Hour 2: Thursday Rewrite & Naughty by Nature

Summary

Podcast Summary: Don, Hahn & Rosenberg
Episode: Hour 2: Thursday Rewrite & Naughty by Nature
Release Date: May 29, 2025

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1. Introduction and Fanatics Fest [00:31 - 01:50]

The episode kicks off with Don Hahn and Peter Rosenberg introducing the podcast and promoting the return of Fanatics Fest in New York City.
Peter Rosenberg excitedly shares details about the three-day event at the Javits Center from June 20-22, highlighting its convergence of sports culture and content. He mentions celebrity appearances, live podcasts, and panel discussions.

"Fanatics Fest is making its return to New York City this summer at the Javits Center from Friday, June 20 to Sunday June 22."
(00:43)

2. Playoff Analysis: NBA, NFL, and NHL [01:51 - 05:38]

The hosts delve into the current playoff scenarios across major sports:

• NBA: Discussion centers on the unpredictability of the playoffs, contrasting it with past seasons where outcomes were more predictable. They highlight teams like OKC and Minnesota in the West, and Knicks and Pacers in the East.
• NFL: The conversation shifts to football, criticizing the dominance of the Patriots and Chiefs, and noting the increased competitiveness yet top-heavy nature of the AFC, mentioning the Bills and Baltimore.
• NHL: A lively debate ensues about the Florida Panthers' consecutive appearances in the Stanley Cup Final and the potential for a rematch between the Panthers and Edmonton Oilers, emphasizing star players like Connor McDavid.

"Connor McDavid like you're talking about, that's like the LeBron James of the NHL."
(03:32)

3. Pat McAfee Incident and John Mellencamp's Response [10:27 - 21:03]

A significant portion of the episode addresses a recent controversy involving Pat McAfee during an NBA game and musician John Mellencamp's subsequent reaction:

• Incident Overview: McAfee delivered an unscripted promo that included profanity, intended to energize the crowd, and later interacted humorously with celebrities like Timothée Chalamet and Spike Lee.
• John Mellencamp's Statement: Mellencamp, a lifelong Hoosier, criticized the behavior, apologizing on behalf of Indiana, which sparked debate about free speech and brand representation.
• Hosts' Perspectives:
  • Alan Hahn suggests that the responsibility lies with those who handed McAfee the microphone.
  • Peter Rosenberg emphasizes accepting diverse opinions and not blaming McAfee or Mellencamp solely.
  • Michael Kay sides with Mellencamp, viewing his reaction as taking things too seriously.

"When you give certain people a microphone, you can't act shocked when they are themselves."
(17:30)
"I think John Cougar Mellencamp is not happy."
(19:00)

4. Thursday Rewrite: 2020 NBA Draft and Knicks' Decisions [23:28 - 36:43]

In the "Thursday Rewrite" segment, the hosts re-examine a pivotal moment in the 2020 NBA Draft involving the New York Knicks:

• Original Draft Picks:
  • The Knicks had the 8th pick, choosing Obi Toppin from Dayton, while Tyrese Halliburton was selected 12th by the Sacramento Kings.
• Hypothetical Scenario:
  • If the Knicks had selected Halliburton instead of Toppin, how might the current NBA landscape differ?
  • Implications for the Pacers: Halliburton would have stayed with the Knicks, potentially altering the Pacers' trajectory and their rivalry with the Knicks.
  • Team Performance: Discussing whether Halliburton would thrive in New York as he has in Indiana, and the impact on the Knicks' Jalen Brunson situation.

"We keep moving on here because those were the big names in that draft. But the Knicks come up at 8, and there were several names that were out there for them. One of them was Tyrese Halbert."
(24:03)
"What one decision, what one little change in history could do that changes everything and where we are right now."
(32:37)
The discussion highlights the unpredictability of draft outcomes and how a single decision can have ripple effects across multiple franchises.

5. Halftime Segment with Naughty by Nature [40:33 - 50:52]

The latter part of the episode features a special halftime segment with members of the iconic hip-hop group Naughty by Nature:

• Introductions: Kaley Cuoco moderates, engaging with group members KG and Vinny.
• Music and Legacy: The conversation covers the group's most famous tracks like "Hip Hop Hooray" and their contributions to hip-hop culture.

  "We knew it from shooting the video because here's another Nick's reference. Spike Lee directed the video."
  (46:14)

• New York vs. New Jersey Identity: They discuss their strong ties to both New York and New Jersey, reflecting on the cultural dynamics between the two regions.

  "Jersey has always been the stepchild to New York. But we fought for our right, the party. And it is what it is."
  (42:18)

• Community Engagement: Shout-outs to local initiatives, such as the renovation of Oval Park in East Orange, NJ, and their upcoming summer league.

  "They just renovated our childhood park, Oval park in East Orange, New Jersey. Named the basketball court after us."
  (49:34)

• Music's Longevity vs. Athletic Careers: A reflection on how music can endure beyond an athlete's career, emphasizing the lasting impact of their work.

  "When your career is over, there's no residuals. But a musician, your music could live forever."
  (48:28)

Conclusion

The Don, Hahn & Rosenberg podcast episode offers a rich blend of sports analysis, intriguing "what-if" scenarios, and cultural discussions with special guests. From dissecting playoff outcomes across multiple leagues to exploring the ramifications of past draft decisions and celebrating hip-hop legends, the hosts provide insightful commentary enriched with memorable quotes and engaging dialogue. This episode is a must-listen for enthusiasts eager to gain a deeper understanding of sports dynamics and the interplay between athletics and cultural phenomena.

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Notable Quotes:

• "Connor McDavid like you're talking about, that's like the LeBron James of the NHL." — Peter Rosenberg (03:32)
• "When you give certain people a microphone, you can't act shocked when they are themselves." — Peter Rosenberg (17:30)
• "We keep moving on here because those were the big names in that draft. But the Knicks come up at 8, and there were several names that were out there for them." — Alan Hahn (24:03)
• "Jersey has always been the stepchild to New York. But we fought for our right, the party. And it is what it is." — Vinny (42:18)
• "When your career is over, there's no residuals. But a musician, your music could live forever." — Alan Hahn (48:28)

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For listeners who haven’t tuned in, this summary encapsulates the essence of the episode, ensuring you stay informed on all key discussions and insights shared by Don Hahn, Alan Hahn, and Peter Rosenberg.

Transcript

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[Don Hahn]

This is the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.

[Peter Rosenberg]

That sounds like heaven to me.

[Don Hahn]

Listen live weekday afternoon starting at 3 on 880 ESPN, the ESPN New York app and your smart speakers.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Fanatics Fest is making its return to New York City this summer at the Javits center from Friday, June 20 to Sunday June 22. A three day celebration where sports culture and content converge. Bring fans closer to their favorite athletes and sports legends and than ever before. With appearances by your favorite athletes, celebrities and entertainers, live podcasts and a full schedule of panels featuring the most recognizable names in sports. You can enter to win a four pack of tickets on the ESPN New York app. Find the contest tile to submit your entry. Adult and kids tickets are available now@fanatics fest.com we're here at stout 33rd and 7th. Come on down downstairs. As soon as you walk in, come on down the stairs and hang out with us until 7 o' clock. Kurt Thomas is going to be here. Jay will at at some point as well to talk about game five Knicks and Pacers. Thanks to Bill Peto for swinging by and I'm asking him about the parody. And the more I think about it, just incredible, right? The NBA was the furthest thing from parody. Same teams every year. You could pretty much lock in the final, you know, before the season even started. And now it could be any team, right? I mean look at the West.

