The Visegrád Four is back from the dead

Summary

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Brussels Playbook Podcast

Episode Summary: The Visegrád Four is Back from the Dead

Date: June 23, 2026
Host: Zoya Sheftalovich
Guest: Ian Wishart, POLITICO's Senior EU Politics Editor

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Overview

This episode dives into the surprising resurgence of the Visegrád Four (V4)—Poland, Czechia, Slovakia, and Hungary—after years of dormancy and political schisms. Zoya and Ian discuss the significance of their revived summit in Budapest, what this could mean for the region and the EU, changes in the UK political landscape with Keir Starmer's resignation and Andy Burnham's rise, and a lighter update about flexible work-from-abroad rules for EU Parliament staff.

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Main Themes & Discussion Points

1. The Visegrád Four Revival

• Context & Historical Role

  • V4 established in 1991 to coordinate Central European integration into NATO and the EU ([01:24 – 01:46]).
  • Collectively, they represent about 64 million people—a considerable bloc within the EU ([01:24]).
  • The group traditionally prepared for EU Council summits as a like-minded coalition ([01:46 – 02:08]).

• Recent Schisms

  • Russia's war on Ukraine split the group due to Viktor Orbán’s pro-Russia stance vs. other members' pro-Ukraine orientation ([02:08]).
  • Poland’s political shift under Donald Tusk aligned it more with the pro-EU stance ([02:31]).

• Current Dynamics

  • New Hungarian PM, Péter Magyar, replaces Orbán and is actively reviving V4 cooperation ([02:47 – 03:10]).
  • “They’re only now coming back together...their biggest common interest is their anti-green agenda.” – Zoya ([03:13])
  • Shared positions include opposition to EU Green Deal policies (especially the Emissions Trading System) and a focus on traditional budget spending—cohesion and agriculture ([03:13 – 04:14]).

• Strategic Timing

  • Reunification occurs amid critical EU budget discussions—V4 is expected to push for higher cohesion/agriculture funding ([03:55 – 04:21]).

• Internal Divisions & Expansion

  • Magyar has suggested expanding the group to include Austria, Romania, Croatia, Slovenia, and even Germany ([05:04 – 05:17]).
  • Ongoing differences persist, especially over Ukraine policy—Tusk and Magyar are aligned, but Slovakia’s Fico remains closer to the Kremlin ([06:19]).

Notable Quotes

• “[The summit is] a first date. Actually, after a long time, they're just feeling each other out.” – Zoya referencing a diplomat ([04:48])
• “It’s really interesting how...these informal blocs get created and fall apart and reconstitute. But actually, those countries have things in common, and it’s interesting that those old alliances never really go away.” – Ian ([05:28])

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2. British Politics: Keir Starmer’s Resignation & the Rise of Andy Burnham

• UK’s Leadership Turmoil
  • On the eve of the 10th anniversary of the Brexit referendum, the UK has seen six PM resignations ([07:07 – 07:23]).
  • Starmer, two years after a landslide, steps down due to lack of continued party and public support ([07:52 – 09:00]).
  • Andy Burnham, former Mayor of Manchester and pro-EU figure, is poised to become PM without a general election ([07:52 – 09:37]).

Key Implications for EU-UK Relations

• The upcoming EU-UK summit, scheduled for July 22, has been postponed amidst the leadership change ([09:00 – 09:12]).

• Burnham is expected to be more pro-EU, potentially pursuing closer alignment with the single market. Nevertheless, Ian cautions, “just because the UK wants it, it doesn’t mean the UK will get it” ([11:14]).

• General Election Speculation

  • Nigel Farage, now leader of Reform and likely opposition leader, demands an election ([09:53 – 10:21]).
  • Burnham may delay elections to consolidate power, or gamble on an early vote for a new mandate ([10:21 – 10:48]).

• UK’s Role in European Geopolitics

  • The emergence of the E3 (France, Germany, UK) as key negotiators with Russia sidelines the EU—a notable shift in geopolitical alignments ([12:06 – 12:33]).

