Hour 3: Gary Myers joins the show

Summary

Don, Hahn & Rosenberg Podcast

Episode Hour 3 – Gary Myers Joins the Show
Date: January 7, 2026
Host: Don Hahn, Alan Hahn, Peter Rosenberg
Guest: Gary Myers (longtime sportswriter, host of "Saturday Huddle")

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Overview of the Episode

This episode centers on the NFL coaching carousel, with a particular focus on John Harbaugh's future, the New York Giants' coaching situation, and the unique pressures and considerations of coaching in New York. Gary Myers, well-known NFL writer and radio host, joins to share inside reporting, analysis on Harbaugh's potential landing spots, Giants organizational dynamics, and how the next days of the NFL playoffs may shape the coaching market. The discussion also touches on Giants ownership and front-office issues, alternate coaching candidates, and the state of local hockey (Islanders/Devils).

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. John Harbaugh’s Immediate Plans & Team Contact

• Harbaugh Not Interviewing Right Away:
  • Gary Myers reveals Harbaugh won't do interviews this week due to family obligations. (00:52)
  • "Harbaugh is not going to be doing any interviews this week... It's likely going to start next week. His daughter's in college, and because they're not playing this weekend, she must be on her Christmas break still." – Gary Myers (01:11)
• Teams Contacting Harbaugh’s Camp:
  • Confusion clarified over how many teams have reached out (directly and via search firms); estimate is “more than 6, less than 9.” (03:04)
  • Some teams with no current openings have reached out, including playoff teams possibly considering a move after disappointing finishes. (03:11)
  • Notably, some search firms do not disclose which team they represent, leading to “double dipping.” (03:05)

2. Harbaugh’s Fit with the Giants & Challenges

• Structure and Power Dynamics in Giants Organization:
  • Giants prioritize a separation between GM and coach since George Young's hire in 1979. Harbaugh is collaborative and not expected to demand full control over personnel. (04:01)
  • "The Giants are really clear that there's got to be a clear separation of powers. And I just. And I don't think John is the kind of guy that's going to come in and say, I need complete control of the personnel. I think he's a collaborator." – Gary Myers (04:04)
• New York Coaching Pressure:
  • Debate on whether “winning in New York” is an attraction versus the reality of “losing in New York.”
  • Myers compares media pressure in Dallas vs. New York, saying Dallas’ was even more intense, with New York’s volume being higher but often the “back page bark” is worse than actual reporting. (06:28)
  • “A lot of it is mythical... and a lot of coaches who come in here, they find that out pretty quickly as long as they act accordingly.” – Peter Rosenberg (07:38)
• Harbaugh’s Media Savvy:
  • Myers describes Harbaugh as polished and quotable, capable of handling the NY media spotlight, drawing contrast with his brother, Jim. (08:38)

3. Potential Obstacles and Other Openings

• Giants’ Risk of Losing Harbaugh:
  • Discussed whether other jobs (eg. Philadelphia or Buffalo if surprises happen) could draw Harbaugh away, but Myers downplays Philly and notes Buffalo or Miami could have intrigue if jobs open. (10:47)
• If Not Harbaugh, Then Who?:
  • Mike McCarthy floated as next most likely candidate, valued for experience commanding a room, though perceived as less exciting than Harbaugh. (12:59)
  • Kevin Stefanski is “admired for offensive design,” but hiring a fired Browns coach (esp. after Pat Shurmur’s history) is a tough sell to Giants fans. (14:17)
  • Mike Tomlin also discussed as a possible backup candidate if he leaves Pittsburgh, but more likely to go into TV if let go. (15:30, 17:25)

4. Joe Schoen’s (Giants GM) Security and Ownership Health

• John Mara’s Health as a Factor:
  • Myers discusses how Giants owner John Mara's health battle might be influencing the team's reluctance to make major front-office changes, with Mara “the biggest advocate for Joe Schoen.” (19:19)
  • Concern among potential coaching candidates about job security if Mara is no longer in a position to support Schoen, given succession uncertainty. (20:25)
  • “The fact that John is sick... might have contributed to the Giants not want to blow it all up again.” – Gary Myers (20:25)

5. Financial Negotiations for Harbaugh

• Harbaugh’s Future Salary and Offsets:
  • If Giants signed Harbaugh, the franchise could theoretically underpay due to offset language (Ravens would pay the difference), but co-hosts agree that’s not a “classy” approach and likely won’t happen. (23:01-24:18)

6. Coaching Staff Dream Scenarios

• Intriguing Coordinators:
  • A “dream scenario” is floated: Stefanski, if not given a good HC offer elsewhere, could join Harbaugh as offensive coordinator, creating a "dream team" staff. (25:25)
  • Kliff Kingsbury mentioned as potentially available for OC roles, but panel doubts he’ll attract a head-coach job this cycle. (25:29)

7. Precedent for Frenzied Coach Markets

• Unprecedented Harbaugh Demand:
  • Myers notes the overwhelming demand for Harbaugh is unusual—references that when Belichick and Cower became available, there was not nearly as much “frenzy.” (26:21, 27:54)
  • “...in all the years I've covered this, I don't ever remember a coach being in such demand, at least initially, like this, as Harbaugh has been.” – Gary Myers (26:21)

8. Listener Q&A and Commentary Recap

• Recap segment after Myers departs, hosts reflect on:
  • The likely pivot targets if Harbaugh doesn't sign: McCarthy seen as “less disappointing” than Stefanski due to championship resume. (35:58)
  • Tomlin would make history as the first Black head coach in Giants history—an important point for the franchise and many fans. (37:52)

9. Hockey Segment – Devils/Islanders

• Devils’ Historic Defeat:
  • Discussion on Devils’ 9-0 defeat to the Islanders, context for the historic loss, and why the coach left the goalie in through the blowout. (41:34-48:06)
  • “That might have been one of the worst goaltending performances I've ever seen.” – Don Hahn (43:27)
  • Alan asks if Don regrets not calling the historic (if ugly) game.
  • Analysis on Devils leaving Markstrom in goal—coach Sheldon Keefe says it was both about message-sending and goalie management with a busy schedule. (44:14, 45:00)
• Islanders' Turnaround:
  • Peter praises Patrick Roy’s coaching, holds up the benching of Mat Barzal for tardiness as a turning point for the franchise’s accountability and success. (50:00-52:37)

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Memorable Quotes and Moments

• Gary Myers on Giants' Power Structure:
  “The Giants are really clear that there's got to be a clear separation of powers. And I just... I don't think John is the kind of guy that's going to come in and say, I need complete control of the personnel. I think he's a collaborator.” (04:04)

