Alan Hahn (2:29)

Because they came in the league in 82, 83. Or came from Colorado in 82, 83. That's the first year in New Jersey. And they were a joke. Yes, they were. They were the. They were the punchline of a bad joke and didn't come close to making the playoffs. Wayne Gretzky called them a Mickey Mouse organization when the Devils lost to the Oilers in 83:12, 4. And they were an embarrassment. And they were. They were irrelevant in the New York landscape at the time. I don't think people even knew they existed. I'm being serious. Like, you're in New Jersey and they're not good. And you've already, like, three teams in the New York market for hockey. Hockey sport.

Michael Rosenberg (3:09)

Right.

Alan Hahn (3:09)

Two baseball teams, two football teams, two basketball teams. I got argued.

Michael Rosenberg (3:13)

I will argue. Hockey back then was covered a lot differently in New York than it is now. That's a fact.

Alan Hahn (3:23)

Run. I get it.

Michael Rosenberg (3:24)

It was covered. But you had. You had serious coverage of it. But. But you're right. I remember as a kid, the thing about the Rockies moving. The only thing that I knew about the Devils was I liked the logo. I couldn't have named it. The only one. And again, Chico. I only knew Chico. I didn't know anybody else.

Alan Hahn (3:42)

He was a former island because he.

Michael Rosenberg (3:43)

Was a former Islander. Yeah. And other than that, no clue.

Alan Hahn (3:46)

And. Yeah. Right. So they were. They were like any sports franchise when you're awful for the first, you know, five years of your existence, and you've got the New York Rangers, the more popular team, the Islanders, in the midst of a, you know, five straight Stanley Cup Final appearances and four straight Cups, and.

Michael Rosenberg (4:02)

Right.

Alan Hahn (4:03)

You got the Knicks. And the Nets weren't bad then, either. And the jets and the Giants and the Yankees, the Meds. It was. You get lost in the last.

Michael Rosenberg (4:08)

Going on. Yeah.

Alan Hahn (4:09)

And then they had to go. For people that don't know the story. 1988. Devils are finally in the run. Lou Lamarillo takes over the team. They get Sean Burke coming out of the Olympics, and they get hot at the. At the stretch, and they're alive. They go into the final day of the regular season. Penguins, Rangers, Devils are all alive for that fourth playoff spot in the Patrick Division. And they're all playing the same day, a Sunday. Penguins beat the Whalers.

Michael Rosenberg (4:32)

Pardon?

Alan Hahn (4:33)

They're alive. Rangers beat the Nordiques, eliminate the Penguins. So the Devils had to win the game in order to make the playoffs and eliminate. The Rangers couldn't tie the game, right? They had to win. The game is prior to the shootout. So John McClain scores a goal midway through the third period, ties the game. It ties the game up. They go to overtime and the Devils have to score. And at 221 of overtime, John McLean beats Darren Pang, and they're in the playoffs for the first time in franchise history. Gary Thorne with the big call and all that. Devils go on a run, beat the Islanders in six, beat the Capitals in seven, take the Bruins to game seven of the Stanley Cup Final. They go from irrelevant to now playing in the final four. Yeah, and people started to pay attention. WFAN at the time, they're. They're doing spots. Rock radio stations are playing like jingles for the, like. All of a sudden they found their footing in New York sports, at least for a month. And I think there's a lot of people, including myself, that became more of a fan. It became real. And then they missed the playoffs the next year and the next four years after they get eliminated in the first round. So the fallacy of the predetermined dog come out. And if they don't make the playoffs, if McLain doesn't score, they tie that game in Chicago and the Rangers make the playoffs. It would be not till 94 that the team would make a run like, you can't build a fan base. You can't build. Get people's attention until you have your moment. Now, Patrick Eliash scores a goal in Game 7 in 2000. Arnott wins a Cup in Game 6 against Dallas. Jeff Friesen scores a goal in Game 7 against Ottawa in 2003. There are goals that are significant in the playoffs, but that run doesn't happen. They were born that year, in essence. And it all happened because of John McClain's goal. And that's why I think it's the biggest goal and. In franchise history.

Michael Rosenberg (6:24)

Yeah, no, legitimized. I totally understand it because it, it's of the new franchises, because look, look, Giants, Yankees, you know, Knicks been around for 100 years, right? So there's. They were. They. They were established when the leagues were established. So it's harder to say what was the moment that they got their footing, where they arrived. And you know, in comparison, when you want to look at it from an Islander perspective, it's not, you know, nystrom's goal in 1980, it's JP Paris's goal in 1975 to knock out the Rangers. That, that put the Islanders on The map that was it that they were now all of a sudden a functioning real franchise with a fan base that could start to kind of follow them. And they stole some fans away from the Rangers that year and you know the Rangers got their revenge in 79 but it just that started it and every franchise, neither the Mets and had to have had a moment before they even got to the World Series. Right? There had to have been a moment along the way where it all of a sudden became. Wait, wait a second. They're.

Alan Hahn (7:31)

No, I guess their moment would have been let's say they lost to the Orioles. So it would have been something that happened in the series against the Braves or just making it that would have been significant. The Devils came up short and they ended up winning three Stanley Cups. He's saying well how could it, how could it be the biggest moment. There were three Stanley Cups. But would listen to an Islander fan, an old time Islander fan who would have the JP Parisi goal bigger than Nystrom's because it beat the Rangers. It put the Islanders on the map in just their third year they scored, they won 12 games in their first year of the island.

