Can Europe fight fires this big?

Summary

Brussels Playbook Podcast — Episode Summary

Episode Title: Can Europe fight fires this big?
Date: July 28, 2026
Host: Zoya Sheftalovich (POLITICO Chief EU Correspondent)
Guest: Ian Wishart (Senior EU Politics Editor)

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Episode Overview

This episode delves into two major themes shaking Brussels and Europe:

• The mounting pressure on Europe's shared emergency response as wildfires rage across France and Spain.
• An unexpected political shift in the U.S., as some high-profile MAGA supporters begin to back Ukraine—with reflections on ramifications for the EU.

Along the way, lighthearted conversation (“llama drama”) touches on EU-backed biotech and the great euro banknote debate.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Wildfires in Europe: Scope, Response, and EU Solidarity

[00:30–06:49]

• Crisis Context:
  Wildfires have led to the evacuation of over 300,000 people in France and Spain, with significant threats around Bordeaux, Madrid, Toledo, and Castellon.

  • Quote (Zoya): “The vibe in Brussels today is scorched as wildfires rage across France and Spain, putting Europe's shared emergency response under growing pressure.” [00:30]

• EU Mechanisms Mobilized:
  France and Spain have triggered the EU Civil Protection Mechanism and "rescEU," prompting coordinated aid:

  • Helicopters, planes, and over 134 firefighters sent from Portugal to Spain, supported by 41 vehicles.
  • Assistance being coordinated not only from inside the EU but also neighboring non-EU countries.
  • Quote (Ian): “Kind of doesn't make the news very often, but this is actually one of the few tangible ways that the EU can make a difference... they can really show working together helps.” [02:56]

• Challenges and Future Plans:

  • Many EU countries, especially those not traditionally hit by wildfires (e.g., Western Balkans, northern Finland), struggle to prepare for increasingly frequent disasters due to climate change.
  • While an EU-wide firefighting fleet of 12 new planes is in planning for 2028, immediate capacity lags behind need.
  • Quote (Zoya): “In the meantime, the fires are burning now … and that's really a worry, an immediate worry.” [05:11]
  • Even if the EU bought dozens more planes, a single mega-event could still overwhelm capacity.
  • The European Commission is pivoting to focus recommendations on better prevention (managing forests, clearing dry vegetation, improved risk management/forecasting).

• Underlying Debate: The Green Deal

  • The hosts discuss political headwinds facing the EU’s Green Deal as climate crises mount, with recent far-right gains slowing climate-related reforms. [04:30]
  • Notably, the EU still does not own firefighting equipment directly, relying instead on member states for resources.

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2. U.S. MAGA World’s Shifting View on Ukraine

[06:49–12:41]

• Backdrop:
  The funeral of U.S. Senator Lindsey Graham brings Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky to Washington—his first potential Oval Office meeting with former President Trump since a tense exchange 18 months ago.

• Inflection Point:
  Senator Graham, a major Ukraine supporter, met Zelensky shortly before his death. His passing has reignited efforts in the U.S. Senate to push through a stalled Russian sanctions package as a tribute. [08:07]

  • Quote (Zoya): “Since he died ... there is this renewed push to get the sanctions bill over the line … honoring Lindsey Graham and his memory.” [08:07]

• MAGA Influencers Flipping on Ukraine:

  • Citing far-right activist Laura Loomer, Zoya explains a growing trend of high-profile MAGA voices retracting anti-Ukraine stances—often after personal visits or meetings with Zelensky.
  • Quote (Zoya): “As of last week, all of a sudden, there was this flurry of activity, and we found out Laura Loomer had decided ... she was going to go to Ukraine. She met with Zelensky, she did an interview with him, and she said, oh, I've been fooled by Russian propaganda and I've changed my mind.” [09:14]
  • Others mentioned: podcaster Tim Pool; Senator JD Vance.

