where you're supposed to be the first place team. This Detroit's not supposed to be better than you.

[Don Hahn]

No, they weren't. But again, they went into this season with an identity and with a purpose, a consistency. I think this next season started with a new system that was going to take a minute. They got off to a relatively good start, but not nearly as good as Detroit did. You know, they remember they were second in the league for most of the start of the season. Detroit just was out of the gate like a monster.

[Rosenberg]

That, that's another, that's another thing that doesn't make any sense to me. The all new system. Well, you should be getting better, not worse. If you're, if you're trying to put in a new system, that would explain a slow start and then eventually beginning to build and get on. It just seems like they're losing it as the game, the season goes on. That doesn't make any sense. I'm not denying that the system is an issue, but shouldn't it be getting better, not worse?

[Don Hahn]

Yes. And that's why you made the coaching change last this past season. Why the next step then is. Are you saying we brought in the wrong coach or are you saying, all right, we gave this roster a chance, now we've got a no, we've got to do some more things because you have a guy in Jalen Brunson who's going to be 30 years old. This, this guy is the best thing you've had in 25 years on this team. And the window with him as your main piece as a star, I can tell you you can win with this guy. He's a winner. Look at his career. But you've got to make sure the right pieces are around him to do that. And that's got to be the next question if you feel comfortable with you having the right coach.

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[Rosenberg]

Check engine ABS or maintenance light on. Take the guesswork out of your warning lights with O'Reilly Veriscan. The service is free and provides a report with solutions verified by ASE Certified Master Technicians. And if you need help, we could recommend a shop for you. Ask for O'Reilly Veriscan today.

[Monica McNutt]

Oh oh oh. O'Reilly

[Don Hahn]

Auto Parts.

[Podcast Host]

Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.

[Rosenberg]

I didn't listen to anything you just said.

[Podcast Host]

Catch the show on demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcasts.

[Rosenberg]

You just made to this, buddy.

[Podcast Host]

This is the list with Don, Han and Rosenberg.

[Rosenberg]

So I had all fun Monday, minding my own business. But you know what? You can't not listen to the show.

[Don Hahn]

Right?

[Rosenberg]

You have to. Okay, so I was listening a little

[Don Hahn]

bit with the kids. You were out with the kids?

[Rosenberg]

I was out with the kids. But we had to go to and fro.

[Don Hahn]

All right.

[Rosenberg]

I wanted to find out what was going on with my boys.

[Don Hahn]

That was a bar, by the way. We had to go to and fro.

[Monica McNutt]

Really? Yeah.

[Don Hahn]

It's pretty good.

[Rosenberg]

I see.

[Don Hahn]

I see the rapper and Donnie. Right. It's not bad. Donnie can do it.

[Rosenberg]

You think?

[Don Hahn]

Yes.

[Peter]

All right.

[Rosenberg]

Another time. Now, I heard someone ask you guys to give a list of the top. I think it was Yankees of the 21st century.

[Don Hahn]

Oh, yes.

[Rosenberg]

They started. I did this, and then I figured, you know what? Why don't I do it for both the Mets and the Yankees?

[Don Hahn]

That's what he asked for. Because he. His argument was, we couldn't. Dude, we. Yeah. Okay. All right, let's hear this. Because I know I did the list that day live, but I didn't do

[Rosenberg]

a metro out there, but I thought I'd put. You know. But that was on the spot.

[Don Hahn]

Right. I think it's a good one, and

[Rosenberg]

I want to be as technical as possible. So this would be at the start of the 01 season. Technically, the 21st century began in 01. But listen, we're playing semantics here, because it's gonna not. It's not going to change the list if I include the 2000.

[Monica McNutt]

All right.

[Rosenberg]

In no particular order, or do you want. Why don't you give me yours again and see if it matches?

[Don Hahn]

Well, I wrote it down and I forgot, but I think the list. The list. The list was pretty obvious. The list had Jeter on it. The list had MO on it.

[Rosenberg]

Okay.

[Don Hahn]

The list had CC on it. That's 3A rod. And then Judge.

[Rosenberg]

Yeah, that, that, that. That's the list.

[Don Hahn]

Right?

[Rosenberg]

That's the list Derek Jeter has to be on there. Even though he accomplished a lot of. In the late 90s. He continued it on.

[Don Hahn]

Yes.