• Peter Rosenberg on the NY Sports Media Myth:
  “A lot of it is mythical... and a lot of coaches who come in here, they find that out pretty quickly as long as they act accordingly.” (07:38)

• Gary Myers on Harbaugh's Media Savvy:
  “He's very cooperative. He's very quotable. He's just, he's a really, I really like him a lot. I've never covered him on, obviously on a day to day basis, but I've gotten to know him over the years and I think he's a really good guy.” (08:38)

• On Owner John Mara’s Health (Gary Myers):
  “The fact that John is sick and he's in the battle of his life and... I think that might have contributed to the Giants not want to blow it all up again.” (20:25)

• On Harbaugh’s Market Frenzy:
  “In all the years I've covered this, I don't ever remember a coach being in such demand, at least initially, like this, as Harbaugh has been.” (26:21)

• On Tomlin’s Historical Significance (Peter Rosenberg):
  “Might be the first black, first black head coach in Giants history.” (37:52)

• Don Hahn on Historic Islanders Win:
  “It's the worst law, worst shutout loss for the Devils since March of 1986 when they were beaten by the Rangers nine to nothing... That might have been one of the worst goaltending performances I've ever seen.” (41:48, 43:27)

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Important Timestamps

• 00:52 – Gary Myers begins: Harbaugh won’t interview this week.
• 03:04 – Explains number of teams calling, search firm confusion.
• 04:01 – Giants’ organizational philosophy, Harbaugh’s style.
• 06:28 – Discussion on NY media pressure versus other markets.
• 08:38 – Harbaugh’s approach with the media.
• 10:47 – Could other job openings lure Harbaugh away?
• 12:59 – Discussion of fallback options if not Harbaugh (McCarthy, Stefanski).
• 15:30 – Tomlin’s situation and future in Pittsburgh.
• 19:19 – John Mara’s health and its impact on Giants decisions.
• 23:01 – Financial offsets in Harbaugh’s hypothetical Giants deal.
• 25:25 – Dream staff scenario: Harbaugh with Stefanski as OC.
• 26:21 – Myers: unprecedented demand for Harbaugh.
• 35:58 – Hosts discuss best pivot if Harbaugh isn’t hired.
• 37:52 – Potential history of Giants hiring their first Black head coach with Tomlin.
• 41:34 – Switch to hockey: Devils’ blowout, Islanders’ turnaround.
• 44:14 – Sheldon Keefe explains keeping Markstrom in net.
• 52:00 – Peter recaps Islanders’ positive culture shift.

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Tone & Style

• Conversational, banter-heavy, but highly informed.
• Gary Myers brings reporting and insider perspective; hosts balance fan-level emotion with industry knowledge.
• Occasional humor and self-deprecation, especially regarding “mythical” status of NY sports markets and historic losing/winning.

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Summary Takeaway

The episode provides a comprehensive, real-time look at both the macro (NFL coaching carousel, Giants’ future, league-wide intrigue) and the micro (insider details on John Mara’s health affecting Giants moves, nuances in coach-team negotiations, staff-building strategy). Gary Myers’ reporting grounds the conversation, while the hosts’ insights contextualize both sports industry trends and fan sentiment, especially the unique nature of New York’s sports ecosystem. The segment ends with a passionate local hockey breakdown, again blending analyst expertise and hometown pride.

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For listeners looking to understand the Giants’ coaching search, contingencies beyond Harbaugh, and the ways in which local media and ownership realities shape outcomes — this episode is essential. It also offers a side of honest, impassioned New York sports talk true to the show’s spirit.

Transcript

[Don Hahn]

New year, same extra value meals at McDonald's. So now get two snack wraps plus fries and a medium soft drink for.

[Alan Hahn]

Just $8 for a limited time only.

[Don Hahn]

Prices and participation may vary. Prices may be higher in Hawaii, Alaska and California. And for delivery.

[Podcast Host]

This is the Don Hahn and Rosenberg Podcast.

[Don Hahn]

That sounds like heaven to me.

[Podcast Host]

Listen live weekday afternoon starting at 3 on 8 80, ESPN, the ESPN New York app, and your smart speakers, 502.

[Don Hahn]

In the big city. Don on Rosenberg with you until seven. Then it's Knicks and the Clippers here on ESPN New York. He's one of my favorite people. He's Gary Myers. He's got a show called Saturday Huddle that is usually on Saturdays, noon to 3. This Saturday will be on 4 to 7 after the St. John's game. Gary, Don Han and Rosenberg, how are you, sir?

[Gary Myers]

Oh, is that a standing ovation or just an ovation?

[Don Hahn]

I think it started out sitting and then they stood up.

[Peter]

Everybody just, everybody stood right up. The significance, I mean, they've been after reading all of your tweets over the last 24 hours, that's a standing ovation.

[Gary Myers]

Ah, thanks.

[Peter]

You have been a busy man, you guys.

[Don Hahn]

Oh, good.

[Gary Myers]

Harbor is not going to be doing any interviews this week.

[Don Hahn]

Okay.

[Gary Myers]

It's likely going to start next week. His daughter's in college, and because they're not playing this weekend, she must be on her, you know, the, the Christmas break still. And his plan right now is to take her back to school. And I thought he'd be in New England on Sunday night, you know, to support Jim when the charges play the Patriots. But as of right now, that's not part of the plan.

[Don Hahn]

So I figured everything.

[Peter]

Okay. Well, that's very interesting because there was some thought it could be as soon as this weekend. There was some thought maybe even tomorrow, but not, not diving into this right away, which makes sense.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah.

[Gary Myers]

Alan, unless something changes, which is always possible, there's nothing in their calendar with any team until sometime next week. All right, that's so, you know, we'll see what happens. And I do want to clarify one thing that I've been saying that nine teams have contacted the Harvard camp, Right. You know, six who are looking for coaches, not including the Ravens, and then three others. What was told to me like 15 minutes ago is that might be a little misleading, and I certainly didn't mean to be misleading. But some teams are calling, and those teams also have search firms who are calling. But when the search firms are calling, they're not identifying on whose behalf they're Calling like they're not saying I'm calling for the Giants or I'm calling for the Falcons. They're just calling to say, you know, know to feel out the harbor people about what his plans are. So some teams might be double dipping there.

[Don Hahn]

Okay.

[Gary Myers]

I hope I explained that.

[Don Hahn]

Well, no, you did because. So there could be a firm reaching out on behalf of a team that already reached out to.