• The Trump Factor:

  • Observers and Zoya’s reporting suggest that MAGA-world opinion tracks closely with Trump's tone; as Trump has warmed to Zelensky (notably at NATO), followers are shifting accordingly.
    • Quote (Zoya): “This is a matter of, you know, quite classic Trump messaging, where you go, look, this is the team that's going to win, and you surely want to back the winner.” [11:00]
  • According to former Trump Ukraine envoy Kurt Volker (interviewed by Zoya):
    • The shift is “because Trump gave his entourage and his backers essentially a signal that they should back Ukraine now.” [11:28]

• What Ukraine Wants Next:
  Ukraine’s hope: With a tough winter ahead, the country wants Trump’s future support during any post-winter peace talks.

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3. Llama Drama: Biotech, Pesticides & a Side of Podcast Banter

[12:41–14:44]

• Science News with a Twist:
  Belgian biotech company Biotalis is researching the use of unique antibodies (naturally produced by llamas, alpacas, and camels) for developing safer pesticides.

  • Such antibodies, already used in medical research, may allow for “healthy, safe pesticides”—a hot topic in EU regulation debates.
    • Quote (Zoya): “Apparently there's this Belgian company ... looking into the potential use of this particular antibodies ... helping in the fight against diseases like COVID 19 and HIV and cancer. But now it's all about antibodies for pesticides.” [13:01]

• Comic Relief & Chemistry:
  The segment is sprinkled with animal puns (“stick my neck out … like a llama might” [12:53]) and playful skepticism.

  • Notable moment: Zoya jokes that llama fertilizers come from “your butt?”
    • Ian: “No, from the blood, Zoe. Yeah, it doesn't harm the llama, so it's not very llama drama.” [14:03]

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4. Banknote Banter: Birds vs Famous People

[15:09–16:23]

• Listeners weigh in on whether euro notes should feature birds or prominent Europeans.
  • Zoya and Ian, both “team bird,” share passionate (and sometimes tongue-in-cheek) listener feedback, with arguments about neutrality and regional representation.
    • Quote (Joey from Belgium): “The people on the banknotes feel very Western European centric, whereas birds ... feel much more neutral.” [15:42]
    • Quote (Gustav from Sweden): “If the Euro notes had cool birds ... I might be inclined to support Sweden adopting the euro.” [15:54]
  • Brief jokes about putting Winston Churchill—or even llamas—on banknotes.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On European Solidarity:
  Ian Wishart (02:56): “This is actually one of the few tangible ways that the EU can make a difference in countries joining together and helping each other, which is kind of what the EU is there for in the start.”

• On Political Climate:
  Zoya Sheftalovich (04:30): “The Green deal was all well and good, but then the far right went into power around the EU and things turned and so did the Green Deal policy.”

• On MAGA’s Ukraine Pivot:
  Zoya Sheftalovich (09:14): “Laura Loomer ... met with Zelensky, she did an interview with him, and she said, ‘Oh, I've been fooled by Russian propaganda and I've changed my mind.’”

• Podcast Humor (Llama Drama):
  Ian Wishart (13:01): “I don't want to stick my neck out, Zoya, much like a llama might, but I can't see that this will become completely widespread.”

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Key Timestamps

• 00:30 – Wildfire crisis in France & Spain; scope, response, and EU coordination
• 02:33 – Introduction to EU Civil Protection Mechanism and “rescEU”
• 04:30 – Discussion: climate change, preparedness, and the Green Deal's political challenges
• 06:49 – Pivot to U.S. politics: Zelensky’s DC trip, MAGA world’s stance
• 09:14 – MAGA influencers’ rapid reversal on Ukraine and the Trump effect
• 11:28 – Kurt Volker on Trump and MAGA world’s Ukraine policy shift
• 12:41 – ‘Llama drama’: EU innovation in pesticides (with antibody tech)
• 15:09 – Listener feedback on euro banknote designs (birds vs people)

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Tone & Language

The episode maintains a conversational, lightly irreverent tone, with clear, reporting-driven explanations and bursts of humor (especially during the “llama drama” and banknote debates). The hosts balance news reporting with insightful context and playful banter, creating a breezy yet informative listening experience.

