Hour 2: Moral Victory Monday

Summary

Don, Hahn & Rosenberg — “Hour 2: Moral Victory Monday”

Date: September 22, 2025
Podcast Overview:
This hour of “Don, Hahn & Rosenberg” dives deep into the rollercoaster weekend of New York football, focusing primarily on the Jets' stunning special teams play and loss, perennial issues with building and sustaining team identity (especially with the Giants), quarterback development debates, and some wider NFL topics. The hosts bring their signature blend of sports knowledge, New York cynicism, and biting humor, serving up both analysis and levity for frustrated local sports fans.

---

Main Theme / Purpose

• The core focus: Unpacking “moral victories” in New York football, with particular attention to the Jets’ and Giants’ recent performances, identity issues, and the perennial struggle between hope and heartbreak for local fans.
• Recurring question: Are moral victories enough, or do they just highlight the dysfunction?
• Tonal blend: Sarcastic, passionate, introspective, and self-deprecating, reflecting the lived experience of long-suffering New York sports fandom.

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Jets’ Heartbreaking Loss & Blocked Field Goal Play

Timestamps: 01:08 – 09:00

• The Play: Jets come back from three scores down; electrifying blocked field goal returned for a touchdown by Will McDonald to tie the game late—only to lose after failing to deliver a defensive stop.

• Radio call reactions: The hosts dissected emotional GoPro/booth and broadcast calls, highlighting the chaos and elation, but also the much-too-familiar “same old Jets” heartbreak.

  “It was there and then it was gone immediately...I wanted to believe, but the second the Bucs got the ball, you knew how it was ending.”
  — Anthony Beck (08:58)

• Debate on Jets’ “talent” and defensive ability:

  • Alan Hahn: “I think their talent is overrated. Sauce? Garbage.” (07:00)
  • Injury depletion and youth at key positions noted.

• Recurring frustration: The Jets’ inability—despite supposed defensive identity—to get crucial stops late in games.

  • Discussion of coaching (Aaron Glenn), young roster holes, accountability for “personal fouls that keep happening.”

2. Are Moral Victories Worth Anything?

Timestamps: 09:22 – 12:25

• Clapping After Losses: The crew (and callers) debate whether Aaron Glenn’s visible postgame enthusiasm is appropriate, or just optics for change-starved fans.
  • Hahn: “Moral victories do exist in Jet land. They do. ...But until you start winning, you’re the same old Jets. Culture doesn’t change after losses.” (10:17)
  • Rosenberg: “Stop saying it’s not same old Jets. It absolutely is. Your job is to get to the point where it’s no longer ‘same old Jets.’” (12:07)
  • Consensus: You don’t tell people you’ve changed—winning makes the case.

3. Quarterback Development Debate (Jets & Giants Focus)

Timestamps: 14:36 – 26:10

• Callers & Hosts: Should the Giants/Jets throw their rookie QBs (specifically referencing the Giants’ “Dart”) into the fire to “see what they have,” or risk damaging their futures by rushing them?
  • Rosenberg: “You cannot put this kid in if you don’t think behind the scenes he’s up for it already…You can damage him, then you start all over again.” (19:59)
• Room dynamics & “losing the locker room”:
  • Hahn: “You can lose a room by playing a kid who’s not ready. ...But if you’re 0-4, 0-5, what kick do the players have? Just do your job.” (18:35)
• Comparisons to other teams/QBs: Mahomes, Baker Mayfield, Lamar Jackson, Russell Wilson, and Tommy DeVito.
  • Discussion emphasized that draft slot matters for expectations and timeline ("project" QBs sit more often, e.g., late 1st/2nd rounders).

4. NFL Binge Quick-Hits — Wild Week Recap

Timestamps: 27:43 – 38:47

• Historic Sunday:
  • 7 games with game-winning scores in the final 3 minutes (most since merger).
  • 5 blocked field goals, 4 in the 4th quarter (most in 45 years).
• Game Recaps and Host Gripes:
  • Browns’ defensive dominance and Cleveland’s win (Anthony: “I felt pretty good about Cleveland covering...No one did a thing.” 30:14)
  • Eagles’ blocked kick return for a win (“Do you believe in miracles?”/Al Michaels reference ribbed).
  • Chargers’ surprising 3-0 start with all division wins (commentary on “Cameron Dicker the kicker” and comedy about his name).
  • 49ers’ win over Cardinals, Chris Carlin’s call, and “living the dream” life as a broadcaster.
  • Peter notes Washington’s (“the Commies”) ugly win as “the kind of game you just lose for years. But instead, when you’re a functional franchise, you bring in a backup and spank a bad team.” (37:45)
• Self-Mocking: Hosts roast their own picks and fandoms.

5. Giants’ Identity Crisis & the NY Head Coach Problem

Timestamps: 42:52 – 50:45

• Caller ‘Dom’ from Rochester: “Is this some sick joke?” on what it means to watch the modern Giants.
  • Dom and hosts pine for the days of a clear identity: physicality, dominant lines. The current roster is “nothing.”
  • Rosenberg: “Who are the Giants? ...On both sides of the ball, they don’t have that identity anymore.” (45:57)
• Why can’t NY teams build lasting cultures?
  • Hahn: New York may devour first-time head coaches, citing success with experienced ones (eg. Parcells, Coughlin, Keenan for Rangers).
  • Peter & Anthony: Jets/Giants coaching carousel and lack of foundational leadership—unlike franchises that win, where opponents “know what’s coming.”

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the Jets’ defense letting fans down, as always:

  “You’re the same old Jets until you start winning.”
  — Alan Hahn (10:17)

• On the tough love of NY fandom:

  “When you’re no longer same old Jets, you’re not going to have to tell us. We’ll know.”
  — Alan Hahn (12:25)

• On quarterbacks being thrown into pressure:

  “You can lose a room by playing a kid that’s not ready…But if you’re 0-4, what kick do the players have? Just do your job.”
  — Alan Hahn (18:37)

• On Giants’ lost identity:

  “Who are the Giants? They aren’t anything because the coaches aren’t anybody…Are they good at defense? Not really. Great offense? No. Special teams? Nope.”
  — Alan Hahn (47:15)

• On “project” rookie QBs:

  “When you’re drafted 25th overall, that tells you this is a bit of a project.”
  — Alan Hahn (25:06)

• On NY coaching hires:

  “Is this the place to go to a first time head coach? No, it just eats you alive.”
  — Alan Hahn (48:47)

---

Funniest / Lightest Moments

• Buccaneers throwback uniforms:

  • Alan loves the colors (“gorgeous”), while Beck says, “That jersey, to me, Don, is the epitome of suck.” (12:52)
  • Peter’s “you’re in good hands with Allstott” line bombs, leading to a riff on the worst puns and Chris Berman’s dad-joke legacy.

