← Drop Dead Serious With Ashleigh Banfield
Drop Dead Serious With Ashleigh Banfield
Breaking: SWAT Deployed 2 Miles From Nancy's Home, 3 People Detained | Nancy Guthrie Missing Day 13
01:06:51
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- [00:00]
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- [01:01]
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- [01:36]
Ashley Banfield
Hey everybody, I'm Ashley Banfield and this is drop dead serious. And holy is it late. It took until 4 o' clock in the morning to get this podcast out to you. Okay, well I wanted to record this on Friday the 13th, but Friday the 13th rolled over into Saturday the 14th. It's now, like I said, 4 o' clock in the morning. And the reason that it rolled into the morning hours is because the activity in the Nancy Guthrie investigation went ballistic this evening. All evening long, reporters were following a SWAT action about two miles away from Nancy Guthrie's home, one mile away as the crow flies. And dozens and dozens of SWAT FBI, Pima County Sheriff's vehicles piled into this neighborhood and dozens of deputies and agents piled into this neighborhood. And you're going to see a lot of that in just a moment. And Brian Enten was right in the inside of the perimeter. Like literally in the perimeter. He was the first one on the scene and he's reporting from inside the driver's seat of his vehicle. And we thought that was going to be the most sort of dynamic action tonight. And it kept going. Well after midnight, suddenly, we were getting reports that two people were taken out of a house, a man and a woman, and that there was a third person arrested at a traffic stop. And so cameras were trained on a white Sprinter van at a traffic stop for a while. Then the scene seemed to change to a culver restaurant parking lot. And this is what I had to stay up so late for tonight. I still can't tell you what it all means and what actually happened. But here's what I know, just from the reporting and the pictures that are coming in from the scene. A man was being questioned in that parking lot, seated in the back passenger seat of a sheriff's vehicle. The sheriff's deputies were sort of blocking who the person was, but you could clearly see they were. They were questioning somebody. And that's what we thought must have been the third person who was detained, you know, at a traffic stop. And maybe it was a culver, and maybe it wasn't that sprinter van. And then it got crazier. The next thing we're learning is that there is what looks like a, I don't know, maybe abandoned silver Range Rover. Certainly looks real dirty, like it's been there for a while. And it is parked in the culver parking lot as well. And suddenly agents are snapping lots of pictures of it, right? And people are trying to get pictures of them taking pictures, but we can't see inside the vehicle. And they are taking pictures all the way around the vehicle. And then they bring up two vehicles to sandwich either side of that silver Range Rover. And the next thing we see is tents going up to shield whatever it was they were looking at. When they opened the back trunk of the silver SUV of the Range Rover, and they held these, you know, like privacy screens on either side so that reporters could not see whatever it was they were looking at photographing or processing or taking out of the back of the silver Range Rover. Next thing we know, they're hooking it up and they're towing it away, pulling it up on a flatbed, taking it out of there. There are a lot of reports that have been flying around all over the place, including local TV stations, saying that a man took his own life. We can't put that together yet with whether it was at a traffic stop, whether it was at this particular area, whether it even happened at all. But it has been a night. It's been a late one. So before all of that happened. I had a very busy compilation day all recorded for you. And so I think you should hear about all the other batshid crazy stuff that happened in this investigation today too. So here's how the day played out. Hi everybody, I'm Ashley Banfield and this is drop dead Serious. And it is day 13 in the Nancy Guthrie saga. Nancy has been now missing for almost two weeks. It's been a day. And I'll tell you what, I'm recording this right now. It is 11:23pm on Friday the 13th, and as I speak, there is an active SWAT event happening about two miles away from Nancy Guthrie's home in Tucson, Arizona. It's dynamic, it's rainy, it's dark, There are no streetlights anywhere. But I can tell you this starting about an hour and a half ago. So about 10 o' clock Eastern, suddenly there was this rush of activity. SWAT vehicles and a mobile command center took off from the Pima County Sheriff's Department. We went through this the other night, right? We went through this. We saw the bomb squad and we saw the SWAT vehicles taking off to an hour south of Tucson. They rammed the door of a guy and his mother in law and took him away and detained him and ultimately released him and believe they had a good alibi. Tonight there is a very similar dynamic that's playing out, but it is only two miles away from Nancy's actual house. Brian Enten is everywhere. He never misses anything. He and Mo Moran as photographer are right there on the scene watching it. They're inside the perimeter. They accidentally ended up inside the perimeter. So they're just sort of frozen in place, trying not to make any waves or make trouble. And they witnessed two dozen sheriff's deputies vehicles and FBI vehicles, as well as two armored SWAT trucks and just a, you know, a phalanx of SWAT officers who descended upon this home and actually took two people out, man and a woman. Here's how Brian Entin reported this live from the driver's seat as he was trying his best to see out the rainy window in the pitch blackness with all these, you know, vehicles who'd responded to this incident. Take a look.
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Brian Enten
There is an active SWAT situation happening right now. Earlier I reported that the SWAT team was staging. They have now moved in on a house in Pima County. And again, we're keeping our lights off because we're very, very close to where this is happening and we don't want to interfere at all and we don't want to reveal our location. Obviously, we don't want to compromise the investigation. But I know that they have already, from what I can tell, pulled two people out of a house. And I know that this is connected to the Nancy Guthrie investigation that I have confirmed. Whether this is going to pan out into something significant or whether we're going to sort of see what happened the other night with the man who was detained and then released, that I cannot tell you. But this. The amount of resources here is massive. We saw dozens of SWAT members. We saw at least two SWAT trucks, fully armored. There is the FBI that is now out here. There's the Pima County Sheriff's Office, and there's at least. I must have followed at least two dozen sheriff's deputies and FBI cars into this neighborhood where I am now. So I wish I had more information. I have again confirmed that this is related to the Nancy Guthrie investigation, that this is a SWAT operation, that they have pulled two people out. So I wanted to wait to come on until I knew that we were not putting any, you know, law enforcement in jeopardy. Like, before they went in, they have already gone in. So it was a man and a woman, and it was hard to tell because it's so dark. And some of this is from sources. Some of this is not what I saw. I saw a little bit of it, but I'm also hearing that from several sources in terms of who was pulled out. So I couldn't see if they were handcuffed, but I am told it was a man and a woman. And there may also be a traffic stop close by that's also involved, which I'm trying to sort of piece that part of the puzzle together right now. But. But again, I do know for sure that this is connected to the Nancy Guthrie investigation.