[Gary Myers]

Right. But there are. I can say this for sure. There are teams that have reached out that currently do not have an opening. I'm just not positive who they are. So it is more than 6, but I think it's less than 9.

[Don Hahn]

So that's a lot. No. All right. Because these types of coaches don't grow on trees. And when they do become available, even teams with coaches have to kind of take a look and say, can we, can we upgrade? Can we be better? Especially some teams that are even playing in the playoffs that maybe have disappointing early exits. And that leads to my first question. Gary. I feel good about this. I think both sides want this to happen. What are some of the things can. That can stop it from happening for the Giants?

[Gary Myers]

Well, I know that John does not have a relationship with Joe Shane.

[Peter]

So.

[Gary Myers]

I, you know, I know him fairly well and I just, I have not spoken to him. I've tried to reach him in the last two days, but I haven't been able to that. I just don't think he's the kind of guy that's going to come in and say, I want you to get rid of the general manager because I have my own guy. You have to remember the Giants don't. Giants made a clear decision when they hired George Young in 1979 that the General manager and the coach cannot be the same person. The coach cannot control the general manager because that's what led to the Giants not making the playoffs from 1964 to 1990. 80. And they hired George in 79 is because there was no clear general manager. And so the Giants are really clear that there's got to be a clear separation of powers. And I just. And I don't think John is the kind of guy that's going to come in and say, I need complete control of the personnel. I think he's a collaborator. And I know that Shane is a collaborator. I also know that Giant fans are like up in arms of how he kept his job, but I don't see that getting in the way. I think Jackson Dart is a huge attraction for any of these coaches. And listen, let's face it. It is still the Giants. I mean, despite the struggles of the last 15 years, they have won eight championships over the years. They've been around for 100 years, and there's nothing like winning New York. I. We're all prejudiced about where we live, but talk to Eli about what it's like to win in New York and what it's meant to his life. And I think that John is the kind of guy that would embrace coming here and trying to win here with this franchise. But Gary don't see.

[Alan Hahn]

Yeah, no, I'm sorry, Gary, say, like, everyone does throw in the. What it's like to win in New York, and it is true. But what we've seen most of, basically across all sports in the last 15 years, is what it's like to lose in New York. And do you also think John has the. The appetite for that? Because. Don't get me mean. You know, I know Baltimore pretty well, and it's definitely a serious football market, but it is not quite the same. The Baltimore sun is not exactly the same as what he'll deal with up here.

[Gary Myers]

Of course. Yeah, I think he's like, I guess you're asking, does he have the stomach for it? And I think that he does. You know, there's pressure in every city. And I worked in Dallas for eight years, and I'm really telling you the God's honest truth here. There was more criticism and more pressure from the media in Dallas on the Cowboys than anything I've experienced since I've been. You know, I grew up here, but I was gone for, you know, most of the 80s. But I've been back since 1989, and there's been a lot of ups and downs. The jets have sucked all these years, but the criticism and the pressure was much worse in Dallas than it was here. And I'm telling you that from experience. I think what makes it hard here is the volume of the media and the back pages. But, I mean, Alan, you know, you worked for Newsday all those years. I always thought the bark of the back pages was much worse than anything that was under somebody's byline.

[Peter]

That was always the problem. Right. Like, you would have to answer to the headline writers when you're like. But did you read the story? Like, you're so right about that. The bark of the back pages was always part of the story. You know, it's funny, Gary, you say that, not to go off on a tangent, but I've talked other sports writers, other guys who have been in New York a long time. And we all kind of used to joke about the whole big, bad New York sports media thing. When, you know, look, when you, when it's, when it's due, you're going to get it in this town. But a lot of it, a lot of it is mythical. And a lot of coaches who come in here, they find that out pretty quickly as long as they act accordingly. And you would imagine that of all people, John Harbaugh had a podium in New York. He certainly would understand, would know how to handle it. He wouldn't be overwhelmed by it and doing some things that we've seen some other coaches do when they first get here and think, I've got to be aggressive right back in your face when we all know that's not how you do it.

[Gary Myers]

No, he's, he's very polished with the media. That one year they made the super bowl, he was very impressive. I mean, the year he went against his brother in the super bowl, you know, Jim was very distant and moody and not, wasn't like he was uncooperative. He just wasn't expansive. Where Don would be to ask these questions. And I've seen him do this even now, the Super Bowls. He would say to somebody, you know, thank you for your question. And then you go and answer the question. He, he's very cooperative. He's very quotable. He's just, he's a really, I really like him a lot. I've never covered him on, obviously on a day to day basis, but I've gotten to know him over the years and I think he's a really good guy. I think he's a really good coach. The key, of course, would be who his offensive coordinator would be and the problem. And everybody's painting that there's a problem with Lamar between him and John. I heard the problem was with Lamar and Todd Monkin, the offensive coordinator. And maybe John got defensive of his offensive coordinator. And that potentially could have been a problem with Jackson, but the problem itself was not between Lamar and, and Harbaugh. And now I, you know, I'm reading, oh, he lost the locker room. And I was watching Schefter today on Pat McAfee's show, and Adam was talking about how three players went in to John's office yesterday and they were like crying in his arms that he got fired.

[Don Hahn]

Right.

[Gary Myers]

So it doesn't sound like, like, to me like somebody who lost the locker room.

[Don Hahn]

No, it just ran its course.

[Gary Myers]

But he was also there for 18 years.

[Peter]

Right.

[Gary Myers]

You know.

[Peter]

Right.

[Don Hahn]

That's what's going to happen. Talk to Gary Myers. You could catch a show, usually noon to 3 on Saturdays, but this week it's going to be on a four because of St. John's all right, we've talked about it. What if the Bills lose? What if something goes sideways in Philadelphia? Is there another job that can open up that would become more attractive for John, and can that be a way the Giants lose a face off?

[Gary Myers]

Well, I mean, the thing about Philadelphia is you remember that John was Andy Reid special teams coach for a number of years. So he does know Jeff Laurie. But how do you fire a coach a year after winning the super bowl and getting back in the playoffs and having a home playoff game? I don't, I don't think that's. I don't think that's Jeff Laurie's DNA to do something like that. I mean, I don't particularly care for Sirianni, but I can't see the guy getting fired one year after blowing out Kansas City in the Super Bowl. Buffalo. I mean, I think McDermott deserves to be fired because with a guy who's been one of the two, three best quarterbacks in the league since, you know, he came in the league in 2018 and not to get to a Super bowl and to lose some home playoff games, and the playoff game he lost in Kansas City, when he had the lead with 13 seconds to go and had didn't have his kicker dribble the kickoff to waste time, instead kicked it in the end zone, Kansas City ties it and then wins it over. I mean, that was an, that was a fireable offense right there. So I think that is possible, although I just haven't really heard anything strong in that area that, you know, if McDermott loses in the first or second round, that he's gone, but I do think he deserves to be fired. Miami is another situation where they haven't hired a general manager yet. Troy Aikman, in another great conflict of interest story in the NFL is helping them hire their general manager. And who knows what's going to happen with Mike McDaniel after that. I don't know.

