Hour 3: Game 3 Must Win?

Summary

Don, Hahn & Rosenberg Podcast Summary

Episode: Hour 3: Game 3 Must Win?
Release Date: May 9, 2025
Hosts: Don LaGreca, Alan Hahn, Peter Rosenberg
Platform: ESPN New York

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1. Knicks vs. Celtics Playoff Series Overview

The episode delves deep into the high-stakes NBA playoff series between the New York Knicks and the Boston Celtics. With the Knicks facing elimination, Game 3 emerges as a pivotal "must-win" encounter.

Don LaGreca sets the stage by highlighting the significance of the upcoming games:

"This is the biggest game on Saturday that Madison Square Garden has seen involving the Knicks in the last 25 years. So it's the game of the century." ([00:39])

He emphasizes the potential outcomes, whether the Knicks clinch the series or face a daunting deficit:

"Either a chance to close it out in a sweep, which would be an absolute incredible thought, or the chance to go up 3-1 in the series, which also would be incredible." ([00:39])

2. Expert Analysis of Key Games and Players

The hosts dissect the performances of key players, particularly focusing on Kristaps Porziņģis and Devin Williams.

Alan Hahn discusses Porziņģis's impact and current struggles:

"Porziņģis played 1/2 in Game 1 and didn't return and they miss him and then in the second game that he could give him 13 minutes." ([15:04])

Don LaGreca adds:

"Porziņģis has been that guy for them. He was in Game 1 of the NBA Finals if you remember. That was such a huge performance by him. And then he just did nothing the rest of the series." ([14:42])

The conversation shifts to Devin Williams and the pressures he faces as a Yankees closer:

"He's been mumbling about being annoyed by that, that’s the part that just makes you wonder." ([24:32])
"The Yankees should have prepared him. This is what's going to happen. I don't exaggerate." ([24:44])

3. Fan Engagement and Caller Opinions

Listeners contribute their perspectives, drawing parallels between current series and past upsets.

Caller Aiden from Brooklyn reminisces about the 2015 Mets sweeping the Cubs:

"Nobody in the world thought the Mets really had a chance of beating the Cubs that series... Lo and behold, the Mets sweep the Cubs." ([43:42])

This anecdote serves to inspire optimism for the Knicks:

"Where we are at this point in time, it is not on the table." ([44:34])

4. Media Pressure on Athletes

A significant portion of the discussion revolves around the intense media scrutiny athletes endure, especially in high-profile markets like New York.

Don LaGreca critiques the Yankees' handling of Devin Williams:

"They should have prepared him. This is what's going to happen. I'm not exaggerating." ([24:44])

Alan Hahn echoes the sentiment, emphasizing the relentless media presence:

"There's probably on any given day, there's at least 15 to 20 reporters around a given locker." ([28:10])

The hosts debate the impact of this pressure on athletes' performances and mental health.

5. Additional Topics: Football Discussion and Draft Picks

The conversation takes a brief detour into football, discussing the Giants' draft picks and the media's focus on quarterback Jackson Dart over Abdul Carter.

Alan Hahn expresses frustration with the Giants' draft strategy:

"Everything is about him. Everything loves this kid. It's unreal." ([34:07])

Peter Rosenberg adds:

"They knew they were going to get Abdul Carter, right? And Jackson Dart was the piece they had to do some work to get." ([34:30])

The hosts humorously touch upon the challenges Dart faces with his snap count cadence, referencing a viral clip involving Jon Gruden:

"Make fun of the fact that the Giants trade up for a quarterback that somebody asked about, wondering if he's going to be able to do anything other than clap when it comes to a snap count." ([42:54])

6. Conclusion and Upcoming Events

Wrapping up, the hosts preview upcoming sports events, including the Hudson River Derby between New York City FC and the New York Red Bulls, and tease coverage of the Mets vs. Cubs series.

Don LaGreca encourages fans to engage with the content:

"Are you a New York City soccer fan? Enter now at espnnewyork.com or on the ESPN New York app." ([45:02])

Alan Hahn reminds listeners of the breadth of coverage:

"Catch the show on demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcasts." ([37:11])

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps

• Don LaGreca on the stakes of Game 3:

  "This is the biggest game on Saturday that Madison Square Garden has seen involving the Knicks in the last 25 years. So it's the game of the century." ([00:39])

• Alan Hahn on team focus:

  "The job is not close to being done yet." ([04:02])

• Jay Williams on Celtics' offensive strategy:

  "If somebody's down, you keep them down." ([06:23])

• Caller Aiden on historical upsets:

  "No one in the world thought the Mets really had a chance of beating the Cubs that series... Lo and behold, the Mets sweep the Cubs." ([43:42])

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Key Takeaways

• High Stakes for the Knicks: Game 3 against the Celtics is critical for the Knicks' advancement in the playoffs.
• Player Performances Under Scrutiny: Porziņģis's inconsistent performance and Devin Williams's media pressure are central discussion points.
• Fan and Media Impact: The intense media environment in New York adds additional pressure on players, influencing their performances.
• Hope from Past Upsets: Historical moments like the 2015 Mets-Cubs series inspire hope for current underdog teams like the Knicks.

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For those eager to stay updated on these discussions and more, subscribing to the Don, Hahn & Rosenberg podcast on your preferred platform is highly recommended.

Transcript

[Don LaGreca]

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[Alan Hahn]

This is the Don Hahn and Rosenberg Podcast.

[Don LaGreca]

That sounds like heaven to me.

[Alan Hahn]

Listen live weekday afternoon starting at 3 on 880 ESPN, the ESPN New York app and your smart speakers.