Notable Quotes

• “Ten years ago tomorrow David Cameron resigned as Prime Minister...Six British Prime Ministers have resigned since. In ten years.” – Ian ([07:08 – 07:23])
• “...Even a very pro-EU, very European-aware Prime Minister like Andy Burnham...that still doesn’t mean the EU are ready to give him everything he might want.” – Ian ([11:14])

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3. EU Parliament Staff: Remote Work Expansion

• Policy Update

  • From July 1, EU Parliament staff can work from abroad for up to 10 days annually (up from 5) ([12:33 – 12:46]).
  • Applies to assistants/advisors, not MEPs; still requires managerial approval ([13:11 – 13:16]).
  • Move is in response to staff surveys aiming to improve workplace flexibility ([13:00]).

• Humorous Moments

  • “Two weeks from a beach in Majorca.” – Zoya ([12:48])
  • “I've tried it. It's not very nice.” – Ian, about working from the beach ([12:50]).

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4. Community & Trivia

• Listener Contributions

  • Listeners sent in creative EU social media app ideas ([13:59]).
  • Birthday wishes sent to Bashak from Luxembourg and a tidbit about Luxembourg’s national day ([14:24 – 14:48]).

• Memorable Exchange

  • “We learn so much trivia...European facts that we didn’t even think we needed to know. And I’m still not sure whether we needed to know.” – Ian ([14:48 – 14:58])

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Timestamps of Key Segments

• [01:06 – 06:58]: Visegrád Four summit revival - origins, rocky recent history, evolving alliances, common interests, split over Ukraine, potential expansion.
• [07:07 – 12:33]: UK political situation – Starmer’s resignation, Burnham’s rise, EU-UK summit delay, potential policy shifts, UK’s evolving role in EU geopolitics.
• [12:33 – 13:42]: EU Parliament staff remote work policy update—specifics, intentions, and banter.
• [13:59 – 14:58]: Listener engagement, EU trivia, and Luxembourg national day.

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Tone and Style

The episode is breezy, conversational, and peppered with light-hearted asides typical of Zoya and Ian’s rapport. Dense political topics are broken down with clarity and humor, making EU intricacies accessible and engaging.

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Takeaways

• The Visegrád Four’s revival signals renewed Central European ambitions but faces internal contradictions—especially regarding Russia.
• Andy Burnham’s pending elevation to UK Prime Minister could mark a thaw in UK-EU relations, but EU realities may limit ambitions—especially regarding the single market.
• Staffers at the EU Parliament gain slightly more work-from-abroad flexibility, aligning with broader European workplace trends.
• Community engagement and European trivia keep the podcast personable and rooted in its audience.

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Transcript

[A]

Today's episode is presented by Team Poland. Team Poland is a one stop shop offered by six Polish development institutions to unlock global potential of Polish companies and their international partners.

[B]

Good morning, it's Tuesday, June 23rd, and this is the Brussels Playbook podcast. The vibe in Brussels today is resurrected as the Visegrad 4 comes back from the dead. Also on the pod, Keir Starmer has just resigned as the British Prime Minister. What does that mean for Europe? And we have some good news for those working at the European Parliament who want more time working from abroad. I'm Zoya Shevdolovic and with me today is Ian Wishart, our senior EU politics editor. Hey, Ian.

[C]

Hello, Zoya. How are you?

[B]

Pretty good. Have you been working from abroad? Where have you been?

[C]

I've been in Brussels.

[B]

Well, I haven't seen you.

[C]

I've been here. I've been melting in the sun like an ice cream. Feels like it's abroad. Feels like you're on holiday.

[B]

It does a bit, except the air conditioning.

[C]

Amount of work you've done, it seems like you've been on holiday as well.

[B]

Ah, Ian, always the sunshine comes with you. All right, Ian, let's talk about a super interesting summit that's happening today in Budapest. The leaders of Poland, Czechia, Slovakia and Hungary, they're getting together for the first proper Vishagrad Group summit in more than two years.

[C]

A lot of people in these four countries, isn't there? About 64 million people? So it's quite a huge chunk of the European Union, isn't it?

[B]

Yeah, it absolutely is. Represents a large share of it. And it was created back in like 1991. The idea was to help these Central European countries coordinate the road into NATO and the eu. And it's been kind of going since then.

