← Estate of Mind — The Art of Selling Luxury Real Estate
Estate of Mind — The Art of Selling Luxury Real Estate
Demonstrating Value vs. Expressing Value
00:45:00
In this episode of Estate of Mind hosts Tami Simms and Jack Miller are joined by special guest Mike Everett from the Real Estate Negotiation Institute as we delve into the essential strategies for effectively demonstrating value to luxury real estate clients amidst industry changes. We explore the importance of understanding client needs and preferences, translating perceived value into actionable strategies, and tailoring presentations to resonate with individual clients. This includes the use of visual tools, such as high-quality media and virtual tours, to enhance property showcases and provide tangible examples of success through past client experiences. Learn how to build trust through transparency and personal branding, while highlighting the role of testimonials and case studies in illustrating the value offered. Gain insights and practical tips for positioning themselves as trusted advisors in the competitive luxury real estate market.
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Transcript48 lines
- [00:00]
Tammy Sims
Foreign.
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Jack Miller
Welcome to A State of Mind, a podcast series all about motivating, inspiring and educating you in the art of selling luxury real estate. The podcast is brought to you by the Institute for Luxury Home Marketing. Tammy I'm Tammy Sims, lead trainer for the Institute and a full time real estate professional in St. Petersburg, Florida for more than two decades. In this episode we're going to explore strategies for demonstrating your value amidst the recent industry changes with an accomplished expert negotiator. Today's podcast is sponsored in part by Real Marketing, the only marketing firm recommended exclusively by the Institute. Real marketing utilizes over 25 years of expertise and their products are built and customized for you to dominate any neighborhood anywhere. Go to realmarketing4you.com that's real marketing. The number4you.com. Also look for past State of Mind episodes with CEO David Collins as our guest. I'm here today with my co host, Jack Miller, a 25 plus year veteran luxury agent with Onward Real Estate in the Greater Nashville Tennis. And today we have a special guest joining us, Mike Everett, Master certified negotiation expert and senior Vice President and certified National Instructor at the Real Estate Negotiation Institute. Mike holds a Texas real estate license and actively consults with both commercial and residential clients from his current home in Shalimar, Florida. Hello to both of you and welcome. Mike.
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Mike Everett
Hey, Sammy. Hey Mike. How are you?
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Tammy Sims
Jack? Doing well and you?
- [01:57]
Mike Everett
Good. Good to see you.
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Jack Miller
Excellent, Excellent. We are excited about this particular podcast. Not that we're not excited about all of them, but given what the the state of the market is right now, the real estate industry. For those of you that aren't aware of the recent changes within the real estate industry, there's a renewed focus on demonstrating value for our services, particularly in buyer representation. Everywhere I turn, agents are scrambling to update their presentation materials and build lists of just how many things they do for their clients. And so in our conversation prior to today, Mike, you brought up a point that I'd like to highlight right up front, that expressing value and demonstrating value are totally different things. And I would love for you to start us off by speaking to that.
- [02:52]
Tammy Sims
Well, that's great, Tammy, thank you. It's really critical that agents understand that difference between expressing value and demonstrating their value. Over the years as agents, we've gotten into some habits because we so often have to present to clients and we will either tend to be agent centric, where we talk about all of the things that we do, maybe we will be preferred vendor centric, if that's a good way to put it about all the accomplishments that we have as agents, you know, we'll talk a lot about our brokerages or our teams and the support groups that we have or maybe the connections that we have. And when we do that, we are clearly expressing the value to the client of all the things that we do. But the one point that we miss is what's important to the client. And, and it's just really critical that we be able to connect what we do specifically to the client's needs, because it's the client's assessment of value that's going to drive their decision on whether or not to hire you as an agent. And so the key to demonstrating your value is, is going to be the subjective aspect of the client. We want to, we want to kind of get into our client's mind about what's important to them and be able to connect that. Because if you don't understand their priorities, then your value presentation really doesn't have any meaning for them. Let me give you a real quick example. I was rereading a book this week that I would recommend to everybody and it's called Selling Real Estate, Third Level Secrets of Top of Top Performers. And it's by an author by the name of Robert A. Potter. And in his book he talks about, about airbag presentations. And the example that he gives is this, is that if you were looking to buy a car and the salesman said, well, hey, this is a great car. In fact, it's got airbags. And you would go, so does every other car. They've all got airbags. Right? And so the question is, are you presenting value components in your presentation that your competitors are also presenting? In other words, is it an airbag presentation that everybody's got, or are you focusing in on your clients needs so that you can differentiate what you do in their eyes and thereby demonstrate your value rather than just expressing it? Because when we look at value, we tend to think that everybody else sees it the same way that we do. And that's not true. We need to see value the way that our clients do and present directly to that.