[Don LaGreca]

503 in the big city. Don Lagreca, Alan Hahn, Peter Rosenberg. It's Don Hahn and Rosenberg. Take it up at 6:30. Then it's Mets, Cubs. Interesting weekend series. The Yankees will be in Sacramento to take on the A's, so you're gonna have to stay up late for that. But all the conversations about the Knicks and what Monday and Saturday are going to mean to the city, to this franchise and to that building, it was brought up by Alan earlier. This is the biggest game on Saturday that Madison Square Garden has seen involving the Knicks in the last 25 years. So it's the game of the century. And no matter what happens on Saturday, Monday will be the biggest game of the century. Either a chance to close it out in a sweep, which would be an absolute incredible thought, or the chance to go up 31 in the series, which also would be incredible. So it is going to be a magical day tomorrow. 3:30. Our coverage begins at 2:30 and then on Monday you got a 7:30 tip. We're going to be on until 6:30 and we're going to be leading you in to Mets. But we're going to be talking about game four because we're going to be right there at the watch party, 33rd side of Madison Square Garden. We're going to have guests. We're going to have just an incredible atmosphere. We're going to be with the people on Monday. So this is just big guys. It's. You don't get moments like that. This off. The Rangers have given it to us over the last few years. We certainly get it from the Yankees on an almost routine basis. But football's given us almost nothing for over a decade. So we don't get moments like this. As big as New York is, as many teams as we have, we don't get two games like this too often. Two games in three days like we're going to have at Madison Square Garden on Saturday afternoon and Monday Night.

[Alan Hahn]

I think I've told a lot of fans, as exciting as those first two games were, as far as stealing them, where you stole them, who you stole them from, the lead that you got as a result of it. I've said we got to keep just kind of staying focused on the next game. When everybody wanted to start doing the whole, can we go to the finals? Can we win the championship? Like, it's like, wait, wait, wait. The job is not close to being done yet. But I do think that Saturday, the result of Saturday, and especially if it's a positive one, you really could start dreaming. Like, there's no reason that you couldn't start dreaming if they.

[Peter Rosenberg]

The whole thing of everything.

[Alan Hahn]

You could. Now, to me, the ceiling is the roof. Like, to quote the great Michael Jordan. I. I honestly, like, that's what. That's what Saturday represents, is if. If you get that performance from the. From your team that you're hoping to get that. That you dream about and the roof is blown off that building and you're up three. Oh, yeah. Now. Now, I give you Mother's Day. It'd be one of the great Mother's Day a Nick fan could possibly have. Like, it is. You are at that point now where you can, but you can't until you get there. And so that's what you want to see. Because even three, one. I don't think you should start dreaming.

[Don LaGreca]

Three.

[Alan Hahn]

Oh, yes.

[Don LaGreca]

Yeah. Three, not three. One, three, zero would be colossal. And for some reason. Not that I. Because of how banged up the Cavaliers are. I think it's on the table no matter who wins that series between the Cavs and the Pacers.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah. Tonight's an interesting game. The Cavs and the Pacers. The Pacers are a great home team.

[Don LaGreca]

Yeah.

[Alan Hahn]

They're in Indiana. That you think that place isn't going to go nuts. They're right. They can taste it, too, that they're going to go back to the conference finals.

[Don LaGreca]

Can you just.

[Alan Hahn]

They're right there.

[Don LaGreca]

Yeah. So you go into Saturday with the Pacers up three. Oh.

[Alan Hahn]

Oh, my God.

[Don LaGreca]

And the Knicks leave the garden tomorrow and they're up 3.

[Alan Hahn]

Oh, yeah.

[Don LaGreca]

And we just be just talking up the possibility of the Knicks and the Pacers. And then, I mean, I listen, I think going to the final would just be unbelievable. Oklahoma City, That's a whole nother. That's another.

[Alan Hahn]

Who cares?

[Don LaGreca]

Again, at that point. Right? I really.

[Alan Hahn]

You're trying to do something you haven't done. Like, remember what we've talked about going into the playoffs Remember the conversations that we were having about the season and how do we judge how the year went? And there, there is. There were so many things on the table, including blow it up, fire the coach, call it a failure. Right. If they don't get out of the first round, if they only get to the second round. Right. Like, because the expectation going in was you were supposed to be in the conference finals. You were supposed to take on the Celtics. You weren't supposed to be a team that loses in the second round. Right. That was. These were all the things that. That we were talking about. And so this is how you're two wins away from advancing the cause one more step and then you could argue, can you get to the finals? Well, that's advancing the cause two steps. You're jumping two ahead.

[Don LaGreca]

Yeah.

[Alan Hahn]

The progressing, you know, and Wendy said this this morning, and he's right. The Knicks didn't build this team for this year. I was trying to tell everybody that from day one, too. I was saying the same from the start of the season. I was telling people, this is not the year, but this is a really good team that you're going to feel good about. But just know. And I. Everybody got mad at me. I was doing the show with Bart and I was saying, just want you to know this season's going to end in disappointment and that's okay. And people are like, how could you say that? Why are you being negative? Say, because you. I know what I'm looking at. They don't have enough depth yet. Like, they, they are not quite there. They're going to need time together. They're going to need to face losses and go through adversity. That's what great teams do before they finally figure it out. Now they have an opportunity here to advance it a little quicker. But I still say, like, this is just the start of what they're hoping to build. This wasn't supposed to be in the first year Magic. But you never know. Maybe you will strike gold.

[Don LaGreca]

No, it. It's. It's all happening now. Jay Williams was on first take, and this is a hot take. He says the winner of game that this is going to be a must win for the New York Knicks.

[Jay Williams]

You're damn right it is. You don't play with your food when you're going against a team with the best offensive rating in NBA history. Two of the games they've been down 20. I'm going to be in the building on Saturday. This building is going to be electric. MSG is going to be off the charts. What do you do when somebody's down? You keep them down. And sa. Wendy, you both know this personally. Shooters shoot. What's the last thing you want shooters to see? The ball go in the net. You don't want them to find their rhythm. Because if the Celtics find their rhythm, all the pressure will then be back on New York because the Celtics will have found their jump shot. And if they shoot anywhere better, don't let them shoot in the 40s from the three point line, because that momentum. And by the way, they're a better team on the road than they are at home. Third, 43, eight on the road this season, which set a franchise record for the Boston Celtics. So them coming into that building, knowing all the history, playing at this level, when the crowd's going to be electric, if they shoot the lights out of the ball, all that momentum is going to swing back towards Boston. We've seen it before in playoffs, back in the past. So I think New York, if they're down, keep them down, keep your foot on their neck. Because people don't really believe that. The Knicks, Knick fans believe it, but everybody else who follows basketball, you're just waiting for the Boston Celtics to find their rhythm because, you know, this is not the team we've seen them be throughout the course of the regular season.

