Hour 4: Andrew Gundling talks World Cup

Summary

Podcast Summary: Don, Hahn & Rosenberg – Hour 4: Andrew Gundling Talks World Cup (Dec 6, 2025)

Episode Overview

In this hour, Peter Rosenberg and Don Hahn welcome soccer journalist and podcast host Andrew Gundling (“Caught Offside”) to break down the U.S. Men's National Team's 2026 World Cup draw. The conversation covers the draw's implications, expectations for the U.S. team, group stage pressure, and broader themes about American soccer's growth. The crew also fields listener calls about music, pro wrestling, and NFL picks, wrapping up with light-hearted banter characteristic of the show's style.

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Main Topics & Key Insights

1. Immediate Reaction to the U.S. World Cup Draw

• Favorable Outcome (02:19)
  • Gundling explains the tournament's pot system and why the U.S. avoided the world's top teams as a host. Despite this, he notes they could have still drawn difficult teams but largely avoided them:
    • “If your goal here is like, we want to go as far as possible, then this is a really ideal draw.” – Andrew Gundling (02:19)
  • He adds it’s not the most glamorous grouping, but optimal for tournament success.

2. Who’s the Fourth Team? Qualifying Process Explained

• European Playoff Breakdowns (03:26)

  • Gundling describes how regions have set team allocations, focusing on Europe’s playoff system:
    • “For the U.S., they know it will be one of Slovakia, Kosovo, Turkey and Romania.” (04:10)
  • Potential group opponents will be decided by a mini tournament in March.

• Uncommon Familiarity (04:42)

  • Due to scheduling quirks, the U.S. has recently played friendlies against all potential group opponents, a rarity:
    • “...there's a chance they’ll have played all three of the teams in their group within the last six months, which is incredibly rare, almost never happened.” – Andrew Gundling (05:09)
  • Notably, Turkey dominated the U.S in their friendly.

3. Potential Pressure on the U.S. Team

• Expectations as Hosts (06:11)
  • There’s always pressure on host nations to overperform. The expanded format makes it even harder to “fail”:
    • “Not getting out of the group would be, it would be horrifying...32 of the 48 teams in this tournament are going to advance out of the group stage...” – Andrew Gundling (06:11)
  • Success should be measured by more than just escaping the group.

4. Historical Context and Hopes for the Team

• Reflecting on 2018’s Missed Qualification (09:42)

  • Rosenberg recalls the infamous failure to qualify in 2018; Gundling reflects on that night and recent improvement:
    • “It’s those low moments that make this fun. Like, this team looks good right now...Momentum is good.” – Andrew Gundling (10:15)
  • Hopes are high that 2026 can mark a true new era for U.S. soccer.

• The Need for Real Progress (11:19)

  • Rosenberg voices a long-standing fan frustration: the U.S. cannot simply aim for round of 16 exits forever.
    • “At some point, this thing actually has to take a turn...where you can say in earnest that they’re moving in the right direction.” – Peter Rosenberg (11:43)

• Luck and Tournament Pathways (12:18)

  • Gundling notes success isn’t just about strength, but also favorable matchups in the knockout phase.
    • “A lot of that...is luck...if the U.S. wind up by just sheer unluck facing France in the round of 32...” (12:30)
  • The draw for the knockout stage opponents is still pending.

5. Listener Q&A: Eagles Concerns & Miscellaneous Topics

• Quick NFL Discussion (14:31)
  • Rosenberg pivots, asking Gundling to rate his concern about the Philadelphia Eagles on a scale of 1–5:
    • “Four and a half closing in on five.” – Andrew Gundling (14:44)
    • Gundling details the offense’s troubles and his skepticism about a sudden turnaround.