- [10:07]
Ashley Banfield
So vehicle after vehicle after vehicle after vehicle entered through the cones and into the area, the neighborhood where this dynamic situation was playing out. Dozens and dozens of vehicles, including two that were Pima County Sheriff's office forensic vehicles. Super interesting. The search could take hours and hours and hours. It did the other night in Rio Rico. It took hours and hours. I don't think it wrapped up till around 3am eastern time. But the sheriff's department decided at one point they were going to hold a news conference, like right there out in the rain. And then that plan changed. So we have been waiting for an update. Late into the night, at about ten to midnight, the Pima county sheriff said there'd be no press briefing and that there would be a written statement forthcoming. And so two hours plus later, we get this, and it's not very informative. But it says law enforcement activity is underway at a residence near East Orange Grove Road and North First Avenue related to the Guthrie case. Because this is a joint investigation at the request of the FBI, no additional information is currently available. So obviously they're working well together tonight. But that's all we have. A couple of things that I have on on the agenda for the episode. Big, big notes today. So last night, if you watched my episode, Fox News had broken this big, big piece of news very late at night that they had high level FBI sources that had told them that there was a glove found inside Nancy's home. And then there was also this beef that was ongoing between the sheriff and the FBI. And today that whole thing is now reversed. The sheriff has come out after telling us he wasn't going to do any press conferences or give one on one interview, started to do selective interviews. So I'm going to give you one really good interview that he did that's coming up. And it's really Elizabeth Vargas with News Nation. Former colleague of mine, she's really smart. She did just a fantastic interview with the sheriff. She really covered a lot of basis. And I'm going to let you see all of the things he said from his own lips. But you know, first and foremost as he knocked down a that there's no glove that was ever retrieved from inside the home. Around the home, sure. In a vicinity, not on the property. Though number two, that there is no beef. Now we talked a little bit about this off the top of the episode last night. Careful reporters love to seize one guy's words or one person's words and then blow it up really big. It makes a really big headline. But you know, it's nuanced. There's a lot of politics going on in that jurisdiction. And sure there's some people who don't like their boss. That's not unheard of anywhere. I've certainly heard that about this particular sheriff's department. But to say that the FBI is not playing in the sandbox with the sheriff's department or the sheriff's department is not playing in the sandbox with the FBI. I think overall, if you believe what the sheriff said today, that's overblown. Watch the space because someone in the FBI may leak again what what they think. But so far he's done a lot of interviews, he said over and over and you're going to hear all of his words in multi different areas and ways, statements, interviews, all the rest. And then also another note, it wouldn't be the day 13 if we didn't have another note from some freak. Whether this freak is connected or not remains to be seen. But somebody sent another note to tmz. So this would be three that Harvey Levin and his team have received. And this third note has some specifics in it as well. I'm going to get to that, tell you what TMZ has on this and what they've done as well with it. And then there's some really crazy video that was shared on a neighborhood app and it kind of went wildfire through social media today of a mysterious looking guy about six miles away from Nancy Guthrie's house poking and prodding in somebody else's front entrance. Twice in the night, two different times. I'm going to tell you exactly what is happening with that video and with the police and what they think of it because it matters. It matters. They're taking it seriously. And then, I don't know. I really like this Derek Kalela Kaye. Yeah, I don't know how he pronounces his name, but that fella's in a world of hurt. He's the guy that authorities believe sent the bogus ransom requests straight to Annie Guthrie and her husband. He was caught in California. He made an appearance in Tucson federal court. You don't want to mess with the feds. And we're going to show you, I guess you could call it the walk of shame if he's guilty. Holy shit, is this guy in trouble? His life is over, right? Anyway, I'm going to show you all of that. And again, I've got this phenomenal interview that I'm going to play for you with the Pima County Sheriff. And then some weird shit, like just a lot of weird stuff happened today. And I got a whole basket of it that I'm going to send your way. Okay, let's go over some of the day because yet again, it was a doozy. So at 6pm Eastern Time, 4pm Tucson Time, Brian Enten reports that there's planes, like, circling overhead as he's doing a live shot for News Nation. And he says they are Pima county sheriff's aircraft. They are known for doing surveillance, which is intriguing. There's no announcement as to what they're doing, why they're up there, but they were up there. So the search has gone to the air at least today, at least at 4pm local time. And then not long after that, Brian and a whole other bunch of media outlets reported that the mobile command vehicle and a SWAT vehicle were on the move that happened about 5:30 and Kvoa, as I mentioned, a local station confirmed that is connected to the Guthrie case. And so a lot of media followed, a lot of streamers followed and responsibly many and most stayed back so as to not, you know, alert said target that, you know, the popo's coming. And so that's still ongoing as I come to you tonight. It's 10 o' clock Eastern right now. Don't know what it's going to yield, but we got a really late yield. The last time there was a door knockdown, you know, raid that happened around 10, 11 o' clock at night. Guy was arrested. Well, guy was detained, put in cuffs on a traffic stop. He had his family in the car door dashing. They busted down the door of his home. They did a very long search and ultimately determined not the guy. He had a good alibi, the sheriff said, but a tip and some other things, other kinds of electronics, some houses. The sheriff's wording was odd. Other kind of digital work led to to that particular action. Don't know what led to tonight's, but we do know that there's DNA I.
- [17:23]
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- [18:23]
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- [18:49]
Ashley Banfield
Now, that is not Nancy Guthrie's DNA and not anyone in her immediate orb, family or others that was found inside the house. What kind of DNA? Good question. That's important. Really good question. I'm gonna explain in a moment how critical the kind of DNA you get is in an investigation like one piece. DNA ain't like another. And there's a real, there's a great expression for it and that is that DNA is a dirty word. I'll explain it in just a moment. But first, just so you know, Sheriff is confirming DNA in fact found in Nancy's home not related to her family or those that she has in her, you know, direct circle of people. So ABC reported that early on and said that DNA samples are being compared to samples taken from associates of Nancy Guthrie, according to Sheriff. Now I want to give Matt Finn from FOX News Channel big props because he was first today by my estimation and I'm scanning pretty far and wide, but he was the first today to score an interview with the Pima County Sheriff, Chris Nanos and knock down a lot of the story from yesterday. He'd done this big interview and let me give you the like highlights. No glove inside the house and emphatically no fancy words. No wishy washy's, no, you know, getting around it, no 100%. Sheriff's like, nah, nah, that is just wrong. There was no glove inside the house. So here's how FOX News channel opened one of their late prime hours with this exclusive reporting last night. Take a look.
- [20:40]
Sheriff Chris Nanos
And Jesse, I want to start with.