[Alan Hahn]

He's right with that. He is. Everybody around the country just thinks that this is. This is. And you said it, Don. Right. It's like the Celtics have lost more than the Knicks have won in this series. And that is how it's being viewed. But Jay saying it here, Shaq said it, and I. This is where I want to slam my head into a wall. Don't get complacent. You know, don't. Don't sit back. And I'm thinking, who's comfortable in this series?

[Don LaGreca]

The Knicks.

[Alan Hahn]

The knicks have trailed 80% of the series. They were trailing. Why would they ever just sit back, go, wow, we're playing great. We, we're awesome. No, you've had to. You've had to scratch and claw and somehow pull out these two Houdini wins. There's no comfort. If anything, you're kind of. You probably have that nervous energy, like, yo, we gotta actually win one here.

[Don LaGreca]

Well, that's the thing is that by looking at a 20 series lead, winning both games in Boston, on the surface, looks like you've got your foot on their neck. But you really don't because of the fact that you really haven't. Again, I don't want to take anything away from them. But it wasn't really anything that you've done to cause this other than taking advantage of the situation at the end of games. I mean, in two straight games, you were down 20 points. A ton of uncontested threes have been missed. The Knicks are not a great defender of the perimeter. So when he's talking about don't let it happen, I don't think. I don't think it's a case of the Knicks letting anything happen. If the Celtics start hitting their shots, I just don't know if there's anything the Knicks can do about it other than just matching them shot for shot. I don't think it'd be complacency. If they lose tomorrow, it's going to be just because the Celtics just played better. And that's why I don't think it's a must win because, yeah, that can happen. But then you got a chance to. For the Celtics to shoot poorly again and, and the Knicks find a way to win game four, and then you're. You're in the driver's seat again. So this isn't a case that the Knicks are never in a position to bat the bunny? No, it's just that and the Celtics, that they've been complacent and I think they've been arrogant because they've been sticking with their threes. But dude, if those things fall, I don't know what the Knicks do about it.

[Alan Hahn]

You want to take the temperature. Let's of the fan base because, like, we're getting all these from experts.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Take it rectal.

[Don LaGreca]

Yeah, well, that's the only way to.

[Alan Hahn]

Get the most accurate.

[Don LaGreca]

Right. I mean, honestly, raise your hand if you've experienced that.

[Alan Hahn]

By the way, as a kid, did you experience anybody? Anyone?

[Don LaGreca]

Of course.

[Alan Hahn]

It's, it's, it's not, it's not a good memory.

[Don LaGreca]

It was.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I know it's not.

[Don LaGreca]

You know, it was the only time, like take nobody. You wouldn't look forward to getting your temperature taken.

[Alan Hahn]

No.

[Don LaGreca]

Now it's like, I don't even think my children even know you have the.

[Alan Hahn]

Gun right where you just hold it right in front of the forehead and it just tells you.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Wait, your kids don't get the rectal thermometer?

[Don LaGreca]

No, they do, but it doesn't. They don't seem to be traumatized by. Maybe they will at some point, but it's not anything. That's a big deal. I remember it. I remember there being times I'm like, oh, my God, please don't take my temperature.

[Alan Hahn]

I feel fine. I swear, I feel fine.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I'm good. I'm good. All right, let's take the temperature. I'm sorry I threw us down the path of rectal.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah, I thought you just a really bad memory.

[Don LaGreca]

Let's go to Lou and Alepp and you're on ESPN New York.

[Caller]

Hey, how's it going, fellas? Let's go, Nick. So personally, I'm getting a little tired of listening to the Knicks hate from, you know, the national media. And, and I get it, you know, Nick. Fans are loud, they're obnoxious, they're, you know, where we're passionate. But like, if, if the rules were reversed, if the knicks were up 20 and the Celtics came back two times a one, you know, basically everyone would call the Knicks finished. You know, not saying that the Celtics are done. They, they're a great team, but, you know, just strategy wise, if they don't improve, they're. They're not going to get back in. You know, they can't get back into the series. They're fouling Mitchell Robinson every time he walks onto the court because they don't want him in the game. They're afraid of Mitchell Robinson. It's hilarious.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah.

[Caller]

The only thing that I really need to see and the Knicks, I mean, I was expecting the Knicks to be down two games and I was expecting them to lose in five or four or whatever before the series started. But I'm, you know, fully on board. Obviously the thing is, is, is Saturday tomorrow. They have to, the crowd has to be into it. They have to be loud. The team has to play better basketball. But if that, if that results in a loss, depending on like the temperature, which you guys are gauging right now, depending on all those things going right, and it still comes into a loss, I think the Knicks will feel still confident that this series is there. I don't, you know, they haven't been playing great basketball outside of the last six minutes of gain, ten minutes of game.

[Alan Hahn]

Right. You know, they turn it up. They turn it up at the right time.

[Caller]

Yeah. Let's go next.

[Alan Hahn]

Thank you.

[Don LaGreca]

I just think that, you know, when you shoot 25% from three, that's, that's a recipe for disaster. Right? So what if they, what if they shoot 40%? What's it look like? I mean, judging.

[Alan Hahn]

We know what it looks like.

[Don LaGreca]

We've seen, judging by the first two games, you're going to get blown out.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah, we've seen it. It's not so there.

[Don LaGreca]

Does it's so odd to me. I guess it's kind of similar to in a football game, you win the game because the other team turned the ball over four times. Yeah. Some of it was because you played good defense and you deflected the pass, but sometimes it was just unforced errors by the other team. You took advantage of it, you won the game, you're not going to apologize for it. But certainly the team that won had a lot to do with the fact that they lost the game. You know, a pitcher walking the ballpark, you know, and did you really bash your way to the lead or did the pitcher hand it to you by walking? And even coaches decisions, guys, those are self inflicted too. The fact that the Celtics are not making adjustments, not anything the Knicks are doing it, just the Celtics being stubborn. So what you want to do is you want to be able to play the best you can and be in a position for the Celtics to screw this up. I mean, I don't think there's anything wrong with, with, with. With that being the secret sauce, right? No, I mean, because again, the reality is you were down 20 back to back. That does not happen. That never happens. So if you go out there and play your best basketball and you win, you're not going to apologize for it because three oh is three oh. But I guess there's that fear. And I don't think it's the national media hating on the Knicks. It's the defending champions playing like garbage. And if all of a sudden they play to the best of their ability and win by 20, you're going to see a complete shift. Now I don't think that's going to happen because I don't think the Knicks are going to let that happen. They play games close, but that's kind of what everybody's waiting for. What does it look like when the Celtics put it together, by the way?

