237: On Taylor’s Engagement, Celesbians, SSENSE Drama

Summary

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Every Outfit – Episode 237: On Taylor’s Engagement, Celesbians, SSENSE Drama

Hosts: Chelsea Fairless & Lauren Garroni
Date: September 5, 2025

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Episode Overview

In a characteristically witty and fashion-obsessed installment, Chelsea and Lauren tackle the latest in pop culture, fashion, and queer internet drama. Highlights include Taylor Swift's engagement announcement (and the Gaylor fandom’s reactions), a packed celesbian news cycle (notably Chloe Grace Moretz’s wedding and high-profile lesbian lawsuits), the fate of retail giant SSENSE, major fashion campaign castings, and the ever-accelerating encroachment of AI into the fashion industry.

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Key Discussion Points

Catching Up: Jury Duty, Fashion Fails, Mahogany Screening

• [00:54 – 04:38]
  • Chelsea and Lauren recount travel hassles, fashion disasters (greasy dress stains, baby-induced outfit changes), and their event at the Friend of the Fest festival.
  • Lauren: “Morty lost his mind at bedtime... he then proceeded to all over the outfit that you had selected for me.” - [02:13]
  • Chelsea laments slipping and falling at Figaro Bistro, resulting in a “fashion roadkill moment.”
  • Both reflect on wardrobe mishaps: “I just love that both of our outfits got fucked up.” – Chelsea [04:38]

Jury Duty Antics & Cardi B’s Court Case

• [04:43 – 09:21]
  • Lauren’s (failed) attempts to avoid federal jury duty: being a podcaster proved more effective than being a new mom.
  • They discuss the recent Cardi B trial, debunking rumors and recapping the outcome: “This was to teach people a lesson,” Chelsea [08:43]

Pop Culture Grab Bag: Powerball, Burning Man, and More

• [09:21 – 14:59]
  • Chelsea admits to Powerball fever and purchasing tickets with “no strategy.”
  • Burning Man recap: from a rare murder to a surprise childbirth (“cryptic pregnancy”).
  • Lauren: “It was a cryptic pregnancy. She didn’t know she was pregnant till she gave birth on the Playa.” [14:19]

Taylor Swift Engagement Frenzy & Gaylor Meltdown

• [14:59 – 21:27]
  • Chelsea’s emotional reaction and surprise at Taylor Swift and Travis Kelce's engagement (“I am really happy for her. ...I was starting to think this was never going to happen for her, honestly.” – Chelsea [14:59])
  • Speculation about Ralph Lauren wedding spawn, ring details, and wedding dress designer.
  • The inevitable reckoning within the “Gaylor” (queer Taylor Swift) fandom.
    • Quote from subreddit: “Sometimes I wonder, what if they actually get married? What if she’s really not queer at all?... I honestly think I could end up in the hospital or worse.” – Read by Lauren [19:41]
  • Karlie Kloss (alleged ex/muse) likes the engagement post.

Celesbian News: Weddings & High-Profile Lesbian Drama

• [23:20 – 34:24]
  • Chloe Grace Moretz and Kate Harrison’s Vogue-covered femme-femme Louis Vuitton wedding.
    • Chelsea: “She wore a light blue gown... two white wedding gowns, that’s a lot. It’s a weird vibe.” [23:53]
  • Discussing celesbian wedding aesthetics and after-party fashion misfires.
  • The lawsuit drama between RHONY’s Raquel Chavarmont and artist Mickalene Thomas: allegations of exploitation and sexual harassment.
  • The ever-unfolding saga of Elizabeth Gilbert (“Eat Pray Love”) and her upcoming lesbian memoir—scandalous excerpts abound.
    • Chelsea: “She’s such a fucking junkie. I’ll just kind of like… have her get her pills mixed up.” [29:27]
    • Lauren: “It is becoming abundantly clear that Elizabeth Gilbert is the definition of a woman that would do something for the plot.” [30:10]
  • Speculating on adaptation: “I hope it’s Julia Roberts again. Or... Cate Blanchett shaving her head.” – Chelsea [34:30]

Fashion News & Campaigns: Sapphic YSL, Miley for Margiela, and More

• [35:15 – 44:52]
  • Chloe Sevigny & Kate Moss’s YSL campaign: “one of the great homoerotic fashion advertisements in recent years.” – Chelsea [35:15]
  • New Margiela ambassador Miley Cyrus, a curious choice given the brand’s legacy of anonymity.
    • “It made me want to cry, actually, when I first saw this. Or, like, throw my phone into the ocean a la Carrie Bradshaw.” – Chelsea [39:53]

Venice Film Festival Fashion

• [44:52 – 51:47]
  • Chloe Sevigny, Charlotte Rampling, Julia Roberts, Amanda Seyfried, Greta Lee, Mia Goth, and Tilda Swinton among notable looks.
  • Julia and Amanda’s matching (very un-Versace) dark wash jeans from Dario Vitale’s debut; a “Sisterhood of the Traveling Pants” moment orchestrated by a shared stylist.
  • Mourning the death of Giorgio Armani, who “was working up until his death.” [52:08]

Industry Shifts: Editorial Shakeup, E-Commerce Woes & AI Slop

• [55:13 – 69:02]
  • Chloe Malle named Head of Editorial Content at Vogue, replacing the title Editor in Chief but not Anna Wintour herself.
    • “Chloe Malle has a journalism background, which is something that Anna Wintour highlighted when she talked about appointing her.” – Lauren [58:20]
  • SSENSE seeks bankruptcy protection; reflections on flash sales, young designers’ struggles, and the legacy of now-failing retailers.
  • J. Crew’s AI-generated campaign for Vans is exposed by Blackbird Spyplane.
    • “...you could find inaccuracies ranging from weird fabric glitches to a model’s foot bending 90 degrees the wrong way.” – Lauren [66:25]
  • Chelsea: “It is really crazy because it’s so obvious and AI does make mistakes, but under normal circumstances, someone comes in and retouches those mistakes so we don’t notice.” [66:25]
  • Consensus: AI’s growing role is concerning, and not even “AI Sam” can replace real photo shoots.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the Gaylor Fandom’s Reaction:
  “What if she’s really not queer at all?... I honestly think I could end up in the hospital or worse.” – Read by Lauren [19:41]
• On Elizabeth Gilbert’s Memoir:
  Chelsea: “She’s such a fucking junkie. I’ll just kind of like… have her get her pills mixed up.” [29:27] Lauren: “It is becoming abundantly clear that Elizabeth Gilbert is the definition of a woman that would do something for the plot.” [30:10]
• On Matching Celesbian Wedding Gowns:
  “Two white wedding gowns, that’s a lot. It’s a weird vibe. It’s like, look at Rebel Wilson’s wedding, you know... there’s something really campy about two wedding dresses.” – Chelsea [23:53]
• On Miley as Margiela’s Ambassador:
  Chelsea: “It made me want to cry, actually, when I first saw this. Or, like, throw my phone into the ocean a la Carrie Bradshaw.” [39:53]
• On SSENSE’s Buy Model:
  “They have everything. And yes, I don’t get the vibe that anyone ever pays full price for anything. I certainly never have.” – Chelsea [60:53]
• On J. Crew’s AI Photography:
  Lauren: “...you could find inaccuracies ranging from weird fabric glitches to a model’s foot bending 90 degrees the wrong way...” [66:25]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

| Time | Segment | |-----------|------------------------------------------------------------| | 00:54 | Opening catch-up: canceled flights, wardrobe malfunctions | | 04:43 | Jury duty adventures & Cardi B trial recap | | 09:21 | Powerball fever & Burning Man chaos | | 14:59 | Taylor Swift’s engagement (the fandom, clues, wedding talk) | | 19:41 | The Gaylor subreddit meltdown | | 23:20 | Celesbian news: Chloe Grace Moretz’s wedding, lawsuits | | 29:27 | Elizabeth Gilbert’s wild memoir | | 35:15 | Sapphic YSL campaign, celesbian campaign analysis | | 39:53 | Miley Cyrus for Margiela (and the brand’s contradictions) | | 44:52 | Venice Film Festival fashion | | 52:08 | Giorgio Armani’s passing | | 55:13 | Vogue shakeup: Chloe Malle’s new role | | 59:33 | SSENSE bankruptcy: sales model, industry effects | | 66:25 | J.Crew Vans AI campaign—the rise of “AI slop” |

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Tone and Takeaways

Chelsea and Lauren’s breezy, sardonic banter is rich with fashion trivia, incisive commentary, and internet-savvy cultural analysis. They cover headline news, but never without a wink—or a shade of skepticism for the ever-corporatized and AI-infused fashion world. This episode will satisfy anyone who loves fashion drama, queer pop culture, and unapologetically bitchy, insider commentary.