- [20:41]
Ashley Banfield
A little breaking news. A high level source of the FBI.
- [20:43]
Sheriff Chris Nanos
Has just confirmed to me that the.
- [20:45]
Ashley Banfield
Pima County Sheriff's Department has blocked key.
- [20:48]
Sheriff Chris Nanos
Evidence to the FBI. We're talking about a glove found inside Nancy Guthrie's house along with some DNA. The FBI wanted that evidence so they could take it, analyze it themselves, send it to Quantico to get some faster return.
- [21:02]
Ashley Banfield
The sheriff's department decided to keep that evidence and send it to a private.
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Sheriff Chris Nanos
Analyst firm in Florida.
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Ashley Banfield
So clearly that is not going to.
- [21:10]
Sheriff Chris Nanos
Help the relationship here between the FBI and the Pima County Sheriff, which we.
- [21:14]
Ashley Banfield
Know in the early going has been tense at best. You know, and FOX has really good contacts in the federal government. They're very connected to Cash Patel as well. I don't know if Cash is the source of that, but that was a sourced Report. Multiple other outlets match that reporting. And that was the headline of the night, only to be flipped on its ass today. And Fox News, Matt Finn getting the, you know, the different side of the story. So no glove was sent to that Florida lab. And by the way, if you were watching last night, turns out it was the Florida lab that I had named. The lab that the Pima County Sheriff's Department uses is in Deerfield Beach, Florida. And it is a very, very good lab with a really good track record. And that is the one apparently that they've used that I should say came from good source reporting. I didn't find that out myself, though. Okay, so apparently they've been using this lab for over a decade. They got that stuff out fast. This is before the FBI comes in, because the FBI comes in the next day on Monday. This is what the sheriff has told us now is that the FBI got involved one day into this thing. So it's not like, oh, they were left out for days. They were brought into the fold on. On Monday. And remember what we had on Sunday? We had a missing grandmother. So time is of the essence, right? Chop, chop. I need this tested now. And so it kind of stands to reason that the Pima County Sheriff's Department would fire that stuff off to a private lab that can do it fast. Your state lab is way backed up, right? They just forget it. State labs. Don't even get me started. They're so overworked, underpaid, and they mess up a lot, and they screw up a lot of cases. Not necessarily because they're bad people. It's just because there's just too much, too much to do. But private labs, bam, you can get that done. You can get that back within 24 hours, you know, if you pay. And I've got some details about money changing hands. Reports of $200,000 being paid to that lab. Then other reports saying it was pro bono. A little confusing there as well, but important that you know that that was the plan. Get it to the lab in Florida, Deerfield Beach. They're really good at what they do. They've got incredible track record. And let's get that back fast and just find out if there's somebody we can catch quickly. So the sheriff also said to Matt Finn, Fox News, it's bullshit that there's this massive war going on between the FBI and us at the sheriff's Department. It's just not true. We're working well together. Said it is a kidnapping. Still believe it's a kidnapping. Found a few different gloves around the area, but not in the property. Some of them miles away, some of them as far as Phoenix. Right. No one is ever really eliminated. When asked if anyone's been ruled out, this is what Matt was told also. Again, more than one issue led the sheriff to the Rio Rico man, But he's satisfied with that man's alibi. Will not confirm to fox that there was forced entry. Remember, I told you on Tuesday of last week that my source said there was indeed forced entry, but every time the sheriff's been asked, he says, I won't confirm that. Of the criticism that the sheriff's office released Nancy Guthrie's crime scene too soon and opened it up too quickly, originally he said, that's on me. But now he's kind of going back on that and saying that's not true. They got what they needed. He said that they, you know, anybody who else who came in and investigated afterwards got what they needed and then was asked, should you have cleaned the blood up outside the house? Now, I know the answer to that one. It's not the job of the police to clean up a crime scene. That's not what they do. So nobody should take swipes at the cops for leaving blood. That's. That's the way it works, unfortunately. Anyway, deputies, car. Sheriff's deputies, cars that are parked outside of the home of Nancy Guthrie's home. That is also something that the sheriff said is at the request of the family for safety. It's not a signal that the sheriff left too soon, that they're back there. He said that was something that the family requested. Then, on the allegations that the family members are involved, Sheriff said, quote, family's been fully, 100%, completely. Whatever we've asked for, they've done. It was getting crazy out there with allegations about family. But in the same interview, he also said no one is ever really ruled out as of today. He also said that he's got a great relationship with the FBI. They're a good team. They're good people. Okay, so Elizabeth Vargas did this fantastic interview on Elizabeth Vargas tonight on News Nation tonight. And she asked a wide range of these questions and more. And you'll get the differences in his wording, the differences in the questions. But I want to play that interview for you now, sheriff.
- [25:54]
Matt Finn
Now, I want to first talk to you about the DNA that you are testing. You have unknown DNA that you have found. DNA that does not match anybody in the Guthrie family, does not match anybody working for Nancy Guthrie inside her home. This sounds like this could be A significant lead.
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Sheriff Chris Nanos
Well, we found DNA and we eliminated some people. Yes. And yes, it's significant when we find somebody that certainly matches that for sure. But right now, there's a lot of significant leads we're working. I think that video was very key to us, and we're tracking down some things there, too. So we. As of what's today? Sorry, it's Friday. So as of Wednesday, we had over 18,000 leads here. The FBI had some 14, 15,000 leads there. We put that video out in less than a couple hours. We had almost another 5,000 leads. Wow. Probably close to 40, 50,000 today. But. But we want those leads. We need those leads. We need people to keep calling us and sending us things and. And because that's what's going to solve this case.
- [27:02]
Matt Finn
Presumably you've run that DNA against codis, which is the database for people who've been convicted of crimes and did not find a match.
- [27:10]
Sheriff Chris Nanos
You know, I don't know where they're at, but correct. We have no match. I don't know how. There's a lot of work to do with DNA in splitting it and mixtures and different things. Way above my grade. I just allow my team. They deal with this stuff all the time. They're the experts, the FBI as well. And we let them come to us and tell us what it is they need, and we help them with that.
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Matt Finn
Did you find this DNA inside the house or outside the house?
- [27:40]
Sheriff Chris Nanos
I'm just. I can't go there. I'm sorry.
- [27:42]
Matt Finn
But it was near the house. I mean, it wasn't, you know, at some random place two miles away.
- [27:47]
Sheriff Chris Nanos
It was. Well, the DNA we worked with was the DNA from that house. The morning we went out and processed.
