Hour 4: State of the NBA

Summary

Don, Hahn & Rosenberg Podcast - Hour 4: State of the NBA Summary

Release Date: February 18, 2025

In "Hour 4: State of the NBA," hosts Don Hahn, Alan Hahn, and Peter Rosenberg engage in a dynamic and insightful discussion about the current landscape of the NBA. The episode delves into various aspects of the league, including recent incidents, the efficacy of the All-Star Game, broadcasting strategies, and fan engagement. Through a blend of expert analysis, listener interactions, and personal anecdotes, the trio offers a comprehensive overview of the NBA's successes and challenges.

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Opening Discussion: Building Dream Teams in Business

The episode begins with Don Hahn and Peter Rosenberg drawing parallels between assembling a dream team in business and sports. Don emphasizes the importance of having skilled players:

Don Hahn [00:00]: "Are you ready to build your company's dream team?"

Peter adds that combining specialized professionals with award-winning AI can help identify MVPs in any organization:

Peter Rosenberg [00:03]: "Just like in sports, finding skilled players is essential for success."

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Recent Plane Incidents and Their Impact

Shifting gears, the hosts discuss a startling plane crash involving a Delta flight at Pearson Airport in Toronto. Don expresses his perplexity over how a plane could flip entirely during landing:

Don Hahn [03:10]: "I don't even... How does a plane completely flip over?"

Peter provides context by mentioning a series of recent aviation mishaps, including Vince Neil's private plane crash, highlighting concerns over increasing air safety issues:

Peter Rosenberg [02:26]: "There have been like two or three of those recently. I have... It's odd."

Don shares his personal apprehension about traveling more frequently due to these incidents:

Don Hahn [03:00]: "I've been traveling more than ever. It's freaking me out."

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The Rise of the "Four Nations" Hockey Event

Peter Rosenberg enthusiastically discusses the "Four Nations" hockey event, praising the high skill level of players like Charlie McAvoy and Sidney Crosby:

Peter Rosenberg [01:11]: "Like the four nations... it's just awesome hockey."

He cautions against overvaluing the event's format, urging fans to appreciate the genuine skill on display:

Peter Rosenberg [05:00]: "These are the best of their country playing. It's legit."

Don agrees, affirming the authenticity and competitive spirit of the event:

Don Hahn [06:34]: "So it's legit. It's an All Star Game. You are seeing All Stars get after it."

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Critique of the NBA All-Star Game

A significant portion of the episode critiques the NBA's All-Star Game, focusing on its lack of competitiveness and over-reliance on monetary incentives. Listener Presley from Brooklyn suggests that the introduction of the NBA Cup, offering $500,000 to each player, has made participation more enticing:

Presley [06:45]: "That's why they came up with the NBA cup. You give 500,000 to each player."

Don Hahn questions the effectiveness of such incentives, especially when compared to the substantial salaries of top-tier players:

Don Hahn [07:31]: "Crazy, Don, isn't it crazy that a 500 grand would affect those guys that much?"

Peter Rosenberg echoes skepticism, arguing that while money can attract players, it may not sustain genuine competition or fan interest:

Peter Rosenberg [08:24]: "I'm still unconvinced about how many players care about the in-season tournament as well."

The conversation highlights a broader issue of maintaining fan engagement through authentic gameplay versus manufactured entertainment.

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Broadcasting Strategies and Generational Gaps

The hosts delve into the NBA's broadcasting strategies, particularly the challenge of attracting younger audiences while honoring past legends. Peter criticizes the inclusion of older commentators who may not resonate with younger viewers:

Peter Rosenberg [12:53]: "They have to appease the 40 something that want to watch the game so they have, they can remember the good old days."

Don Hahn adds that broadcasters like Charles Barkley might not effectively engage a younger demographic:

Don Hahn [13:46]: "There are young people who are watching sketches last night going, I don't get it, I'm not interested."

Peter suggests that the NBA needs to balance honoring past stars with promoting contemporary voices to maintain relevance across generations.

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Listener Interactions: Suggestions for Improvement

The interactive segment features listeners presenting creative ideas to enhance the NBA experience. Presley proposes transforming the All-Star Game into a more entertaining spectacle by embracing its "goofy" side fully:

Presley [28:38]: "Let’s make a four-point shot... have alley oops worth four points instead of two points and just have it be a show."

Peter contemplates the practicality of such suggestions, considering their potential impact on the game's authenticity:

Peter Rosenberg [35:57]: "I just know it is what it is, guys. I really listen. I love the creativity."

Another listener, Jay from Newark, suggests hosting the All-Star Game in the MVP's home city to boost local engagement and revenue:

Jay [43:11]: "His organization should be able to host the following All-Star game. That man will literally bring massive amount of revenue to his city."

The hosts appreciate the input, discussing the feasibility and potential reception of these ideas within the broader NBA framework.

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Creative Solutions and Future Outlook

Exploring potential solutions to revitalize fan engagement, the hosts brainstorm innovative approaches. Presley imagines a relaxed, street-style All-Star Game with minimal competitiveness, drawing inspiration from unconventional formats:

Presley [44:35]: "They're just walking around the court and casually throwing the ball up and just... it's totally chilled out."

Don Hahn and Peter Rosenberg debate the merits of such ideas, weighing entertainment value against the need for genuine competition. They acknowledge the necessity of authentic gameplay to retain and grow the fanbase.

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Conclusion: Balancing Tradition and Innovation

As the episode concludes, Don Hahn and Peter Rosenberg reflect on the NBA's ongoing challenges, emphasizing the importance of balancing tradition with innovation. They agree that while financial incentives and special events can offer temporary boosts, sustainable fan engagement requires authentic competition and strategic broadcasting tailored to diverse audiences.

Don hints at future discussions, including deeper dives into the "Four Nations" tournament and further analysis of the All-Star Game's evolution:

Don Hahn [46:46]: "Tomorrow at 3:00 we'll do more, of course, on the four nations coming up Thursday."

