B (3:34)

But my mom loves his show. By the way, not to interrupt you. My mom would watch his show every day.

A (3:40)

I think a lot of people did. I mean, he had a huge audience, of course, and he's a guy who gave up a lot to take the role. So he gave up a lot of money in order to do it. So that's. When you see stuff like that, it feels like a positive sign. It's a sign of somebody trying to do something that they think is more important but involves personal sacrifice on their part to do it. A good signal, usually. But for people like. So across the board, everyone in the administration who had ever discussed this matter within the last several weeks or months, people who had access to information, who publicly declared that there was something there, sometimes in exquisite detail, including thousands of hours of pedophilia. Right. To then do a 180 on this completely and act as though it's totally nothing. This is this. When have we ever seen anything like this? I mean, I cannot think of another. The only other example I see where people are willing to come into the camera, come in front of a camera and willing to essentially trash their integrity so deeply was during COVID And other than that, in my life, I do not recall that happening. I mean, people would hedge or something. And so then you got to wonder, well, what is it that would make them do it? And then there are the Trump apologists who say, well, now he's got all the blackmail data and now he can get his way. Okay, let's assume that's true. So you're going to allow these unbelievably evil acts that have been perpetrated on the most innocent amongst us children, and it is way worse than Epstein getting massages from 17 year old girls. I mean, it's evil shit that was going on for a long period of time. You're going to say that is not, it's not worth trying to right that wrong, which is probably still occurring even though Epstein is not the center of it anymore. In order that I can use the blackmail against other people to force through my economic agenda. I mean, fuck you, that's ridiculous. There isn't the economic agenda. I want America to be strong. I want America's economy to be turned around. But I, if it meant that children would be abused for that to occur. No, I'm not in with that. So that theory to me is ridiculous. The theory that maybe Trump is on the list and that's why he wouldn't do it. That doesn't make sense to me either. He may or may not be on the list, but he wouldn't have to because we have no, I mean there are people who have, like Ryan Dawson has done a huge amount of work on this and has well documented the people, the characters involved with it. He didn't have anything with Trump on it. But there are bad, there are bad actors that could be outed, could be prosecuted for this and Trump still retain information that if he were on it. So I don't believe it's to cover up his own involvement with it because they could do partial information. We would have no idea. It's not the complete information. So I don't think that's it. There's also the basic handling of it. The idea that you would come out and say there's nothing here, it's just. Yeah, where we were wrong, there's just actually nothing here. Move on. That to me is a crazy way to approach it. Why would you approach it like that? They could literally say this is a huge investigation, it's gonna take us a lot of time and we're working on it. And they could drag that shit out for years like that. They could slow roll it if they wanted to. So why didn't they take that approach? Is it that they're too stupid to do that? No, these people are not that stupid. So that doesn't make sense to me. So the data point, I guess that they came out and did it the way that they did it and that these characters, which at least I believed had some integrity, were willing to totally torch all of that integrity to destroy their futures. And some of them had futures that were, would be very expensive to destroy, like Dan Bongino for instance, must Mean something like one other theory is it's so big that it would cause so many institutions to fall, so many things to. It's got all these Wall street guys in there and it would cause damage to the economy and the markets and great turmoil and all of that. And so we need to save ourselves from the truth in order to preserve the system. That too again, will I, am I, will I. Are your viewers willing to preserve this system and in exchange for that to sacrifice. Is it hundreds, thousands, tens of thousands of children that get abused and even killed? You've heard the stuff that Dave Column talks about with this and it's the dark side of this, how dark it gets. And it's true. So are you willing to make that trade? Like, I don't think I'm not willing to make that trade. So all the, like, the justifications that are used for it don't make sense as to why you would do it. And the inexplicable 180 of all these people, like what, Let me ask you this. What do you think would motivate all of them universally without any not one person step? Like if I'm Dan, as soon as I hear this, I resign. I'm just out. It's just that simple. It's not like I know we hear in the press they might resign. I think that's all nonsense. If you're gonna resign, it's like that day, it's like, no, I'm not. I will not participate in this. I'm out of here. You resign and then you have a career. You have plenty of career to continue beyond that. So what is it, do you think that would cause all these people universally to make a 180 like that? And in the eyes of many who pay, in the eyes of anyone paying attention, know that they're lying.

B (10:37)

I'll take a step back here for a second and ask you the question that. It's the same question I've asked myself and I can't come up with a conclusion is why would they even take these positions to begin with? They were, this was not they. All these people were in the government, right? I mean Bondi was the attorney general in Florida and then her track, her experience before that. Patel, this is not his first time in law enforcement. Bongino was in Secret Service. I don't know how high up he climbed within Secret Service. But you would think that these people would have had the exposure of what you're truly dealing with in this toxic, unsalvageable system. So why especially Bongino, why give up something? You're making so much money, you've got a huge audience, knowing what you. I have to believe they knew what they were getting themselves into with all this. And then go ahead.

A (11:33)

I don't know, though. In the layers of bureaucracy that exist, I think maybe they don't. In Bongino's case, I could see certainly that he. I like to. And it's possible that he was compromised before in some way already, but I don't know. I think that he believed that he could actually make a difference. At least that's what I like to believe. He thought that he could actually make a difference because his exposure had been limited within a certain bureaucracy. And he thought that if he could skip levels above that bureaucracy, that changes could be made, that justice could be brought. So why would you do it? I think you do it as an act of service. And I like to think that there still are Americans who have a belief in the act of service and personal. Everything is. Life is not all about personal gain. You don't do things because they're to your personal advantage always. You do them because they're the right thing to do. And so I think that some of them must have been motivated by that. And I can't say about. I can't just say this about Lutnick. Ludnick expects to get more out of this in some way, I guarantee it. But Bongino, I don't see how he moves up through a move like this. And now he's only. His only option is down, I think, from this.

B (13:01)

So how could he go back. How could he go back to his show after this? There's no way.

A (13:08)

I can't imagine that people would be. Because, listen, at some point in your life, you have to draw a line in the sand, like, what is acceptable and what is not. And if you have children, for sure, the line in the sand is children. For a lot of people who don't have children, the line in the sand is children. So, like, this is something that cannot be smoothed over easily. This is where beyond this line, evil shall not pass. Like, this is it. I can deal with all the bullshit. I can deal with all the crimes and the corruption and the USAID stuff, but this is a line that is intolerable. And I think a lot of people feel that way, and I'm sure a lot of Dan's fans. Fans feel that way, in part because he was very outspoken about these crimes and how awful they were and how they needed to be dealt with.

B (14:14)

Yeah, and the other thing is too. So getting back to what you had asked, I mean, because Pam Bondi's response, that had to come from the White House. Right.

A (14:24)

And. And, yeah, yeah. And Pam Bondi, I think, is a nobody anyway. I think she's a suit that she's just a. She could be whatever she needs to be. So I don't see her as a bastion of integrity or whatever, anyway, or of a person of principle at all. So I can see her like, oh, this is what I have to say now. Okay, this is what I'm gonna say.

B (14:47)

So Kash Patel.

A (14:54)

Clearly a social climber, social seeker. I mean, he was on the podcast circuit big time. He's enriched himself quite greatly in the last several years. So I wouldn't see him as somebody necessarily with a strong sense of integrity or a personal philosophy necessarily, because he has. He's done what's benefited Cash to a great degree over the last several years.

B (15:27)

And for them to do the 180, it also, I mean, tell me your thoughts. They just don't care. Like, this is the way it is. We're moving on, and there's nothing you can do about it.

A (15:41)

Well, why not resign?

B (15:42)

But I mean, just in general, with the administration of the way they're. The way they're like with Trump just calling out that journalist, making them, degrading them basically for asking that question, it's to me, sending the message to the public, this is the way it is. We're moving on, and there's nothing you can do about it.

A (16:01)

Got it. And that's. And I understand that because you're not in charge, it's the administration's in charge. Like, they make the policy, but you can choose to participate or not. And the fact that there is universal participation and universal public coming on a camera and looking the American people in the face and lying. And it takes. We saw it during COVID I think there were a lot of useful idiots, but a lot of people that would just come on and they would just actually lie to people's faces. And again, this is the parallel with now and I. So I think that there's some. What would motivate you to do that? I mean, what kind of blackmail would they have to have on you to get you to do it? Or what bribe could you could be offered to get someone to destroy themselves like that? I can't imagine actually any. I can't imagine blackmail. Oh, so, yeah, NSA's got your web history. We know that are really into dwarf porn and we're going to tell everybody about it. Like, I would expect someone like Dan Bond to say, fuck it, I don't care. I'll take that hit. I'm not going to destroy myself, like, destroy everything that I stand for, do something I will regret for the rest of my life and go along and participate in this. So bribery and blackmail, those don't seem to be it in my mind. And I don't believe that there's nothing there. So what is it? And the only thing I could come up with is absolute fear. Fear. And when you see that original interview with Kash Patel and Dan Bongino where they're basically saying, oh, no, he definitely killed himself. And they look like they're. They looked like they just got put through some shock therapy right beforehand. I think you could see the fear. It was still recent enough in their mind that it was still dominating their thinking when they came out and lied then. And then they, of course, have continued to do so since then. And maybe you've even become more comfortable with lying with the deal that they made at this point. But it's still. To me, it's fear and it's fear. So what could scare me, you, that much to do that and scare everyone involved universally so that all of them. There isn't a single dissenter. There's not a resignation. There's. Everyone's going along with that. And to me, I. So I was trying to imagine, like, what would it take if I'm in a conference room and a couple guys in black suits come in and they threaten me and threaten my children when all the terrible things they're gonna do to my family, that might do it, but then I'd still be kind of thinking, yeah, can you. Would I stop you? Do you have that much power over me? I'm not sure it would scare. I'm not sure that would scare me enough to destroy myself over my own personal integrity, my own values. I would throw them, cast them aside for it. So I think they saw something that scared them so much that. Something that they couldn't prepare for that was so unexpectedly bad that they just. That they bent the knee. They bent the knee and went along with it universally. And I think the important thing about it is it's that same kind of power that might get everybody in the world, except for the few African Americans leaders who opposed the COVID agenda, who later ended up dead, except for basically universally everyone around the world to go along with the lie. And again, I think they were useful idiots who were just participating for personal gain and didn't have to know. But there must have been some people along the way that had compromised their integrity to such a degree that they were like, I'm not going to participate in this. There had to be some. And. But we didn't hear about those guys. They all came on TV and lied to us. And so that's very similar to the situation. And I think it tells us that there's a part of something we're dealing with here in all of this that is beyond our imagination. I think like something that's so frightening that it would cause you to destroy yourself. And you have to understand, if you're a person of integrity and of any. It's not just the money that Dan will lose. Like you kill yourself, you kill yourself by doing it. I mean, my number one goal in life is to not do anything that I am ashamed of. Like, that's the line for me. Like it's something that I can like to not do. To not behave in a way that makes me ashamed of myself. Which is. Which essentially is a violation of what I think of myself as an individual with integrity and purpose and that. And I won't cross that line. And I gotta believe there are a lot of people like that out there. And yet during COVID and yet, and again now we see that people that somehow these people were convinced to bend the knee and to go along and to come out and publicly lie about what they've seen and what's actually happening. And that the prospect of that, I don't know what that is that would cause that. I can't, I've not seen it, thank God. But I think that we are dealing with something that is way more insidious than I think people are giving credit to.