[C]

Like all these things, when these formats grow up, people begin to say, well, what are they for? Has their purpose expired? But it kind of evolved. And I remember when I first arrived in Brussels and in the early 2010s, it was very much seen as a way to prepare for European councils between four like minded countries sort of got derailed when Orban started throwing his weight around there.

[B]

Yeah, and the big kind of schism happened after the Russian war on Ukraine, because you had Orban in the group who was quite pro Russia, and then the rest who were at that time very anti Russia, very pro Ukraine for the most part, although we have had some dabbles in some of those countries with more pro Kremlin politicians. But generally a split emerged and they just couldn't really agree on anything.

[C]

And the changing government in Poland, when Donald Tusk has come to be Prime Minister, has obviously changed those dynamics as well, because it's made Poland much more pro eu, hasn't it?

[B]

Yeah, absolutely. So after that there was a big shift and then of course, now what's happened is we've got Peter Magyar in

[C]

Hungary as replacing Orban as Prime Minister. Yeah, yeah.

[B]

And he's much more. He's really gung ho about the V4. So actually, various foreign ministers of the V4, they met at the last Foreign Affairs Council in Luxembourg, and then last week when you were and I were in the European Council Summit building, the V4 met on the sidelines of the European Council summit. So they've been kind of tiptoeing around getting back together.

[C]

Any evidence, though, that they've been able to change anything?

[B]

It's very early days at the moment. They're only now coming back together. I mean, they do have common interests and I, I would say the biggest common interest they have is their anti green agenda. They've been not so keen on things like the ets. They want the ETS abandoned at the EU level, and so I think that's the focus, that's where they're going to be using their energy.

[C]

But it's interesting because it's tempting to think when four big countries get together, it's all about geopolitics and, you know, how do we change the way that the EU confronts the rest of the world? But it can also be about those sorts of things, Commission rules and new laws and swaying the commission to do various things in various different policies, which is actually quite, quite an interesting thing, just for the Brussels bubble.

[B]

Yeah. And I think it's no surprise that they're getting back together again right after an EU Council summit, which was largely looking at the budget. Because the other big thing that they have in common is their desire to have more spending on things like agriculture and cohesion, which you like to remind people, that's the spending on, like, roads and bridges and things in the regions

[C]

and the poorer regions, which these countries have historically benefited from quite a lot ever since they came into the EU in the early 2000s.

[B]

So that's a big priority for them because, you know, as our regular listeners will know, there are two big camps that are emerging into this budget fight that we're going into, one which is in favor of changing spending priorities, looking at competitiveness and cutting the budget, and the other camp that's in favor of more spending on the traditional Stuff, which is things like the cohesion, spending. So this is them taking a little.

[C]

A little look around crucial time, actually, to start this argument.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And actually, so Nick Vineker, our colleague on Brussels Playbook, a regular on this podcast, he was saying he's been talking to diplomats, and one of the diplomats described today's meeting as a first date. Actually, after a long time, they're just feeling each other out.

[C]

Oh, dear. It was interesting, actually, what Peter Magiar has said about the V4. And actually, perhaps it isn't the best format. And actually a bigger group of countries would be more appropriate. Yeah, he wants Austria and countries like that.

[B]

Yeah, he wants a few more countries in the mix. Romania, Croatia, Slovenia, maybe even Germany, he was saying would be good. And you can see where he's going. Like, he wants the countries, the real Central European.

[C]

It's really interesting how at various times in wider history, but also in the younger history of the eu, these informal blocks get created and fall apart and reconstitute. But actually, those countries have things in common, and it's interesting that those old alliances never really go away.

[B]

Yeah. And as a result of the war in Ukraine, I was hearing this a lot. Over the past few years, the center of gravity of the EU has shifted because you've got Baltic countries, Nordic countries, they're on the front line, they're close to the border. They're the ones that have been pushing this debate about sanctioning Russia, about supporting Ukraine defense spending. So there is a sense in the EU of a shift in that dynamic. And they're also the countries of growth, like that's where the economic growth is as well. And so that is the argument of some of these Central European countries and Eastern Europe.