• Charger Kicker Name Comedy:

  • Alan: “The Chargers kicker, in essence, is Dirk Diggler from Boogie Nights, right?”
  • Anthony: “Two jobs on the table. Kicker is one of them…”

---

Timestamps for Key Segments

| Time | Segment / Topic | |----------|------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------| | 01:08 | Jets miraculous blocked field goal for TD, booth audio breakdown, “moral victory” vs. heartbreak | | 07:00 | Jets defensive talent called out (“Sauce? Garbage.”), injury woes discussed | | 09:22 | Are “moral victories” just an excuse for Jets/Glenn's clapping controversy | | 14:36 | Call-in: Should rookie QBs “Dart”/others be rushed? Locker-room dynamics | | 19:59 | Rosenberg on why you can’t rush the rookie (“You can damage him…”) | | 25:06 | How draft slot changes rookie QB timeline (“project QBs” sit more) | | 27:43 | NFL Binge segment — wild finish games, blocked FGs, host betting gripes, fun with announcer calls | | 37:45 | Washington’s (“the Commies”) ugly but satisfying win; beating bad teams as a “functional franchise” | | 42:52 | Caller Dom: Giants identity crisis — no direction, not ready for anything | | 45:57 | On what the Giants lost: “Physicality at the line of scrimmage… That’s what the Giants were about.” | | 48:47 | Why New York eats first-time head coaches; argument for experienced hires in NY |

---

Conclusion

This podcast hour is a quintessential New York sports radio hour: exasperated but resilient, smart, and always a little wounded. The crew dissects the fine line between building and regressing, questioning the wisdom of “moral victories” and rookie gambles. Central to it all: New York football’s endless search for leadership and identity—and the faint hope that one day, fans won’t need moral victories, just the real thing.

Transcript

[Don La Greca]

This isn't just another ESPN fantasy football season.

[Alan Hahn]

It's your shot at greatness. With a refreshed design, the ESPN Fantasy app is sharper than ever. So you can draft like a pro and dominate your league. And introducing Gridiron Gauntlet, a new game mode where the best compete to be crowned the number one fantasy football player of 2025. One app, one shot, one champion. Download the ESPN fantasy app and sign.

[Don La Greca]

Up to play ESPN fantasy football today.

[Peter Rosenberg]

This is the Don Han and Rosenberg podcast.

[Alan Hahn]

That sounds like heaven to me.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Listen live weekday afternoon starting at 3 on 8 80. ESPN, the ESPN New York app and your smart speakers.

[Alan Hahn]

Game time is brought to you by Telemore Irish Whiskey. Because when it's game time fell.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I like when he holds it.

[Alan Hahn]

We got eggs tonight. Locally, we've got no Yankees, we got no mats.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Good. We need a break.

[Alan Hahn]

No exhibition hockey, that's all. Tomorrow when the Devils play the Islanders and the Rangers play the Bruins, nothing. But we do have Monday Night Football and it's a good one. Ravens playing host to the Lions. And that's at 8:15. Of course you can see that on ESPN. Tullimore Dew, the original triple distilled, triple blended and triple cast matured Iris whiskey. Be sure to grab a Telemore Dew or try the new Tullamore Dew. Honey, during today's action, glasses up to enjoying Tullamore Dew responsibly. So quite an interesting jets game to say the least. Come back from three scores down. They showed heart there. And then this incredible play as the jets are about to fall behind two scores late in the fourth quarter as the Bucks try to end the game.

[Anthony Beck]

Out of the hold of Riley Dixon.

[Don La Greca]

The snap clean. The placement down. That's a Jet touchdown. That's a Jet touchdown off of the block.

[Alan Hahn]

Bill.

[Don La Greca]

No. We're tied with 149 to go. Unbelievable.

[Alan Hahn]

I was in the car driving home.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Same. Not. Not driving home. But I was in the car for it.

[Alan Hahn]

I didn't know what happened.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Incredible.

[Alan Hahn]

I heard touchdown but I couldn't wait to get.

[Anthony Beck]

So wait. I know we don't have the rights to the jets anymore.

[Alan Hahn]

I know. 143. So thank you.

[Anthony Beck]

So someone just took a video of the someone driving down the street?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yes.

[Anthony Beck]

Or did it sound basically that crazy on the radio?

[Peter Rosenberg]

I think that didn't. Wasn't this posted by the jets from inside?

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah, they got one of those the GoPros where you can see so you could find it. The jets have it on their social media of the reaction from Bob and Anthony Back.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Bob was unreal.

[Alan Hahn]

Bob was great. It just steppage.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But, Anthony, love you. I know you're excited. You got to cut your mic. Let Bob have that, all right? You got to let him have that.

[Alan Hahn]

I am all for the steppage. Peter will tell you it adds to it, but not to the point where I don't know what happened. I know there was a touchdown because I heard touchdown.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah.

[Alan Hahn]

So I know the Buccaneers didn't score a touchdown because they were attempting to kick a field goal. So I was able to figure out that it was a block kick. Otherwise, it was just two men screaming. Like, if you had told me.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Pounding.

[Alan Hahn]

If you had told me.

[Anthony Beck]

Excuse me.

[Alan Hahn]

Right now. What this is. Ladies and gentlemen, we've got some sad news to report that Boba Shoes and Anthony Beck are no longer with us. Somebody came into the booth with a machete towards the end of the game, and here's what it sounded like out.

[Anthony Beck]

Of the hold of Riley Dixon.

[Don La Greca]

The snap clean. The placement down.

[Peter Rosenberg]

He does, right? It sounds like Beck got it first.

[Anthony Beck]

No, I miss. In this era. No. In this era. This is dangerous audio.

[Don La Greca]

I worry we're tied with 149 to go. Unbelievable.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Such a good call, though.

[Alan Hahn]

It really is. And what. What Anthony's doing there, he's trying to break the glass to get away from the machete, and it wouldn't break. What were you saying, Peter? I'm sorry.

[Anthony Beck]

No. You hear audio like that in 2025, you worry something's happened.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah, it is, but great. Great call, but. And I. And great job by Bob, because I think Bob got an indication that I don't think anybody heard. So I'm just gonna repeat Jet touchdown because you're just like. But still, it was emotional, was fun. But in this day and age. We talked about it last week with. With these quarterbacks. Baker Mayfield's good quarterback. You give him a minute 40. With time that you just had, you had to get a stop. Think about what you that surprised they didn't at least set up for a field.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Think about what you just said. You know, Baker Mayfield. Like, in what world are you worried that with a little more than 90, 100 seconds left in the game, you're worried that Baker Mayfield's going to beat.

[Alan Hahn]

You for 4,500 yards, 40 touchdowns last year.

[Peter Rosenberg]

It's all he's done this year.

[Alan Hahn]

No, he's. He's listening three and. Oh.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You know, hindsight, of course, is so easy for us to sit back and say on Monday morning, they should have done this. But in reality. What should McDonald have done there? Stop it to one.

[Anthony Beck]

Yeah. Well.

[Alan Hahn]

Well, you're not thinking that.

[Peter Rosenberg]

No, you're not. But they were saying it afterwards. They were like, you know, scoring there. Was that really the best? You know, like, you think about it.

[Anthony Beck]

But by the way, you can't. Because if you don't.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Of course. No, no, I know.

[Alan Hahn]

But.

[Caller]

No.

[Anthony Beck]

It is an interesting thought, though, when.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You think about where. Especially when we talk about what happened.

[Anthony Beck]

Yes.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yesterday. And what we've seen Bucks and Mayfield do in the first two weeks of the season. It's almost like you kind of want to be the last one to score here. But you're right. Because of who it is, they can get to the one and not score. Like, so I get it. But it is amazing to think that that play happened too soon. An incredible play by McDonald, incredible athletic achievement. But just. Can you get like, it's. It's eating at me. It's Steve Wilkes. It's Aaron Glenn. This is what you do. And you couldn't again get the stop I know. Needed late in the game to secure a win where you could. If they're sitting two and one because they got the stops they needed late in the game, you're feeling totally different about things, are you not? But because twice now, the other team. I know one was a 64 yarder. I get it. But it. As a Jets fan, it's maddening to think the one thing you are that. That's your expertise. Aaron Glenn. This is who you are. This should be the identity. Defensively, we got this. Now, offensively, it's going to be a challenge, but defensively we got this. And twice you can't keep a team from kicking.