Michael Rosenberg (8:05)

They were pretty awful.

Alan Hahn (8:06)

And then you fast forward three years later they're beating, they're beating the Rangers in the playoffs.

Michael Rosenberg (8:12)

And then like you but same as 88, they not only beat the Rangers, they come back down three zero to beat the Penguins and then they're down three zero to the Flyers and come back to force at game seven and almost knock them off to get to the, to the Cup. So they had a similar type of arrival where once they got that first one they got on a roll and that is what established a fan base. It's just that's how it goes. I don't know what it was for the Mets but they're the new franchise, you know as well I think the new franchise all had to have moments like that. And what you're describing with John McClane for the Devils that year is, is literally that moment where it all it finally took. Right?

Alan Hahn (8:53)

It's such a cool, it's cool that he's being inducted and it was a long time coming. So, so good for him. So I'm looking forward to that. I'll be on the pre game telling some of those stories where I was when that goal was scored, which is kind of funny but I want to save some for television.

Michael Rosenberg (9:07)

Oh, come on.

Alan Hahn (9:07)

Yeah, listen, come on. I gave you plenty. I gave you the bit, I gave you the money one that I think it's The. It's the biggest moment in franchise history. But. But stay tuned. Coming up on msg, the Knicks and Giannis becoming real, just in the sense of the fans, because Giannis is. He's crabbing, he's trying to get out, but he's hurt. Do you make the deal now? Do you wait till the offseason? We've been telling you since the beginning of all this and we've been on top of this, thanks to Alan Hahn, from its infancy, that it's probably a deal that you're gonna have to wait till the end of the year. But Giannis just can't stop himself. And I would never call Giannis a bad guy, but he's definitely being that guy. And I know we do that on Thursdays because he doesn't want it pinned on him that he's demanding a trade. But Alan, the way he's acting, the way he's acting towards the fans, he's doing everything. But. So we're at semantics at this point where nobody can pin him on actually saying, but everybody in the world knows he wants out of Milwaukee.

Michael Rosenberg (10:08)

I think it's been something that has been whispered over the last two years that some people in Milwaukee didn't want to hear, didn't want to believe because it was whispered. And then when he would be asked about it, he would always talk about, oh, no, no, I love it here, I love it here. Then he signed an extension, a short one, which should have been the message right away. Like, that's your message. He didn't sign a long term deal. They tried to make, they were very aggressive in trying to make trades to upgrade the roster. The Lillard trade, which looked like a pretty good get, did not work out at all. And you know, Kyle Kuzma, that one still, I scratched my head, like, what was that supposed to accomplish? And they fired a bunch of coaches. It's just, it has been a mess there to a point now where he knows, I'm not getting any younger, this is the time. And he's always had an affinity for playing in New York. It's just something some play, some, like mostly Europeans, love New York. It's not like the American players who try to avoid New York because of the pressure. The Europeans love it. They want that kind of attention. They want to play in a big market because it feels more like home to them. And that just felt like at some point it's going to happen. And it looked like it might have, might happen in August, but it didn't. Because from the reports, the Knicks sat down and had a conversation with the Bucs. Neither side felt like either one was really taking it that serious, but it was sort of a, hey, look, he wants to go there. What are you willing to offer? And it's like, well, I mean, I don't really want to blow up my whole team, so here's what we've got. And there was no match. So let's, let's table this thing and keep it moving. And from that point forward, I think that's when Giannis started getting frustrated, because I think now when you look at it, in hindsight, it really seems like he thought he was going to. It was going to happen. And when it didn't, boy, he came at the training camp, he didn't want to talk about it. He said, he said things like, I'm here now and that, you know, I'm here for the franchise right now and wanted to win. The first game he played against the Knicks, he played like, like he had something to prove, like there was some vengeance in his effort in that game. I was watching like, man, this is a little extra, how hard he's playing, how much he's talking about. It was very strange, but that was happening. And then his agent, again, it's all source based, was more about, we're sitting down with the Bucs to talk about the future. The team's not really going anywhere. Then comes the first injury, then he comes back, and now he's mad at the fans and he's mad at his team, and he's talking about players not playing hard enough. Then comes the second injury, and now, of course, the trade deadline's coming. So we all see where this is headed, right? Like, Stevie Wonder can see this coming, as Bart would always say. So by next week at this time, 10 days from now is the trade deadline. It feels like a trade is imminent, but the problem is it's very difficult to trade for a player with that much money on his contract when the team that's trading him is probably not looking to take on a massive contract. So that's what now makes this curious is, can a deal really go down? And the big question in New York is, should the Knicks make sure that they're in the conversation just in case they can pull it off because of that 11 game stretch where they lost nine games. That changed the thinking, at least from the fan base, from a team that won the NBA cup in December. And everybody said, don't touch this team. Remember, we were taking calls and fans were saying, I don't want Giannis, I don't want to break up this team, right? We were taking calls and now we're taking calls from fans saying, you got to do whatever it takes. He's one of the best players in the league and this team over the last 11 games has shown you that they're not a championship caliber team. So go get me. Honest. How the mood has changed in a month's time, Don, is really remarkable. And now I'm curious to see if that same mood has changed within the organization. And, and we'll know whether or not they, they should at least engage in talks just to see what's different between now and August. And will Giannis use any leverage he can to say, look, you might get offers from other teams, but this is where I want to play, and can they use that leverage to make a deal happen?

