Podcast Summary: "90% of Podcasts Are Doing It Wrong — Truth Behind Media Deals & Inside the Joe Budden Podcast Empire"

Podcast: Earn Your Leisure
Hosts: Rashad Bilal & Troy Millings
Guest: Ian Schwartzman (Business Partner to Joe Budden)
Release Date: January 8, 2026

Episode Overview

This episode provides an unfiltered, insider look at the business of podcasting with special guest Ian Schwartzman, business partner to Joe Budden and key architect of the Joe Budden Podcast Network. The hosts and Ian break down the current state of podcasting, the truth behind media deals, the pitfalls creators face, comparisons to the music industry, the Patreon model, the rise of video podcasts, the impact of major platforms like Netflix and Spotify, and why most creators are missing the real opportunities. The conversation is candid, strategic, and aimed at both podcast industry insiders and entrepreneurial-minded listeners.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Ian’s Background & Role in the Joe Budden Podcast Empire

• Relationship to Joe Budden
  • Ian clarifies he is not just Joe Budden's manager but his business partner with unique equity in the Joe Budden Network.
  • "The Joe Budden Network is owned by Joe Budden ... My involvement is there. I do have ownership there, but it’s in a very unique way." (06:56)
• Industry Roots
  • Managed other artists like Remy Ma, DJ Premier, Papoose, and Royce da 5'9".
  • Formation story: Parks, engineer for Premier & Joe, introduced Ian to Joe when Joe sought new business direction.
  • Focus was to transform Joe from a music artist to a media mogul, seeing greater potential in his personality than music.

2. Current State of Podcasting: Parallels with the Music Industry

• Podcasting Becomes the “New Hip Hop”
  • Shift from creative passion to hustling for deals.
  • "Everyone's doing the same thing they did in hip hop. How do I get the quickest bag ... It’s almost like Squid Games for media." (13:01, Ian)
• Ownership vs. Quick Money
  • Lack of curiosity and true business acumen—most creators are chasing quick deals and relinquishing IP for up-front checks.
  • "If 90% of the industry’s looking for exclusive deals because an exclusive deal means you’re getting a guaranteed check, then that’s what the industry at large learns." (15:05, Ian)
• Creators Need to Build Real Businesses
  • Emphasis on creators learning to build a business, not just become famous.

3. Media Deals, Valuation, and Transparency

• How Media Companies Value Podcasts
  • Platforms lowball creators—creators rarely see their true value due to lack of data transparency.
  • "What they give you in a deal is not what you’re worth. That’s what they’re willing to pay. Their calculation on you is what you’re worth. But they don’t tell you that." (20:11, Ian)
• Direct-to-Consumer (D2C) as the Revolution
  • The Joe Budden Network chose Patreon over exclusive deals to better control and understand their value.
  • "You can’t know what your value is with a streamer... But if you’re on Patreon ... all of a sudden, you can figure out what you’re worth. Your fans will dictate it." (21:27, Ian)
• Actual Numbers and Value of Niche Subscribers
  • The power of converting even a small percentage of a large audience. 80,000 subscribers at $10/month = $800,000/month; $1,000/month from 100 fans changes someone’s life.
  • "Everyone’s looking to be a millionaire... At some point, as leadership in this industry, we have to stop putting these ridiculous numbers in front of people and just say, hey, work on securing 100 people..." (30:11, Ian)

4. Lessons from Patreon & Monetization Models

• Why Their Patreon Strategy Works
  • The Joe Budden Podcast is the #1 creator on Patreon due to consistent, exclusive content and business discipline.
  • "We’re the unicorn… But the goal was how do we become non-reliant on the systems that are in place for everyone else." (29:52, Ian)
• Not for Everyone
  • Most creators fail with Patreon because they’re not willing to adjust, experiment, or put in the work.
  • "I don’t think it’s not working for people. I don’t think people are working for themselves." (28:25, Ian)

5. The Impact of Celebrity-Driven Podcasts (and Why They Fail)

• Celebrities Don’t Guarantee Success
  • Major streamers investing in celebrity podcasts found audience engagement lacking.
  • "Celebrities... are fast-tracking failure... Not only do those names not deliver a show, but even when they deliver a show, they’re not delivering numbers." (32:53, Ian)
• Saturation & Shifting Money
  • "Now when the company says, hey, we tried it with celebrity A... we saw that failed. Now that money comes down across the board, too." (37:55, Co-host)

6. Platform Wars: Netflix & YouTube Entering Podcasting

• Netflix’s Entry shakes Things Up
  • Netflix is buying up bundles of podcasts (vodcasts) from companies like iHeart and Spotify, rather than individual shows.
  • "Netflix and YouTube are at war... They’re betting 10 years down the line right now, they don’t give a f*** what show this is." (47:06, Ian)
• The Bundle Model
  • Platforms negotiate for catalogs, not single shows, giving networks leverage and leaving creators with less negotiating power.
  • "You buy one of something, you pay premium. You buy 50 of something, you get a deal. Both parties win." (55:45, Ian)
• Loss of Ownership in New Deals
  • New podcasters sign away video rights and long-term value for bigger up-front checks. "Yes, they are giving up their video rights off the rip." (52:51, Ian)
• Organic Partnerships vs. Generic Ads
  • Joe Budden Podcast only accepts bespoke, collaborative partnerships (like Netflix event integration), not one-off product ad reads.
  • "We went the other way. You don’t see how little we shove down people’s throats so that when we actually talk about something, you’re gonna know we believe in it..." (61:36, Ian)