- [27:57]
Matt Finn
That crime scene, you obviously, this door cam video was a huge, significant breakthrough for you. Are you also working on retrieving video from the NEST cameras that were inside Nancy Guthrie's home or perhaps in other places on her property?
- [28:14]
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- [28:14]
Sheriff Chris Nanos
I won't say where they were located, but I will say this. Yes, we had several cameras that we took and gave. That's part of this story. Was the sheriff's holding back from the FBI or block that's furthest from the truth? I don't know where that comes from. We came in that morning on Sunday or Monday morning, I guess it is now. Took our evidence. My team says we're going to send ours to the lab. It's a lab we use. They're in Florida now. I think years ago, they may have been in Arizona. I don't know. They put in a bid every year or every couple of years, and they win it. They're a good lab. They've done great work for us, solved cases before. FBI has a great lab. They've solved some cases for us. That wasn't the issue here. The issue was we submitted our evidence from that crime scene to there. We also had some hard evidence, what I consider hard physical cameras, phones, computers, things like that. And we knew the FBI has the best resources for those items to be analyzed. And that morning, people say, well, you waited too long. We called them that morning, 8 o'. Clock. They immediately said, sheriff, whatever you need. And they were attached to it. In fact, you just have to look at the press conferences that day, or I think it's Tuesday, the day after. Who's standing behind me? The FBI, the next FBI. So we have a relationship here with the FBI that is not just vital to the FBI. It's not just vital to my department. It is vital to this community. And that relationship has lasted for 30, 40 years, as far as I know. We've always sent people to work in their building with their agents. They've had people at our place to work with us. To suggest that this sheriff would tell the FBI no on anything, that's crazy.
- [30:01]
Matt Finn
These reports, these reports that we have gotten that the FBI is frustrated, that they feel you're not cooperating are completely false.
- [30:10]
Sheriff Chris Nanos
I agree. They're completely boss at this local level. I don't know what's going on in Washington. I respect Washington because they have a job to do, too. That's my team's, my FBI team here locally. That's their boss. And they have right to make decisions as bosses. I have bosses too. That's my community. And so we sit down with their local leadership here, the SAC and the ASAC from Phoenix and Tucson, and we talk about these things. I've spent more time talking to you, probably 10 times more than talking to sacs about this DNA going to their lab or our lab. It was nothing more than simply a matter of I have a lab that has all of our evidence. They have our markers for the family and people we want. Maybe it's the landscape or the pool guy, all of those there, why would I send. And then we had another crime scene at a scene. We did a search, one on all that stuff, went to our labs. And so when they brought me the glove that was found some two miles away, they said, we'll send it to our lab. I said, why do that? Let's just keep it all in one.
- [31:19]
Matt Finn
Keep it all in one place.
- [31:20]
Ashley Banfield
Okay.
- [31:20]
Matt Finn
We should say for our audience that the Sack is a special agent in charge of the FBI. Getting back to the other nest cameras, when do you think we might see? I mean, I know this is an arduous process. Google helped out with the doorbell cam. When might we see the video from the. The other cameras?
- [31:39]
Sheriff Chris Nanos
You know, we looked at it and said, you know, FBI, you guys take this on just like the ransom notes. They're great at that. They handle it. They deal with it. They got some of it back. What? You saw that one video. That's key. That front door video was so key to us. We're hopeful that the other cameras can be done the same way. But we have not heard. We know they were submitted, I think, to Google, and Google said, we'll try our best, but would not hurt back a neighbor.
- [32:08]
Matt Finn
You put out an alert yesterday asking people to recheck all their security cameras, even their. Their car cameras, because Teslas, for example, have recordings you asked everybody to check for. From January 1st until February 2nd, which is a massive time frame. There has been video that has emerged from January 23rd. And this is from a home about six miles from Nancy Guthrie's home. It shows a man on the front step at about 5am Are you investigating this? And do you know whether it's related?
- [32:46]
Sheriff Chris Nanos
So we have, like you suggest, a lot of video to go through, and this is one of them that we were alerted to, and we're looking at it. We're, you know, I allow the team, my team, the FBI team, those men and women who do the work, they take this as it is nothing more than a lead, just like other leads, and they're taking it, and they'll do everything they can to work with it and see does it tie into ours. Right now, the belief is not, not. Not really. But we're not dismissing it. We're still looking into it.
- [33:22]
Matt Finn
And you also asked for a specific date. I believe it was January 11th, for neighbors to search. Why that date?
- [33:31]
Sheriff Chris Nanos
Well, you know, I'm not real sure about all that with dates. I know we think of a search pattern. We come in and we fly over. We have ground troops, we do a search pattern. We come back the next day, and we look at it. Do we miss anything? And we kind of go over it again, and once we feel good about that, we expand that search pattern. The same with dates, time frames. Did we limit ourselves when we said we want to know what happened between 1st February and 2nd February, 31st January, 1st February, maybe, but we know that there's more info out there, so we, we're expanding it. Is. Is January 11th a specific date with specific ties to it? I don't know that I, I allow my team to work and they trust me. There's. They do tremendous work and we. This.
- [34:24]
Matt Finn
Are you still treating this case as a kidnapping, or are you also treating this as a possible homicide?
- [34:31]
Ashley Banfield
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- [36:02]
Sheriff Chris Nanos
So, yes, it's definitely a kidnapping. As for a homicide, we are working under the belief that she's still out there somewhere. The family believes that. I believe that. Why would we think otherwise? There's, there's. People say, well, there's no proof of life. Well, there's no proof of death either. Sometimes hope is all we've got. I've got a team of 400 officers out there from the state, the feds, the locals. They're working hard. Not just for eight to. They're 24 7.
- [36:34]
Matt Finn
Yeah.
- [36:34]
Sheriff Chris Nanos
And they're out there right now as we speak. And they need to have that hope, too. And they do.
- [36:40]
Matt Finn
In cases like this, it is standard protocol. Investigators first start with the small circle of immediate family and very close friends and eliminate them and then work their way out. Have you completely eliminated any member of the Guthrie family?
- [36:56]
Sheriff Chris Nanos
I will say this. I don't believe you eliminate anybody ever. Because take the gentleman in Rio Rico, where we went and did a search warrant, right? We talked to him. We felt comfortable with what he said. We checked into his story, and we felt like, okay, maybe there's not. But you don't know that, because what if the stuff we sent to the lab comes back and says, hey, you have Nancy's DNA here, so you can't really ever eliminate anybody. What we do is we chase that lead down to an end and go, is this it? Are we satisfied? As for the family, and this is really key to me and the media and those on social media need to understand this. You don't know the harm you do when you accuse somebody of something without any facts. And this family is suffering. They are grieving, and they have done nothing but cooperate with us all the way. Every step of the way, my heart goes out to them. Have they been eliminated? Like I say, nobody's ever eliminated. Until we find who we're looking for that video, someone knows who that is. That's who we need. We need to. We need somebody to tell us this is who this man is.