Alan Hahn (14:33)

I just got some news that really bothers me, but I have to let you know first. There are a lot of reasons why people buy at Ramsey Mons. That's their selection, it's their customer service, and it's their savings. Lisa New 20 Mazda CX 52.5s select all wheel drive for $179 for 33 months or buy with 0.9% APR financing for 72 months. Start shopping now at RamseyMazda.com, choose wisely. Choose Ramsey Mazda. Call 833-853-2970 for lease details. Vin SN 379853 MSRP $33,425 0 security deposit APR at $14.27 per month. Per $1,000 financed ends 2226 wow. Adam Schefter. Wow. All right. Bill Belichick, the eight time Super bowl winning head coach is not a first ballot hall of Famer. Per Seth Wickersham and Don Van Nada Jr. Belichick fell short of the 40 out of 50 votes needed for induction into the Pro Football hall of Fame in his first year of eligibility. How is that humanly possible? How?

Michael Rosenberg (15:44)

It doesn't make sense.

Alan Hahn (15:45)

How can somebody, on any level, it makes no sense, not vote for Bill Belichick? I don't care if you hate him. I don't care if you're disgusted by his girlfriend. I don't care how you feel about him personally. What on his football resume tells you that he is not a first ballot hall of Famer when he is literally in the conversation? And as the greatest football coach of all time, how? How?

Michael Rosenberg (16:08)

Don, it's the Pro Football hall of Fame, correct?

Alan Hahn (16:11)

Yes.

Michael Rosenberg (16:11)

Pro Football hall of Fame.

Alan Hahn (16:13)

Yes.

Michael Rosenberg (16:13)

All right. So whatever he did in North Carolina doesn't count.

Alan Hahn (16:16)

Doesn't. Well. Well, no. Well, no. It doesn't count. No.

Michael Rosenberg (16:19)

Right.

Alan Hahn (16:19)

No.

Michael Rosenberg (16:20)

It shouldn't factor in.

Alan Hahn (16:21)

Shouldn't factor.

Michael Rosenberg (16:22)

So what Ben, about his career. What about his career tells you now he shouldn't get my vote.

Alan Hahn (16:30)

What they're going to tell you not to get in these yo yos.

Michael Rosenberg (16:32)

Now, there were other coaches, I believe. Right. That were on this list. I believe when we looked at the class, there were a couple of coaches, I thought we discussed this recently.

Alan Hahn (16:42)

Yes. That were maybe in their last year of eligibility or had been on the ballot before that maybe they feel like they want to get them in, but.

Michael Rosenberg (16:53)

That'S all I could think of.

Alan Hahn (16:55)

Or if you want to go the yo yo route of, well, he never won a thing without Tom Brady, so I'm not going to put him in the hall of Fame. Okay, well, let me ask you, how many Super Bowls did Noel win without Terry Bradshaw?

Michael Rosenberg (17:11)

All right.

Alan Hahn (17:12)

How many Super Bowls did Bill Walsh win without Joe Montana? Because when Steve Young won his super bowl, you know, Walsh was already gone. I believe he's in the hall of Fame. It seems pretty short sighted if you're just going to say, well, he never won nothing without Tom Brady. And the reason Tom Brady was still a Patriot was because of Bill Belichick. He decided to keep four quarterbacks because he saw something, didn't want to cut him. And also we just talked about the. As a defensive coordinator, one of the greatest defensive coordinators of all time. I mean, you can make a case he belongs in the hall of Fame. Just that alone, what he was able to do as a D coordinator, not just with the Giants and their two Super Bowls, but what he was able to do in New England when they went to the super bowl under Bill Parcells and what he was able to do with the jets in 98 when they went to the conference final. So you could, you could say that he's got all those championships because of Tom Brady. Well, how do you explain his defensive acumen and what he was able to accomplish before he became a head coach and also won a playoff game in Cleveland. Not too many coaches have done that in the last 50 years, have they?

Michael Rosenberg (18:18)

No.

Alan Hahn (18:20)

So maybe it's the semantics.

Michael Rosenberg (18:21)

You said, I want somebody else in that.

Alan Hahn (18:25)

What are we doing?

Michael Rosenberg (18:26)

I am trying to find the finalist because I know that Belichick was one of the fine. Oh, let's see, they were. There were semi finalists in the coach category. Belichick was considered a finalist. So here, the eight other semifinalists in the coach category were Tom Coughlin, Mike Holmgren, Chuck Knox, Buddy Parker, Dan Reeves, Marty Schottenheimer, George Seifert, and Mike Shanahan. Who on that list would you say? Belichick has to wait, because this guy's.

Alan Hahn (18:57)

Got to get zero. Now, again, I don't know, you know, who's not going to be eligible anymore because they haven't gotten in. None of those guys. Listen, I love Tom Coughlin. I think Tom Coughlin's all, oh, you know what?