[Alan Hahn]

I got to tell you, like I said, I think their talent is overrated. Sauce garbage.

[Peter Rosenberg]

The jets talent.

[Don La Greca]

Yeah.

[Alan Hahn]

I mean, right now it's. They don't have a ton of talent. I know that because this defense is not any. Remember they were talking about 85 bears a couple of years ago? A lot of the same guy.

[Peter Rosenberg]

They lost. They lost Quincy Williams, who's a big part of what they do. Linebacker, wide.

[Alan Hahn]

They lost Evans. So that pound balances out.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But they lost. But they're very young now at corner, you know, Come on. They didn't have Jermaine Johnson in this game.

[Anthony Beck]

Right.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Bill McDonald's being really good. No, but still I. Michael Clemens, by the way, can we stop? Like, that's. You're going to cut Gibson. When are you going to. How many more personal fouls are you.

[Alan Hahn]

Going to let go that's the problem. You got to stop somewhere. Now, in full disclosure, what you heard was the call that the GoPro picked up in the booth, right? But this, this is, you know, Ray Dinahan knows what he's doing.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Full, full audio here.

[Alan Hahn]

This, this is. This is how. This is how it's done in New York, okay?

[Anthony Beck]

Out of the hold of Riley Dixon. The snap clean. The placement down.

[Don La Greca]

It's blocked. It's the midfield up by Will McDonald. There he goes to the 2010. That's a jet touchdown. That's a Jet touchdown. Off of the block. Field goal. We're tied with 149 to go. Unbelievable.

[Alan Hahn]

The pounding on the glass that you hear like during a power play is eliminated.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Listen, still, I think it's worse.

[Alan Hahn]

You know what? You can make the case. I.

[Anthony Beck]

No, it's much better that way. That way. The only really bad part, the only really bad part, which I think I want to hear again, is that the second it starts at the beginning is the robot, he just jumps on it right from the beginning, then it calms down. You can basically hear Bob's call.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah, no, the. The pounding on the glass like the Graduate. But you lose that.

[Anthony Beck]

You lose that on the radio call. It's not that bad.

[Alan Hahn]

But listen, isn't it sad?

[Anthony Beck]

Think about how that sounded and then what the result was. Think about Aaron Glenn's dance and then what the result was. I just. It was. It was there and then it was gone immediately. And it lasted. What guys, how long in real life time did you think they were going to hold on to the game? Because for me, I think it was probably two and a half minutes. And then the second the Bucks got the ball, I went, oh, well, this is ending with a field goal. It's over.

[Alan Hahn]

No, but that's the problem.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, they can't tackle.

[Alan Hahn]

They can't tackle. 19 missed tackles in the game.

[Peter Rosenberg]

It's just not for lack of effort, but just for lack of still.

[Alan Hahn]

You know, every Jet fan is thinking the same thing. Every NFL fans thinking there is that we're just gonna need a turnover. It's gonna be tough to get a stop in this day and age. All he has to do is get in the field, go range. No, it's. It's tough. But here I want to defend Aaron Glenn for a second. It's one of the most unbelievable plays you're gonna see. You're about to go down nine, game's over. It's a two possession game late. You block the kick, scooped up, score. So he gets excited so what? All the same people. How come Solo doesn't get excited like he did in San Francisco and Seattle? Well, he gets excited. It was an exciting play. Now, as far as him clapping after the game is over, guys, this is what the jets are. They told you they were gonna be this. It wasn't about this year. That's why they got rid of Rogers. It was all about just setting things up, getting the head coach's feet wet. Zero expectations. Yeah, moral victories do exist in Jet lan. They do. They played well enough to hang in that game. They played disgusting for three quarters. Let's not forget that. But I'm not surprised that Glenn is going to be that way now, as far as changing the culture. And we're not the same old Jets. Sorry, Aaron. You're the same old jets until you start winning. Okay, it's all you could say whatever you want. Culture doesn't change after losses. No matter how close they are, no matter how exciting they are, no matter how great the plays are, you got to start winning. But as far as him getting excited off the block, kick him clapping at the end of the game, maybe it's a bad optic, but this guy's. The jets weren't saying we could win seven, eight games. It was you, the fans, calling this show, saying, I think we can make the playoffs. You did it to yourself.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yep.

[Alan Hahn]

But don't blame the Jets. They gave you zero expectations going in. So I'm not shocked that Glenn is clapping after a loss because right now he's just trying to grasp onto anything positive.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You think about it. What is he trying to do but build something up, Right. That's been completely knocked down. That's what he's trying to do. So how do you build something up when you have two devastating losses like that? Especially remember, week one was the moral victory as well. It was a loss, but it felt like a win. And now there's hope. And that's what happened. Everybody just started to jump the gun on what they think they could be, but they're not that team. For me, it's the only frustration. I'm with you. I was in the car, heard the call, and when. When they kicked the extra point, they up by one. In my head I'm like, they could steal this game. But I never was like, they're going to steal this game. It was. They could, but I like, you know, you just don't. You don't feel like they're that team yet. And sure enough, Baker has to go 48 yards. They can't Tackle them and they get the field. Go the walk off. It's. It's just where they are right now. And that's why the one thing I'll. Because I'm with you, I don't have a problem with Aaron Glenn. The only thing is stop saying it's not same old Jets. You got to understand. Yes, it is. It absolutely. Your job is to get to a point where it's no longer same old jets, but you're there right now.

[Alan Hahn]

When you're no longer same old jets, you're not going to have to tell us. We'll know.

[Peter Rosenberg]

There you go.

[Alan Hahn]

And we know that that's not the case just yet. Same old side note, because we're all around the same age, Peter's a little younger. I love those Buccaneer uniforms. I think they're gorgeous. I do. Maybe it's just because of my childhood or whatever. And you could say, well, that brings up the time when they lost their first 24 games. They went to the 79 championship game. No, I remember that as Doug Williams.

[Anthony Beck]

No, no. That jersey, to me, Don, is the epitome of suck.

[Alan Hahn]

Well, you know, the worst.

[Anthony Beck]

Not in terms of ugly. I mean, when I see them, I think the worst team in the world. But I love the colors. And if I were a fan, I would enjoy having the gear I on the field. I don't like them.

[Alan Hahn]

I mean, obviously they won a couple of Super Bowls with the new uniforms, which I think are disgusting.

[Anthony Beck]

I hate the new shooter for sure.

[Alan Hahn]

Once pewter. It's mustard. It's a stain.

[Peter Rosenberg]

It's not a stain called.

[Alan Hahn]

Their pants are stained.

[Peter Rosenberg]

No, it's metallic.

[Anthony Beck]

I don't like the.

[Alan Hahn]

I don't care for.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You don't like the red?

[Alan Hahn]

No, the other uniform. Gorgeous.

[Anthony Beck]

If I see someone wearing a Mike Allstott jersey, I vomit.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You're in good hands with all stock.

[Anthony Beck]

No, no, it's a. Wow. That was that. What's. That's. What's beyond a dad joke. Granddad joke.

[Peter Rosenberg]

That's a Chris Berman line. Where have you been?

[Anthony Beck]

Well, Chris Berman was. Is he. Is he above dad joke? That's his entire career.

[Peter Rosenberg]

His great. One of his great, like, lines that he would have.

[Alan Hahn]

Peter, you're not in the room. Yeah, it's not the joke. It's how he really expected there to be a lot.

