← Don, Hahn & Rosenberg
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- [00:02]
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- [00:31]
Don LeGreca
This is the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.
- [00:35]
Alan Hahn
That sounds like heaven to me.
- [00:36]
Don LeGreca
Listen live weekday afternoon starting at 3 on 8 80, ESPN, the ESPN New York app and your smart speakers.
- [00:44]
Peter Rosenberg
All right, it's a big five o' clock hour. We go with Don Legreck. I'm Alan Han. Don Han, Rosenberg, ESPN New York. We got your calls at 800 now 1-93776. We are awaiting word from the Knicks, although nothing is official yet. So we'll wait and see when they make the official announcement. But all indic from several reports that Mike Brown will be the new head coach of the Knicks. He will take over for Tom Thibodeau, and he will do so facing a ton of pressure for a team that expects to win now. And it's hard to imagine, like any coach stepping into a situation with this kind of pressure, but he will do that. Joining us right now is an old good friend of mine. And I mean an old friend, not an old man, but an old friend of mine. But more importantly, Don, he's a Hall of Famer Kurt Gowdy award winner for his work at 30 years covering the NBA a long time. And one of the good people in this business that, of course is the terrific Mark Spears.
- [01:45]
Alan Hahn
Hey, Mark.
- [01:49]
Mark Spears
Man, that's all right. I need that everywhere I go, brother.
- [01:52]
Peter Rosenberg
He said, that's all right. Yeah, you could say hall of Famer. I mean, that's, that's the only way you should be introduced from now on. How you been?
- [02:00]
Mark Spears
I'll take it, man. No, I'm. You hear my voice, man. I've been on the road for a while. I went to the basketball Africa League in Morocco in early April and basically traveled the whole playoffs, went to the draft. So I was just out your way. Was in LA for NBA Today. These are first world good problems. And so now I'm just trying to get my voice back, man. I love you. So if you ask me to come on, you know I got, I got to do it.
- [02:30]
Peter Rosenberg
It's my guy. I asked him and he said, only for you. And I appreciate you for doing it and I know everybody, all of our NBA people, it is, this is the busy time and once you get to the point where the draft is over, everyone wants to try to shut it down as soon as they can. So I appreciate you, but this is important business mainly because of stuff that I, I did hear you talk about when it comes to Mike Brown. So I hope now that your voice is here all over the New York Tri State area is tell everybody here about what they're getting in Mike Brown and what Mike Brown knows he's walking into here in New York.
- [03:06]
Mark Spears
Well, you know, at first perspective, Tibbs, man. No, Tibbs real well as well. I was in Boston covering the Celtics in 08 when they won, when Tibbs was an assistant. So, you know, shout out to him and the job he did and. But in terms of Mike Brown, man, like, Mike is an extremely impressive guy. He's always going to be ready. He's a military guy. His dad was in the military. I think Mike was actually born in Germany on a base. And so everything with him is really meticulous. Everything is really scheduled, everything has a purpose. And so I know that he's been studying the Knicks for a while, you know, and it's probably in much more, you know, after Thibodeau was departed from the team. But I can't think anybody that probably went into that interview more prepared on what to do and what to not do with the team going forward. And you know, he's been in two of the toughest situations I've, I've seen. He followed Phil Jackson, hey, good luck to anybody trying to do that. Follow them in L. A And then you go to Sacramento, who hadn't been to the playoffs in almost 20 years and basically was a laughed at franchise. And he, he rebuilt it, got him into the playoffs and I think they're firing in was a mistake. Kind of had an emotional losing streak and you know, ended up letting them go. But I think the Knicks certainly realized that, hey man, this is, this is a really, really talented coach. And I think the Mike Brown that you see now is from Sacramento, was a lot better coach than you saw in Cleveland, than you saw in, you know, la. And I think the reason, because of that is because of his time with the Golden State warriors, you know, working with Steve Kerr, learning to, you know, I think before, you know, Mike, that was his whole life. And I think for Tibbs, in a lot of way, that was his whole life too. But you know, I think Steve Kerr showed, you know, Mike, how to have some work, life balance, how to have fun, how to build relationships with the players. And I think Mike does a great job of that as well. So under the circumstances of the Knicks situation, I think he definitely brings calmness and a steadiness back to the franchise that was certainly in disarray and confused when they let Thibodeau go.
- [06:00]
Alan Hahn
And you just described in LA and Sacramento how he should be able to handle the pressures of New York. But it is a unique situation. Right, Mark. Of not just coming to New York.
- [06:10]
Mark Spears
Yeah.
- [06:10]
Alan Hahn
A team that hasn't won in 52 years, but also now the expectations of take us to the next level. We just lost in six games in the conference final. Now anything less than that is going to look like he. He failed. It's tough to. In your first year. All right, take us to the promised land.
- [06:28]
Mark Spears
Yeah, no, I, you know, and I mentioned that to him when he was going through the interview process, scared of it. I mean, nothing's bigger than New York, right? Number one market, number one media pressure. But I mean, he worked in la. He knows what it is. I just hope that from a PR standpoint, from a franchise standpoint, they just let him be him and not try to control him, you know, not pit him against the media, because that's not what Mike is. He's certainly a media friendly guy, wants to talk to the media, build a relationship, let people know what's going on. I mean, Alan, you know, he's. But I've seen guys like Isaiah come there and, you know, other coaches come there and then all of a sudden they kind of change because, you know, the franchise, you know, forces them to change and kind of be media unfriendly and standoffish. And, you know, I hope they don't make Mike be that kind of guy, because that's not his way. He's a really, really likable guy, great sense of humor. Somebody, I think could be a media darling in New York if the franchise allows him to just be him. So I do hope they allow him to do that because I do think that he's very, very open into why a team is struggling and what they need to do better, you know, being transparent. And maybe perhaps that got him in a little bit of trouble in Sacramento, was he was, hey, this is what this person and this is what we're not doing. Right. And I guess maybe they wanted him to take more bullets and be. Be honest. But I do think that the Knicks are not only getting a good coach, but a really good person.