Michael Rosenberg (19:09)

No, no. So does this. So this is not. So there's a contributor finalist, a coach finalist, Then there's the senior finalists that all. And I. If I. If I remember Gary saying, right, like, it's that group then you choose from. Right, right. There's five individual finalists for the. For induction. So again, Kraft is one, Belichick is one. Ken Anderson, Roger Craig, LC Greenwood. Maximum of three can be elected of the. Of that list, and you have to receive 80% approval.

Alan Hahn (19:50)

And he got 40 of the 50.

Michael Rosenberg (19:52)

Which means either no one else got more. Kraft is the only one out of this group.

Alan Hahn (19:58)

Maybe that can stop with the owners. Honestly, can we stop with the owners? I mean, if you want to have a separate category, like you do with broadcasters, but honestly, you're a billionaire. I understand there are good. There are good owners of bad owners. We know that in New York, right? Like, Woody Johnson's a bad owner. Robert Kraft is a great owner. But, like, when you start putting them in the hall of Fame, they shouldn't be lumped in with the coaches and players. Like, stop it. All right? Just have a different category for them. Yeah, these are the billionaires that did a good job not, not, not screwing up their franchises. All right? Because, listen, that's what Robert Kraft does, okay? He's been. He's selected well in his hiring of coaches and executives in the franchise. I'm not going to take anything away from them. But honestly, when you start talking about football, hall of Fame, baseball, hockey, basketball, you start putting owners in. What are we doing?

Michael Rosenberg (20:44)

But then again, create a different wing for somebody that's considered a voter, somebody that has given the privilege to vote. And it's not just media. You made a choice to not give him a vote. Most super bowl wins as a head coach. Most super bowl appearances as a head coach. Most playoff wins as a head coach. Most playoff appearances as a head coach. Most divisional championships as a head coach. Third all time in wins. That's the resume. You might not like them. I mean, how do I. I can't possibly like him. He didn't want to coach my team. He didn't want to be the HC of the nyj. Right. And instead he went on to. To haunt them every time he could beat him.

Alan Hahn (21:24)

Right.

Michael Rosenberg (21:24)

Like you would think I should hate him and I should love this. This is insane. This is stupid.

Alan Hahn (21:29)

Well, it's. It's colossally stupid. And, and again, what he did as a defensive coordinator, won a playoff game in Cleveland, went 11 and five without Tom Brady. Remember, they didn't make the playoffs because just it was a wacky year. But you know, goes 11 and five without the hall of Fame quarterback. I think was it Castle was the quarterback at the time and wins 11 games. Very, very odd.

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Don Hahn (24:50)

Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.

FanDuel Announcer (24:54)

I didn't listen to anything you just said.

Don Hahn (24:55)

Catch this show on demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to wherever you get your podcasts.

Alan Hahn (25:03)

Now the reaction to Belichick not getting into the hall of Fame on the first ballot has got people stirred up about the cheating. You got the Spygate and Deflate Gate under Bill's watch. So now all of a sudden pro football is getting religion. And when Major League Baseball just inducted Carlos Beltram, who led one of the biggest cheating scandals we've seen since forever in Major League Baseball, probably going back to the Black Sox scandal.

Michael Rosenberg (25:31)

Right.

Alan Hahn (25:31)

Of actual cheating. Gaylord Perry in the hall of Fame cheated spitballs for his career.

Michael Rosenberg (25:38)

Yeah.

Alan Hahn (25:39)

And that's Major League Baseball won't let in the steroid guys, but they look the other way with Gaylord Perry and Carlos Beltran, the NFL, who never seemed to give a hoot about steroids. You know, Tom Brady's gonna waltz into the hall of Fame even though he was the guy that was deflating football or telling them allegedly.

Michael Rosenberg (25:57)

Right.

Alan Hahn (25:57)

I mean, that wasn't a Belichick scandal as much as Spygate was Spygate was Spygate was Belichick. Deflategate to me was Brady. So they took Brady out of the hall of Fame.

Michael Rosenberg (26:07)

So again, if this is what you're telling me, though, that this is. And you see in the Wickersham story that it's a Bill Polian or allegedly Bill Polian is like kind of like put out the suggestion of these things. Some guys weren't happy about it, and the whole thought was, make him wait a year. That's his punishment for that stuff. And I'm thinking to myself, so that now this is a popularity contest. It's not really. Listen, it's not really a Hall of Fame of, like, you're worthy of it. It's. You know what? You know, we don't. We didn't really. We didn't rock with you. We didn't really like you.

Alan Hahn (26:41)

Isn't that how everything is dealt with, as a popularity contest? Yeah, because you look at the steroid era, right? Barry Bonds, Sammy Sosa, Mark McGuire, Roger Clemens, they can't get in.

Michael Rosenberg (26:57)

Yeah.

Alan Hahn (26:57)

Weren't very likable guys. Maybe Sammy Sosa was, but then he kind of went off the rails.

Michael Rosenberg (27:01)

But he was all over the map. Yeah, but those other guys are rough with the media.

Alan Hahn (27:04)

But, you know, Andy Pettit. Oh, well, he. He did it because he wanted to help his team, because everybody loves Andy Pettit and, of course, David Ortiz. No, he's got to go in the hall of Fame, Papi. We love Poppy. Big Poppy never did anything wrong. Everything's fine. So they. They've proven it's a popularity contest there.

Michael Rosenberg (27:20)

Yep.

Alan Hahn (27:21)

And clearly it's a popularity contest here.

Michael Rosenberg (27:23)

Yeah.