[Peter Rosenberg]

No, I wasn't. I was just. It was.

[Alan Hahn]

No, you. You had the look on you. You were a little disappointed yourself.

[Peter Rosenberg]

100% throw away. I'm more disappointed in both of the.

[Anthony Beck]

Austrian Gamble.

[Peter Rosenberg]

More disappointed in both of you.

[Anthony Beck]

Well, I would. I would have.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Recognizing the homage to Chris Berman.

[Anthony Beck]

I didn't remember that he did that with All Star.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Oh, yeah, that was his thing.

[Anthony Beck]

But I got to tell you, it's horror. He should come back and apologize.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Never say it again.

[Anthony Beck]

Yeah, he should come back and say I said a lot of things. Golden arches, Archuleta. Well, I'll let it go.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah, but.

[Anthony Beck]

But all start. That's.

[Peter Rosenberg]

That's a good one. That's a good one. Very creative.

[Alan Hahn]

Let's go to Troy in Orlando. You're on espn New York. What's up, Troy?

[Caller]

What's up, fellas? How you doing?

[Alan Hahn]

Good.

[Caller]

Hey, man. Love you guys. But you're dead wrong. I'm playing dark.

[Alan Hahn]

Which part?

[Caller]

You got to play the kid. You got to play the kid, man. This is. It's like, like you said, man. It's. This is New York market. It's just a little bit different here. How many quarterbacks have we. How many quarterbacks have we actually seen that we're seeing that are getting destroyed, that are actually good, that are like. We don't know?

[Alan Hahn]

Could you say that Sam Darnold started too early?

[Caller]

You could, right?

[Alan Hahn]

Obviously.

[Caller]

Maybe.

[Alan Hahn]

Maybe he just needed a change of scenery. I don't know. Zach Wilson isn't good, but how do we know he wasn't damaged because he started too early. Everybody said this kid ain't ready. He starts and now maybe he was damaged to. He'll never be good again. You might be right. Just make sure he's ready, Troy. That's all I'm saying. If he's ready now, play him, but don't play him if he's not ready.

[Caller]

I get that, Don, but what Hong is saying is the organization believes in him. They feel he's the kid. If you got that impression from him, you got to see that earlier than later. If he's a good sort of.

[Alan Hahn]

Patrick Mahomes sat the first 15 games of his career. Didn't hurt him.

[Peter Rosenberg]

My feeling is that if I, If I can. My feeling is. Yeah, my. The indications that a lot of people are getting is that they are very excited about his potential. But they also understand that this is not somebody that you want to just throw out there. This was not a top five pick that is stepping into the league ready. Like, even if you remember Baker Mayfield story, he didn't. He wasn't immediately QB1. He went in when there was an injury. Like, that's. That's the Eli Manning went in when, after, after they decided halfway through the season, we had to make the change. You don't have to always do this, and you only put the player in when you feel like he makes us better. But if. If we make him worse, you're going to damage him. If you believe he's part of the future, you don't want to rush the process just because you need it or the fans want it. You play him when he's ready, otherwise you damage him, and then you start all over again. You know what I mean? That's what I think. They're caught in that moment right now where it might be. He might not be there yet, and they might be worried about rushing the process, but the problem is their current quarterback isn't buying them much more time, so they might be forced to.

[Caller]

And there you go. And you know what's happening while you're doing this? Contemplating you're losing your whole team. Right. So now.

[Peter Rosenberg]

It'S a real thing.

[Caller]

You don't know who you have right now. Let's say this. Okay, maybe he isn't quite ready. Right. But you don't know right now. He's speculating based on the fact that he hasn't really been out there doing it. Let's say he goes out there and is not looking strong. What's the harm in saying, okay, he's not ready. We're still going to work with the kid. We still think he's going to be the guy. But Troy, not ready right now.

[Alan Hahn]

Troy, you can. You can still lose a room that way.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yep.

[Alan Hahn]

You know, because at least Russell Wilson's the veteran, right. I don't think he's any good anymore, but he just threw for 450 yards the week before against Dallas. Right. So. And it seems like he hasn't lost the room yet. You remember what happened with the Giants, 5 and 4? They pulled the plug on Kurt Warner, gave it to Eli Manning. Eli Manning was terrible. Veterans in that room are like, dude, I'm not here to babysit a kid. I want to play football. I want to play meaningful games. So you could lose the room by playing Russell Wilson. You can lose the room by playing a kid that's not ready, you know, so you've got to get.

[Caller]

I think the difference there, though, right, is if you're doing that and they feel like they have the veteran that can win them games. It's not that way. It's there. You're losing them now because they know that Russ is not the guy.

[Alan Hahn]

Well, I don't know if we're losing anything. All right? We haven't heard any comments. Maybe they are. They're owing three. I'm sure they're very disappointed. Let's not forget too, you got Jameis Winston, who. Yeah, he threw 30 interceptions, but also that same year he threw 30 interceptions through 30 touchdowns. You know, so maybe they'd want to see him start. I can't. We said don't listen to the fans. I can't listen to players either. You know, if a player is going to give up and complain, well, then maybe I got to wonder, hey, are you, are you long for this organization? They had to see the writing on the wall when the season started. You've got the toughest schedule in football. They drafted a kid in the first round. They went out and signed a 36 year old quarterback. I mean, should any of these players be surprised at some point the kid was going to play. And I would say to those veterans, I'd say, listen, you're 03. What do you want us to do? Like, I can't let the room dictate. At least with the Giant example I gave, they were five and four. So there are probably players like, dude, we're going into week 10, we're above 500. What are we doing? Yeah, but you know, if you're 04,05, what, what kick do the players have coming at that point? Just do your job.

[Peter Rosenberg]

It's. To me, I know this doesn't sound right because a lot of times a team comes first in this situation. Once you're owing three in this situation, what's, what's good? Like the needs of the few outweigh the needs of the many.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah.

[Peter Rosenberg]

And I'm sorry, the room is gonna have to understand that to get, to get the franchise where it needs to be. And you can say this to Malik, neighbors, that's tough. You know, this kid, you love this kid. But if we throw him to the wolves now, we don't know what's going to happen. We can't. Like, you cannot do this too early. You can. It's just, it's the wrong move. I can't, I can't say it in an entertaining way. I can only say it as plain as possible. You cannot put this kid in if you don't think behind the scenes. He's up for it already yet, but you feel like he's close. That's different. But you're still. He's an apprentice right now. He's not ready to lead the way. But there's guys in that room that see potential in him. So it's not like it would be a. It wouldn't be. It would not be an unpopular decision if they did it right. But it doesn't mean it's the right decision for right now. And you don't do it to save your ass. No way. But I worry that the owner wants this because of what the building sounded like last night.

[Alan Hahn]

Then you can't do anything about it.

[Peter Rosenberg]

That sounded bad last night.

[Alan Hahn]

You know, Peter, the only way he starts.

[Anthony Beck]

Yeah.

[Alan Hahn]

Is when he's running. Not because the fans want it, not because the players want it or there's an injury or.

[Anthony Beck]

Which, by the way, I think is stupid. God forbid, by the way, guys. So tell me.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I know, I know.

[Anthony Beck]

Say, say Rosenberg, you don't know ball. You're a nut. In this specific situation with a team that's probably not going anywhere, you guys don't think because of what we're saying, it doesn't make sense to use one of those spots on having three quarterbacks. All right, if he's not ready, then, then. So they're down 213 and they're just getting attacked by a defense, then they're just gonna have to throw them in. So we're gonna plan it out strategically. But if the game goes bad and Wilson stumbles and gets hurt, well, now that plans out the window and Jackson starts playing.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I.