- [38:13]
Matt Finn
And very quickly, you brought up the glove that was found about two miles away. Do you think that glove was dropped by whoever took Nancy Guthrie?
- [38:24]
Sheriff Chris Nanos
You know, well, every piece of evidence, just like every clue, is vital. And I would never tell my community, oh, don't bother us with that. Don't bother us. But that glove was two miles away. So we prioritize it. We look at it. We'd be crazy not to go and pick that up and look at it. But since then, we've had reports of gloves being found 5, 10 miles away. We still go out there and grab those and we look into it and we prioritize it and prepare it for processing of evidence.
- [38:54]
Matt Finn
But you haven't discovered whether or not Nancy Guthrie's DNA was on that glove.
- [39:00]
Sheriff Chris Nanos
The glove was sent for DNA, and that's all I know right now.
- [39:03]
Matt Finn
You're still waiting. I'm sure if her DNA was on that Sheriff, you would have been the first person to get that phone call. Do you have any doubt you're going to solve this case? Do you have any doubt we're ever going to know what happened?
- [39:16]
Sheriff Chris Nanos
No, I have complete trust in my team. This is a team of young men and women. And now we have several teams of young men and women who do this every day. I would put their work up against anybody. Their homicide rate solvency is probably closest to 100% of any city this size. We're going to solve this, we're going to find this person and we're going to find Nancy.
- [39:40]
Matt Finn
Sheriff Chris Nanos, thank you so much for joining us. Really appreciate it.
- [39:43]
Ashley Banfield
So in all the sheriff's, the line that stuck with me from the sheriff today was there is no daylight between local law enforcement and the FBI here. Again, there is no daylight between local law enforcement and the FBI here. That's what the sheriff says. And to underscore it, he did all these interviews and I know that people have been taking the piss out of him online saying, wait, no interviews being granted, no press conferences. And then, oh, here's my interview. I felt the same way. I thought, well, hold on, what is it? You're either doing interviews or you're not doing interviews or you're selecting, you know, friendlies. I'm not sure that he was selecting friendlies because Fox News, you know, had that report last night saying that there's this acrimony and he gave Fox News an interview. You know, he gave Matt Finn the interview. So I don't know, I'm just here to report what I get. So sheriff put out this statement and it's, it's far reaching. I want to read it for you because there's things in it that weren't in some of the reporting. So I want you to have all the info instead of pieces of the info. Okay? Good afternoon, media partners. Investigation. He headlines each segment. So Investigation. The Pima County Sheriff's Department and the FBI continue to work jointly on this case. Our strong partnership is critical and we remain fully committed to this collaborative investigation. Pretty strong language to ensure consistency and streamline testing. Evidence requiring forensic analysis is being sent to the same out of state lab that has been utilized since the beginning of this case. This decision was discussed with and agreed upon by local FBI leadership, local field office guys. That's different than the feds up in Washington. So maybe there's some disconnect between the Washington folks and the locals, I don't know. But listen, that's really strident language. You know, strong partnership, fully committed to collaborative investigation. And also highlighting what he told Lisbeth Vargas, and that is that we started this investigation on, on Sunday because the locals respond. It's their job it is the local's job to respond to local crime and process a scene. And so when they got a missing woman and they've got some evidence, they're going to send it to the place they're used to using and thing that they're going to get back fastest. So that makes sense that he would then put that in the statement. Let me continue. Evidence. Several gloves have been located during the investigation. The closest gloves were found approximately two miles from the home. Reports that a glove was found inside the residence or on the property are inaccurate. All collected evidence has been submitted for laboratory analysis. DNA other than Nancy Guthrie's and those in close contact to her has been collected from the property. Investigators are working to identify who it belongs to. We are not disclosing where that DNA was located. Leads next section. Investigators continue to follow up on all leads. The suspect description released by the FBI this week remains a key focus. However, investigators are not ruling out any individuals or possibilities. No suspect vehicles have been identified. Identified. It's a huge word. Identified to us. That doesn't mean that they don't have something on their own radar that they're just not making public. We ask the public to continue submitting actionable tips. All submitted videos are being reviewed. There was a statement that the sheriff made actually last night to Mary Coleman, local affiliate kold, when he did his interview with her. As we were all wondering. I thought you weren't doing interviews. Anyway, Mary Coleman did an interview, and at the end of her tweet, she said that the sheriff said, they've got some really good leads. That stood out to me. They've got some really good leads. It's promising, right? You just want hope in a case like this. Yeah. It's mystery. Yeah. All the rest. But you just want to hope, you know, just think again. This is somebody's mother. Just imagine if this was yours. This was your mother. Hope is all you have to go on, and you just want every scrap of it you can get. So when I see a line like that, we've got really good leads, I seize on those things. I like that. All right, video requests. Next section of his statement. The Pima County Sheriff's Department will send an additional message to surveillance camera users in the Guthrie neighborhood via the neighbor app this afternoon, meaning today. And Again, today is February 13th. Pool service. This is important. One of the really batshit crazy things that happened today was that reporters noticed two pool service trucks driving into the home of Nancy Guthrie into the driveway. And it's like, hold it. This is a kind of a crime scene still. I mean, still searchers are happening. The tent went up yesterday. Why is the pool guy here? And two vehicles. Right up went the drones and caught the pool cleaners just doing their job back there. And we all thought what the actual. And the sheriff heard your concerns. So in the sheriff's statement mentions pool service at the request of the Guthrie family. Routine pool maintenance was conducted at the residence today. Totally said at the request of the Guthrie family. Let's be frank, guys. You can't let the house fall apart. The house still has to be looked after. And you can't let a pool not be looked after, especially in that heat and the rain today, etc. So that's what the sheriff just addressed that issue. And then this again, media briefings. Getting tired of reading this. There are currently no press briefings scheduled. The sheriff has granted a limited number of one on one interviews today. I'll say. And will not schedule additional interviews the throughout through the weekend. We understand media interest is high. However, due to time constraints, not all requests can be accommodated. We encourage outlets to coordinate with their local affiliates when possible. Look, I get it. We are a pain in the ass. Honest to God. Ask any, any, any sheriff's department across the country, any police department across the country. Ask the FBI. We are a pain in their ass. Trying to bring the public transparency, you know, that exists and doesn't exist is a hard job and it takes dogged efforts. When there's a big story like this and the media descends en masse, it's just amplified and it's hard. It's hard to deal with people like us. And when