[Alan Hahn]

It's crazy.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You know, right now it looks like OKC is, is unbeatable. But you know, Minnesota looks like it's on the come Denver still hanging around. You look at the east right now and you know the Knicks are great. Pacers don't look like they're going anywhere. But you look at football, which was supposed to be what parody was all about, right? They were the poster child for parody. Everybody opens camp thinking they can win the Super Bowl. Well, it's been a study diet of Patriots and Chiefs, you know, basically over.

[Alan Hahn]

The last half and it's also in the conference championships. It's sort of a steady diet of the same, is it not? Bills, Baltimore Right. Like you're kind of seeing this in the afc. It's incredibly competitive, but it's extremely top heavy.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Oh, very, very top.

[Michael Kay]

It's three teams, it really is in.

[Alan Hahn]

The afc and you're trying to bust through, but you just, you know, you can't.

[Peter Rosenberg]

And hockey was always. Well, listen, all you do is have make the playoffs and you can make a run. We've seen eight seeds win Stanley Cups and now, you know, for the sixth consecutive year, a team from Florida is going to be in the Stanley cup final. The Panthers are going to go for the third consecutive time after Tampa went three straight times. And right now, unless Edmonton blows a 31 series lead, we're going to have a repeat of last year's Stanley cup final.

[Alan Hahn]

Are you good with that?

[Peter Rosenberg]

I'm good with that. The fact that Edmonton started out slow, forced a game seven come back from.

[Alan Hahn]

Three zero down, that was wild.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I'd love to see them both go at it again to see some of the, you know, even though Florida is not a household name team wise, there's a ton of great players and to McDavid and dry saddle to play on that level again. No offense to Dallas, who's got stars of their own, but to see a rematch of that I think would be too.

[Alan Hahn]

How about this? If last year's Stanley cup final was a best of nine, would Edmonton have come back to win it?

[Peter Rosenberg]

I believe they would.

[Alan Hahn]

Right?

[Peter Rosenberg]

I believe they.

[Alan Hahn]

David was playing out of his mind in the middle of that series. He just turned it on and we don't get to see enough of that. That's why I think for the sport, it's good. I will make this argument. And this is not haterade. This is just observation. Go ahead, Pacers, Thunder, if that's your finals matchup. Oh, boy. You know, it's not major markets right now. You know, people will watch because it's the NBA finals. That's what we expect. But if you give me Conor McDavid in the Stanley Cup Final, Connor McDavid like you're talking about, that's like the LeBron James of the NHL, right? Is that, is that hyperbole? No, he's right. Like he is the biggest name in the sport and the biggest talent in the sport. If you're putting him back on that stage again and those games are. Because these conference finals have been a joke blowouts left and right. But if you give me that series again and it is knock down, drag out and he's doing what he does magically special moves like just Everything that he does, he jumps off the screen. I think the Stanley cup final would rate closer to the NBA final than ever before.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, not only that, ever.

[Alan Hahn]

They won't beat it. It's just not going to happen. But I mean, as far as closing the gap, I think it would.

[Peter Rosenberg]

And I'll tell you what. And unfortunately it didn't.

[Alan Hahn]

Now if you put the Knicks in that final, forget it, of course.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But to be able to get those types of markets with. With not marquee names yet. If here's where maybe this is hyperbole, Peter can come, you know, take me over the ledge.

[Michael Kay]

All right.

[Peter Rosenberg]

The fact that you're saying Florida Edmonton could be in competition with Thunder Pacers, then wouldn't Rangers Oilers beat it. Oh, or Bruins beat it.

[Alan Hahn]

Boilers, you understand.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I'm just saying it's a huge gap. Here's what I'll say. You're already starting, but let's say OKC wins in a sweep. None of the games are competitive, which is certainly on the table. And you get like a classic game seven, you know, classic seven game series where a bunch of games go into overtime. You don't think that there is a point where a game in the Stanley cup final could beat any of the four sweeps. So you know, you're doing Thunder and.

[Alan Hahn]

Page, you're doing Four nations versus NBA All Star.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Nine million people watched four Nations.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah.

[Michael Kay]

Right.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Now I don't know how many people would end up watching any given Thunder pace.

[Alan Hahn]

People watch when greats are playing at the highest level. And that's what McDavid is. He's the biggest. He is the biggest name in the sport. And if he's on the cusp of winning a championship, I'm telling you, people are watching that.

[Michael Kay]

I don't want to poo poo at all.

[Alan Hahn]

But you will.

[Michael Kay]

But there were other. There were extenuating things around four nations that took it to.

[Alan Hahn]

Well, the nationalistic stuff I completely understand.

[Michael Kay]

But that's not going to happen here.

[Peter Rosenberg]

No, but we'll wait a minute. But two of the biggest names in four nations in that championship game that had 9 million people would be playing for the champion for the Stanley Cup.

[Alan Hahn]

Right.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You'd have Matthew Kachukachuk and going up against Connor McDavid. Right. And so I do think you might get some.

[Michael Kay]

Well, then you got to do start smart marketing.

[Peter Rosenberg]

The point is, is that you might end up getting that. What you got in 94 with the sports Illustrated, like is the NHL hotter than the NBA kind of thing. If you get a Thunder Pacers. But right now, the Knicks are hoping to avoid that.

[Alan Hahn]

They get it. Forget to blow up. But so here's. Here's the stat I had for you yesterday. We ran out of time. So think about it this way. Greeny and I did this yesterday morning when discussing the potential of, you know, the finals matchups in the markets. And we looked it up. So the city of Indianapolis. Population. The city is a little over 700,000. I'm sorry, 800,000. The. The city of Oklahoma. Oklahoma City, probably less. Right. Is in this, like, almost 700. Wow. All right. The city of Edmonton, Alberta. 1.5 million.

[Peter Rosenberg]

That's dead even.

[Alan Hahn]

Dead even.

[Michael Kay]

Wow.

[Alan Hahn]

And then you're adding south, you know, South Florida, which we know. Miami, that whole area, Fort Lauderdale, like that.

[Michael Kay]

Of course, it's complicated by the fact that the TV is separated by country.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, that's why. That's the problem is TNT won't benefit.

[Alan Hahn]

They won't benefit from it. But the point is, is like, when you talk about small markets, you always would assume that the Canadian one in the Prairies is probably the smallest. It is not. It's actually a larger audience. Now, again, it doesn't benefit the. The. It doesn't benefit tnt. It doesn't benefit Turner, because the Canadian. Who. Who has the. The national for that, is it tsn, The Sportsnet Sportsnet has it. Okay, so they'll benefit in Canada, obviously. But when it comes to eyeballs on. On the screen, not. Edmonton will have more than two markets combined in the NBA finals if the Pacers end up winning the series.

[Peter Rosenberg]

And that's like.

[Alan Hahn]

That's wild, isn't it?

[Peter Rosenberg]

You know, it is. It's.

[Alan Hahn]

I just did a Richard from Manhattan, didn't I?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, Edmonton is the capital.

[Alan Hahn]

I just still.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Alberta.

[Alan Hahn]

Did I just do Richard from Manhattan?

[Michael Kay]

A bit, yeah. Mini Richard.

[Peter Rosenberg]

More like a more and a little mini Richard.

[Michael Kay]

AKA known as little.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, first of all, he acknowledged our existence, so right there. He's not rich, by the way.

[Michael Kay]

Richard was on one yesterday. His blowing by of Allen yesterday was. I would say it's unlike anything we've ever seen.