- [08:32]
Peter Rosenberg
As well, you mentioned Sacramento, Mark, and, and that I'll never forget. You know, that's a franchise. Like you said, they hadn't made the playoffs. What was it, 16, 17 years, whatever it was, he comes in there and it's like his press conference was kind of motivational. Like he came in, I came here to win. Like he, I'm here to win. And he kind of set this standard of an expectation of this is what we're going to do. He comes into a ready made situation here where it's a franchise that for the first time since the early 90s have won back to back 50 wins, got to the conference finals, which they haven't done since 2000. So it's 25 years since they've done that. The expectation, especially when you consider what the east looks like, the landscape of the east right now with the injuries and everything else, you know, for the Knicks, whether Tom Thibodeau was here or not here, the belief was this team should go to the Finals. Like that's something that I think for him, for a guy like Mike Brown, certainly can't shy away from it. Right? Like this is something that you look.
- [09:39]
Mark Spears
At the landscape next season. Right? Yeah. I mean, you can make an argument that the Knicks should, should be in the Finals because I do look like, like the two, you know, additions that they had in the offseason, adding some shooting and look, what are the Bucks going to be? What are the Celtics going to be? What is Indiana going to be? Right. I mean, obviously Cleveland certainly could be back with a vengeance. But no, I mean, I think the Knicks certainly have an opportunity to get there. But you know, when a new coach comes in, obviously there's some typically, some growing pains in the beginning figure out best. But just having New York, whether their championship expectations or not, comes with pressure. Being there comes with pressure. But there was pressure in coaching LeBron James, right? There was pressure. Kobe Bryant. Yeah, there was pressure in coaching a downtrodden franchise that hadn't been to the postseason in two decades, almost two decades. So that's why I said I don't think he's intimidated by this. Like, it's not that he doesn't. I know he respects it. I know he knows the level. I know he knows New York. Everybody knows the history. You guys keep beating us down with it. Us as the media, we beat everybody down with it. We know the talent is there. You can't control injuries and what happens. But on paper, no, this is a Finals team. And my point is, I just, I don't I think he respects what it is. And instead of shying away from it, I see Mike coming in and saying the same thing you're saying this team should be in the final. And that is the expectation because he was trying to give a championship mentality to that had far less talent. Sacramento do I know, based on the talent he has there, based on the east landscape, he's not, I don't. I can't see Mike shying away from the prize that New York has been coveting. I could see him embracing it and basically telling the players that we, yeah, that's it should be championship or bust.
- [12:00]
Alan Hahn
Talking to Mark Spears here on Don Han and Rosenberg, you brought up LeBron James. We've been talking about it the last couple of days. If LeBron wants it, Mark, do you see an avenue where the Knicks could be a fit for him?
- [12:14]
Mark Spears
He, I, I don't think he's going anywhere. I mean, to me what's set up is a tailor made retirement, you know, goodbye tour. You know, he's in the last year of his deal, didn't get a new deal. The All Star Games in Los Angeles, it, to me it just seems prime for this is a great way to, you know, finish up. So I'm not saying he's retiring or this is it, but, you know, I, I wouldn't be surprised if being his last season. I don't know him like that. He ain't telling me that. So this ain't something though. Yeah, this is just, I think based on him like just opting in and I mean, not opting to get a new deal. Things that you, you know, came out on social media about, I guess, how the wife feels about things. And it just seems like a Hollywood movie to end next season to me. That'd be my guess.
- [13:22]
Peter Rosenberg
Yeah. The writing.
- [13:24]
Mark Spears
That is not, that's not. He ain't told me nothing. Rich Paul ain't told me nothing. My educated guest, he does not run to the.
- [13:34]
Peter Rosenberg
Spears is great. He does not want to be in your content. He does not want you. He is not telling you any news and nobody. I love it. Because we know how this all works, right? We understand that. You say something and everybody just runs with it, especially somebody with your credibility. We're talking about Mark J. Spears, senior NBA writer for us at ESPN and Scape. He does terrific work. You see him on the networks as well, throughout the NBA season and of course throughout the playoffs. And he's a Hall of Famer as well. I promised you 15 minutes. Just one more question. Just in regards to what you're saying, if that's the way it goes with LeBron and they talked about wanting to play on a championship caliber team, that Laker team. When you look at the west, it's hard to put them up there as a team that could get out of the West. I know we have the Thunder. Who to right now after seeing some of the moves that were made in early, part of free agency and some trades and the draft. Give me the team that you feel is the best team in the west that could take on the Thunder.