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Jack Miller
That makes perfect sense to me. Jack, what do you think about that concept?
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Mike Everett
No, I think it's terrific. It's interesting because when we first talked about this topic, Mike, one of the things I think about is marketing listings. It kind of follows that same same thought process. I think a lot of agents, when they get a new listing, particularly those who aren't as experienced, have a template of the way they're going to market that property and jump out there and Start, quote, marketing with their template. And really what they should be doing is starting by thinking, who is the audience and how do we speak to that audience? And so that's really what you're saying here, too, is when we're sitting down with a buyer, this is not a template. We sit down and say, as you said earlier, look at how many years I've experience I have and how many awards I've won and how many people are on my team. And those things really aren't what matters. Not really. Not to the buyer. The buyer has things that matter to them. And so we've got to start with understanding what the buyer's needs are and let them talk to us and listen to them, and then from there, we can truly present what it is that we have to offer that will speak to their needs. So, yeah, I think that's right on target.
- [06:30]
Tammy Sims
Yeah, exactly.
- [06:31]
Jack Miller
And you know what's interesting? I told you that we'd go off topic. Along the way here, I got a piece of communication, an email from a prospective buyer who wants to see one of my condo listings. And he also inquired about other units in the building, and he said, I'd be interested to know if you can show me those. And I want a really aggressive buyer pitch from you. And I thought that was a little odd, and I was going to take my time responding. Then I got contact by another listing agent with a condo in the same building, and she was asking about my unit for the same day. And I said, by any chance, is this the buyer? I think he might have reached out to me directly. All of a sudden, all of the listing agents in that building are talking to one another because it just seemed fishy. And for that particular buyer, he's shopping money, right? He's shopping for the cheapest realtor. And what's going to be interesting is that he's going to find that none of them are going to respond to that. But when you talk about what. What is the motivation for the buyer in the luxury space, I think that we have the luxury, if you will, of really being able to dig down deeper and understand what that value is for them, as opposed to just dollars and cents like we might find in other parts of the. Of the market. But I thought that was an interesting spin on. On the situation. But let's. Let's talk about tying this into the bigger conversation more than just defending our professional fee. You know, in the Institute's training, we talk a lot about a fundamental shift in vocabulary. For example, instead of focusing on negotia we suggest focusing on gaining agreement. And so that also leads us back to understanding what's important to the clients because it may not be what we think. And so, Jack, I'm curious, how do you approach truly finding out what's important to your clients and how to achieve those best outcomes?
- [08:52]
Mike Everett
Well, I think we're in a position when you work with a luxury market, you've got an advantage over perhaps some of our colleagues who might specialize, for example, in working with first time home buyers. And that most of our clients, the vast majority of them, have a lot of experience buying and selling real estate. And so if they've had a vast majority or a large degree of experience rather in buying and selling real estate, that means they've had a lot of experiences.
- [09:21]
Tammy Sims
Good.
- [09:21]
Mike Everett
A lot of experience is not so good. So that's usually where we start. I'll ask my clients to share with me what some of their best experiences were working with brokers. Whoever they worked with in the past, what markets, what did they appreciate about working with that particular brokerage and that agent and let them share their experiences. And then oftentimes without even asking, they'll start volunteering some of their less than desirable experiences and what they didn't like about working with certain agents. And it gives me at that juncture, sort of a, a task list, if you will, of how to deal with that particular buyer. And you know, for me personally, one of the things I always look for is how does this buy or how does this sell or like to communicate? Because for me personally, I really love, obviously face to face communication. I love phone conversations and I think text messaging is very effective as well for me and my business. However, I found that some of my clients don't like text messages at all. A lot of my older clients don't like text messages. Some don't even like emails. They want that phone call for all, you know, communication. So it's really important to hear what they like, what they don't like, and then in more detail what some of the experiences they've had that went well and some that didn't. And so it really helps me understand where to start once again and expressing the value I bring to the table for that particular buyer.