B (22:03)

Are you surprised by all this?

A (22:06)

I'm surprised in the way it was done. There are a thousand ways to never let the list come out, or never let all the lists come out, or never really bring people to justice that don't involve these people destroying themselves. So yeah, I'm surprised the way it's been done. And maybe I shouldn't be after Covid because this is a parallel to Covid. It really is. It's a tiny microcosm of COVID It's a. Where a group where all participants universally participate in an act of evil. I mean, I don't know how else to describe it when you're telling me you're gonna now inject six month old babies with this stuff. And then now we have. What is it? Was it the Moderna vaccine The MRNA that it is no longer emergency use authorization. It's officially approved. I mean, this is. There's something insidious happening here, and I don't think we. The answer is not something as simple as the trivial motivations of man for personal gain or loss. There's something deeper here, I think.

B (23:20)

From a spiritual standpoint. Evil.

A (23:26)

I hate to cross. I'm not a religious person, so crossing that gap is difficult, but it is something akin to that. Something. I think that Dan is a courageous guy. The impression I get, courageous guy. He's not a coward. And for a man like that to bend the knee, he had to be scared in such a way that was shocking to him and something he was unprepared for. Because what makes it so scary is that you couldn't imagine it. And that does lead you to these spiritual kind of things. And so, yeah, yeah, it's like you looked evil directly in the face and so shocked. So taken aback by it. You couldn't imagine any. Anything else to do but go along with it.

B (24:26)

Where does this go from here? Does it go away, or do you think it just.

A (24:31)

The Epson thing. I think it goes. I think it goes away. It continues to be a very divisive thing within maga. I don't think that people will ever forget about it. However, the anger about it will dissipate, just like the anger dissipated about all the other things that Trump failed to deliver on in his first administration. Everyone completely forgot about Operation Warp Speed and all that stuff. And we're willing to set it aside because eventually, because most people are team sport fans and they're on a certain team and they're going to go with that team, and there will probably be things that will bring them back in the tent even though this happened. So I don't think we ever get anything. I honestly never thought we would get anything. But it was their statements and their 180 that I think is the most important data points to take away from it, because it does imply something insidious is happening. Something the same sort of insidiousness that we saw during COVID It's still there, it's still present, it's still operative, and it's still, at the end of the day, is the final adjudicator of what happens.

B (25:45)

We discussed this in the past as well. I mean, people that thought this administration was going to come in and just fix all this and right all these wrongs, and I never saw it. I know you didn't see it either yet, but people have just they hoped. That's why I hate that word, hope. Cross their fingers, close their eyes and hope.

A (26:06)

Hope.

B (26:06)

And.

A (26:08)

Well, you say hope and here's the thing. I think that most humans operate from a point of view of good faith. They do it. They go through their lives acting in good faith and they assume good faith in others. And it's not really hope. It's our lived experiences that most people act in good faith. And so they're assuming good faith. And I think that there's something that trumps good faith at some level. I'm not saying it's Trump, but there is something that trumps good faith.

B (26:41)

What do you think it is?

A (26:44)

It's this insidious thing. It's whatever it is that made Dan Bongino and everyone else bend the knee.

B (26:52)

No, I'm sorry, so you said Trump. You said that Trump has good faith or he does not have good faith?

A (26:56)

No, I said no. Well, Trump is a. Does not have any personal philosophy on anything. He's a deal maker. There is no, I don't think, clear right or wrong with him. It's the art of the deal. It's getting more. It's winning. He's a zero sum game kind of guy. And like Wall street people, zero sum game. My win, you lose. That's how it works. And I think in some cases that might be good because it can work out good for America, winning a zero sum game. But I think in terms of counting on him to do what a good faith actor would do, I think is a stretch. You got to have a personal philosophy. You got to have something that you think is more important than you in order to be able to function well, I think. And he doesn't have that well.

B (27:55)

And so many people want to disregard or discount the fact that Operation War Speed and the handling of COVID Not to sit here and say that I could have handled it any better given that scenario, but it was a disaster. And War Speed continues to be a disaster. And people still are getting those shots. And he's not going to denounce them. He talks about how many lives have been saved from it. And yet you've got this MAGA extremists that say, well, it's. He made a mistake, he made a mistake and we need to give him a second shot, second chance. When are you going to start holding him accountable for these things?

A (28:31)

Yeah, and I think, I think that what they're doing, what people are doing when they're rationalizing those things is they're saying, we know people are not Perfect. And they are going to make mistakes. And Trump is one of these characters who will never admit one that's just in his nature. And we all know people like this, and yet those people can still go on to do things that are good and useful, and I think. So they're willing to overlook it because of that. And I think I get criticized, and I'm sure you do, too, for anytime Doug and I, excuse me. Criticize Trump, it's like, no, it's like, give him a chance. You got to let him do his thing. You got to do all this. And. And I think, honestly, it's our job as citizens to criticize when we see authorities doing things that we think are wrong. I think we also have to keep in mind that compromises are made. And it's not like he's a dictator yet, and he. So he doesn't have full control over everything. He certainly doesn't seem like he has a lot of control over a lot of things. So I understand the people who support Trump in that way and say, give him more time. Give him more time. I understand that. And I think that also with all the noise that we see online and the noise that's created by Trump himself about what's going on, it just creates this confusion that people can't process. I think that's intentional, and it makes it so that in this confusion, people substitute their own expectations or hopes or assumptions of good faith on his part. And I don't think it's entirely their fault, because, again, there's so much noise in the system. But you got to look for the signal. And Epstein was signal. And this approval by the FDA is signal. I think there's a lot of stuff on the tariff things that just. If you want to jump to the. Anything else on Epstein?

B (30:42)

No. And actually, I got a notification which is perfect while I'm talking to you right now. It says, do this is on OAN. DOD announces $200 million contract with Musk's artificial intelligence bot Grok.

A (30:57)

Right. Well, it is. His newest version is the most advanced one. It's pretty amazing. Grok 4. My testing of it so far has been pretty impressive, and so I'm not surprised the DoD wants access to it. And this. But this is a sign of this further merger of state and private entities. Some refer to that as fascism, but this is. I would refer to it much more as. With an older term. It's mercantilist. It's this way essentially, of favored parties do exceptionally well by combining with the state where public Entities and private entities work together in order to accomplish shared goals. And we see one of the things that in our first conversation, we talked about what Trump's economic agenda was. I use the expression that it looked to me as though they were trying to model China. And there are a lot of ways that can be interpreted. But one of the key ways that I meant by that is that there is this merger between the state and private companies in pursuit of state objectives, or maybe even in the US Maybe their private company objectives. But either way, these objectives are somehow shared by the two, and there's a great merger between them in order to accomplish them. And that is fundamentally the way it works in China. I mean, one of the big things was, we talked about the idea that China demands that its firms reinvest capital in China. And that accumulated capital base is what's given them the, made them the production and economic powerhouse they are now is that constant accumulated capital there. And we don't have that. But in this big, beautiful bill, that's a big part of it, actually. There's huge incentives for people to reshore things. There's lots. They do it through tax incentives, not threats like maybe they might get in China. It's through tax incentives. But there are lots of things in that bill. And I'm. I haven't read the entire thing yet, but I am, I'm doing it. I don't know why, because honestly, I started reading it and I got to page 28 and I couldn't help myself, but I wrote an essay that basically got me to page 40 and out of 837 pages, and I'm like, I can't do this for every part, but there are some good things in there. And I think one of the biggest things is that they allow you to write off capital expenses that when you're building things in the United States, like right now, if you're going to build before, if you're going to build a factory in the US you'd have to write off the cost to build. So you'd spend the $30 million in the factory, but you'd only be able to deduct that expense on your taxes over a course of 20 years or 30 years, whatever that time period is, depending upon what it is. And so it really dissuaded people from making the capital investment here. It's 100% tax deductible. You build something, it costs you $30 million, then you get to write that off of your earnings that year. It's the way it should be. By the way, should always have been that way. But that change in tax policy is a really big deal. And there have been $5 trillion worth of commitments of investing in the US and factories and things like that. Five trillion. That's a massive number. And it covers the gambit. We talked about this a little bit before, from car companies to semiconductors to weapons manufacturers and drug makers and everyone else along the way in doing this. But in addition to that, something that was announced this week that I think is very telling is that DoD in particular made an investment in a private company, huge investment in a private company where they took over. I don't remember what percentage of the company they own now is, but the company was called MP Materials, and MP Materials is one of the few actual rare earth producers in the United States. And a little plug for our newsletter we recommended to our readers to buy MP Materials, I guess in May. Yeah, back in May. So the stock is way up since then it was up. It was moving up anyway. And then with this announcement with the dod, it's gone way up. And so. But this is again, the government getting involved in owning, having a stake in these private entities and to really drive them forward in order to support what is the most important thing to the US government, which is defense initiatives. Defense initiatives. So a lot of this manufacturing that will be coming back to the US will be defense in nature. There are some critical things like drug making and stuff like that that are clearly coming back too. But this is part of the economic policy that we talked about way back. I don't know when that was. February, beginning of. Yeah. So in February it was clear that these things were going to happen and they are happening. And so that part of it is occurring. So number one, as far as I can tell from Signal, not noise like Trump is absolutely attempting to remake the global trading system and the monetary system along the way. That's priority number one. That's. And there's a lot of Signal in there and there's a lot of evidence that this has been happening. He's doing it by adopting this mercantilist approach. In that approach, the winners are chosen. There are winners and losers, and the winners are selected. And the winners always tend to be the already rich and successful. Honestly, they are not the middle class, unfortunately, the middle class is the enemy of the mercantileist, to be honest. So. But that's number one. And number two, I think that the number one opposing force to the US is China because of the power they've gained. And I think that a lot of what you see otherwise happening is explainable by them trying to get in a position to attack China. And if you look at, there's so much noise on tariffs, like, does anyone really even know what the real tariff rates are anymore? There's tariffs announced all the time, delayed all the time.