- [14:39]
Mark Spears
Well, I'm a preface it by saying to you as well when you think about trades. New York making a trade. Right. With Minnesota. When was that trade made? First week of camp. Yeah, I'm not, I'm not going to like that the Lakers aren't going to improve their roster. There's still a lot of time and I think we get so excited about oh to start a free agency and got to do something now. Like, you know, the Kaminga situation in Golden State hasn't been settled yet. Durant's trade is probably going to get bigger. Like there's still a lot of time and a lot of time for teams to do things. So I think we had yet to kind of put that into perspective too, which is why I mentioned the Cat, you know, Julius trade. But if we're going to base on right now, like I have a lot of respect for what Houston has done, but man, Denver is really, really intriguing to me. Really, really intriguing to me with what they did. The one thing that might have given a little bit of hit, Valencia thinking about going back overseas to Europe to play instead of reporting to Denver, which certainly makes that trade curious. With the Kings, their additions, you know, getting Cam from the Nets I thought was huge. Getting Brown adding to their bench, I really look like what Denver did and I was there when they lost in game seven, you know, to okc. So they certainly can compete with them. So to me, I think the Denver Nuggets are probably the biggest scare right now.
- [16:25]
Peter Rosenberg
Yeah, you saw too what Lou Dort said, right. The team that, that shook them a little bit was the Nuggets. That does say something.
- [16:34]
Mark Spears
They still got. They still got big fella there. Yeah, yeah, he got reinforcements. They made their team better. I really think that Denver could be like the thing with Houston, they still. You add in KD and you're adding a lot of other pieces. They still got need time to gel I think for, you know, Cam Johnson, he just has to fit in. Right. So I think they're going to come out swinging. They're going to have a great record. They're going to be better defensively. They have a deep, deep bench. Whatever they got to do to convince Valentine's Wayne is to stay in Denver and they need to do. But no, the Nuggets are going to come back rested with a chip on their shoulder, trying to. Trying to change things. But one thing I am keeping an eye on, man, like with this Damon Lillard situation, I do as crazy it might sound here that he could be ready by the time All Star break comes. What if he joins Minnesota? What if he joins Golden State? Like, what kind of addition could. Could he be? So, you know, keep an eye on the Damon Lewis situation as well.
- [17:49]
Peter Rosenberg
That'd be amazing to come back that soon. But, you know, these days, again, you never know. And there's a couple of them with the Achilles. Like you don't know if Boston just hangs around long enough. Is Tatum available?
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Mark Spears
Yeah.
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Peter Rosenberg
You know, in time for playoffs.
- [18:03]
Mark Spears
And Danes considering Boston too.
- [18:06]
Peter Rosenberg
Boy, there would not be something. Right. Because they. They definitely have a need now at that position. Yeah. Right now the east looks like opportunity is there. Like I've said this because you remember, you go back when Michael Jordan went into baseball, retired the first time, went to baseball, and you know, the Knicks were running into the Bulls like year after year, could not get past Jordan, couldn't beat Jordan, and he steps out. And that was when Pat Riley said, okay, we're going to be the first team on. They did a Midnight Madness practice to start that season. 93, 94. And he said to his team, we're going to be the first team. I'm going to be the last ones off. They knew there was opportunity with that guy away. Right. With him gone. And I don't think the east has ever looked as gettable as it does this year. And that's probably why there's a lot more urgency in our organization. Like, let's say the Knicks or pretty much them. If you think about it like, I would have had a little more.
- [18:59]
Mark Spears
I'll tell you what, don't. This is. New York's gonna laugh at me. But don't sleep on the Magic.
- [19:07]
Peter Rosenberg
Oh, I agree.
- [19:07]
Mark Spears
Well, don't sleep on the Hawks. You know, they're gonna be interested.
- [19:11]
Peter Rosenberg
Yeah, no, it's. Nobody's saying that. It's a. It's a road paved in gold. But if there's no Boston and the Pacers, who are thorn on your side, are also.
- [19:20]
Mark Spears
It's for the Knicks to get. Yeah, you know that.
- [19:22]
Peter Rosenberg
Yeah. So we'll see if they do. Listen, thank you for the time. Rest that voice, man. I appreciate you, as always.
- [19:29]
Mark Spears
Take care, Mark. I swear I sound cooler than this. I promise.
- [19:34]
Alan Hahn
No, no, you sound. You sound like Barry White that you can't get. Cooler than that.
- [19:39]
Mark Spears
All right, guys.
- [19:40]
Alan Hahn
Appreciate you, Mark. Mark Spears does a great job covering the NBA. I'm glad that last part happened because we do almost make it like a fait accompli, like there's nobody else in the East. Well, you know, certainly the Hawks got better. The Magic certainly can improve, and Cleveland's still there, too. So I get. Some of the big dogs are out, but there's still work to be done. But I'm glad you said it the way you said it. There's a path. It's not paved in gold. It's not. It's not all downhill, but it does seem to be as open as we've seen it in recent memory.
- [20:14]
Peter Rosenberg
Yeah, we keep. We keep kind of glazing over the calves, mainly because they don't have physical injuries. We just keep looking at the Cavs and wonder if it's more of, like, you know, like, are they mentally strong enough? Because they're just. They hit the second round, then something happens to them. It's their kryptonite. They got to get over it. So until they prove it, we're going to almost, you know, not believe in them right now. But they still are a very good team, a 61 team. So, you know, there's. There certainly is that interesting, what he said, though, about LeBron. No, no, he's not reporting anything, but he. Look, when you cover the league as long as him. And I can tell you, this man is as connected and plugged in as anybody I've ever met in the sport. And he keeps it low key. He is not a guy that's out there telling the world all the stuff he knows. If you ask him, he'll tell you that's how he is. And his. His instincts telling him it's a LeBron farewell tour with the Los Angeles All Star Game and all that stuff. It's an interesting, Interesting perspective.
- [21:12]
Alan Hahn
No, it is, but you never know. It's something that I think is going to keep us very, very entertained during the course of the summer.