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Jack Miller
And, and. Go ahead, Mike.
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Tammy Sims
Yeah, well, I was just going to say that, that in, in one of the communication models that I've seen, what you're talking about, Jack, is you, you give them an opportunity to get emotionally connected to you when they share what they like and what they don't like. And you have that opportunity to agree with that. You have an opportunity to reinforce for them the things that you will do that they will like, and also the things that you won't do that they wouldn't like. And then your performance that you give in the relationship actually reinforces that throughout that entire period and builds a lot of trust with your client that way. And they get that emotional connection, which is really important to that.
- [11:25]
Mike Everett
Well, and the other part of that, too, Mike, I think, is that there's a stereotype about real estate agents, and we see it reinforced constantly in the media, usually in comedy shows, on television, and in movies. Whenever there's a character who's a real estate agent, you know, typically they're portrayed as people who don't listen, they talk a lot, and typically they're not really smart. You know, honestly, you think about Modern Family, I love that sitcom. But, you know, the lead character or one of. One of the lead characters is a real estate agent, and that's exactly how it's portrayed. He talks a lot, he rambles. He doesn't make sense. He's not very smart, and he certainly doesn't listen very well, and he's hysterical as a stereotype. But I think a lot of the public has unfortunately had that. That stereotype reinforced in some of their experiences working with brokers. So if nothing else, by taking this approach, one of the first things that we communicate when we're talking with that buyer or seller in the luxury space is they understand that not only do we understand the lux market, but that this is an agent who listens. This is an agent who heard what they had to say, and they can express to them what we can do to connect better with that particular potential client. So I think that's really important.
- [12:42]
Jack Miller
And it's interesting, too, because we're talking about. We're talking about kind of groundwork here in the. In the beginning. Right. Because there's the how, how, what kind of communication, effective connections, determining those. Those. Those desired outcomes. And then we get to the what's the value in a property? And how do we find you that right. 1. And it just reminds me that we are. We are seeking agreement at every step of the way throughout the transaction. But, Mike, you mentioned in our early conversation the value of truly demonstrating your value in terms of effective client communications and outcomes. And so we've talked about communication, but then carrying that through the transaction and looking for outcomes. I'm curious if you'd talk a little bit more about that.
- [13:40]
Tammy Sims
Yeah. So we find that one of the concepts that we teach is because we teach collaborative negotiations or what you would call win win negotiations. And the reason that we do that is because we also define three types of negotiators. We look at competitive negotiators who are very aggressive and the buyer that you were just talking about in the condo community, very aggressive, very competitive buyer. We talk about compliant negotiators which will pretty much agree to anything. And then we talk about collaborative negotiators that are looking to understand the interests on both sides of the table and trying to find ways that they can maximize value for their client but still adequately satisfy the needs on the other side so that you come together with a really good win win agreement. And so in that we want to learn how to ethically influence and persuade the decision criteria, the actual decisions that are being made, and how do we persuade the other side to agree with what we're asking them to do. And I want to emphasize ethical because a lot of times people will say, well, you know, aren't you just being manipulative? And if your objective is an outcome that is win win that is best for both sides, that's certainly a goal that's worth pursuing and encouraging and influencing decisions towards. That great objective is certainly ethical and not manipulative in that case. And then from persuasion, we want to be able, when we talk with others. And Jack, a little bit to your point, you know, when you have clients that only want to be be communicated with via text or by phone or by email or not those kind of things, we recogn ability to communicate is best, as you said, when we're face to face. But if we go to the phone, all of a sudden now we only have our voice and our words. If we then go to text or to email, now it's just our words. And so the question is, how do we, how do we construct our communications in such a way to make them effective? And so we use that through principles of persuasion. So for example, if I'm talking to a client about some, some of the issues that we're dealing with in the trans and the decisions that need to be made, if I can show them which of those is going to be in their self interest, which would be a persuasion principle, how it's in their self interest, People will typically do what they believe to be in their self interest. And so if you can structure your communication to highlight that self interest, they're going to be much more likely to agree with what you're asking them to do. And that applies whether you're Dealing with the agent on the other side, with your client or any of the third parties. You know, I know that this is particularly true in the luxury market where we have to deal sometimes with financial advisors or with lawyers. We have other family members that get involved. And so we're negotiating with all of those people. And so when we come down to communication, if we'll take the time to think before we write something, before we speak something. Okay. Or before we go into a meeting about how do we want to be persuasive in our communications, it makes us more effective in everything that we do, everything that we say, and helps us get the results that we're looking for. And so we spent a lot of time talking about scientifically proven persuasion principles, who the academic authors are that have described a lot of that. But then how do we apply that specifically to the real estate transaction? And again, you know, Jack, I think, I think to your point, the image that people typically have of the real estate agent is not, not necessarily positive. And so our ability to, to work well with people, to communicate effectively with people, to be persuasive with them and to focus on what's important to them becomes a huge differentiator for us. And if you're not able to differentiate, then you become, let's see if I can remember the word. I think you could become commoditized just like everybody else. And that allows other agents to come in and buy the business, to be able to discount and get the business, because you haven't differentiated yourself, you haven't differentiated your value. And especially in the context of what's important to the client.