B (38:12)

There's exceptions. So exceptions made on certain types of products within certain types of countries.

A (38:19)

Right? Well, that's what we hear. But here's the actual tariffs that actually exist. There's a universal 10%, what they call reciprocal tariff that's in effect for all goods imported in the US except for things that fall under the usmca. That. That agreement that we have with Mexico and Canada. Okay, so that's there. There's a 50% tariff on steel and aluminum, which covers things like things that are finished products that contain a lot of steel, like washing machines and refrigerators and things like that car park cars and car parts. There's a 25 tariff, except for, of course, what's covered under the USMCA. So the stuff between Canada and Mexico, not. That's not included in there. And then there's a 30% tariff on all China imports. Now, when you look at. There's also all these announcements that all these other reciprocal tariffs which are constantly delayed, are going to come into effect, which makes people confused about what's actually happening. But if you look at the tariffs that are actually really there, the number one target of these tariffs is still China. They pay 30%. A lot of this steel that comes into Canada gets sort of reprocessed and ends up in the U.S. most of the steel that comes in through Mexico is absolutely coming from China. The cars and car parts absolutely is a target of China. I mean, it also hits Japan pretty hard. The steel imports hit Brazil really hard. There are other countries, but there's one country that is targeted above them all, and that's China. And a lot of the tariff noise. If you remember, we talked about the purpose of tariffs, what they really were. I mean, theoretically they generate revenue. Well, not theoretically. In fact, they do generate revenue. That revenue was apparently, that's a record month for it last month. But the real purpose of tariffs historically has been as a bludgeon, essentially to get countries to agree to new terms. And those new terms were fundamentally monetary in nature. To agree to essentially allow the dollar to devalue, the dollar to devalue. And it's only through that devaluation that the US could possibly. Well, we need growth and dollar devaluation together, and it can make the debt Surmountable, it can make a way out. But in depreciating the dollar, of course, that means that it erodes all of the savings of all the American people or anyone who holds dollars in any form whatsoever. So that's the way tariffs have been used before, I think. The constant talk about tariffs, the constant threats that don't turn into reality, the delays, all that stuff. It's a cudgel to bring people to the negotiating table to cooperate in a devaluation of dollar, which will help our exports, help us with our debt, and it'll be done at the expense of the local economies and all the other countries that are now subject to the tariffs or the theoretical tariffs that have been proposed. So that core economic strategy still seems to be what's happening. So I still think that there is signal there that you can see that is happening now, whether how to what degree these things actually end up benefiting the American people. I don't know. I mean, will it bring more jobs back to America? Yes. Will it? Will it? Will the wages, the growth of wages outpace the pace of inflation that will necessarily be caused by all of this? Especially when you have Trump now saying that Powell's got to go and he should actually reduce interest rates to 1%. That's they're going to spend a lot of money and that's going to be inflationary. And low rates is generally inflationary. So, yeah, I don't know. It's a mixed bag in terms of the outcomes, ultimately, I would say, because these practices implemented by Trump appear to be mercantilist in nature, much like China's are mercantilistic. They are. They don't end up benefiting the middle class at all. In fact, they generally end up squeezing the middle class most of all. So, yeah, it's a mixed bag. But. But I still think my original thesis on it is right, and I think he's following that and that is real. And do I think that's more important than justice? No, I think. What was it? There's something like some Pledge of Allegiance. It's liberty and justice for all. We have no America if we have no justice. So I'm very disturbed by that.

B (43:28)

I don't know. Do they even say the Pledge of Allegiance in schools anymore?

A (43:34)

It's a good question. I homeschooled my kids, so I don't know. I don't know. And by the way, it's a weird practice, I think, anyway, but I think it is what America stands for is justice. Like Americans, it's in our DNA to expect and to demand justice. When somebody does something that is truly harmful to another, we demand justice. And anytime it doesn't happen, we have a visceral reaction to it. And that's what we're seeing. We see online now, people being very upset about Epstein. It's this no justice thing drives people crazy. And of course, there hasn't been justice on anything yet. And Kunstler, who I have tremendous respect for, believes that they're working on complicated cases to bring justice to some of these players. Specifically that went against Trump really hard in his prior administration with the Russia Gate stuff and things like that, maybe with the election fixing activities in 2020. But still, justice applied to Trump's personal enemies, but not to people who kidnap, rape, and sometimes murder children is not a justice system at all, I think.

B (44:50)

Yeah. And taking a step further, even with this, I mean, you look at the education system in this country and what they've done to those kids.

A (44:57)

Right.

B (44:57)

Like over how many decades. And I mean, I don't know if it's fair for me to compare, but the psychological that it's had.

A (45:07)

Alex Craner made a very interesting point in a podcast recently. He says, you see these man on the street interviews around the 4th of July on Independence Day, asking people, who did we fight in the Revolutionary War? Who was the enemy? And most Americans don't know that. They don't actually know who we were fighting. Like, how is something so fundamental, so foundational, like maybe the most important historical detail about America, unknown to so many people who have gone through this school system? Like, that is also signal. It's pretty terrifying. Yeah.

B (45:50)

The whole fabric of this country has changed. And even just from. I mean, I was on the road for a little over five weeks and spent a little time in D.C. and went to Arlington Cemetery and then went to the Lincoln Memorial. And night and day difference. And you're walking around Lincoln Memorial, the reflection pool, and by the White House and just looking around and like, America is so different today than what it was. Just honestly, I felt like I was like, God, this is like diversity, equity, inclusion, all running around on a Sunday evening in D.C. because it was everything going on, all kinds of people, all different kinds of ethnicities, different kinds of shirts. Pride Month was going. I mean, just all of it. Like, you didn't see that at Arlington Cemetery.

A (46:37)

Well, it is. You got to remember DC is a big tourist spot if people are going to come and visit America. So you would expect a lot of diversity there. Going to the hot tourist spots and a cemetery is not usually high on the list for foreigners at least. So I could partially explain it, But I would say still the decay. I heard you talking about the reflection pool being filthy, things like that. That's. That's interesting. Just shows that. It just shows our standards have fallen so far because we're in a state of decay. I mean, the nation is in a state of decay. We are no longer a wealthy nation. We've squandered our wealth on war and corruption, and there aren't the resources to maintain all that we built. And so, I mean, I'm sure you noticed, I mean, how many of the miles that you traveled across the US were in construction zones where there was some construction happening somewhere. I mean, the US highway system is perpetually under construction and seemingly by only temporary means because it needs to be done again very soon. I mean, this is the state of things. And it's because we've impoverished ourselves through fundamentally this corruption and profiteering off of these foreign wars. So it's a. It's a sad state of thing. And honestly, I haven't been to the US in more than a year. So my personal experience there recently, it doesn't suffice to really have a strong opinion about it. My son goes back more regularly and his barometer is basically where his mom lives. And the changes around that one single place and the deterioration with homelessness, with drug abuse, with people's attitudes toward one another, with the way people drive road rage being so much greater than it once was, these kinds of things. So those, of course, they're only anecdotal stories, but using the same place and then was stepping away from a year and coming back and seeing the changes over time. You don't have that boiling frog syndrome where it just slowly gets worse and it grows around you and it's hard to see it, but it's like if you have young kids and you don't see them for a week, it's like, holy shit, you've grown so much. It's amazing. But day to day, it goes. Slides by unnoticed. And I think most Americans don't truly understand the level of decay that's occurring because they are. They're in the pot, they're boiling with it.

B (49:28)

You got time for me to talk about a little bit of my trip? Because you brought up. You brought something that I forgot about and with the construction, first of all, and I'm sorry people are going to get annoyed because I brought this story up a couple times, but maybe you and I talked about this on the Phone. But do you remember the movie Falling Down, Michael Douglas from the early 90s?