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Further Listening

If you enjoyed the deep dive into celesbian weddings, queer internet drama, or the fashion industry’s existential woes, check out their hotline episode next week or revisit earlier episodes for more takes on Sex and the City and fashion’s wildest stories.

Transcript

[A]

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[B]

I spent $40,000 on shoes. What's the matter, Morty?

[A]

Oral.

[B]

Just a thing. Change my arm. Oral. Just a thing.

[A]

Great gowns.

[B]

Beautiful gowns.

[A]

Fashion has changed. No, it hasn't.

[B]

Hi, I'm Lauren Garrone.

[A]

And I'm Chelsea Fairless.

[B]

And welcome back to the Every Outfit podcast. Chelsea, it's great to see you. I have not seen you in a week and a half because you went home to see your parents. And I feel like every time I texted you, your flight had just been canceled, so I was worried you might not make it to this recording.

[A]

I barely made it here because, yes, I booked a round trip ticket and both of my flights got canceled. This is one of the hazards of living in the Pacific Northwest, I have to say.

[B]

That goddamn fog.

[A]

I want to hear what you were up to when I was gone, but I also want to kick it back a couple weeks because we haven't recorded since we did our Mahogany screening, which was so fun.

[B]

That's very true. For the second year, not in a row. But for the second year, we participated in the Friend of the Fest festival for podcasters. And yeah, we selected the movie Mahogany. We did the introduction. We sold some merch before. And I mean, I think you had a relaxing, even understandably so. Paul and I, not so much. First night out from the baby.

[A]

Well, yeah, you were in a terrible mood when I first saw you, for one thing, but I understand.

[B]

No, no, no. I want to clarify. Paul was in a terrible mood. I was actually. Okay. Which was very surprising to you.

[A]

Okay, he brought you down.

[B]

Then again, this is absolutely our fault. First time parent, rookie mistake. So the screening was at 10pm and we were like, you know what? We're getting a babysitter. Let's go get a drink before we have a little mini date night. And it'll be perfect by the time the babysitter comes is when we're putting the baby to bed. It'll be simple. Morty lost his mind at bedtime, something that's never happened before. He then proceeded to all over the outfit that you had selected for me. So on the fly, I had to pick a new outfit. While this was happening. Paul was like, I think I should wear my tabbies tonight. And somewhere in the back of my mind, I was like, don't do that. They always give you blisters. But then mor everywhere. And I forgot to remind him of that fact. It took three parking lots to finally find parking. Paul had to lug. All of the merch instantly got a blister. So when you appeared like that's what had happened.

[A]

Well, I'm sorry that he fucked up your outfit. How annoying.

[B]

The baby. Yeah, yeah, I'll send him my dry cleaning bill.

[A]

I too, had my own fashion nightmare that evening because I had dinner at Figaro Bistro beforehand. The iconic French restaurant in Los Feliz. It's also, incidentally, where the Louis Vuitton campaign with Madonna was shot for the, like, African collection that Marc Jacobs did. Anyway, I was walking to the bathroom, Lauren. I slipped, I fell. I had the most humiliating public fall, like, fashion roadkill moment.

[B]

Wow, we must have been in such a foul mood that you were like, I'm not even gonna bring this up.

[A]

Well, I didn't realize that nasty, greasy floor had actually stained my dress. Had I realized that at the time, I would have had a full blown nervous breakdown. But thankfully, I did notice, and it was fine. I mean, I looked like shit by the time I finally introduced the film, but it's okay.

[B]

You absolutely did not. It's funny, you had a very voluminous dress that I was scared I was gonna have my own fashion roadkill moment. Stepping on your dress.

[A]

Oh, yeah. Cause I was wearing the. The pleats, please, Madame Tee caftan, which is like a classic piece with long train. Yeah, no, it wasn't even tripping over the train that got me. My feet just, like, went out from under me.

[B]

So perhaps this is our last year participating in the Friend of the Fest podcast festival.

[A]

I just love that both of our outfits got fucked up. Anyway, what else is new?

[B]

Well, while you were gone, I had jury duty, which I know is your dream.

[A]

Yeah, I've had it and I love it.

[B]

Yes, Chelsea is one of those sickos who loves having jury duty. And I think because you love jury duty so much and you would love to be on a trial, you never get called for jury duty. Me? Someone who does not want to do jury duty every year.

[A]

But you didn't get picked. You just had to go in.

[B]

So this time. This has never happened to me before. It was federal jury duty. The first time I got a summons was when I was nine months pregnant. So I had my doctor write a note because clearly, what better excuse to be excused than a heavily pregnant woman? They were like, great, we'll postpone it two months. So I did go in and I was ultimately excused, but it wasn't for being a new mother and being the primary food source of a baby. You know, there's all this discussion that there's not enough support for mothers and I'm really starting to feel that because when I got called up, I did my whole spiel. I was like, haha, I have a two month old and you know, I'm his main food source, so obviously I can't participate in the jury. The woman's just looking at her screen. She goes, I see in your questionnaire you work for yourself. I said, yes. She goes, what do you do? I said, oh, I have a podcast. Do you work from home? I go, actually I do. I think being a self employed podcaster is what got me excused from jury duty. More so than being a mother.

[A]

See, that really shouldn't be a valid excuse to get out of jury duty. I have a podcast. Come on. It's not a daily podcast, I'll tell you that much.

[B]

Now I will say it was federal jury duty, but if it had been regular degular jury duty, I might have rolled the dice of getting on a jury. Because I'm sure you've seen the Cardi B civil trial that was going on. Could you imagine if I got called to be on that jury?

[A]

It would be great for the podcast because you could talk about it afterwards, surely.

[B]

Absolutely. I mean, I think half the people that were on the O.J. simpson jury wrote books.

[A]

Right.

[B]

So you must be able to. So I was unaware of this Cardi B trial until I started to see the memes that Evan Ross Katz was publishing. So do you know what this court case is about?

[A]

Not really. She assaulted a security guard.

[B]

So a security guard claims that Cardi B assaulted her, which Cardi has assaulted several people. Concerts, strip clubs.

[A]

Never forget the iconic Harper's Bazaar party.

[B]

Oh, with Nicki Minaj.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

So this case dates all the way back to 2018, when Cardi was pregnant with her first child. It is a female security guard, which was my first surprise. And they had locked down the building because no one knew that Cardi B was pregnant at the time. And so it was a private appointment on the weekend. And the security guard basically treated this like it was her own personal meet and Greet and put her phone in Cardi's face and alleged that Cardi, four months pregnant, beat the crap out of her and was suing, according to cardi B for $24 million in damages. And it did not go this woman's way.

[A]

Well, did she have any proof that she was attacked?

[B]

There were no cameras in the building. There was a photo that I believe her doctor took, but then there was an expert witness that was like, that scratch on her face came from someone who's right handed and Cardi B is left handed. You also had the doctor, Cardi B's doctor, and the receptionist, who it seems like out of anyone that got injured, it was the receptionist at this office who supported Cardi's story. It's very clear that this woman, the security guard, was like, I'm going to sue her. She's not going to want to go to trial because that's very expensive. And so I'll get a payment out of this. And Cardi B was like, bet I have trial money. I'm sure the court fees cost way more than it would if she had just settled with this woman for a couple hundred thousand dollars. But as Cardi said, after she was vindicated, this was to teach people a lesson.

[A]

Look, what the security guard did is not right, but I get it. We all dream of a payday like this. Which is why I've been compulsively buying Powerball tickets for the last few days.

[B]

Oh, my God. It got you too.

[A]

They got my ass.

[B]

Do you have a strategy? My father is also a Powerball sicko.

[A]

No, I have no strategy. I don't even pick my own numbers. I just let the universe decide. But I still haven't won, unfortunately.

[B]

Is the universe chatgpt? Because I've seen people trying to game the system by using ChatGPT.