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• On the Draw’s Stakes:
  “Getting out of the group can’t be a measuring stick. The bar has to be higher…” – Andrew Gundling (06:11)
• Nostalgic Callback:
  “Would you be waiting with bated breath to see that U.S.-Romania rematch from 1994?” – Peter Rosenberg (04:30)
• On U.S. Soccer's Next Step:
  “We've been having this conversation since you and I were like, you know, teenagers...at some point this thing actually has to take a turn.” – Peter Rosenberg (11:43)
• On the Role of Luck:
  “...there is this element of it that is luck. Draw, shake...” – Andrew Gundling (12:18)

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Important Timestamps

| Timestamp | Segment/Topic | |-----------|--------------| | 02:19 | Gundling’s immediate reaction to the draw and group breakdown | | 03:26 | How the fourth team in the U.S. group will be determined | | 04:42 | U.S. friendlies with group opponents—a rare advantage | | 06:11 | The pressure and disaster scenario if the U.S. doesn’t advance | | 09:42 | Reflection on the U.S. not qualifying for 2018 | | 11:43 | Fan frustration about U.S. consistently falling short of expectations | | 12:18 | Importance of draw/luck in going deep at the World Cup | | 14:31 | Quick pivot to NFL–Gundling’s concern about the Eagles |

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Listener Interactions

• Music/Pop Culture: Clarification regarding Ozzy Osbourne rumors, with listeners and hosts expressing relief that a shocking story was debunked (19:00–20:44).
• Pro Wrestling: Dream scenarios for John Cena’s last match discussed with a caller, with Rosenberg fantasizing about a Rock run-in (21:06–21:57).
• NFL Picks: Discussion of listener bets and regrets over “knowing” the Lions would cover yet picking the Cowboys (22:39–24:16).

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Tone & Style

The conversation is lively and accessible, blending soccer analysis with the irreverent, personable banter familiar to New York sports radio. Rosenberg in particular infuses the chat with nostalgia, humor, and casual skepticism, while Gundling provides measured expertise and context.

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Conclusion

This episode delivers an in-depth, entertaining take on the U.S. World Cup draw and what’s at stake for American soccer on home soil in 2026. With a blend of genuine sports insight, fan frustration, and playful side topics, it’s both informative for soccer buffs and welcoming for casual listeners. The stakes are clear: for the U.S., this World Cup is about more than participation—it's about taking the next meaningful step on the world stage.

Transcript

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[Don Hahn]

This is the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.

[Peter Rosenberg]

That sounds like heaven to me.

[Don Hahn]

Listen live weekday afternoon starting at 3 on 8 80, ESPN, the ESPN New York app, and your smart speakers.

[Peter Rosenberg]

All right, we are going to get Andrew Gundling on the line, the great Andrew Gunling.

To talk about the US's draw in the World Cup. And we're also going to open the phone lines to you guys right now. 1800-919377-61800-919-3576. It is all on the table for you right now. Any single subject that interests you, give us a shout. We will get to it between now and seven o'. Clock. But first we bring in our good friend Andrew Gunling. You may know him from his Caught Offside podcast, his years of flawless production on the Case Show. Andrew, how are you?

[Andrew Gunling]

How you doing?

[Peter Rosenberg]

I'm good, I'm good. We talked about you earlier when we got the news of the U.S. men's National Team's World cup draw.

And we wanted to talk to you now. I wanted to make sure we spoke to you before we started getting into our basic topics, like why don't they keep time more exact and some of your favorite subjects. But I have to imagine diving and all those things. Oh, they're diving. We don't know how much time. What is it with this extra time? Now, what was your original and immediate reaction when you saw this grouping? And was it not surprising that it was so favorable given that they're the host nation? Did any of it surprise you?

[Andrew Gunling]

Well, host nation or not, I mean, they still could have drawn potentially difficult teams. Now, not the most like high level difficult teams because the US were in what's called Pot 1, where the host nations go along with the other nine highest seated teams in the world. So you were never going to get England, Germany, Argentina, Spain, none of those. But there are still very good teams that they could have drawn. Morocco, Norway has been unbelievable in European qualifying and they missed, they missed pretty much all of them. I mean, it's a pretty if Your goal here is like, we want to go as far as possible, then this is a really ideal draw. If you were hoping for the US to draw some, like, glamour nations, like other big names, then maybe you're not quite as happy. But I think the goal here for most people is like, let's. Let's win as many games as possible and see how. How much fun this summer can actually wind up being.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Now, is the group favorable enough? And also, can you explain before that. So we know it's the U.S. paraguay and Australia. How is the fourth team in the group being determined?