[Don Hahn]

Now it's just pretty credible that there are so many opportunities to kind of spring up here for these coaches. Yeah. So it looks like it's going to happen, but you never, you never say never. If it were to not happen, who else is. Who's Next? Is it McCarthy? Who would be the next in line if for some reason John Harbaugh would have slipped through their fingers?

[Gary Myers]

Yeah, I think the Giants have to hire a coach that has experience and they can walk in the room and command the room and have respect. So, I mean, McCarthy's record is really good. His first and last year in Dallas were bad. I think Dak, I know he got hurt in the last year. I'm trying to remember if the first year is the year that Dak broke his ankle against the Giants. If you remember that one.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah.

[Gary Myers]

But in between when 12 games in a row. I mean, 12 games. Not in a row. 12 games a season for three years in a row now. He didn't have playoff success. His record is very similar to Harbaugh's.

[Peter]

But every.

[Gary Myers]

Everybody's like really excited about Harbaugh and they go, oh, McCarthy, it's not very creative.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah, because they kill him in Dallas for not winning. Who's won in Dallas, Right. Since Jimmy Johnson? Who's won in Dallas? Yeah.

[Gary Myers]

I mean, their last super bowl just had their 30th birthday.

[Don Hahn]

That's pretty incredible.

[Gary Myers]

It is, it is. Now, I was talking to Phil Sims today. He really likes Kevin Stefanski.

[Alan Hahn]

He says, so does Alan.

[Gary Myers]

So is Alan.

[Peter]

I'm a big fan. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah.

[Gary Myers]

Phil said that Stefanski draws up amazing offenses, that he's just one of the best at doing that. Here's my problem with Stefanski is that the Giants have won seven games the last two years. The Browns have won eight. Can the, can the Giants sell to their fans that they're hiring a coach who just got fired by the most dysfunctional team in the league? I don't know Kevin Stefanski at all. I know he's two time coach of the year. He got the Browns into the playoffs twice, which is an amazing accomplishment. But, you know, they've been bad the last few years. And the last time the Giants hired a failed coach from the Cleveland Browns, it was Pat Shermer.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah, then. But I don't want to revisit that.

[Gary Myers]

Yeah, I mean, he was 9 and 23 with the Browns and he was 923 with the Giants. So he's pretty consistent, you know, not.

[Don Hahn]

In a good way.

[Peter]

Is there, is there, Gary? Because this is always coming up and we'll see the results of the weekend. Right. But is there, is there, is there a reason for the Giants to do any back channel stuff on Mike Tomlinson? So if something does go down in Pittsburgh, they're ready for that too.

[Gary Myers]

Oh, yeah, definitely. Because I never thought him just making the playoffs removes the pressure. And you know, the fans, they have really turned on him. I mean, they've chanted fire Tomlin, it one of the last games of the.

[Don Hahn]

Season, haven't lost.

[Peter]

Right?

[Gary Myers]

Well, they lost. They lost to the Browns in the.

[Don Hahn]

Bob. That's right, but still game and.

[Gary Myers]

Yeah, well, if the kid hits a field goal on Sunday night, how much changes? You know?

[Peter]

Right.

[Gary Myers]

But I don't think that Tomlin just getting to a wild card game necessarily changes what's going to happen in Pittsburgh. I think he hasn't won a playoff game since 2016. Everybody says, oh, you know, Mike Tomlin never had a losing season. All right, it's terrific. But how many times was the 8 and 8 or 9 and 7 or now 9 and 8 or 10 and 7? It's not like they've been, you know, one of the dominant teams in the league. And then the last 10 years, he hasn't won a playoff game. So I don't think that story has been written yet about Tomlin being back there next year. I don't think that's guaranteed, but I think there's a better chance of him going into television than taking another job right away.

[Peter]

Why do you say that?

[Gary Myers]

Still a relatively young guy now.

[Peter]

Why. Why did you. Why do you say that? Why would. Why would he do that? Like, because we were wondering a lot of time when you've been there, we've seen coaches. You coach for such a long time, you just want to take a break. Right. You've been doing it for so long, you take that year, you assess, think about things, and then maybe you'll dive back in. You know, Bill Cower never did that. Right. Billock never did that, but we thought maybe they would.

[Gary Myers]

Well, Billock wanted to. He just couldn't get another job.

[Peter]

He's couldn't get a job. Okay, fair. But why would. Why would Tomlin do that?

[Gary Myers]

Well, I think Tomlin is 53. Harbaugh is 63.

[Peter]

Right.

[Gary Myers]

If John. I think John wants to continue coaching, and it's not like he can sit out two years and then try to get back in it at 65, because then people start saying, oh, he's 65 years old and he hasn't coached in two years. So I think there's more of an urgency for him to coach. And he's in tremendous demand, as we've seen the last two days. Tomlin, I think maybe he just feels he needs a break, but then can get back in it. But then once you're out and you're making a ton of money in TV and you don't have to worry about the winning and losing anymore, I mean, that's why Cowan never got big. If you remember a year after Tomlin. I'm sorry. After Coward left the Dealers, he interviewed with the with the Browns and he was going to interview with the jets before they hired Rex. But Woody Johnson was on vacation someplace in Europe and Cower wanted a quick resolution and Woody wouldn't come back from vacation. So Coward said the hell with that. And he said I'm not coaching anymore. And he went back to CBS and has never interviewed since.

[Don Hahn]

That is typical.

[Gary Myers]

Are you really surprised about that?

[Peter]

Oh my. Does that not. That's it right there. That's it in a nutshell.

[Don Hahn]

There it is.

[Peter]

There's nothing more to say. That story right there is everything you need to know about why the jets are where they are now.

[Don Hahn]

Gary, I gotta ask you before we let you go, you're. You're in touch with everything. Where does the organization stand with John Maris health and what is the plan, you know, God forbid if he loses this fight and it is. Is it an issue within, you know, the Giants of, of making decisions and moving forward because of John's health?