Alan Hahn (27:24)

Well, we don't like Bill, so we'll keep him out a year. We'll punish him. We'll slap him on the wrist for Spygate. But let's see if they make Tom Brady. Wait. Let's see if that happens. Right. And never mind the fact that Belichick did a hell of a lot before Spygate and also won Super Bowls after Spygate. But no, we. Because Bill, he bothers us. We all wish we had a hot girlfriend like him. Let's punish him.

Michael Rosenberg (27:47)

By the way, Donnie, like, when she gets wind of this, do you think she goes off the. Like, she just goes off the rails. Scorched earth. That only make it worse. Right. He's got to tell her, like, yo, chill. You got to chill, honey. Chill.

Alan Hahn (28:02)

Listen, he's gonna go to hall of Fame eventually, right? So I. You know, and I think the reason it bothers me is the hypocrisy.

Michael Rosenberg (28:09)

Yes, yes. Of.

Alan Hahn (28:10)

Of how, you know, some guys. Oh, it's fine. You know, they did it to help their team. There was a misunderstanding that reports wrong, and it's somebody you don't like, and we're going to hold them out forever.

Michael Rosenberg (28:22)

Yeah.

Alan Hahn (28:23)

You know, and. And that's why I think Alex Rodriguez can eventually get in because he was a pariah when he got busted. And he's done a really good job PR wise since then. So maybe some people will be won over by that. But it just shows you how all this stuff, everything, every walk of life, the likable get the benefit of the doubt. The unlikable don't. And when I'm putting somebody in the hall of Fame, I'm not putting them in the hall of Fame as a person. I'm not putting at the hall of Fame for the kind of friend they were, the talker they were, or any of that. You put them in based on their resume. And how do you not build? How do you make Bill Belichick wait a year with that resume?

Michael Rosenberg (28:58)

Yeah. Did they make Shula wait?

Alan Hahn (29:02)

Well, he didn't cheat with the mud bowl.

Shopify Advertiser (29:04)

Yeah, he did.

Alan Hahn (29:05)

Field advantage.

Michael Rosenberg (29:05)

No, it's. Please.

Alan Hahn (29:08)

Why? Please.

Michael Rosenberg (29:09)

What? Oh, no, no.

Alan Hahn (29:10)

They were the ones.

Michael Rosenberg (29:11)

Don't put the tarp. Don't put the tarp down. Let it rain. We need a muddy track.

Alan Hahn (29:16)

He was.

Michael Rosenberg (29:18)

Let's make this dude throw.

Alan Hahn (29:19)

Yeah, he was allowed to make.

Michael Rosenberg (29:20)

That's that, that. How is that any different than deflating a football?

Alan Hahn (29:24)

Because there's a rule against.

Michael Rosenberg (29:27)

Well, that's the problem. There wasn't a rule, but we all know that it was. That was poor sportsmanship. And that again, I'll never forgive that. That's just as bad as deflating a football, Don. Just as bad. But it's all interfering with the headset, all that stuff. It's all the same.

Alan Hahn (29:43)

Let's just say for sake of argument.

Michael Rosenberg (29:45)

I'm never letting it go.

Alan Hahn (29:46)

Dan. The Don Shula broke a rule and cheated. They will waltz down the hall of Fame. They love Don Shul.

Michael Rosenberg (29:53)

Of course.

Alan Hahn (29:54)

Of course people don't like Bill Belichick. And I, I, I'm. Listen, I could probably assume. Why? Because he didn't seem like he was. Didn't give you a lot of. So the media didn't love him.

Michael Rosenberg (30:05)

He wasn't a good boy. Yeah.

Alan Hahn (30:07)

He beat a lot of teams, humiliated a lot of teams. And I'm sure a lot of people are happy that he didn't succeed in North Carolina. Is going to sit and they're going to giggle in their little offices, right? With their, with their oak desks, and we got him. He's got to wait a year. Meanwhile, you wish you had him. You wish you won at the clip. That he won.

Michael Rosenberg (30:26)

Yeah.

Alan Hahn (30:27)

And all it stems from is jealousy.

Michael Rosenberg (30:30)

Yeah. It is true. And by the way, if, if that it if the story is accurate, which is. It's hard to. But those two guys, yeah, Wickersham and Vayanata, they know stuff, but, like, boy, Bill Pollian's got some major influence to affect votes like that.

Alan Hahn (30:51)

Well, so it says here.

Michael Rosenberg (30:53)

It says a voter who spoke on the condition of an anonymy. Anonymous said that Polyan, an ardent craft supporter and former general manager of the Buffalo Bills and Indianapolis Colts, of course, a chief Patriots rival during their dynasty, told some voters he believed Belichick should, quote, wait a year, end quote, before induction as penance for Spygate, the 2007 cheating scandal that cost the team a first round pick. Interesting, right?

Alan Hahn (31:22)

Do they make Brady wait a year? They should, right? What's it. What's any different, right? They were both involved in a gate. One was Spygate, one was deflate gate. Will they make Brady wait a year? I.

Michael Rosenberg (31:36)

Highly deflate.

Alan Hahn (31:38)

I highly doubt it.

Michael Rosenberg (31:40)

But find out that this is, like, you guys love to just say reindeer Game. This is Reindeer Games. Well, this is just like. Like, you're just like. You're just doing it because you can. You're flexing a little bit.