[Anthony Beck]

Still doesn't make sense.

[Alan Hahn]

You know what I think would happen, honestly, if Wilson got hurt?

[Anthony Beck]

Yeah.

[Alan Hahn]

You would see some sort of. Based on how they've used him. See, like Wildcats, like, I don't know.

[Anthony Beck]

They wouldn't drop him back.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah, well, they. Not a lot of scatter. Boo. But. But here's. Here's what Dable said. Would you feel comfortable starting dart?

[Anthony Beck]

Well, we put him in the game for the last two weeks, so we.

[Alan Hahn]

Wouldn'T put anybody in the game we.

[Anthony Beck]

Don'T feel confident with.

[Alan Hahn]

But you didn't have him throw, right?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Like Tommy DeVito. They didn't have him throw either.

[Alan Hahn]

Listen, and you know what? He might not be ready and go out there and play well. Right. I mean, well, the more Andrew. I'm not saying he's going to soil.

[Peter Rosenberg]

To shape and gets back into condition.

[Alan Hahn]

But once you start, like, isn't it possible that Wilson gets hurt, dart comes in, finishes the game, and then next week, Winston's the starting quarterback and he's back to be in the backup again. Like, it's all part of the process of preparation, consistently going out there and playing. It's not just about one game, one drive, one moment. It's like, are you ready for all that comes with being a starting quarterback for the New York Giants? You saw what happened with Tommy DeVito. If you play well, expectations are going to go through the roof. Sports center is going to be doing specials on you. You know, Bruce Beck is going to be coming to interview you, you know, before it's all. That's all part of the process too, man. You don't do things in a vacuum with the New York Giants or the New York Yankees. There's like certain teams in certain positions. You play center field at Yankee Stadium, it's a big deal. You play quarterback for the Giants, it's a big deal. Are you ready for all of this? And if they don't think he is, Peter, So maybe he would come in and finish a game, but are you ready to say he's now our starting quarterback?

[Anthony Beck]

One more, one more thing, though, that I'd ask you. We can discuss it more later. And maybe you think it's silly, but in this version of the NFL, how late, like do you go in a season where your rookie quarterback still isn't, quote, ready and they're ever going to be ready? I know you brought up Mahomes, but these days, Don, it's so rare. Like, at what point is he ready? They usually, it seems like the quarterbacks who become good these days are pretty much ready to play well.

[Peter Rosenberg]

It's, it's, you're seeing Michael Pennix, you're seeing Bo Nix, right? These are not guys that were taken at the very top of the draft.

[Alan Hahn]

That's important.

[Peter Rosenberg]

They, they won the job through the season, right? They, they had a veteran in place.

[Anthony Beck]

Yep.

[Peter Rosenberg]

They unseated the veteran and they have picked it up from that point. Now again, Pennix didn't have a great game this past weekend.

[Anthony Beck]

He's been, he's been a little.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But, but you know, like, they've established that it's, it's not, it's not Kirk Cousins. Like, they've established that. So that's kind of what you have to get to here. And we're getting really close to it now with the Giants. Very close to the fact that a guy like, of Russell Wilson's resume, that you're realizing that this ain't it and at some point you're going to have to just say, ready or not, we got to put him in and we've got to do whatever we can around him to make sure that he's successful and then build week after week for the rest of the season, which is again, it's collective. But Malik Neighbors has to be better. Andrew Thomas has to be better. They all have to be better around him.

[Alan Hahn]

But to your point, you know, Penix was the eighth overall pick. You know, Mahomes was the 10th overall pick. You know, we're talking about a kid. There's the 25th overall pick in the draft. He's drafted in the bottom of the first round. So that's your answer.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Lamar Jackson was the 30th pick.

[Alan Hahn]

So when. When guys sit, when you're a little bit careful with them, those are the guys that are usually drafted in the second round, third round, late in the first round.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But Don. Lamar Jackson was the 30th pick. They changed the entire offense in the middle of the season. When they decided to go to him, moved on from flat. It was Flacco, right?

[Anthony Beck]

Yeah.

[Peter Rosenberg]

And they changed the entire offense. Yeah, because they saw his skill set and said, what we're doing.

[Alan Hahn]

Well, sometimes that happens.

[Peter Rosenberg]

And it. It clicked.

[Anthony Beck]

Guess what? Went six and one the rest of the.

[Alan Hahn]

Because what did Seattle do? It was. Who is the. I forget his first name. Flynn. That was in.

[Anthony Beck]

Matt Flynn.

[Alan Hahn]

Matt Flynn. He was gonna be the starting quarterback. And then Wilson, who was taking in the third. Third round, stole the job from him.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah. All right. Just outplayed him.

[Alan Hahn]

So when that happens, that's a different story. But I'm just saying, a guy that they don't think is ready if he's drafted third overall, Peter, it's like, all right, well, what are you doing, man? You drafted him third overall. Let's get him ready. When you're drafted 25th overall, that tells you this is a bit of a project.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Becker was number one. They didn't start him right away.

[Alan Hahn]

Right. Well, that. Listen, that's. And guys were started third overall and started right away. And it. There's no formula. You just try to be as cool and as calculated as you can. The NFL binge is next. Don Hunter Rosenberg on ESPN New York.

[Anthony Beck]

All right, guys, the FanDuel sportsbook app is your home for all your favorite NFL bets. From yards to touchdowns. Who will win? It's all there with FanDuel, any play can be the play of the game. All right, FanDuel is giving all customers a 50% profit boost token on tonight's game. All right, tonight, this is a hell of a game. You got the Lions against the Purple Birds and Derrick Henry. That's right, the Ravens. Maybe you want to go Henry anytime. Touchdown Lamar Jackson over yards. It's all there for you. Just go make Fanduel your Go to app. For any snap, just visit fanduel.com Peter play your game with FanDuel, an official sports betting partner of the NFL 21 and over in fizzly present New York. Opt in required bonus issues non withdrawable profit boost tokens. Restrictions apply including any token expiration and max wager amount. See [e-mail] for help with a gambling problem. Call 877-HOPE in wire text open y 467-369.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.

[Anthony Beck]

I didn't listen to anything you just said.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Catch the show on demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcasts. This is the NFL binge.

[Alan Hahn]

Oh yeah.

[Anthony Beck]

All right. Ok. Hey, why not? Let's just get right to it, shall we? The NFL binge man, a lot happened yesterday.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You think we got Peter Seven games with a game winning score in the final three minutes of the fourth quarter. Five blocked field goal attempts, four of them in the fourth quarter. An insane, insane.

[Anthony Beck]

Yeah, and some of them had some real personal profound effects on some of us here. But let's get into all of it because as Allen just said, it was nothing but pure madness. Now Sunday's games, as Alan just said, were insane. Seven games where the final score came in the final three minutes. Now according to the Elias Sports Bureau, that's the most such games in a single day since the merger. We love saying since the merger. That's a big one. Sunday also saw five blocked field goals tied for the most in a week since 1673 when a guy named Larry Blue Shoes Johnson. No, I'm just kidding. Since 1990. All right. Among those four came in the fourth quarter. The most blocked field goals in the fourth on a single day in the last 45 years. So this one may be the most insane. I got to tell you guys, I haven't heard from Ballard yet. I should check in. After being held scoreless through three quarters, the Browns managed to tie their game with the Packers 10 10. The Pack had a chance at a go ahead field goal late, but Cleveland special teams came through. Whelan kneels at the 33. This is a 43 yard field goal try to give Green Bay the lead.