[Alan Hahn]

Tire tracks right over me.

[Michael Kay]

But a couple weeks ago, he made.

[Alan Hahn]

Michael lose it today.

[Michael Kay]

He did?

[Alan Hahn]

Yes.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Oh, I didn't hear that.

[Alan Hahn]

Oh, he lost.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, speaking of losing it, you. Let's honor the teas, people.

[Michael Kay]

All right, well, a couple of things. Number one, Juanito told me he said hello to you, Don. You didn't recognize him.

[Vinny]

Wow.

[Michael Kay]

That he has a. You know, maybe he has a differently shaved face.

[Peter Rosenberg]

He didn't Oh, I did say. I did say hello to someone I came in, but I didn't recognize.

[Michael Kay]

Was it. Was it a. Say what you want to say. It was an importantly Latino gentleman.

[Alan Hahn]

Oh, boy.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I wasn't gonna say either of those things. I'm uncomfortable labeling people in that way.

[Alan Hahn]

What were you gonna say then?

[Peter Rosenberg]

I was gonna say, I met some people when I came down. I didn't recognize him. I was not gonna go ethnicity or portly.

[Alan Hahn]

Well, how else would you describe somebody human?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Not. Not that way.

[Alan Hahn]

He had. He had almond eyes.

[Michael Kay]

Anyways, he said. But he wasn't offended. He said, I said hi to Don. He didn't recognize me with my clean, shaved face. He said, I definitely said hi to the goat Allen. For sure.

[Peter Rosenberg]

The goat.

[Michael Kay]

And then he said, michael, be old. Then he said, michael was talking greasy about you. Is that. It was Mikey Michael talking greasy about me, but you.

[Alan Hahn]

So he's talking greasy about everybody?

[Michael Kay]

Yeah, that's kind of what he does.

[Peter Rosenberg]

What does that mean, greasy? Yeah.

[Michael Kay]

Not nice.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Okay, I figured that's what it meant.

[Michael Kay]

But you wouldn't want to take a gamble. But your response.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Am I supposed to know?

[Michael Kay]

Talking greasy?

[Alan Hahn]

No. No.

[Peter Rosenberg]

And how do you know, Alan?

[Alan Hahn]

It's just grammar. Is it? Yeah. I don't hear a word, and you just kind of assume you know what it is.

[Michael Kay]

I don't think he's putting it together. He heard the point in the sense.

[Peter Rosenberg]

No, no, he did. He took the chance. He just said it. Yeah, I. You know, I know what things, you know, I could figure out.

[Michael Kay]

I know where words go in sentences, and I put it together. Now. Now, you guys are aware that Anthony Pusick was down here earlier.

[Alan Hahn]

He was.

[Michael Kay]

He was here.

[Peter Rosenberg]

He left like this place was on fire.

[Michael Kay]

And. And. And he said that, you guys, Michael was gone.

[Alan Hahn]

He said, he's out.

[Michael Kay]

And he said, you know, everybody always wants him to be here. And he was here.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah.

[Michael Kay]

And then you guys had a private lunch, and. And he wasn't invited. And he was just here by himself kicking. Just kicking rocks down the road by himself and was left out of the lunch festivities. I personally was flabbergasted.

[Alan Hahn]

Lonely. Pusa.

[Peter Rosenberg]

This is.

[Michael Kay]

We.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Alan and I have to park in the same lot.

[Alan Hahn]

Yep.

[Michael Kay]

Okay. So we just said, you mean metaphorically or in actuality?

[Peter Rosenberg]

We have to park. The lot that we park in by the garden is right by the garden. And so we just said, hey, do you want. If we get. If we arriving at the same time, you want to go to caboose? So that's all we did. Yeah, because we figured Michael's doing his show here, so we'll just, you know, we'll, you know, it wasn't like, hey, let's invite everybody over. Go out of your way. Come. So we both arrived at, you know, 1:40, and it just. So don't, buddy, stop it.

[Michael Kay]

But think.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Why is everybody gonna get offended?

[Michael Kay]

Think about it like this.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Love, Anthony.

[Michael Kay]

It's not you, though, Don. But think about who you're sitting next to.

[Alan Hahn]

What does that mean?

[Michael Kay]

This is a man who, whenever lunch is had without him being a part of it, he throws a borderline temper tantrum. I'm all set. And Anthony. Am I wrong? And Anthony got left out. He's the one who always wants Anthony to come. Anthony's here and. And no one says, do you want to come to Taboos or Boo Boos or wherever you guys went? No one wants to say a word to the poor guy.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Taboos or Boo Boos.

[Alan Hahn]

Well, Taboos and Boo Boos is a different kind of joint that we usually go at later.

[Peter Rosenberg]

And we'd still not be back.

[KG]

I'd go there.

[Peter Rosenberg]

No, it was just an impromptu, Allan. I'm not going to have it. So this is. This is the big.

[Alan Hahn]

Can't we have a thing?

[Peter Rosenberg]

This is.

[Alan Hahn]

This. How do I pry him from Michael K. And his infatuation with K. The only way I can do it is I take him out a few times. Wine and dine, show them a good time.

[Michael Kay]

Wine and Don them.

[Alan Hahn]

That's all I got. Right.

[Michael Kay]

How'd it go? It went pretty well until he showed up and then hung out with Michael.

[Alan Hahn]

You know how many things like, it happens. We got to get over there. We got to get to Michael. We have to get there.

[Michael Kay]

Yeah, and I want to be late.

[Alan Hahn]

We just had a nice time. And he's.

[Michael Kay]

And then he's bringing.

[Alan Hahn]

He's running across the street. The.

[Vinny]

The.

[Alan Hahn]

The walk sign was already blinking like, warning you. And he's just, I gotta go.

[Peter Rosenberg]

He's exaggerating a little bit.

[Michael Kay]

Oh, but you were.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, because we did get the test text from our pinhead suits. And you go, where are you guys?

[Alan Hahn]

You guys did say 2:30.

[Michael Kay]

And you know what? I didn't. Now that text makes more sense because Don responded, we're on the way. And I thought, well, where are Don and Al?

[Alan Hahn]

Who's this we?

[Michael Kay]

Yeah, who is this we that we're talking about? I didn't know.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Honestly, if anybody should be offended, it's you. But again, we weren't leaving people out.

[Michael Kay]

You parked on the same lot.

[Peter Rosenberg]

If you and I were parking in the same lot, then I would have. We would have probably had the same conversation. And stop someplace at Tebow's.

[Alan Hahn]

No, not Thibault's.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Tebow's.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah. Tebow's is another peekaboos. No, Tebow's is like, it's a Christian place. Yeah. It's very religious. And you walk in and you have to take your shirt off and they spray you with water. Oh, that's t bows. Oh, yeah.

[Michael Kay]

Some people would enjoy them.

[Alan Hahn]

You remember that's what he did at jets camp, right?

[Michael Kay]

He didn't spray himself, did he?

[Alan Hahn]

No, but it was raining. And then he decided, and he was.

[Michael Kay]

Like, oh, I'd be more comfortable.

[Alan Hahn]

Be so much more comfortable if I didn't have this shirt on.

[Michael Kay]

Is he still on tv? Yeah, he's still doing college stuff.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Isn't it great to now and to actually have good teams instead of good teams in theory? Like, you know how many times we had good teams in theory, like with the Jets? A bunch of times. Oh, we got Tim Tebow. We're good team in theory. Aaron Rodgers. We're going to have a good team in theory. We got all the new coaches. Super team in Brooklyn. We've got teams in theory. Is it nice to actually have a good team? Exactly.