[A]

I haven't been doing that, but if I don't win, I'm going to be really sad.

[B]

So what would you do, Jill, if you won the $1.7 billion, would you take the one lump sum which would have the money? It would be about 500 million or.

[A]

Over the course of your 588 after federal. But that doesn't account for state taxes. Although the jackpot has grown because no one won the last time that they did it.

[B]

Well, it sounds like the first thing you'll do if you win this money is move to a no income tax state.

[A]

No, I can't be one of those tax haven state losers. No. Guys, I have a truly thrilling announcement to make. My dreams have Come true. And I'm so excited to share that this episode is sponsored by the RealReal, which is the best place to shop for authenticated luxury bags, clothing, watches, and so much more.

[B]

Congratulations, Chelsea. I know how much this means to you.

[A]

Thank you, honey. If you listen to this podcast with any regularity, you know how much I Talk about the RealReal. I am on the app every single day. I would say that roughly 75% of my shopping at this point is done on this website. And I'm always curious to know what other people are buying. What have you purchased on the RealReal lately?

[B]

For me, I'm always searching for jackets. I found an amazing Alexander McQueen vintage jacket from the early 2000s, 70% off the retail price. And you know what, Chelsea? I didn't click the button fast enough. Someone purchased it, returned it, and I immediately got it back. There is no high like that.

[A]

Oh, it's true. I have acquired some incredible pieces doing precisely just that.

[B]

What about yourself?

[A]

Well, I'm going to Miami next week, and I do go to the Real Real whenever I need something highly specific. For this trip, I need something that is in the vein of Samantha Jones meets Nathan Lane from the Bird age. So I got tat this really beautiful Versace silk shirt from the 80s, and I got myself the most incredible poochie caftan. I've always wanted one. I'm completely obsessed with Camille Micelli, who is their current creative director. And this is the perfect example of a piece that I could never afford Otherwise. It was 80% off the retail price. And on the RealReal, you can get discounts of up to 90% off retail. Oh, and did I ment mention that everything is authenticated?

[B]

Oh, look at you hitting the talking points, guys. I'm just so happy that Chelsea wants to do ad reads with me now.

[A]

Well, thankfully for you, they booked a bunch of ads with us, which is smart of them because any money that we make from these ads will be reinvested in clothing from the RealReal. Anywho, I will let you do the outro.

[B]

The RealReal is the world's largest and most trusted resource for authenticated luxury resale. With thousands of new arrivals daily. No one does resale like the RealReal. And now get $25 off your first purchase when you go to therealreal.com outfit. That's therealreal.com outfit to get your $25 off. When you type in the URL, please make sure that it is lowercase. It will not work if it is uppercase. Start shopping now. @therealreal.com outfit in all lowercase. Speaking of tax haven losers, you also miss Burning man, which took place in Nevada. And look, it's hackney to do jokes about Burning Man. Right. It's awful. You couldn't pay me to go. I just want to highlight because the same thing happens every year, right? There's. You get videos of people who are stuck in dust storms for some reason, every time Burning man happens the last few years, it rains and so it's muddy. We all know this. I just want to bring to your attention two things that have never happened at Burning man before. A man was murdered at Burning Man. A man was found in a pool of blood.

[A]

To be fair, people have died at Burning man before. They just haven't been murdered.

[B]

Right. And it made me realize I'm surprised we haven't had a whodunit murder mystery set at Burning man. Because Burning man is sort of like an EDM nightmare. Fuel midsommar, if you think about it.

[A]

Yeah. With like a much less appealing look.

[B]

Yeah. The style is terrible. I love that. A festival that was built on the idea of under consumerism is now all about consumerism because people buy outfits to go to Burning man amongst many other things.

[A]

Of course, you can't wear those, like pink neon platform boots just out in the world. Also, did you hear that someone gave birth at Burning Man.

[B]

So this is the other thing I was going to bring up. A baby was born at Burning Man. And I'm sure you're like, why would a nine month pregnant woman go to Burning Man? It's 112 degrees. That's irresponsible. No, no, Chelsea, this is the most terrifying thing. I think even more than a man being murdered. It was a cryptic pregnancy. She didn't know she was pregnant till she gave birth on the Playa.

[A]

So scary is that show.

[B]

I did.

[A]

I didn't know I was pregnant. I don't know. I haven't watched it in years. But I did enjoy it when it was around. They should resurrect it and do a special episode just for the Burning man birth. But how terrified. I was reading the New York Times article about this and they were like, the man that delivered her baby, who was a doctor, like was in his underwear at the time of the delivery.

[B]

He had just left the refrigerated orgy tent. God, I'm sure our listeners are so thrilled to hear us talking about all of this stuff. I'm sure they're screaming at their phones. Taylor got engaged. Taylor got engaged. We need to know Chelsea's thoughts about Taylor getting engaged.

[A]

Okay? Only the Taylor people care about that. Again, I apologize. Apologize to the segment of the audience that doesn't give a shit about any of this. My thoughts. I am really happy for her. I felt, like, a sense of relief when I saw the post, just knowing how much she values marriage, has wanted to be married for so many years. She wrote Love Story when she was 17 years old. I was starting to think this was never going to happen for her, honestly.

[B]

So can I just say how I found out about this news is I looked down at my phone and Chelsea had sent me a text message with no context. It was the photo of Travis Kelce proposing to Taylor Swift, but from very far away. And you just wrote, I'm literally crying. And I sent you back that gif of Shemar Moore when Susan Lucci finally won the Daytime Emmy. And I was like, the streak is over. Taylor Swift is engaged.

[A]

Well, especially after the relationship with Joe Alwyn. And, you know, she clearly wanted to get married. He did not want to get married. That must have been extremely frustrating for her. I'm just happy that she found someone that is down.

[B]

Well, as we know, podcasts are forever. So he couldn't not propose after she appeared on his podcast.

[A]

Also, was this post Ralph Lauren Spawn? Because they're both wearing Ralph Lauren. She's wearing a Ralph Lauren dress, a striped summer dress, and he's wearing, like, the classic polo shirt. Was this a coincidence?

[B]

Probably not.

[A]

I don't know.

[B]

So they made it Instagram official. The caption said, your English teacher and your gym teacher are getting married. Which confused me because I was like, oh, she considers herself the English teacher.

[A]

Well, she can't say the music teacher because that's a little too egotistical. So she went with the English teacher because, you know, of course, she is a wonderful lyricist.

[B]

According to Page Six, they noted that Travis Kelce proposed the day they filmed that podcast episode. Her fans noticed Swift's manicure and her, quote, hair creases matched from the podcast to these engagement photos.

[A]

Taylor Swift fans are so insane. There's this tweet that haunts me. You might have sent it to me. There was something to the effect of, like, real Taylor Swift fans can tell what night of the LA show she was doing based on the continuity of her manicure. Because, you know, she did five shows.

[B]

In a row and got a manicure in between.

[A]

No, she had the same manicure the whole time. Real fans know which night it was based on the continuity of her manicure.

[B]

Oh, the manicure. Getting worn down night after night.

[A]

Yes. Jesus, that's like so psycho.

[B]

So also, according to Page Six, Travis Kelce spent six to eight months planning and co designing the ring.

[A]

When I saw the ring, I was like, you know what? It's very her.

[B]

Explain.

[A]

I think the fact that the band has these sort of antique, ornate elements that are not trendy at all, that's very Taylor.

[B]

So who do we think is going to design the wedding dress? I was unaware of this subliminal Ralph Lauren spawn potentially in the engagement, so now I'm sort of leaning towards Ralph Lauren. Previously, I would have said Oscar de la Renta.

[A]

Yeah. But I could see her randomly going with Versace or something.

[B]

Also, it's going to be a poofy dress, isn't it?

[A]

I have no idea. I actually don't know what to expect from her.

[B]

So, more interestingly than Taylor Swift getting engaged is, I would love to know your thoughts about the inevitable gaylor fandom meltdown at the news that our girl is indeed heterosexual. Which, if I may make a point.

[A]

This is bi erasure.

[B]

Well, I want to say, during our last live show, we had a debate. We debated Taylor Swift's sexuality. You said she was queer, I said she was straight. By audience applause, you won.

[A]

But I was never claiming that she was a closeted lesbian. I was claiming that she was a bisexual woman.

[B]

But do I get to now win this debate because she's engaged to a man?