I say us, you know, we are your gateway to getting whatever information there is about a story like this. And, you know, we're all in this together, right? This isn't us against them. This is. These are our agencies. We pay for them. They're our security agencies. We are hoping that they're taking care of us the best we can. I think everybody's developed quite an affinity for Mrs. Guthrie, whether it's because of the story itself or whether you're a fan of Savannah. And you, you know, you're really moved by the photos of her with her mom. Who wouldn't be? Who wouldn't be? You know, but we all seem to really care a lot. And I. I have been in this business a long time and I see when certain stories like Gabby Petito really gripped people, they care. You know, they're worried for the welfare of the missing person. And so I get it. I Get it? Okay? So I said, DNA is a dirty word. And Matt Murphy, who's got a great book called the Book of Murder, I encourage you to run out and get it, because he's a smart guy and he's super analytical. He does not talk out of his ass. Matt Murphy said today in a segment on NewsNation that DNA is a dirty word among investigators. And that's because not all DNA comes in the same delivery packet, right? And I don't want to upset you because I'm going to talk very clinically with regard to criminal justice. But if DNA comes from semen, that's a different story. That is a different kind of DNA, right? If DNA comes from blood, that is a different story. That is a different kind of DNA. If there is just DNA, say, on the front entrance of Nancy's floor after you pass the front door, if that's the DNA, well, that's different, okay? Because there's such thing as touch DNA, right? DNA transfers very easily. So we shed skin cells and hair cells and all sorts of stuff all the time. And I'm just going to give you a scenario. I'm going to give you two. We'll start with this one delivery guy sweating like hell because it's, you know, Tucson, and he's got a package and he's ringing the doorbell, or he drops it on the front doorstep of Nancy Guthrie's home. And she opens the door, eventually she picks it up or she takes it from him, right? And she throws it on her front hall table or she puts it on the floor, or she puts it on the kitchen table. It is quite possible that his DNA is now in Nancy Guthrie's home. Does that delivery man have any reason to have been inside Nancy Guthrie's home? No, of course not. Does it mean he's been in Nancy Guthrie's home? No. That's why DNA is a dirty word. Because things get dirty with DNA and they transfer into places that they might not otherwise have ever been. And here's a better example, and Matt actually brought this example. He said he had a case once, California case. Woman is dead, fingerprints all over her fridge, right? DNA. Fingerprints all over her fridge. We got the guy and they get the guy, but he's all the way over. I think on the East Coast. He's a long way away. Anyway, if I'm getting the story slightly wrong, Matt, I'm sorry, but they figure out that this guy has never been to California. So how are your fingerprints and your DNA on a fridge, sir? And said sir worked in the actual production line of the fridge in the manufacturing of the fridge. So dude had his hands in the fridge, probably putting it into the box that ended up getting shipped to California. Touch DNA, it can make its way all over the place and it can be rubbed off on one thing and then from that thing be rubbed off onto something else. So I just caution you about the kind of DNA that was found and the location of the DNA. The sheriff said the location of the DNA, that's critical because the location of the DNA is also important. You get a guy's DNA on her bedsheets different than the front hall floor or table or kitchen table. Right? Little harder to have touch DNA rub off. Not impossible. Again, I've taken my FedEx packages upstairs with me and cut them open, thrown the package onto the bed. I'm sure you have too at some point. So just remember that shit can go sideways easily with DNA. But the kind of DNA that doesn't often go sideways is semen blood. That's the kind of stuff that isn't like came in on a package, you know.
- [50:49]
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- [52:04]
Ashley Banfield
Okay, so another Matt Finn story from today that I found very interesting. Matt, you're getting a huge shout out on Drop Dead Serious tonight. He's been doing some really good work by the way, Fox News has been doing just bananas work, just such good work on this story. But I also know that they've got about 35 people, maybe more at this time, you know, in the Tucson area helping them to cover this story. They've really descended upon the story. Hence, they're doing really good work. But Matt Finn, one of the correspondents for Fox News, said in one of his tweets today that catching a vehicle on camera. Well, there's a scenario in which the Guthrie getaway car may not have been clearly recorded on a traffic camera. And I know what you're saying, that's impossible, right? How is that possible? There's cameras everywhere. In this day and age, there's effing cameras everywhere, right? Like, there's like flock cameras everywhere. Flock cameras seem to get under people's skin. Other people hate them, love them. But flock license plate readers are kind of all over the place. How on earth could this guy have driven? Because you're not carrying, Nancy, on a bike or on your back out of this very, very dark you're driving. So how could that car not have been registered somewhere? Okay, well, here's what Matt Finn said. It's very smart reporting. By the way, city of Tucson tells Fox News that it doesn't use traffic cameras to record vehicles. Right. That's important because what they're trying to say here is that our traffic cameras measure dynamics of traffic so that maybe the signals can change quicker. Right. Have you ever noticed that sometimes your light's really long? Well, there's vehicle, you know, surveillance that can assess that. Hey, this traffic's very heavy going this way. So let's shorten up those red lights and get this traffic flowing faster. And that's effectively what Matt was saying the city of Tucson said about using traffic cameras to record vehicles, to assess the live patterns. Sure, Pima county says that it does have cameras that record, but that they're not perfect, that they are imperfect and may not catch the license plates. That's a piss off, because why bother? Why are you recording the vehicles? I mean, okay, maybe we'll have a, you know, remember the white elantra? We didn't have a plate on that either, but we had a white Elantra. So maybe it won't catch a plate, but it might catch a car nearby Oracle Road. A lot of people have made. Hey, about Oracle Road, which partially connects Nancy's neighborhood to Annie's neighborhood, her daughter. That is a state route, but Arizona dot. Arizona Department of Transportation says it has cameras, but they Also don't record again, I guess that is for traffic flow, for assessing the traffic flow. But there was this commenter on Twitter today that I found interesting. I can't back it up because I don't know this person. I looked at their bio and it didn't look like they had, you know, anything that indicated they would know a lot about this. But they did say that regarding flock license plate readers, Tucson has about 175 of them including several on North Oracle Road. I can't tell you that that's true, but I was interested just to hear that because another commenter said that local politics in Tucson has affected traffic cams, that traffic cams used to mail out tickets to people but that, you know, there was a lot of backlash and there was a local ballot measure that repealed that. So that's interesting. And then going a little further, one of the commenters said take a look at this website, deflock tucson.com so I went to the website dfloc tucson.com and it is an anti surveillance group that was started just this past September 2025 at the University of Arizona. They are just anti surveillance. They