[Michael Kay]

And tonight you can celebrate.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah. Can we follow up on something?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Do it.

[Alan Hahn]

So we all know John Mellencamp, right?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Sure.

[Michael Kay]

Oh, yeah.

[Alan Hahn]

He's.

[Michael Kay]

He's a man from Indiana. He's from a small town.

[Alan Hahn]

He is. He is.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Little pink houses.

[Alan Hahn]

Little, Little pink house.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Jack and Diane.

[Alan Hahn]

Yes. He. He put a message out.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Oh, no.

[Alan Hahn]

About Pat McAfee's promo that he cut before the fourth quarter of game four.

[Michael Kay]

He did?

[Alan Hahn]

Yes. And I found it interesting because, you know, he was sitting right there courtside as well.

[Michael Kay]

John Mellon, I am so interested. I have no idea where this is going to go.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah, it could go either way.

[Michael Kay]

I, I, by the way, I'm, I'm visually visibly excited.

[Alan Hahn]

Are you really?

[Michael Kay]

That's.

[Alan Hahn]

I Can you tell?

[Peter Rosenberg]

I thought it was the way.

[Michael Kay]

This is, this is. By the way, this is a tease. All right, give it to me. Give me the Cougar melon camp.

[Alan Hahn]

He said, Knicks Pacers games have been very entertaining for anyone who likes basketball or sports. I attended Game 4 in Indianapolis, Hoosier hospitality. I was embarrassed when somebody, under whose direction I don't know, called out some of the people who had made the trip from New York to support their team, and in turn, Support our team. The audience booed these people. I'd say that was not Hoosier hospitality. One could say it's poor. Poor sportsmanship. I was not proud to be a Hoosier, and I've lived here my entire life. On behalf of most Hoosiers, I would like to apologize for our poor behavior. I'm sure the Pacers had nothing to do with this smackdown. Signed John Mellencamp. Notice that he threw smackdown in at the end.

[Michael Kay]

Now I feel slow.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You can't. He wouldn't go after Mellencamp, would he? You can't do that. Oh, he's an American treasure.

[Alan Hahn]

But I. I think I. I think all bets are off now.

[Michael Kay]

He's an Indiana.

[Alan Hahn]

Now, in. In Pat McAfee's defense, you did say that You.

[Michael Kay]

You.

[Alan Hahn]

You got some information yesterday. I was annoyed by it. And when you. When you find out what really happened, this was not planned. He said he was sitting there. Someone came up to him and gave him a mic, and he thought, this is before the fourth quarter. He's like, oh, you're going to interview me? And the guy said, no, we're going to have you address the crowd. So he's like, all right, what do you want me to do? Well, you know, get them all fired up. So he's like, well, all right. If I'm doing that, there's only one thing I know, which is the wwe. Let's. Let's cut a promo. And he made eye contact with Chalamet. He said Chalamet saw him and had a grin on his face like, I know what's coming. And so. And then he saw Spike Lee, and he's like, okay, I know what I'm gonna do.

[Michael Kay]

It's a good idea.

[Alan Hahn]

And he went all in.

[Michael Kay]

Yeah.

[Alan Hahn]

He said Chalamet loved it. Ben Stiller had fun with it on social media after the fact.

[Michael Kay]

Yeah.

[Alan Hahn]

And so he thought, like, this was all in good fun, him dropping a couple of curses. He's like. It's just when you're in that mode, you just go. So with that in mind, I'm like, all right, I get it. Somebody handed him a mic. We all know that He's. You know, he's. He's about that life.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah.

[Alan Hahn]

So, you know, getting himself into.

[Michael Kay]

I mean, like, when we had the blame and.

[Alan Hahn]

And John Mill Cam saying that I'm sure the pace had nothing to do with this.

[Michael Kay]

He's wrong.

[Alan Hahn]

That's wrong. Clearly somebody from the Pacers or from. From the game, the game ops staff thought this would be a Great idea. And it became what it became. So I don't know if I really would have great Criticism of Pat McAfee in this one, only because he was caught in the moment. It was spontaneous, and this is his brand. So it happened. But now, apparently, John Cougar Mellencamp is not happy.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, we can live in a world I was joking around about, you know, you're not going to go after Mellencamp. Listen, he's entitled to his opinion. There could be people that had no problem with the. McAfee did, and there are going to be people that had a problem, feel.

[Alan Hahn]

Like it was taste.

[Peter Rosenberg]

And so that's it. He had his say, McAfee had his say. And everybody go to their respective corners now, where I do think there is a villain in this. Oh, are, you know, the person that made the decision to think it. Let's give McAfee a microphone, and everything's going to turn out okay. You should know. You should read the room and say, maybe we need to have a conversation of do's and don'ts. You know, it's like when our company hired Rush Limbaugh and we were like, oh, my God, he was controversial. I had no idea. Like, what do you.

[Alan Hahn]

You.

[Peter Rosenberg]

When you. When you give certain people a microphone, you can't act shocked when they are themselves.

[Michael Kay]

They do what they do into the.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Do what they do.

[Michael Kay]

Right.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You know, so. So I'm not going to, like, fire anybody or kill them for it. But if you. If you want to blame anybody, the person that thought it was a good idea to give somebody like Pat McAfee, who's going to speak his mind and not care, something unscripted to say. And don't be, like, shocked when all of a sudden they kind of go there.

[Michael Kay]

If I. If I. If I were to take a side on this, it would be against Mellencamp. He's taking it too seriously. I'm sorry. None of those celebrities felt like they were actually under attack. They got it. It was all.

[Alan Hahn]

No, but I think what he's saying is, like, there's a. There's the. Again, the standards and decency and who. What we represent as middle America. And you're. You're. You're making us look like that when really middle. Middle America, we'd like to feel like we represent something a little more decent. Well, I think that's what he's trying to suggest.

[Michael Kay]

He probably feels. He probably feels like as, you know, as one of these sort of longtime celebrities who represents that area.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah.

[Michael Kay]

Like, come on. Man, I've been trying to get people to be accepting of us, not talk trash when they actually come to our town.

[Alan Hahn]

Right.

[Michael Kay]

But I do think that that's still taking it a little too seriously. I don't think anyone was actually bothered by it. If there's any criticism, it would be, hey, you probably shouldn't use the S word because kids are there. But I think otherwise it was in good.

[Alan Hahn]

By the way, he's from Indiana. McAfee's not.

[Michael Kay]

Well, he threw that line in there. But he said, as someone who's from here my entire life, right. He's clearly saying, like, hey, I know you think you run Indiana because you're a big star, right? There have been people. I literally wrote small town dude like that. This is my.

[Alan Hahn]

And then he added smackdown at the end, which I.

[Michael Kay]

And then he had smackdown. He well worded. You know what? Mellon camp. Going for this. I'm impressed, though. He's going for it. What time of day was this? Was this.

[Alan Hahn]

When did this come out, this standby? Because.

[Michael Kay]

Has Pat response yet? Because there's no way.

[Alan Hahn]

Three hours ago.

[Michael Kay]

Three hours ago, Pat was on the air.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah. So one o' clock.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I don't. Listen, I. I don't know if McAfee's got to go after him. It's just his opinion. I think he did it. Nice. Just, hey, you know, that's not kind of what he thinks Indiana's about. But I wouldn't get.

[Alan Hahn]

It's already gotten 2 million views.