[A]

You know what's crazy is that Karlie Kloss liked the engagement post.

[B]

Whoa.

[A]

Will they reconcile fully? Will she be at this wedding? Taylor wasn't at Carly's wedding, as I pointed out out in our live show.

[B]

So I want to highlight a couple of the most unhinged gaylor thoughts that I found on the Internet. One that made the rounds from the subreddit, gaylorswift was a woman who I assume it's a woman.

[A]

Yeah, I don't think there are men that are gaylor.

[B]

So the post says. I'm scared. I'm genuinely scared watching how serious Taylor and Travis are becoming. Sometimes I wonder, what if they actually get married? What if she's really not queer at all? It feels like everything I believed about her could collapse overnight. If this is real and not some PR game, I honestly think I could end up in the hospital or worse. So, Chelsea, I want to know, why.

[A]

Did you write that you're such a cunt? Look, I am not that crazy. Although I do follow there's multiple gaylor subreddits that I subscribe to. It is interesting seeing how people are reacting to this news.

[B]

How are people doing?

[A]

They don't seem to be doing well.

[B]

In the words of Dorinda Medley to Candace Bushnell, not well, bitch. Okay, can I read you just one more unhinged post from Gaylor? Sure. That I'm not saying you wrote, but I'm not not saying you wrote it.

[A]

You're not not saying that? I didn't upvote this.

[B]

Damn. I was not expecting that. Not sure how I feel. To be honest, I've been gayloring a long time since 2014, but I've wavered on whether or not I think she's bisexual or les. I really didn't expect this relationship to be endgame though, even if legit. Ugh, I miss Joe. To be honest, I can see the two of them being compatible long term. The football meathead and one of the greatest lyricists of this generation. It goes on and on.

[A]

But who misses Joe? That's insane. That's a crazy thing to say.

[B]

It does feel like a fever dream that this woman, when she began the ERAS tour, was with Joe Alwyn. They break up, she was with Matty Healy, and then by the end of that summer ends up with Travis Kelce. And that was somehow two years ago.

[A]

Look good for her. I'm obviously not obsessed with Travis Kelce, but sure, he's fine. He seems like a reasonably nice guy.

[B]

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[A]

There is for one thing, Chloe Grace Moretz and her now wife Kate Harrison got married a femme en femme wedding. Fascinating.

[B]

Featured in Vogue.

[A]

They both wore Louis Vuitton wedding dresses.

[B]

This is how I learned that Chloe Grace Moretz was a Louis Vuitton ambassador.

[A]

Yeah, it's true. It does seem like a weird fit for them. Like not the route they usually go. No shade to her.

[B]

So they were both in dresses. Chloe Grace Moret's dress was baby blue.

[A]

Which I love that she wore a light blue gown. I thought that was a really great solution because two wedding gowns, two white wedding gowns, that's a lot. It's a weird vibe. I'm sorry. It just is. It's like, look at Rebel Wilson's wedding, you know, I mean, those were basically matching dresses also.

[B]

And it sort of works because Rebel Wilson and her wife are slowly morphing into each other.

[A]

There's something really campy about two wedding dresses. It's like you don't even know who to focus on.

[B]

Right. So it's good that the sky blue pulled focus.

[A]

Yeah, they didn't look like weird twins. There's something that gives sister about wearing like an almost identical outfit to someone else.

[B]

Don't I know it. That's why we always have to be careful when we get dressed up for events. So the wedding looks fine, traditional with a bit of edge. But I would love to discuss Chloe Grace Moret's after party look.

[A]

I would love to not discuss that after party look, which was Inspired by.

[B]

A 2019 Louis Vuitton Runway look. For those who have not seen it, I will try to paint you a word picture. It is a Blazer? Sort of. It's a white blazer that ties in the front, which creates cutouts on the sides. There's lace at the bottom. She's wearing a giant white cowboy hat. It was giving a bachelorette look of someone we saw when we went to Thunder from Down Under.

[A]

It looks like costuming from the Hunting Wives also.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Like, Margot would wear that.

[B]

Oh, I would love to see Chloe Grace Moretz in season two of Hunting Wives.

[A]

So congrats to them. They looked super cute. Except for that regrettable after party look. But whatever. Let's not be bitches us.

[B]

You know, Chelsea, as an ally, I take pride in bringing you some lesbian news. And nothing brings me more joy than when I can tell you about some lesbian drama you were previously unaware of. Like how Real Housewives of New York alum Raquel Chavarmont, a highlight of the doomed reboot, I must say, was suing her ex. Now, when I read that headline, Chelsea, I was like, oh, no, she's suing Mel, the forensic neuropsychologist. But no, she is suing her previous ex, Mickalene Thomas. So she is seeking $10 million in damages for alleged, quote, years of exploitation, non payment, and unlawful conduct.

[A]

Okay. Also, Mickalene Thomas, a hugely famous artist. For anyone that requires context for this woman, for this truly iconic dyke. Yeah, this seems bad. This seems really bad.

[B]

Yeah. I don't know how long they were together. In the lawsuit, it discusses the years 2012 to 2022. So I think that encompasses their professional relationship and their personal relationship. And one of the things she alleges is that Micklane was diverting funds from their joint accounts to her own. And then also when they broke up, Raquel alleges that she was sexually harassed and pressured into resuming a romantic relationship. And when she did not reciprocate, that is when the professional relationship was terminated.

[A]

Yeah. I've heard through the lesbian grapevine that Mickalene Thomas doesn't have the greatest track record in terms of fidelity. But that's obviously very different than sexual harassment, which is what Raquel is alleging also. I can't believe you didn't mention that Raquel was the art consultant who picked out LTW's art collection on end just like that.

[B]

Oh, my God. Yes. That is a huge.

[A]

That's why we're bringing this up, basically.

[B]

Well, I'm also bringing it up because when I initially said this story to you, I was like, this is a lost L Word storyline. Like, this is something that would happen to Bette Porter or has It.

[A]

Yeah, she kind of had a sexual harassment moment when she was briefly the dean of an art school. But. But anyway, this sucks. I like both of them. If I was Mickling Thomas, I would have probably just paid her to make this go away, because her work sells for millions of dollars. Like, I don't think $20 million is actually that much to this woman.

[B]

Well, and not even $20 million, because Raquel is seeking 10 million in damages.

[A]

Oh, okay. $10 million. Yeah, definitely. That's, like, a few paintings, I would think.

[B]

Do you think somewhere Andy Cohen is regretting his decision to cancel the reboot of Real Housewives of New York?

[A]

Y have tuned in for. For sure, but there was a lack of dyke drama on that show for all the lesbians that they brought on.

[B]

Such a bummer.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You know, if they do ever bring back the Real Housewives of New York yet again, you know who they should add to the cast?

[A]

Who?

[B]

Elizabeth Gilbert.

[A]

Yeah, so she could be the Jenny Schecter of the Lesbian Housewives.

[B]

You sent me a doozy of an article. I can only assume that Elizabeth Gilbert is back to terrorize us with another memoir.

[A]

Yes. The lesbian memoir of the decade is upon us. Elizabeth Gilbert is about to release her second memoir, which is called all the Way to the River. It's about her tumultuous relationship with her best friend, who she left her husband for after her friend was diagnosed with terminal cancer.

[B]

Let's go back a few beats, Chelsea. For those who are like, I'm sorry, did you say the woman who wrote Eat, Pray, Love? Yes, guys. So the woman who left her husband to then go on a transcontinental trip to find herself ultimately marrying a Brazilian she met in Bali. That Elizabeth Gilbert, who then left that man that she found in Ypres, love to be with this woman. Yes. Who she ultimately wanted to murder.

[A]

Yeah. Elizabeth Gilbert has talked about her relationship with this woman in the press in the past, on her Instagram, on other people's podcasts. But now that excerpts are coming out from this book and reviews of the book are coming out, we are getting a fuller picture of just how fucked up this situation actually was. Because basically, her dying lover was like, a former, like, coke and heroin addict who then relapsed to the point where Elizabeth Gilbert was like, I guess the only solution is for me to murder this woman, which she writes about plainly. She was like, she's such a fucking junkie. I'll just kind of like. Like, have her get her pills mixed up.

