Every Outfit Podcast — Episode 235

On Project Runway, Taylor Swift, Eddington
Hosts: Chelsea Fairless & Lauren Garroni
Date: August 22, 2025

Episode Overview

In this rich, fast-moving episode, Chelsea and Lauren catch up on the cultural landscape post-“And Just Like That,” delivering sharp and hilarious commentary on topics from Bethenny Frankel's viral take-down, to Taylor Swift's new album and relationship, to Project Runway's bitchiness revival, high-end lipstick prices, and the social satire of Ari Aster’s new film Eddington. The hosts dissect online vs. offline discourse, the evolution of pop-feminist movie narratives, and share summer culture highlights with their signature wit and style.

Main Themes & Key Discussion Points

1. The Ongoing “And Just Like That” Discourse

Bethenny Frankel’s TikTok and SJP’s NYT Interview

• Bethenny Frankel Drags the Show
  • Bethenny Frankel, referenced (negatively) in the show, savagely critiques the “And Just Like That” finale on TikTok, calling it "the worst show ever."
  • [02:47] Bethenny: “This is the worst show ever. Like, honestly, this is from Hero to Zero."
  • Hosts note how she memorized her reference and does a “spot on Aiden” impression.
  • Chelsea: “Bethenny Frankel is way more rude than we are. But I get it. They did her dirty.” [03:41]
  • Observations about connections between Bethenny, Andy Cohen, and SJP—all with history in the Hamptons, but also "so much animosity and also never a Hamptons episode." [05:20]
• Relocation of Characters
  • Lauren notes Bethenny's move to South Florida and reflects: “At least half of the and just like that cast would be living in South Florida for tax reasons.” [05:52]
• SJP's NYT Interview
  • SJP seemingly shrugs off fan hate, saying, "I guess I don't really care. And the reason I don't care is because it has been so enormously successful..." [06:50]
  • Chelsea: “I personally think that it is healthy that SJP is naive to or perhaps actively ignoring the discourse… No journalist is going to succeed in baiting her to tell the Hate Watchers to go fuck themselves. Mostly because she would never use the word fuck.” [07:24]
  • Lauren points out that “hate-watching” is left online and feels odd in mainstream journalism. [08:04]

2. The “Materialists” Movie and Online Discourse Breaks Containment

Film Criticism, Class Tensions, and Broke Boy Propaganda

• Film Is Misleading but Worth Watching
  • Audience expected a rom-com, got a darker, more complex film. Chelsea: “I maintain that the film is a worthwhile watch, even a rewatch.” [09:39]
  • The key narrative: “What if Carrie Bradshaw’s choice was between a Steve Smith–Jared hybrid and Mr. Big?” [09:55]
• "Broke Boy Propaganda" & Celine Song Pushback
  • Online accusations that the film valorizes “broke boys”; director Celine Song gives a serious defense in interviews about the ethics of talking about poverty [10:50].
    • Song: “Poverty is not the fault of the poor… I find it very cruel to talk about John as a character who loves Lucy… to talk about him as broke boy, it doesn't make me laugh actually.” [10:50]
  • Hosts discuss the tension:
    • Lauren: “I think the broke boy propaganda conversation… is basically the Miranda-Steve dynamic.” [13:16]
    • Chelsea: “I think we have to make a distinction though between a scrub and a broke boy." [14:47]
• Age and Casting Issues
  • “All of the actors are a little too old to be playing these roles... And whatever is going on with his hair... very distracting.” [15:09]
• Verdict
  • Despite flaws, both find the film valuable and crave more highbrow, complex romantic comedies:
    • "More movies like this, more romantic comedies that are a little bit more highbrow and tasteful." [16:20]