7. Adversity, Adaptation, and the Unique Joe Budden Model

• Adaptation through Change
  • The Joe Budden Podcast has survived major cast changes, adversity, and failed spin-offs by embracing change and learning from experiences.
  • "Anything when you’re first going through it is extremely intimidating... But doing that made us stronger. It gave us experiences..." (41:25, Ian)
• The SNL Analogy
  • The show is an incubator for talent—like SNL, cast members launch their own careers and might return later.
  • "We’re the SNL of 2025…where The Office meets SNL…We put, we’re a platform. We hope you use us and then go off and do your own thing." (63:14, Ian)

8. The Podcast "Bubble" and the Future

• The Bubble Has Burst
  • The hosts agree the podcast space has popped; easy ad money is gone, and only creators who can build loyal audiences and self-sustain will survive.
  • "The podcast space ... it’s popped already. You’re gonna see a crumble right now." (71:00, Ian)
• Comparison to the Barbershop Business
  • Podcasters waiting for platform deals ("walk-ins") will struggle; those building relationships with loyal audiences will thrive.
  • "We have a bunch of people that have entered the space that are waiting for walk-ins... and then you have the barbers that have been in the game for 20 years..." (73:02, Ian)
• Data Is the Real Asset
  • Real value is not in the initial deal but in audience data, which companies can leverage endlessly.
  • "The deal number is not the real number. The real number is what they make off of you once they have your data." (75:09, Ian)

9. Joe Budden Network’s Strategic Direction

• Quality Over Quantity
  • Future expansion will focus on internal IP and carefully curated partnerships, rather than rapid scaling or managing external podcasts.
  • "Let’s stop reaching outward... There’s no race to quantity, there’s a race to quality. We could do a lot with a little." (78:02, Ian)
• No Immediate Plans to Become a Podcast Management Firm
  • Ian prefers to stay boutique and focused on current ventures: "A lot of times people drown in opportunity and I don’t want to do that... I won’t have the ability to recapture where I am in the moment right now." (79:21, Ian)

10. Legacy, Influence, and Final Reflections

• Shout-outs and Gratitude
  • DJ Premier, Papoose and Parks are credited as key figures in Ian’s journey.
  • The recently released Nas & DJ Premier album, "Light Years," is highlighted as a milestone project.
• Encouragement to the Community
  • Ian urges creators to get their business straight, value audience over fame, and avoid giving up ownership just for short-term gain.

Memorable Quotes & Timestamps

• "It’s almost like Squid Games for media." — Ian Schwartzman (13:01)
• "No one knows how to build a business. … Who’s teaching creators how to build businesses?" — Ian (15:12)
• "If you’re on Patreon ... all of a sudden, you can figure out what you’re worth. Your fans will dictate it. It’s not a guessing game." — Ian (21:27)
• "Celebrities are not. … Celebrities in my opinion are fast-tracking failure." (32:53)
• "Joe Rogan took his shit off of YouTube for his check at Spotify ... that didn’t work." — Ian (53:30)
• "We went the other way ... when we actually talk about something, you’re gonna know we believe in it." — Ian (61:36)
• "We’re the SNL of this generation ... we hope you use us and then go off and do your own thing." (63:14)
• "The podcast space ... it’s popped already. You’re gonna see a crumble right now." — Ian (71:00)
• "Get your business straight." — Ian (82:09, closing)

Notable Timestamps

• 06:56 – Ian on ownership in the Joe Budden Podcast and industry dynamics
• 13:01–15:12 – Podcasting as "new hip hop," IP, lazy industry defaults
• 20:11–21:27 – How platforms value shows and Patreon’s D2C advantage
• 29:52–30:11 – Monetization math, setting realistic goals
• 32:53 – Why celebrity podcasts mostly fail
• 47:06–55:45 – Netflix’s moves, video rights, and the industry’s future
• 61:36 – The Joe Budden Podcast’s selective approach to sponsorship/partnerships
• 71:00 – The "podcast bubble" has popped; what’s next
• 73:02 – Barber analogy: transactional vs. relational podcasting
• 75:09 – Data is the real business
• 78:02–79:21 – Network expansion, boutique vision, staying focused

Closing Thoughts

This episode is an intensive masterclass on media entrepreneurship, content ownership, and adapting to a rapidly changing podcast landscape. Ian Schwartzman’s frank and detailed insights reveal why most shows are “doing it wrong,” how deals are structured to benefit platforms—not creators—and why the future belongs to creators who focus on business fundamentals and building direct audience relationships. Rashad Bilal and Troy Millings expertly guide the conversation to help listeners understand not just the "what," but the "why" behind podcast business success.

For aspiring creators or anyone in the podcast industry, this is essential listening — or reading.