- [21:19]
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- [21:37]
Alan Hahn
You can Venmo this or you can Venmo that. You can venm.
- [21:43]
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- [22:20]
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- [22:50]
Don LeGreca
Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.
- [22:54]
Alan Hahn
I didn't listen to anything you just said.
- [22:55]
Don LeGreca
Catch this show on demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcasts.
- [23:03]
Alan Hahn
Game time is brought to you by Telemardu Irish Whiskey because when it's game time, Alan.
- [23:18]
Peter Rosenberg
I like when he holds it.
- [23:19]
Alan Hahn
The Mets finish up their series with the brewers coverage immediately following us on 8:80 at 6:30 and the Yankees, they'll finish up their four game set in Toronto with the Blue Jays at 7:07. The Liberty play host to the Sparks at 7 and NYC FC faces Toronto FC at Yankee Stadium at 7:30. Tullamore Dew. The original triple distilled, triple blended and triple cast matured Irish whiskey. Be sure to grab a Tullamore Dew or try the new Tullamore Dew Honey during today's action, glasses up to enjoying Tullamore Dew responsibly. All right, help me out, Alan. Aaron Boone spoke for the game today up in Toronto and the topic of Parraza was addressed about, you know, what are you going to do with him?
- [24:00]
Peter Rosenberg
He's in a lineup tonight.
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Alan Hahn
Second base.
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Peter Rosenberg
Yes, he's playing second and Jazz playing third. Hang on A second. So he's in the lineup tonight playing second. Who's playing third?
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Mark Spears
You know what? I don't know.
- [24:10]
Peter Rosenberg
It's Jazz.
- [24:11]
Alan Hahn
Jazz is playing third.
- [24:15]
Peter Rosenberg
Why would you. I hate it here. Yes. I want to go home. Yes.
- [24:20]
Mark Spears
Okay.
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Alan Hahn
Here's what Boone said about Paraza playing second base instead of third. He says, I don't want to just move them back and forth and do that necessarily in that form or fashion. He doesn't play.
- [24:35]
Peter Rosenberg
Okay, I get it. You get it? I do. I understand.
- [24:39]
Alan Hahn
Okay, then explain it to me.
- [24:41]
Peter Rosenberg
All right, so what he said, because I'm defending Boone here.
- [24:44]
Alan Hahn
Okay, interesting. I wasn't expecting this.
- [24:48]
Peter Rosenberg
I'm defending him here for this reason. This is not a long term change. This is not a. You know, Peraza is not now becoming like an everyday position player. They're probably giving LeMayhue a day off.
- [25:00]
Mark Spears
Right.
- [25:02]
Peter Rosenberg
So rather than put Jazz at second for one game where he's still trying to get back a rhythm from playing third, leave him at third so that at least it's consistent. So that does make sense. I will say this. It does make sense. As much as I want to rip my hair out about this stuff, I. First of all, I know deep down in his heart of hearts that Boone doesn't want to play Jazz at third and understands that this is not good for him.
- [25:32]
Alan Hahn
No, I understand.
- [25:32]
Peter Rosenberg
They tell him that's where you should play him, so he does it. Okay, but now I understand, I think. But Boone, as a former player also knows I can't. Jazz is from. Since June 30, 25, 26 games he's played third base. If I just. Now, hey, tonight you're gonna play second, but then on Friday you're going back to third. No, just stay at third. Just get into a rhythm, stay consistent. I'm not messing with you, Peraz. I don't care. He's jumping in. Just, just. You're a utility, infield, infielder, Be a utility guy. Wherever I put you, you play that. I understand if this was. If, if, like, let's say lemayhue had an injury and he's going to be out for two weeks. Different story. But, but it's a one game deal. Yeah, I wouldn't mess around with Jazz either.
- [26:17]
Alan Hahn
Well, he didn't say, I don't want to just move him back and forth. He said them.
- [26:21]
Peter Rosenberg
Well, he. That's because again, that's what you do. You always make it a.
- [26:25]
Alan Hahn
Here's the thing, here's the thing.
- [26:26]
Peter Rosenberg
Alright?
- [26:27]
Alan Hahn
You explained it very well. Why did it make sense to you.
- [26:31]
Peter Rosenberg
Before you start, did what I say.
- [26:32]
Alan Hahn
Makes sense to you, but then say that. If he says that, then that makes sense. What you said to me makes sense.
- [26:38]
Peter Rosenberg
Okay.
- [26:39]
Alan Hahn
But also reading it deeper, going back to what Michael said during his show, that they're more likely to trade for a second baseman than the third baseman is. Jazz is your third baseman.
- [26:48]
Peter Rosenberg
Yeah.
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Alan Hahn
So even, even based on your explanation of it is why would I move Jazz to second? He's our third baseman. I'm not moving him back and forth. If we make a deal, it's not going to be a third baseman where he's going to go back to second. That ship has sailed. He's our third baseman.
- [27:01]
Peter Rosenberg
Yeah.
- [27:02]
Alan Hahn
So when there's a chance to rest, dj, maybe it makes sense to have everybody play the position they should because maybe for that day we'll be better defensively. But he's my third baseman, so why would I move him?
- [27:13]
Peter Rosenberg
Yeah, that's it.
- [27:14]
Alan Hahn
So, but the question is why? Why are you so married to making him your third baseman when you could probably, on occasion at least strengthen your defense by having him play his most natural position? Why are you force feeding him someplace where it looks like he's not ready to play? And I don't even think it's about reps. That's just not where he's played. You know, and you've got guys like, Hasn't Rice played first? Hasn't he caught? Wasn't there times Judge played right field? He also played left field, played center.