[Andrew Gunling]

So every region in soccer, these tournaments, the World cup, is broken down into different regions of the world. You may have heard people reference concacaf. That's the region that the US Are in. And so every region is assigned a certain number of teams that can enter this tournament. UEFA is the European region. They get 16 teams into the tournament. 12 have already qualified automatically, and then the last four happen via a playoff, which will occur in March. And so up to this point, it's still not determined who those Final Four teams will be. For the US they know it will be one of Slovakia, Kosovo, Turkey and Romania.

Slovakia is going to play Kosovo. Turkey plays Romania. The two winners will meet, and then whoever wins from that kind of mini Final Four, that will be the final team in the. In the US Group.

[Peter Rosenberg]

So these are. These are games that would air on TBS on a Tuesday, is what you're saying, is this.

[Andrew Gunling]

Are these like the true tv.

[Peter Rosenberg]

The true TV playing games now? Would you be. Would you be waiting with bated breath to see that U.S. romania rematch from 1994?

[Andrew Gunling]

Oh, wow. Look at you.

[Peter Rosenberg]

How do you like that? How do you like that?

[Andrew Gunling]

Well, I'll tell you what, I would be interested. So the US the thing that's interesting about this group for the US So they. They haven't gone through qualifying. When you're a host nation for the World cup, you qualify automatically. So they haven't gone, had to go through the qualifying cycle, which means they've been able to schedule friendlies against other teams looking for opposition to play. And through a stroke of luck, the US Scheduled friendlies recently against Paraguay and Australia.

[Advertisement Voice]

So.

[Andrew Gunling]

So they're very familiar with them. And then I think the favorite to come through that foursome of teams in Europe would probably be Turkey, who was another friendly that the US Scheduled earlier this summer. So there's a chance they'll have played all three of the teams in their group within the last six months, which is incredibly rare, almost never happened. So that's the rematch. Turkey really kind of dominated the US in that game. So yeah, if you're, if you're nostalgic like you are, apparently for the US Romania rematch that we've all been waiting for, then yeah, have at it. But I think the one against Turkey, I guess would be the one that I would be a little more intrigued by.

[Peter Rosenberg]

How can you put into words how bad a loss not getting out of this group would look for U.S. soccer? Like, because the group is this favorable, is there actually an immense amount of pressure for them to make it out of this stage or was that always going to be there just from them being the host nation?

[Andrew Gunling]

So yes, there will always be. For whoever the host nation is. However, even even the tiniest of host nations, there's always inherent pressure to overperform a little bit. Whether that means for some countries just get out of the group, for others you got to win the whole thing. So for the US there was always going to be pressure no matter what to, to do well in this tournament, I would say now, I mean not getting out of the group would be, it would be horrifying. It would be, it would be a hideous missed opportunity for the US Especially to Peter. Like this is the first World cup of the expanded format used to be 32 teams. The top two from each group advance and you go into the round of 16 for the knockout stage. This is the first year where they've expanded to 48 teams. So the top two from each group still advance automatically. But the best, the top eight third place teams also advance. So think of like it would, it would be a disaster of epic proportions. It's hard not to get out. 32 of the 48 teams in this tournament are going to advance out of the group stage into this newly formed round of 32. So I would almost say now for the US like getting out of the group can't be a measuring stick. The bar has to be higher than simply just getting out of the group.

[Peter Rosenberg]

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[Peter Rosenberg]

Can you believe I was just looking back, it was 2018 that they didn't qualify, right? Do you realize that it's been over eight years? That means. Or around eight years. Sorry, it's 2025 now. So it's been seven to eight years since me, you and JJ Devaney were in that small studio back at, at 125 West End watching when. When there was just too much Tobago from Trinidad Tobago and the US couldn't qualify.