[Gary Myers]

You know Donnie, it's obviously a very sensitive area but it's a really good question. And I've been told that John was the biggest advocate for Joe Shane and, and he's probably responsible when anybody else there probably even more than Steve Tisch because John's around him every day for Joe still having his job. I felt all along that the Giants would not have the stomach to change everything because you know when you change the general manager and Joe completely changed the scouting system and I know people have talked about he's modernized and computerized the whole scouting department. The Giants are really far behind. I think John, John's health might have contributed. Now I don't know this. I'm just trying to use a little common sense here.

[Don Hahn]

Right.

[Gary Myers]

I think John's health contributed somewhat to him not wanting to completely start over with a new general manager. At least in this case Shane is leading the search for the coach. If they got rid of Shane also, then what happens? Then John's got to be more involved than maybe he's capable of at this point to help find the general manager. Now Chris Mara is very, very capable and if his name was last name was in Mara, he would probably been the general manager of this team a long time ago. Parcel swears by him. So I think that the fact that John is sick and he's in the battle of his life and you know, everybody's praying for him. He's a Great guy. I've known him since the late 70s. I think that might have contributed to the Giants not want to blow it all up again. But I have heard this, and I heard this yesterday, that some candidates are a little concerned because they do know that John was the biggest proponent of, of shame. That if they take the job and things go poorly and, you know, God forbid, you know, like you say, John loses this battle, are they then going to be working for a general manager who could be let go because his biggest advocate, you know, is not there to support him?

[Don Hahn]

Right.

[Gary Myers]

Again, it's, it's really hard to talk about this.

[Don Hahn]

Of course it is.

[Gary Myers]

But it's, but it's, it's a legitimate. You asked a very legitimate question, Don. And I think that it's something that I would almost guarantee, you know, during this process that the Giants could have to address to these candidates because they're going to be concerned, you know. Okay, what is, again, hard to talk about, but what's the succession plan? What is the Marrow family, you know, have in mind? And listen, I'm playing. They don't have to worry about this for 20 years, you know, but we all are. But it's a realistic situation.

[Don Hahn]

And couldn't they solve that end of it by just giving Shane an extension?

[Gary Myers]

Yeah, but what does that really mean? John harbor signed a three year extension in March.

[Don Hahn]

That's true.

[Gary Myers]

And, you know, and they just blew him out. You know, the other thing to think about. Okay, I'd like to change this part of the conversation.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah, I get it.

[Gary Myers]

If I'm just kind of guessing now, I'm, I'm surmising that Harbaugh signed for like 15 to 17 million a year because that's kind of the going rate and all these coaches have offsets in their deal. So just for argument's sake, if the Giants signed up for $7 million a year, the Ravens would have to make up to 10 million. So the Giants, The Giants aren't the kind of organization that would do that. But they could really get away with not paying John a lot of money over the next three years because the Ravens have to make up the difference.

[Peter]

Yeah, but what's, what's the, like, what does that do for you? Like, there's no cap on it. Right? There's no, there's no reason to not show him.

[Gary Myers]

Well, I mean, if you, if you can save $30 million over three years, who doesn't want to do that?

[Peter]

I want to hire the guy. So I don't want a nickel and dime the last thing I would want.

[Don Hahn]

To do is get it anyway.

[Peter]

I know he's get you. How would you feel if I came to you, Gary? And I was like, you know what?

[Gary Myers]

I understand. And that's probably why they're not going to do it, because the Giants are a classy organization. I'm just saying that is a possibility.

[Peter]

Yeah.

[Don Hahn]

You know what?

[Peter]

It is for me. I wouldn't want to mess around with any of that if he said it to me. Hey, listen, don't worry about it. You know, pay me 5 million. They got to cover the rest, and then we'll redo this in three years when my deal's up down in Baltimore. Like, if he wants to stick it to Bishotti, which I don't think he does, but, no, I don't think so. I would let him bring that up or his agent. I would not want to do anything that would make him be like, what? What? You don't want to pay me? Oh, you. Oh, you want them to pay me to coach you? Like, like, that would make it feel, too. That feels like a jetsy move. That's Mickey Mousey. I wouldn't want the Giants to do that.

[Gary Myers]

Yeah, you're probably right, I guess.

[Peter]

No, it's interesting. It's interesting.

[Gary Myers]

One other thing I want to mention is another former Giant I was talking to today said that his dream scenario would be that Stefanski does not get an offer from a team that he really wants to go to, and then he comes here and works as Harbaugh's offensive coordinator. That, and then depending on who Harbaugh would hire as his defensive coordinator is plenty of good coaches out there on that side of the ball. That would be like a dream team for the Giants.

[Don Hahn]

Wow.

[Gary Myers]

Harbaugh is the CEO and Stefanski working with.

[Don Hahn]

Well, now you're talking.

[Peter]

I mean, that would.

[Alan Hahn]

Well, by the way, there's a world in which I could certainly see a world in which Kingsbury doesn't get a head coach offer as well. It would be interesting, which.

[Gary Myers]

Oh, I don't think he will.

[Alan Hahn]

Right.

[Gary Myers]

I don't see Kingsbury less. I mean, he's got, like, a short shelf life at all these jobs he goes to.

[Alan Hahn]

I found it a little bit weird, too. The mutual parting of ways without a job. Felt more like a firing, right?

[Gary Myers]

Yeah. I mean, they could just be doing that to save face. Then I saw a headline today that Dan Quinn didn't want to lose either of his coordinators, and he was forced into it. So you never know what to believe. And There were even reports yesterday that Harbaugh and Bishadi was a mutual agreement and go, well, that doesn't sound right. And then, like an hour later, the Ravens put out a statement where Bashadi admitted he fired him.

[Peter]

Yeah, you know, it's like nobody wants.

[Gary Myers]

To admit that he guy like harbor can get fired. 1. One of the things I'll tell you is that in all the years I've covered this, I don't ever remember a coach being in such demand, at least initially, like this, as Harbaugh has been. If you remember, just two years ago, Belichick got fired by the Patriots, and the Commanders and the Falcons were the only teams that showed any interest. And when Tower retired or left the Steelers, like I mentioned, you know, he made it clear he wasn't going to coach that next season, but the following year, only the Browns and the jets contacted him. So this is, to me, is somewhat unprecedented where, you know, within 15 minutes of this guy getting fired, every team that had an opening was in touch with the agent. And I think some teams were actually in touch with him before he got fired in anticipation, like, hey, if he gets fired, we're in on him. I mean, I. I do know of one team that did that.

[Peter]

So I'm trying to think of a coach, a prominent coach, who was let go, became a free agent, and it was like a frenzy because of, like, again, Jimmy Johnson. That was kind of abrupt. Right. And you would think there'd be a frenzy for him, and then just slipped my mind. There was one other that came to mind, and I thought, what happened, Gary, you know this better than anybody.