[Rosenberg]

Through the 2000s into his retirement year of 2014. Judge has to be on there. Well, he's putting historic numbers up. Not the body of work of other people on the list, but still amazing. Cece Sabathia, Mariano Rivera and Alex Rodriguez.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah.

[Rosenberg]

I think what's interesting is the person that I fought to put on the list, I just played the game of who you taken out.

[Don Hahn]

Yep.

[Rosenberg]

And that is Mike Messina,

[Monica McNutt]

because cece

[Rosenberg]

did have a lot of compiling seasons, wasn't very good at the end. Messina was fairly consistent throughout the 2000s. He didn't win a championship. Had the 120 game season. That's the only other guy, right?

[Don Hahn]

It feels like the only other guy. And that though does go to the. Who you taking out? Because I wouldn't put Teira on that

[Rosenberg]

list to share would be an honorable mention.

[Don Hahn]

You could, you, you, you could. You could say his name. But right away you're like, no, he's not replacing anybody.

[Rosenberg]

I think. I think Matt Sui is an honorable mention as well.

[Don Hahn]

Yep.

[Rosenberg]

He had some phenomenal.

[Don Hahn]

Matsui was fantastic. Yes.

[Rosenberg]

04 season and he was the MVP of the 2009 World Series. So that's. We got that list right. I guess as far as both of us having the same ones. And the honorable mentions are where they're at.

[Don Hahn]

Okay.

[Rosenberg]

Mets are interesting.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah. This is going to be. I'm curious about this.

[Rosenberg]

You got to put Jose Reyes. What a batting title didn't end well. Obviously going to the Marlins and all that. But Jose Reyes would be on the list for me. David Wright, one of the greatest Mets of all time. On that list.

[Don Hahn]

Too easy.

[Rosenberg]

Not a lot of time. But it was so dominant. I've got Jacob deGrom there. It was a four years like he just. You couldn't touch him. And he was great in the postseason.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah.

[Rosenberg]

That 2013 year. Pete Alonso again, a short period of time. A very dominant.

[Don Hahn]

Well, he rookie record for home runs. Right, right. Yeah. And had a massive home run in the playoffs. Like that does add to it too.

[Rosenberg]

And yeah, probably the greatest free agent signing in Mets history. Carlos Beltra. I have on the list as well.

[Monica McNutt]

Okay.

[Rosenberg]

The honorable mention that can get people. I do not have Mike Piazza on the list.

[Peter]

Now.

[Rosenberg]

Mike Piazza was one of the most amazing mets ever. But 98, 99, 2000. But when you take a look at. At the 21st century.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah.

[Rosenberg]

Who you taking out?

[Don Hahn]

And when did he leave?

[Rosenberg]

His numbers certainly began to decline. I got the numbers right here. Just give me one second to punch it up. If you really. Again, it's Mike Piazza said. What are you talking. It's Mike Piazza. You can't not have like Mike Piazza. But you can if you really were to take a look at what he accomplished post 2000. All right, so he's a Met. Comes over in the 98 season. Great. 99 All Star. 2000 All Star.

[Monica McNutt]

All right.

[Rosenberg]

He was an All Star several times as a Met after that. But we're looking at, like, his home run totals. 36, 33. Then it's 11, 20, 19, 22. He never drove in 100 runs. 2001 beyond came close with 98 in 2002. His last year was 05. Then he went to the Padres in 06 and closed out his career in 07 with Oakland. So who are you taking out?

[Don Hahn]

So there's the four years, basically, if you're counting, if you're doing this, the 2001 forward, it's. It's not a lot of time. And who are you taking again? DeGrom was incredibly dominant, despite the fact he didn't win a lot. But that wasn't his fault. But he was dominant as far as

[Rosenberg]

pitching the numbers that matter. He was as dominant as a pitcher, you know, since Seaver. And he was good in the postseason, too, when he got the opportunity. Again, you look at the wins and losses, but, you know, 14 and 8, 15 and 10, 10 and 9, 10 and 9 with a 1.70 earner on average. Think about that. He led the league with an ERA of 1.70 and finished 10 in 910 wins. There were games the Mets lost 2 to 1.

[Monica McNutt]

Right.

[Rosenberg]

He would go 7 innings, leave the game down. 21 they lose the game or he'd get a no decision and he would drive in the only run. It was crazy how many times that happened.