[Don La Greca]

It is blocked balls down to the ground and Greg Newsom falls on it on the 47 in the brown. Denzel Ward off the edge just like I told you.

[Anthony Beck]

Now that one easily could have been a scoop and score it wasn't. And then a few moments later from distance, this happened 2 seconds left.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Snap is back, kick is up.

[Don La Greca]

And the kick is right down the middle. And it's gone. Wait, there's a flag. It's good. Andre Schmidt nailed it. Green Bays throwing a helmet. Time, Green Bay. The Browns have beaten the Green Bay Packers.

[Peter Rosenberg]

That was my three point play.

[Anthony Beck]

Oh, I loved it.

[Peter Rosenberg]

What a disaster.

[Alan Hahn]

Oh, we're awful. We're awful at what we do. If you wanted to set fire to the picks right now just to do people a favor, I'm good, but.

[Anthony Beck]

And you know what the crazy thing is? I went one for three this weekend, guys. And based on yesterday, which we're going to get to in a second, I think I found it because I still consider that I got one of the games right. It's. What happened is simply impossible. I had to have had the game right the whole day long. Now listen, Alan, I felt. I felt pretty. I did not feel great about your Green Bay pick. Basically in the fourth quarter, the game was so nothing going on. Nothing that once Green, once Cleveland cut it to 10 3. I actually felt pretty good about Cleveland covering because just no one did a thing. And didn't we say it a couple weeks ago, guys? And I'm not trying to take anything away from Green Bay because obviously Cleveland. Cleveland's defense is incredible and so is Green Bay's. But like before we put a team in the super bowl, let's see if they can beat Cleveland on the road. You know what I'm saying?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Dude, it was 10 nothing.

[Alan Hahn]

I think I say this with all my covering.

[Peter Rosenberg]

We're shutting them out. Like everything's going well.

[Alan Hahn]

Football's whack.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Whack.

[Anthony Beck]

It's too much. All right, here we go.

[Peter Rosenberg]

So that shouldn't happen. It happened, baby.

[Anthony Beck]

Now, even after coming back from a 26, 7 deficit in the second half, it looked like the Eagles were going to fall to the Rams on a game winning field goal. All right, when the Eagles score late and go up one with the line being three and a half, I just feel fantastic either way. Then of course, the Rams get the ball back, move down the field, get into position and this happens.

[Don La Greca]

The ball is spotted, the kick is away. It's blocked. It's blocked. It's picked up by the Eagles. Running with it as Davis 30, 20, 10, 5. Touchdown. Game over. George Davis. Are you kidding me? Lock them again. Are you kidding me? Lock them again. Have you ever seen anything like this? Do you believe in miracles? The Lambs are standing silent. They can't believe what just happened to them. Successful field goal blocks Winning for the Eagles now. Great. Great.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I don't love the Al Michaels reference, but okay, now.

[Anthony Beck]

Now let me just say this. There, there, Don. I. Do it again. I liked the Rams, and I was right. I was right, Don. I wasn't wrong for a second until the final play, which was a scoop. And score never was it in question. It was a Rams cover all day long. Even when they blew the lead, it was a Rams cover.

[Alan Hahn]

So let's take the points because we. We were right in spirit. I.

[Anthony Beck]

We deserve it, don't we?

[Alan Hahn]

I think so. And can I just throw this out, too? I despise everything. Philadelphia Eagles. The uniforms, their coach, their players, everything.

[Anthony Beck]

Yeah, that's right.

[Alan Hahn]

Merrill Reese is a gem. Love him. Great announcer. He's been there.

[Anthony Beck]

I mean, I gotta tell you, he is fantastic. But in that moment, I wanted to sock him.

[Alan Hahn]

He's just doing his job, man.

[Anthony Beck]

I know, but he gets so happy, and it just makes me sick. All right, don't look now, guys, but the Chargers are kind of running wild. Charger mania is running wild.

[Alan Hahn]

Coryell all over again, man.

[Anthony Beck]

Two game lead on everyone in the AFC west after a great comeback win in Denver.

[Alan Hahn]

Snap.

[Anthony Beck]

Good hold. Good kick is good.

[Don La Greca]

Cam Dicker.

[Anthony Beck]

Sorry.

[Don La Greca]

Who secures victory as the Chargers start.

[Anthony Beck]

The season 3 and 0, knocking off each of their AFC west division foes in the process.

[Peter Rosenberg]

So, 3 and 0.

[Alan Hahn]

So the Chargers kicker, in essence, is Dirk Diggler from Boogie Nights. Right?

[Anthony Beck]

What's his last name? Proper Anthony?

[Peter Rosenberg]

That would be Cameron Dicker, the kicker.

[Alan Hahn]

Cameron Dicker the kicker. He want. He wanted it. He wanted a name that can cut glass.

[Anthony Beck]

Well, I got. I got news for you, by the way, with that name, there are only two jobs on the table. Kicker is one of them, and I think he made a bad choice. Well, the other job wouldn't have paid as well, but it would have been a hell of a time.

[Peter Rosenberg]

That's a name you draft in fantasy.

[Anthony Beck]

It's. It's so true, by the way. Both could have included being in a men's locker room at some point, but, you know, forget it. Anyways, the chargers are the third team since the division realignment in 2002 to start a season 3, 0, with all wins against the division, 3 and 0. 3 and 3, 0. That's done. Last time to do it, it was the Chicago Bears in 2006. Oh, what a boring team that was.

[Alan Hahn]

Oh, my God.

[Anthony Beck]

Mental. The super bowl, though.

[Alan Hahn]

I know. Maybe that could be because we got a list on Wednesday.

[Anthony Beck]

Good teams ever?

[Alan Hahn]

No, Just like the worst super bowl appearance.

[Anthony Beck]

The Kyle or Engrossman team was truly the definition of Super Bowl.

[Alan Hahn]

It's that or the the Stan Humphreys Chargers that lost to remember that. I know. Yeah, they beat.

[Anthony Beck]

All right. The Niners were on their way to dropping their game to Arizona after a safety gave the Cardinals a 1513 lead. But Mac Jones led a late drive into field goal range and Eddie Pinero did the rest. Here's the call from our good friend Chris Carlin.

[Alan Hahn]

Thomas Morstead is the holder.

[Anthony Beck]

Here's Eddie Pinero from 35 snap.

[Don La Greca]

The spot is down, the kick is up and it is good. And San Francisco has gone to 3, 0 for the third time under Kyle Shanahan with Eddie Pinheiro knocking it through from 35 yards away.

[Alan Hahn]

They're going to kill our boy Chris.

[Peter Rosenberg]

So he's so good.

[Alan Hahn]

No, he's great. But you know, they know he has a show the next day at 10 o' clock in the morning. San Francisco this week, Vegas next week. At least Indianapolis. That wasn't bad.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Living the dream, man. Living the dream.

[Alan Hahn]

And he was in studio today, I think. I mean, come on, man. No, it's living the dream.

[Peter Rosenberg]

It's good work.

[Alan Hahn]

He wasn't inside. Well, you could have kept the facade.

[Peter Rosenberg]

We have a stream. There is no facade.

[Anthony Beck]

He sounded great though.

[Alan Hahn]

No, he's.

[Anthony Beck]

When I think of Chris Carlin, actually, there's that call and only one other call call.

[Alan Hahn]

Right. It's not right.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Don't do that. Don't do that.

[Alan Hahn]

Don't point at Jacob because Jacob was. Was. He was doing the boy.