Notable Quotes:

• Don Hahn [00:00]: "Are you ready to build your company's dream team?"
• Peter Rosenberg [01:11]: "Like the four nations... it's just awesome hockey."
• Presley [06:45]: "That's why they came up with the NBA cup. You give 500,000 to each player."
• Don Hahn [07:31]: "Crazy, Don, isn't it crazy that a 500 grand would affect those guys that much?"
• Peter Rosenberg [12:53]: "They have to appease the 40 something that want to watch the game so they have, they can remember the good old days."
• Presley [28:38]: "Let’s make a four-point shot... have alley oops worth four points instead of two points and just have it be a show."
• Jay [43:11]: "His organization should be able to host the following All-Star game. That man will literally bring massive amount of revenue to his city."

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This episode offers a thorough exploration of the NBA's current state, blending critical analysis with listener engagement. Don, Hahn, and Rosenberg provide valuable insights into maintaining the league's relevance and appeal in an ever-evolving sports landscape, making it a must-listen for basketball enthusiasts and industry watchers alike.

Transcript

[Don Hahn]

Are you ready to build your company's dream team?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Just like in sports, finding skilled players.

[Don Hahn]

Is essential for success. With Robert Haft's winning combination of specialized.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Recruiting professionals and award winning AI will help you find the MVPs and key role players who will have you hanging.

[Don Hahn]

Banners in the rafters. Because in business, it's all about having the experienced team on your side. At Robert Half, we know talent. Visit roberthalf.com today. This is the Don Han and Rosenberg podcast.

[Peter Rosenberg]

That sounds like heaven to me.

[Don Hahn]

Listen live weekday afternoon starting at 3.

[Tommy]

On 8 80, ESPN, the ESPN New.

[Don Hahn]

York app, and your smart speakers. In two years, Don, this day, this, this holiday Monday, we could be breaking down the super bowl from last night. Not. No, no, we will be if we still have a job. That is the plan. Two years from now. Super Bowl Sunday will fall on the President's Weekend Sunday. Does that feel weird to you or feel right?

[Peter Rosenberg]

No, it feels right. I think everybody would love to have the day off after the Super Bowl.

[Don Hahn]

It totally depends for me on how much I care about the Super Bowl. Like this past super bowl made no difference. I didn't even. I was checked out of it by the fourth quarter. But yeah, if it's a game I really care about, I'm excited. I go to someone's house for a party. That's a different kind of conversation. Can I say what I'm not thrilled about, Don?

[Peter Rosenberg]

What's that?

[Don Hahn]

Another. And by the way, that super bowl will be an ESPN vehicle. The one I'm talking about in two years. Oh yeah. I will say this, Don. I saw that there were injuries, fortunately no fatalities as a Delta flight landing at Pearson Airport in Toronto ended up flipping over.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah. How did that happen? I saw it. The pictures of it upside down, I guess something on landing.

[Don Hahn]

But like. And how is it a thing? I mean, I guess everyone's buckled up during the landing. So fortunately everyone was. No one was killed. But like, how does a plane completely flip over? I don't even. And by the way, can we just talk about this? How many different major plane things are going to open?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, we had those back to back things happen a few weeks ago, catastrophic ones. But there's also been like little like private airplanes. Like Vince Neil's private plane crashed. He wasn't on it, but his pilot passed away. There's been like two or three of those recently. I have. I've never seen it such a close proximity to each other. So I don't know if it's just coincidence or something's going on but it's odd.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah. Like, I'm flying to Pearson in a couple weeks, and I've been. And I've been traveling more than ever. It's. It's.

[Peter Rosenberg]

That's why.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah. Yyz. If that's what you're. What you're into. But, man.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Not good. But I'm sure we're gonna see, because that's the one thing about the cameras all over the place. Some there'll be footage of this. Some I just. I need to see how it ended up upside down.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah. That must be terrifying to getting to the point of that. I'm trying to. I like, wait, hold on. It's like, are the. Are the wings completely broken off? Because if the wings aren't. To me, it looks like they would have to be. Yeah. A wing is gone. There's a wing that's gone for sure. Because how else are you getting on your. On your back right. Plane?

[Peter Rosenberg]

One of them would have to be gone.

[Don Hahn]

It's freaking me out.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Tough, man. It's tough to talk about because we can all go relate to it. But, like, the one in dc, man, there were. There might have been people unbuckling because they're practically landing. No matter how scared you are about flying, like, when you get to that point where you see the Runway, you're coming down like, all right, we're home free.

[Don Hahn]

It's. It's so weird, man. This is. This is not okay. All right, back to la LA la. Nothing's happening. The world is good. Let's go to Tommy in Connecticut. What's up, Tommy, Donnie, Peter, always good to talk to you boys.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Thanks for having me.

[Don Hahn]

You too, man.

[Peter Rosenberg]

So, been a lot of chatter about the popularity and the success of the four nations. And I just Hope that the 4.4 million people that watched that game on Saturday, like, realize how high the level of skill they were watching was when they. When they showed the replay of McDavid's first goal when he's skating at 23 and a half miles an hour. I drove on a road today with the speed limit was 20. He could have gotten a speeding ticket on that road. Right? And then. And then what? Five minutes later, Charlie McAvoy blows him up and sets up that gentle goal. So it was just awesome hockey. I don't want the gameplay to be, you know, over. Overvalued by the success of the event, but it was. Oh, my. I didn't. I didn't sit down the entire game. No, it was amazing. And even today, what turned out to be an Important game for Canada, but it was pretty much over five, three late. I don't know if you saw it. Peter Crosby gets laid out at center ice, but then is able to get up and then fire it to the empty net to score and give it to Finland. Because they, they actually gave. I mean, they, they kind of laid down for two periods, but they did actually show out in the third. Yeah, listen, the winner of that game in regulation was advancing. So, yeah, it was important, but that for nothing for them to be able to still go out there and play, I thought was pretty interesting. Let me just caution everybody though, because this happens all the time. If you think you're going to turn on your next Ranger Islander Devil game in this, in this market, and we'll just, just because they are our property, we have a relationship with the Rangers. Ranger Sabers on Saturday when we come back is not going to be the same. All right? So that, that's always the danger is that like the 4.4 million people like, oh, man, this hockey, I didn't realize how cool it is. Let me watch the next game that's on in Chicago or New York or la, and don't expect it to be the same. Now, listen, there'll be intensity. I mean, they'll be into it. That's a, That's a meaningful game for the Rangers. They're going to want to win, but you're not going to see three fights in nine seconds. You're not going to skill, because not every player is to the level of the four nations. These are the best of their country playing.

