Empire Podcast Episode 235: "The Viceroy, The Psychopath, and The Merchant: The Irish in Empire (Ep 3)"

Release Date: March 6, 2025

Hosts: William Dalrymple and Anita Anand
Guest: Professor Jane Olmeyer, Author of Making Empire: Ireland, Imperialism, and the Early Modern World

Introduction

In Episode 235 of Empire, hosted by William Dalrymple and Anita Anand, the discussion delves into the intricate and often paradoxical roles that the Irish played within the British Empire. The episode, titled "The Viceroy, The Psychopath, and The Merchant: The Irish in Empire," features insights from Professor Jane Olmeyer, whose expertise in Irish imperial history provides a nuanced perspective on this complex relationship.

The Irish as Pillars of the Empire

Anita Anand opens the conversation by highlighting the Irish involvement in the British Empire, particularly through the East India Company. She remarks, "Ireland is basically the blueprint, the roadmap, the laboratory for what the English will then go and do on a far bigger scale" (02:06). This sets the stage for exploring how Irish individuals were instrumental in shaping imperial policies and practices.

Professor Jane Olmeyer underscores the significant contribution of the Irish, noting that by the 1880s, Irish Catholics constituted two-thirds of both the East India Company's armies and the Raj's civil services (29:27). She emphasizes the economic and social conditions in Ireland, explaining, "The Irish peasants are poorer than the Bengali peasants. They need the king's shilling" (29:38), which drove many to seek fortunes abroad.

Gerald Anger: The Merchant and Founder of Bombay

William Dalrymple introduces the first key figure, Gerald Anger, an Irish merchant whose entrepreneurial spirit was pivotal in the establishment of Bombay (now Mumbai). Anger's early engagement with the East India Company in the 1660s marked the beginning of Ireland's serious involvement in India.

Professor Olmeyer highlights Anger's multifaceted contributions:

• Economic Foundations: Anger was instrumental in transitioning the East India Company from spice trading to textiles, particularly calico, which became a cornerstone of British wealth (14:10).
• Urban Development: As the second governor of Bombay, Anger laid the foundations for its legal system and attracted diverse communities, including Parsis and diamond merchants, fostering a cosmopolitan environment (16:32).
• Architectural Legacy: He constructed formidable forts like Worley Fort, designed to defend against both European rivals and local forces (16:19).

A notable moment includes Anger's vibrant lifestyle, described with elegance and extravagance: "At meals he has his trumpets usher in his courses and soft music at the table" (20:45). This portrayal underscores the blend of business acumen and personal flair that defined his legacy.

John Nicholson: The Imperial Psychopath

The discussion shifts to John Nicholson, a figure epitomizing the more brutal aspects of the empire.

Anita Anand describes Nicholson as "the incarnation of violence" (07:27), emphasizing his ruthless response during the 1857 uprising. His actions during the rebellion showcased extreme measures:

• Atrocities: Nicholson led counterattacks with extraordinary violence, leading to what he termed as the "devil's wind" that claimed countless lives (07:52).
• Legacy: Despite his brutal reputation, Nicholson is remembered as an imperial hero in certain circles, with statues commemorating his role, such as one in Dungannon, County Tyrone (09:14).

Professor Olmeyer provides a critical perspective, noting that Nicholson's legacy is controversial. While hailed as a hero in loyalist circles, his actions are comparable to atrocities committed by oppressors in other contexts:

• Psychopathic Leadership: His severe punishments, including mutilation and extreme torture, reveal a deeply ingrained brutality influenced by historical violence in Ireland (23:11).
• Cultural Impact: Nicholson's legacy persists, with his grave in Surat featuring elaborate Indo-Islamic architecture, symbolizing the complex intersections of culture and power in the empire (21:38).

A poignant quote from Nicholson himself illustrates his ruthless ideology: "If I had them in my power today, I would inflict the most excruciating tortures I could think of on them with a perfectly easy conscience" (37:44).

Lord Dufferin: The Viceroy and Diplomat

The final key figure discussed is Lord Dufferin, an Irish diplomat whose role as Viceroy of India epitomized the administrative and cultural dimensions of the empire.

Professor Olmeyer outlines Dufferin's extensive diplomatic career and his tenure as Viceroy, where he oversaw eight Indian provinces and extended British influence into Burma (46:20). His contributions include:

• Infrastructure Development: Dufferin's administration saw the introduction of electricity in Shimla and the establishment of the Vice Regal Lodge.
• Cultural Perspective: He viewed Indian affairs through an Irish lens, drawing parallels between Irish and Indian nationalism. His experiences during the Irish famine influenced his governance approach, fostering a blend of empathy and control (46:20).
• Educational Influence: Institutions like Trinity College in Dublin were pivotal in training Irish professionals who would serve in the empire, reinforcing the interconnectedness of Irish and British imperial ambitions (48:58).

Anita Anand critiques the romanticization of figures like Dufferin, arguing that their contributions cannot overlook the exploitation and atrocities committed during their administration: "There’s a lot of exploitation, looting and pillage, killing and death" (51:44).

Impact and Legacy of the Irish in the Empire

Throughout the episode, Dalrymple and Anand explore the dual roles the Irish played—as both enforcers of imperial power and as individuals seeking upward mobility amidst economic desperation. The Irish involvement in the empire was marked by significant achievements in administration and trade but was equally tainted by participation in brutal colonial practices.

Notable Quotes:

• Anita Anand: "Ireland is basically the blueprint, the roadmap, the laboratory for what the English will then go and do on a far bigger scale" (02:06).
• John Nicholson: "If I had them in my power today, I would inflict the most excruciating tortures I could think of on them with a perfectly easy conscience" (37:44).
• Alexander Fraser (c. 1820): "At least half are Scottish, a couple of Englishmen, the rest Irish." (49:39).

These quotes encapsulate the complex interplay between cultural identity, economic ambition, and the often violent enforcement of imperial dominance.

Conclusion

Episode 235 of Empire provides a comprehensive exploration of the Irish influence on the British Empire through the lives of Gerald Anger, John Nicholson, and Lord Dufferin. Through engaging dialogue and expert analysis from Professor Jane Olmeyer, the podcast sheds light on the multifaceted roles the Irish played—from pioneering merchants and ruthless military leaders to influential administrators. The episode underscores the enduring legacy of the Irish in shaping imperial history, while also critiquing the romanticized narratives that often obscure the darker aspects of colonialism.

Timestamps of Notable Sections and Quotes

• Introduction of Irish Role: 02:06
• Gerald Anger's Lifestyle: 20:45
• John Nicholson's Atrocities: 07:27, 37:44
• Lord Dufferin's Diplomacy: 46:20
• Critique of Romanticization: 51:44
• Alexander Fraser's Observation: 49:39

This detailed summary encapsulates the key discussions and insights from Episode 235 of Empire, offering a comprehensive understanding for those who haven't listened to the episode.