[Andrew Gunling]

What. What a night that was. That's still. I still can't believe that that happened. Like it never. That was one of those sporting events that just like never seemed real to me until I was just. Until we were looking at it and there Was zeros on until the game was over. So the idea of the US not qualifying is crazy, but, you know, it's those low moments that make this fun. Like, this team looks good right now. They just beat Uruguay 5 1, and Uruguay is a really good team. You know, the US had a rough patch mid year in the summer. It was not. It didn't look good. They've ended the year with five. Five games unbeaten. Momentum is good. Like those nights that night against Trinidad, it feels. No one will ever forget it, but, like, it feels. It feels like a long time ago now, which it was. And like, that's good. It's time. Hopefully this tournament will be like a true turning of the page. If that didn't happen already with 2022.

[Peter Rosenberg]

The United States, obviously, O2 was the best year. They. They made the quarters and lost to Germany, who went on to the final.

Doesn't it feel like, though, at some point? I mean, that was such a long time ago. Like, you just can't simply, if you're the US do round of 16 over and over again, that, that is just. I know we've said this forever, but like, Andrew, we've been having this conversation since you and I were like, you know, teenagers and, you know, I'm in my mid-40s.

You're catching up with me quickly. At some point, this thing actually has to take a turn in the right. Like something truly affirmative has to happen with this team where you believe, where you can say in earnest that they're moving in the right direction.

[Andrew Gunling]

No, yeah, I know. And I mean, look, this is like, this is so the opportunity to do it at home. I mean, just think of. Of how influential this moment could be for American soccer if they're able to go on a run in a way that we haven't necessarily seen before. Now, the thing with these tournaments, though, is.

It'S. It does take like, yes, the US need to be good. They've got to play well, they've got to stay healthy. There's things like that, but there is this element of it that is luck.

Draw, shake. If you, you know, we don't know yet what their pathway will be. I think it's tomorrow that they're going to announce which groups will face other corresponding groups in the knockout round. So we don't know yet what the US's potential opponents would look like should they advance. But, you know, a lot of that, like, like England, for example. Now, England are great as it is. They've got some of the world's best players. They're incredible. But in the last couple of tournaments, they've also benefited from being on, like, the quote, unquote, right side of the draw. They haven't had to face, you know, some of the world's gigantic teams in some of these tournaments, and they've been able to benefit from that. And they. They beat who's on the schedule and they go on runs. And, yeah, they haven't won, but they finished runner up in a couple of European championships, so there is that element of it, too. If you look at the US Wind up by just like, sheer unluck of facing France in The round of 32, who are ridiculous and could easily win this whole thing. If the US Lose, does that mean that American soccer is not as good as where it should be?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Right.

[Andrew Gunling]

I don't know now, how it looks.

[Peter Rosenberg]

How it looks matters is what you're saying.

[Andrew Gunling]

Yeah, like, so.

[Advertisement Voice]

Yeah.

[Andrew Gunling]

Now, look, if they wind up faced with a smaller nation and can't win, then we can have a whole conversation about that. So it's hard. It's hard to say right now. Just like, what. What's the round that they need to get to for this to be a success?

[Peter Rosenberg]

I. How much you want to bet? And I say this based on nothing but conspiracy that they end up tomorrow, we'll find out. They have a very favorable situation. I guarantee. I guarantee they have a favorable path. It's just a matter of, like, can you beat Cutter? You know, can you win that, that, that game? And. And will they be able to do that? Well, listen, as we get closer, we really hope to have you and jj, who, by the way, not only do they do a great job with soccer, but they're just generally entertaining and charming individuals caught offside. The podcast, you can find it everywhere. And as we get, as we get closer to World Cup, I'm sure we'll. We'll try to have you guys on as much as we can. So thanks for making time, buddy.

[Andrew Gunling]

Yeah, you bet, man. Good to talk to you.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Oh, and last thing out the door, what is Your scale of 1 to 5, your level of concern about the Eagles at this moment?

[Andrew Gunling]

Oh, for.