[Peter Rosenberg]

The funny part is we've seen what it looks like. They're up 20 points. Can they keep it together? But I will maintain the Knicks haven't put it together.

[Alan Hahn]

Can I also.

[Peter Rosenberg]

That's the funny part.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah.

[Peter Rosenberg]

The Knicks have not been great.

[Alan Hahn]

That's what everybody's arguing is that they also haven't had their rhythm. They haven't had, they haven't had a Brunson 40 point game. But Porzingis is such an X factor here.

[Don LaGreca]

Yeah.

[Alan Hahn]

And the fact that Porzingis played 1/2 in Game 1 and didn't return and they miss him and then in the second game that he could give him 13 minutes. And you could see that while he hit a huge shot with the big three, he had a dunk, you know, but he. He didn't really have that much of an impact. And he. Apparently his energy, like his battery drained quickly and they had to get off the. Up the court. He's. He's still not right. And he's been getting. And they've been trying to give him as much treatment as possible, IV fluids, all the stuff that you'd normally do when somebody is. Is sick. He's got some type of viral issue, and it's causing him to feel massive fatigue. And that has also been something I don't think we've talked about enough because the Celtics are. Are good, but he is a dimension that when they have him, they're just different. Yeah, a 74 guy that can just drain threes, but also his size defensively is an impact. It's hard to make layups around him and stuff. Like, there's a lot of things with the Porzingis factor to watch, of course, in Saturday as well. How much more can they give him? They. He was. They. They weren't sure if he's going to play. They. Then he didn't start. Al Horford is 100 years old. They got him playing almost 40 minutes. You see him at the end of games he's spent.

[Peter Rosenberg]

That sort of ruins him.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Because his great player to have for 25, 30 minutes.

[Alan Hahn]

Yes.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah.

[Alan Hahn]

Yes.

[Don LaGreca]

And that's the point that Adam in the car is going to make about kp. You're on ESPN New York. Good afternoon, guys. Firstly, go Nix. Yeah, thanks, Alan, for stealing all my thunder there. I was just saying on the radio that, yeah, the. That's one of the things that no one's really talking about is that Porzingis.

[Alan Hahn]

Has killed the Knicks in the regular season.

[Don LaGreca]

Our former unicorn. And when he's not out there, it changes everything about their offense. And I think as long as he can't really continue to go, the Knicks have a real shot to take this home. Go, Nick, baby.

[Alan Hahn]

Thank you, Adam. I'm telling you guys, it does change who they are a little bit because it puts so much more pressure on Tatum and Brown to be primary scores and to be on. And he's just one of those guys like Derek White's really good too, at this, where they just. You're. You're so worried about those two guys, and all of a sudden the ball swings and the next thing you know, there's Porzingis that can shoot, you know, high 30s from three. There's white who shoots high 30s from three. They make you pay. So that, that hasn't been a major factor. Peyton Pritchard also 6 Man of the year, he hasn't really put his fingerprints on this series yet. Deuce McBride has kind of played him to a standstill in this series already in the first two games. And Deuce was a guy I wasn't feeling great about after the Detroit series. So there's, there's so many others. You know, we always like to focus on the stars. Brunson, Towns, Tatum, Brown. I didn't know that would rhyme, but it did. But that's really what you focus on. But the others always make a difference. And so who's one of the others? It was Bridges in game two in the fourth quarter. Who's one of those that's going to have that moment or have that game that just is such a difference maker? Porzingis has been that guy for them. He was in game one of the NBA Finals if you remember. That was such a huge performance by him. And then he just did nothing the rest of the series. He got hurt again. That's been a thing with him. He's not reliable because he always finds a way to find himself off the court. This is another way. It's not an injury, but it's an illness and it is definitely something to watch.

[Don LaGreca]

1-800-919-3776 more of your calls enn coming up at 6 o' clock and then at 6:30 it's the Mets and the Cubs. It's all happening right here on 880 ESPN New York and the ESPN New York.

[Alan Hahn]

Let me remind everybody too, Don. Game three between the Knicks and the Celtics is tomorrow afternoon that we've been talking about. But MSG Networks has you covered with a 30 minute pregame show at 3 o' clock. That's where I'll be. I'll be there with Wally and Bill Pedo and, and, and Monica McNutt will be joining us as well. And so you'll have the game on ABC at 3:30. Then when the game's over, you know where to go. Go back to MSG Networks right after the game. I mean the minute the buzzer sounds, we give you an hour long post game show. You get all the player and coach interviews, you get us breaking it down, giving you the analysis, the highlights and everything else. So remember tomorrow, pre and post game shows on MSG Networks before and after game three.

[Don LaGreca]

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[Alan Hahn]

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[Don LaGreca]

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[Don LaGreca]

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[Don LaGreca]

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[Alan Hahn]

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[Don LaGreca]

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[Alan Hahn]

Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I didn't listen to anything you just said.

[Alan Hahn]

Catch the show on demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcasts.

[Don LaGreca]

Game Time is brought to you by Tullibordoo Irish Whiskey because when it's game time didn't even have his mic on.

[Alan Hahn]

It's just fading.

[Don LaGreca]

Oh boy.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You know, it came out better than you made it sound.

[Don LaGreca]

Don wasn't terrible on Mike would have been nice. But listen, you didn't know that he.

[Alan Hahn]

Didn'T need a mic.

[Peter Rosenberg]

It was so in the moment I wasn't planning on participating. But then the moment it existed and.

[Alan Hahn]

It was what we're doing. Don. We're bringing him over to our side. Starting to he's starting to realize how fun it is.

