Economic Update with Richard D. Wolff

Episode: How Capitalism Shapes Our Food

Date: June 25, 2021

Overview

This episode of Economic Update delves into two intertwined themes:

1. The economic forces and corporate interests that shaped pandemic responses, especially regarding lockdowns vs. vaccines;
2. How capitalism, corporate profit motives, and industrial agriculture affect what we eat, our health, and the environment.

The second half features a deep conversation between host Richard D. Wolff and food writer/analyst Mark Bittman about the origins and consequences of industrial agriculture, the concept of agroecology, and the systemic barriers to transforming our food system.

Part 1: COVID Economics and the Profit Motive

Confusion and Contradictions in Public Health Policy ([00:10]–[07:30])

• Wolff begins by highlighting the conflicting information about COVID-19 policies—dangerous variants, assurances from pharmaceutical companies regarding vaccine efficacy, and the varying policies of governments (e.g., UK, Germany, Japan).
• He notes discrepancies even within the US: governors debating reopening and masking policies.
• Quote:
  "What sense is one to make of it?" – [A, 01:47]

The Economics of Lockdowns vs. Vaccines ([05:30]–[10:10])

• Wolff contrasts lockdown (prevention) and vaccine (cure) strategies.
• He stresses the lasting costs of widespread infection—chronic illness, strain on healthcare systems, and enduring financial burdens.
• He calls out the economic rationale: lockdowns reduce business profits and may require tax-funded wage support for non-working employees, whereas vaccines allow continued business operation with minimal profit loss.
• Quote:
  "Lockdowns are not good for business... So the business community is terrified it's not going to make money... Vaccines are much better. Your workers keep working, people can keep shopping." – [A, 09:07]

Pharmaceutical Profits and Policy Influence ([10:10]–[15:18])

• Wolff points out pharmaceutical companies' massive profits during the pandemic and their influence on the response.
• He discusses how advertising and corporate interest shape both consumer and policy decisions—even in healthcare.
• Notable Statistics & Figures:
  • Nine new billionaires, all tied to vaccine manufacturing, gained $19.3 billion collectively ([12:58]).
  • Stock prices:
    • Moderna up 700%
    • BioNTech up 600%
  • Pfizer expects $26 billion in 2021 vaccine sales at a 30% profit margin ([14:53]).
• Quote:
  "Wow. That's a self-destructive behavior of a society." – [A, 12:05]
  "If you take the nine billionaires—the new ones—they together are now worth $19.3 billion of wealth. And that's the price it would take right now to provide vaccine to 780 million people on this earth." – [A, 13:30]

Part 2: Food, Capitalism, and the Industrial Food System

Introducing Mark Bittman ([15:19]–[15:37])

• Author of How to Cook Everything and Animal, Vegetable, Junk.
• Special advisor on Food Policy at Columbia University.

What Is Industrial Agriculture? ([15:57]–[18:02])

• Bittman explains that modern agriculture prioritizes profit over nourishment, health, or ecological sustainability.
• Romanticized images of family farms are largely a myth; most farming is done on massive plots producing commodity crops for sale, not direct consumption.
• Factory farming treats animals as "widgets."
• Quote:
  "All of this amounts to a system that puts profits first and eaters last. Remember, we are all eaters, but we don't all profit from industrial farming." – [B, 17:05]

Agroecology: An Alternative Vision ([18:02]–[19:16])

• Agroecology combines agriculture and ecology, emphasizing the interconnectedness of humans, non-human species, and the Earth.
• It advocates farming that protects workers, communities, and the environment, while producing better food and building local economies.

The Systemic Power of the Profit Motive ([19:16]–[22:13])

• Wolff notes that the food system, much like other industries, is steered by profit, with unhealthy additives and over-processing justified by returns.
• Bittman says the system works for the wealthy and powerful, leaving many with poor food choices and health outcomes.
• Quote:
  "Food system works pretty well [for the well off]... But the people who have power, most of the power to change things, have cars, eat well, do okay in the current economy... Are we willing to work to change a system that is obviously not to everyone's benefit?" – [B, 20:50]

Systemic Change vs. Individual Solutions ([22:13]–[24:30])

• Both agree that anger at food company executives misses the point—systemic incentives reward profit-seeking, not public health.
• Addressing food-system injustice requires building broad-based movements, not relying on consumer "choice" or appeals to executive morality.
• Quote:
  "The minority who suffers most can decide to try to cause a revolution, and it usually fails... Or they can try to ally themselves with progressive elements of the majority..." – [B, 22:13]
• Bittman suggests small wins (pesticide control, limiting junk food advertising) can build momentum, but acknowledges, "I don't have the key here." ([23:30])

Organic Food, Inequality, and "The System's Revenge" ([24:30]–[26:26])

• Wolff observes that "organic" foods are available to those with more money, further entrenching inequality: "If you don't [have money], it's almost like the system is saying, well, we're going to mess up your body..." ([24:44])
• Bittman replies that the system is agnostic: it will sell whatever people can afford. Supermarkets and producers simply follow the money, thereby reinforcing market-driven disparities.

The Potential for Cooperative Agriculture and the Need for Reparations ([26:26]–[28:04])

• Wolff asks about organizing agriculture as worker co-ops rather than capitalist enterprises.
• Bittman affirms interest but points out necessary preconditions:
  • Address land reparations: most US farmland was appropriated from Indigenous peoples ([26:52]).
  • Implement land reform to redistribute land fairly for genuinely cooperative farming.
• Quote:
  "We have an unequal and unfair distribution of land, which is a great source of wealth... So how do we repair that damage and what do we do about the existing land?" – [B, 27:09]

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the essence of the food system:
  "We are all eaters and one of the things that binds us... is food." – [Bittman, 16:08]
• On pharmaceutical profits vs. global health:
  "If you take the nine billionaires... they together are now worth $19.3 billion of wealth. And that's the price it would take right now to provide vaccine to 780 million people on this earth." – [Wolff, 13:30]
• On systemic obstacles:
  "Unless we change that system, hoping to appeal to these people, even on the grounds of a basic morality, it doesn't seem to have worked real well." – [Wolff, 21:46]

Important Timestamps

• 00:10–15:18 — Wolff on COVID-19, capitalism, and the economics of pandemic response
• 15:37 — Introduction of Mark Bittman
• 15:57–19:16 — Definition and criticism of industrial agriculture; explanation of agroecology
• 19:16–24:30 — Discussion of systemic power, profit motive, and barriers to food system reform
• 24:30–26:26 — Organic food, inequality, and market-driven disparities
• 26:26–28:04 — Cooperative farming and the need for reparations/land reform

Tone & Takeaways

The conversation is frank, critical, and informed, inviting listeners to look beneath surface narratives about personal choice, innovation, and market efficiency. Both Wolff and Bittman argue that profit-driven motives—whether in vaccine production or food manufacturing—shape outcomes in ways often at odds with public health and ecological sustainability. Real solutions, they suggest, require collective action, systemic change, and a willingness to reckon with deep-seated inequalities.

For further insight, read Mark Bittman’s Animal, Vegetable, Junk and follow Democracy at Work for continued discussion on capitalism and the everyday economy.