[C]

No wonder that they want influence and they try to get more influence.

[B]

Yeah. But I mean, they're going to have some trouble because they're not on the same page on a bunch of things, Ukraine being probably the biggest one. So Magyar and Tusk, they should be kind of on the same page. I mean, Tusk was the first leader that Magyar visited when he won his election, and he's seen as a bit of a protege of Tusk. So I think their relationship is in a reasonably good place. But you've got Robert Fitzo, who was a longtime ally of Orban, loves himself, a bit of backing, talks with the Kremlin now, you know, he's on a completely different page on that. Good.

[C]

Should we move on?

[B]

Yeah. All right, let's do it. Then. Let us talk about the second topic of the day. I've got a question for you.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

June 23, 2016.

[C]

I've lived through all this. I've lived through all this. Tomorrow is 10 years of the day that David Cameron resigned as Prime Minister because he the night before he'd lost the referendum. And six British Prime Ministers have resigned since. Since. In ten years.

[B]

Pretty epic.

[C]

We're about to get the seventh Prime Minister. Normally, we don't like to talk about the UK too much on this podcast, but I think it's quite important today because a lot of this. How would you put it, this chaos in British politics. It's easy to date that back to the Brexit referendum 10 years ago, isn't it?

[B]

Yeah, absolutely. I mean, list truss the lettuce.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

So it's an interesting one. So where are we at in catch us up as our resident Britain ophile

[C]

or just a British person? Is that what you mean? Same thing, yeah. So Starmer, the Prime Minister, two years after winning a huge election victory, resigned, saying he didn't have the support of the country anymore. This other Labour politician, he's been the mayor of Manchester, Andy Burnham, he won a by election to become a member of Parliament and he was always seen as the next contender to be the leader of the Labour Party. Keir Starmer realized yesterday that he didn't have the support of the country or his party and has said he'll go quietly. And it looks like Andy Burnham will just very quietly become, without even an election, in an internal election, the next leader of the Labour Party and therefore the Prime Minister. It doesn't need a general election. He'll serve as the Prime Minister for the next three years unless he calls an election. So it looks like Andy Burnham, who traditionally has been pro eu, anti Brexit, will be the next Prime Minister. That changes the dynamics from Brussels as well, because obviously we were going to have a summit between the EU and the uk that's been postponed.

[B]

That was meant to be held on July 22. They only just confirmed the day. For ages there was this talk of like, when is it going to be scheduled? When is it going to be scheduled? Finally, the EU said, All right, July 22nd and now we've chucked that.

[C]

Yeah, because everything is up for grabs and Burnham might have a different idea of where the UK should go to in its relationship with the eu. Obviously, that is notwithstanding all the ideas within Brussels and the European Commission and the member states of the eu, what they think the relationship should be.

[B]

And it looks like in terms of the timing. I mean, Burnham could be the prime minister from July 17, if there are

[C]

no rivals to stand against him, to be Prime Minister. And at the moment, it looks like there won't be. His most prominent competitor, Wes Streeting, who was the Health Secretary, said he would back Burnham instead of running himself. So it looks like he'll have just a clear way to becoming Prime Minister next month. Yeah.

[B]

Meanwhile, Nigel Farage, who's the leader of

[C]

Reform, somebody everybody knows well here in Brussels, as he was a member of the European Parliament for so long, really led the campaign to get the UK out of the eu. Yeah.

[B]

Well, he's now kind of seen as the presumptive leader of the opposition because of the extent to which the Tories have fallen in terms of their support. And he's calling for a general election, he says, you know, which is probably

[C]

one reason why Andy Burnham won't give it to him.

[B]

I mean, he doesn't have to. Right. He can hold out until three years

[C]

and there's a case for doing that. But he will also think to himself, perhaps he could gamble for a general election while he's. I'm talking about Andy Burnham here, while he's got the momentum of some popularity, while he thinks perhaps that Nigel Farage's Reform Party isn't ready, isn't prepared for an election. He may think, I actually want another five years and go for an election in a very quick way, but I think that's less likely than just hanging on for another three.