3. Taylor Swift Mania: New Album, Numerology, and the Kelce Brothers

Album Rollout, Relationship, and GQ Styling

• Swift’s “Life of a Showgirl” Rollout
  • Taylor's album emerges mid-tour; working with old collaborators Max Martin & Shellback again signals a return to pop bangers. [19:21]
  • Chelsea: “Thank God. I think the most encouraging detail about this album is the fact that it only has 12 songs. I like a tightly edited Taylor album.” [20:27]
• Pop Culture Collisions on “New Heights” Podcast
  • Taylor announces her album on Travis Kelce’s podcast—“way too heterosexual for me... Jason Kelce is actually hotter than Travis Kelce.” [21:05]
  • Hilarious gap between pop culture worlds—Jason doesn’t know who Elizabeth Taylor is:
    • Lauren: “Why would the defensive linebacker from the Philadelphia Eagles know who Elizabeth Taylor is?” [25:13]
    • Chelsea: “It’s crazy to think that this is how an entire generation will learn about Elizabeth Taylor.” [25:23]
• Marketing & Aesthetic Observations
  • Album artwork, alternative covers (Bug/Shiny Bug editions), and collaborations with Bob Mackie for Vegas showgirl looks dissected [26:47, 27:49].
  • Law Roach stylings of Travis Kelce for GQ:
    • Chelsea: “Putting Travis in a high visibility vest with no shirt is like very Village People. The fur outfit is very Bear Week.” [30:05]
    • Lauren: “Law Roach has evolved putting straight men in embarrassing leather and pushed it forward—putting straight men in embarrassing fur.” [31:41]

4. Project Runway Returns to Bitchiness

Law Roach, New Cast, and Reality TV Savagery

• Format & Hosts’ Reactions
  • Project Runway's new season: “bitchy again” with Karlie Kloss gone, Heidi back, and Law Roach as “the Michael Kors of the show.”
  • Lauren: “Law Roach is extremely mean. Like, he makes people cry and shit.” [34:28]
  • The Estrada twins (identical gay contestants) described as “not good designers” but "great reality TV" as they continually antagonize Law Roach. [34:48]
• Panel Dynamics & Judging Philosophy
  • Dissecting how garments are critiqued differently on TV vs. industry standard:
    • Chelsea: “There’s something about Project Runway where it’s like they have to sort of see the best in certain people, or else they would just hate everything. Probably.” [36:24]
• From Contestant Pool to Judging Curve
  • Noting the effect of social media on casting; “it’s a very particular kind of person that goes on Project Runway now… they have to be good at sewing, which a lot of designers aren't.” [38:43]
• Rumor Round-Up: Law Roach & Ungaro
  • Speculation about Law Roach assembling investors to buy the dormant house of Ungaro and revive it. [40:21]
    • “Of all the fashion houses that have not been revamped, Ungaro makes a lot of sense… In my lifetime I have seen so many designers come to this brand. It is honestly one of the most ran-through luxury brands we have.” [41:40]

5. Vuitton x Pat McGrath Beauty: The $160 Lipstick

Makeup as Luxury Object

• Product Release
  • Louis Vuitton’s new beauty line with Pat McGrath:
  • Lipsticks: $160. Eyeshadow palettes: $250. Refills still high ($62/$92).
    • Lauren: “Have you ever run through a lipstick you needed to refill?” Chelsea: “I actually have… [but] I’m not gonna wear a hyper pigmented red lipstick, though I’m sure it’s the best one in the world.” [44:08]
• Packaging & Exclusivity
  • Emphasis on the packaging and “lipstick trunk” as real luxury driver.
    • Lauren: “If you’re not getting that Louis Vuitton lipstick trunk… why even bother?” [45:44]
• Market Context
  • References to Hermès ($81/lipstick) and Christian Louboutin's more expensive alternatives.
• Brand Loyalty
  • “If it was my favorite brand, I would be like, fuck yes, I'll buy this $160 lipstick. But I just personally wouldn't care enough to go there.” [47:59]

6. Summer Culture Wrap-Up

Queer Music Legends, Library180, Met Costume Institute, and Leisure

• Melissa Etheridge and the Indigo Girls at the County Fair
  • Chelsea describes an “incredible scene” among the butch lesbian audience:
    • “I saw some of the butchest women I’ve ever seen in my life—cargo shorts, crew cuts, the whole thing.” [49:06]
  • Reliving Etheridge’s infamous divorce and dildo-delivery scandal in hilarious detail. [51:11]
• NYC Cultural Highlights
  • Praising Library180, a new reference library with a “back room for all the adult ephemera… modeled after video stores with adult sections.” [54:02]
  • Review of the new Printemps department store, with European vibes and multiple bars—“You don't feel like you're in New York at all.” [55:26]
  • Met Costume Institute exhibition on Black tailoring: “Spectacular, but very upsetting… But then you turn a corner and it's Prince's ruffled blouse or Sylvester's sequin jacket and it's fab.” [55:41]
• Exhibition Curation Gripe
  • Mannequins stacked too high: “At some point, you need to be able to rent binoculars if they're going to keep stacking these looks higher and higher.” [57:43]