[Don Hahn]

So it's legit.

[Peter Rosenberg]

It's.

[Don Hahn]

It's an All Star Game. You are seeing All Stars get after it. Let's go to Presley in Brooklyn. What up, yo, man?

[Presley]

All right, so I feel like everything has to be monetary as far as.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Getting everybody involved in this All Star Game.

[Presley]

That's why they came up with the NBA cup. You give 500,000 to each player, all.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Of a sudden, everybody wants to play the game.

[Presley]

Every time one of those NBA cup.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Games come, everybody is all in.

[Presley]

So, I mean, as much money as these All Star people players are making.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I mean, LeBron James was excited about making the $500k last year when they.

[Presley]

Won or two years ago, whenever that was. But yeah, they need to monetize it, try to incentivize the players for actually being there, wanting to play mean. Everybody's tired of the accolades, whether, you know, like just being there, making it boring. So, yeah, money talks for sure.

[Peter Rosenberg]

It's a shame but you're right. If you.

[Don Hahn]

Crazy, Don, isn't it crazy that a 500 grand would affect those guys that much? I'm not. It's real money. It's real money. For sure. For sure. But like $500,000 to the, to the guys on the end of the bench. Totally get it. $500,000 to the guys making 35 million a year. That's 1 70th of your salary. So if you currently make $70,000, would you be motivated to do something for $1,000? Sure, absolutely. But like it would completely change your level of interest. 1 70th of your salary. That's. It's surprising to me if that's actually. And Don, frankly, I'm still unconvinced about how many players care about the in season tournament as well.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I don't think they care. I think they care once they get to Vegas and they have a chance to win it. But because I look like the Lakers were totally in on it. I don't even know who won this year, do you? I mean, I know the Lakers won the first one. I don't. Didn't pay attention enough. The Bucks won to how much they cared, but I don't think their fans necessarily cared. You know, who would care if the Pistons won because they're probably not winning a channel. The Wizards won because they're not winning a championship. But you know, the Bucks still fancy themselves as a team that can make a run and certainly the Lakers might do that now. It feels contrived because that's what it is. It is contrived. It just. What. What's going to hit Peter? What's. What's going to make them care enough? Now the average NBA salary is 11 million each. But what's the average salary for an all star, right? So like. Yeah, so, yeah, McKay always used to mention it to like, listen, even, you know, even Warren Buffett cares about $500,000. But is it really going to make you die for that ball when you don't have to? Is it going to make you play when your hamstrings tight? Maybe, but I don't, I don't. How much money could you possibly offer them to care?

[Don Hahn]

Let's go to Danny and Elizabeth. What's up, Danny?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Danny.

[Presley]

Hey, what's up guys? Long time fan, Pete. I'm a listener of the Juan that podcast. I love it.

[Don Hahn]

Thank you, man.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Appreciate you.

[Presley]

I'm a Patreon, also a Patreon member.

[Don Hahn]

Oh, I love it. We have our patrons. Thank you, buddy.

[Presley]

Yeah, but yeah, I Just want to say like no one is mentioning that the, the All Star Game, the players do care man, but the, the way that TNT presented it yesterday, it was just horrible, man. It was like they honored Chuck and Kenny and Shaq like more than, than the actual players. And like I don't know why the NBA feels like they want to shove these, these guys down our throat. Like nobody likes that. The real NBA fans, we're annoyed by that. These guys, all they do is crap on the NBA any chance they get. That is Shaq, Shaq one like, like, like he crap on Jokic right to his facehold. He didn't deserve the mvp. Yesterday during the game, I know you guys didn't watch because you guys are watching snl, which I was watching too, switching back and forth. But there was a moment they stopped the game and Kevin Hart starts cracking on the players and he's making fun of, of SGA shoes. And SJ was mad. He was like, he was like wrapping up. Like he could just see the players didn't want to be there. It was, it was, that was embarrassing. And I'm just glad that next year NBC has the, the All Star Game. So hopefully it's going to be better and hopefully it's just east and west and give the winners a million dollars and that's it.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Maybe interesting perspective, which partly is good job.

[Don Hahn]

Which part?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Just, just, just the idea that you know, you're trying to get that younger audience. Everybody's trying to get the younger audience, yet you still have to drag guys that played years ago that have been crapping on the current league and that that's how you're marketing your sport. Like trying to appease the 40 something that want to watch the game so they have, they can remember the good old days. And yet how do the younger fans feel about these players who don't have anything kind to say about the current players and don't care about the old time stuff and they want, they want the players now to be promoted. Maybe that is a mistake by tnt. Maybe you gotta, you gotta turn into the curve of hey this, these are our all Stars. You know, listen, they gave Draymond's a current player but he's obviously a veteran. But maybe there's a, maybe there's a younger audience that just doesn't want to be told how great it used to be. That's a turn off I would think for you for younger kids, right?