[Don Hahn]

What.

[Peter]

What happened after. Well, not Ditka. That wasn't like. There's a couple of coaches that you would think would have caused a stir. I would think that Jimmy would have been one of them.

[Gary Myers]

Yeah. I mean, Jimmy went to Dallas, you know, from University of Miami, and then when he left Dallas, Tampa, and. And the. And the Dolphins were interested in him. I don't know that anybody else.

[Peter]

Yeah, I mean, like, not Tony Gungy, right?

[Gary Myers]

Yeah, no, that never happened. Dungey got hired right away, but it wasn't like.

[Peter]

It wasn't a frenzy.

[Gary Myers]

People lining up at his door, and Jimmy made it clear that it was the Dolphins or nobody.

[Don Hahn]

Right.

[Gary Myers]

Because, you know, he loves South Florida so much. But I. You know, when Parcells left the. The Giants the first time, I mean, when he left the Giants, not the first time, but when he left the Giants, you know, he almost went to Tampa, but I don't remember. I mean, he, he, he wanted to go to Green Bay that time when Tampa was interested. But Ron Wolf, who's his best friend, really didn't want him. He wanted his own guy. And that's when he hired Holmgren. And then Bill left Hugh Culverhouse at the altar, if you remember that.

[Don Hahn]

Oh, sure.

[Gary Myers]

And so, you know, Bill never had like five teams interested in him at once.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah, this is pretty unprecedented.

[Peter]

Yeah, this is big.

[Don Hahn]

Gary, we gotta run. Thank you so much for this great show.

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[Podcast Host]

Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.

[Alan Hahn]

I didn't listen to anything you just said.

[Podcast Host]

Catch the show, demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcasts.

[Alan Hahn]

Ah, Don Han and Rosenberg, ESPN New York A lot to to dig into among those things though. Guys, how about this wild card round that has crept up and fanduel they're turning on playoff mode right now. All customers get a profit boost pack every NFL playoff game day. Each game day during the wild card round, you'll find a pack loaded with multiple profit boosts waiting for you in the app. Pick the matchups you believe in. Like I'm feeling the Bears these days. I'm sorry, I hate to say it Ballard, but I like the Bears. You choose what you want. Maybe you want to take your shot in an upset or build a parlay that fits the moment. Then apply your profit boost and go after an even bigger payout while the playoffs get rolling. So visit FanDuel.com, an official sportsbook partner of the NFL and grab your profit boost pack and every NFL playoff game day 21 and over physically present in New York Opt and required bonus issued as non withdrawable Profit boost tokens. Restrictions apply including any token expiration and max wager amounts he [e-mail] for help with the gambling problem, call 8778-HOPE N Wire Tex Open Y467 369 I almost thought we were going to give Gary and N just now.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah, there's a lot of variation.

[Alan Hahn]

He's got a lot of meat up there's a lot of meat on that bone.

[Peter]

Well, he's plugged in.

[Don Hahn]

And I feel like the grim reaper every time I talk about John's health. But you just heard Gary admit that it's. It's a thing.

[Peter]

Yep.

[Don Hahn]

And that Joe Shane is back because of it. That was the speculation we had back on Monday, guys, when Joe Shane was coming back, that it probably had to do with John's health. He was not given a contract extension. And I know what Gary means when he says, what does contract extensions mean? You know, you can fire guys, just eat the money, but it does. It would definitely send a message to all of these potential coaching candidates that they believe in Joe Shane by not giving him a contract extension. It sends the message off like, yeah, we believe in them, but if you got a problem with them, maybe we can. We can make an exception for you. And I would think John Harbaugh would be the guy that they would do that for. Or maybe it's just a case of, hey, let's bring a new coach in here, let's see how they get along with each other and will structure the contract as such. But, guys, no matter, you know, hearing Ian o' Connor on with K, hearing Gary Myers on with us, this sounds like it's definitely a thing. And that's why, and I mentioned it earlier in the show, that Stefanski would be okay. I'm not a huge fan, but I'd live with it if that was the case right out of the box in Harbaugh State, in Boston, of Baltimore, if you lose out on John Harbaugh for whatever reason, I think the pivot has to be McCarthy, because the resumes are pretty much the same. So if you got everybody high on Harbaugh, is it too big a drop to go to Stefanski now? I don't think how fans feel about it should be the reason why you make a decision. But don't you think from a fan standpoint, the better pivot, the less disappointing pivot would be McCarthy than Stefanski?

[Peter]

The less disappointing, yeah, because. Because of the championship resume. I think, regardless, right now, because of so much. There's so much hype, there's so much talk about it, there's so much they must. That there'll be a disappointment either way. You're not going to. You're not going to feel better. But I guess, like, would you say the lesser of the two? I honestly. Because you could make the argument about McCarthy that. Or the argument against McCarthy because of what's been said about him when he got the job in Dallas. They talked about the clock, management. He had to be better than what happened. He messed up managing the clock late in games until they had to get him a coordinator on the sideline to help him with the clock. So both of them are going to come, come with that disappointment because Harbaugh at this point now has just become a, it's almost become mythical. Right. In two days and now we're going to wait till next week. He's being smart. He's going to slow play this like it's. This is going to build up to something that will be a disappointment if you don't win. Now what has become a sweepstakes for the best coach available until Tomlin does and Gary. Another one. Gary's another one. Ian said it earlier. Jeremy Fowler has said this. There is a belief that it could come to an end in Pittsburgh with Mike Tomlin as soon as this week.

[Don Hahn]

There's more of a chance of Tomlin being free than McDermott.

[Peter]

Yeah, because he said he going to TV though. Yeah.

[Don Hahn]

He felt McDermott was deserving to be fired, but didn't say he's hearing anything, that he has to win this game this weekend. But that, that, that, that makes it interesting too. Like how many Giant fans would rather have Tomlin, Harbaugh and that would be an interesting pivot. Yeah, would ra.

[Alan Hahn]

I think, I think it'd be 50, 50 on Tomlin and Harbaugh.

[Peter]

I don't think you're wrong either way. You can't. The one thing Tomlin would make history.

[Don Hahn]

Might be the first black, first black.

[Peter]

Head coach in Giants history.

[Alan Hahn]

Well, and let's be. No, it's not nothing. And also to that point, Alan, there's a large chunk of the fan base that'd be very happy about that.

[Don Hahn]

Sure.