Alan Hahn (31:53)

I get it, man.

Michael Rosenberg (31:53)

I didn't realize that, like, polio calls you and you're a voter and you're like, no, man. Like, what are you talking about? He's. He belongs in. That's why clearly, enough voters did at least vote for him. Well, but not enough, because there's a.

Alan Hahn (32:06)

Lot of people that don't like him. So it probably didn't take much twisting of the arm. Say, hey, here's your chance to get back at him. You're gonna make him wait a year. Like, I don't know if Bill cares. I'm sure he wants to go.

Michael Rosenberg (32:14)

Is there some satisfaction? What's the satisfaction to that?

Alan Hahn (32:18)

I.

Michael Rosenberg (32:19)

It's so strange.

Alan Hahn (32:20)

No, I.

Michael Rosenberg (32:22)

Dissatisfaction.

Alan Hahn (32:24)

I Like that we got him out. I'm a big hater.

Michael Rosenberg (32:26)

He had to wait.

Alan Hahn (32:26)

My father taught me how to hate.

Michael Rosenberg (32:28)

Cheers.

Alan Hahn (32:29)

But when your reason for hating someone is because they win too much, you got to look in the mirror and just say, you know, I got to be a better person. Like, I admit. I've admitted on this air that my hatred for the Yankees is 100% solely based on the fact that I'm jealous of them. And that's how the hate manifests itself. And that's. And, you know, I. I could come up with reasons on this. No, I actually. Derek Jeter, very likable.

Michael Rosenberg (33:00)

Yeah.

Alan Hahn (33:01)

Aaron Judge, very likable. You know, like when I hated the Cowboys back in the day, you know, it came from the. Couldn't beat that damn team.

Michael Rosenberg (33:09)

Yep.

Alan Hahn (33:09)

I don't hate them nearly as much now, and they've gone 30 years without a Super Bowl. They become a lot less hateable when all of a sudden they're beatable. So when you ask yourself, are you that jealous, are you that petty that you couldn't figure out a way to beat the guy so you found the one little tiny weakness and that's. And you're going to keep him out. And, you know, there were a lot of people that, because the consensus is that Eric Mangini blew the whistle on him for Spygate, that many people felt that Mangeti was out of line because there were a lot of coaches that were doing the exact same thing and that he did it out of jealousy. And the rivalry of the jets and the Patriots, which I get. Try to get any advantage you can, but at the time it was, oh, maybe, maybe Mangini shouldn't have done that. And now you fast forward and it's going to keep him out of the hall of Fame for a year, but probably won't keep Brady out, I guarantee you that.

Michael Rosenberg (34:05)

No, but to make him wait a year.

Alan Hahn (34:07)

Let me ask you, let me ask you something. You think Sean Payton's going to have to wait a year?

Michael Rosenberg (34:14)

I was thinking that. And then I'm wondering, is he a Hall of Fame coach?

Alan Hahn (34:19)

Well, if he got, Listen, I think if, if he eventually wins with Denver, he's won a Super bowl in New Orleans, he's a hell of a coach.

Michael Rosenberg (34:25)

No, no, there's no question.

Alan Hahn (34:27)

He may not go in the first ballot.

Michael Rosenberg (34:28)

He might not be a first ballot anyway. But you're right, that, that bounty gate is, to me, that's, that's more egregious. As bad as deflategatens. But, you know, the Spy Fl stuff on. That stuff's bad. I get it. But, but the bounty thing, and you're overseeing it to a point, you had to take a year off. Like, that's, that's pretty bad.

Alan Hahn (34:50)

It's something. It's. It's interesting. 1-800-919-3776 let's go to Kevin out on Long Island. You're on ESPN New York. What's up, Kev?

Caller Kevin (35:00)

Hey, Don Allen. How you guys doing?

Michael Rosenberg (35:02)

What's up, buddy?

Caller Kevin (35:04)

Long time, first time.

Alan Hahn (35:06)

Excellent.

Caller Kevin (35:08)

Love you guys.

Alan Hahn (35:08)

We.

Caller Kevin (35:09)

We, me and my two kids and my wife, we listen to you guys all day long. We, we love it. We. It ends our day perfectly.

Michael Rosenberg (35:15)

Where are you? Where Are you on the island?

Caller Kevin (35:17)

Valley. Valley Stream, or as I like to call it, Valley Queens.

Michael Rosenberg (35:22)

Right on the border. Right on the border. You got it. Yeah.

Alan Hahn (35:25)

Yeah.

Caller Kevin (35:26)

So, so anyways, big Yankee fan, big Ranger fan, all that and everything.

Commercial Announcer (35:31)

Put.

Caller Kevin (35:31)

But Don, I know it's not fraud Friday. I just got a question asked since it's the first time I've ever gotten through and tried to call numerous times. I know it's not Friday, but I grew up on Long island and my uncle, he went to college in Lemoyne up by Syracuse there.

Alan Hahn (35:50)

Right, right.

Caller Kevin (35:51)

So he became the athletic director at the college there and ended up, you know, becoming friends with Bayheim or whatever.

Commercial Announcer (35:57)

Whatever.

Caller Kevin (35:58)

So every time when I was a kid, I would be, you know, for birthdays and Christmas, I would get Syracuse swag. So I grew up a Syracuse fan here on Long island, even though I had no blood in the water there or anything, you know, like, am I, am I a fraud for being a Syracuse fan living out here on Long Island?

