The PM Podcast: "For The Next 100 Years: A Conversation with Dr. Abraham George"

Date: August 30, 2025
Host: Jay Frost
Guest: Dr. Abraham George
Produced by: Jack Frost (DonorSearch)

Overview

This episode features an intimate and inspiring conversation between Jay Frost and Dr. Abraham George—founder of Shanti Bhavan and The George Foundation—whose work has transformed the lives of India's most disadvantaged children through education and social empowerment. The discussion traces Dr. George’s journey from a military officer in Southern India to a successful international finance professional, and finally to a lifelong philanthropist challenging systems of caste and poverty. The conversation delves deeply into the origins, philosophies, challenges, and triumphs of Shanti Bhavan, illustrated with personal anecdotes and bold reflections on social change.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Early Life and Military Career

• Dr. George’s Roots in Kerala

  • Born in Trivandrum, at the southern tip of India.
  • Attended the elite National Defense Academy, modeled after Sandhurst (01:20).

• Military Motivation and Experience

  • Childhood fascination: Inspired by the synchronized parades outside his grandfather’s house:
    • “I got excited and I told my parents, you know, I like to join the military. That's what happened. Nothing else.” (02:39)
  • Early exposure to national diversity in the military, with a stark north-south cultural divide (05:00).
  • Rapid promotions, becoming the youngest captain in the Indian military at the time.

• Transformative Accident

  • Deployed to the Himalayan front post-China conflict, suffered a near-fatal dynamite accident at 18:
    • “There was absolutely no reason why I should have been saved. If I was a fraction of a second late, I would have been killed... That is the beginning of my story.” (09:54)
  • Recovery offered time for deep personal reflection and seeded a desire for social service (10:32).

2. Seeds of Philanthropy

• Formative Influences

  • Impact of reading Albert Schweitzer and classic works on Western civilization, challenging the morality of war and the dignity of service (11:49).
  • “There is nothing right about war. It’s about who is left.” (12:24)
  • Family influences: Father’s refusal to fund church division, emphasizing action over rhetoric (14:36).

• Awakening to Social Responsibility

  • Early lessons in the importance of service and the limitations of charity without systemic change.

3. Journey to the United States & Broadening Perspective

• Immigration and Education

  • Moved to the US in 1968, supported by his trailblazing mother—a physicist working at NASA (16:49–17:18).
  • Lived in segregated Alabama, experienced racial discrimination firsthand:
    • “I learned firsthand what segregation was because I never felt it. I had never been a victim of racial prejudice.” (18:42)

• Parallels Between Caste and Race

  • Explores similarities/differences between US racial discrimination and India’s caste system (20:13).
  • Witnessed caste-based marginalization throughout India, especially during military service.

4. Conceptualizing Shanti Bhavan

• Challenging the Caste System

  • Academic exploration in economic development and persistent belief that change must come “from the bottom up” (23:18).
  • Rejected common wisdom that poor children lacked intrinsic capabilities:
    • “If you bring them up well, correctly and give the best education, they too will succeed.” (24:35)

• Defying Skepticism

  • Board members, despite prominence, doubted the vision.

    • “None of them believed that poor children, children from poor families can succeed… I refused to accept that.” (24:35)

  • Results over time “proved the first point”—graduates now attend top universities and work for major multinational companies. (26:54)

    • “Our kids get 95 to 99 percentile in SAT... It is possible children from the poorest of society can achieve great success if you bring them up well.” (27:30)

5. From Vision to Reality: Founding & Building Shanti Bhavan

• Transition from Finance to Philanthropy

  • Successful international career (JP Morgan, Credit Suisse), then sold everything in his late 40s to return to India for service:
    • “I decided that I cannot wait any longer... I sold everything... came to India.” (30:44)

• Sacrifices and Family Support

  • Family dislocation: Lived apart from his wife for 25 years to pursue this mission (32:07).
  • His son, Ajit, joined and now leads fundraising and organizational transition.
  • Major personal financial risk, especially after 2007-08 losses; recovery achieved through dedication and support, primarily from US donors (33:44).

6. Operating Shanti Bhavan: Philosophy & Practice

• Recruitment and Immersion

  • Admission criteria: Only families earning less than $2/day; many single mothers (35:07).

  • Age of admission: 4 years old for full immersion, to counter negative home environments and instill new values (36:00).

  • Balanced visitation policy preserves family ties while prioritizing transformative upbringing.