don't like the Big Brother. A lot of people don't like the Big Brother neighborhoods. They don't like to be under surveillance without people being able to be aware of that. They, they think if you're going to be under surveillance there should at least be signs saying you are under surveillance so you don't feel like you're again just under Big brother's watch. So DFLock Tucson.com suggests to me that there is a lot of flock activity in the Tucson area. Why you can't get a read on someone coming out of a neighborhood that's got like one in, one out, one ingress, one egress, I don't know. Okay, Sheriff Chris Knapps. I'm going, I'm jumping around a little bit because I collected a lot of information throughout the day and it may not be in perfect order, but Sheriff Nanos told News 4 Tucson that the Florida lab is analyzing samples that were given voluntarily and those from the crime scene pro bono. You know what that means? Free. But the Reuters report said that he spent $200,000 on the DNA tests. Now I can't make hay of that. All I can say is that News4 Tucson got the comment that there was pro bono work and Reuters got comment that both things can be true. Maybe there's some pro bono work going on and maybe there's also a $200,000 bill for additional work. I think there's a shit ton of testing that's going to go on with this case. A lot. So. And $200,000, by the way, is not a lot. DNA testing is not cheap, it's not quick, and there's a lot of it that's needed. And so if you have kind of like, if you want to get your order faster from Amazon, you pay a premium. It may be a lot of that as well. So interesting just to see that reporting. And thank you, News 4 Tucson, for getting that. Very interesting. Okay, so now let's go this. I feel like my chain gets yanked. And I think you do too, all day. One moment you're seeing something on Twitter and then it's making the cable news outlets and you're like, oh my God, this is related. And there's this guy six miles away from Nancy Guthrie's home, and he's seen on the front porch of someone else's home, again, six miles away. He's seen at 3:30 in the morning. And he's seen at 5 in the morning on January 23rd. This was posted on a neighborhood app. Okay. A lot of people were showing this guy his face. They weren't digitizing his face. They were spreading all over social media. And I'm digitizing it because there's resolution on this. First of all, I saw what he looked like, and it did look like he could be the guy in the mask. I mean, he's got a goatee, right? He's got that and he's got the build and he's got dark hair, you know, the eyebrows. But apart from that, anybody could be in that fucking mask. The mask covers everything. So there's like an artist who drew up a. This is what I think the guy looks like based on, you know, his eyes in his mouth. But I had to guess that everything else that was covered up. I'm like, really? Really? So the sheriff was asked about this video from January 23rd, six miles away, that it had everybody like freaking out today. And he said it's nothing more than a lead and they're taking it and they'll do everything they can to work with it and see does it tie in Right now the belief is not really. But we're not dismissing it. We're still looking into it. Right now. The belief is not really. That's really interesting. Okay, now to some of the TMZ reporting today, they have received this third note from scum of the Earth. Whether he's or she, whoever it is, is associated with this crime or not, whether they're just parasites trying to, you know, extort a family in the worst moment of their lives. So the third note is now a person who has said that they're upping their price. One bitcoin was what they said in the first note. Second note was, I'm not being taken seriously. And now the third note is I'm now upping my price to $100,000 instead of the one Bitcoin, which is $67,000. So this is the third note in a series of three. But don't forget, TMZ also received a free fourth communique, an alleged ransom note that asked for $4 million on a Thursday, and if that deadline wasn't met, $6 million on a Monday. TMZ has said that they check the bitcoin account on that, by the way, every day, and that there's been absolutely no movement, no money, nothing. But they received this series of three notes over the last couple days, and the third one came today from the same person. And they know it's the same person because they. They include the same details that TMZ has not released to the public. So they know it's the same person. They've used an email address and a name, and apparently the email address and name are different every time. And they've upped the price again to $100,000 for information. They said they know who has Nancy, and they know the condition of Nancy. That's something else that they said. And they said this quote, this is important. I was listening to Charles Adebodier on this. He said he's the second in command at tmz. He said when he gets the initial payment, he will give up the name of the main individual. It's interesting wording. When he gets the initial payment, he will give up the name of the main individual. Does that mean there's more than one individual and you're just going to give up the main one? So there's a conspiracy, or is this all bullshit? Anyway, the price has gone up to $100,000. And apparently this guy doesn't like police. Says he's too scared. He's got a whole litany of reasons why he won't go to the police with this and wants to go to TMZ with it. Okay. Another piece of information that came out today that was interesting. Brian Enten had an interview with a former Pima county undersheriff named Rick Castigar. He didn't have a lot of good things to say about Sheriff Chris Nanos. Here's the quote. Nanos has an exorbitant ego. In one case, he told the FBI that he's the better investigator and doesn't need their help. Take a look at this interview. And you know, I have heard there's a lot of politics that are playing out among the Pima County Sheriff's Office folks, prior and current. That's there's a lot of ugliness going on. So there you have it. There's a guy who's not fond of Sheriff Nanos. Something I saw on a Twitter account called Nerdy. I actually see him every day. It was a photo, but I haven't been able to find out where the photo comes from. And it's a photo of Nancy's front door since the white tent went up yesterday. And he pointed out that the nest bracket mount, you know, what was left behind after the camera was removed. The language has been different. Right. My source said it was smashed. The sheriff has said it was tampered with and disconnected. But in any case, that nest bracket mount is gone in this photo. So I'm trying to find some other reporting that shows that. That's the only photo I could see today of Nancy's door. But this was after the white tent was erected and then removed. And they've taken that bracket mount off of Nancy's front door. Okay, now to the moment you've been waiting for, I hope. Anyway, this guy, Derek Kalela Kaye. Yeah, I don't know how he pronounces it. 42 years old, makes a court appearance. I guess he had to come from California all the way to Tucson for a federal court appearance. But there's video of him leaving court and the reporting is as he was let out on a $20,000 bond with an ankle bracelet. I don't have that report on my own. I do have this, though, from the U.S. attorney's office at the District of Arizona, California. Man charged with transmitting a demand for ransom made an initial appearance today in federal court in Tucson. That is the U.S. attorney, Timothy Corshane. Derek, Kalea, Kaya Kalela, I don't know, of Hawthorne, California, is charged with transmitting a demand for ransom in interstate commerce and without disclosing his identity, utilizing a telecommunications device with intent to abuse, threaten or harass a person. According to the criminal complaint, Kalea Calla is alleged to have sent the demands via two text messages to a missing person's family on February 4, 2026. He's also alleged to have made a nine second