[Alan Hahn]

That's, that's something that's sort of been hanging over this team for a while. So I just, I now I'm sort of leaning more. This is bad. I'm leaning more. Tomlin, after reading that statement from Harbaugh yesterday, I was just like, what is wrong with this guy?

[Peter]

Oh, that is.

[Alan Hahn]

It made me like Tomlin a bit more.

[Don Hahn]

It was, it was certainly interesting for sure.

[Alan Hahn]

But the emoji, smiley face emoji in a statement was. It was new for a 63 year old man. Yeah, he wrote his, his recommendation for his first job. He wrote with a typewriter and now he's using an emoji. It was a bit weird.

[Don Hahn]

Now if you miss Gary early on he said don't expect anything this week. He's not going to interview till next week because his daughter is in college and he's going to deal with that. So he's not even going to go see his brother in the playoff game. So. And we figured all the interviews would be next week anyway, so I'm going to stick to my timeline of no sooner than next Friday, but it doesn't look like anything's going to be happening until until after the playoffs. And I also see the irony in that. Let's see what happens with Buffalo, see what happens with Pittsburgh.

[Peter]

Let's see things open up.

[Don Hahn]

What if, you know, shakes loose between now and it gives Tuesday morning because there's a Monday playoff game.

[Peter]

And you know what else too, Don? It gives the Giants time to get in other interviews so that when they do sit down with John, if they're like in full bloom, love to use an expression from the past of the Giants. Yeah, they can just slide the contract across the table and let's get this done.

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[Podcast Host]

The Don Hahn and Rosenberg Podcast.

[Alan Hahn]

I didn't listen to anything you just said.

[Podcast Host]

Catch the show on demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcasts.

[Don Hahn]

Game Time is brought to my Televordu Irish Whiskey because of what it's game time guys.

[Peter]

It's telly time.

[Don Hahn]

You betcha. It's Tommy's time trying to right the ship against the Clippers coverage immediately following us on 880 at 7 and the Nets will take on The Magic in Brooklyn as basically the family of Peter is going to be at the game today. Laura Stiles is going to be there. Natalie is going to be there.

[Alan Hahn]

That's right.

[Don Hahn]

And that'll be at 7:30 Tullamore due. The original triple distilled, triple blended and triple cast matured Irish whiskey. Be sure to grab a Tullamore Dew or try the new Tullamore Dew honey during today's action. Glasses up to enjoying Tullamore due responsibly. I did not do the game at UBS last night. That was an ESPN plus vehicle.

[Alan Hahn]

Now let me ask you then, Don, before you get into the details of this horrible atrocity of a game nine, is there any, nothing, any part of you that like, missed out on account of it being historic, even though it was historically bad for the Devil?

[Don Hahn]

Not a second, not a mill.

[Peter]

Really glad you didn't have to call that game.

[Don Hahn]

How about why Peter? I understand where you're coming from and I like where your head's at because.

[Alan Hahn]

It'S like you're not a fanboy.

[Don Hahn]

Who would have cried? It's the first time. No, but I'll explain it in a second. But the history of it, it's. It's the worst law, worst shutout loss for the Devils since March of 1986 when they were beaten by the Rangers nine to nothing. That. That 86 devil team was terrible. And that 86 Ranger team went to the conference final. It's up there with the 124 loss to Edmonton, which is renownedly known as the Mickey Mouse game back in 1983. It's a humiliating loss. So I understand the historical aspect of, hey, I was there. But to call that Peter would have been very, very difficult. And not from a fan standpoint, just from, you know, doing the job as the Devil announcer, as the Islanders are scoring goal after goal after goal. It just. It's awkward. What do you say? I felt bad for Matt and Chico on the radio having to call that. And the Islanders will start with the good Anthony Duclair with the hat trick. Tzikis was fantastic. But congratulations to Ilya Sorokin. Franchise record for shutouts as he top Chico. Reschico was in the building for that. He was spectacular because the devils did get 44 shots on goal. There were times early in the game where I thought they were the better team. I thought they were the better team. Allen, after one, it just. They got zero goaltending. That might have been one of the worst goaltending performances I've ever seen.

[Peter]

I mean, Markstrom shorts was stick side, right? Like they were killing him. Stick side. It was all short side. Those first. What? The first four goals were all the same place, weren't they? Now, defensively, they weren't very good. Devils weren't very good in front of him, but he was whiffing on a lot and it just started getting frustrating. But the Islanders were getting odd mans. They were just down the ice faster. And I don't know, man, it like, how do you leave him in the game? How do you pop? That's the part that I didn't get. It's like they're leaving him in. He's. He's obviously doesn't have it, and they're just smoking him. It's an absolute party going on in the building. You're embarrassing your number one goalie by leaving him in the game.

[Don Hahn]

Let's hear from Sheldon Keefe, head coach of the Devils, why you left Mark Stroman.

[Sheldon Keefe]

It's all part of it. I mean, my thought process on it is, like I said, I didn't like the quality of chance that we had given up, and Markey has been playing quite well for us and I thought deserved the opportunity to stay in, you know, through the first period and decided to go back out with him again in the second. And, you know, once that other one, next one goes in, for me now, it's just. He's got to own it. He's just got to battle through the rest of the game. So that's really it. But like I said, a lot of it was just the quality of the chance that we'd given up then the mistakes that were made leading up to that chance. I don't think it was fair. It would be fair to just put it on the goaltender in that case. And then once they start going in now, it's. Now it's too far gone. Now it's a. I don't want to put Jake in that game, in that situation, given that I need him the next time out.

[Peter]

How do you feel about that?

[Alan Hahn]

Went from giving him the benefit of the doubt to almost punishing him in. In one fell swoop.

[Peter]

It's. It really is amazing. Right, Peter? Because he's not wrong. Again, the. The quality scoring. They were in odd man situations. There was like, easy just up the left side. Duclair's goals were all. Almost the same goals.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah.

[Peter]

And it was all like, easy up. There's no real resistance. The Devil's defense has not been. Don knows this. I'll say it for him. Devil's Defense has been soft lately and the Islanders took advantage of it. And on top of it, we're beating them to the same exact spot every time. But to say after that, you gotta own it.

[Don Hahn]

What?

[Peter]

I don't want to put Jake in that situation. What?

[Don Hahn]

Well, here's the history, okay? Now, I was not here last year to know this for fact, but talking to people that he's not. He's not a guy known for pulling the goaltender. He pulled Markey earlier in the year, and Allen came in and ended up giving four goals up.

[Peter]

Yeah.