7. Eddington: Ari Aster’s Pandemic Satire

Plot, Online Responses, and Critical Reception

• Film Summary and Reactions
  • Lauren: “I loved it.” Chelsea found it “gripping for the first 2/3” but "could be 20–30 minutes shorter." [58:22, 61:27]
  • Plot: Fictional small-town New Mexico, COVID-19 divides, Joaquin Phoenix as conservative cop, Pedro Pascal as liberal mayor, Emma Stone as depressed wife led astray by cult leader Austin Butler.
• Cultural Satire and Critique
  • Lauren praises its “Verhoeven levels of satire about pandemic culture and the fact that we all lost our minds five years ago.” [59:56]
• Online Criticism Debated
  • Fights over whether the movie is “about anything,” whether it “both-sides” issues, whether Aster is a "centrist shill."
    • “He's roasting both liberals and conservatives. And that makes a lot of people uncomfortable because… people would probably prefer a clear cut good vs. evil.” [63:39]
    • Lauren: “I think what the film is trying to say is that ultimately the technology companies that are fomenting this divide ultimately win.” [65:25]
• Insightful Observations
  • On modern film criticism:
    • “People feel like the media I consume, the consumer choices I make, the people behind that have to adhere to my values completely. And I don't think that that is Ari Aster's job.” [67:46]
  • On Ari Aster’s next move and the hope for contemporary films from top-tier auteurs. [67:08]

Notable Quotes & Moments

• Bethenny Frankel’s savage TikTok [02:47]
  “This is the worst show ever. Like, honestly, this is from Hero to Zero.”
• On Project Runway’s new mean era: [34:28]
  “Law Roach is extremely mean. Like, he makes people cry and shit.”
• Taylor Swift as marketing mastermind: [23:43]
  “There’s way more than three [versions]! I think there's five or six at this point. I've lost count.”
• On fashion editorial homoeroticism: [30:05]
  “Putting Travis in a high visibility vest with no shirt is like very Village People. The fur outfit is very Bear Week.”
• Cultural event highlight at Indigo Girls concert: [49:06]
  “I saw some of the butchest women I’ve ever seen in my life—cargo shorts, crew cuts, the whole thing.”
• Ari Aster’s approach to the present: [67:46]
  "I would like to see artists and filmmakers comment about these moments... I don't need Ari Aster to spoon-feed this movie to me."
• On luxury beauty as content: [47:45]
  “Product is just content. Content is just product.”
• On generational education gaps: [25:13]
  “Why would the defensive linebacker from the Philadelphia Eagles know who Elizabeth Taylor is?”

Important Segment Timestamps

• "And Just Like That" & Bethenny Frankel: 02:17–08:56
• SJP’s NYT Interview & Online Hate: 06:21–08:22
• Materialists, Broke Boy Discourse: 08:56–16:42
• Taylor Swift Album + Kelce Brothers: 18:20–32:48
• Project Runway Returns: 33:45–42:14
• Law Roach & Ungaro Rumors: 40:21–42:09
• LV x Pat McGrath Beauty: 43:12–48:17
• Summer Culture Report: 48:17–58:00
• Eddington: Plot & Analysis: 58:00–68:13

Tone & Style

Witty, irreverent, insightful, and deeply informed about fashion and pop culture. Chelsea and Lauren’s banter blends deep knowledge with pop sensibility, never shying from bitchy honesty or nuanced takes.

This summary provides a comprehensive, timestamped guide to episode 235, highlighting the best moments, sharpest debates, and signature Every Outfit observations for listeners and non-listeners alike.