[B]

No more than that, Chelsea. It is becoming Abundantly clear that Elizabeth Gilbert is the definition of a woman that would do something for the plot. Because why she wants to murder her lover. Which, by the way, the last time I touched down on this relationship was when they got married to each other in like 2017 or 2018.

[A]

It wasn't a legal ceremony, but yes, there was a ceremony.

[B]

It's because she didn't think that this woman was going to live so long.

[A]

Well, yeah, because she was told that she had six months to live. So they basically went on this six month long like sex and shopping and drug binge that then just like didn't end because this woman just didn't die.

[B]

For those who have read Julia Fox's down the drain memoir, it feels like this book is going to be that. It's like, you know, what was missing from Eat Pray Love. What if Rosamund pike from Gone Girl was the lead?

[A]

I think it's going to be way more fucked up than Julia Fox's book. Just based on what I've already heard.

[B]

I was pleased to see that Elizabeth Gilbert does acknowledge that she's a love and sex addict.

[A]

Oh, for sure. And Gia Tolentino said something to this effect in her takedown article of Elizabeth Gilbert that was published in the New Yorker this week. But the funny thing about Elizabeth Gilbert is that with Eat Pray Love, she was relatable to so many straight women, like basic straight women, essentially.

[B]

Well, I mean, yes, she inspired a whole demographic of straight women to leave their jobs and go on a multi continent trip and go broke because they didn't realize that Elizabeth Gilbert was able to fund her trip because she sold the idea of Eat Pray Love as a book and use the advance to actually travel for sure.

[A]

And she also set the stage for people like Glennon Doyle, who is arguably just the like less fucked up version of Elizabeth Gilbert in our culture right now. But with this book, she's very much showing herself to be a full fledged psycho, which honestly I support.

[B]

Yeah. It was also shocking to see as someone who's like last touched down with this woman seven or eight years ago where she had, you know, a blonde bob, not, not, not too dissimilar to your hair that she is rocking a full Kathy Acker shaved head now.

[A]

But see, that's the thing about Elizabeth Gilbert. It's like she can't just have a late in life lesbian relationship. She has to wind up in this crazy situation with this like leather pants wearing like former drug addict that attempts to drag her down to the depths of hell.

[B]

I mean, what I got from the excerpts is I don't know if this woman dragged her down to the depths of hell. It seems like Elizabeth Gilbert just did a, you know, a butterf.

[A]

Oh, it was definitely a codependent relationship. I don't want to say that Elizabeth Gilbert has no part in whatever this toxic dynamic clearly was in the excerpts.

[B]

That have been released. I read it in a Guardian article. It does make you wonder if this is what is being released now, what else is in this book? Because in these excerpts, basically, her partner won't let her sleep because she can't sleep. So therefore, Elizabeth Gilbert can't sleep. And as someone that has not experienced a REM cycle in months, I understand where she's coming from. But there is a moment where she's like, I'm going to kill this woman tonight. It's not a mercy killing. She's basically annoying me so much, and I just want to close my eyes.

[A]

I know. I love how she clarifies. Like, just so you know, this wasn't about, like, euthanasia or putting someone out of their misery or suffering. She clearly wanted to live, but I chose to kill her anyway.

[B]

She doesn't.

[A]

We should say she didn't succeed.

[B]

This isn't a jinx situation where Elizabeth Gilbert is publishing this memoir from behind bars or something.

[A]

Also, I remember her talking about this on Glennon Doyle's podcast. But after this woman died, she then started fucking her, like, roommate, her, like the woman's former male roommate, and then got into a crazy, like, love and sex addict situation with this man, like, because they were both, like, dealing with grief and stuff. So I think there's going to be a lot of happening in this book.

[B]

Who do we see in the film or prestige TV series adaptation of this book?

[A]

I hope it's Julia Roberts again. Or I could see Cate Blanchett shaving her head and doing this whole thing.

[B]

Yeah, enough of that. What was that terrible Apple TV series that we watched with Cate Blanchett?

[A]

Oh, yeah, that was really bad disclaimer. Yeah, it was bad. Yet I watched the whole thing. Yet somehow it got nominated for Emmys. I don't really understand that, but it happened.

[B]

And a Golden Globe. And yet I have no memory of it.

[A]

Anyway, so that book comes out on September 9th. I cannot wait. I will report back.

[B]

Ooh, do we know who's doing the audiobook?

[A]

I'm sure Elizabeth Gilbert is doing the audiobook.

[B]

That might be a book. Best experience while walking, listening to it at two times speed as an audiobook.

[A]

In other celesbian news. I can't believe we never talked about this Kate Moss Chloe 70 YSL campaign. One of the great homoerotic fashion advertisements in recent years.

[B]

Yeah, I hadn't seen this campaign before. You suggested discussing it under the Celesbian banner. And I was like, how gay could this photo shoot be? And the answer is very gay. Very sapphic.

[A]

Very sapphic.

[B]

It calls into question something you and I have experienced, which is when we take photographs as a duo, there's a very thin line between we are work partners and we are partners. Please come to commitment ceremony.

[A]

Well, when I saw this, I immediately thought about the Isabella Rossellini portion of the sex book, which was obviously on the mood board for this shoot because they recreated two different setups from that photo series. The shot of them in the pool and then the shot of them on the beach where Kate moss is under Chloe 70's like, large overcoat. In the Madonna sex book, it's Isabella Rossellini with Madonna sort of cuddled up up next to her like that. I love seeing a direct reference like that. Plus, I just feel like this is one of the better campaigns that we've gotten for a while. If for no other reason that it's shot outdoors and not in a studio.

[B]

And not AI Generated.

[A]

Not AI Generated. Just a respectable Chateau Marmont photo shoot. Oh, speaking of which, did I tell you I went there the other night and I saw Charli xcx.

[B]

No, you didn't.

[A]

She looked great.

[B]

Okay, we did a brief digression into Celesbian news. Should we pop back into our Pop It Girls news?

[A]

Sure.

[B]

Every. Every.

[A]

This Lana W. Magazine cover is so insane.

[B]

I was like, what does this cover remind me of? Because her neck is so elongated and her face is just so doll like. And I was like, oh, it's like a John Curran painting.

[A]

It's very John Curran. It's also very like she looks like a wealthy Italian woman who was photographed by Slim errands in the 60s. Who also has, like, a crippling barbiturate addiction. Like, there's a real palpable sense of despair underneath the sort of glossy sheen of this image. To me, anyway, I don't know if others have read it in that way.

[B]

Well, it's just an interesting juxtaposition because the images are so elegant. You're right, it does look like a Slim Aarons photograph. But also, I mean, if you read the Lynn Hirschberg interview with her, it seems she's never been happier, which is relative in Lana Del Rey terms. But, like, the idea that she's dressed like this Italian 1960s aristocrat and she's married to a swamp tour guide is very funny to me.

[A]

I support the look. I don't support the retouching. Like, she doesn't actually look like this in the face.

[B]

Well, yeah, her neck isn't that long.

[A]

Well, it's also like they smoothed out her jawline or something. I think they Also, the retouching on the hair is like fully mental. It's almost like, you know how your phone, like, automatically silhouettes things now. It gives that. The retouching is so extreme that it just gives the image this really, like, uncanny quality. That said, I'm definitely buying this issue from a camp standpoint. This is a landmark achievement up there with the Meisel, Linda Evangelista, British Vogue, like, face reveal cover.

[B]

Right. And I will say that the interview is equally campy. Like, some of the highlights for me is she talks about how her and her husband have parking lot time, which is where they drive to various parking lots, whether it's a empty Macy's or a Home Depot parking lot. And they just read and talk to each other. That sounds cute. And people say we've lost third places.

[A]

So this was one of three covers that Debbie released for the September issue. The other ones were Steven Meisel photos of Zoe Kravitz and Julia Garner. The Zoe Kravitz one was pretty incredible. Certainly looked more natural.

[B]

Well, yes, it definitely looked more natural than the Lana Del Rey cover. But, like, there's something about Zoe Kravitz that is just so unreal. She's so beautiful.

[A]

Yeah. The styling was also quite good. What else do we need to talk about? Oh, these Miley Cyrus Margiela ads.

[B]

Yes, Margiela. A brand so intertwined with the idea of anonymity that people aren't even sure what Margiela looks like now. The man, Martin Margiela. They have named their first celebrity ambassador, and it's Miley Cyrus.