[Don LaGreca]

He'll start to start to feel it met start a series with the Cubs. Coverage begins immediately following this program at 8 on 8, 80 at 6:30 and then the Yankees are out in Sacramento facing the athletics at 10:05. Tullamore Dew the original triple distilled, triple blended and triple cast matured Irish whiskey. Be sure to grab a Tullamore Dew or try the new Tullamore Dew Honey as during today's action Glasses up to enjoying Tullamore do responsibly.

[Alan Hahn]

What did you think of what Passon said about Devin Williams? When I followed up with the soft thing that he suggested that Max Freed had a bit of that reputation that, you know, he's not like. He didn't seem like a guy that would embrace New York. And if I'm not mistaken, coming to New York was not exactly a priority for him. But then he, you know, obviously the money and everything else, but he has been phenomenal on this stage. So when I followed up and said, well, what about Devin Williams, who. Closers normally have swagger, they have confidence, bravado. That's usually what is in the DNA of a closer. And he's come here and he's kind of been a puddle and even, even passing sounded guys like. He was very surprised at how Devin Williams has been so far as a Yankee and to the point where he would even suggest that some guys just can't do it on that stage.

[Don LaGreca]

We've seen it. I mean, New York is just different. I mean, I'm glad you brought that up. I've always said it. Not saying it's. It's better, it's just different. New York's just different. And in any other market, you blow a save, all right, big deal. You'll have the same three or four reporters you always have, and you're probably friendly with three of them. And, and, and everything's going to be a bit of a soft landing. And the fans will encourage you. This is a franchise that just when you're a closer, you're expected to win games. And it's a lot like a corner you in the NFL when they do the job, nobody says anything. But when the receiver blows by him and the Telestrator shows how bad he was beaten in the replay, everybody gets on him. You know, you just do your job until all of a sudden you don't do it. And a closer, when he makes a mistake, it usually cost you a game. And it's a tough position to be in. Just ask Chapman. Yeah, and you know, Mo made it seem easy. And nobody else has been able to make it as easy as Mo made it. And even Mo had his moments where he didn't close it out and heard it from the fans. So he has set a standard that everybody else is just going to fail to live up to. And I just keep circling back, guys, to the Yankees being doing a bad job of preparing this guy for what was going to be expected of him. Now, you're never going to know. They're always going to answer the question, yes, can you handle New York? Of course I can. I'm looking forward to it.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah, exactly.

[Don LaGreca]

But when he questioned the amount of reporters, that tells me they did not do a good enough job articulating to him what, what's it going to be like to be a New York Yankee? And what's it going to be like to fail? Hey, in Milwaukee, if he blew a save, it's possible that nobody would have batted an eye. If he didn't talk to the media after the game, he might have been able to put his suit on and walk out of the building and go, oh, shucks, we'll just have to talk to him tomorrow, right? Oh, it didn't happen here. 20, 30, 40, sometimes 50 people are going to be all there staring at him, asking what happened. And for him to sit there, tell him about, I didn't know there'd be this much media. That's a bad job by Brian Cashman and the Yankees not letting him know.

[Alan Hahn]

Oh, he's got to know. The fact that he's been mumbling about the, being annoyed by that, that, that's the part that just makes you wonder. But you know, again, it could all tell.

[Peter Rosenberg]

How would you not know, though?

[Alan Hahn]

He's, of course he knows. It's not like he's never pitched here.

[Don LaGreca]

Before, but, but it's different just wearing that uniform. Peter, I'm sure, you know, he's pitched in New York before. He's pitched in the postseason before. But he probably didn't realize that some meaningless April Tuesday game is the equivalent to like game seven in Milwaukee that you just, I, these players don't realize the amount of attention that's constantly on you. The media is there always. These guys are getting there at three o' clock in the afternoon. They're hovering around the batting cage, they're hanging out well after the game.

[Alan Hahn]

And some guys just don't like it. Like, they just don't like having people around. They think the media thing does bother certain people where they're just, what are you doing? Like, I, I, we've all been in these situations. Like, I remember again, my years as a beat writer, there are times and, you know, look, the team you cover, the players know you like, they kind of like you're there every day. So it doesn't take long before they know you, and then you can have those personal relationships. There are certain guys that it's like, you know, do you have to hang out over here? Like. And you realize, like, yeah, yeah, because you don't like loitering in the locker room, but you also know you're waiting out a player. You got to get somebody after a practice or after a game or. Or whatever it is. And so you're just standing there. You know, you do forget, oh, this is a locker room. Like, this is their sanctuary. Like, you really should be respectful. But when there's 20 or 30 of you, like, when I've covered Stanley Cup Finals and NBA Finals, that that's like, it's unavoidable. A lot of times it's just a crowded locker room, and the players get annoyed because they're used to it being their sanctuary. I can't walk around. I got to walk around these people. Is a big crowd, my lockers taken up. And it does. It does frustrate guys, and they don't like dealing with.

[Don LaGreca]

But. But you just brought up a point that I think people don't realize or don't think about. The brewers gone to the playoffs.

[Alan Hahn]

Yep.

[Don LaGreca]

And what happens in the playoffs?

[Alan Hahn]

More media coverage.

[Don LaGreca]

Well, but what happens is, is that after the game, you'll go to a podium or to a table, and there's a separation, you know, but the clubhouse.

[Alan Hahn]

Is open, too, though. Keep that in mind.

[Don LaGreca]

What's that?

[Alan Hahn]

Clubhouse is open, too, though.

[Don LaGreca]

No, I get it. But, like, Devin Williams blew that save against the Mets. He probably wasn't next to his locker. He probably went to a deus or a table, and then the media spoke to him.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah.

[Don LaGreca]

Because there were so many people there. But there's probably on, like I said, in the middle of a regular season, you go back to your locker, there's one or two guys, you know them well. They're not going to kill you. But you know how much media, never mind the newspapers and. And all of the television and the radio, like, there could be, honestly, no exaggeration, I would say on any given day, there's probably at least 15 to 20 reporters around a given locker.

[Alan Hahn]

Oh, yeah. On a. On a basic series.