- [18:04]
Jack Miller
You know, that makes me think of the fact that we've been having to redefine our value proposition since the beginning of time. I've mentioned before, I often talk about my mom, who I work with, and she had her first website in 1986. And it's when there was a static, static single page with a photograph of her on her block phone. Her car phone, right. And I remember there was a time when the Internet came and of course it was going to be the end of our industry because people were going to be able to have access to the information. And then it became when you were trying to get a listing or working with buyers trying to get a buyer's business, it was a who has the best website, right. And then of course, we all had the same websites, right. And so cyclically in this industry, we have cutting edge differentiators and then we all end up with the same tools and we have to figure out what the next level of differentiation is. And I think in that luxury space, like you mentioned, Jack, it's totally different than first time buyers or what we refer to as bread and butter. And so I think right now where we all need to be is figuring out that additional differentiator. And that may be in our presentation. But I think, Mike, you've really hit it on the head in terms of demonstrating versus expressing. And so how do we go a little further in terms of demonstrating versus just expressing?
- [19:57]
Tammy Sims
Is that directed to me?
- [19:58]
Jack Miller
Yes, it is.
- [19:59]
Tammy Sims
Okay, great. Well, here's the thing. I think that is important in that when we talk to clients, we will tend to explain to them a service that we provide, something in our offering, our service offering. And what we don't do is tell them why that's important for them. And so what we want to be able to do is identify exactly what that benefit is. And the way that we do that, verbally at least the way that we do that, it would be to say what this means to you is. And there's other ways to say it. But that's, that's the easiest one, I think, to, you know, to understand, use benefit statements like that to focus on the client needs to take that service and to focus that on the client needs. So what this means to you, it may save you time, may save you money, it may address that particular feature of a home that you're looking for, those kinds of things. And so benefit statements are really important. We also talked about value statements. And a value statement is something that you can throw in that would tell the client what you do and how you do it and the benefits, it tends to be built into that. So I might say to a client, I use my negotiation skills to help ensure that you get the maximum value on every real estate transaction that you do. And so the how is my negotiation skills and the what is the maximum value and benefit can be implied in a value statement like that. Or I can say I have trained, I've invested the time and resources to gain training in the most valuable skill that consumers look for in a real estate agent. And that's negotiation. And what this means to you is I'm able to bring a structured and a disciplined approach to negotiating with your money and ensure that you get the best value in whatever transaction we're looking to accomplish. Be similar to that.
- [21:53]
Jack Miller
Yeah, it's about the what's in it for them. Yeah, that makes, that makes, it makes perfect sense. Jack, what do you think about that?
