Economic Update with Richard D. Wolff
Episode: Choosing Your Struggles
Date: March 20, 2016

Episode Overview

In this episode of Economic Update, Richard D. Wolff discusses the fragility of the US economic recovery, the political debates over trade with China and the Brexit vote in the UK, intergenerational inequality and the challenges facing millennials, the economic core of fascism, and an in-depth look at job creation, worker cooperatives, and the state’s historical relationship to both capitalism and alternatives. Throughout, Wolff urges listeners to recognize where their real economic interests align and to question the narratives put forth in mainstream discourse.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Fragile US Economic Recovery

[01:00 – 06:30]

• Wolff begins by noting the Federal Reserve's reversal on its plan to raise interest rates in 2016, citing weakness and the unevenness of the economic recovery.
  • “After all the malarkey and the spin that the basic decision of the Federal Reserve is to face the reality that the economic recovery, so called, is on such shaky legs that even the minuscule interest rate increase they had contemplated is too much and too soon.” — Wolff [03:10]
• Real wages over the past year went “absolutely nowhere” even as employment numbers appear to improve.
• More people are getting jobs, but mainly low-wage positions, so incomes have not increased for the majority.

2. The Real Interests Behind US-China Trade Debate

[06:30 – 17:45]

• Politicians (especially Trump) paint the US-China trade imbalance as a national issue, but about half of Chinese exports to the US come from American corporate subsidiaries operating in China.
  • “Let's remember that about half of what comes from China to the United States is produced in China by subsidiaries of American corporations.” — Wolff [04:20]
• Tariff proposals are critiqued as simplistic:
  • Tariffs would raise costs for Americans and may not result in net job gains.
  • Debate over tariffs is not about the well-being of ordinary Americans, but a struggle between different factions of business capital (importers like Walmart vs. domestic producers).
  • “This is not a struggle that the vast majority of American people could or should care about... we're being asked to side with one group of capitalists against another. It’s their fight, it’s their issue, it’s not ours.” — Wolff [11:57]

3. Brexit: Another Business Struggle, Not a People's Movement

[17:45 – 22:45]

• Wolff draws a parallel to the Brexit debate in the UK: a fight chiefly among business interests about whether to stay in or leave the EU.
  • “Once again, these are struggles between contending groups of big businesses who have the resources as well as the incentive to line people up on one side against the other.” — Wolff [20:17]
• The general population is used as political leverage; core issues affecting most people remain unresolved.
• Key argument: the mass population’s real interests—such as labor and consumer rights—are left out of these debates entirely.

4. Millennials: The First Generation to Face Worse Prospects

[22:45 – 27:30]

• Citing a Guardian article, Wolff outlines that young adults (Generation Y/Millennials) in advanced economies earn on average 20% less than the national average—unprecedented outside war or disaster.
  • “It is likely to be the first time in industrialized history, save for periods of war or natural disaster, that the incomes of young adults have fallen so far when compared with the rest of society.” — Guardian, read by Wolff [23:55]
• This reflects a broader trend: shifting production and jobs to cheaper regions, leaving fewer high-wage opportunities behind.
• Older generations’ job protections are now being used as a scapegoat for these structural trends, rather than critiquing the profit-driven system itself.
• Mario Draghi (ECB President) is cited as encouraging intergenerational blame, something Wolff warns against:
  • “Where young people should focus their anger... is on the older workers. [But] Don’t be fooled. The problem is the system, not the particular benefits wrung by one generation of workers from that system.” — Wolff [26:24]

5. The Economic Core of Fascism

[27:30 – 31:00]

• By popular request, Wolff unpacks fascism’s relationship to capitalism.
• Fascism is presented as a desperate tactic by capitalism to preserve itself when mass opposition threatens the system: civil liberties and political pluralism are suppressed, and capitalist dominance is enforced by the state.
• Private property and business ownership are retained; fascism is not anti-capitalistic at its core.
  • “Fascism is a moment in the history of capitalism when for capitalism to survive, it can't allow what we might like to believe are the ‘normal rules’ of political life...” — Wolff [28:51]