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Conclusion

This episode delivers a brisk yet comprehensive scan of urgent EU issues—solidarity under fire (literally and figuratively) and major developments in Brussels, Washington, and beyond—before signing off with animal-themed science and a bit of euro currency whimsy. The Playbook’s hallmark mix of clarity, context, and wit makes for essential listening for those tracking European (and transatlantic) affairs.

Transcript

[Podcast Sponsor/Announcer]

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[Zoya Shaktalovich]

Good morning. It's Tuesday, July 28, and this is the Brussels Playbook podcast. The vibe in Brussels today is scorched as wildfires rage across France and Spain, putting Europe's shared emergency response under growing pressure. Also on the pod are Trump's MAGA supporters turning toward Ukraine. And we've covered monkeys, we've covered peacocks. It's time for some llama drama. I'm Zoya Shaktalovich and with me today is Ian Wishart, our senior EU politics editor.

[Ian Wishart]

Hey, Ian, did you say llama drama?

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

I said llama drama, baby.

[Ian Wishart]

And when you say we've covered monkeys and peacocks, I mean extensively, so.

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

Oh, I think we've been extra extensive on the monkeys and the peacocks. We've heard they're not. Do you know how to make a llama sound?

[Ian Wishart]

No, but I think we're going to find out later in the podcast, aren't we?

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

Stay tuned, folks. Story one, Ian, you've seen the wildfires that have been raging across France and Spain over the past few weeks. There have been more than 300,000 people who've been evacuated, and it's not over. Things are getting pretty dicey around Bordeaux in France. In Spain, there are fires around Madrid, Toledo, Castellon. There are national emergencies being declared. And the EU's forecast actually shows that the extreme failure danger is going to continue. And France and Spain, but also in the western Balkans and northern Finland of all places.

[Ian Wishart]

Pictures look terrible, don't they? Must be terrifying for the people who live there or who are on holiday there. Part of the raison d' etre of this podcast, of course, is to talk about the EU and the political angle of it. And our colleague Gerardo Fortuna has been looking into sort of what the EU can do centrally in. In ways to help the authorities in France and Spain and elsewhere.

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

Yeah, that's right. So the EU has some levers at its disposal that it can pull to help countries when they're suffering under a natural disaster like this. So both France and Spain have now asked for that European assistance.

[Ian Wishart]

This is the Civil protection mechanism, isn't it?

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

Yeah, yeah, that's one of the levers that they've got. And they also have rescue, which is R, S, C E Rescue, Rescue you. So they're getting assistance. It's a bunch of planes that are coming in, helicopters as well as all sorts of other resources. So firefighters, I think 134 firefighters have been sent by Portugal and 41 vehicles to Spain.

[Ian Wishart]

Kind of doesn't make the news very often, but this is actually one of the few tangible ways that the EU can make a difference in countries joining together and helping each other, which is kind of what the EU is there for in the start. And this is actually one of the ways that they can really show working together helps.

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

Yeah, that's right. And the idea basically is like, well, if you're in the midst of a crisis, if there's a fire burning or a flood that's coming, you can just go to one central place and say, hey, I need help. Ra than trying to call up everyone and say, do you have extra fire trucks? Do you have firefighters you could send us?

[Ian Wishart]

Yeah, so. So extra firefighters are coming from 14 countries, I think you said that, didn't you, to help in France and Spain, is that right?

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

Yeah, that's right. And there's also actually non EU countries that are sending help as well, and that is also coordinated by Brussels. Of course, the issue is that this is happening again and again. I mean, last year we had wildfires the year before, and I come from a country, Australia, which suffers under fires. In Australia, that is normal. But unfortunately, due to the impact of climate change, it's happening more and more and in places that are not used to these fires. Such as, you know, we talked about the Balkans, we talked about Finland, not exactly hotbeds of wildfires in the past. And so those governments are having to try to deal with the fact that this is the new normal and they need the equipment, they need the resources to be able to deal with it more and more, but they're not necessarily super prepared for that.