[Anthony Beck]

Was he ready though?

[Alan Hahn]

He was doing Satan's boy.

[Anthony Beck]

Was he ready though? All I had to do. I didn't plan that joke. That was on the fly and he was ready.

[Alan Hahn]

I think in fairness, you know, what was it? Pandemonium? Piscataway could have worked too, but no.

[Peter Rosenberg]

We don't have that saved as a drop.

[Anthony Beck]

That one's not saved that one not to death.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Doing what he loves. By the way, did the Niners really win this? Because I mean, more injuries, more issues like they never can stay healthy as a franchise.

[Alan Hahn]

No, they can't at all. And you know, Bosa, now you lose your starting quarterback, but. But in a division it's very winnable.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Mac Jones.

[Anthony Beck]

And this one wasn't written down, but how about my commies, guys, huh? Huh?

[Peter Rosenberg]

It wasn't written down for a reason.

[Anthony Beck]

Yeah, well, it's a great win though. It feel those ugly ones.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Is it a great win? You didn't finish the game.

[Anthony Beck]

Why would I put it down.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Comes east plays. It won't.

[Alan Hahn]

Out of context, you can make it really look bad, Peter, as a fraud. It's like you turn the game off to watch preseason hockey if they didn't know it was for me. Great point.

[Anthony Beck]

No, no, Anthony, I'm not suggesting you should have had it. I'm just saying it felt good to watch your team in a spot with a backup quarterback play a dumpy game. That's the kind of game that guys for years I'm used to. You just lose.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yep.

[Anthony Beck]

So it doesn't matter that it's. The setup is you still lose. And instead when you're a functional franchise, you bring in a backup quarterback and you spank up a bad team.

[Peter Rosenberg]

So you're very satisfied. I was just gonna say that like you. You walked away from that game with.

[Anthony Beck]

It usually is. You're right. Don. Sorry, Alan. You were saying?

[Peter Rosenberg]

No, never mind.

[Caller]

Oh, great.

[Alan Hahn]

All right.

[Anthony Beck]

I wanted to hear your point, though.

[Alan Hahn]

It's not as good as I'm telling you. Everybody right now wants to hear your point.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah, I should.

[Alan Hahn]

He, he.

[Anthony Beck]

Look, he's, he's.

[Peter Rosenberg]

No, no, do the math, Peter. Peter's making it clear that he enjoys a good spanking.

[Anthony Beck]

No, listen, I enjoy, I enjoyed the hell out of that game, by the way. Including incredible special teams game. We didn't do very much. But anyways, that is your NFL binge. Thank you to producer Anthony. What a great job dubing.

[Alan Hahn]

A bunch of calls to get to it. 1-800-919-3776. And there is baseball, both the good, the bad and the ugly of it coming up as well. Don on Rosenberg, take up until 7 o'. Clock. Then it's Dan Grasse here on ESPN New York. There are a lot of reasons why people buy at Ramsey Mazda. It's their selection, it's their customer service, it's their savings. Lisa New 2025 Mazda CX90 Turbo select for 249 for 24 months. Start shopping now at RamseyMazda.com. choose wisely. Choose Ramsey Mazda. Call 833-853-2970 for details. Vin S1225248 MSRP $40,000 0 Secure deposit ends 9 30, 25.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.

[Anthony Beck]

I didn't listen to anything you just said.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Catch the show on demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcasts.

[Alan Hahn]

Golf's greatest rivalry tees off at the Beth Page Black. And the guys are bringing you all the Action, energy and passion straight from the course. Don't miss DPH Rowan Rothenberg this Friday morning only on ESPN New York, brought to you by Michelob Ultra. No matter what you're playing for, make it superior with Michelob Ultra. 2.6 carbs, 95 calories, a superior taste with worth playing for. Official beer sponsor of the Ryder Cup. So that's, that's going. And that was getting talked about a lot during the broadcast yesterday because it's an NBC thing, I feel like I'm missing. I listen, I don't. I'm not complaining, believe me. But if everybody talks about this, I'm like, I don't care. Am I missing it? Am I a bad guy?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Because Ryder cup is, you know, again, it's the team. It's the whole team thing. So that's what's supposed to be cool about it.

[Anthony Beck]

But Ryder Cup's fun, man. Fact that it's here, it's very entertaining. Yeah, it's as entertaining as golf gets. Really. Honestly. Like, like, let me say this, Don, considering your argument about the Masters being stupid, is that the point that everyone gets excited about is like celebrating grass. I'll at least say this in defense of the Ryder Cup. What gets people hyped about it is that it's actually intense and has celebration and action. Like that is the thing about.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, the team aspect is huge, right?

[Anthony Beck]

And they, and as a result of that team thing there, the, the, the normal decorum, Don, that you like to make fun of is kind of golf out the window.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Especially as they've noted the New York slash Long island crowd that you're going to have at this event where they're going to be rowdy, it's going to act up. So it could have you.

[Anthony Beck]

You might not all the way hate it.

[Peter Rosenberg]

No, you might not hate it.

[Alan Hahn]

Well, I mean, I'm not going to watch a second of it, so, you know, they could actually be mentioning my name, promoting the Devil Games and invite Marco to play a hole.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I.

[Alan Hahn]

They'd have to, they'd have to inform me after the fact.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah. In your backyard. Then you might.

[Alan Hahn]

You're talking to the air. I'm not going to watch a second of it, but it seems like people are excited about it. And, and the thing that I found interesting. Thank you again. I don't know for a fact. I'm just based on what was talked about during the broadcast is the first time it's in the Tri State area since it was in Ridgewood, New Jersey, back in 1935. You remember that 90 years ago. I don't remember.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, again, that's what's gonna make the atmosphere interesting, because it's that New York crowd that tends to be a little more rowdy, a little louder, and so we'll see how it goes. But traffic in my area is gonna be a mess, that's for sure. Not fun. Not fun.

[Alan Hahn]

So you're. You're close to Beth Page?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Relatively, yeah. It's in the way of some things. So I won't be going to change the route, stay north.

[Alan Hahn]

I know Michael's gonna be doing the show out there, and like I said, he's not.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Michael's at Times Square, right.

[Alan Hahn]

But. Oh, that's right. He's at Times Square. But around the boys in the morning.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Oh, Rockefeller. There's Times Square. Whatever. There's a reading there somewhere. Somewhere midtown. But the. But. But the boys in the morning are going to be there on Friday, right? Is it Friday? Yes. Friday, right. Dnr.

[Alan Hahn]

Yes.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yes, Friday for dnr. Yeah.

[Alan Hahn]

So they got that going on for you.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah.

[Anthony Beck]

There you go.

[Alan Hahn]

Which is nice. Let's go to Dom and Rochester. You're on ESPN, New York. What's up, Dom?

[Caller]

What's up, guys? Can you hear me?

[Alan Hahn]

Oh, easily.

[Caller]

Hey, I just, you know, calling to talk about the Giants. Thanks for having me. It. Is this some kind of sick joke, like, what we have to watch every week? Because I grew up watching. You know, I was born in 97, so, like, you know, I grew up watching, like, real football. You know what I mean? And those teams didn't even have. I mean, on defense, we had some superstars, but that. That team. Those teams. You could argue. Those super. Those super bowl teams weren't even, like, you know, loads of talent, right? Like, across the board. Like, they didn't spend a boatload of money. You know what I mean? Like, the point I'm trying to make is, like, what we watch every time this team plays. Like, when you bring up Dart being.

[Anthony Beck]

Ready or not, I don't even know.