[Peter Rosenberg]

If you too crazy about it. But, you know, would it have been so bad that before you handed the microphone to McAfee, just say, hey, listen, you know, this is going out to. This might be some kids in the building. Just try to keep it clean. Say whatever you want to say. Have fun with it. But, you know, let's try to keep.

[Michael Kay]

Pat reposted John's statement. Oh, and he wrote, I am quote somebody.

[Alan Hahn]

Okay.

[Peter Rosenberg]

And it's probably. That's probably all.

[Alan Hahn]

That's nothing really. There.

[Michael Kay]

I was embarrassed when some. Well, there's. There's two ways of playing on it, right?

[Alan Hahn]

Oh, he's saying, you know, say my name.

[Michael Kay]

I am somebody. What? I am somebody is a. A saying in and of itself. And he's saying, I am that person that's thrown a little bit back. We'll see. We'll see what happens.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I don't think there'll be a volley. I think it dies there.

[Michael Kay]

But if he hasn't been on the air yet to talk about it, that's the key what he says on a show live microphone.

[Alan Hahn]

Glad New York can provide content for middle America.

[Michael Kay]

Look at us.

[Alan Hahn]

You're welcome America. That's right, New York.

[Michael Kay]

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[Don Hahn]

Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.

[Michael Kay]

I didn't listen to anything you just said.

[Don Hahn]

Catch the show on demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcasts.

[Alan Hahn]

The time continuum has been disrupted, creating.

[Peter Rosenberg]

An alternate 1985 hey Doc, are you telling me you built a time machine?

[Don Hahn]

The Thursday Rewrite.

[Alan Hahn]

All right, so it is our Thursday rewrite, and I tried to find something that would be very topical and very much, you know, like right on point to tonight's Game and this series in general. So let me take you back not too long ago, but it is a long time ago when you consider where the franchise was to the NBA draft of 2020.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Okay.

[Alan Hahn]

The Knicks had the eighth pick in that draft.

[Peter Rosenberg]

We're in the midst of COVID Yes.

[Alan Hahn]

And they had. Leon Rose had just come in to take over the organization, running the team. Tom Thibodeau was named the head coach. And now they were trying to go in a new direction. And that new direction had a top 10 draft pick in it, in a draft that had some really good players. Now, remember, Jalen Brunson was in Dallas. This was not. He was not on the team yet. They were trying to find pieces in that draft. There were several really good players that you could have chosen from. But what happened in that draft, of course, is that you had a lot of. A lot of teams that were. And of course, now that I. I had this all set up in front of me, it's amazing how things just completely.

[Michael Kay]

This is unfortunate.

[Alan Hahn]

This is unfortunate because you need to have the names.

[Michael Kay]

You need to.

[Alan Hahn]

I wanted to be able to tell you the names. And now, of course, that I'm trying to find the whole draft.

[Michael Kay]

What year did you say this was again?

[Alan Hahn]

20.

[Michael Kay]

20. 20.

[Alan Hahn]

So I like, put it this way. You had Lamelo Ball, Tyrese Maxey. It had, like, a. A lot of really good guards in this draft. And as we know, anybody that has followed me, you know that all I've ever done is just kind of pine for the day that the team finds themselves a damn point guard. So Anthony Edwards went number one, Wiseman went number two to the Warriors. That ended up being a mistake.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah.

[Alan Hahn]

Lamelo Ball went three to the Hornets. All right, we keep moving on here because those were the big names in that draft. But the Knicks come up at 8, and there were several names that were out there for them. One of them was Tyrese Halbert, Iowa State. He had good length and size. He could. He could. He's a great passer, an excellent shooter with a weird release that some people a little hesitant about at the NBA. Would he be able to get his shot off in the NBA? But in college, he was a terrific player. The Knicks liked him. They worked him out, they brought him in, but they also liked the player they took at 8. His name's Obi Toppin.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Right.

[Alan Hahn]

Obi Toppin was at Dayton. He was a national player of the year.

[Peter Rosenberg]

He.

[Alan Hahn]

His family is from New York. His grandfather, a season ticket holder of the Knicks, and his agent of Course, in caa, which is where Leon Rose was from, there was a lot of familiarity with Obi Toppin. And the feeling was, this guy has got great athletic ability. He's a wing. He's going to be somebody, that this is where the league's going. So they took him. Tyrese Halliburton didn't go 8, he didn't go 9, he didn't go 10, he didn't go 11, he went 12 to the Sacramento Kings. They already had De' Aaron Fox, but they had him. So now they have this backcourt of two really good guards. But after one year, they felt like it wasn't working, so they traded Halliburton, and Halliburton was available for trade. And you would think if you were the Knicks at the time, I think, was Alfred Payton was your point guard, that maybe, just maybe, you would say, what is it going to take to get this guy? We liked him in the draft. He's available. We could have him and Obi Toppo. But they didn't act. Instead, the Pacers did. They traded Demonta Sabonis to the Sacramento Kings, and they got Halliburton. And so now a guy that you really liked ended up in Indiana. We all know what has happened since then is he's become a great player and he has haunted your franchise now for two straight series, playoff series. But not only that, the pick you had, Obi Toppin, that you took at eight, you realized was not a great fit anymore. It was due to pay him. You didn't want to. So off he went. And where did he end up? In Indiana. So if we rewrite the headline and the Knicks choose Halliburton with the eighth pick in the draft, which, if you look back at that draft now, you'd say that's a steal when you consider the players that went one through seven. Right again, Edwards is a great player. Wiseman, not so great. Lamello Ball. The kids love him. But has he done anything? Has he won? No, he's done nothing. Halliburton, right now, you could argue the second best player in that draft. And so if the Knicks take him, they have him. Does Brunson come to the Knicks? Probably not. And where does Toppin end up? Is he not in Indiana? What do the Pacers look like right now if the Knicks had made that pick? And then, of course, what do the Knicks look like? And where's Jalen Brunson in all this? So that's your rewrite. It's like, would we have Knicks, Pacers? Would we have these two teams where they are heading towards, you know, a rebirth of the rivalry. Two of the best teams in the East. If that decision in 2020 was made differently.

[Peter Rosenberg]

All right, so obviously Halliburton's not there at 12 of the Knicks. Take him at 8. At 8.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah.

[Peter Rosenberg]

No, but I'm saying the Pacers had the 12.

[Alan Hahn]

Well, Sacramento did.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Sacramento. Sacramento does.

[Alan Hahn]

Sacramento doesn't take.

[Peter Rosenberg]

So. But who knows? Halliburton is a Nick. So what? Brunson's not here.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Could you. Could you honestly tell me they're better off with Halliburton instead of Brunson?

[Alan Hahn]

Because. Yeah, you have no idea.

[KG]

You don't know.

[Alan Hahn]

But you know the Pacers aren't the Pacers.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Pacers. Well, unless they. Unless whoever took Halliburton ended up trading him to the paper. The Pacers at some point, I guess. Unless the Knicks take out the Knicks.

[Alan Hahn]

That's my point.

[Peter Rosenberg]

So who do the Pacers end up?

[Alan Hahn]

Let me reset the two choices that the Knicks had on the table that draft night. There was only two. There were two guys. There were a couple others that other. That they liked, but there was two names. Obi Toppin, Teres Halberd, those two guys, and they chose Obi Toppin. So I'm saying if we rewrite the headline and they choose. They say, you know what? We really need a guard. We have Julius Randle. We need a guard, and they take Halliburton. What do the Knicks look like? And what do the Pacers look like today? And are they both even in the conference?

[Peter Rosenberg]

No. Although I don't think the Pacers are.