A (49:48)

I rewatched it after you and Bracken talked about it. Yeah.

B (49:52)

Is it not amazing how that movie was made in the early 90s and how relevant it is today?

A (50:00)

The only thing that's not relevant is that there aren't people that are saying, fuck this in the same way that Michael Douglas did in that movie. And it's a little surprising how much that, that things were bad then, but there's so much worse now that there aren't more people like Michael Douglas saying, I'm just not going to take it anymore.

B (50:24)

Well, and the construction scene in that movie, remember with the grenade launcher? And he's like, what's wrong with the street?

A (50:30)

What do you. Yeah, what are you doing here? There's not a problem with this street. I drove on it yesterday. There was nothing wrong with it. This is like, what are you doing? Yeah, it was all like, as a make work project, essentially.

B (50:42)

And he responded. The guy's like, we're fixing it. And he's like, no, you're just trying to meet your budget. And so when I was in New York, Pennsylvania, every state I was in, and it's. I mean, it's really bad here in Arizona too, but like Pennsylvania, I'm on Interstate 80 because I'm leaving state college to come back to Cleveland. And it was like every. I mean, you'd have it for four or five miles, then you might get a 10 to 15 mile breather. And then there was construction again. And I was on the phone with an old friend of mine talking about it. He goes, yeah, it's also summertime too. So they're getting all this stuff going because you can't really do it in January. And I'm like, there's nothing wrong with like, some of the, like, construction. There wasn't even anybody working.

A (51:28)

It's like something that's. The ratio of like cones to workers is insane. It's like you gotta have like 10 miles of cones for every one mile of work. You know what I mean? Maybe that's for safety reasons, I think is the excuse that they have around that. But I'll tell you, here in Uruguay, this is a backwards country, tiny country. They completely redid this major road. It's one of the national roads, one of the major roads that goes by me. They completely redid the entire thing in a year. I couldn't believe it. I mean, they actually got shit done and they got it done quickly. And they made it as they tried to make it as convenient as possible for people. But it was. Road construction is always inconvenient. But they did things that were remarkable, and they did it in short order. And I couldn't believe it. I'm like, I didn't think that I actually had grown growing up in the US I grew up with sad to the construction is a. Something that is like moving. It's like moving a giant mountain. It's like something that takes enormous time and effort and never ends. But no, they just build shit. They just. They just actually get people out there. They get the equipment out there and they just make a road. And it doesn't take forever. So. But it's just a sign of the grift. Everything's a grift. And I think that the. Certainly the construction angle to a lot of it must be a grift as well.

B (53:03)

Well, and also seeing. I mean, I got to see parts of the country that I did. I mean, most of my trip was stuff I'd never seen before experienced. And man, I saw, in my opinion, like, just how hollowed out the middle class is. Like, I drove through West Virginia. Route 77 is the link between Cleveland and. En route to my friend's friend in Cherry Creek, which is near West Jefferson. And you go through a little part of Virginia, but mostly you go through. Mostly a lot of it's West Virginia. And what a beautiful state. First of all, like, yeah, the Appalachia and the Greenery. But I stopped in Charleston. I ended up going to Parkersburg. I think it's Parkersburg to get something to eat. And there's just nothing there. Like, there's just. I'll never say a town, like, sucks or it's shitty or. Cause who am I to say that? But I just didn't see anything. And what do people do for work? I mean, I was in Rochester. I drove through Buffalo, and I have family from Buffalo and still have cousins that live there. And drove through that didn't see anything. Spent a night in Rochester, went downtown, get something to eat, and walked around a little bit. And just like, you could tell that these were cities that once were. And I would say the same thing for Cleveland, too. I mean, maybe Cleveland's a little bit ahead of that now, but. Yeah, but like, you could tell that was a. At its time, this was a special place. But there's no manufacturing anymore.

A (54:29)

There's no economic power there. And I think I'm from the Midwest also. I grew up right along the Illinois, Iowa border where the head office is and the Founding of John Deere. Most people there worked for John Deere at one point or another big industrial area and started to change in the 70s and just constantly accelerated from there. Basically my entire life. And every time I still have family that lives there, so I go back there occasionally when I'm in the US I'll go and see my family, obviously, so. But I have to say it's a very sad place to be because I think everyone there is. Well, first of all, everyone there is not everybody, seemingly everyone is obese. Everyone is driving a relatively new car, though. And it seems to me that the vast majority of the population is probably on Social Security. There aren't many young people, Social Security or disability or something like that. And there's no economic engine to drive anything forward. And so just despite the efforts of trying to make improvements where the various cities will install like a. There's this. It's called the Figge Art Museum in Davenport, Iowa. This really kind of outrageous looking building they built right on the riverfront with Mississippi, donated in part by this rich family, the Figgies, who had a long history there when it was an industrial powerhouse. That town still also being on the Mississippi river, it created lots of economic activity and opportunity, and it just was. But it also of course was in part paid for by taxpayers. This gigantic building. And first of all, it's a shitty art museum. They never have. The art there is actually always very disappointing as art museums go. I love a good art museum and I can't, it certainly isn't one. But despite these efforts to try and create things that are designed to create economic activity by building new things, and there are theoretical jobs created to support them, there is no economic engine, there's nothing produced that actually the rest of the world needs. So those towns, these old industrial towns, which there were wealthy people there, there were people who became wealthy in those places because they were able to make something there of value to people elsewhere and thus import capital to those towns. So ever since, and this is, to some degree at least, this is the story of what Trump is trying to alter, is to change that so that places in America have something of value that they can export to the world or to other parts of the country that do drive capital back into those places, they give them some economic vitality which is desperately needed. It's desperately needed because without that, it's decay. It's decay. It's. That's all you can see. And you see the people, you see the people like quietly suffering in these places because there is no Economic vitality. Young people, get the hell out. If you've got any future, you leave because there's nothing for you there. I mean, there's some bullshit service job. Maybe you get hired in a nonprofit, right, or something like that. There are plenty of those around everywhere. But that's not going to be great either. There is no economic engine to these places. And that 5 trillion of new capital invested in the country will alter that. In those localities where that money gets spent, it will alter that. They will create things that get exported. Unfortunately, a lot of these things have to do with weapons systems. So that's the downside. But still, I mean, actually where I grew up, right along the Mississippi river, there was, there's an island in the middle of the Mississippi coal and it's called Arsenal Island. And that island they used to actually manufacture mortars all the way back to the Civil War. So it was like a military, it is a military base. They manufactured weapons there that were exported elsewhere. And the start of it was during the Civil War and it's. That place now is still a military base, but it's basically kind of administrative in nature at this point. And yeah, so even that, there's nothing, there's not even weapons made anymore. So you got to have an economic engine. That's your vitality. That's how it gets created. At least Trump's policies do begin to address this long term decay by shifting it there. And instead what he's getting people to do, which is great, is that normally these people that are basically have lots of dollars because they're selling US goods, they are the production capitals like Nvidia and Taiwan. Right? They are. They end up with lots of dollars because they're producing something locally. And so there's influx of capital there. Normally that capital ends up getting deployed in our financial markets and causes stock prices to go up and causes the rich to get richer and the poor to get poorer. He is putting pressure on them. And I think this is very positive to do instead of that, to do foreign direct investment, to actually take that capital, don't put it in the markets, don't buy the Mag 7 or the S and P, but actually build a factory and is, and with the, with this bill, which I built, the BBB bill, at least it does do that. At least it incentivizes money to people to, to invest their capital in real shit in America instead of these financial assets on the stock market.

B (61:00)

Also we were talking about MP materials to add in. Apple's putting 500 million into it as well.

A (61:07)

Into MP materials. Yeah. Really? I gotta check this stock. I might have to sell some at this stage.

B (61:15)

Don't forget my cut too because I'm your manager or agent or something, right? I'm your hype dude now.

A (61:21)

Well, while I am a paid subscriber to your sub stack, you are not a paid subscriber to mine. So you missed out on it.

B (61:28)

I'm sign up for it right after.

A (61:30)

I'm gonna give it, I'm gonna give it. I'm gonna comp yours, so don't comp mine. I'm going to. I'm going to. But I am a paying subscribers to your pay subscribers and everyone should be a paid subscriber to yours. I don't need the money because this. I just do podcasts for good karma and for entertainment. That's why Doug, Casey and I, that's what our podcast about. It's about good karma and about entertainment. So we don't. That's not the. This is your gig. This is your full time job. So for you to keep doing it, you have to make money. And you could either be like, you could be a sellout and you could fill this with ads from bullshit companies like Patriot Supply or some other nonsense like that where you get a bunch of shit that you would never want to eat, but you'll make a good commission on it if you promote it. So you can either do that or people could support you by subscribing to your substack, which if they don't, then shame on them as far as I'm concerned.

B (62:33)

I appreciate that we're not wrapping up yet. We got. I got more stuff to talk to you about. I hope so, but yeah, I wanted to. I didn't mean to jump back to the mp, but I thought you'd find that interesting that Apple pumped in 500 million towards it that just came out today or yesterday.

A (62:49)

Yeah, I've been wrapping up the book. Believe it or not. We're that close now. I know we've been talking about it for a long time and so my energy has been devoted there.

B (62:59)

Yeah, I was debating whether I was going to ask you or not because I figured you'd provide an update on where that was and it's probably annoying at this point that people keep asking you, which it's a good. Annoying because people are excited about it.

A (63:11)

Yeah, it's my fault for talking about it too soon. And I was talking about it, but I was mostly talking about it too soon because I'm just proud of what my son is Doing as the beta tester for it. I think that's probably why I talked about it too soon. But it's also. It's very difficult to write a book with. It's very difficult to write a book that's decent at all. And that's one another reason why I admire a counselor because he writes great books. Bracken too. But that's difficult alone. Doing it with a co author, I think is a whole other experience because.