- [27:46]
Peter Rosenberg
Yeah.
- [27:47]
Alan Hahn
You've moved guys around. Remember Glaber Torres, when he was here? He played second, he played short, you know, but they are, it just seems this is the stubbornness of the Yankees, where I'm saying they are telling you this is our third base. We're going to make him a third baseman. And I don't understand when you have, when you are World Series championship or bust, and you have the third highest payroll in baseball, over $300 million, why you should force anybody into anything. Like, you should be able to slot everybody where they're supposed to be. Well, if you don't have a third baseman, get a third baseman. Don't make a second baseman a third baseman. And then at the end of the year, if Jazz ends up costing you a championship, then whose fault is that? Is it Jazz's fault or is it the Yankees? It would be the Yankees. Don't force a ground peg into a square hole or vice versa. Does that make sense?
- [28:37]
Peter Rosenberg
Think about where all this originated from. When they Acquired Jazz. The plan was to move Gleyber Torres to third.
- [28:45]
Alan Hahn
Yeah.
- [28:46]
Peter Rosenberg
Gleber Torres said, what? No, I don't want to play. I'm not. Remember, that was a big deal then. Yeah, no, I don't want to play third. I'm a second baseman. Because he refused to do it. Then they're like, well, I guess we need. I guess Jaz has played third before in his life. I, I don't think it was in the majors, but it was somewhere else in his career. And so he did it because this guy, for everything you want to say about Jazz, Chisholm, like with what you know, whether he's inconsistent, whether he likes to wear a lot of jewelry and different. This guy's a team player. He cares. He's been a good Yankee. He understands it. So I, like, I, I respect the guy. So he'll play third. Okay, I'll play third then. And he did. And now this year, they tell him in the winter, don't worry about it. You're going to be where you belong. Second base. Because we let Glabor go. Because Glaber's not a team guy. We don't want to pay him. We're done with him. It's so funny that Don. We're four months into the season, right? Yeah, like almost right. Three and three and change, and Jazz is already back at third. And Gleber Torres is an All Star. Second base.
- [29:53]
Alan Hahn
Yeah, right. That's right. He's an All Star.
- [29:57]
Peter Rosenberg
It's.
- [29:58]
Alan Hahn
I can understand the Yankees frustration, Yankee fans frustration over things like this. And again, it's not about Jazz. You got to like the fact he's willing to do it.
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Peter Rosenberg
I respect.
- [30:06]
Alan Hahn
Because he wants to do what's best for his team. I understand that he's not your typical Yankees, you said, with the bling and stuff, but he might be a little flamboyant. Not necessarily everybody's taste, but he's a team player. Try works his ass off and he's trying to make this work. But I don't know why you're trying to make anything work. Go find a third baseman.
- [30:25]
Peter Rosenberg
Well, they're not going to do that.
- [30:27]
Alan Hahn
That all off season is true.
- [30:29]
Peter Rosenberg
Like, that's, that's, that's wild. And I'll give Jazz even more credit. And if he ends up, you know, he's, you know, he's not going to be a plus defender. He's just, he just want to get through it. But if he can get his bat consistent enough and, and helpful enough, you'd really, honestly, you'd really have to tip your cap as a fan to him. He fans need to understand he is literally playing out of position. Yeah, not willingly, but he's doing it because he knows it's for the best of the team and he knows I'm in the lineup every night, so I'm not going to complain because it's what I want. But we've seen players do it again, Gleber Torres said. I'm not doing it. We've seen players raise hell about this stuff. He's not doing that. So you got to show respect to the player. And so when he does make a mistake, try not to call him out as much as you want to blame those who are really deserving the blame. So every time a ball is coming at him hot and he's playing it too close and that, you know, whether it, it just takes a spin on him or wherever it does at third base and you see him just get handcuffed, don't curse his name. When you see him throw the ball away, don't curse his name. That's not the guy to blame. He's there because they need him there. That's the, that's the reality of it. Mets update here. Don yes, severe thunderstorm warning is in the area. There is a tarp down at Citi Field and Anthony Decomo just tweeted that the Mets brewers game will be delayed due to thunderstorms in the area. More updates to come. We are done at 6:30 though.
- [32:09]
Alan Hahn
Yeah.
- [32:09]
Peter Rosenberg
So there'll have to be dead air. It's if they're not ready.
- [32:14]
Alan Hahn
This weather has really just been a major, major, major problem. Now I heard K talking about this today too with Peraza. Now Peraza just can't hit now. He can play short, he can play second, he can play third.
- [32:28]
Peter Rosenberg
He's actually a good fielder.
- [32:29]
Alan Hahn
He's, he's predominantly in his career, he's played 75 games at third, 29 at second, 26 at shortst. So he's a third baseman. Okay. He could solve your problem defensively at third, he just can't hit. But what's interesting about the Yankees, as you said, putting prioritizing offense over defense is there have always been teams that were just light in an area but they liked it defensively. I know it was a long time ago, it was 100 years ago, but when the Mets won in 86, they didn't have a great offensive shortstop. Rafael Santana was a Punch and Judy hitter, but he was at a plus defender at short and they felt that the Strawberries and the Carters and the Hernandez's of the world should be enough to score runs. Let's prioritize defense at shortstop and we'll just have a guy batting eighth. That's going to be an automatic out, but we'll find it because one through seven we're going to be great and we're going to navigate through it. And they did to win 108 games, win a World Series. There's a, it's a history of light hitting second baseman or shortstops or whatever because they you there were a plus defenders but that's not an alternative, just not a hitter. So it's unfortunate and they would rather have someone out of position who is going to make mistakes defensively but be a hitter. And Jazz, Jazz can hit and he's hitting home runs now and he gets on base and all that. But God, I just think defense is for, for a championship caliber team. You got to be able to play defense at your positions. You have to. And Jazz, we learned that enough offensive player where you can live with him playing out of position.