[Alan Hahn]

No.

[Peter Rosenberg]

And the question is, where does Halliburton take the Knicks now? I don't know. Can Halliburton do in New York what he's doing in Indiana? Like, Brunson seems made for New York.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Because you know how difficult this place is. Indiana. I'm sure it's tough to play anywhere in the NBA, but there's not the scrutiny. You just heard one of their biggest names in Indiana, like, not liking what McAfee like. So obviously it's a soft landing there. There's not pressure to win there the way it is with the Knicks. So I can't. As you could sit there. Even if you believe that Halliburton's a better player, which I don't. But even if you believe that, there's no way you could extrapolate it out to say that Halliburton would do in New York what he's doing in New York.

[Michael Kay]

That's what I kept thinking like, would.

[Alan Hahn]

He have become Tyrese Halliburton now in Sacramento? He was showing so signs, and that is playing next to Fox, who was ball dominant, but he was showing signs like this. Something here, like, this guy's pretty good. And then when he got to Indiana, they gave him the ball, like Rick Carla gave him the ball and said, this is your show and we're going to develop this. And in a matter of time, as we saw last year in the playoffs, it started to grow. And then this year, you know, they're right now one win away from going to the NBA Finals for the first.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Time, because let's say they.

[Alan Hahn]

So one decision, really, if you think about. You always say that sometimes a decision doesn't affect one franchise. This one affected three.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, that's why I'm fascinated by the draft always. Not only just the players, like how their life changes depending on who drafts them.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But how a team's fortunes and the team that's behind them, you know, how their fortunes fare.

[Alan Hahn]

Yep. You know, that's true.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Who picks ninth is going to. I want that player. But he goes eighth. I gotta. I gotta put it. I gotta go different direction.

[Alan Hahn]

It's the famous Steph Curry moment. Steph Curry with. The whole plan was the Knicks were going to get Steph Curry, and all of a sudden Golden State, which wasn't in on Steph Curry, and the Curry family told Golden State, we don't want to go there. You have Monte Ellis. I mean, people might remember that name, but he was like their lead guard. And they felt like, that's not a place we want to go. You don't need a guard. Don't take him. And the thought was, they're not going to. And then Jerry west said, no, no, you know that. You don't. You don't pass on that guy. You take him anyway. We'll figure it out later. And he took him, and that changed the rest of the board. It was unbelievable, especially the Knicks.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Now, if Halliburton doesn't cut it in New York and the Pacers still like him, and the Knicks having a history of either trading picks or giving up on players that aren't exactly what they expect. If Halliburton is struggling in New York, would they make a deal with the Knicks to get them the way they made a deal with Sacramento? Now, Sacramento gave him up for a different reason.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah, but they wanted a big man, and they didn't need. They had two guards. They needed a big man. That's why they got Sabonis. It worked out for. I mean Sacramento was good for a little while. Yeah, they're a mess. But. But yeah, it's, there's a lot of, there's a lot of other tentacles to it. But all I'm saying is is that it's amazing. What, that's why that's what the rewrite's all about. What one decision, what one little change in history could do that changes everything and where we are right now.

[Michael Kay]

Yeah, there's no such thing as little decisions in sports when it comes to personnel. Particularly the NBA.

[Alan Hahn]

Yep.

[Michael Kay]

Maybe in the NFL with a 53 man roster. There are times where a player being there, not being there makes no difference. Not with the size of the NBA roster. My biggest takeaway listening to Allen set that all up was when we talk about draft picks as being so valuable, it's just a reminder that it is such a complete crapshoot.

[Alan Hahn]

Yes.

[Michael Kay]

And you get so bent out of shape about losing draft picks and then he's going over the list and there's a handful of names in an entire draft class that is more than a role player. It really, it's just, it's so hard to turn your draft picks into something and so people get freaked out about what. Mikhail Bridges has already paid off more than the draft picks he got by single handedly closing out a couple of playoffs.

[Alan Hahn]

Funny you say that because a lot of people would just would argue with you the other way at this moment. Yeah, it's amazing.

[Michael Kay]

What are the what and when you.

[Alan Hahn]

Look because you don't know what the draft picks are going to be, but you already know what, what, what Bridges has done in, especially in the Boston series to help you win games. Like that's already concrete. That's already been paid. The draft picks haven't been paid yet. So you don't know what they're going to be.

[Michael Kay]

And you know, that's a good point. They're mostly not going to be anything. Right. They're lottery tickets and, and you hope that you hit one. How many? Let's look back at the Knicks history. When was the last Knicks great draft pick regardless of who, where they were picking? Great.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah, you would probably say poor zing.

[Michael Kay]

Which by the way, didn't even feel great.

[Alan Hahn]

RJ Barrett was very good, but he, you know, like very good.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah, he was the third pick.

[Michael Kay]

Very good. And also, let's not rewrite history. Porzingis wasn't great here.

[Alan Hahn]

Well, he was getting there. He became hurt.

[Michael Kay]

He became a great player. Eventually it didn't work out great at any point.

[Alan Hahn]

But if you're, if you're, I mean, if we're gonna really play that game of like, you know, when was the last time the Knicks had a draft pick that hit, like, really Remember, I've told, I've told people this like the re signing a draft pick thing. Like they just, they don't do it.

[Michael Kay]

I know.

[Alan Hahn]

Like they draft a guy and they just, they end up never getting that next contract. Barrett did, and then he lasted a year and then they moved on from him. So if we're playing that game, Charlie Ward, and that was like the 30th pick in the first round and that.

[Michael Kay]

Was like 30 years ago.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah. And Charlie Ward ended up being a key piece on a team that they did to a finals.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You don't think Frederick Weiss worked out at all?

[Alan Hahn]

No. You know, that's interesting. You know, that's one way that, that's definitely one that shakes you a little bit.

[Michael Kay]

What about Nella Keena?

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah, there's another one. I mean, but like, yeah, the people are shouting out Mitchell Robinson, who was a second round pick. I think when we say a draft, we're talking about like a lottery pick kind of level, right?

[Michael Kay]

Well, no.

[Alan Hahn]

Or unless you say Deuce McBride, like you find some guys in the second round and you could say, boy, that was a good pick. But, but you're talking about a pick that was high enough to feel like this could help the franchise.

[Michael Kay]

Yeah. Like, let me, let me put it this way.

[Alan Hahn]

Which is why again, Charlie Ward also feels like a late, like that wasn't, that was a late pick. That was a 30th pick.

[Michael Kay]

Like, so, for example, when, when so.

[Alan Hahn]

Man, I, I, we're going, we're just going to keep going back. We might end up going all the way to, to, to Patrick.

[Michael Kay]

So if, when fans, Mark Jackson, when fans get upset, Strickland, because you've stockpiled picks and you move a bunch of the picks, I think it's because in their mind they go, oh my God, that could be our next star. Of course, it's not them going, oh my God, we're giving up on other role players.

[Alan Hahn]

Well, when you say but that's.

[Michael Kay]

They're scared of missing the star, my point is you're not getting the star. You have a guy here, Mikhail Bridges. We don't know what he's going to be long term, but I saw him close out a couple of games in these playoffs that's more valuable than most things the Knicks ever end up getting.

[Alan Hahn]

The only argument is, is that it's five of them. You know, and then. And at the you you did, but.

[Michael Kay]

They had a lot.

[Alan Hahn]

You paid a tax and. And then it's like, well, you could have used those picks to get Giannis or things like that. Like that's always going to be the argument because it's always easy after the fact to say that. But what you have right now is the tangible evidence trade has helped them win.