[A]

It's so against God, like, it made me want to cry, actually, when I first saw this. Or, like, throw my phone into the ocean a la Carrie Bradshaw. I understand that these heritage brands need to evolve to stay relevant, but it's like, like, yeah, this is the brand that is about anonymity. And that was a critique of other brands and how personality based the fashion industry had become. Whether it's fashion designers that become celebrities themselves or the celebrities and the supermodels that are the spokespeople for these brands. Margiela has always been about stripping. It back to just the clothes. So yes, it seems like a truly insane creative choice that that directly contradicts what this brand is all about.

[B]

Yeah, I guess for me it falls under the sure, why not category. I mean, you imagine that even though Glenn Martin's. We haven't seen Glenn Martin's design work just yet, or I guess his ready to wear design look, that he had a hand in picking Miley Cyrus as their first ambassador for the brand.

[A]

Well, it's also not as if like John Galliano never had celebrities associated with the brand. I remember he did that fragrance campaign with like Willow Smith and Princess Nokia a few years ago. You know, he cast Gwendoline Christie obviously in that fashion show. But like Gwendoline Christie wasn't cast because of her fame level. She was cast because she has this extreme height, these extreme proportions and is someone that is genuinely like part of the British fashion scene. Miley Cyrus is someone that's kind of is a Disney Channel child star that's kind of always been famous. And also someone that has modeled in campaigns for like every other brand even like very recently. Like I associate her so much with Gucci.

[B]

That's what I was gonna say is even though her new work does align with an austere alien look that they're trying to go for with this campaign, I do so associate her with the Alessandra McKelly maximalist 70s Gucci look.

[A]

But she's also been in Dolce and Gabbana ads quite recently. I think there was like a. An eyewear campaign that she did maybe a couple years and of course she's modeled for Marc Jacobs. It's just if you are going to pick a celebrity spokesperson, I do think it should be someone that isn't this ran through in terms of being the face of all these different brands.

[B]

It's also an odd choice. Even though Glenn Martens has debuted his couture collection, this ad doesn't feature those couture looks. So he has not shown his ready to wear vision for Margiela just yet. So it does seem bizarre to pick a celebrity ambassador.

[A]

That said, the photos are stunning. They're beautiful.

[B]

She looks great in a pair of tabbies.

[A]

It's just like everything that it represents really, really put me off.

[B]

Shall we get into some fashion at the Venice Film Festival? A perfect topic for an audio medium.

[A]

Chloe Sevigny killing it once again. We've seen two looks from her so far. A Simone Rocha look and a YSL look. And truly Chloe Sevigny upstaging all of these Europeans on the red carpet is one of the. The few things that inspires, like, a genuine sense of patriotism within me.

[B]

Absolutely. I mean, and she's been doing it the longest, and she's still turning out great looks at film festivals.

[A]

I don't know if she's been doing it the longest. Charlotte Rampling was also at the Venice Film Festival. Looking fab, by the way.

[B]

Fair enough. Fair enough.

[A]

I think also in ysl, probably, if.

[B]

You want to talk about faces that reflect the brand that they wear.

[A]

But the YSL in particular was so good. It was like a poofy little satin mini dress that had these lacey bike shorts attached to it, which sounds like a horrible fucking idea.

[B]

Well, it didn't work so well for Demi Moore when she tried to wear bike shorts at the Oscars.

[A]

True. This dress somehow solved all of those problems. It looked incredible. And it was based on an archival design that had, like, a full lace tight or some sort of bodysuit under it or attached to it instead of these bike shorts. But I didn't know bike shorts could.

[B]

Look like this on a person and not give revolve.

[A]

And not give revolve. Are you just, like, running errands in Hollywood?

[B]

Those are gym shorts. How dare you? The Venice Film Festival has really come out in the last few years, I think ahead of Cannes as a great festival for fashion looks and also setting up what are going to be the awards films of the season, for sure.

[A]

And this year, the timing of it is just really insane because we have all of these new creative directors that have been appointed to all of these luxury houses. We haven't seen full collections from them, so we're seeing some of the first things that they are designing at the Venice Film Festival. Another example of that is Julia Roberts and Amanda Seyfried in the first looks from Dario Vitale's Versace, which were a.

[B]

Pair of dark wash jeans.

[A]

Yeah. In case you guys haven't seen this, they both wore the same outfit, which.

[B]

Was a dark wash bootcut jean, a blazer, a striped shirt. Unless you think this is a fashion faux pas akin to Samantha Jones and Miley Cyrus wearing the same dress to Smith Jarrett's premiere in Sex and the city. 2. These two women share the same stylus. Elizabeth Stewart, Julia Roberts was seen wearing it during a photo call for her Luca Guadagnino film, which we should mention. When Julia Roberts arrived in Venice, she was wearing a Luca Guadagnino sweater with Luca Guadagnino's face repeated on the sweater. And then According to a clip I saw from Vandy Fair, Amanda Seyfried saw Julia Roberts wearing it in one. Was like, you know what? I'd love to wear this too.

[A]

Wait, really? I thought they were trying to make a more intentional statement about sustainability, which I don't think this is the way to make that statement.

[B]

But no, she quite literally was like, that looks cute. We have the same stylist. I just love to imagine Elizabeth Stewart's assistant on one of those Venice water taxis. Like, bringing the outfit from hotel to hotel. Like, this Versace look is the sisterhood of the traveling pants.

[A]

Well, it's just so weird because it's not very Versace. It seems like a strange choice to put this much focus on a look that is so casual.

[B]

It's funny because when I saw Amanda Seyfried in that same Julia Roberts look, it reminded me of this story that. Remember when Anne Hathaway won the Oscar and she was in a very subdued Prada gown and everyone was like. Like she was the odds on favorite. That's so weird that she's in this understated gown. And there is this apocryphal story that I've been told is actually true, that the reason that Anne Hathway wore that Prada dress is that was actually a backup dress. And the night before, when they were rehearsing the Les Mis song bit, Amanda Seyfried was like, here's the dress I'm wearing. And it was identical to what Anne Hathaway had made.

[A]

Right. I vaguely remember this.

[B]

So really, Amanda Seyfried is an unintentional fashion terrorist is what I think I'm trying to say.

[A]

Well, Amanda Seyfried also wore it better because with Julia Roberts, a truly demonic shoe choice. A boot cut jean with a pump that was kind of like a high coverage pump. No toe cleavage, very uncomfortable tension between the hem of the jeans and the shoe. Whereas Amanda Seyfried wore a strappy sandal. The jeans practically hit the floor because she's shorter, I guess, and, like, it worked from a proportional standpoint.

[B]

Do you think Amanda Seyfried saw Julia Robertson and was like, I can wear this better? That's really what it was about.

[A]

I guess we'll never really know what it was about.

[B]

Who else do we have?

[A]

A lot of people have been talking about Elba Rohrwacher's Dior look, which I thought was fab. I don't understand the online hate that this gown is getting, because I thought it was absolutely gorgeous. The problem Is that it got really fucking wet. I don't know if it was the rain. I don't know if this bitch fell into a canal in Venice. I don't know what happened.

[B]

She pulled a U. She was in the bathroom of the theater and slipped and fell.

[A]

Yeah, like when you see the photos of the gown and the atelier and the ones of her wearing it in her hotel room beforehand, it's like, beautiful. But something happened in transit, I think.

[B]

I believe it was pouring rain at Venice. So that's probably what happened. But yes, it is the first of Jonathan Anderson's statement for his idea of women's wear with Dior, which I think is built off of the menswear collection that we have already seen, which a very. For those who haven't seen the look, just imagine, basically the back of the dress looks like she has a fabric bbl.

[A]

I don't even think it does. I think it was just like a weird angle or something. I don't know. Dior also dressed Greta Lee and our fave Mia Goth, who I thought looked really beautiful also.

[B]

So we can expect them to be Dior girlies.

[A]

But I think the most exciting thing for me was this Dior shirt that Luca Guadagnino wore that said no Dior, no Dietrich.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Which a very cute reference to something that Marlene Dietrich once said to Alfred Hitchcock because she wanted Christian Dior to design the costumes for stage fright. And she was basically like, I am not doing this movie if I cannot get these costumes.

[B]

No Dior, no Dietrich.

[A]

Respect. Of all of the designer logo tees, this one speaks to me deeply.