[Ian Wishart]

So I'm sure a Green mep, if they were sitting here with us today, would say, well, it's one good thing to praise the, the EU for these rescue missions and working together to fight fires together. But on the other hand, what's happened to the Green deal?

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

Yeah, and the response might be, well, the Green deal was all well and good, but then the far right went into power around the EU and things turned and so did the Green Deal policy. But the commission is trying to do Some stuff there are, as we said, you know, there are mechanisms at play, but one of the things is that the EU itself doesn't actually own any firefighting planes or equipment yet.

[Ian Wishart]

Right. This is actually something that I didn't know about until I started looking at it. But there's this idea to build this permanent European fleet with 12 new planes based in Southern Europe, Portugal, Spain, France, and countries down in the south, south of Europe. But that's not expected to start until about 2028, apparently.

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

Yeah. And I mean, in the meantime, the fires are burning now here and around Europe, and that's really a worry, an immediate worry. And the message from the commission is that more planes isn't actually going to solve the bigger issue.

[Ian Wishart]

And from our reporting, one commission official told us that even if Europe bought, you know, another 24, another 50 planes, it still wouldn't be enough if these huge fires broke out across several countries at once.

[Podcast Sponsor/Announcer]

Yeah.

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

And so Gerardo has some interesting information in terms of what the commission is telling countries. It's been telling countries that look better. Prevention and management of forests and dry vegetation is the thing that needs to be done. So you've got to protect homes, roads, industrial areas. You've got to, like, make sure there isn't long, tall grass around those areas. You need shared forecasting, analysis of how fires will spread. And the commission is actually preparing a new set of recommendations on how to manage wildfire risks together as European countries, rather than individual countries trying to manage it on their own.

[Ian Wishart]

Well, if you are listening to this podcast this morning and you're in an area affected by the fires or you're, you live there or you're on holiday there, let us know on the WhatsApp number. It would be fascinating to hear your awareness account.

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

Yeah, especially because, you know, Bordeaux, key place for people to holiday. Spain, key place for people to holiday. So, folks, you can send us a voice note or leave us a message on our WhatsApp. The number is in the show notes, but you can also just dial it old school with your fingers, your little fingies. It's plus 324-910-50629.

[Ian Wishart]

Right. So you've been doing some reporting about the funeral taking place in Washington for Republican Senator Lindsey Graham and the fact that Ukraine President Zelensky is going to be there. And that's an interesting turn of events, isn't it?

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

It is super interesting. So what I started picking up and I've actually been looking at this for a few days now since last week, and we know that Obviously, Volodymyr Zelensky is not a favorite of the MAGA crowd or previously has not been a favorite of the MAGA crowd. There was that infamous Oval Office meeting around about 18 months ago where Trump and J.D. vance, the vice President, really berated him and said he was ungrateful and he had no cards. And now, 18 months later, Zelensky is coming to the U.S. he's coming to D.C. this will be his first Oval Office meeting with Trump since that.

[Ian Wishart]

Oh, is it the first one since

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

then in the Oval Office? Yeah, they've met elsewhere. But this is assuming it happens in the Oval Office, which we don't 100% know. But if it does, then this will be the first one. But it comes at a very different point. Point in the relationship.

[Ian Wishart]

Sorry, Zoe. For people who haven't been following this particularly closely, Senator Lindsey Graham, also a Republican, one of his last things he did before he died was to meet Zelensky in Ukraine. The thinking is that he was very pro Zielinski, very pro Ukraine, and sort of the politics has sort of flowed from there.

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

Yeah. And Lindsey Graham. So he's the champion behind this Russia sanctions package, which the US has been trying to get across the line. I mean, over a year, this thing has been languishing over various disagreements and because the administration can't get behind it. And Republicans and Democrats disagree since he died earlier this month, quite suddenly, quite unexpectedly, there is this renewed push to get the sanctions bill over the line. Now in the Senate with this feeling of like this would be honoring Lindsey Graham and his memory because he was one of the key Ukraine backers. The whole time, he has been really pushing Trump into the direction of Zelensky and in the direction of Kiev. So this is kind of the backdrop of. Of this visit that Zelensky is paying. But what I started to pick up last week was just like this big shift in conversation that's been happening in MAGA world. And there are some MAGA influencers who previously.