Alan Hahn (36:15)

And where did you go to school?

Kodiak Advertiser (36:17)

I did.

Caller Kevin (36:18)

I went to Nassau Community College.

Alan Hahn (36:20)

You're not a fraud.

Michael Rosenberg (36:21)

No, no.

Alan Hahn (36:22)

I mean, you had, you had a reason to root for, for them. You gave a nice detailed description of why you didn't go to a school that had any kind of sports program. I, I don't sense any fraud. And, and it's not weird to me either, like these people that, that, that become die hard college fans that never went there or didn't have any kind of ties to the school that interests me and being a little weird. But his story doesn't sound weird to me at all.

Michael Rosenberg (36:48)

No. And by the way, for the record, Nassau Community College used to have an unbelievable football program.

Alan Hahn (36:56)

A community college?

Michael Rosenberg (36:58)

Yeah. Nassau back to your school, right? Yeah, yeah. Unbelievable football program. In fact, there is some historic, there's some historic connection between Nassau. They've sent some guys on to big time college football.

Alan Hahn (37:13)

Interesting.

Michael Rosenberg (37:14)

Yep.

Alan Hahn (37:14)

But that didn't seem to be who I am. He still decided.

Michael Rosenberg (37:16)

No, I don't think, I don't think it would have affected him in any way.

Alan Hahn (37:19)

And it sounds like just basketball. I don't think he had any love for the football program.

Michael Rosenberg (37:22)

I guess not.

Alan Hahn (37:23)

No.

Michael Rosenberg (37:24)

But just throwing it out there. Just, just for the record.

Alan Hahn (37:27)

No, no, I, I did not. I didn't know you could have a football program at a junior college.

Michael Rosenberg (37:30)

No, they did for junior college. Junior college. There was a time where like junior college was, and, you know, your, your way in sometimes if right out of high school, you weren't, you know you were weren't ready? No, they may supplies or other reasons.

Alan Hahn (37:44)

So it makes a lot of sense.

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Don Hahn (40:06)

Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.

FanDuel Announcer (40:09)

I didn't listen to anything you just said.

Don Hahn (40:11)

Catch the show on demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcasts.

Michael Rosenberg (40:18)

Well, Donnie, you've got we've got some pissed off people in the NFL and media and former players. Our good friend Booger McFarlane Farlan, who We'll have on tomorrow, he called this the bell. So just joining us, Bill Belichick, according to ESPN report, will not be a first ballot hall of Famer. He did not get enough votes to be in this year's class. And it is some suggestion from some sources that it's almost punish him, make him wait a year because of Spygate that he oversaw when he was with the Patriots. Booger McFarlane said it's a disgrace to the game of football for this to happen. Our good friend Chris Carlin beyond absurd. We have Ralph Fakiano more proof that the voting system is badly in need of reforms. Dan Graziano said it many times, will say it again. The Pro Football hall of Fame voting process is monumentally stupid and should take much more annual grief than it does J.J. watt. I can't be reading this right. This has to be some other hall of Fame. And by the way, Peter King was told about it. He did not vote this year and Peter King was spitting out expletives when he heard that Belichick did not get in.

Alan Hahn (41:41)

So the list of people that you gave.

Michael Rosenberg (41:45)

Yes.

Alan Hahn (41:45)

And correct me if I'm wrong, are media and competitors.

Michael Rosenberg (41:49)

Yes.

Alan Hahn (41:49)

It wasn't like you were talking to former Patriots who of course are going to back Belichick. You would think. Right. Because they won those championships. So, you know, if there was a, a quote from any of them, I'd say, all right, maybe they're coming from a place of bias. But, you know, not Booger McFarlane, not J.J. watt.

Michael Rosenberg (42:08)

No. No. They wouldn't have any reason at all to say anything other than, you know, whether they agree or not. You know, it's here's J.J. watt. More of J.J. watt. There's not a single word whatsoever in which Bill Belichick should world whatsoever in which Bill Belichick should not be a first ballot Famer.

Alan Hahn (42:27)

Now, I am not for the whole punishment stuff.

Michael Rosenberg (42:31)

Shefty's saying that he talked to an NFL executive who said the 10 plus people who didn't vote for Belichick should be exposed.

Alan Hahn (42:38)

Yeah. And be told why. And if you're telling me he cheated, the thing about the, the steroid deal is that you could make the case certainly would those would those players have been hall of Famers if not taking the pds? And if the answer is no, then you don't let them in, not punish them because they took it. Say, well, it skews my judgment of the. That player that they took performance enhanced drugs, performance enhancing. Their performance was enhanced. Is there anybody in the world that believe that Belichick wouldn't win those Super Bowls anyway? Now, the argument would be, well, why did he do it, Don? Well, he did it because other players, it probably gave him an advantage. Sure, other coaches did it, but do you look at Bill Belichick as a guy that the reason he won those champions was because he had Spygate for a few of those seasons? Now, if you want to tell me, get Tom Brady, okay, that, that I can wrap my mind around that one. And it was illegal and he was punished for it. He was fined. The organization lost draft picks, just like I don't think. I think Tom Brady would have been just fine had the balls not been deflated. Yeah, but they want to punish him because they don't like him. So let's see if those same 10 vote no for Tom Brady in a couple of years when he's eligible.