[Don Hahn]

Did you see the news the other day that a local favorite is going to be in the mix for the NBA studio situation on NBC knows that Carmelo Anthony Nice will be a lead analyst. They're saying for the return of the NBA and NBC. He's been getting reps doing his 7pm in Brooklyn podcast with Marrow and my boy Kaz. So he's been, he's been doing a great job building up sort of his resume as a broadcaster. It's going to be interesting to see what they do overall. Like it's been so long, don, that since NBC's been it. I know Tirico's obviously going to be a lead, they said for lead play by play. But filling out all the other people for the NBC of it all is going to be interesting.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But, but put, put itself in, in the shoes of the younger audience. Okay, so when you were a kid watching the, the 1995 All Star Game and you're watching Penny and Shaq and Jordan, right? And the broadcast, on the broadcast or just in the, in the way that it was presented by the NBA on the court. They're dragging guys from the 70s out, you know, pick whoever you know, Dave DeBusher is coming out and all these great players from the past are coming out telling you how it was so much better when I played. Wouldn't that, wouldn't you be, would you be put off by that as a young fan watching, watching these elder statesmen coming out there and telling you how it's not as good as it was when I played. That's kind of what's happening now, right?

[Don Hahn]

You're not wrong.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Wouldn't you be like, oh shut up man. I got, I got. Listen, I love my dad, but that's all my dad go, oh, he wasn't like when I play and I roll my eyes like, yeah, okay, I don't need to be, I don't my face.

[Don Hahn]

There is also it like we all believe that Chuck is amazing, right? Like Charles is, is one of the greatest athlete to broadcast people who's ever lived. It is possible though that his humor and charm is lost on the 22 year old NBA fan. Like it is possible. We Don and I sat there and were amused by 90% of the SNL 50th anniversary yesterday. And I'm sure, you know, listen, they have young writers there so they know how to tap into some young people. But unquestionably there are young people who are watching sketches last night going, I don't get it, I'm not interested. It's not for me. Like those things do happen. So it is an interesting point. We never think about as Much as we love the inside the NBA crew, could they possibly be aging out of the young NBA fans?

[Peter Rosenberg]

But I would add one thing. When I guess the TNT crew, especially.

[Tommy]

Charles Barkley, has a whole segment dedicated.

[Peter Rosenberg]

To who he plays for. It doesn't help promote your product when you're joking on what certain players play where on certain teams. That, I mean, that's not really something you want your analyst to be doing. It is true. And one of the reasons we love the TNT is because they bash the league and they're honest about it. But does a young fan need to be told how bad what they're watching is?

[Don Hahn]

I don't know.

[Peter Rosenberg]

And you look at. It's an interesting parallel with snl. And we just said that, listen, a lot of the skits from back in the day didn't age very well, but we all understand the original cast. There wouldn't be an SNL. There wouldn't be a 50th anniversary. It wasn't for Ackroyd and Belushi and Chevy Chase, other than Chevy Chase being there on stage at the end. I mean, they didn't utilize those guys because let's face it, 80% of the audience can't relate to it. They know the names, but that's not their wheelhouse anymore because, because they really don't listen. They honored an 88 year old Garrett Morris because that was the right thing to do. And I don't know how much they could utilize him in a skit. But let's face it, if you, if your wheelhouse is, is the original cast now, you're not ready for primetime players. You're in your 70s.

[Don Hahn]

No, you're, you're old as dirt. It's, it's, it's, it's. The, the fact is, last night Don and I both, we both loved the SNL 50th Special. They really leaned into the cast of 2002. And beyond that, you got a lot of Kristen Wiig, you got your Maya Rudolph, you got your Amy Poehler's, your Tina Faze. They did not do a lot. Now Sandler hit his song, which I thought, by the way, was wonderful. I wept. Loved the Sandler song. He's, he's been crushing it. He did it as Kenny Center Honors and he did it again yesterday. He's been awesome. But yet it's so true. They really didn't lean back in. Now, Steve Martin opened the show and Martin Short closed the show. Two of the biggest icons ever in SNL history. But also, Don, they're Hot now.

[Peter Rosenberg]

They have a show right now that's. That's the perfect thing. Yeah, you can use Steve Martin and Martin short because they're in one of the biggest shows on right now in Only Murders in the Building. Like, would that have been the case if those guys hadn't done anything in a while? They're hot right now, so they're, they're utilizing them. But there's a lot, a lot of those guys haven't done anything since Saturday night.

[Don Hahn]

I have a scorching hot take for you right now. I'm hitting you with it right now. You ready?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Okay.

[Don Hahn]

I like them both. I like them both, particularly the first one, SNL over the last couple of years in particular this weekend. It's a lot of Pedro Pascal and John Mulaney. A lot like. I like them both. I do. We love Pedro. I'm a big fan of Last of Us and it starts again in April. I saw yesterday when I watch White Lotus. And John Mulaney is not my favorite comedian the way he is. Some though I like him. But Don, they go back to that. Well, with. Those are two guys they go back to constantly. I mean, they know what works. I guess they do. I mean, they also do a lot of Bad Bunny. But don't get me wrong, Bad Bunny is so huge generally that I guess I get it. But yes, sometimes the Pedro Pascal. Oh my God. He's not the number one actor on planet Earth.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Right.

[Don Hahn]

Good. And Mulaney never leaves Saturday Live. I can't watch an episode without him.

[Peter Rosenberg]

And they, they did utilize Lorraine Newman in that one bit, but it was kind of almost making fun of the old time. Right. So it wasn't that have been.

[Don Hahn]

Can I be honest? Because I barely remember Lorraine Newman. In fact, I don't really at all. Shouldn't that have been Jane Curtin like.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But maybe she didn't want to do it. I don't know.

[Don Hahn]

Maybe she just didn't want.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Maybe Lorraine Newman did it because she was. Again, she was a part of the original cast, but not. She wasn't.

[Don Hahn]

No, she's a. She's a forgotten player somewhat.

[Peter Rosenberg]

It's an unfortunate. She was really good. But don't get me wrong. I mean, obviously Gilda passed away a long time ago, but she wasn't Gilda Ratner. She wasn't John Belushi, she wasn't Chevy Chase. You know, there's a difference in that. But they, but they had to kind of entertain it with using one of the modern day guys, one of the, you know, just Kind of almost making fun of the generation gap. Now, Alan Hannah's text. Oh, he said this weekend is not the player's fault, it's the league's fault. I'll explain tomorrow. I've never seen a tease from a guy that took the day off for tomorrow. Classic.