[Caller]

If it's a matter of Dart's ready or not. This team isn't ready for, like, anything.

[Alan Hahn]

Like, these coaches are not ready for him. You're right.

[Caller]

They're not ready for him. They're not ready for him.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You've been a Giants fan your whole life, clearly, so.

[Caller]

Yeah, I grew up.

[Alan Hahn]

I got.

[Caller]

I grew up watching the tapes of the Broncos Super Bowl.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Okay. Yes. Yeah. So you even went into the past.

[Caller]

I know my. I couldn't. I could recite those 90 and 86 teams, and I Wasn't even born.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Right. Okay. So with that in mind, this current team, what's their. What is their standard? What's their identity? What would you say?

[Caller]

They haven't had one in years. We saw in 2022 that they were developing one, but 2022 was the worst thing that honestly could have happened for us fans and that head coach because it was such falsehood.

[Peter Rosenberg]

So. All right with that. All right, so the teams that you enjoyed the most from, you know, 2005 to 2011, 12, what was their identity?

[Caller]

Obviously it was defense, but I'm going to be realistic. The Giant, those defenses, they had great pass rushers, but they gave up some yards. Right? They gave up yards.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, they remember they were in the second Super Bowl. They were hurt most of that season, got healthy and then they were.

[Caller]

They were. They were.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I'm just being realistic.

[Caller]

I'm not going to say that they had like cut out defense.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Understood. Right. But they were known. But that's what they were known for.

[Caller]

They had an identity. And they also had a defensive coordinator that had a clue. Shane Bow literally admitted it in that Hard Knocks two years ago. We're going to be built on putting your hand in the ground and go win the thing. We haven't seen Abdul Carter have his hand in the ground ever. All he does is stand up and run at the center. I get it. Like they're banged up at the inside linebacker position. But like, this team doesn't have a clue, Don. Like that guy doesn't have a clue.

[Peter Rosenberg]

So, Dom, hang on. I'm going to ask Don now because Don also was very close to watching the Giants most of his life, if not his entire life. Would you say that those teams that I discussed, their identity was. Line of script.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah. Both sides. Line of scrimmage, of great offensive line.

[Peter Rosenberg]

They rarely lost at the line of scrimmage.

[Alan Hahn]

Ever lost. The great defensive line, Great physical at.

[Peter Rosenberg]

The line of scrimmage on both sides of the ball. Right. You always knew what you were dealing with when you played the Giants. Physicality at the line of scrimmage, did they outskill you? Not all the time. They tried to. Again, the plaxical year. You said that was probably their best team in that run, but they. That was the identity of the Giant. When you knew when you were playing the Giants, that's what you're going to do. This current iteration, on the defensive side of the ball, I think there's a lot of physicality at the line of scrimmage. It's a lot of it. But on the other side? No, no. So they don't have that. That to me was Tom Coughlin. That to me was Bill Parcells. That to me was Bill Belichick. That to me was what the Giants were about. Even Jim Fossil, look, it was physicality at the line of scrimmage.

[Alan Hahn]

I'm glad you brought up Jim Fossil.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You don't have that because you know.

[Alan Hahn]

Jim Fossil did coach this team to the playoffs a few times, did go to a Super Bowl. Now, he's not Tom Coughlin, he's not Bill Par. I get it, but what did you just say? A Parcells team, a Coughlin team, a Fossil team. When you got a coach that I can identify the strengths and the weaknesses.

[Peter Rosenberg]

That's what I'm trying to say.

[Alan Hahn]

This is what we're going to be as a team. I see a collection of talent, but I don't say are they good at defense? I mean, they can rush the passer, but they're not really a great defense. All right, they've got some offensive weapons, but are they a great offensive team? No, they're not a great offensive team. They don't really do anything special on special teams.

[Peter Rosenberg]

So who are they?

[Alan Hahn]

Who are they aren't anything because the coaches aren't anybody. Well, what did McAdoo do after he got let go? What did Shermer do after he got let go? What did Judge do after he got let go? What's Dabel gonna do after he gets let go? They'll go back to being their assistants or they'll go back to college. They're not gonna become a head coach. I never honored the tease from earlier. In this day and age, with the pressure it is to win, I'm wondering, is it really fool's gold to find a young guy or do you need to win by bringing in somebody that's done it before? Rangers last championship, who do they bring in? Mike Keenan, who went to a Stanley cup final in Philadelphia. Went to a Stanley cup final in Chicago. All right. When was the last time the Giants won? Tom Coughlin went to two championship games in Jacksonville. Right. Think of all of them. Well, last time the Yankees won, Joe Girardi, he had been a coach and won coach manager of the year in Florida with the Marlins. Right. I'm wondering, do you have to bring in some. Is this the place to go to a first time head coach? No, it just eats you alive. You gotta have now obviously Bill Parcells, but that's going back 40 years ago. Right? There are exceptions to the rule. Al Arbour nobody knew who he was. He was a defensive of the Blues and becomes the greatest coach of all time. But now, with the way that the sports scene is established here in New York, how did the Devils win? You know, Pat Burns, he had won three other places as coach of the year. Larry Robinson had pelts from the Montreal Canadiens. Jacques Lemaire, same thing. Like you bring in these guys with experience, guys that have won before. That's the formula. You bring in young guy, you don't know. It's hit or miss with these guys. There's no experience.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Last time the Islanders were relevant, it was because Barry trots, right?

[Alan Hahn]

Oh yeah. What did he do, you know, with Nashville and was able to turn them around. Is New York just a place where you can ill afford to bring in somebody inexperienced in the hope that they're gonna figure it out in the brightest lights, the biggest city sports wise in the world?

[Peter Rosenberg]

I don't understand.

[Alan Hahn]

Thousand people who want you dead every time you don't get a first down.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Especially because of football. I don't understand. Well, and the jets is a great example. Who was the last coach that they hired that had a head coach resume? Like. And I mean when I say resume, not gay snob.

[Alan Hahn]

Because they were interim.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah. They weren't real coaches.

[Alan Hahn]

Right.

[Anthony Beck]

Not an idea, an actual resume.

[Alan Hahn]

Herm. No, Herm. No, Herm coached in Kansas City. At Herm. Herm was a defensive coordinator. Right.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Like everything they do is. Even Rex is the success he had early on.

[Alan Hahn]

Rex still was the last time they hired a coach that had extensive head coaching experience. I'm not talking interim like Bulls and gays. I guess you go back to parcels, right?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah, yeah. At Belichick and the last time the.

[Alan Hahn]

Giants hired a code Shermer. Shermer had a few years in Cleveland, but it wasn't successful.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Come on. Like, I'm talking about somebody that comes in resume.

[Anthony Beck]

Yeah.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Again, I know Pete Carroll is a million years old, but Pete Carroll is a guy that, you know what you're getting, you know the identity, you know what you're getting, you know you're gonna be right. Like. And some franchises just need that. And the Giants have lost that kind of a foundation. And the jets never have a foundation because they don't have anybody that comes in with that identity. So that's why I asked what Dom was saying about the teams that I grew up watching. Is all you have to say to yourself is, who are the Giants? What are they? Because when. When you talk about teams in the NFL, the good ones you always say we know what we're dealing with when we play them. We know what's coming. And you don't say that about the Giants. And I don't think you've been able to say that about the Giants for years. Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.

[Anthony Beck]

I don't want to know how the.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Sausage is made, man. I just want to know. It's good. Hear more of Don Allen and Peter weekday afternoon starting at 3 on 8 ESPN, the ESPN New York app, and your smart speakers.