B (63:48)

I.

A (63:50)

Have made it a part of my mission in life really to try and support Doug and Doug's ideas because I think Doug is like the closest thing you're going to find to Socrates and walking around. And I think he's a great man and he has a lot of wisdom. So. So it's an honor to co author a book with him. And yet it's difficult because it requires a collaboration which I'm not which just difficult to reconcile everything properly. But I think we've figured it out and so I think we're really at the final. I think we're very close now. So I've often said, oh, it should be 60 days. But really I really. Do you think it should be within 60 days now?

B (64:36)

First of all, I can't wait to read that. But also, I know you've talked about the idea of doing a follow up in regards to your daughter. Because I have friends that have daughters that are in that age range and I think about that and I've talked about it with their moms and what's the blueprint or suggestion for a young girl?

A (65:01)

Yeah, I think it's as crucially as important as it is for young men. And because I have a daughter who's 17 and she's at the stage where she's got to make some serious decisions. She's got to pick a path of one form or another. And she's a contrarian. I'd say she has a personality. It's kind of a lot like mine. And I think that she would not. She doesn't want to do the traditional options either. So I have the same duty to her that I do to my son to try and help give them a path that may work and that will work for them. And so yeah, it's going to happen. The difference between that one is that will not be one that will be co authored between Doug and I. I actually think my wife will probably be. We've done a lot of. It is the same, the framework is the same and then there are parts that are very different. And I think that you really need a woman who understands what a woman feels at that stage of life, what their primary motivations are, what their insecurities are, what the things that they're trying to tackle, the questions they're trying to answer. You need to be able to have an intimate understanding of that in order to be able to speak to them well. And I don't think I could do that as well for my daughter as a woman could. I think I felt perfectly qualified to do that for my son and for other young men that find themselves in today's day and age where college seems like, if nothing else, a very expensive endeavor. But on top of that, and it's so undercounted, is that it actually takes four of your most powerful years that you have away from you and kind of puts them in the penalty box for a while where you can't really do anything truly exciting, adventurous, can't really test the waters in the same way. And that time that you have that energy, that you have that natural openness to the world of possibilities that you have to squander that in a lecture hall, I think is a huge mistake. Now, I do think the academics are important, but frankly, all of the academics are in the preparation. In addition to adventure, hands on experience, real skills, a vast network that presents you with constant opportunities that you never can imagine. So. So yeah, I think I talked to my wife about it and I think that she's up for it and she can do it. I think she can do it. So it'll probably be something that she and I end up writing together.

B (67:54)

Does it ask the same question? Did you pose to Max where you said to him, and I'm paraphrasing, but don't ask yourself what you want to do. Ask yourself what kind of man you want to become. Does that same question still apply to your daughter?

A (68:09)

100%, because this is all that matters. I mean, Doug has this great. Doug thinks of, likes to talk about this idea of be, do and have. He says these are the most important verbs in essentially every language. And our tendency is to focus on have. I want to have this, I want to have this achievement, or I want to have this physical good, or I want to have a family or whatever it is, have. And our consumer society has made that really intense, the focus on having. And the truth is that having is a natural byproduct of doing. And doing is the primary force that especially a young person has because they have unlimited energy. And you don't realize how unlimited that energy is. You have at 18 or 22, until you get to be older like us, and you realize, man, I just can't do any more right now. I just. I'm done. It's a huge resource that they have. So they have. And it's the biggest lever they have to change their life is by doing novel things, doing things that are new to them and outside of the box, they create opportunities. And if it's done right, you develop lots of skills along the way as well. And that preparation is about doing it right. So the doing is your lever. The having is a natural byproduct of that. But the only thing that really matters is the being. The being is what matters. It's who you are. It's getting to a point where the way I described it earlier is, I just don't want to do anything that I will be ashamed of. Like, I refuse to do anything that I will be ashamed of. And I think that anyone of any real character has figured that being part out. And they had to do. There had to be a whole bunch of doing in order for them to get to that part where they really know where their being is really there. But the being is all that really matters. You can't focus on being. You got to understand it in its importance and understand how character is shaped. And the book talks about all this. And you absolutely can't focus at all on having, because that will lead you down roads that might not even get you what you really want to have and certainly will lead you astray from being the man or woman you want to be. The doing is the lever and the preparation. What it does is it gives you a prescription for doing. It's laid out exactly this, do these things. And of course, everyone, we picked 16 specific things, 16 specific major activities that each take about three months to do. So it's an equivalent of a college degree, and it takes four years if you do the whole thing. And of course, by picking 16, we left out a thousand other possibilities that would be equally as valuable. So we also show you how you can build your own. How you can build your own cycle. We call them cycles, if you choose. But the truth is that most young people, they don't really know what to do. They don't really know what they want to be, and they don't really know what they want to do. And they have lots of things they'd like to have. And so what we are attempting to do with the book fundamentally is express to them the necessary that the end goal is the being. That's character. Here's how this must always be in the back of your mind. And we give them a way of sort of beginning to understand that, figuring out who they want to be by developing a personal code, a set of rules for yourself. Like I hate rules. I hate rules. Any rule that's given by the government, I don't like any of them. But rules that I create for myself, those are. That's something different. Those are rules where I'm saying this, where I establish my personal sovereignty over my. Over myself. So having a set of rules and also identifying a set of virtues that you seek to pursue. The good and beautiful things in life that you aspire to. The virtues that are more important than the having. Okay, so this personal coat is about creating all creating that. The bulk of the book though ends up being around doing because people don't know what to do. It's like here's the place you go, here's how much it costs, here's what you're going to learn and here's from the adventurous sort of part of it. And then here's the academic elements that you should be studying everything in more than you'll be getting in college. And then here's some additional activities we encourage because a well rounded man has exposure to lots of different things. And when you're young is the time to get exposed to these different things. Whether they be learning to ride a motorcycle or fly fishing or playing chess or whatever these things are, they're good things. They're good things not just because they're leisure activities or whatever. They're good things because they open up the world to you in different ways. Like I'm not a golfer personally, but I know golfers who use that basically as an excuse to see the world, to go to places, beautiful places, I mean truly beautiful parks where you almost get the thing to yourself and around the game. And they love the game. The game becomes an excuse for them. I find it's a weird obsession, but it does. It's a gateway for them. It's a gateway for. To be amongst a certain group of people who are usually have more wealth. It gets you entree into there. The best example of this is polo. I mean, Doug played polo and polo is the most exclusive sport in the world. It's incredibly expensive. I mean you have to maintain at least one stable of very expensive horses. In his case, he had multiple stables of these very expensive horses because he had in multiple countries. And he can still walk into any polo club and there are clubs or like gentlemen's clubs in the world and be welcomed there because he was one of them, even though he doesn't play polo anymore. So, like this, these activities actually lead to secondary stories of your life that you don't expect and so are a really important part of it. But anyway, the doing is what matters. The doing is the lever that you have. College is not doing. College is participating. It's showing up, sometimes just going through the motions, sometimes trying hard to meet what the authority figure tells you is the goal. But it does not involve you going out into the world as an individual and learning to do and succeed and struggle and essentially learn to become an effective adult. So, yeah, anyway, female version will come. I think that will take far less time than it has taken us for the male version of it. But, yeah, it's on its way.

B (75:56)

I look forward to both of those. Is there anything that you could share in terms of, like, with Max and I've had Max on here. He went to EMT school and then sailing and private pilot's license and fighting wildfires. Is there any courses or from the standpoint where it would apply to your daughter or any other young girl that you have found out there?

A (76:21)

Oh, definitely. And there's one that's in the preparation for men, but it would apply to women as well, is that there's this awesome school in Florence, cooking school, and you go there, you get Italian lessons every day. You live at the school, and you learn to cook from professionals. And, you know, it is a real gift if you can prepare a wonderful meal for people you love. So it's a real. It's a real gift to be able to do that. But it's a real skill that has real economic value. I mean, I'm not saying that you want to become a chef or pursue that, but each of the major anchor activities in each of the cycles has economic value. Like when Max did the sailing thing through around the Falkland Islands and then through the Strait of Magellan. At the end of that, he got the status as a competent crewman, which means he can work on a sailing ship. Like he's qualified, he's met the qualifications, the training required to. At that level at least he could take it much, much further if he chose to. Getting a private pilot's license, obviously that allows you to fly. You can't fly at night, you can't fly commercially, but it can lead to more. He could do something with it if he chose to take it further. The EMT one was one of the least expensive ones he did. It took about two months and sure, you can work on an ambulance crew and things like that, but he got offered a job to go work on wildfires as an EMT and earned $600 a day doing that. And these opportunities are just sort of thrown his way because he publishes his work. He basically says, here's what I'm doing along the way on substack. And so people reach out to him and go, this one guy reached out to him and said, hey, I know you like. I know you like horses and stuff like that. It's like, I. This sounds crazy. He's a professional mule packer. Like, used to lead people on these hunter hunting groups, mostly on these expeditions, basically deep into the wilds in order on these hunting expeditions. And so he's. He said, come up and spend a few days with me and I'll teach you how to do it right. And so Max did that. The guy was again, an older gentleman, full of wisdom, which gave Max the opportunity to soak that up and learn another skill that's interesting. And working with these animals, like, is he going to do that professionally? I mean, no, but, like. And that wasn't even part of a cycle. It was like an extra thing he did because it was another opportunity thrown at him. So the whole key is that young people, they look at the world with a lot of uncertainty about, well, they don't. How can you possibly. Well, let's just say it's a wonderful gift if at 18, you actually know what you want to do with your life. And I know that there are some people that have that I didn't. I had no clue. I knew I didn't want to be poor anymore. That was it. But that's not an affirmative goal. It's not a goal that drives you in any particular. So. But most people don't really know what they want to do anyway. And so by default, because they can, they go to college. And I think that's the wrong way to enter college. Especially the AI thing is a whole other thing that basically makes irrelevant the vast majority of people who graduate from college or in college studying today, it's going to make their degrees irrelevant within the next five years. So there's a whole. That's the whole other problem. So when you don't know what to do and you don't really know who you are, what are you supposed to do as a young man today? There's no solution for you. Which is why I think we have so many young men that feel lost and aimless and are kind of going through the Motions. The beta male is like becoming a beta male, which we often might criticize is like the natural outcome of a man without direction or purpose. And I think that this is a gigantic problem. Then if our work can somehow contribute to solving that, then I will be. It will be the best thing I have done in my life. For sure.