[Don Hahn]

Alan, you rarely get that.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I don't think we've ever gotten it.

[Don Hahn]

This weekend is not the player's fault, it's the league's fault. I'll explain.

[Peter Rosenberg]

And maybe we just touched on it because that's all by design. It's. Listen, one of the difficult things about sports and even in television is all right, how do I get all the different generations to care? And when you're gonna skew young and when you are going to try to get a younger generation interested. I'm sorry, Peter, you're probably not gonna get a number because there's a whole generation that doesn't consume things on television. They don't sit there on a Saturday night and watch something on television. It just. That doesn't happen. So there's that juxtaposition of how do I get. How do I get the people that are the most interested and we're willing to spend the most money watch. Because television's kind of convoluted for them. Television is old school. Like how do you get younger generation of fans that love the NBA and consume the NBA but they're not going to sit there for three hours and watch something.

[Don Hahn]

By the way, I am curious for what Alan's going to say tomorrow when he's back with us starting at 3pm tomorrow afternoon about how. Now I can understand how it could be both. I don't know that he'll be able to convince me. It's fully not on the players tomorrow. Anthony edwards, late scratch. LeBron James late scratch. The general style of the of play. You know who decided to be in the dunk contest? I don't know. It'll be. I'm compelled to see if he can convince me. Well, because so far to me, Don, it would be decidedly. It's a.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Both.

[Don Hahn]

It's both players and the league have not made. Have not helped that weekend.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Well, now o'clock tomorrow.

[Don Hahn]

Now, now in the NHL, obviously the league made a decision that did put it on them and it paid off. And we'll talk about that as the week goes on because the USA and Canada will play 8:00 on Thursday on ABC ESPN. Get in the zone. AutoZone.

[Tommy]

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[Don Hahn]

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[Tommy]

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[Don Hahn]

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[Tommy]

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[Don Hahn]

Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast. I didn't listen to anything you just said. Catch the show on demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcasts. I understand this one. It's cuz Sabrina Carpenter opened the show last night with Paul Simon, huh? That's right. I got to tell you. Let me tell you something about Sabrina Carpenter. I certainly was in the camp of I did not think that I, I, I thought the Grammys got it right and that Cowboy Carter was album of the year. I thought it was a better album than Sabrina Carpenter's, but I got to tell you, that's a hell of a pop album. That's a really fun listen. And last night, getting to hear her, like, go acoustic with Paul Simon was really put her voice on display. She's super talented.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Very much so.

[Don Hahn]

I was impressed by Sabrina. That was a hell of a performance.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Now, you guys are familiar with, with Guns, right?

[Don Hahn]

You talk about the Guns show.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah.

[Don Hahn]

G U N Z. Sure. We know Guns well.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Big, big fan, you know, Worked for us. Love the. Worked for us for a long time. Gunzelman is a, is a really talented guy. Well, apparently he had an interaction with Kevin Durant.

[Don Hahn]

Okay.

[Peter Rosenberg]

On social media earlier today.

[Don Hahn]

Sure.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Like you dream about now. Kevin had tweeted out, I think it's more fun to complain about the NBA than to actually watch it. Crazy. Cancel All Star Weekend. Let's just give everybody a break since we're so miserable around this time. And then Guns responds. Katie, today's a day off for y'all. I am asking you to rewatch the full live broadcast with the unreal amount of commercials. Break commercial breaks, everything else today. Watch it from your couch and see if you can watch the full event straight through. And it was an All Star Game. Not ideal. And Kevin's response was, I get it. My point is, fans complain about everything. Like, nothing is good enough for the fans right now. Only thing they enjoy is playoffs, trade deadline, free agency. And when players beef with each other, laugh out loud. Well, whose fault's that? That's what I'd say to Kevin. I'm not saying it's your fault, Kevin, but, like, whose fault is that? That shows you that fans love the NBA. That's why when there was that big trade between the Lakers and the Mavericks, everybody talked about it. Because the NBA is huge. And when you get a great playoff series, you get to get a great playoff, period. The fans come out. There is no question the NBA has fans, but collectively, those fans check out during the regular season. Why? Well, because they like to complain. No, they. Because you're not entertaining them. They're there, but you're not entertaining them in other sports like the NHL. Well, maybe the fans just aren't there and they're trying to generate new fans. The NBA has shown when something happens, they all come out of the woodwork. So those fans have collectively Said your regular season's boring. I love you, but I'm not interested. Why? And the All Star Game, collectively, they've all said we're good.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah. By the way, I don't hate KD's response. No, like I totally get why he's like, hey, you know what? Everyone's not into this anyway. Let's just bag it. Totally hear you. But if there, there are other pieces here, there is a little bit of blame to be heaped on everybody.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Right. And the reason I brought up the regular season is because he said all they care about the trade deadline, the beefs, the playoffs. He named it free agency.

[Don Hahn]

He got it right. He named the things people like.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But they don't care about your regular season. Why? Because. And you blame the players. Don't blame the NBA. They've come up with the play in the in season tournament. They've. They've tried to make the games more meaningful by adding more playoff teams. Right. So those teams that normally would be tanking now have a chance to sneak into the playoffs because of load management. Because there's a lot of players that just don't put out the effort in the regular season. I'm telling you, I know it's a smaller fan base. This is not an NHL problem because the players, they don't load manage in the NHL. The games still have mean. Listen, I can't get you to care about Seattle and Sandy and San Jose because those teams stink. But you turn on most NHL games. The fans can be interested because their stars are playing every night, they are blocking shots and they're trying to win games. So it's not an NHL problem. They just haven't been able to generate the amount of fans the NBA does. The NBA does not have a generating fans problem. They've got fans, but their fans are collectively not entertained by your All Star game or your regular season. And I think they need to be more concerned about the regular season than the All Star game.