Well, again, if, like, if the expectation is super bowl, then, like, four and a half closing in on five.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You're just, You're. It's. It's coming unglued, is what you're saying.

[Andrew Gunling]

Well, like, I'm sure. I mean, I don't know. You probably don't watch them as closely as I do, but you. They're on national TV a good amount You've seen them like, oh, sure, I.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Watch them on Black Friday. Every snap.

[Andrew Gunling]

Yeah, I mean, this offense is just, I don't know, it's, it's, it's impossible to watch. I think they lead the league in three and outs. Like how, how they have superstars at every position, so something is just broken here. Now, their defense may be good enough to carry them and if the offense can find it, like just enough to steady themselves and go on a run, then that, that's certainly possible. But their offenses just look so bad for the entire season. It just doesn't feel like you can snap your fingers and they're suddenly going to just be like, oh, we fixed it, here we go. It doesn't feel like that's going to happen.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, I mean this with all due respect, that I hope you're right and it doesn't happen. I'll talk to you next week, buddy.

[Andrew Gunling]

All right, I'll see you.

[Peter Rosenberg]

There he is, the great Andrew Gunling. We love Andrew. Actually have plans with him next week. Going to see my guy. Haven't seen him in a minute.

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[Don Hahn]

Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I didn't listen to anything you just said.

[Don Hahn]

Catch the show on demand whenever you want want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcasts.

[Peter Rosenberg]

All right, we are five minutes from the weekend, folks.

1-800-919-3776. Any single topic you want to get in in the next five minutes, I will put you on. That's how we do it. Truly. Freedom Friday, Anthony in Jersey City. What's up, Anthony?

[Caller]

Yo, Rosenberg. What's up, man? I've been a fan for years. I used to listen to Hot 97 every morning for years. No Thanksgiving wrap this year?

[Peter Rosenberg]

No, I dropped this year.

[Advertisement Voice]

You.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You left us. You didn't. You didn't hear it? Come on.

[Caller]

Oh, I didn't hear it. I didn't hear. All right. I'll have to find it. Yeah, I wish, yeah, I wish that Don was still on for this, but.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I won't worry about what you're going to share.

[Caller]

Okay?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Thank you.

[Caller]

I'm sure I wasn't the only one who was disturbed by that list that Don gave the other day, which I thought was hilarious to do as a tribute. Just tell all the crazy stuff that Ozzy did. So I was looking it up last night and supposedly Ozzy's sons, Jack and Louis have since debunked that story and said that Ozzy was most likely just hallucinating and going crazy. They never owned 17 cats or 11 cats, whatever. He probably shot some, like, feral cats outside. But the, the story with him and the shotgun and Sharon like that, that was a hallucination, according to his sons.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I have to tell you, this is very, very big news that you just dropped here on the show because I was, yeah. Disturbed.

[Caller]

Yeah, I agree. And one thing that I also think is funny is that when I told this to the great Anthony Pusick, the group to be very. Anthony Pusick, the great music, he seemed to be very upset at the fact that he didn't actually kill the cat.

[Peter Rosenberg]

He shot all the cats.

[Caller]

So I don't.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah.

Anthony, you were. You were disappointed that Ozzy didn't actually murder the cats. I'm disappointed it might hurt the drop for Drop Madness. That's what.

[Advertisement Voice]

That's what.

[Caller]

That's why I'm in.

[Peter Rosenberg]

That's where I'm hurting now.

[Caller]

See, I argue that it makes it better because it's not as dark.

[Peter Rosenberg]

It's Don kind of talking about cats getting shot. That's exactly right. But it's. But it's not real. I. I'm with the caller, Anthony. It's a great call. Thank you for waiting on hold. Have a great weekend. I think it makes it less dark that in fact, Ozzy did not murder all the cats, because that. That. That was always a stain. EJ and the UPS truck. What's up, ej?

[Andrew Gunling]

Hey, I'll be quick.