    • “The model has worked immensely well. I am able to groom the children to be suited for today’s society...” (37:22)

• Values and Success

  • Social, ethical, and global values emphasized alongside academic excellence.
  • Alumni now working for leading companies worldwide; “the secret is you have to love them just as your own” (37:50).

7. Breaking the Cycle and Measuring Impact

• Lifecycle of a Student

  • Ongoing support through college and into professional life (38:11).

  • Graduates urged to focus initially on family upliftment, but also given a “moral obligation” to help at least 100 others in their lifetime (39:59).

    • “You have a moral obligation to help others, just the same way as you have been helped by strangers...” (40:20)

• Multiplicative Change Model:

  • Goal is a generational ripple effect to “break the caste system” from within.

8. Sustaining the Vision: Leadership and Longevity

• Building the Team and Succession

  • Shanti Bhavan now has 120–130 staff; biggest challenge is instilling organizational values in employees (42:53).

  • Transition plan: Son Ajit taking over, supported by new staff, including alumni and their descendants (44:13).

    • “I have created a family, not an institution... the affection, the care between each other is what makes this organization run.” (44:32)

• Preparing for the Next Century

  • Focused on creating sustainability beyond personal leadership: “Planning for the next 100 years.” (45:57)

9. Reflections, Pride, and Final Thoughts

• Greatest Source of Pride

  • “The greatest pride obviously comes from the fact that the children are blossoming... They are able to live a good life.... And the second part is they’re lovely children. The amount of affection I get, I can’t describe to you.” (46:15–46:49)
  • The relationship: “Don’t think of you as a father. Father is your biological. I am your dad only.” (47:11)

• Purpose of Life

  • “The purpose of life that I have been chasing from early years, I feel I have achieved a little bit of that or quite a bit of it, and I’m a happy man because of that.” (49:51)

• Approach to Challenges

  • Stresses the role of environment—love, attention, and care—in overcoming difficulties faced by children (49:51–50:33).

Notable Quotes

• “There is nothing right about war. It is about who is left.” —Dr. George, reflecting on the impact of history books (12:24).
• “If you bring them up well, correctly and give the best education, they too will succeed.” —Dr. George on the capabilities of disadvantaged youth (24:35).
• “The secret is you have to love them just as your own. If you do those two things, you can, can groom them.” —Dr. George on the recipe for success at Shanti Bhavan (37:50).
• “I have created a family, not an institution.” —Dr. George, on Shanti Bhavan’s culture (44:32).
• “You have a moral obligation to help others, just the same way as you have been helped by strangers...” —Dr. George on civic duty (40:20).
• “The purpose of life... I feel I have achieved a little bit... and I’m a happy man because of that.” (49:51)

Timestamps for Important Segments

• 01:20 — Dr. George’s early life and introduction to military life
• 09:54 — Life-changing accident and contemplation on purpose
• 14:36 — Insightful childhood lesson on service
• 17:18 — Experience in segregated Alabama
• 20:13 — Analysis of caste vs. race discrimination
• 23:18 — Academic formulation of the “bottom-up” model
• 26:54 — Graduation results and challenging stereotypes
• 30:44 — Transition from finance to philanthropy
• 35:07 — Unique recruitment model for Shanti Bhavan
• 37:50 — Dr. George shares the essential elements behind his success
• 39:59 — The principle of “100 lives” and the ripple effect
• 44:32 — Organizational culture: family over institution
• 45:57 — Looking ahead to a sustainable, 100-year legacy
• 46:15 — Greatest personal pride
• 49:51 — Fulfillment and the meaning of life

Memorable Moments

• Dr. George recounting his harrowing Himalayan explosion, sparing his men, and considering the moral arc of his existence (09:54–10:32).
• The practical, loving design of Shanti Bhavan’s model: full immersion, focus on the youngest, and an emphasis on universal values (37:22–37:50).
• Discussion on the deeply personal sacrifices, including decades-long geographical separation from his wife, to pursue a mission-driven life (32:07).
• Dr. George candidly mentioning his board’s skepticism and how tangible results won over doubters (28:21–28:56).

Conclusion

Dr. Abraham George’s life and work exemplify principled action, sacrifice, and audacious hope. From military parades in Kerala to Wall Street boardrooms and the villages of India, Dr. George’s journey showcases the power of one individual’s vision—rooted in love, service, and transformative education—to reshape the trajectories of generations. His approach at Shanti Bhavan not only breaks barriers for India’s most marginalized but provides a replicable blueprint for bottom-up social change worldwide.