[Ian Wishart]

This woman, Laura Looma, she's a. She's an activist, isn't she?

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

She is. She's far right. She's got this really popular kind of podcast that she does, talks a lot about Ukraine, and up until very recently, hated it.

[Ian Wishart]

She was, you know, Ukraine shouldn't win the war. It's all.

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

It's not that she was saying it shouldn't win the war, but she was saying the US shouldn't support Ukraine. UKRA is full of Nazis and all of that kind of stuff. Really parroting Kremlin Talking points and propaganda. And as of last week, all of a sudden, there was this flurry of activity, and we found out that Laura Loomer had decided that she was going to go to Ukraine. She met with Zelensky, she did an interview with him, and she said, oh, I've been fooled by Russian propaganda and I've changed my mind.

[Ian Wishart]

People think this is sort of symptomatic of sort of a broader trend in the MAGA world, that actually they've kind of realize now that maybe some of this that they believed over the last 18 months, two years, has been Russian propaganda, and perhaps they're now going over to the Ukraine camp. Have they been taking the lead from Trump on that?

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

Yes, I would say absolutely. And this was what my reporting has been picking up on. So it's not just Laura Looma. It's also this guy, Tim Pool, also previously a very fierce critic of Ukraine, now all of a sudden saying that actually Ukraine is fighting an evil dictator and backing Ukraine. Even JD Vance, who famously was so critical and nasty to Zelensky in that Oval Office meeting, actually said in an interview earlier this month that while Ukraine has the advantage and probably can lead to peace talks, and what people are saying is you can trace it back to the warming that Trump has had with Zelensky. So the fact that in Ankara at the NATO summit, he said, oh, I like this guy. This guy's doing well. We're going to let them make patriots. And generally warmer messaging around Ukraine that he's been putting out. And, you know, the link that's being made in Kyiv suddenly is Ukraine is doing really well in the war. It looks like a winner. Trump likes to back a winner. And so he's backing Zelensky.

[Ian Wishart]

I was going to ask you exactly that. I really would want to know what has actually caused that shift, what really has started that shift. And it may be as simple as that.

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

I think it's as simple as that. There's probably several elements to it happening at the same time, because you do have various camps trying to convince Trump and the administration, people within that kind of MAGA world, even if they're not in the administration, of the merits of Ukraine's fight. But I really think that this is a matter of, you know, quite classic Trump messaging, where you go, look, this is the team that's going to win, and you surely want to back the

[Ian Wishart]

winner for this article this morning, Zoe, you spoke to Kurt Volker, didn't you, who was Trump's special representative in Ukraine.

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

Yeah, this was during Trump's first term. And it was a super interesting conversation. People can read about it. There's a story out this morning. He's a big Ukraine backer himself. He now works as an advisor to Detect, which is Ukraine's largest energy firm. But he said basically that if you look at this shift in this MAGA narrative, it really was because Trump gave his entourage and his back is essentially a signal that they should back Ukraine now. And so they're picking up on that and running with it. And so here we are at this point where 18 months after that horrible meeting, Zelensky goes into this new meeting hopeful that, okay, the reception will be better. And most importantly, and I think this is the key ask that Ukraine has from Trump and from the administration, they expect that probably Putin has this winter left in him and he will keep hammering Ukraine and it's going to be horrific. But after the winter, the economic strain may see Putin decide that maybe he is ready for some sort of negotiation, some sort of talks. And what Ukraine wants is for Trump to be on Kiev side when that happens. Ian, we've spoken about monkeys, we've done peacocks. Now it's llamas.

[Ian Wishart]

Yes. Tell us about them. Well, what is their EU connection?

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

Did you know that llamas produce a unique type of antibody which you can use to make safer pesticides?