- [21:59]
Mike Everett
Well, it's interesting because all the conversation we've had so far in this podcast is kind of the way that we speak with buyers, for example, or sellers in our first meeting where we're talking about all the services that we provide. And as you said, Mike, what those services and what those tools mean to them, how do you translate that into what does it do for me, Mr. Buyer? You know, what does it do for me, Mr. Seller? And so that's the important thing. They have to understand what. What. All these tools are wonderful. All the bells and whistles are wonderful. And there's actually are some potential clients who get all excited about bells and whistles, and there's a fit for certain agents that's the right, you know, buyer or seller for that agent. But the vast majority, I think, of prospective clients that we work with really could care less about the bells and the whistles, the tools, and the programs. They really don't care about all those specifics. And I think, unfortunately, a lot of agents do get wrapped up in that. What they really care about is do you care about them? It's more about the fundamentals. As we started this podcast, that's what they. That's what people, I think, really care about at the end is, as we said before, do we hear them now, we responding to them, and how does this, how do we make these tools and how do we make these various platforms that we use work for them and help them achieve their goal? And all throughout this conversation, we haven't yet mentioned once how we get paid or how we expect to get paid. And yet that's something we have to talk about in these meetings when we're expressing our value proposition and we're, you know, talking with a potential client. But just like we're doing today, that should be on the back end of that conversation. At the front end of the conversation, it's really about what do we bring to the table and how is this going to be a good fit for that particular client. And if you've done a good job in getting through these topics and helping them understand how we connect to them and how we meet their needs, then when we get to the part where we talk about how we're compensated, it's a natural flow of the conversation, and it's not that abrupt. Oh, my gosh, I'm paying what, you know, they expect that they expect for us to be compensated, and they know then what our value truly is, and they're wanting a broker that can bring that value to the table for them. And so, you know, so far, again, after the, you know, after this August 17th, drop dead date that we had earlier this year, we haven't received any pushback from our clients. You know, quite frankly, they see it as. They're seeing it as a little bump in the road. We all been all excited about it and writing articles and blogging and everybody's doing podcasts. Podcasts, Right. And the public is like, okay, you know, it's like, you know, I want a really good, bright. Particularly, again, we're talking about the luxury home market. These are the buyers and sellers that can use anybody they want, and they have high expectations. You know, we've got to meet those expectations. And they're prepared to pay for it. Truly they are. It's. But we have to be better skilled, and that's why we're doing this podcast. Better skilled at bringing to the table what is it that we do for you, and how and why are we getting paid. And that's what we're here about.
- [25:05]
Tammy Sims
And if, if I can, Tammy, just real quick, because to your point, Jack, I love the word compensation versus commission, because compensation implies that I'm getting paid for a value that I bring to the table. I'm getting compensated for what I. Right. And. And so many times the consumer, and even at the luxury level, their impression is, is we're going to get paid no matter what. And so therefore, we're all the same. And so that ability, again, to differentiate yourself based on value related to the customer's needs is what will create an opportunity for us to maintain and even increase the compensation that we receive for the services that we provide. But if they don't know about it, all they're going to be concerned about is price. It gets back to that commodity perspective.
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Jack Miller
Yeah. I had conversations recently with buyer clients, and I think Jack and I are both. Both very similar in that the lion's share of our business comes from repeat clients or referrals from clients or other vendors. And this was the case recently, helping someone as a buyer here in our market and explaining about the compensation and about the services and whatnot. And they're going to be selling their property in Massachusetts, and they have been there for 26 years. They are completely clueless about how that works. And they built such a trust in us that they were asking us to help them understand what they should expect to be hearing from their listing agent right. In another state. And so that, to me, is truly the conversation where they understand the value that we're bringing. And we even talked about the analogy of, you can buy bed linens at Kmart and you can buy bed linens at Nordstrom or Saks, and you can pay totally different prices and you're going to get a different level of quality, a different product for the price. And that kind of analogy absolutely resonates with a consumer who wants that higher level of service that Jack described. Right. They have a higher level of expectation and they're willing to pay for it.
- [27:26]
Mike Everett
That, and I would add another word to tam, we've talked about this before too. And they also expect a different level of experience. And I'm not talking about necessarily our experience. That's true. They want our experience we bring to the table, but they want a different experience as a luxury buyer or luxury seller. And that's what they're willing to pay for.