B (80:52)

That culinary experience sounds amazing.

A (80:56)

This is the thing. I look at every single one of these anchor activities in all the cycles I want to do them.

B (81:05)

What does that cost? What's that one month in Florence cost, roughly?

A (81:12)

It's written down.

B (81:15)

Five grand, ten grand, two grand.

A (81:17)

I think it's something around five grand.

B (81:20)

And you got to pay to stay there for a month?

A (81:22)

No, it's room. No. Well, the room and board is packaged with it. Oh, it's all included, so maybe it's a little bit more. It's under 10 grand for sure. And I know that sounds like a lot to people, but you got to realize colleges get a cost you about 30 grand a year. And that's not the cheapest one. This cooking school is not the least expensive one. The EMT one you can probably find for $1200 around where you live right now, you can probably find that. So the range in cost, the most expensive one for sure is the private pilot one for sure. And that's not. A lot of people have no interest in that or can't afford it. But the preparation also. We have a chapter that I. That was one of the last ones I had to finish, which was how to finance the program. And there's basically two situations. You have a situation where you have parents who would otherwise pay for your school, and how do you convince them that this is the right path instead? Because they're going to remember college the way college was for them and how useful it was. And so how do you go about convincing them? That's one category. The second category is the category I was in. I was flat broke. I had no money. I joined the army to be able to pay for college because there was no other way to even do that. So it was like the only choice. And the fact is that you can pay your way through it like you used to be able to do with college. You can pay your way through it now. Maxim had a little bit of money because I had set up a custodial account for him and my nieces and nephews and my daughter when they were young. And I wasn't like, great about constantly putting new capital into it. So it wasn't a ton of money. But Maxim today has more money than he did two years ago when he started. Okay, so the buffer certainly made him more comfortable, probably taking on these things that were more expensive. But today he has more money than he did when he started. Because the program is designed to take advantage of all the opportunities that are thrown your way sometimes to work. And also that you can use part time job making $15 an hour at McDonald's if necessary to finance. A lot of this you look at. But you look at a job as a pit stop, as a, you look at it like a, as a, like a mercenary. I need a certain amount of money. I'm going to go and earn that money and I'm going to learn as much as I can about good or bad. I'm going to learn as much as I can about the world by doing it. And I'm going to. But I'm going to use that capital in order to finance further steps of it. Of course, it requires you not to take on debt. It requires you not to sign a lease that commits you to basically having a shitty job that basically just to be able to pay for that lease. It requires you to learn to be flexible. I mean, stay with your parents longer. I'd say it's a big key. When I was growing up, maybe it was the same with you. 18 and out the door is kind of the unspoken rule. It was, in some places it was a rule and some families I know, but like it was expected. I think that's an unbelievably terrible idea. To take someone who has no financial wherewithal at all and say now, okay, now you have to double the cost structure that you live on and try and make it work. It doesn't work. So it requires you not to do certain things, not to succumb to the call of consumption. Like I'm going to need a new car that I can't pay cash for, which means I have to pay for much higher levels of insurance, which then makes my monthly nut that I have to get over before I can save a penny so high that I don't have the ability to save it for anything. I mean, Max worked shitty jobs delivering during this time, delivering pizzas, working at Office Depot. He saved virtually all he made except for gas money back and forth and of course the food he ate along the way. Eating cheaply in order to make it work. And it has worked. So yeah, you don't have to be rich to do it. You can be poor like I was and make it work. And I wish to God I had Something like this when I was 18.

B (85:45)

Yeah, me too. I, well, and I think too, you bring up a, you bring up a really interesting point with the whole what life was like when we were in high school, going to college, 18 out the door, Everybody needs to go to college because that's what our parents, that generation, it was paving the way for life to be easier for us. And when I hear that now and I disclaimer, I know I don't have kids, so I don't know whatever, but not whatever, but I don't have kids, so I'm not in the situation like you're in and some other friends. But we are in a different time now. And the thing is what I like tell people, because a friend of mine is sending her daughter to school and she knows she and I, in my opinion, she feels the same way I do, but she's getting a lot of influence from her siblings and like, daughter needs to go to college, the experience and whatnot. But I said college is not valued today like it was. I don't even know if it was value back when I went because, I mean, I have a degree that, I mean, I don't know, it's a marketing degree and a minor in finance. But we're in a different time. And I'll quote Dave Collum, I mean, that's an expensive place to go figure things out. It will cost you a lot of money to just go figure shit out. And I think, and you mentioned this before too, like the big disconnect between the older, like the boomers, I can't even deal with some of them anymore. I mean, I've gotten unfriended. I've gotten, I mean, just bring up, try to bring up objectivity with things. And I've been called a supporter of Putin. I've been, I mean, just because get into a discussion on social media with a boomer and they just, they don't want to hear it. And I always respond with you boomers, not all of them, but in this example you said all are all the same. You don't listen. You just don't listen.

A (87:35)

It's because their reality was what it was. And so they just don't. They're not open to the idea that the reality has changed. And I'm trying to scroll through the book at this point to try and give you the data on it, but the cost of college has gone up, let's say three times.

B (87:56)

I could tell you, I could tell you, oh, sorry not to cut you off, but I could tell you that just from my own experience, I mean, where I went to school in Kent State University, my freshman year, I lived in the Dorm, it was 10 grand, roughly. And now I've been told it's over 30,000 a year.

A (88:12)

Yeah, and not only that. So like, so the cost of college has gone up and wages have gone up, but not nearly at the same rate. And the cost of housing has gone up more than college has. So it's like the whole economic situation is a totally different situation than it was before. So if you go to college, you succeed there, you get a good job, that good job is not going to pay what the good job paid before. Your housing costs are going to be triple or more what they were before. And the general, and that goes, that extends to every other element of the cost of living as well. So it does not set you up economically to succeed. And there are people who can make it work who do end up succeeding. I'm not saying that's not true, but I asked AI, I took the manuscript of the book and I put it into both chat GTP and Grok4 just over the weekend. And I said, within the context of the AI future and looking at the curriculum here, compare like it is, because the best, one of the best, the most successful majors you could have had in the last decade and a half or so has been in finance. I mean, in terms of the economic result was financed. I'm not saying it was a worthwhile pursuit, but that's just what the facts were. So I used to, I said compare it to that, a finance degree at a good college, maybe even with an MBA added onto it. And does the preparation, does the preparation do a better job or not? And in which ways? And it was hands down in both cases, it said the preparation crushed it in terms of what it does for the person as an individual, their character and for their economic potential. And then I asked it a semi related question which was, okay, given the AI future, let's look at the top 10 majors in the United States. How do they compare to the preparation? And there were only three categories of the top three businesses by far and away the top major in the U.S. by the way, business, just general business. Those people are completely fucked according to AI, Completely fucked. Teachers, fucked. Sorry, doesn't work, it's not going to work. The only three where it said that it's possible that you might again be better able to survive the AI future than the preparation were in the medical fields. So like, and I, even though we're using AI more and More for that. But it's like the parts that need the human touch within the medical field, they said. And psychologists was another one, which I disagree with, actually. I think AI will be a better psychologist for people very soon. If it isn't array, I know people by at least the hundreds of thousands, if not millions, use it as a helpful psychologist when they have problems right now. Okay. So I'm not sure about that. And what was the third one?

B (91:46)

I have something to add to that, too. Whenever you get to. Whenever you say the third one.

A (91:50)

Yeah. I can't recall what it was, but it was some other real high touch, soft one like that. But. Oh, no, actually, no, it was the opposite. IT Engineering. But computer. Computer science. No.

B (92:06)

Did it specify what type of engineering?

A (92:09)

It's civil engineering, electrical engineering.

B (92:13)

Let me share a story with you in regards to that really quick. Okay. So I was in Virginia. I was in Reston and started talking to this guy at the place I was staying. He was using the outdoor grill. And we're chatting it up or whatever, and turns out he worked for aws, Amazon Web Services. I didn't realize. I guess we have him here. I mean, we do have him here because I talked to a woman yesterday that had visited one. But we have data centers in Virginia. There's data centers all over the place in Reston, probably the whole state. But he was explaining how Amazon, like, that's their most profitable sector of their business, so they lose money on the distribution and everything else. And he was saying even as an employee, they would love to split them in half because the stock would be so much more valuable if AWS was its own entity. But he's an electrical engineer, and he was saying how we can't find people. Like, we cannot find people to do these jobs. And like, I'm sitting back and I'm just like, wow. And like, I didn't realize either. Like, they put them where there's fiber optics.

A (93:20)

That's why they're in that area in particular.

B (93:22)

And Virginia, they were doing a massive movement into Pennsylvania. I want to say 20 billion they were pumping into Pennsylvania for more of these, but they cannot find. They can't fill these jobs. And I'm assuming, like, Google's doing something similar. Same thing. They probably shortage. They can't find electrical engineers.