[Don Hahn]

That's hilarious. You know? Yeah, no, no, they're. Yeah. Wright is obvious. He probably is the boy. He's the player of the century, right?

[Rosenberg]

Yes. I think he's the best player of the 21st century.

[Don Hahn]

So. Yeah, no, I think that's a. The Alonzo won. But again, his rookie year, he was phenomenal. He had big years, then he had it off year, but then he had the big hit in the playoffs. There's enough there. There's definitely enough. Where is he in all time? Where has he met all time? Home runs?

[Rosenberg]

He's the leader. He's number one.

[Don Hahn]

That's right. He is number one. Okay. I couldn't remember for some reason if he got. If he caught it or he did, but. That's right. Yeah, he did. Right.

[Rosenberg]

So here is numbers. His rookie year, 201953 home run runs led the league, broke the rookie record. All right, 2020 was the shortened season. Still had 16 home runs in 60 games, 37 home runs, 40 home runs, 46 home runs. Led the league in RBIs with 131 in 2022. Leather League in doubles in 2025 and hit one of the biggest home runs in franchise history. Pete Alonso has to be there.

[Don Hahn]

Yes.

[Rosenberg]

Reyes and Wright have to be there. Beltron was.

[Don Hahn]

Maybe Beltron. Maybe Beltron. If you wanted to make a case for Piazza.

[Rosenberg]

All right, well, let's.

[Don Hahn]

I'm saying maybe. I didn't say. I'm not. Look, you're the Met fan. I don't have the same depth with Mets that I do with Yankees, so I can't pretend that I have that same feel of Piazza versus anybody. But if that, that's the, The Beltron. I know his numbers were great, but what's the context of the numbers?

[Rosenberg]

Again, if we're getting. He went to the 2000 World Series, did Piazza losing to the Yankees, but again, that's technically not the 21st century, but whatever. But here.05, he comes in. Carlos Beltran.

[Don Hahn]

Yes, he was right after basically five.

[Rosenberg]

And then the Mets traded him in 2011. So a pretty significant amount of time. Okay. Oh, six, seven years with home runs.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah. Seven years with the Mets. Right.

[Rosenberg]

Seven years with 116 RBIs. 112 RBIs. 112 RBIs. Like three really monster seasons.

[Don Hahn]

Well, these were his best years. It's 149 home runs, 559 RBI, 100 stolen bases. Yeah, these were his best. These are the best years of his career with. With basically any team that was. Multiple years batted 280.

[Rosenberg]

No, he's. I, I can't take him out.

[Don Hahn]

It's fair. I was just saying, like, if there's someone you play the. Who you taking out when it comes to him and Piazza.

[Rosenberg]

Well, that's, that's what I always ask.

[Don Hahn]

That's the game I'm playing. Is, is okay if, if, if I'm thinking of someone that I, I don't think Carlos Beltran and think great Met moments. You know what I mean? That's all.

[Rosenberg]

Yeah. And unfortunately for Beltron, you think about him striking out.

[Don Hahn]

That's the, that's the moment that seven against the Cardinals, everybody remembers. So now, now what do you think about with Piazza? Piazza did eight years, but we know a lot of them were what was out of the eight years. What is it? 98, 98, 99. 99. So three of the eight. So five. So basically five. So let's, let's just take his five. Five years with the Mets in the. In this century that you want to play. And If I told you 119 home runs, 342 RBI, 277 batting average, that it's it's fewer years than Beltron, but still production.

[Peter]

It.

[Rosenberg]

It. No, I just don't know who you're taking out. I can't take out Beltran. I'm not taking out Reyes or Wright.

[Don Hahn]

Okay.

[Rosenberg]

If you want to tell me deGrom, because it was a shorter period of time, but he was so done.

[Don Hahn]

No, no, no. There's no way you take deGrom out. No way. Let's see his war. 9.8. 9.8 for Piazza in those five years.

[Rosenberg]

Okay.

[Don Hahn]

Right. And now as I wait for 9.8

[Rosenberg]

for Piazza in five seasons with the Mets.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah. And now the seven years with the Mets. And this doesn't want to. Look, look at this. This is where, though. This is good radio. The Internet is deciding it doesn't want to hurry up and tell me this one because it's taking too long. So you'll bear with me a second as I try this one more time. But. But I. I could use that as my only argument. So I'll go from 05. He put 11.