[Don LaGreca]

Right. Just a basic. On an everyday. And then every paper's got at least two.

[Alan Hahn]

And a columnist. Right. At least two writers and a columnist.

[Don LaGreca]

Right. And the subway series, that probably doubles. Oh, yeah. And it's all just going to your locker, which is your sanctuary, your place to kind of cool off. And all of a sudden.

[Alan Hahn]

There'S just People in the way, five people gathered around. Right.

[Don LaGreca]

And I could think it could be disconcerting if you're not prepared for it. That's why I said the Yankees, they should have prepared him. This is what's going to happen. I'm not exaggerating. This is going to happen.

[Alan Hahn]

Probably didn't know to even think this, to say it sort of heating up. Is that something? Look, we got another week before these teams meet up. He hit his. He's got four home runs right now in the month of May.

[Don LaGreca]

Yeah.

[Alan Hahn]

Is. Is like this is setting up to be okay. He's starting to feel it. He's starting to get hot just in time for this series. This series is a May series, but it does feel like there's. This is going to get bigger and bigger. I know you guys think I'm juicing this thing up. Maybe I am, but maybe I just want it to be big. I think this series all of a sudden is going to have a lot of juice to it.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, I mean, let's say it'll be a slightly subdued juice if the, you know, Knicks are gearing up for the NBA Finals.

[Alan Hahn]

Well, if, but let's. The game, what did we say Game six is Friday. Right. And that's when the series begins.

[Peter Rosenberg]

It's next Friday. Right. So, yeah. So if the, if the Knicks just won a series or playing that night to go to the conference finals, maybe it won't have as much room as it would have had otherwise.

[Alan Hahn]

Okay.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But I think, Don, there's going to be a lot of noise around.

[Don LaGreca]

It depends on what's going on with the Knicks. Like, as you said, the game that Friday, Game one of Mets Yankees at Yankee Stadium is going to be the same night as game six. So you can make the. Yeah, the building will be packed, but from like a media talking point, it is going to be about the Knicks. And if the Knicks win the series or even lose the series, our lead Monday is probably going to be Knicks. So there will be a little starch out of this, guys, depending on what happens with the Knicks. Because you said it yesterday, Peter, it's, it's, it's not nothing. I mean, baseball is big in this town, but playoffs is.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But yeah, I mean, I'll put it this way. The Knicks beat the Celtics in game six at the Garden to head to the conference finals to take on the Pacers.

[Alan Hahn]

So Monday we.

[Peter Rosenberg]

And the Mets and the Mets beat. Well, and the Mets beat the Yankees 3 1. Friday night, the Saturday newspaper, you're going to have to Dig round to find that Mets Yankee game.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Nick's going to the conference finals is this Monday.

[Alan Hahn]

Monday show. If the Mets take two out of three and Soto just absolutely just, you know, just puts. Just sets fire to the to stadium that month, that Monday show will have a little bit of a split to it. There's no way you just glaze over Soto's revenge. You can't.

[Don LaGreca]

But here, here's. Here's the difference. All right. I agree with you. If, if the series wraps up in game six, because then the Knicks move on. We don't, you know, whenever it would start, it wouldn't start that Monday.

[Alan Hahn]

I could tell you when.

[Don LaGreca]

If, but if the boat. If. When would game seven be?

[Alan Hahn]

Oh, game seven Sunday.

[Don LaGreca]

Right. So. So forget it. Like if there's a game six that leads to a game seven in Boston, there would be no real split. We'll talk about it, obviously. But it's going to all be about that game seven Monday lose.

[Alan Hahn]

I'm wrong. Game seven is Monday.

[Don LaGreca]

Wow. Yeah. So same thing. Another clear about Game 6.

[Alan Hahn]

It's another hockey weekend. That's why another hockey weekend. So the conference final would begin. Eastern Conference finals was. What's May 21 is. What is that a Wednesday? Yeah.

[Don LaGreca]

Yeah. So has the chance to be somewhat obscured by the Knicks if they lose the series in six or seven. That's all we're going to be talking about winning the series. You're going to. It's going to be talk about it, but then you're going to have all that knowing that Wednesday. So there'll be a little bit more room to maybe talk about the Mets in the Yankee series because we'll still have another round with the Knicks and the, the talking. Yeah, you'll get the break there. This, this, this was sent to me by Anthony. You probably got it too. Juan Soto's numbers in May versus Aaron Judge.

[Alan Hahn]

Here we go. Here we go.

[Don LaGreca]

Soto.346 batting average.455 on base, 1.339 OPS, four home runs, five RBIs.

[Jay Williams]

Wow.

[Don LaGreca]

Judge. Yeah.261 batting average.320 OBS, 1.016 OPS, two homers, two RBIs. So is very fluid, guys. But listen, it's early Mets. Yankees is always going to get some shine. There's no question about it. But I, I think the Knicks do disrupt this thing just a little bit.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah, right. Right now the attention is definitely because.

[Don LaGreca]

Let'S, let's be honest, guys, as much as we'd love the Knicks to wrap this up in four. Okay. In all likelihood, we're. We're probably. We're definitely looking at a game five.

[Alan Hahn]

Yes.

[Don LaGreca]

And I think I would bet in all likelihood there's going to be a game six.

[Alan Hahn]

We'll be working Friday night, too. Yeah, I think you're right. Can I, Can I now. Can I throw in a little football here, please?

[Peter Rosenberg]

I would love for you to.

[Alan Hahn]

I'm curious if you guys are noticing because the Giants doing minicamp, they have, they have. They've been putting out video. They have a little show that they've done from. From draft night, all that stuff. Do you remember who they picked first in the draft?

[Don LaGreca]

That would be Abdul Carter.

[Alan Hahn]

Right? Yeah, but. But like, Jackson Dart feels like the favored son, does he not?

[Don LaGreca]

Well, that's.

[Alan Hahn]

Everything is about him. Everything loves this kid. It's unreal. Like, honestly, it does feel like they view him as the bigger get. And it's like Abdul cars like, oh, we got that guy too. But this. We got our corner.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You know why, Alan?

[Alan Hahn]

Unbelievable.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Besides that he's a quarterback, but besides that he's a quarterback.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah.