A (93:41)

Yeah. So as far as college degrees go, that one is a winner. That one is, according to AI, is expected to be a winner. Other than that, they say shrinks or psychologists and healthcare workers. Okay. This is what they say. So. But now if I were to say, but I didn't bother to compare it and say, what about a heavy equipment operator? Because I'll tell you what on those, I have a friend who operates, who owns a construction company that's building one of these data centers right now and they can't find people that can work either and that either. So these blue collar professions certainly are, there are in demand and will be, survive, will survive much longer in this AI future that we have coming. And part of the preparation is you learn those skills. There's one cycle where you go to the school and you learn to operate all of the heavy machinery and get certified as an operator on all of them. I mean, maybe not some of these really incredible cranes that are out there, but I mean everything else and it's part of it and it's an intense thing, but you come out of it and you can, you can, if you wanted to do that, you wanted a blue collar job doing that operating some of these machines, you could do that. So welding actually is one of the things. There's a cycle where welding is part of it. Welding is at its highest level, it's a craft for sure and it's in great demand. But it also teaches you a lot about a lot of things. It teaches you a lot about. It teaches you a lot about science actually, but in a very practical way. So those blue collar pieces of it are parts of the cycles. And I think those are the things that looks at all those things AI did and looks at the resilience created by other cycles and can do nothing other than conclude that this is much more, this is a much better place to be in our AI future than the vast majority of college degrees available today. So if you are pursuing real engineering like electrical engineering or even civil engineering, go to college.

B (95:58)

Something in nuclear, something in the nuclear world maybe too.

A (96:02)

Yeah, go to college. Yep, absolutely, go to college. But if you're getting a marketing degree, if you're going for business administration, if you're going for any of the humanities, if you're doing, if you want to be a journalist, if you want to do any of that shit, any of the top 10, it's not going to work. It's just. It won't work. It not only.

B (96:19)

What about it?

A (96:22)

Well, there wasn't really an information technology major in the top 10, so it was just computer science and the engineering and it bundles a bunch of them together. So I could probably expand it out to the top 50 or so. But fundamentally this is done just considering whether or not you have employment Potential by pursuing these. These majors. This isn't even factoring in whether or not it's economically justifiable. Okay? It's not factoring in whether or not it makes. It's just saying that you can. You could still have a job. It's not saying things like these four years are a better use of your time. It's literally just looking at the economic viability of an individual after going through either our prescribed course or a university for pursuing a particular degree.

B (97:20)

You know what I would add to that is a friend of mine pointed this out, and I never even thought about it. And I've been telling, like, young people because I just find it super interesting. Be an elevator repair man.

A (97:32)

Yeah, sure.

B (97:33)

I've never met an elevator. A guy that can fix. A guy or woman that can fix elevators. Have you? Like, there's elevators all over the place.

A (97:40)

I've seen them, but I can't say I've talked to them. I've seen them working or the escalator guys. There's always an escalator guy. You go to the mall, right? There's always somebody there digging it, fixing it, trying to make it work. Yeah, I think there's all kinds of skills like that that are necessary. But again, the problem with that idea, although I think it has a lot of economic viability, the problem with it is it doesn't help with the fundamental question that must be answered, which is the. The be. Like, what do you want to be? And you use the leverage of do in this time where you have tons of energy and time to establish the be and acquire skills that make the having occur automatically.

B (98:26)

I can't wait for the book. I'm going to shift.

A (98:30)

I'll sell at least one copy.

B (98:33)

Say, I want to buy a few copies for my friends. But you know what? Make those cheap bastards buy their own. I mean, they're doing well in life. They can afford to buy a. Buy one of your books.

A (98:41)

Yeah, I just got to pitch it. I got to pitch it hard. Hopefully this helps. But, you know, you got to sell it. You can't expect people just to.

B (98:49)

No, I'm just talking to my own friends that have, like, listened to our conversations. And they always enjoy when you and I talk and they say, oh, I can't wait to get a copy of the book. And I thought, I'm like, well, maybe I'll order like 10 copies and just get. Give them to them. I'm like, well, you know, wait a minute. Those cheap bastards, they can buy their own books.

A (99:03)

Yeah, they should be able to do that.

B (99:05)

I. I do want to talk about, though. You got a little bit more time?

A (99:09)

Yeah, I would say another 10 or 15 minutes.

B (99:11)

Yeah, I. Because I do. Because I want to talk about just the state of the United States. I know at one point you said you didn't have the desire to come over here, and I'd like to tie that into just Russia, Ukraine, and then the Middle east, if they're correlated.

A (99:29)

Well, I mean, I. We're in this giant transition period where everything is going to change, the fourth turning, that kind of those kinds of ideas, these cycles that occur in history where everything changes. And my. My personal belief is that we've been in World War 3 since 2020, and that modern warfare does not look like old warfare, although we do see elements of old warfare occurring obviously on the front in Ukraine and Russia. We see elements of old war, but I think we've been in a state of war since 2020. And I do think that there's a connection between what's happening in what happened in Iran and what happened with Syria and what happened with Lebanon and with Gaza, with what's happening in Ukraine and Russia. And if you assume, as I do, and it is an assumption, because it hasn't been clearly articulated, is that China is the adversary that must be taken down in order to preserve the status of the US the tariffs certainly indicate that's a big part of it. Then I see Russia and Iran as gateways to China, as gateways to disempowering them. It's picking it at the sides like a direct conflict is extremely risky. What's much wiser is to try and pick apart the infrastructure that enables China to overpower the US And Russia is an ally as a fuel source, as a source of many resources, actually, that China is. Needs to be peeled away. Can it be peeled away through destruction? Yes, it would in that case. But could it be peeled away through negotiation? Perhaps. And maybe Trump is pursuing both of those options at this point. But I think that the idea that the notion. I think that if Trump ever really sincerely believed he could resolve the war within 24 hours or whatever, was the idea that he thought he could negotiate a deal that would peel them away from China. And I think given all that had happened at that point, I don't think that was a likely possibility. Not to say it couldn't still be done. But Iran also is a key vector in this entire system because Iran and China are close trading partners. And China relies a lot on the. On oil, for sure, for them and so, yeah, so I think all of those activities are basically targeting China ultimately, but doing it in an indirect way because in a direct way, the whole world could lose and certainly the US or the US alone could lose. So this is a war is not being fought the way it was once before. The. What do they call it, Spider attack or whatever. These more blowing up pagers. This is what you should expect. Much sabotage and subversion is, I think, a big part of it. Combined with economic warfare, I think, are the fundamental tools of all this. So I think that's my. I'm not an expert on Iran, I'm not an expert on certainly on anything really, but that's my overall impression based on what I've been able to gather in terms of the US itself. The US itself is a decaying empire. And I think that the state at least would like to maintain its power if it comes at the expense of the people. I don't think any state ever really cares about that, truly, so long as the state can retain its power. Which is why, I think. Which is why the primary focus of reindustrialization happens to be military in nature, why the DoD in particular is stepping forward and making specific investments. So. But that also supports the idea that the US is setting the stage for more conflict leading toward supplanting China's current rise. And along the way, I worry about a lot of things in the United States. I mean, the erosion of civil liberties, the basic discourse between people, the dire economic circumstances that people find themselves in. It's like the vast majority of all the spending. If you go to airports which are still full, or you go to some nice restaurants which are often still full, that's the top 10% of the population that's doing all that consumer spending. Lots of other people are having a hard time making ends meet. Lots, most. And their situation is becoming more and more dire by the day. So that landscape, plus, of course, then we have this invasion of millions of people into the country, then we have the increase of the internal police state to oppose it. One of the things in the big beautiful bill that a lot of MAGA people would support, and I understand why, is that the ICE budget went from, let's say 0.2 billion to just under 75 billion in this bill is an 800% increase in spending for them. Now, I have to say that the deportation numbers of Trump in any single month have not yet exceeded the month of January of this year. Before, when, before Trump was in charge of it, they deported more. Biden deported more people in January of this year than Trump has been able to deport in any month since then. And they did that with an eight point something billion dollar budget, not a $75 billion budget. So I have concerns about what this, how these funds will be allocated, how much of them will be used. This is this internal police force that is attempting to identify individuals and to do deport individuals. But that internal police force, federal police force, could so easily be used in ways that we, that don't only serve the interests of deporting people that are here in the country illegally. And that's a concern of mine for sure. But just the growing division, you see these couple of coordinated attacks on ICE facilities. There was this one where I think it was nine individuals with body armor and assault rifles and attacked. They basically lured some police into an ICE facility, attacked him, shot him in the neck. He survived. But these guys mean business. And I think these sort of insurgent forces could grow in addition to that. Of course, one has to think. And Michael Ioannis talked about this. I'm pretty sure he said, I guarantee that every country that does not love the United States has infiltrated the country during that period with sabotage units of some kind that have the ability, when they get the, to get the message to cause chaos and America. And I just think it's dangerous. I mean, the bottom line is bringing back to my hometown, which I saw decay over my entire life because it lost its economic engine. That decay led to more crime and more suffering among the people there in particular, that is true of much of America. There are spots of wealth where the wealthy people are who have profited from the way the economic structure is because they own assets and the assets have all gone up in value, so they become wealthy because of it. But this, I guess quoting Yan again, he says it's all about conditions and the conditions ripe for things to go wrong in the US And I think this internal police force with now this gigantic $75 billion budget, I think is a little frightening because if we were able to deport more people with only $8 billion and with it supposedly not being a priority, clearly it wasn't a priority under Biden. But more people than we've been able to deport since he left makes me think that it isn't a model of money problem and that money could very likely be allocated toward other activities which we would oppose. So I worry about it. I worry about the state of the country. I worry about the way the people, the economics are a big part of it, but also Just the demeanor, the civility, treating each other like humans. It sets the stage for bad things. And so, yeah, I worry about it. Timeframe, who knows, as Michael Yan would say, who knows about timeframe? I only know about conditions. Conditions are there. It's gonna happen. It's inevitable. The question is when?