- [34:05]
Peter Rosenberg
We learned this, didn't we? We learned it in the, in the world at the worst possible place to learn it. You learned it in the World Series because when you needed to make fundamental plays, you could. And that was something that was exposed.
- [34:18]
Alan Hahn
Yep.
- [34:18]
Peter Rosenberg
And there are, like I said this in the off season. It's the part, it's the part that frustrates me the most about the Yankee organization is things that should be the wake up call. Things that should motivate you into the next season are not just losing because let, that's a given. You're supposed to be motivated by losing. We didn't win this year like the Yankee standard and House Timer said it himself, we don't win a World Series, we consider it a failure. Right. You have to. That's, that's just the standard. And I, and I don't think that it should ever go away. No matter how much you say that it's a pie in the sky in these days that baseball is different, you can't outspend and all that stuff. But I don't care. There's a standard with this franchise and expectation for this fan base. But when you walk away from a season and teams and scouts and opposing players, former players are mocking everything you do, shouldn't there be like a bit of a, okay, let's take a little inventory, right? Because eventually like one or two haters, they just hate. But when there's a lot of them Maybe it is more about you. And I feel like the Yankees didn't leave the World Series with a sense of, you know, we need to get it right.
- [35:38]
Alan Hahn
Yeah.
- [35:38]
Peter Rosenberg
Because that can't be it. Doing that on the biggest stage of the sport, having that fifth inning, well, that can't ever happen. But yet here we are halfway through the season and a lot of the same things are still happening.
- [35:51]
Alan Hahn
And now it's, it's hurting because now you're tied for first place instead of having a second half game lead. And again, I think they'll be okay. But remember, I went from oh, they'll be okay to now. I think they'll be okay.
- [36:02]
Peter Rosenberg
Yeah, I got you on my side. I got you on my side.
- [36:04]
Alan Hahn
Yeah. Well, listen, it's true. Let's go to Griffin in Connecticut. You're on ESPN New York. What's up, Griffin?
- [36:11]
Caller
Hey guys, you know what I was thinking?
- [36:13]
Mark Spears
How much does not having Oswaldo Copper hurt right now?
- [36:19]
Caller
Oh, because if he didn't fracture his.
- [36:20]
Mark Spears
Ankle, he would be at third.
- [36:22]
Peter Rosenberg
Yes.
- [36:22]
Caller
Volpe would be at short, Jazz would be at second. It would be the same infield that.
- [36:27]
Mark Spears
Beginning of the year was.
- [36:28]
Peter Rosenberg
Yes.
- [36:28]
Mark Spears
Hip fracturing his ankle has blown this whole thing up.
- [36:32]
Alan Hahn
Really? Listen, he's a better defense, but remember, he's not even like he's played more outfield than he's played third. And he's only a 234 hitter. It's like. So he, he doesn't solve your problem. He makes it better. But going into the year as Cabrera is your third baseman was not ideal. It's gotten worse. But you're right, the injury has hurt Griff. But having Cabrera as your full time third baseman was not paradise either.
- [36:58]
Peter Rosenberg
That wasn't supposed to be that way.
- [37:01]
Caller
Yeah, but he was also, he would.
- [37:02]
Mark Spears
Be also a piece that can help you. And he can hit.
- [37:06]
Peter Rosenberg
Yeah, he's not hit. No. Those guys, the problem is they're not great hitters, but they're, they're good fielders and they're, they're guys that you would consider utility guys more than anything. But Griff, once DJ LeMayhue was healthy enough to play, it felt like he was going to play.
- [37:24]
Alan Hahn
Yes, he was definitely going to play.
- [37:26]
Peter Rosenberg
Because so I, in a way. Did they, did they lie to Jazz? Like if you knew DJ LeMay was still on your roster. Yeah. Right. Like if you knew that he was still going to be around and you were going to play him.
- [37:38]
Alan Hahn
Yeah.
- [37:38]
Peter Rosenberg
Why would you tell Jazz, hey, just focus on second base. This whole off season. That's what Jazz said. They told me I'd be playing second base, so I only worked out at second base all winter.
- [37:47]
Alan Hahn
Yeah. And because I guess Cabrera was going to be your answer until he was all right, you know, but if you're, if you're an injury away from playing someplace, you might want to let that player know because guys do get hurt, alright? Guys get moved around. So just a curious case of the New York Yankees.
- [38:04]
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- [38:26]
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- [38:33]
Alan Hahn
See mintmobile.com have you ever spotted McDonald's hot crispy fries right as they're being.
- [38:39]
Peter Rosenberg
Scooped into the carton and time just stands still?
- [38:47]
Mark Spears
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- [38:57]
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- [39:05]
Alan Hahn
And breathe.
- [39:06]
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- [39:17]
Peter Rosenberg
1-800-Contacts.
- [39:20]
Don LeGreca
Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg Podcast.
- [39:24]
Alan Hahn
I didn't listen to anything you just said.
- [39:25]
Don LeGreca
Catch the show on demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcasts.