phone call to a family member. Through the course of the investigation, it was found that Kalea Kaya Kalela was acting as an imposter, trying to take advantage of the ongoing situation. The U.S. attorney's office and the FBI will continue to hold this defendant accountable and any other individuals who seek to interfere with federal investigations or profit from the victim family's grief. A criminal complaint is simply a method by which a person is charged with criminal activity and raises no inference of guilt. Any individual is presumed innocent until evidence is presented to a jury that establishes guilt beyond a reasonable doubt. Case number 260-4209. M.J. derek, if you did this, you're going to the pokey and you know, you'll have your day. Either you'll have a day before a jury or you will be making a deal, some kind of deal. I don't know what your background is like, but it better be squeaky clean if you want a good deal. I also just wanted to do something that Lindsey Haller, who's the producer of this podcast, looked at the different balaclavas and ski masks that were available at Walmart, because the backpack is available at Walmart. And I just wanted to show you some of the balaclavas that are for sale in, you know, through Walmart. Not a lot of them have the eye hole in the mouth hole, right. There's a lot of balaclavas that have just the eyes across. A lot of ski masks. And let me tell you, I live in the Northeast. These things are a dime a dozen. Especially in Vermont when I'm up there skiing. I mean, everybody's got one of those, right? I would say in Tucson, not many people have them. I don't know why more people aren't talking about this. Who buys a ski mask or a balaclava in Tucson? I get it. Some people ski. I get it. Not many. Not many people, right? Fewer people in Tucson than, say, Vermont. Yeah. So I kind of feel like the backpack, while it could be pretty popular, I don't think that that ski mask balaclava is so popular. And what if that balaclava was purchased alongside any of the other items that are seen on this video? Right. Cluster purchasing. I've seen it happen before. Idiots. You know, Brian Walsh bought all of his stuff together, you know, for chopping up and disposing of his wife, Anna Walsh. But people do that. They. They buy all of their preparatory material in one fell swoop or in one or two fell swoops. That Bella Clava, to me, is going to Be the end of this guy. And I just wanted you to see a couple of examples of the balaclavas that are for sale. And when you see it in night vision, you can see the texture of it, right. My feeling is that it's black because it shows up lighter. Black shows up lighter in the night vision. And you can really see the texture, and you can really see the seams around the eyes. It's just fascinating to get a look at them as potential purchases. And there's not that many of them, right? Yeah, they're kind of dime a dozen. But again, in Tucson, I don't know. So another thing I wanted to talk to you about tonight was the foliage. I have been going back and forth on this a lot, and if you go over the video with me, when this perpetrator puts his hand over the. The camera, I. I see him clench his hand slightly, and I'm wondering if he's trying to pull it off. But he realizes he cannot get his hand in between the bracket and the camera. There is just a couple millimeters between these NEST cameras. It's hard to get a key in between. That's how narrow it is. You're not going to get your fingers in between if you want to yank it off. So I'm sensing that he was maybe putting his hand on, seeing if he could pull it off, and realized, oh, I can't. And he turns around, looks down. I think he's got the mouth light because it seems to illuminate the ground in the vestibule area, Sees there's nothing there, goes out to the. To the foliage, and then he pulls up on that foliage. Right. A lot of people have said he was trying to cover up the camera, but I don't know that that's true because he holds the foliage in his fist quite tightly. One commenter said that it looked like he was testing the strength of it at the foliage. I'm not sure of that. But when he comes back to the camera, he still got it clenched in his fist. And so if you're trying to cover the camera, I'm not so sure that you'd have it clenched in your fist, as if you'd maybe try to manipulate it with both hands to cover the camera. But he's got it clenched in his fist. And I actually, as I look at it over and over, I feel like he may actually have it clenched in two hands. And he's like, wedging the, you know, this vine in between the camera and the mount. And maybe he's trying to pull it. And that's what's got the foliage mucking about on the front of the lens. But that he might actually be trying to use the vine to tug the camera off. It stops before we know if he was successful. And if my source, you know, who's been right on a lot of stuff is right about the cameras being smashed, maybe the vine and all the debris that's down below didn't do the trick. And eventually it was just smashed off the mound because Michael Ruiz of Fox News found glass fragments, little small glass fragments in Nancy's vestibule area below, below that camera. But it is interesting just that, the possibility that maybe that's what was happening, which leads me to one other thing, and my husband and I have disagreed about this a lot. How was Nancy's blood in that front area? It looks impossible to get in through that front door. And my source said that the back door was wide open. Is it possible that when your ring cam is disturbed by activity, some people have alerts that go off, right. And they're NOISY, and it's 1:47 in the morning, perhaps, or 2:12, whatever time it is. Is it possible that Nancy was asleep and the alert went off on her phone? Activity at your front door. There's motion at your front door and that she's rested out of a deep sleep and gets her phone to see what's going on and looks at it at the exact moment that that foliage is dangling in front of the camera and she's wondering, what is that? Is it an animal? What on earth is happening out there? And puts the phone down before you get a clear look at the man's face and that might have taken her to the front door to open the door and wonder if it's an animal or something on her camera. It's hard to imagine that you would do that, but is it a possibility? And of course, as you're opening the door, if the perp is there, might he have pasted himself up against the wall and waited for her to come out and then injured her as she came out to look at her, you know, to look at her camera, which is something I was noodling the other day as to. I'm still confounded by how there's blood inside the house and outside the house, the front door and down the pathway. And of course, we don't know what happened to Nancy. We don't know. We don't know if she was taken out on foot, if she was carried out. We don't know if she was injured. Well, we know she was bleeding. We don't know if she was incapacitated, we don't know if she was killed. But all of these scenarios, I'm sure sheriff's deputies, detectives, FBI, homicide division was there. I'm sure they are going over every scenario as well as you know FBI agents who've done this for a very long time and mark my words, they've got a lot more evidence to go on than we do. Are they getting there? Let's hope so. Thank you so much for being with me through this podcast. I so appreciate your. I so appreciate your dedication. I love that you're here and I love that we're in this community. Join as a member. Would love to have you as a member as well. And don't forget, subscribe. I always have to say that. Subscribe. Subscribe. It's just a button. It's free and nothing happens and it doesn't affect you in any other way other than you will get my updates. Thank you everyone. I so appreciate you watching and listening. And remember, the truth isn't just serious, it's drop dead serious.
- [72:37]
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Ashley Banfield
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