- [27:47]
Jack Miller
Absolutely. I was showing property, showing neighborhoods mostly just a few days ago, and one of the clients is the general manager for a, a very high end resort hotel. And so I have been in her house, if you will, the, the hotel. And so I made sure that the, the experience for their touring was set up. I said when they got in the car and they brought their dog without asking. Right. I thought that was interesting. Right. Anyway, it's a, it's a very nice dog and it doesn't shed and it was very well behaved, so that all worked out. But I said, there's a cooler here that has beverages, there's sweet, there's, you know. Water. Water, right, exactly. And, and, and, and I said there's snacks in here that, you know, I've got savory, I've got sweet, whatever. And, and, and she said, she's the general manager. And, and she said, oh, you didn't have to go to that trouble. And I said that's just, just, that's just how I wanted to present it. And so after a little while, she was snacking like crazy in the backseat and at the end of it, and she was having a little anxiety about different neighborhoods and things that she was reacting to on the tour. And I saw her just yesterday for something else. And she was telling someone else in our company, in our mutual company, how those snacks absolutely saved her when she got a little bit antsy and she's like, can you imagine that she had all those snacks in the back of the car. Right. And that has nothing to do with compensation or with helping them find the right place, but it goes back to the, the experience and it's taking it just a little bit, a little bit further. And Jack, you're absolutely right.
- [29:39]
Mike Everett
There's something interesting about that, Tammy, also, you brought up the dog. The fact that she brought a dog may be part of the expectation, if you will, of that particular client. We had a client. This has been probably, gosh, I think over 20 years ago and now we've worked with, I think four different times over the last 20 years on buy and sell both. And the very first time that we met them, they brought two standard poodles to the, to the homes that we were showing them and which we weren't expecting, but again, extremely well behaved dogs. They didn't have kids. They never, they never did have kids. But their dogs were an extremely important part of their lives, but also, as I learned, extremely part of their decision making. So we had to readjust the way that we present and the way that we interact with the client. Because what we learned very quickly was, you know, how in the past we've had situations where people bring a family member or some, you, they, sometimes they bring a wealth manager with them, some business associate, somebody that they value their input, opinion and input it before they make this, you know, purchase, for example. Well, in this particular case, the dogs coming with them, the dogs were an important part of the purchase decision because they needed to know, I know this even sounds laughable, but it was really important to them. They needed to know that these two dogs felt comfortable at the property they were considering buying. So the first time out, the dogs would go in the yard and if the dogs didn't react well, the property, they would mark it off the list.
- [31:12]
Jack Miller
Wow.
- [31:13]
Mike Everett
And then for the second showing, if they were narrowing it down to when they're about to purchase, we would call the seller and I would explain to them how important these dogs are, the decision making process. And the dogs would have to go into the property and the same thing, did the dogs feel comfortable in the home? And it seemed crazy, but that was a very important thing. So I learned a lot about them. And again, the fact that we were able to respond to just the sales and make that part of our communication about how do the dogs feel about it, you know, that was, I know it's crazy, but that was important to them, so it had to become important to us.
- [31:44]
Jack Miller
Well, and Mike, you talked about when in the upper tier, when other, other players come into the situation and you're having to reach agreement, essentially negotiate with all these other factors. Now the having to negotiate with the dogs, that's a, that's an extreme. But, but you had to manage that process, Jack, and you had to engage in negotiation with the sellers of those homes to agree to let the dogs in. And so, Mike, I would love your feedback on that kind of level that we get to.
- [32:25]
Tammy Sims
Well, two things. The first thing I wonder is whether or not you're going to equip your cars with dog bowls.
- [32:31]
Jack Miller
I am. Yes. I made a note. I made a note. Yes.
- [32:36]
Tammy Sims
And it really. Because in that situation, we know that people like to do business or like to be around people who are like them, who like the things that they like, the process of making connections. And so you're able, you're able, Jack, in that situation, not only to make a connection with the homeowner, but also improve that connection with your buyers, because that was an important factor for them. Your ability to communicate to both sides created a connection between those two, whether they chose that home or not. And it was just something that's immediate. And we've all seen the deals that get done because, you know, the homeowner and the home buyer have certain things in common. Maybe it's their background, maybe it's their profession, and, you know, their hobbies, anything like that. But all of that requires communication. So you have to be, you have to be aware of it. You have to make sure that you have to be aware of fair housing, things like that, as you, you know, do those things too. But it's just a beautiful example of being able to communicate on both sides of the transaction in order to achieve your client's goal. I think so. I really like that story.