[Rosenberg]

What was the war for his.

[Don Hahn]

Oh, my God. Oh, forget it. Yeah.

[Peter]

Yeah.

[Rosenberg]

Belcher 31.1.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah. In full seasons is 27.8. So we. We're done. Yeah, we're done.

[Rosenberg]

I think you would have a better chance arguing deGrom off the list than Belcher.

[Don Hahn]

Oh, God.

[Monica McNutt]

No, no.

[Don Hahn]

DeGrom was. How many Mets were considered the best in the.

[Rosenberg]

I'm not saying you win. No, but I'm sorry, I think if

[Don Hahn]

you have a player that in his time was in multiple seasons considered the best at what he does, like he's on the list. He might lead the list.

[Rosenberg]

Right. So that, that, that's the point. I'm just saying there's no place for Mike Piazza, who you're taking out.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah. No, no, there's no.

[Peter]

You're right.

[Don Hahn]

There's no. There's no taking out.

[Rosenberg]

And just have too big a body of work.

[Don Hahn]

Yes.

[Rosenberg]

To even be considered being taken out.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah.

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[Podcast Host]

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[Podcast Host]

Thanks for listening to the Don Han and Rosenberg podcast.

[Rosenberg]

I didn't listen to anything you just said.

[Podcast Host]

Catch the show on demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcasts.

[Don Hahn]

I love this song. So this, this is like Emma and I. This is our song. Such a sweet song. And yes, today did feel like it had a summer breeze. Got about 79 out there. I think we topped off about 79.

[Rosenberg]

That's good, right?

[Don Hahn]

Felt good. Gonna get some rain tonight, but that's April.

[Rosenberg]

That seals and cross to you and me, right?

[Don Hahn]

Of course it is.

[Rosenberg]

And we lost Dash Crofts, I think over the weekend.

[Don Hahn]

Oh wow.

[Rosenberg]

How old do you think he was

[Don Hahn]

going to go? 73.

[Rosenberg]

73.

[Don Hahn]

Is that too young?

[Rosenberg]

That's way too young. He died at the age of 87.

[Don Hahn]

87. So he was doing this Stuff a little bit later in life.

[Rosenberg]

And matter of fact, if he had lasted till August, he would have made it to 88. So he was a lot closer to 88 than, than 86.

[Don Hahn]

God bless for him.

[Rosenberg]

Yes, God bless is right.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah. Summer makes me feel fine. Yeah, It's a great song. When Emma was little and remember she was my first. So there was a time it was just me and her and we would be in the car. This song came up one time and for whatever reason she just sang it. Don't know why this, you know, little kid, they just something appeals to me. They start singing it. So it just became a thing that anytime they played it then there was a remix done of it. I don't know. I can't remember exactly who did it. And so now it just became like every time it came on, I would think of her, I would tell her the song's on. Then when she was away at college one time it came up in a mix somewhere and she like took a picture of it and sent it to me. I lost it, you know. So that's become like our song.

[Rosenberg]

No, that's pretty cool. That's. It's. It's a lot of fun to hear that music. I love that sweet song. And we did lose dash at the age of 87 back on the 25th. So I guess sometime last week. 1-800-9193776. More stuff on. The Knicks Mets are still tied at one of the bottom of the ninth inning. But the Cardinals do have a winning run at second with two outs with Jordan Walker on. So we're keeping an eye on that. Devin Williams is in this game steady

[Don Hahn]

as usual, right Don?

[Rosenberg]

I know, I know.

[Don Hahn]

It's never, it's never a nerve wracking experience when Devin Williams on the mouse

[Rosenberg]

to defend Devin Williams and everybody else, even Mo who was the gold standard of closers. Right? Yeah, you never got their best in

[Don Hahn]

Many safe situation, many clean innings, just

[Rosenberg]

a non save situation. Just a different animal.

[Don Hahn]

It's true.

[Rosenberg]

You come in pumped up for a chance to win the game when you're in a past the baton moment. Just get us through this inning so we can try to win it in the next inning. You know, you get it's a little bit of a different animal. But still he lets the leadoff batter on. But still at second with two out. So chance to get out of this. Let's go to Peter in Elmsford. You're on ESPN New York. What's up Peter?