[Peter Rosenberg]

They knew they were going to get Abdul Carter, right? And Jackson Dart was the piece they had to do some work to get. So this is the one that they're.

[Alan Hahn]

And they almost didn't get him.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Abdul Carter. Abdul Carter didn't give them any credit. They didn't get any credit whatsoever for drafting Abdul Carter.

[Alan Hahn]

Right.

[Peter Rosenberg]

They got credit. Oh, the Giants won the draft because they were able to find Jackson Dart.

[Don LaGreca]

So.

[Alan Hahn]

But the way they're treating like they're reacting to it, it's like, this is the prodigal son. This is. This is everything. This is our prized possession of the draft, not the guy we took at three.

[Don LaGreca]

That's it.

[Alan Hahn]

I'm not saying it's true. I'm saying it's. It's so the perception I'm feeling coverage.

[Don LaGreca]

Because like Peter said, you know, if they didn't trade back in and it was just Abdul Carter in the first round, and I think people would say, oh, the Giants did what they were supposed to do, but by trading back in, getting the quarterback. Seeing Dable's reaction tells you that Dable feels like he's got a quarterback that's going to save his job, which then saves Shane's job, but we're ultimately going to see. Hey there, travelers. Kaley Cuoco here. Sorry to interrupt your music. Great artist, BT Dubs, but wouldn't you rather be there to hear it live with Priceline? You can get out of your dreams and into your dream concert. They've got millions of travel deals to get you to that festival, gig, rave, sound bath or sonic experience you've been dreaming of. Download the Priceline app today and you can save up to 60% off hotels and up to 50 50% off flights. So don't just dream about that trip. Book it with Priceline. Go to your happy price. Priceline.

[Alan Hahn]

Ryan Reynolds here from Mint Mobile. I don't know if you knew this, but anyone can get the same Premium Wireless for $15 a month plan that I've been enjoying.

[Don LaGreca]

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[Alan Hahn]

One of your assistant's assistants switch you.

[Don LaGreca]

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[Alan Hahn]

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[Don LaGreca]

Switch upfront payment of $45 for three.

[Alan Hahn]

Month plan equivalent to $15 per month required three months only then full price plan options available, taxes and fees extra. See full [e-mail] make your next move.

[Don LaGreca]

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[Alan Hahn]

Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I didn't listen to anything you just said.

[Alan Hahn]

Catch the show on demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcasts.

[Don LaGreca]

Hey New York City soccer fans. The Hudson River Derby is coming. New York City FC takes on their rivals, the New York Red Bulls at Citi Field, Saturday, May 17th at 4:30pm you could be there for free. We're giving away two pairs of tickets to this massive matchup between the Boys in Blue and their crosstown rivals. Get there early for Fan Fest with music and family fun for supporters of all ages. Don't miss your chance to be there. Enter now at espnnewyork.com or on the ESPN New York app. Just find the contest tab and submit your entry. Don't miss the action. Grab your seats [e-mail] NYCFC Don Hahn and Rosenberg taking up until 6:30. We got ENN coming up at 6 and then 6:30 it'll be the Mets and the Cubs. But Allen brought up just the infatuation of Jackson Dart. Giants seem to love him. Fans are excited about him. So at Minicamp Dabel and Dart both spoke. Brian Dabel said or talked about Dart's clapping, snap count, and having to learn cadence. Most every college does that. I did it when I was at Alabama in 2017. I think Hertz and Tour are doing a good job of cadences in the league. So most college guys haven't done it. I would say most of them are. You know, you clap. So when I first went to Alabama, look, I didn't know anything about clapping. SEC stadiums, you can't hear. And I'm like, how is this going to work? But you hear it. And then again, any of these new players, quarterbacks, free agent quarterbacks, first round, like, most of them haven't done a cadence, but I don't. I mean, it's not too hard to learn a cadence. You know, you say a couple words, voice inflection, you continue to learn from that. But I wouldn't say it's like rocket science. Learn a cadence. All right, I'm sorry that I can't give you those 35 seconds back. So we're not going to talk. You know.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You know what?

[Don LaGreca]

I. I apologize to everyone.

[Alan Hahn]

It's a real thing, though. I was really wondering where that was going.

[Don LaGreca]

Know what? I. You know, I don't know if I could send flowers to everyone.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I'd like it if you did, but did you see.

[Alan Hahn]

Did you see the clip from the Gruden Camp?

[Don LaGreca]

I don't care. Oh, no, I saw it. I saw. You know, I saw. Sure. I. As I was reading the description, I said, I wish I could take, like, suck this all back into my mouth and just pretend.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Whoa.

[Don LaGreca]

That this was never going to happen. Oh, hard. But it didn't happen. But let's see if we can do better. Jackson Dart on the first day of camp. I mean, it's been surreal up to this point, being Abdul, just talking about it and, you know, we kind of just hit us for the first time. You know, being out here wearing this jersey, it's an amazing privilege. So, you know, we definitely hold it in high regard. And you just want to continue to get better each and every day. And anytime you get to play football, I mean, that was. That was the Declaration of Independence compared to the first.

[Alan Hahn]

At least it was an Abdul Carter mentioned. That was nice.

[Don LaGreca]

He exists. I'll put it to a vote. Okay. Dart on how Dable coaches him. You want that?

[Alan Hahn]

No.

[Don LaGreca]

All right, how about. How about Abdul Carter goal to be great. No.

[Peter Rosenberg]

No.

[Alan Hahn]

I could have had a longer lunch hour.

[Don LaGreca]

1-800-9 1. And you know, it's my fault. I think some of this is actually quality. I forgive you, but we played 35 seconds of Brian Dable talking about the cadence of the snap.

[Alan Hahn]

But the clap. I get what you're saying, but people are legitimately concerned.

[Don LaGreca]

Well, that. These kids and those people need to be institutional.

[Alan Hahn]

Yes, they should.

[Don LaGreca]

This is a conversation to have. If he can't hear the snap on week four, we could talk about cadence. I'm not talking about cadence in May.

[Alan Hahn]

See, Peter, that's why clapping.

[Don LaGreca]

You see, by the way, that's.