[B]

Well, let's assume he is hanging around and this summit with the EU does get rescheduled to some point in the not too distant future. There are some differences between Burnham's approach and the Starmer approach to things. So particularly, as you mentioned earlier, you know, there is some sense that Burnham might be closer to the eu, so that might mean maybe taking Britain further into the single market, for instance. Is that something that you're seeing any signs towards?

[C]

Whether there are signs or not, all of this depends on the eu. It depends on the European Commission and It depends on 27 member states. You know, I am a veteran of covering the Brexit negotiations, and just because the UK wants it, it doesn't mean that the UK will get it. And even a very pro eu, very European, aware Prime Minister like Andy Burnham will probably become. That still doesn't mean the EU are ready to give him everything he might want. And they'll be very strict in saying you can't get access to the single market without giving free movement of European people. In return. And that is a hu huge red line that Burnham would have to cross, which would be very difficult to sell to the British public, I think. One last thing, Zoya, is we've talked a lot about Ukraine and a lot about geopolitics. Even on Friday, when we were at the European Council, we were talking about the E3 and the E3 being Europe's negotiator with Russia. Now, the E3 is France, Germany and the UK. That's a whole new formation. That almost means that the EU is sidelined and the UK is just as important in France and Germany. Those dynamics are at play as well.

[B]

Hey, Ian, third story today. It's a fun one. Good news for our European Parliament staffing listeners. They are going to be allowed from the first of July to work from abroad for 10 days in the year instead of five.

[C]

That's what, two weeks?

[B]

Yeah, two weeks from a beach in Majorca.

[C]

It's quite difficult to work on a beach. I mean, I've tried it. It's not very nice.

[B]

Well, I think that's why it's limited.

[C]

But I guess this is all about creating a better working environment, is it?

[B]

Yeah, that's right. There was a staff survey that was conducted and by the way, they still will require approval from their manager, so it's not a given. But in response to this staff survey, the Parliament decided, right, we're going to match the commission. This is like.

[C]

We're not talking about MEPs though, are we? We're talking about like their assistants and advisors.

[B]

Yep, exactly. And there's loads of them and they wanted to be able to, I guess some of them, they are probably not from around here and they might want to work from there. Parents place, you know. Anyway, our listeners, if you have this policy at your work, let us know. Does it work? Doesn't it work? What do you like about it? Do you wish it was more our number? We. Do we get two weeks, Ian, do we? Yeah, I'm going to be doing it from Australia, actually, pretty soon.

[C]

Oh, nice.

[B]

Yeah. So I'll see you down under. Sadly, it's winter, Folks. Last week we asked you about the launch of this EU alternative to X W as it is Captulino.

[C]

So confusing.

[B]

People were sending in their own social media ideas and we got some really good ones in. We got Supreet from Athens who suggested an all in one shopping app called why? So that every time you go into the shops to buy something, you think, why am I doing this?

[C]

I think, why am I doing this?

[B]

Quite a lot in this podcast studio

[C]

over the last 10 minutes.

[B]

What about birthdays? You know, we've got a special birthday today.

[C]

Really?

[B]

Yeah, we do. It's our listener Bashak's birthday. They're from Luxembourg. And actually it's also Luxembourg's national day today. Would you like to try to pronounce it?

[C]

Yeah. Grouse head Sal Gibbert's tag.

[B]

That was actually delightful. Well done, you. Well, in any case, so 23 June has never actually been a Grand Duke's real birthday, says Bashak. They just moved it to June because the weather is nicer.

[C]

We learn so much trivia, don't we, on this podcast? European facts that we didn't even think we needed to know. And I'm still not sure whether we needed to know.

[B]

Speak for yourself. I like to do well in the trivia.

[C]

Happy national Luxembourg Day.

[B]

That's about it from us. Folks like us. Review us five stars and we'll see you tomorrow. Bye. Foreign.

[A]

A message from Team Poland. As a partner of the Ukraine Recovery Conference 2026 in Gdansk, we thank all strategic thinkers for inspiring economic dialogue. Team Poland brings together six development institutions connecting companies and investors to unlock ideas and capital and drive sustainable growth across Europe. Find us at www.teampoland.eu.