[Peter]

How you doing? I agree about the Stone. I, I agree about this, the song, but I have never understood the jasmine of my mind part. Do you smoke it? I mean, I've tried other stuff, but no, no Jasmine.

[Don Hahn]

It's, it's it. I believe he's talking of blowing through. It's a breeze blowing through jasmine in his mind. He's picturing the field. Yeah, no, no, I get what you're saying. Did he roll up the jasmine and smoke it? I don't know.

[Monica McNutt]

But yeah, right, right, right, right.

[Rosenberg]

I just love the fact, Peter, you admit that you spoke a lot of things.

[Don Hahn]

He was willing to try it. I think Don is what he was saying.

[Monica McNutt]

Oh, yeah.

[Peter]

Oh, sure. I, I would agree with your supposition about changing coaches if it were analogous to the Malone deal in, in Denver last year, but it's Denver had Denver was Malone was not putting his young talent on the court. Edelman came in and did and they produced right away. One of them memorably. Pickett came in making jumpers, stealing the ball here. A new coach is not going to fix your issue, which is Towns. And I want to give a shout out to Stephan Bondi in the Post, who yesterday had some amazing numbers. And this article ties into your discussion about the coaching because this piece came off to me as a defense of the coaches because he indicts Towns, pointing out, among other things, that his, his, the percentage of times that he scores when he receives the ball in a Post up is 43%, one of league low, lower than Brunson. And more frighteningly, he when he gets the ball in the post, he turns the ball over 24.8% of the time, league high.

[Don Hahn]

Now the big reason for that is the offensive fouls that he, you know, with the stupid hooks that he was doing early in the season, the arm bars. So a lot of those turnovers are based on the offensive fouls.

[Peter]

He just doesn't have the footwork or the skill set if you need at that position. And this is the immutable geometry of basketball. He should be able to get down on a low block, especially on the hand when you're doing a turnaround and you're turning the ball toward the baseline, the right side for a right hander, for example, and make that shot 80% of the time. He just doesn't do it. But Bondi also talked of Damon Fizz there and I thought he, he made some good related observations. He, he said other than Jalen, nobody breaks, nobody breaks into the link. Nobody can take the guy off the dribble and get and get.

[Don Hahn]

There's no one that beats anybody off the dribble on the team. Yeah, that's correct. Yeah. I read the article and Bondi did a great job. He's a very good beat writer. And this was, this was exactly the kind of piece that you put together after a series of games where Towns has lost in the first half three times, where he had, I think, four shots in the first half of one game, one shot against okc, maybe three last night against Houston in the first half until he finally got it going in the second half, where then he started taking a lot of shots and he ended up with 17, which led the team. But it's. I think it's the. The question is, is it the player, is it teammates or is it coaching, or is it all three? That's the problem here. Because I don't remember the Towns thing being an issue last year. I don't remember feeling like Towns doesn't know where he belongs in this offense. I don't remember that being a problem until the postseason when teams were picking on him defensively, which was obviously the biggest problem of all, playing drop coverage, and he was really bad at it. But this year, from day one, he's talked about finding his role in the offense, and he's still talking about it. With six games to go that I don't know what is that? I don't know who to blame there. And what Bondi does is kind of give you the evidence of all the different people you can blame. Is it Brunson doesn't find him enough? Is it Brown doesn't call his number enough? Or is it Towns is making it too easy by just being stubborn about how they want him to play? I don't think there's an answer.

[Podcast Host]

Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.

[Rosenberg]

I don't want to know how the

[Don Hahn]

sausage is made, man. I just want to know. It's good.

[Podcast Host]

Hear more of Don Allen and Peter Weekday afternoon starting at 3 on 8 80, ESPN, the ESPN New York app, and your smart speakers from 30 for 30 podcasts.

[Monica McNutt]

Did you say someone got sh.

[Rosenberg]

Brian Pata, senior defensive lineman from Miami, gunned down?

[Don Hahn]

The key to this case. It's Brian. An hour before he died, he was on the phone arguing with somebody.

[Monica McNutt]

This might be a hit.

[Don Hahn]

You want the truth? They just want a conviction.

[Rosenberg]

Being placed under arrest. We had a killer amongst us.

[Podcast Host]

Murder at the U. Listen now.