Michael Rosenberg (43:58)

Polian really like, again, this is a bad look for Bill Polian. If that report, if again, the source that Wickersham and Van Naada talked to, that's a voter, suggested that Pollian was kind of like work in the room about how we got to make him wait a year. Because like, again, what does that say and what does it say about you? And then would not comment or would not return a call in a comment that kind of already now starts implicating you as well. You got nothing.

Alan Hahn (44:26)

I know.

Michael Rosenberg (44:26)

If it was me and I didn't say it, the first thing I do is pick up the phone. No, no, no. That story is bogus. I did not do that. I would never do that. But instead say nothing. And your silence sort of implicates you a little bit here. I don't love this at all for all parties. Napoleon's a respected guy. And you know, again, Belichick is. Whether you like him or not, you can't deny his long term success. This is not like, hey, he had a good run for four years, but we found out he cheated this guy. Right.

Alan Hahn (44:58)

And then when the tank after we discovered.

Michael Rosenberg (45:00)

Right, exactly. I mean, come on. It's very bizarre.

Alan Hahn (45:04)

Well, it's bizarre and also the fact that Pauline twisted the arm of some voters doesn't mean the voters have to listen, you know, so, so like, well, so what deal is being made?

Michael Rosenberg (45:15)

Well, that's the part is where are you trying to curry favor Are you trying.

Alan Hahn (45:19)

Exactly.

Michael Rosenberg (45:19)

I hate this stuff, man.

Alan Hahn (45:21)

Well, this is why.

Michael Rosenberg (45:22)

But.

Alan Hahn (45:23)

And for people that don't know each team is represented by a writer in that room. And then you have, I think 8 to 10. Gary Myers always reminds me, and I forget that are national. And then like when, when Lawrence Taylor had to get into the hall of Fame, Vinnie ditrani was the guy that represented the Giants as their reporter and he had to convince all the other voters to look past his drug use and put him in the hall of Fame. And, and he, he was able to convince them and do it. But like, because that was back in the day where, you know, maybe you didn't watch every game. We have the ability now to see every game. There might have been a guy that slept, that didn't go under the radar because they didn't play him on the night football or weren't a playoff team. But now we have the ability to watch and see how good these players are. Make up your own mind. Don't have an executive, you know, for a favor later on, hey, put my vote for my guy down the road. Don't vote for Bill this time. You know, that stuff's going on and that means it's all compromised in. Which means it's all bs.

Michael Rosenberg (46:22)

Yeah, again. And it also, by the way, I mean, it's a Hall of Fame and we, we do put a lot into it. But when you see the process of all this stuff, sometimes it's, it does make you kind of shake your head like it's popularity.

Alan Hahn (46:37)

It feels like it's a bit.

Michael Rosenberg (46:38)

We know who belongs there, right? To wait a year. What does that do?

Alan Hahn (46:41)

I mean, what is it at the end of the day, you know, the whole first ballot, second ballot stuff, he's going to be there, he's going to get his day in the hall of Fame. But it just, it will be odd that there'll be. He didn't get the first ballot. One of the greatest coaches, if not the greatest coaches of all time pro football. Let's go to Fred on Long Island. You're on espn, New York. What's up, Fred? We lost Fred.

Michael Rosenberg (47:03)

We lost Fred. Yes, we have, we have a Knicks call or a Giants in. Knicks call.

Alan Hahn (47:12)

All right, Jared, in the truck. You're on espn New York.

Michael Rosenberg (47:17)

Hey, Don.

Caller Jared (47:17)

Hey, hon. Up in the. How are you guys doing today?

Alan Hahn (47:20)

Good. And you?

Caller Jared (47:22)

I'm doing pretty good. I, I've been a long time listener and a first time caller, but I just. You guys are always great and have great points. I, I was just reaching out to you guys about the, I had a couple points on the, the Knicks and the Giants and then the super bowl, the, with the, with the Giants. I believe they did right in hiring Jim Harbaugh and I believe that they're from a real perspective. I believe that their floor is probably maybe nine games for what they can win next year. But I believe their ceiling, if everything falls right like it did for the Patriots, could be the Super Bowl.

Michael Rosenberg (48:08)

Wow, that's, that's a lot. That's, that's optimism.

Alan Hahn (48:13)

Hey, well, it happened with New England, right? I mean, it's, we were unfortunately up against it. So sorry that we can't get to your next point. But hey, listen from your lips to God's ears, as they say. But that's, and it happened in New England, but that's pretty bold. But I do think the eight and a half is interesting. I do think they could be playing meaningful games in December and I would not be shocked if they were a wild card team. But Super Bowl. Not ready to say that yet. What I'm ready to say is coming up next, it's Anthony pusick.

Michael Rosenberg (48:40)

Yeah.

Alan Hahn (48:40)

With ENN right here on Don Hanna Rosenberg, ESPN New York.

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Don Hahn (49:39)

Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.

Alan Hahn (49:43)

I don't want to know how the.

Michael Rosenberg (49:43)

Sausage is made, but I just want to know. It's good.

Don Hahn (49:45)

Hear more of Don Allen and Peter weekday afternoon starting at 3 on 8 80, ESPN, the ESPN New York app and your smart speakers.