6. Debunking the “Capitalist as Job Creator” Myth

[35:30 – 44:00]

• Wolff addresses a common claim: “capitalists create jobs, and thus deserve their profits.”
  • “Does the capitalist create a job? The answer is, no, he doesn't. In order for a job to exist, there has to be what economists call demand.” — Wolff [36:47]
• Besides demand, nature (raw materials) and accumulated knowledge/skills are also essential contributors.
• Capitalists merely coordinate these factors and claim a disproportionate share of the benefits.
• Alternative models—namely worker cooperatives—can also combine these elements, but distribute benefits more equitably.

7. The Case for Worker Cooperatives

[44:00 – 52:00]

• Worker cooperatives are presented as a viable, democratic alternative to capitalist enterprises.
  • “The worker cooperative can create jobs every bit as well as any capitalist could. It's simply an alternative.” — Wolff [41:05]
• Discussion of rules in the workplace (no child labor, no violence, etc.) shows it’s not unreasonable to demand workplace democracy.
  • “Maybe we should add another rule. Here’s the—the workplace can't be undemocratic.” — Wolff [44:53]
• Worker cooperatives allow for a more egalitarian distribution of benefits and democratic decision-making.

8. Government Support: Capitalism vs. Worker Co-ops

[52:00 – 56:45]

• Explores the history of state support for capitalism (tax breaks, subsidies, Taft-Hartley Act undermining unions, public education tailored to business needs, etc.).
  • “Capitalism from its birth to this moment... has been desperately dependent on the state. States have supported capitalism at every stage.” — Wolff [52:07]
• The demand for state support for cooperatives is not special pleading but a request for a level playing field.
  • “Worker co ops would win the day in this country the minute there was anything remotely like equal opportunity for them to make their case to the people and equal support from the state for them compared to what has always been... delivered by the state [to capitalists].” — Wolff [56:36]

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “We're being asked to side with one group of capitalists against another. It’s their fight, it’s their issue, it’s not ours.” — Wolff [11:57]
• “It's not a system that works this way. It's not a system driven by profits... No, no, no, no, no. Where young people should focus their anger... is on the older workers. ... Don’t be fooled. The problem is the system...” — Wolff [26:24]
• “Fascism is not the overthrow of capitalism... The role of the government has been to ensure... the dominance of the capitalist class.” — Wolff [29:04]
• “Does the capitalist create a job? The answer is, no, he doesn't. ... The job comes out of demand, nature, and knowledge.” — Wolff [36:47]
• “Worker co ops would win the day... the minute there was anything remotely like equal opportunity...” — Wolff [56:36]

Important Timestamps

• [03:10] - Federal Reserve's interest rate reversal and fragility of recovery
• [04:20] - American corporate role in US-China trade imbalance
• [11:57] - Why tariff debates are business fights, not issues for ordinary Americans
• [20:17] - Brexit as a business-driven divide, not a question of public interest
• [23:55] - Guardian's findings about Millennial earnings
• [26:24] - Scapegoating older generations vs. critiquing the system
• [28:51] - Economic definition of fascism
• [36:47] - Capitalist as (not) job creator
• [41:05] - Worker co-ops as alternatives to business-as-usual
• [44:53] - The case for workplace democracy
• [52:07] - History of state support for capitalism
• [56:36] - Level playing field for cooperatives and the need for equal state support

Summary

Richard D. Wolff argues that many mainstream economic debates—from trade wars to Brexit—are primarily contests between competing business interests, not urgent questions for the majority of working people. He points out the growing challenge for younger generations caused by global capital’s pursuit of profit, leaving them with stagnant or declining real incomes and little recourse but to scapegoat others unless they redirect their frustrations at the system. Addressing economic myths, Wolff dismantles the trope of the “capitalist as job creator” and promotes worker cooperatives as a proven, fairer alternative—one that deserves equal support from the state, just as capitalism has always enjoyed. The thread tying the episode together is a call for clarity: See through elite narratives, understand the real beneficiaries of economic choices, and organize for systemic alternatives that actually serve the public.