[Michael Kay]

What do they have now?

[Alan Hahn]

They have three that they can still trade.

[Michael Kay]

They still have three they can trade.

[Alan Hahn]

They could trade. Yes. Three futures they could still trade.

[Michael Kay]

Because Giannis is going to cost more. More than just futures.

[Alan Hahn]

It's going to cost picks, but it's going to cost bodies.

[Michael Kay]

That's what I'm saying. There's going to be bodies.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah. Yeah. Brian Windhorst has said this regularly, that from what he understands the Bucks are if they are to move him, it's not a situation that you are moving a player to blow it up. Give me a whole bunch of picks and we're just going to suck for three years. That's not necessarily the case because the Bucks don't have their own draft pick. So for them to finish last doesn't help them because they don't have their own lottery pick. So the suggestion is, and then whoever you're trading him to, whatever picks you're getting, they're not going to be lottery picks either because whoever gets them is going to be a good team. So he's saying that they, the plan for them is to stay competitive. So they're going to want talent back and they would want as high level talent as they can get. Probably young talent, but I don't know what kind of young talent that can keep you competitive that's going to be out there to get that also goes is from a market that he wants to go to.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Good job, Alan. That was a good Thursday rewrite. I enjoyed 430 every Thursday. 109, 1993.

[Alan Hahn]

We got some guests showing up here. We got a couple of people texting that they're on their way. Special guests.

[Peter Rosenberg]

They will come in. We've got Kurt Thomas coming. We're going to take up until 7:00. More calls coming up at 1-800-919-3776. Don Rosenberg on 880 ESPN New York and the the ESPN New York app.

[Alan Hahn]

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[Naughty by Nature]

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[Kaley Cuoco]

Go to your happy price.

[Michael Kay]

Priceline.

[Kaley Cuoco]

This episode is brought to you by Amazon Prime. From streaming to shopping, prime helps you get more out of your passions. So whether you're a fan of true crime or prefer a nail biting novel from time to time, with services like Prime Video, Amazon Music and fast free delivery, prime makes it easy to get more out of whatever you're into or getting into. Visit Amazon.comprime to learn more.

[Michael Kay]

The new McCrispy Strip is here. Dip approved by Ketchup Tangy Barbecue Honey Mustard honey mustard Sprite McFlurry Big Mac sauce Double Dipped in Buffalo and Ranch More Ranch and creamy chili McCrispy strip dip now at McDonald's.

[Don Hahn]

Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.

[Michael Kay]

I didn't listen to anything you just said.

[Don Hahn]

Catch the show on demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your Podcasts.

[Michael Kay]

Another special halftime. And some hall of Famers, some legends, some Jersey legends, and Nick fans. Naughty by Nature performing at halftime. And KG and Vinnie are here right now. What's up, guys? Kg, how are you, man?

[KG]

I'm good, man. Coming just out here just having fun, man. And playing basketball myself.

[Michael Kay]

Playing ball, too.

[KG]

Yes. I'm still playing ball, man. I gotta stay in shape, man.

[Alan Hahn]

Don't ever stop. No, don't ever stop.

[Michael Kay]

Let me. Let's jump right into it. Why even wait? Who's the most interesting person you ever played basketball with?

[Vinny]

Chris Weber.

[Michael Kay]

Jalen Rose come out to say, I know you have some random games from back in the day.

[KG]

No, I would say you say interesting.

[Michael Kay]

Yeah.

[KG]

Vady Debo.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Oh, how about that?

[Alan Hahn]

That's very interesting.

[KG]

I played a rocking jock with him one time. I'm not going to say why. I'm not. I can't say why it was interesting, though.

[Alan Hahn]

Oh, really?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Off the air. Can you tell us?

[KG]

Huh?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Off.

[KG]

I'll tell you off the air.

[Alan Hahn]

Okay. That's good.

[KG]

Yeah.

[Michael Kay]

Wow. By the way, Rock and jock with Bloody Divach. That is a moment in time.

[Alan Hahn]

And of course it rhymes.

[Michael Kay]

Like, of course it rhymes right Now, Vinny, I gotta ask you, Obviously, you guys are such Jersey legends.

[Vinny]

Yes, sir.

[Michael Kay]

And you're synonymous with Jersey. But at the same time, you guys are also. Have always sort of been in the New York category. I mean, when everything was. When hip hop was much more divided. I don't think anyone was super specific about Naughty being from the Oranges in New Jersey. It was like, nah, they're New York. You know what I mean? So it's. Were you guys ever Nets fans? Did the Nets going to Brooklyn affect you? Where are you guys?

[Vinny]

Of course it hurt us. Come on. We used to go to Burn arena, right? And watch the Nets play. We had all the Nets gear. And then they jacked us for the Nets and sent them to Brooklyn. But, you know, by default, Jersey has always been the stepchild to New York. But we fought for our right, the party. And it is what it is. We're the Sixth Borough, whether your guys.

[Michael Kay]

Like it or not.

[Peter Rosenberg]

All right, so Van Horn, Kittles.

[KG]

Yeah.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Got excited for that.

[KG]

Yep.

[Peter Rosenberg]

And yet here you are wearing Knick stuff. What's going on now?

[Alan Hahn]

Wait a minute. Let me make something clear. The Knicks are represented in Jersey very well. Here's what Jalen Brunson jersey. That's a jazz Carl Anthony Towns, right?

[Vinny]

That's right.

[Alan Hahn]

Now settle this for me. Because they argue this. So Cat always says he's from Central Jersey. And Jalen said, there's no such thing. He said, there's North Jersey and South Jersey. There's no Central. How do we feel about this?

[Vinny]

Listen, let me tell you something. Once you pass Union, New Jersey, you're South Jersey, baby.

[KG]

It's all north and South.

[Vinny]

You know what? You know what? I have two homies. Well, my homie Malik, he's from New Brunswick. So I always say, you know, coming from East Orange, I'm like, yo, I'm on my way down to South Jersey, man. This ain't no South Jersey.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I'm telling you. I thought the same thing growing up in North Jersey, because we're the age where it was 201 and 609. That was it.

[KG]

Right.

[Peter Rosenberg]

So it was easy. North, south. But I got it. And whenever I would go over the bridge in Sayreville, I felt like I was down the shore.

[KG]

Yeah.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But then I moved to, like, the Somerset area, and I'm like, no, there is a Central Jersey. I'm not down the Shore, but I'm not North Jersey. I can't get any Texas wieners down here. What's going on? But wait a minute. If tomorrow's Friday, they would fail a fraud. Friday?

[Michael Kay]

You think they're failing? Fraud.

[Alan Hahn]

Oh, are you calling them out? Wow. No, no. That their team left them. Left them? Yeah.

[Peter Rosenberg]

And that's when you became their team.

[Alan Hahn]

Told them after they left that their town wasn't cool enough, they needed Brooklyn.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Were you juggling a little?

[Michael Kay]

Absolutely.

[Vinny]

But you know who else we have who's a Nick?

[Michael Kay]

KG is giving Don the dirtiest one.

[Alan Hahn]

Because I have a responsibility.

[KG]

No, no, because he. He know me. We went eye to eye.

[Peter Rosenberg]

He.

[Michael Kay]

He.

[KG]

He saw it. And I got to tell you guys, off air again.

[Alan Hahn]

Oh, boy.

[KG]

About that one.

[Michael Kay]

Really?

[KG]

Yeah.

[Michael Kay]

About the relationship change.

[KG]

No, as far as Nick's next.