[B]

I know. All of this made me very excited for Paris Fashion Week. It's one more month away. Ciao. Who else do we have? There was Tilda Swinton and Chanel.

[A]

Amazing.

[B]

Really. I thought it was a little matronly.

[A]

Oh, I loved it.

[B]

You think Matu Blasi had a hand in designing this?

[A]

I think he most likely did. It certainly wasn't in a fashion show that we've seen recently, but I thought it was incredibly glamorous. Like it's the sort of mid century glamour that I associate with someone like Dita Blair. And I loved the sculptural hair. And to me, this is as timeless as a look gets. But yes, it is conservative. Certainly there's a lot of fabric involved in this look.

[B]

That's why I was giving Chanel design team for me personally.

[A]

See, I think it's kind of far from what they've been doing in the sense that it's More minimal.

[B]

Right.

[A]

And that could be a direction that they're going into. Speaking of minimalism, Vicki Creeps, our girl from Phantom Thread. Truly stunning in this Bottega Veneta gown, which is the first thing that I've seen from Louise Trotter. I don't know if she's done other red carpet stuff before this, but just so beautiful.

[B]

Yeah, I. I don't think so. And I think this is a very smart choice to debut these looks at a film festival, at an increasingly fashion focused film festival ahead of their first collections.

[A]

Well, it works if people like the look. I think this look was very well received. Certainly the Julia Roberts Versace look. I don't know. Although we should point out that he also did design a black sort of harlequin print gown for Julia Roberts as well as this very casual look.

[B]

I just don't associate her with Versace. But then again, she's been the face of Lancome forever. And whenever I see that Lancome perfume ad, I'm always like, huh, her. Interesting.

[A]

Well, remember she also was in those Givenchy ads where she wore a suit like that was quite cool. I like the idea that Julia Roberts, although she's sort of the most like mainstream a list actress that we have, I like the idea of putting her in something atypical because yes, she doesn't seem like a fussy girly girl to me in her heart, you know.

[B]

Very true. I do feel like she has made some of her most interesting style choices pre stylist. Like there's that. Was it an Armani suit that she wore when she won the Golden Globe? Like an off the rack Armani with a straight tie from the early 90s.

[A]

Yeah. I don't remember who designed that, but it was fab RIP Armani also.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

We were supposed to mention that at the top of the episode, but we failed.

[B]

Giorgio Armani has passed away at 91 years young. According to the New York Times story in the statement that was released by his company, he was working up until his death. It did seem like he was probably not in the best health because I believe it was the couture show in July. He did not do his end of show walk, so.

[A]

But good for him. He clearly wanted to work until the end.

[B]

But he is one of the few still privately owned fashion houses. It is not owned by anyone else. LVMH doesn't own it. So I'm very curious to see if they install a new designer. If the designer musical chairs continues. I'm trying to think of who's available?

[A]

Yeah. Because they could kind of go two routes, both of these routes having been recently explored by Tom Ford. And I could also see a world where they bring in someone else that has a parallel but differing vision.

[B]

Riccardo Tisci.

[A]

That wouldn't speak to me.

[B]

Sabato di Sarno.

[A]

I don't care about him either. I don't know. They need someone like, new and fab.

[B]

So RIP to a legend. Annette Bening. Jodie Foster. Diane Keaton. I'm so sorry for your loss. Before we leave Venice, should we touch down on Kim Kardashian wearing Margiela Couture?

[A]

Sure. What did you think again?

[B]

Sure. Why not?

[A]

See, for me, I think something was lost. The fashion show, the way it was presented was obviously so dramatic and scary. And I do think having the matching veil added a lot to me. I really liked the jumpsuit that she wore, but the hair and makeup felt very inconsistent with the clothes. You know, it was almost like a Bratz Doll kind of glam concept with a look that is very Rick Owens adjacent, certainly.

[B]

Right. It was a classic Kim Kardashian beat. It wasn't like she went understated with her look or did bleached eyebrows or something.

[A]

It was a kind of beat that you could almost do in a 90s.

[B]

Period film when the popular girl is trying to look grunge.

[A]

Yeah. Not even like just the popular girl.

[B]

We also got Cate Blanchett and Margiela Couture. See, that's who should be the face of Margiela.

[A]

That would make a bit more sense than Miley Cyrus. I mean, honestly, anyone would make more sense. But I mean, I thought she looked good. I like both of these pieces, certainly. And I think Kate was a bit more successful than Kim, certainly. Clearly, Kim's outfit, though, also got fucked by the rain.

[B]

It is very clear that the festival has gotten bigger than the city of Venice. Venice, another city that is overrun with tourists, and they're having a sort of reckoning with that. But perhaps quite like the Sundance Film Festival, the Venice Film Festival might need to move to a different location, because think of the gowns.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

All right. What else is there?

[A]

Our big news at Vogue. Chloe Mal is the new head of editorial content. Doesn't that have a exciting ring to it?

[B]

Yeah. I was going to say Chloe Mall has been named Anna Wintour's replacement, but she is not the editor in chief. It seems that Anna Wintour will be retiring that title with her because, yes, Chloe Mall, as you said, is the head of editorial Content. Unless we forget Anna Wintour still there. She's staying on as the Chief Content Officer because. Because it's 2025 and everything is content, baby. Yeah.

[A]

I still think even though Chloe has this job, she's still picking the covers.

[B]

Oh, absolutely. I mean, it was in the New York Times story that she will be reporting under Anna Wintour.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But that's part of Chloe Mal's vision for the future of Vogue is actually to condense the print issues and make them more focused kind of quarterly magazines. It seems like she's going to go with the V magazine approach in the future when it comes to Vogue.

[A]

I mean, how much more condensed can Vogue get these days? She's looking skinny.

[B]

That's what I'm saying is I think that they are going to. Instead of releasing an issue every month or scarily, an entire summer is condensed into one issue. That it will be these larger volumes that she said would be more like art pieces that you would want to keep and collect.

[A]

Sure. The visionarification of print media.

[B]

So we should say Chloe Moll has a deep history with Vogue. She runs Vogue.com, she's also the host of Vogue's flagship podcast. So again, podcasters, we just keep winning.

[A]

Okay. But I really hate the nepotism conversation around her appointment, which has been flourishing online this week, certainly.

[B]

Really? Who's her mom? Chelsea?

[A]

Her mom, in case anyone needs a refresher, her mother is Candace Bergen, formerly a model who was on the COVID of Vogue. She, of course, was Enid on Sex and the City, Carrie's oppressor. And her dad is Louis Mal, the film director.

[B]

I get it. And in the New York Times piece that talked about her new role, she did say that of course, she acknowledges her privilege. But I agree with you. She has been at this for 20 years at this point, like she has built a career in journalism for sure.

[A]

And also, just because your mother plays a Vogue editor on Sex and the City doesn't mean that you get handed a job like this. It's just not how it works.

[B]

Yeah. For those who want to learn more about Chloe Moll, obviously you could listen to her Vogue podcast, which I do wonder if she will still be the co host of with her new role. But she was recently on Kristin Davis Are youe a Charlotte podcast.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

Which she was very delightful.

[A]

Yeah. I also feel like some. Some people online are disappointed because she's not the type of fashion editor that is also an influencer, which, no shade to those people, but is a genre of fashion editor. That exists now.

[B]

Right. I mean, her. Her look, her personal style is a little more understated, which, I mean, most editors. I think there's also this confused idea of what a fashion editor should look like for two reasons. The influencer effication of things, but also because, you know, when we were growing up in the 90s and 2000s, so many stylists, particularly French stylists, became fashion editors. But Chloe Maul has a journalism background, which is something that Anna Wintour highlighted when she talked about appointing her. So. Yeah.

[A]

Also, I continue to reject the narrative that's like, well, it's one Nepo baby hiring another Nepo baby.

[B]

Oh. Cause Anna Wintour's father was a publisher.

[A]

Yes. As we discussed when we talked about Amy Odell's Anna Wintour biography, it wasn't like Anna Wintour got her start in media because she worked at her father's newspaper.

[B]

Right. And it's also not like Anna Wintour appointed her own daughter, Bea Schaeffer, into the role.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

However, I mean, Chloe Moll is the person who had the great idea to appoint Jake Schlossberg as their political correspondent. So she might not be beating the nepotism begins. Nepotism charges.