- [33:42]
Jack Miller
Yep, absolutely. Now, most real estate agents that I interact with always feel as though they could improve their negotiation skills. And a lot of them are kind of intimidated about that. And so I am curious, Mike, if you will, if you will talk a little bit about the certified negotiation expert course, the various curriculum that you have, and how your training can help real estate professionals to hone their skills and build their confidence that they need in order to be successful.
- [34:19]
Tammy Sims
Well, I really appreciate that. Thank you for that opportunity. NAR tells us that it's greater than 90% of all agents who come into real estate. They don't have any kind of professional training either. Negotiation, sales, management, those kind of things. And so as a result, when they come in, they go through pre licensing, then they get into their brokerage, and the brokerage is going to teach them little thing, you know, the standard things. How do you do CMAs? You put together a listing presentation the way that we like to do it, you know, and then they'll get them coached up on, you know, how to generate leads A lot of those kind of things and all that's very well and good. But in the United States there's not a single state that offers any negotiation training and pre licensing. And as you know, real estate's a people business. And your negotiation skills are what helps you relate to and manage your relationships with other people in a very positive and a productive way. We take the, the same negotiation concepts that are taught at major universities. Maybe it's Harvard or Wharton or Stanford or Oxford or a lot of different places. And one of the things that I meant to mention earlier was that the collaborative style of negotiation is the style that is taught by all major schools because collaborative negotiators are the ones that are able to effectively negotiate with competitive, compliant as well as also, you know, just with their clients in general. And we want to try to understand what our clients negotiation style is too for that matter. But in any case, we go through basic foundational negotiation skills. We look at tactics that are employed by other negotiators and we want to learn how to identify those, we want to learn how to defend against those. Sometimes we may have to use those ourselves in order to reach our collaborative win win goal, which is maximizing results for our client but still adequately satisfying the other side. We will teach them principles of influence and persuasion like we talked about earlier, so that they're able to influence the decisions that are being made and be able to persuade others to agree with what they're asking them to do. Which there are psychological components to that. There are a lot of, well, not only just psychological components, just, just, just strategies that go along with that. But what we want to do is we want to get, we want to create positive emotions in the transaction, we want to create positive agreement in the transaction. And then we want to find ways to explore options on both sides to try to maximize the value as much as we can. And then ultimately what we will go through is how do you, number one, create a, A comp. An unbeatable competitive advantage for you in your client relationships and in your lead conversion through your negotiation skills. And how to, how not only to bring a structured and disciplined approach to negotiating with your clients money, but how to demonstrate to them that that is what you are doing. And what's interesting about that as far as agent benefit back in 2023, early in 2023, that seems like such a long time ago now. Keller, Keller Williams, they did a survey of their agents and they wanted to know what they thought their training priority should be for the coming year and the number One training priority that came back in the survey was lead generation. And we all sat around and we went, why not lead conversion? Ah, because you can buy leads, you can find leads, you can get people referred to you, but if you can't convert them into a client, it doesn't do you any good. And so we want, we want agents, when they come out of our courses, to be confident that they can handle any situation expected or unexpected, that they know ways to create positive emotions, to explore beneficial options for both parties, how to use and defend against other negotiation tactics, and ultimately to achieve the very best results for our clients in an ethical and a high integrity way. I like to tell people that as a realtor, I want to operate at the highest level of professionalism in my chosen field. And so I will also use the code of ethics as a proof source for my, for my business behavior and my personal values. And I have them beyond just the code of ethics. But it's those kind of things that you bring to the table for your clients that will cause them to look at you and say, you know what, I'm not hearing that from anybody else. And that's why I want to work with them.