[Michael Kay]

Yeah, about something next.

[KG]

Yeah.

[Alan Hahn]

Okay, Let him know that can't be on air.

[Vinny]

We have our big Homie Thomas from the Knicks as well. Yeah, Tim Thomas.

[Alan Hahn]

Oh, that's right. Yes.

[KG]

Well. Yeah, well, well. Really honest? No, I'm not going to do it.

[Peter Rosenberg]

All right.

[Alan Hahn]

Sure.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But I just have a. You listen.

[Alan Hahn]

I respect for good radio. We're all in.

[Peter Rosenberg]

So how many minutes they giving you tonight?

[KG]

Four minutes.

[Alan Hahn]

Wow.

[Michael Kay]

Halftime.

[KG]

That's part of the reason why I don't really want to, you know, because I'm really a Nets fan, to be honest. Nets is Jersey.

[Michael Kay]

So it. So that is deeper, you're saying?

[KG]

Yes, it's deeper.

[Michael Kay]

But you're repping tonight.

[KG]

I'm repping tonight and I'm repping the Knicks. I do like the Knicks there. Both of them are locals. Same like the jets and Giants. I'm actually really a still. I'm a still. Not even really. I. Steelers fan.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Steeler fan.

[KG]

Yes, I'm a Steeler fan.

[Peter Rosenberg]

How you become a Steeler?

[Vinny]

I'm all New York.

[KG]

Just.

[Alan Hahn]

They were good.

[KG]

Yeah, they were good at that time.

[Alan Hahn]

So, you know, so Vince, the pack just trying to jump in, like.

[KG]

Yeah.

[Alan Hahn]

I mean, I don't know about this fraud, but I'm all New York.

[KG]

Hey, hey.

[Vinny]

I'm not really.

[KG]

I didn't want to be a fraud. So you guys are push. You pushed it. So I'm just like, let me just tell the truth.

[Alan Hahn]

Bring it out. Take the filter off.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Some of my best friends are fraud.

[Michael Kay]

Right.

[KG]

I didn't want to be a fraud. So I'll just. I'll just tell the truth. You know, that's a.

[Alan Hahn]

That's a journey.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But what you like, though, when you. You got a hype crowd, right? The Knicks are facing elimination.

[Alan Hahn]

Just to be able to play in.

[Peter Rosenberg]

The garden front of a building, like, this is the Mecca, man. Oh, it's got to be cool.

[KG]

This is so, so cool. So cool.

[Michael Kay]

And Vin, you guys, you know, you have multiple, like, true anthems, but, you know, Hip Hop Hooray is. It's arguably the most known hip hop record of all time. Yes, it's in the conversation. At what point when that song started blowing up up did you guys realize we have this in our pocket for the rest of our lives?

[Vinny]

Oh, we knew it. We knew it from shooting the video because here's another Nick's reference.

[Michael Kay]

Spike Lee.

[Vinny]

Spike Lee directed the video. You know what I mean? So big shout to Spike Lee. And we shot the video in New York in New Jersey and in Brooklyn, right? Well, New York. Brooklyn is New York, but shot on. On both sides. And we just unified, man. Because again, coming up in Hip Hop from Jersey, it was like you were a stepchild. So we came with OPP and then came right back after that with Hip Hop Parade. New York began to embrace us more. So we. It's all love. It's all love.

[KG]

But also too Uptown Anthem. You know, when we did Uptown Anthem soundtrack, that's what really, really made. Not made, but, you know, we've really started getting that love from New York.

[Michael Kay]

Listen, I just want to. I'm sure I've said this to you guys before. Before. I know, I know you guys did one Epstein you did the podcast years ago and I'm sure I've said it and I'm old now and I forget, but so I'm doing. You guys are so friggin great. Like Naughty By Nature as a group, it's easy to get caught up when people have big hits.

[KG]

Right.

[Michael Kay]

With their hits. Right. Because you know, Don, who's a metal guy, he'll know hip hop. Hooray. He'll hear it and he'll hear and that's the average person will know. But within, you know, hip hop, there's a reason that Biggie said Rocking Red man and Naughty like you guys were such. I mean, it's the reason Eminem sings the praise to Naughty By Nature as much as he does. There's just so much great music besides the hits. Like right when you bring up Uptown Anthem, it's one of my favorite records of all time. Everything's gonna be all right. Yeah, you guys have such big hits at the top that, that, that Ghetto Bastards almost been forgotten for how big a record it was at the time also.

[Alan Hahn]

Absolutely, absolutely.

[Michael Kay]

So I just, anytime I'm on a live mic with you guys, want to tell you one of the greatest rap groups of all time, you know.

[Vinny]

Thank you.

[KG]

We appreciate it.

[Michael Kay]

Needs to be met. Now, kg, I probably asked you this last time too. Well, of all the side production, what's the best little chickity check that comes hitting the mailbox every six months? Because you got a lot of classics outside and already by nature there.

[KG]

Collectively.

[Michael Kay]

I have to say, it's just a nice combo.

[KG]

It's a. Yeah. Collective of. Yeah.

[Alan Hahn]

It's the one thing an athlete doesn't have. When your career is over, there's no residuals.

[KG]

Yes.

[Alan Hahn]

You know, like it's done. But a musician. Oh, your music could live forever.

[KG]

We call it Walking to the Mailbox.

[Michael Kay]

Yeah. No, that's a great day. And now.

[Vinny]

And actually now it's all about the inbox. You don't even have to walk to the mailbox.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah.

[Michael Kay]

You just have to click and, and, and for kg, you know, to have done a record on Life After Death, every time Biggie gets celebrated and there's another awesome moment where Life After Death hits another anniversary that's more listens for Miss you. Which is which, by the way, when I'm. When I'm really sad and need to like post something morbid, Miss you is my go to default death anthem. Congratulations. You should be thrilled to know that. But no, you guys are both fantastic and we'll be stoked tonight.

[KG]

Yes.

[Michael Kay]

No pressure. Bring that energy tonight.

[Alan Hahn]

It's different.

[Vinny]

It's what we do, man.

[KG]

Yeah, we get everybody.

[Alan Hahn]

It'll get the bill.

[Vinny]

And for the record, the elephant in the room is we are missing our third member. For the sake of our legacy, for the sake of the fans, for the sake of every concert, go out there. We are working, hoping and praying for the original three man threat to be whole again. All right, let's pop it up for that.

[Michael Kay]

Yeah, that I'll make a noise. I would love to see Stretch with Ben and KG again. We need that. Guys, thank you so much.

[KG]

Real quick, before we go, I just, I want to shout out our mayor of East Orange, New Jersey, Mayor Ted Green.

[Michael Kay]

Okay.

[KG]

You know, they just renovated our childhood park, Oval park in East Orange, New Jersey. Named the basketball court. Well, dedicated the basketball court after us. We grew up playing basketball, grew up playing football in that park and everything. So we want to shout East Orange out.

[Vinny]

That's right. And we'll be running our summer league this year. So shout to Marcus, Tony L and Brandon. They're helping us put together the leagues and we rock it.

[Michael Kay]

All right.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Amazing Jersey in the house Jersey at the Garden tonight.

[Michael Kay]

More Don Hahn and Rosenberg next.

[Peter Rosenberg]

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[Don Hahn]

Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.

[Alan Hahn]

I don't want to know how the sausage is made, but I just want to know. It's good.

[Don Hahn]

Hear more of Don Allen and Peter weekday afternoon starting at 3 on 8 80, ESPN, the ESPN New York app and your smart speakers.