- [39:33]
Peter Rosenberg
Hey, get ready to swing big at the ESPN New York Tee It Up Golf Challenge presented by Jake's 58 Casino Hotel. It's all happening Monday, July 21 at Clark Colonial Springs Golf Club in Farmingdale, New York, where teams will battle it out for amazing prizes and bragging rights. Of course, lock in your foursome now at the on the ESPNY app, you can join people like Chris Carlin, Rick DiPietro, Dave Rothenberg, Bart Scott, Don Legreca, myself. I'll be there as well. Plus we have special guests like Larry Johnson, John Starks, Justin Tuck, and more. All proceeds support the Garden of Dreams foundation. It's the ESP New York Tee It Up Golf Challenge, presented by Jake's 58 Casino Hotel. It's brought to you by London Jewelers, Verizon and Infinity. For more details, find the Tee it up tile on the ESPN New York app.
- [40:22]
Alan Hahn
Now, Jeff Patson was on get up and so was Alan, if I'm not mistaken. Right. He did both get up and first day.
- [40:28]
Peter Rosenberg
Yeah. Jeff and I were not on the same time, though, so I was on.
- [40:31]
Alan Hahn
Didn't you.
- [40:32]
Peter Rosenberg
He was remote.
- [40:34]
Alan Hahn
Oh, I.
- [40:35]
Peter Rosenberg
Not in studio. I was.
- [40:37]
Alan Hahn
I get it.
- [40:37]
Peter Rosenberg
Yeah.
- [40:38]
Alan Hahn
You're more dedicated is what you're saying.
- [40:41]
Peter Rosenberg
Or he's just busy baseballing, you know.
- [40:44]
Alan Hahn
Well, pass in some way, shape or form was on get up and he's talked about the state of New York baseball. And who has it worse, New York.
- [40:51]
Mint Mobile Advertiser
Baseball is a mess right now. And these were two teams that less than a month ago looked like two of the best in all of baseball. And now they look like also Rams. They look like teams that are losing to division leads. But I think when it comes down to it, it's the New York Mets. And it's not so much the composition of the Mets. They need help. The Yankees need help. That's obvious. It's more what's surrounding the Mets. The American League stinks. Like, the Yankees could go and blow the division league to Toronto. Tampa Bay could come up there, and still the American League Central, not very good. The American League west, not very good. They could back their way into the playoffs in the National League, you've got good teams in the east, you've got good teams in the Central, you've got good in the West. And it's really that competition that more puts the Mets at the disadvantage than anything.
- [41:41]
Alan Hahn
Yeah. And you know, we had a caller who was on hold that we never got to that wanted to call me a fraud because I said, you know, baseball stinks right now. And there's too much parody and there's passing saying the American League stinks and the National League's a lot stronger. But the Giants have done nothing but lose since getting Devers. The Padres are still not as good as people think. Philadelphia, not too long ago lost eight of their last nine. I mean, but the. But he's right. The Yankees could take advantage of that American League. They could play exactly the same way they're playing now and the rest of the year, and you complain every day about it. And they can still win this division. Right now, the way the Mets are playing may not make the playoffs. So that's the difference between, like, who's in worse shape, even though the Yankees might be. Might have their issues, yeah, it'll cost them. It will cost them a championship, but it will not cost them a playoff berth and likely will not cost them the division. But for the Mets, if you don't get this right, there's a very good chance that your best avenue to the playoffs will be like what happened last year. You're playing on the road in the wild card and not having the best avenue to be able to get to a World Series. So the Mets are in worse shape because they're in the wrong league.
- [42:56]
Peter Rosenberg
It's a lot harder. Their path is a lot harder. Right.
- [42:59]
Alan Hahn
They're in the NBA West.
- [43:01]
Peter Rosenberg
Yeah.
- [43:01]
Alan Hahn
The Yankees are in the NBA.
- [43:04]
Peter Rosenberg
You could say, yeah, you could put it that way and you'd be accurate. But I also think there's. This is going to set you off. There's two different standards here. Oh, I know, I know.
- [43:19]
Alan Hahn
You know.
- [43:20]
Peter Rosenberg
Stop, stop.
- [43:21]
Alan Hahn
I'm going to tell you, stop.
- [43:22]
Peter Rosenberg
Same diamonds.
- [43:23]
Alan Hahn
We don't play with history. I don't bring a history book to a baseball game.
- [43:26]
Peter Rosenberg
Okay?
- [43:27]
Alan Hahn
I don't bring the baseball encyclopedia to the baseball game.
- [43:29]
Peter Rosenberg
I know this pisses you off.
- [43:30]
Alan Hahn
The standards are the same. You know why the standards are the same? The standards are the same because you went to the World Series last year and the Mets came within two games of going to the World Series and lost to the same team. You did. All right.
- [43:42]
Peter Rosenberg
Correct.
- [43:42]
Alan Hahn
That's the standard, the immediate standard. I don't. Nobody cares about four championships in five years. Nobody cares about Ruth, Garrick, DiMaggio. That doesn't matter. Get your head out of that. No, that's the problem with the Yankees. Forget the standard. What standard? Baseball had a standard. Now everybody goes to the playoffs. You got how many different. How many rounds of playoffs to get. Their teams can completely bottom out, still find a way to get to the playoff. Just. You can't keep all of it about history. I'm not arguing now, man.
- [44:11]
Peter Rosenberg
I'm not arguing with you on any of the things you just said. None of it. But I am telling you that when you look at it from the fan perspective, the Mets last season was a great success.
- [44:26]
Alan Hahn
Yeah.