[Don Hahn]

Go back to the explosive phone lines on the show. Let's. Man, I'll tell you what though. People are into complaining about this All Star game in a good way. I'm not, I'm not mad. Let's do a Patty's idea. Patty and Schenectady. Let's put Patty's ideas. Patty.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Good evening gentlemen. I'm a first time caller so it's good to hear you live.

[Don Hahn]

Pleasure.

[Presley]

So my idea is let's buy into the goofiness. Like if it's going to be goofy and we're not Going to play defense. Let's buy into the goofiness. Let's make a four point shot. Let's make alley oops worth four points instead of two points and just have.

[Peter Rosenberg]

It be a show.

[Presley]

And then at least you can know who's gonna play and who's not. You don't have to worry about this guy's not playing basketball or that guy's not playing basketball.

[Don Hahn]

Just want to be a show.

[Peter Rosenberg]

That's what it's there for anyway.

[Presley]

No one's gonna compete the way they.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Did in the 90s anyway.

[Presley]

Unfortunately, that's kind of where we are.

[Don Hahn]

I just feel like that's already happened. Like I feel like it's already a goof and it's. Maybe what you're saying is just take it further. Like if you're gonna go. Yeah, like you're already gonna have it be silly. So you, you want to go full rock and jock, like 25 point basket.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Like maybe not that far, but like.

[Presley]

Okay, kind of how, Like, I don't know.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I've enjoyed the flag football for the.

[Presley]

NFL over the last couple years. Like, I think it's a fun way to get. I think they should do it with lineman. I think you should take a step.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Further and have a five on five.

[Presley]

Lineman tournament in flag football.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Like something like that for the NBA.

[Presley]

I don't know, just to get people.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Like, if it's going to be goofy.

[Presley]

Let'S just go all the way goofy. Let's not be half goofy and expect.

[Peter Rosenberg]

It to be a real game.

[Presley]

Let's go full goofy and have it be and fun, you know?

[Peter Rosenberg]

But you know what's so interesting about.

[Don Hahn]

I don't hate that thought, Patty.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I don't hate it either. I think you can again lean into what's happening here. But, but I think the issue with these all star games that is not an issue with the Pro bowl is the Pro Bowls at the end of the season. All right, you're. You're taking a break in the middle of the season and you're trying to offer those fans something and they're disappointed with it because they're not getting any old basketball. We're already ended a football season when they play the, the flag football, right? Season's over. Your team's already been eliminated or your team's getting ready to play in the super bowl. So you're already engaged, so it doesn't really matter. Like the Pro bowl never bothered me because it was at the end. Imagine if they stopped the regular season for two weeks and played A Pro bowl and it was flag football. People be out of their minds. It's like, why am I not playing regular season games? This is stupid. Because when you're interrupting the season for this, it's gonna aggravate people, right? Because they want to see something if it's at the end of this. If they don't care at the end of the season, it wouldn't matter.

[Don Hahn]

That's such a. You know what, Don? I don't. I don't know why people say that you're an idiot.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Because that's another great. I asked that every day.

[Don Hahn]

It's a great point by you because it's true. I literally love the NFL more than life itself. And forget about the Pro bowl every year. I don't spend time complaining about it. I don't talk about how they could improve it. No thoughts about it whatsoever. However, this one, it's annoying. We want it to be good. Let's go to Geno in the Bronx. What up, Gino?

[Presley]

What's up? Hey. So I've been watching hockey for 50 years, right?

[Don Hahn]

50.

[Peter Rosenberg]

50.

[Presley]

So listen, so I love the international competition. Love it, right? So going back to the old Canada Cups, right, It was. It was different. So watching the game Saturday, it was intense. It was great. Every. All that was great, right?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Right.

[Presley]

But what I think got. Got lost is the speed is so much. And this is what's different from the old Canada Cups. The speed in today's players, the size, the speed, as fast as the game is the rink. To me, that's why I think the Olympic next year will be a better product because it's going to show more of the. Of the skill of the great player. The stood. The speed of the game neutralizes the. You know, all the skills. So you look at all the big time players, right? The Matthews, the. The Hughes, Crosby, McKinnon. You know, McDavid was. Was the best player on both teams, right? But how many guys were stars? Mitch Marner, all these guys are stars. And you didn't even notice. You didn't even notice because there was just no room. There was no time. There was no space, right? And Canada to me lost. And that's why I think Thursday they'll play a simple north south game. They were doing way too much. East, west and everything got intercepted. And listen, I'm a huge Pence fan, right? Crosby, Mario's my favorite, is my next. But since turnover was just a hope pass, east west got picked off, turning to a two on one. And then Canada's got a seven Goal right in Bennington, who. Who's terrible. And if they lose, that'll be the reason. That'll be the reason why. Because I. The first goal was brutal, right? Soft goal. And the second goal was just too far. That shot's probably not beaten, you know, a Shastar.

[Peter Rosenberg]

There's no. There's no question that Canada's goalies aren't as good. And that's why I gave USA a chance and I picked them to win. Because I think Hollabuk is way better than Bennington or anybody else, whether it's Aiden Hill, whoever would play for Team Canada. Here's the thing. When you get to the Olympics, Peter, you'll play an international ice surface. So it's all skill. You're playing on an NHL service, which is switched smaller. But even. Even that said, Peter, as intense as the game was, you still saw the McDavid goal, showed all skill. I mean, Bennington had the secondary assist on that. Was it Bennington, the McKinnon, now the McDavid Bangalore. So there's still. I don't want to see it too much of anything. I want to be able to see an actual game. That's what makes it work. So I don't want to see all skill and no physicality. I want to see the best of both. And that's what I saw in that game Saturday. That's what made it so much fun. It wasn't just the fighting, because once that was over, we actually had a game that only saw four goals, one of them into the empty net. But I saw skill, I saw hitting, I saw strategy. I mean, these are the things that.