B (108:54)

Well, and just to add to that really quick is the fact that Big Tech, it benefited them to have Trump in. Right. Whether they took over maga, installed him, I don't believe the elections matter anymore. People are gonna give me shit for that, but whatever, I just don't believe it. And I believe that they, it benefited them to have him in office to implement this new system, which we spent a bunch of time talking about the financial side of it, but there's a surveillance side of it as well. And that will get tighter and tighter.

A (109:21)

And tighter and the surveillance side and the financial side will become one.

B (109:27)

Yep.

A (109:27)

They will become connected. Yes. And right now they have basically every ICE agent's got this little app on their phone. They take a picture to identify people. That's all powered by this system. Right by this system. That, that Palantir is the hub for, the ultimate hub of all these intelligence systems that are being put together. And to think that's not going to be turned on the American people broadly is just, it's a uninformed optimism, I think being naive.

B (110:05)

And I still believe this too. This is the new wef. This is the World Economic Forum, the Soros of the world. Soros is old. He's 90 something years old. He is the, he's the boomer did.

A (110:18)

His job and he did his job. It's. This is tag team wrestling and he needs someone to come in and relieve you. And yeah, it's, it's. I totally agree. You can take the WEF goals and I mean, I did this in an essay, took the WEF goals, what they wanted to achieve, and I took what's been done on the IT side and they're the same. They got advanced way faster than anyone could imagine. So, yeah, it's. I totally agree. And whether Trump is a useful idiot in it, I can understand him not understanding the technology. I think he doesn't use a computer. He doesn't. We know he doesn't read anything. I mean, I can understand. He wouldn't even understand what's happening. And it's true that the deployment of these systems gives them better visibility about what's actually happening in the government. Yep, I get all that all makes sense. However, it's the suite of tools Together. That's the problem. And they're being deployed right now in earnest. And they are being deployed currently to target a group of people that Americans broadly support the targeting of, but they're being expanded beyond that. Yeah. For instance, this thing where, you know, if you're coming into the US under a, basically a tourist or an educational visa, maybe others as well, but at least under those two, you have to provide your social media accounts and they must be unlocked because they want to know what you're thinking. And I, presumably this is to combat anti Semitism, but again, for that to be the mission of the federal government is also a concern.

B (112:00)

I mean, they're doing the same thing in Australia. I was told by a couple of people, if you want to go to Australia right now, they will look through your phone and looking for anti Semitism, Trump and pro Republican. And if you have that stuff, they're going to pull you into a room, they'll still let you in, but they're going to make life very uncomfortable for you. And this is where, I mean, you've talked about this. I think you and I have spoken about this both personally and in recordings. You can't stop this. That's not black pill, that's not doomer. That's being objective of where things are now. If the grids go down and there's no electricity, okay, then there's a whole nother animal that we're talking about here. Like, then you're talking Mad Max and that is possible. But as there's still electricity, you cannot win a war against technology. I don't care. Just tell me some, give me a solution to that. And you have a, you have a choice. You have a couple of choices. How do you want to live if you stay in the United States? How do you want to live? You want to fight it all? Life is going to be inconvenient, difficult, or you work within the sphere, your local sphere, the best that you can. Like the real id, I haven't gotten it yet because, because if I end up moving, I'll get it. Then people are like, well, I'm not going to. Like, I already have a passport, I have credit cards, I have an iPhone.

A (113:22)

The difference is, apparently I've looked into this a little bit more. Is that the photographs that they've taken that are on your normal id, they do help with facial recognition, but they do not provide the number of data points necessary for positive, like certain easy, like basic camera outside of a gas station to be able to know who you are. It doesn't give you the Chinese surveillance state kind of data. So the real ID though does. And I think that's the difference. And ultimately that real id, the key with it is that it gets in your phone, it's digital. You're supposed to put it in your wallet, in your Apple wallet, on your phone. Okay. And then wherever you go, every cell tower you pass knows exactly who it is and where they are. It knows, not to mention all the GPS data that's generally submitted. And it also is combined with all the Internet and other activity that's happening on your device. Ultimately it'll be used to log into the Internet on any device. So this is. Yeah, so the real ID is a difference. I mean, I. And apparently you have a choice of getting. When you go most states you can that offer real id. You could still say, I don't want the real id, I want the. Just to give me a driver's license. And they will still give you a driver's license. So. And if you have a passport, you can travel with that.

B (114:51)

Yeah, I used it. I used it domestically.

A (114:54)

Yeah. And you don't need a real ID. So. And there's some, apparently there's like 14 different forms of identification that you can use to travel with. I don't know what they all are, but they. It goes beyond just the real id. So anyway, yeah, you're right. This technology is coming and there is a way to fight technologies with technology. And. But the things that. The technological infrastructure that was begun in earnest, begun to be deployed in earnest in 2020 again, the same time I think World War 3 really started, is just accelerating very quickly. And I think that it's so much further ahead than people think that the idea of stopping it is probably impossible. However, your number one thing you can do is not comply. Not comply. Don't get a digital. Don't get a real id. Like just don't get one. I mean, if not enough people have them, then the system can't be turned on to the same degree and they need the real id. So then they connect the financial part of it and then you're really in hell once that happens. So you really don't. The real ID is the anchor to it. And the push globally right now for these digital IDs is incredible. It's all at once now again. I mean, it's come up at different points, but it's happening again so similar to a Covid like push. So it's. It shows you that's a linchpin in the entire system and they wouldn't be pushing it so hard if they already had it. Like Mike, if they didn't need. If they didn't need the real ID to make it work, they wouldn't be out there pushing it so hard and making demands that you have to have it in order to fly, which you do not. There are other options, but Kristi Noem wouldn't say that. I mean, Kristi Noem came on, she said, you have to have it by this date. It was on Instagram or whatever. She made the statement before Congress. Then a couple days later, she says, well, actually that's not really. No, you could travel with these forms of identification. And then the next day she comes on and says, the deadline is this. You have to have the real id. So the public messaging is there's a push to get this. They wouldn't push it unless it was necessary to complete the grid that they're trying to put around us. So I think non compliance is the thing you can do as an individual. Don't take the easy route.

B (117:27)

And last thing is, what could set this all off with an attempt to lockdown again is. I mean, they were talking about yesterday was the Secretary of NATO. United States is providing more weapons that they're planning to distribute to a variety of countries within the EU to protect themselves from Russia. It's like all these balls in the air, in my view, to attempt to lock this country down again.

A (117:53)

Yeah, I think the lockdown wouldn't occur in the US until the thing. Until citizens. You got to remember the lockdown last time, the chorus of citizens calling for it was massive. So in my mind, they need a situation where the chorus of citizens is again calling for it.

B (118:15)

I agree.

A (118:15)

And I think. And I think that requires something domestically to occur. Domestic and dangerous. And maybe it's these, what Michael Yan talks about, these infiltrators. I don't know. I don't know. But, yeah, it could happen again. And if it does happen again, it'll be because the public will demand it.

B (118:34)

Where could people find him at? Well, we gave people two hours. We gave people two hours of great conversation today, by the way, which means.

A (118:42)

That they have a moral obligation to subscribe to your substack to reward you for this free gift that you've given them. You can Find Me on YouTube or any podcast platform. Doug Casey's take. This is where I sit with. We usually do it over zoom, like you and I are doing right now with Doug Casey, who's, like I said, is the closest thing you're going to find to Socrates walking around when we just discuss what's happening in the world and Doug often brings it to a moral question of some kind actually. So that podcast is some people like it, some people hate it. Might be good for you. Check it out. That's number one. Number two was we have a website called crisisinvesting.com crisis investing. We publish articles there for free all the time, at least for a week. And we also have a paid newsletter where we talk about investment opportunities specifically. And we're big into resource companies given where we are in the cycle including gold mining, copper, things like that too. And including MP which just stock has blown up recently because of its the DOD getting involved in it. So not to say I want the government involved in these businesses but listen, it was obvious that the demand for what they did was going had to grow given the moves that Trump was making. So if you're interested in getting our take on what's happening in the financial markets and what to do about it, then you should become a paid subscriber to Crisis Investing. Also one last pitch with that. If you do that, you become a member of our private group which we call file. Essentially it's a private community where like a Facebook type clone where basically people can talk freely amongst themselves and in an area where they don't worry about being censored and they're with people of good faith and like mind. And that's branched out beyond the virtual to the physical where we have a local file here in Uruguay where we get together regularly and are doing things locally to do what we can to improve the world in the way that we can. So anyway that's crisisinvesting.com and Doug Casey's take. That's where you find us.

B (121:02)

Well I look forward to when the preparation comes out and as always I appreciate you coming on here. And when's your next show with Doug Anything?

A (121:12)

This week was scheduled for tomorrow but I think it probably won't happen. So it'll probably be Friday.

B (121:18)

Oh good. I look forward to. I watch all I wait that's I never miss your guys show.

A (121:23)

Oh well thanks man. Thanks, I appreciate that.

B (121:25)

Well I appreciate you guys taking the time to do it and it's great for people that haven't watched it and I'll put the I'll put the URL on YouTube as well on here. So Matt, I always enjoy our conversations and look forward to continuing to follow your work and more chats ahead.

A (121:41)

All right, thanks Michael. Appreciate it. Take care.

B (121:43)

Mic Shop.