[Caller]

What is your dream booking for John Cena's last match coming up here?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, ej, whatever it is, it's probably not happening, right? Because in an hour, smackdown starts and Gunther and La Knight will have this match and one of them will face John Cena.

[Andrew Gunling]

You don't want either.

[Caller]

You want either of them to be his final match?

[Peter Rosenberg]

I'm not saying I don't want it. You said, what's my dream?

[Caller]

That's true. That's true.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah. My dream was not La Knight or Gunther. I'd say my. My dream would be, okay, you know, at this point.

You know, what if all of it was planned and then as the match is about to happen, the Rock just showed up and the Rock said, final, boss, your final match is against me. Isn't that the thing?

[Andrew Gunling]

Yeah, but he would never do it. He stopped wrestling.

[Caller]

It's so sad, the storyline they had going into elimination Chamber. He didn't show up.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I know Encino probably wouldn't like that. Casino's a good guy. And if, you know, unless that was the plan the whole time, he wouldn't want to take this opportunity away. So who do you prefer between La Knight and Gunther?

[Caller]

I think they're going to pass the torch to Guther. I think it's.

[Andrew Gunling]

He's next up.

[Caller]

I'm not a big fan of La Knight, really.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I appreciate you, ej. And if you get a chance Cheap Heat will drop tomorrow. We talked about that a lot today on today's episode of Cheap Heat on Pro Wrestling Nation. Obviously spent a lot of time on Cena as we head down to the final week now. This is an upsetting call. Let's go to Matt and White Plains. Hey, Matt.

[Caller]

Hey, Peter.

[Andrew Gunling]

Start on.

[Caller]

Big fan. So, you know, not coming at you, but I was hearing everything you were saying about the Lions yesterday in the beginning of the show and obviously he's had a tough year with the picks, you know, so I was, I was in my pick and flow leaning Lions and then, you know, I'm hearing that I'm agreeing with everything you're saying. But then later in the show, you go ahead and pick the Cowboys against everything that you said. And at that point, I knew I had to go and make a key bet on the line on the Lions.

[Peter Rosenberg]

No, I hope you did.

[Andrew Gunling]

I mean, you know, you must. You put yourself in the bathroom with.

[Caller]

That situation type of thing, you know, so you did it to yourself at all the right points.

[Peter Rosenberg]

You gave it out the right thing, but you did the right thing and you picked the Lions. Good.

[Andrew Gunling]

Yes.

[Caller]

Yeah, for sure. So I appreciate you.

[Peter Rosenberg]

All right, Matt, thank you. You're correct. You're honest.

I did that completely wrong. I knew everything that I knew with my soul. The Lions would cover and there I was. By the by the way, also note by the way, Anthony, just write down footnote. The day started with Ballard texting me going, you got to go with the Cowboys tonight. He's. He's truly in the bathroom. Game time. Brought to you by telling more do Irish whiskey When it's game time, it's Tully time.

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It's.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Knicks jazz right after us right here at 7 o'. Clock. The Devils and the Golden Knights at 7 on MSG networks as well. And Don and Don will be on the call. Allen will be a part of the Knicks coverage. Of course. Tullamore do the original triple distilled, triple blended and triple cast matured Irish whiskey. Be sure to grab a Tullamore do or try the new Tullamore due honey during today's action. Glasses up to enjoying Tullamore do responsibly.

Yeah, I bout Ballard is so often wrong that the fact that I ended up even landing thinking that was a good idea. What was I thinking? I knew it was Detroit. It's a bad job. Listen, I'm doing a bad year. And when you're lost, you're lost. Shout out to everyone in the chat. Black Metronome Rico, Dylan Davis, Master of Squirrels, Primo Cesar, everyone who's been rocking with us in the chat. We appreciate you. And to Anthony and Jacob as well.

[Don Hahn]

Thanks for listening to Madonn Han and Rosa Rosenberg podcast.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I don't want to know how the.

[Don Hahn]

Sausage is made, but I just want to know it's good. Hear more of Don Allen and Peter weekday afternoon starting at 3 on 8 80, ESPN, the ESPN New York app, and your smart speakers.