[Don Hahn]

You want to see of fights.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah, I mean, so you really saw everything. So when it's international, they don't fight. It's not that physical because there's more ice to skate. And you'd see a ton of skill, but then that would be it. Hockey's got everything, and you want to be able to include everything in the competition. That's what makes it fun to watch.

[Don Hahn]

Let's keep things moving. Let's go to Rich and Forest Hills Queen.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Rich.

[Don Hahn]

What up, Rich?

[Presley]

Hey, guys. How's it going?

[Peter Rosenberg]

It's all going. So all happening.

[Presley]

Good, good. So two points on how to change NBA, maybe regular season a little bit.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Number one. And I don't know if it's feasible.

[Presley]

But instead of giving them the annual salary divided by 82, give them game checks. So if they don't play, they don't get paid. We said during the All Star Game, the monetary Incentive maybe not enough, but if LeBron said 6, 7 games, maybe 4 million, 5 million is enough.

[Peter Rosenberg]

But we haven't. We have a union that would just never allow that to happen. I appreciate the effort, I do, but the union's not going to let that happen. And there are times where players can't play. That's the thing is if I say my back's bothering me, who, who are you to take money away from me? My back's bothering me. Now. I can't. You can't put them on a lie detector test. But like, how do you do that? You just can't fair.

[Presley]

And that's why I said I didn't know the feasibility. The second one, what if you make free throws worth two points? Maybe you get a little bit more action in the paint. Maybe people are getting more fouls and you're not just throwing up these three pointers from all the way outside. Maybe that gets the game a little bit more physical. Bring it back. That's the other one that I was thinking about.

[Don Hahn]

Yeah, I'm not into these. Thank you, Rich. I'm not into these. Sort of like if we, if we really futz with the game in fundamental ways, we can accidentally have it turn into like, better.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I just know it is what it is, guys. I really listen. I love the creativity. It just shows that our audience is smart and how desperately they want, want to see something change.

[Don Hahn]

But I mean, listen, the, they're obvious ones. You could try push the, push the three point line back significantly. I don't know, push it back five feet. That could do something.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I've always said that. No, nobody wants to do it. But at what point do you outgrow your game? Like when they invented basketball, they had the height of the basket when they put in the three point play, which was what, 40 years ago? Haven't we outgrown it? When guys are taking threes from the logo, maybe it's time to move it. When guys are seven foot and skilled, maybe it's time to raise the basket. I mean, don't you outgrow it? When the average guy was 6, 2, then it made sense. But now the average guy is like 6, 9, 6, 10. Like you, right? And don't you get to that point? Like baseball seems to have it right? Like no matter how it just, they, they're just out at first base. But ever got to the point where everybody on. When there was a ground ball to the second baseman and everybody beat it out, wouldn't they change that? It wouldn't be 60ft in 90ft anymore. You change it. They haven't had to do it. But in basketball, does it make sense that that's the same court that, you know, that Garon played on and that Mahavlich played like? Right. We've evolved as people were bigger. There's a reason why all these players hit their head on the dugout at Fenway Park. Because people are older than they were in 1912 or taller than they are in 1912.

[Don Hahn]

The NBA was, like, 5 foot 4 and Jewish. Okay. Right. It's a fair point.

[Peter Rosenberg]

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[Don Hahn]

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[Peter Rosenberg]

Sorry, do we legally have to say that?

[Don Hahn]

No. This is just how I talk. And I really love my Bombas.

[Peter Rosenberg]

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[Don Hahn]

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[Peter Rosenberg]

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[Don Hahn]

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[Peter Rosenberg]

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[Don Hahn]

Now, let's break it down.

[Peter Rosenberg]

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[Don Hahn]

Sound good?

[Tommy]

I participate in restaurants for a limited time.

[Peter Rosenberg]

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[Don Hahn]

Thanks for listening to the Don Han and Rosenberg podcast. I didn't listen to anything you just said. Catch the show on demand whenever you want. Just subscribe to us wherever you get your podcasts. Oh, yeah.

[Peter Rosenberg]

One of the great innuendo songs of all time.

[Don Hahn]

What's it called?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Big Balls.

[Don Hahn]

Sorry?

[Peter Rosenberg]

That's what it's called.

[Don Hahn]

Big Balls.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah, like, you know, it's about ballrooms. My ballroom's always full. I'm itching to tell you about it. These are the lyrics from the song, which is, like, all innuendo. It's really. It's a classic AC DC song Off the Dirty Deeds album. Bon Scott, lead singer before he choked on his own vomit, which is a way a lot of rockers go. It's the number one cause of death among rock and rollers back in the 70s.

[Don Hahn]

Did you pull up that audio of Don in the last segment there? Jingle.

[Peter Rosenberg]

What did I say? Thanks. What did I say?

[Don Hahn]

I guess he didn't. Does that mean you didn't capture. I didn't pull you.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I guess not.

[Don Hahn]

You tried to say. You tried to say a play. You were pulling a player's name from the NBA. You tell me. Maybe I misunderstood.

[Tommy]

Let's hear what happened.

[Peter Rosenberg]

That. That's the same court that, you know, that Garon played on and that Mahavlich played like. Right.

[Don Hahn]

Unless I'm mistaken. Did you make a mistake there?

[Peter Rosenberg]

No.

[Don Hahn]

Mahavlich.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Oh, you know what? I said Mahavlich, which is a hockey. So I don't. I don't take it back.

[Don Hahn]

You.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Because they were big basketball players.

[Don Hahn]

You meant Maravich.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I meant Maravich, but I went Mahovlich because I'm a hockey guy and I'm proud of it. I'd do it again. Pete and Frank are very good people. I'd say Pete at the Garden all the time. He was a scout for the Panthers.

[Don Hahn]

Big M. Yeah.

[Peter Rosenberg]

So these are. These are actually. You know what I'm proud of that I would do it again. You could correct me and I'd say, no, no.