[Peter Rosenberg]

That's a number of the name of Don's 11th book, Cadence.

[Don LaGreca]

There's no way to blame me. Listen, if anybody's mad at me, be. Or mad, be mad at me. It's my fault.

[Alan Hahn]

Cadence and May were like the name of Don's first two girlfriends, I think.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Oh, Cadence and May.

[Don LaGreca]

Yeah, sure. Like. Like stripper names.

[Alan Hahn]

Aren't you so disgusting? I brought up the Giants.

[Don LaGreca]

Sorry?

[Alan Hahn]

I brought up the Giants.

[Don LaGreca]

Listen, Alan gets an assist on it.

[Alan Hahn]

I do.

[Don LaGreca]

All right. Anthony gets an assist as well, because I. Secondly, at any point did you say I'm completely wasting my time?

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah. No, I legitimately think because of how viral that clip went.

[Don LaGreca]

What?

[Peter Rosenberg]

No, it did. Listen, hold on, Don.

[Alan Hahn]

I don't think you're understanding what's happening here.

[Peter Rosenberg]

No, Anthony's doing. Anthony's absolutely doing his job in the sense that not only is he doing the work, but that. Like this clip of Jon Gruden and Jackson Dart where Gruden was making fun of the fact that all he does as his snap count is clap the ball, clap his hands. Gruden was a little concerned about that. And that was a viral thing that was moving around.

[Don LaGreca]

Now it's football.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But that's. That's. That's ultimately.

[Don LaGreca]

What do.

[Alan Hahn]

We made fun of Kenny Pickett's hands.

[Don LaGreca]

Because that's funny.

[Alan Hahn]

That's actually funny. You're not going to be able to do this in an NFL game. You're going to need to do white 20.

[Don LaGreca]

Thing. I watched the whole thing and. But for all the questions I would have set it up to, saying that this apparently is something. It's a concern. But just out of. Now we know we're talking about cadence on May 9th.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah.

[Don LaGreca]

In the year of our Lord 20, 25. You want to make fun of something?

[Alan Hahn]

Make fun of the fact that the Giants trade up for a quarterback that somebody asked about, wondering if he's going to be able to do anything other than clap when it comes to a snap count. That's what you're concerned about.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I mean that's a reasonable thought also.

[Alan Hahn]

That's a problem.

[Peter Rosenberg]

We'll see.

[Alan Hahn]

Big problem. That's why he's not going to start right away. That's why you need Russell Wilson. This poor kid, all he does is clap.

[Don LaGreca]

I'm only concerned with my quarterback. If he has the clap. The fact that he's clapping right now, not a concern.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, why, why should him having the clop he be concerned?

[Don LaGreca]

Because then it just.

[Alan Hahn]

Donald had mono, but at least he didn't have the.

[Don LaGreca]

I'm just saying that he just needs. He's making poor decisions already.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Sure, sure. But having a good time getting there. You know what I mean?

[Don LaGreca]

Well, I don't know. I'm not there. I'm just saying I need a quarterback that can make good decisions. That's obviously some poor off the field decisions.

[Alan Hahn]

Let's grab a couple of calls, shall we? Feel good. Let's feel good about this.

[Don LaGreca]

Aiden in Brooklyn, you're on ESPN New York.

[Caller]

Yo boys, Huge fan. I think each of you guys are freaking awesome. I just got a quick point that I want to make. It's not really a point, it's just a bit of connective tissue here. From this Knicks moment to another New York sports thing. I was trying to think of, you know, applicable times that a New York team has gone up against the juggernaut and my mind just wandered. I'm a huge Mets fan. My mind wanders to 2015, the NLCS. Nobody in the world thought the Mets really had a chance of beating the Cubs that series. I remember the Cubs came in, it was their year 19. You know, the back to the future thing. 2015, year of destiny, yada yada yada. Lo and behold, the Mets sweep the Cubs. I'm not saying that the Knicks are going to sweep the Celtics, but where we are at this, you know what, where we are at this point, where we are at this point in time, it is not on the table.

[Alan Hahn]

It's love it.

[Caller]

It's on the table.

[Don LaGreca]

Right. So, so then similar.

[Caller]

This, this is, this is where things just, you know, if you're one of those people like me, I, I'm not the most superstitious guy in the world, but sometimes I do read the tea leaves. Who are the Mets playing this weekend? The Cubs. Oh, I do, I do think, listen, I do think if you were to be a person who read tea leaves that this would be something that you would say. Oh, that's an auspicious synchronicity.

[Don LaGreca]

That's Aiden wins. That is. You know what? You saved the show, Aiden. Great. No, seriously, because what happened before, I.

[Alan Hahn]

Just, I. Yeah, Dom was devastated. Now he's feeling.

[Don LaGreca]

Coming in on Monday. But you know, it's funny because when he's. When I saw what he wanted to talk about, I was wondering if he was connecting the dots to the Mets of last year.

[Alan Hahn]

That's what I was thinking.

[Don LaGreca]

Somebody had the Mets going to the league championship series, but he, that's. I like what he did there. That's as big as Pope Leo.

[Alan Hahn]

That's right there with Pope Leo.

[Don LaGreca]

Yeah, I think it's. I think it's absolutely right there. Now it's game time. Brought to you by Tullamore. Do Irish whiskey because gentlemen, when it's game time, give me the big one.

[Alan Hahn]

Come on.

[Don LaGreca]

I might want to hear a drop later of Peter saying I want the big one. The Mets start the series with the Cubs.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I knew what I was doing.

[Don LaGreca]

Following us on 880 at 6:30 and the Yankees will be out in sack of tomato. Yes, taking on the athletics at 1005 Tullamore Dew, the original triple distilled, triple blended and triple cast matured Irish whiskey. Be sure to grab a Tullamore Dew or try the new Tullamore Dew. Honey, during today's action, glasses up. To enjoying Tullamore Dew responsibly.

[Alan Hahn]

Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast. I don't want to know how the sausage is made, man. I just want to know. It's good here. More, more of Don Allen and Peter weekday afternoon starting at 3 on 8 80, ESPN, the ESPN New York app and your smart speakers.