- [44:26]
Peter Rosenberg
The Yankees did not feel the same way. That felt like a failure. That's the difference.
- [44:32]
Alan Hahn
All right?
- [44:32]
Peter Rosenberg
So when you say it's harder to get, there I go. I completely agree. But just making the playoffs for the Yankees is no longer considered a success.
- [44:42]
Alan Hahn
All right? But it's not for the Mets either. But guess What? It's not for the Mets either. Because after you lose in the league championship series and go and get the best player or one of the best players in baseball, that standard is now changed. So now just making the playoff. But I'm saying I'm living in. I'm living in the now, Alan. I'm not going to the past. All right? Yeah, it was nice that the Mets made a run to the playoffs. Now the scholarship is over. Now the expectation is go to the World Series. So we're both in the same boat.
- [45:10]
Peter Rosenberg
Okay?
- [45:10]
Alan Hahn
So that's all. We're living in the 2025 universe. They're both in the same boat. Go to the World Series.
- [45:16]
Peter Rosenberg
Then you're acknowledging that now you're acknowledging that everything from here on in, because you have an owner that is willing to spend and has that you have a team that's good enough to do it, that anything short of a championship is a failure. It's a bad season.
- [45:29]
Alan Hahn
Right, but not. But not because of Cohen, but because of what you did last year. Like, everybody has a scope, but look at. Wait, wait, wait. But what you did in 2017, the Yankees were like the Mets last year. You weren't expected to make the playoffs. You weren't expected to go as far as you went. And then that's when it ended.
- [45:46]
Peter Rosenberg
Bang.
- [45:47]
Alan Hahn
So it didn't have anything to do. We're the New York Yankees. We have a different standard. It was. You went to one game of the World Series. So now, scholarship over. Now get to work. And it's the same for the Mets. It'll be same for any other team. Now the same for the Knicks. Knicks have no standard of winning. The Knicks have no legacy. But when you go to the conference final, you fire your coach. Guess what? Get it done. Scholarship over, get to work, get your ass out of bed and go to class. That's exactly what both of these teams are in. So forget the history burn. It doesn't exist. Live in the now. And we're both in the same sinking ship, paddling water out of the boat, trying to survive.
- [46:22]
Peter Rosenberg
Right?
- [46:22]
Alan Hahn
And Ruth and Garrick and Keith and Ron aren't coming to save us.
- [46:28]
Peter Rosenberg
And what you're saying is the Mets are in an ocean, the Yankees are in a pond. Because, yes, the way the American League.
- [46:36]
Alan Hahn
Is, when the boat sinks, you'll just walk out of the pond.
- [46:38]
Peter Rosenberg
You'll just climb out and swing right.
- [46:40]
Alan Hahn
In the National League. We're going to be with the Titanic.
- [46:45]
Peter Rosenberg
You'Re down with the fishes, and with the. With the medallion that the old lady threw to the bottom.
- [46:50]
Alan Hahn
I want to squeeze Jonathan in LA because he's got a question. What's up, Jonathan?
- [46:55]
Caller
Hey, fellow. A great show as always. Really like that. Back to the feature segment.
- [46:59]
Alan Hahn
Yeah.
- [47:00]
Caller
Regarding the Yankees. I'm gonna squeeze in this really quick. I'm more afraid now. I'm not really afraid of the Rays or the Blue Jays. I'm more afraid of the Astros creeping in now. So I really hope we start winning. So at least if we get to face and we get home field advantage. All right, fellas, I'm kind of nervous and I. I don't want to be that guy. I'm actually going to New York this weekend with my son. Like I said, I called you guys like about a month ago. I'm taking it to the Aaron judges camp. But Don. Alan, you weren't there when I called in. Don, I wanted to ask you.
- [47:27]
Peter Rosenberg
I don't want to.
- [47:28]
Caller
I'm so embarrassed asking you about, like, you know what? The hell with it. You only live once. Don, do you think I could cash in my invite?
- [47:35]
Alan Hahn
Anthony, put them in the system, get them on hold.
- [47:37]
Peter Rosenberg
When? Monday.
- [47:40]
Caller
I'm gonna be there Sunday morning. So we're actually going to the game Sunday and we leave in Tuesday night.
- [47:46]
Peter Rosenberg
So you want to stop by Monday? Monday when we're doing the show together?
- [47:51]
Alan Hahn
Yeah.
- [47:52]
Caller
Oh, my God, that would be great. Me and my son would love it, man.
- [47:55]
Peter Rosenberg
Put them on hold and tell them where to. Where to, where to find us.
- [48:01]
Caller
Thank you. Thank you guys. And you guys have a great weekend and I'll see you guys Monday again.
- [48:07]
Alan Hahn
Listen now, don't expect now get calls. Can we swing by? He's. He's from la. He happens to be in New York. He's a die hard.
- [48:14]
Peter Rosenberg
He's a regular caller. You don't think we would do well with a live studio audience?
- [48:18]
Alan Hahn
I think we would do very well with a live studio audience. I feed off of Jacob laughing at my jokes so I get a bunch of people doing it. I don't know how I'd feel if they started booing me, but maybe I'd be encouraged. I thought we did well on Friday with the live audience, so. But I'm looking forward to seeing Jonathan on Monday.
- [48:36]
Don LeGreca
Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.
- [48:40]
Peter Rosenberg
I don't want to know how the sausage is made, man. I just want to know. It's good.
- [48:42]
Don LeGreca
Hear more of Don Allen and Peter weekday afternoon starting at 3 on 8 80, ESPN, the ESPN New York app and your smart speakers.