[Don Hahn]

So he doesn't. And the Devils have a game Thursday in Pittsburgh. I got a flight tonight to catch up with them in Pittsburgh. And then they play back to back games against Winnipeg in Minnesota. And Minnesota's gonna be a very emotional game, taking on Quinn and all that stuff. So you've got three games in five nights. But that, that, that Saturday is a quick turnaround. It's a. It's a one o' clock start local in Winnipeg. So Allen's gonna have to start one, if not two of these games.

[Peter]

Yep.

[Don Hahn]

So you put him in a game where your team's not playing well, he gives up a bunch of goals, it could affect his next start, which, you know, he's starting the next game. Yeah, I would. He's starting in Pittsburgh.

[Peter]

He's starting in Pittsburgh. There's no doubt about it.

[Don Hahn]

So I understand that logic, but you do get to a point where it's like, dude, this is this nine good.

[Peter]

I mean, at six, you probably. That's gotta be it.

[Don Hahn]

I would have. I would have had. I would have had Jake Allen start the third. It's five nothing. Now. Devil's had a power play, so maybe he's thinking, hey, we score on the power play, we make it 5:1.

[Peter]

Really?

[Don Hahn]

I think he was making a statement. I am not going to pull Jacob Markstrom early in this game because then it's going to make it look like it's his fault and bail out the rest of the team. So I think he was sending a message to the rest of his team. This is on you guys. Okay? Then at some point it got on Markstrom 2. All right, well, then you get to a point, it's like, you know, I could pull them with 10 minutes left. What are we doing? So I think he got caught betwixt in between, quite honestly. But because I know I asked him early in the season, I forget where we were about the play of the goaltending. And he said, can we stop with the goaltending? It's all about what's happening in front. When a goaltender wins, it's because the team plays well in front of them. When a goaltender loses, usually is because they play poorly in front of him. So he was saying. I think Sheldon's very good with this. That he gets his message across without specifically saying it is that, hey, we lost because of the guys up front. I don't want to bail. I don't want to always make it seem about the goaltender. And I think early in the game, it was, hey, this isn't about Markstrom. This is about us giving up on me, on rushes. We're not playing well. Then it became, as he said, then it was on market because now, because. Come on, five, nothing going. You gave four more goals. Like, that's bad.

[Peter]

It was. It was. Well, that was. That felt like a white flag. Like, that almost felt like. Like.

[Don Hahn]

And what I thought of Alan was what happened to Patrick Wa.

[Peter]

Oh, yeah.

[Don Hahn]

In Detroit, in Montreal all those years, Detroit, where. That was how he got. How he got traded. I'm never going to play for you again. Because they didn't pull him and embarrassed him.

[Peter]

Yeah. And they went right up to. Who was the. Was it Mario Tremblay? Like, he went right up to.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah. Said, I'm not playing.

[Peter]

First went to the coach, then right to the gm, said, I'll never play for this.

[Don Hahn]

Or that's Sergey. I'm trying to remember who the general manager was, but the way it was at the old 4 Peter that, like, right behind the bench. Right behind the bench is where the general manager sat. So he whispered something to the gm, like, went to tromble, sat down, and what he said was, I've just played my last game in Montreal. And they ended up having to trade him to the Avalanche later that season. And that was it. It's that. That's epic. But it's also. Think about this, Alan. All those amazing dynasty teams during the Islanders. 19 straight series wins. Yeah. Never blew a team out by that many goals.

[Peter]

It's hard to believe is that you're.

[Don Hahn]

Telling me they didn't beat the Golden Seals at, like, the Coliseum, 10 nothing.

[Peter]

I know. I thought they had an 11. 11, two. Like. I thought there was something somewhere, though back then they were putting up double digits sometimes they were so damn good. I do want to. You had the devil's side. Is the devil side. I do want to give an Islander side to this whole thing. Right. But look, it was a big win, but no trophy was raised. But when a trophy is raised, it can Feel like the season's over. But on the ESPN app it never really is. Because with more than 47,000 live events, plus originals highlights, coverage from every corner of the sports world, there's always something to dive into. Plenty of hoops to watch, no off season, just everything a fan needs to keep going. Always in season, get all of ESPN all in one place. Download the ESPN app on your TV or phone today.

[Don Hahn]

That was very nicely done.

[Alan Hahn]

Thank you. He's very professional.

[Peter]

The islander side of this thing though, needs to be said and that is that Patrick Waugh has done. Speaking of Patrick Waugh, the head coach, he has done a tremendous job this year. Matthew Darsh, at the very start of this thing, you could see that the franchise changed. And I'm telling you the moment, and we did mention this when it happened, I feel like the moment the season turned, we're all giving Matthew Schaefer a lot of credit for his impact. The 18 year old defenseman who is probably going to run away with the Calder should be considered for Norris. He's been, he has been a force multiplier. He has been a franchise changer. Can't deny that. However, when they benched Matt Barzel for missing a morning skate, for being late to it and it was something that clearly had been happened before and they said enough's enough, you're supposed to be one of our leaders and you can't do this. And so you're. They scratched him and that's embarrassing for a star to be scratched a healthy scratch. Since then he has been such a dynamic player. He has been an all star. He has played great. He has given you an honest effort every night. Something changed in that organization that day, Don. Something changed. And as they got healthy and as of course again Schaefer and his impact and what he's done as far as just the effervescence of a young talented player that gets the old vets to kind of get out of their country club ways and now they feel like, you know what, we're, we're a damn good team and, and they obviously get great goaltending. Something special happened there in that moment and I know Patrick Wall was at the front and center of that. I do think Darsh had something to do with it as well. And that building, you know, someone said it on social media when they talk about, I think it's seven straight sellouts now at ubs and some people get to be like surprised, like, oh, they only come out when the team's good. No, they come out when the team gives them a reason to come out. That's why the franchise could have never left Long island, because there's always been support there. But they have given you years where there's no reason to sit in traffic and be miserable and spend your money for a team that wasn't given the effort that you would expect. There's a high standard that happened in the early 80s, and they have that standard back. And it all started because they held their best player accountable. It cost them a game, but they didn't care. We're not going to do this here. And that, to me, is where things really turned. And that's why I tip my cap. That Darsh has been great since he took over, but Patrick Wag deserves a lot of credit for the coaching that he has done with this team, and they are a team to watch as we get close to the playoffs.

[Podcast Host]

Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.

[Don Hahn]

I don't want to know how the.

[Peter]

Sausage is made, man. I just want to know. It's good.

[Podcast Host]

Here, more of Don Allen and Peter Weekday afternoon starting at 3 on 8 80, ESPN, the ESPN New York app, and your smart speakers.

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