[Don Hahn]

Who was the first name you said, by the way?

[Peter Rosenberg]

Bob Garon, but he's the famous Nick.

[Don Hahn]

Okay, so you went Bob Guerin first. I think we had a Bob Guerin drop. You had a. You went Bob Guerin first, followed by then.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I meant to say Pete Maravich, but Pete Mahovlich again, very proud.

[Don Hahn]

Can I hear one more time that.

[Peter Rosenberg]

That'S the same court that, you know, that Garen played on and that Mahavlich played like. Right. Well, Mahavlic played the court. They removed the court and it was the eyes. He played at the Garden back. I was really struggling for trying to find the 70s comp guys. I did throw the busher out and I could have went wilt. I was trying to. I was trying to get too obscure.

[Don Hahn]

Hold on. Do you mean. Do you mean Richie Garrett?

[Peter Rosenberg]

That's it again. Hockey Bob Garrett. You know what? I'm again, very proud. I. I've never been more proud of myself.

[Don Hahn]

None of those players played on that court either, so.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Right. But Bill Garon is the guy I tried to avoid saying.

[Don Hahn]

Right.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Because Bill Guerin, you know, obviously the General manager of Team usa, former Devil, Stanley cup champion Richie Garrett. But I went, Garon. But whatever. I, I. Listen, it was an effort. It was an effort.

[Don Hahn]

You effort it.

[Peter Rosenberg]

And you know what? Still a much better effort than you get from the NBA players on a given day.

[Don Hahn]

Well said. All right, let's go to Jay in Newark. Hey, Jay.

[Presley]

Hey, guys, quick idea and I'll get out your way. All Star mvp. His organization should be able to host the following All Star game. That man will literally bring massive amount of revenue to his city. If they're allowed to do that, I think that'll make some play. His organization is going to want him to play hard.

[Don Hahn]

Well, they always plan these things years out. Yeah, but that is interesting. If you're going to come up with a way to try to trick people into trying, that, that would be an interesting one.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Now, you might not be able to do it the next year for what Peter said, but, you know, could you do it in like, two years from now where now they're. They're part of the rotation? Although, God, they would die if somebody from Sacramento won.

[Don Hahn]

Oh, nightmare. Let's go to Stephen in Melville. Hey, Steven.

[Presley]

Hey, guys.

[Don Hahn]

Hey, man.

[Presley]

Hello. First, I wanna, I wanna say I Do it Again is so underrated. It's just, it's.

[Peter Rosenberg]

It's such a state, such an arrogance.

[Don Hahn]

And it's a staple of what we do. And you're right, it's great. It is a great I Do It Again as a Don Classic that can't underappreciate.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Thank you for noticing.

[Presley]

Yeah. Fixing, you know, the conversation about fixing the NBA. Talk about underrated. Fix. The conversation about fixing the NBA All Star Game is fantastic. I would like to see you guys lean into it. I love lean into it too. It's fantastic. All these ideas. I'm even thinking of, like a game show of a show that would be dedicated to just people talking about how to fix the NBA. I'm thinking about a contest. The NBA has a contest.

[Don Hahn]

Fix our league.

[Presley]

Oh, yeah. People has a contest. What do you think? And then you win the contest, you get $50,000. So my idea for. My wacky idea for fixing the NBA is the guys are all wearing street clothes. They wear a cap of their team and they're just like walking around. They're not even running on the court. They're just walking.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Like.

[Don Hahn]

You can smoke a cigarette during this game.

[Presley]

Yes, exactly. It's totally chilled out. And the guy. And you got the, you got you catching all the every, all their banter with like, Maybe the parabolic mics picking up all I was thinking about. They're all. Mike, but forget that. The nice job with the parabolic mics to pick up all the conversation. They're just walking around the court and casually throwing the ball up and just. And not the street clothes. Not that. The fancy stuff where they're going out and they're all this. No, I'm talking about the street clothes. Like guys show up to the 4th Street. What's that? You know, what's the court on the famous court and West 4th. West 4th, yeah. The way that guys would show up to the court, that they're dressed like that.

[Don Hahn]

Even Stephen in Melville. How old are you, my friend?

[Presley]

62.

[Don Hahn]

So you're close to the age of Richard. I think Stephen is like sane Richard. Don.

[Presley]

Yeah, yeah.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Yeah. He's. I like Steven together. I like it.

[Don Hahn]

I want more of you, Steven. I want you back as a fixture.

[Peter Rosenberg]

I don't know how big a Monty Python fan you are, but when he was talking about that they're all in their street clothes, just wandering around the court. There's an old Monty Python bit where they. All the scholars of history are going to play soccer and they, they blow the whistle and they just start wandering around like reading books. So it's like Socrates just. It just, it's very. That's what I just thought. They're just wandering around, hanging out, high fiving each other, not playing, waving to the crowd.

[Don Hahn]

I do think we found something that, that leaning in. If you're gonna, if you're not gonna change this thing and make it competitive, leaning into it being what it is may be a great idea. Tomorrow at 3:00 we'll do more, of course, on the four nations coming up Thursday. Alan will be back, give us his theory on the All Star weekend. We will see you tomorrow right here on Don Hahn and Rosenberg.

[Peter Rosenberg]

Thanks for listening to the Don Hahn and Rosenberg podcast. I don't want to know how the sausage is made, man.

[Don Hahn]

I just want to know.

[Peter Rosenberg]

It's good.

[Tommy]

Hear more of Don Allen and Peter weekday afternoon starting at 3 on 8 80, ESPN, the ESPN New York app, and your smart speakers. All right, let me ask you something. Ever feel like you're juggling at all, work, family responsibilities and still trying to keep your eye on the ball? Yeah. You're in. Ander and National University gets the hustle. That's why they have flexible online classes and support services for folks who are balancing jobs and kids and everything in between. If you're ready to take the next step, National University can help you level up your education and score your goals. Check them out at nu Edu to learn more.