[Ian Wishart]

Well, I don't want to stick my

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

neck out, Zoya, much like a llama might,

[Ian Wishart]

but I can't see that this will become completely widespread.

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

I don't know, maybe it will. So, apparently there's this Belgian company, it's called Biotalis, and they are looking into the potential use of this particular antibodies, which essentially exist in llamas, alpacas, camels. They're very small. They can bind to parts of disease proteins that larger antibodies can't reach. They're already helping in the fight against diseases like COVID 19 and HIV and cancer. But now it's all about antibodies for pesticides.

[Ian Wishart]

For healthy, safe pesticides, presumably, is the idea, because there's obviously a huge debate all the time in the EU about which pesticides should be banned and which ones are safe. There's always a big debate about glyphosate, I remember, and things like that good

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

old glyphosate, which the various EU countries tried to ban, and then the EU ended up renewing its permission to exist in Europe. People are on very different sides.

[Ian Wishart]

Anyway, back to the llamas. Basically, you. You inject a llama with a plant pathogen and then the llama produces antibodies Yep. And then where does the fertilizer come from?

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

Your butt?

[Ian Wishart]

No, from the blood, Zoe. Yeah, it doesn't harm the llama, so

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

it's not very llama drama.

[Ian Wishart]

Yeah, llamas, what are. Where do they come in?

[Podcast Sponsor/Announcer]

Where.

[Ian Wishart]

Where do they live? Llamas.

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

They're South American.

[Ian Wishart]

Yeah, but they're part of the camel family, aren't they?

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

I guess. Or maybe the camel is part of the llama family. I don't know.

[Ian Wishart]

But, you know, my biggest injury was when I fell off a camel.

[Podcast Sponsor/Announcer]

No.

[Ian Wishart]

Yeah. I broke my hip.

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

Get out. Where was this?

[Ian Wishart]

India. It was the most painful thing I've ever experienced.

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

That sounds terrible.

[Ian Wishart]

Yeah, it's a two. Two humped camel. What'd you call camel with three humps?

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

Humpy Humphrey. Oh, you've killed me, Ian. I really didn't see that one coming.

[Ian Wishart]

Do you know what, though, Zoya? I would love to know what a llama sounded like.

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

Oh, I would love to know that too. I would love for Dionis to make.

[Ian Wishart]

I would love us to have alarm or alarm. Sounds, just like the peacock did. Every sound effect that they play always sounds exactly the same.

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

We had a lot of feedback on our conversation from yesterday on the EU banknotes, Ian. People telling us whether they were team bird or team famous people.

[Ian Wishart]

Yeah, and which were you?

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

Bird. And you, Bird? Yeah, we're bird folks in this place. What about you, Dionis? Birds or people People. Saga Bird. Oh, it's a birdie house in here. Well, listen, our listeners were pretty split. I think we got slightly more famous people than birds. But there were some strong feelings. Joanna from Poland said, sorry, Zoya, People person. All birds look the same to me. Wow. Tell that to the bird eater. Joey from Belgium said, birds all the way. The people on the banknotes feel very Western European centric, whereas birds, on the other hand, feel much more neutral. There you go, Ian. Gustav from Sweden said, I am bird gang. If the Euro notes had cool birds on them, I might be inclined to support Sweden adopting the euro.

[Ian Wishart]

And Jonathan from Switzerland suggests putting Winston Churchill on the Euro 20 note and that would undo Brexit. That is a joke, but actually might work.

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

Yeah, because didn't Britain just kick him off their banknotes?

[Ian Wishart]

Yep, the thing put a puffin on instead. All right, folks, what about putting a llama on it?

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

Oh, well, I don't think llamas are European, so.

[Ian Wishart]

Necks are too long, aren't they? Won't fit.

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

All right, that's it from us today. Enough tomfoolery, Ian.

[Ian Wishart]

Sorry.

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

Yeah, that's right.

[Ian Wishart]

Get on with your day.

[Zoya Shaktalovich]

Yeah, folks, have a good one. Speak to you tomorrow.