- [38:56]
Mike Everett
I want to share a ripple benefit of that. Mike, if I may too, you know, I had a client and Tammy, I think I may have shared this with you at one time in the past. I had a client several years ago that throughout the transaction he was a very high end client. He was extremely demanding in every conversation and everything that we did, everything was a negotiation. I, you know, with most of my clients, I could share with them a reasonable course of action and they would move in that direction based on my experience. But with this particular client, everything was, it almost seemed confrontational. I had to, I had to prove everything. Everything was negotiation. It was, it was the most challenging client I had worked with in years, but also very high end client. But by the end of the transaction, we got it successfully closed. I was so frustrated. I told my business partner, I said, let's just take him out of the database because honestly, I don't know if I had the bandwidth to work with him again when he resurfaces. And then lo and behold, about, about a month and a half later, he contacted me after the closing and he said, I've worked with a lot of real estate agents throughout my career. And he said, you were above and beyond those I had worked with in the past in making things happen and happen and listening, your listening skills and in working with me, you know, to achieve the Goals that we had. I'm thinking to myself, you have no idea. But anyway. But anyway, so I talked. But he referred somebody to me, and it was a terrific. A terrific new client who he had hired to come work here in Nashville. I told Robert, I said, well, begrudgingly, we need to put him back in the day, because he referred somebody to us. And he made this really nice compliment. I said. And I told him how much I appreciate that. Well, the interesting thing is he has referred more of my luxury clients to me than any one single source over the last five years. In fact, we had two closings in the last 60 days. No, two closings in the last 30 days. One for 4 million and another actually closes this coming week for 6 million, who also referred by this same client. And here's the reason. I'll circle back. Because when you've demonstrated your ability to negotiate and you've demonstrated, demonstrated your ability to please somebody who, that, who's that aggressive of a negotiator, that individual has a circle of influence. They know how tough that person is. And if you please that person, you must be good. And so I think a lot of us look to people like that to say, you know, who's your best. You fill in the blank for a contractor. You know, who's your, who's your, who's the best builder, who's the best accountant, whoever it is. Because, because they know that if that person can impress that individual, they must be good. Those people have a line of business following them that if you can, you know, negotiate with them successfully, you're going to win not just their repeat business, but a ripple effect of other businesses in the future. Yeah.
- [41:52]
Tammy Sims
And, and Jack, if I can add to that, if, if, if. Why would a client want an agent to represent them who isn't willing to negotiate their own compensation and doesn't know who? Why do you want somebody for the very, you know, at least one of the very largest transactions you're ever going to do in your life if you can't negotiate for yourself, what makes you think that you can negotiate for me, you know, for me as a client? Absolutely.
- [42:18]
Mike Everett
Yeah.
- [42:18]
Tammy Sims
Yeah. And so it's. You should never, ever, ever shirk or be bashful at all about your ability to negotiate. But again, you got to translate it in terms of the benefit to the client, and that's your ability to communicate with them, your ability to give them great advice, to be. The ability, like you said earlier, to show them a path to the success that they're trying to achieve. Make sure they're emotionally connected and all of that, and that they understand why you're doing what you're doing and why what you're doing is going to be beneficial to them, why it's going to help them achieve their goals.
- [42:55]
Jack Miller
That is a perfect, perfect spot for us to wrap up. We could go on and on. Yes. So soon. But I think that that's a perfect way to really round back out to the point that those negotiation skills are crucial and that, Jack, you absolutely demonstrated your value to that client. And so it's not all about your presentation. It's not all about your new printed packages. It's about truly demonstrating your value. And I want to thank both of you for your time. Jack, you know I always look forward to our time together. And Mike, we are so grateful that you took the time to be with us today.
- [43:43]
Mike Everett
Mike, I want to thank you because you said earlier in the podcast this is your first time to be on a podcast. You were wonderful. Great guest.
- [43:50]
Tammy Sims
Thank you.
- [43:51]
Jack Miller
Absolutely, absolutely. I think you have. You have a new career path, I think, Mike, to go along with your negotiation expertise.
- [43:59]
Tammy Sims
I appreciate that. It's nice working with a great team and I'm really pleased. Thank you. It's a great topic, one that I love anyway, so it was good.
- [44:07]
Jack Miller
Indeed. So for our audience, I want to thank you so much for joining us, us on this episode of A State of Mind, the art of selling luxury real estate. If you're interested in learning more about the institute, you can find out more@luxuryhomemarketing.com if you like what you just heard, please share it with a friend. And don't forget to subscribe, rate and review this podcast. And if you've got a hot topic that you'd like us to discuss in a future podcast, feel free to let us know. Send an email to infoluxuryhomemarketing.com thanks so much for listening.