[A]

Yeah, but that was interesting. At the very least, ESSENCE is filing for bankruptcy.

[B]

Well, they have filed for bankruptcy protection, or whatever the equivalent in Canada of bankruptcy protection is after they learned that their lenders were trying to force a sale of the E retailer. So, everyone, don't get so excited. Save the items that are currently in your cart. But in a letter obtained by Business of Fashion, Essence CEO Rami Atala explained that the ending of the the de minimis loophole, where packages under $800 in value were not subject to tariffs, also played a huge factor in their move to seek bankruptcy protection.

[A]

Well, because it's a Canadian company, just for context.

[B]

It is indeed. Yes. And Canada has some of the highest tariffs, so all of our ESSENCE orders would automatically be hit with 35% tariffs. Horrible. This is all bad. I've seen a lot of people rejoicing online, making jokes about how this ESSENCE sale is going to be epic, but they're never ending discounting of designer items. While the reason why a lot of us have the designer items we have in our closet is also the reason that the brand isn't doing well right now.

[A]

Well, I never understood how ESSENCE works because their buy is so big for every single brand, you know?

[B]

Right.

[A]

They have everything. And yes, I don't get the vibe that anyone ever pays full price for anything. I Certainly never have.

[B]

Yeah, it turns out not a great business model. However, the business exploded during the pandemic and so they were able to sell a minority stake to Sequoia Capital. So for all of those of you who are canceling your MUBI membership because they recently got a cash injection from Sequoia Capital, you can cancel ESSENCE as well.

[A]

Those ESSENCE pandemic sales did really hit. I got several pairs of tabbies and also the, the pleats please caftan that I just ate shit in the other night.

[B]

ESSENCE has built so many memories. No, it's bad. I mean, look, the end is not near for essence, but it's not looking good. Again, all of these jokes about how, yes, the, the fire sale of ESSENCE is going to be epic. A lot of young designers depend on ESSENCE and their buys to sustain their brand. And they're already having trouble paying those designers for sure.

[A]

And ESSENCE basically replaced Opening Ceremony and now it just feels like we can't have one company that's like that.

[B]

I just hope Dover Street Market is okay.

[A]

Me too. Although I feel like whoever is running that whole enterprise is doing a really good job. And also they buy such a small fraction of what ESSENCE buys at the end of the day. Although like with essence, I am trained to just shop at the sales.

[B]

Right. But I think also the undoing of ESSENCE is the fact that they just started to permanently have everything on sale.

[A]

Yeah, well, they discount things prematurely, certainly. It feels like there's pretty much always a sale happening at any given time.

[B]

For sure. Yeah, I guess it's hard to have year after year growth if you're selling your Rick owens collection for 60% off.

[A]

But it sucks because it's like they were really killing it with their buy, with their E Com photography, just the way with their editorial content as well, which was quite good. It's sad.

[B]

They were also doing, I mean, beyond things like designer incubators, there was that collaboration they did last year with a bunch of designers like Vacara to do an ESSENCE vision of wedding attire, which I bought the Vacara white dress as my wedding after party look.

[A]

Yeah, no, their bridal stuff was incredible. Although one thing that they did suck at was customer service. Especially in the aftermath of one of these bloodbath sales. It was always, always, always terrible. Like once Tat got a Margiela tuxedo on sale, the pants just never came. She could. She never got refunded for the pants.

[B]

To this day, Chelsea, they're in trouble. Think of that as supporting ESSENCE still existing. So only time Will tell. But it's not looking good.

[A]

No.

[B]

And we might have to start paying full price for things from Essence.

[A]

Well, it's also fucked because it's like Matches was so great. Now we're in this situation where it's what, Net a porter and revolve. Net a porter and forward. No, I reject this.

[B]

What's the one that I can never say? The name. My Theresa.

[A]

Yeah, My Theresa will still be thriving somehow, despite having a truly diabolical name for a luxury e commerce site.

[B]

Great packaging though. We should also note that what was the other one? Luisa Viaroma also went bankrupt. Can clearly see how much I shop there. Yeah, it's not looking good. You know what's also not looking good, Chell, is have you passed by the Fred Siegel Ron Herman location on Melrose and Crescent Heights? No, it's completely closed. I thought that they were rehabbing the building, but I'm now worried it's never going to open again. And. And here's my pitch. If anyone works at Dover Street Market, open a Dover Street Market in West Hollywood. Please, please stop making us drive to downtown la.

[A]

No, they won't give us that. You know what's crazy? That we don't have a Miu Miu store. Like they are building a Louis Vuitton flagship that is like the size of a city block that basically has a public park on the roof before we can get one like 10 foot by 10 foot Miu Miu store on Sunset Plaza or something.

[B]

Well, I think we discussed this the last time we recorded. Or whenever you discussed that you had gone down to Orange County. The only Courage store on the west coast, or at least in California, is in Orange County. Why?

[A]

Yeah, it's weird. The retail scene here is just. Is pretty whack.

[B]

Well, Chelsea, in more bad news for the overall health of the fashion industry, J. Crew is now serving us some AI slop. And they didn't think that we would notice this. All credit goes to the substack Blackbird spy plane who clock that a recent set of imagery promoting their van's collaboration in the mode of a late 80s early 90s J. Crew catalog were indeed not real. Because when you zoomed in on these images, you could find inaccuracies ranging from weird fabric glitches to a model's foot bending 90 degrees the wrong way, and a host of other AI slop indicators having to do with the environment that these models, and I'll put that in quotes, were seen in. So instead of copying to the AI Slop, J. Crew Just updated the photo credits to credit someone named Sam Fine Studio, which when you go to his Instagram, he calls himself AI Sam, because That's right, Chelsea, you guessed it, he's an AI photographer.

[A]

It is really crazy because it's so obvious and AI does make mistakes, but under normal circumstances, someone comes in and retouches those mistakes so we don't know if notice.

[B]

So that is the crazy thing. One that they didn't pay a retoucher to fix these glitches. But also, and I find the more disheartening thing, they literally have all of the back archive they need to feed the AI to give them an accurate 1980s, 1990s early J. Crew catalog.

[A]

Well, at first glance, they look passably fine.

[B]

Well, yeah, in a 4x5 image on Instagram for sure. But then you start noticing that the blonde model doesn't look the same from shot to shot.

[A]

This sad thing is that AI photography is just going to get more and more common. I'm truly scared for photographers. And the reality is that right now AI isn't that great, which is why there are these glaring mistakes in these images. But that's going to change soon. Soon we won't be able to tell.

[B]

Very true. In a statement, J. Crew said, we're always exploring new forms of creative expression, expanding how we work work, and finding fresh, innovative ways to create content. This partnership with Sam Fine Studio is one of many examples of how we engage artists of all genres to interpret our brand and experiment with different art mediums.

[A]

Well, it's also sad because you have the financial resources of two companies, Vans and J.

[B]

Crew, to actually hire models.

[A]

I understand more if it's like an independent fashion brand that doesn't have the money to produce full fledged shoots like this. Not that I think that's a good thing. It's just, just. It's certainly more understandable than this.

[B]

For sure. I've been noticing on TikTok, I keep getting served ads for like Pilates studios with AI people giving the testimonials of how great the Pilates studio is, which is just very odd.

[A]

It's really sad.

[B]

Perhaps that's why Armani passed on from this mortal coil is someone suggested a AI campaign and he was like, that's it, I'm out.

[A]

Yeah, I actually don't want him to live in the same world as AI.

[B]

Why? It's for the best.

[A]

It's not right.

[B]

It's like when Prince and David Bowie died before Trump became president. It felt like they knew something anyway.

[A]

Rip Armani.

[B]

Rip J. Crew catalogs. They just brought them back. It hasn't even been, I think, a full year since they brought the J. Crew print catalog back, and they're already. They've devolved into AI Slop.

[A]

Well, what's so shitty is that, like, they will do anything but just shoot a campaign on film, which is the look that they're going for, Right?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Anyway, thank you, guys for listening, as always. We will be back next week with a hotline episode, so please call in.

[B]

Yes, please call into our hotline. That number is 323-486-6773. Even though Chelsea and I, we listen to every single one of these calls, if you could please keep it under a minute, we would really appreciate it. Feel free to ask us questions about fashion, pop culture, even sex in the city, perhaps. And, well, we'll be back next week. Bye.