404, Fun Not Found

Summary

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Podcast Summary: "Everybody's Business" – Episode 404, "Fun Not Found"

Date: July 10, 2026
Hosts: Max Chafkin & Stacey Vanek Smith
Guests: Noreen Malik (Bloomberg Energy Reporter), Ben Steverman (Bloomberg Reporter)

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Episode Overview

This episode dives into two disparate, but ultimately linked crises of summer 2026:

1. A nationwide “fun shortage”—as the cost and accessibility of traditional summer fun activities become out of reach for many Americans.
2. The escalating strain on energy grids, driven by both climate-driven heatwaves and the explosion of AI-powered data centers.

With reporting and conversations from Bloomberg’s experts, the show explores how these trends are reshaping daily life—from canceled barbecues to skyrocketing vacation costs.

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Key Segments & Insights

1. The Convergence of Heatwaves and AI: Straining the Grid

[01:08 – 14:07]
Guest: Noreen Malik (Bloomberg Energy Reporter)

• The Setting: Hosts open by noting New York’s intense heat and canceled summer activities—framed humorously as an "official fun shortage."
  • "Everything is getting canceled for weather, Stacy, even for a brief moment now... Even the Great American State Fair was briefly evacuated." – Max [03:05]

Highlights:

• Grid Under Stress:
  • Even mild heat (low 80s °F) is now spiking demand and threatening regional electricity grids, especially on the East Coast and in Northern Virginia—a region packed with energy-intensive AI data centers.
  • "We’ve definitely seen some severe heat already... when it wasn’t that hot... we started to see signs of stress on the grid, especially around Northern Virginia." – Noreen [04:31]
• Consumer Impact:
  • Operators increasingly ask residents to conserve energy; alerts go out about pending shortages.
  • Some smart thermostats now automatically precool homes during cheaper, off-peak hours, reflecting emerging behavioral (and tech) changes.
  • "There is like a behavioral change that is starting to happen. And it depends utility by utility." – Noreen [07:31]
• The Role of Data Centers:
  • Huge “hyperscale” data centers—critical to the current AI boom—are rapidly outpacing grid infrastructure, often driving up local prices and monopolizing spare capacity.
  • "Data center demand growth is the fastest growing demand... So much has come online that it’s like eaten up all the excess supply." – Noreen [09:57]
• Who Pays?
  • As costs soar and infrastructure upgrades become necessary, a fierce debate erupts over whether tech giants or regular consumers should foot the bill.
  • "This is like federal regulators are weighing in, and in the next, like, month and a half or so, we’re going to see the grid operators share with the federal regulators how to split the cost." – Noreen [10:45]
• Comparisons to Europe:
  • While U.S. utilities historically cost less, that is changing. Europe’s stricter zero-carbon commitments have led to higher prices and different approaches to integrating data centers.

Notable Quote:

• "Shouldn’t the new users be the ones paying for the new infrastructure instead of having the average American make that sacrifice of feeling hot and icky?" – Max [13:45]

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2. America’s “Fun Shortage”

[15:10 – 27:56]
Guest: Ben Steverman (Bloomberg Reporter)

• Definition of Fun:
  • Ben defines fun as shared experiences: vacations, going out, community events—real world, not screen-based activities.
  • "Fun needs to be shared to actually be something that’s lasting and fun." – Ben [16:21]

Key Points:

• Fun as a Scarce Commodity:
  • Traditional fun outlets (bars, restaurants, bowling alleys, golf courses, beachfront hotels) are in decline; demand is up, but supply and affordability are way down.
  • "There’s more people playing golf... Yet the number of golf courses is going way down. The number of bowling alleys is going down." – Max [17:49]
• Fun as a Luxury Good:
  • The price for many experiences has soared, making them inaccessible for younger people and the middle class.
  • "You have to either cut your vacation in half or just pay through the nose." – Ben [19:42]
• Changing ‘Third Places’:
  • Social spaces are moving toward solitary, transactional models (e.g., drive-thru coffee shops replacing community-building cafes).
  • "Many Starbucks... basically drive through windows. People just order on their phone and they, they don’t even interact with the person behind the counter." – Ben [21:23]
• Not Just About Booze:
  • Decline is not solely about reduced alcohol consumption: even fitness centers, golf, and communal activities struggle with supply constraints.

Societal Impact:

• Consequences of Less Fun:
  • European studies correlate the closure of communal venues (pubs, cafés) with increased far-right voting and political anger, suggesting that loss of shared spaces erodes social cohesion.
  • "In the villages and towns where those closures have happened, right wing voting goes up over time...is that something like that happening in America, too? We’re kind of shrinking into our homes. We feel less connected." – Ben [24:13]
• Seeking Solutions:
  • Even small acts, like popping bubble wrap in the office, measurably increase well-being—a playful nod that turns into a live experiment on air.
  • "I did discover this study from the 90s about bubble wrap. You pop bubble wrap, your level of stress and anxiety goes down and your feeling of well being goes up." – Stacey [25:35]
  • [Sound segment: hosts and Ben systematically popping bubble wrap, laughs and jokes about it being the “original TikTok.” [26:41]]

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3. Underrated Stories & Quirky News

[29:40 – 36:09]

Max's Pick: "Freedom Fuel" and Trump-Branded Gasoline

• The Trump administration touts a network of “Freedom Fuel” gas stations selling gasoline at below-market prices (tied to Trump’s 47th presidency).
  • "This is sort of Trump branded gasoline priced at a very trumpy price of $3.47 because he is the 47th president." – Max [33:06]
• Surprise: The actual price is about the same as local Costcos, raising suspicions about the promotion.
• Raises questions about political optics and blending of private business with public messaging.

Stacey's Pick: Skyscraper Evacuations and the Limits of Office-to-Apartment Conversions

• A dramatic evacuation at a retrofitted Midtown Manhattan building highlights the perils of converting commercial real estate into housing—a solution increasingly promoted in cities across America but riddled with engineering challenges.
  • "Conversions are more difficult than people are letting on. And I did hear from a couple of real estate people in New York saying that this is a really bad sign." – Stacey [34:54]

Max's Wry Solution: Data Center Apartments

• Jokingly suggests that today’s heated, oversupplied data centers might “one day” be converted for people to live in—a tongue-in-cheek sign-off tying together the energy and fun crises.

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Memorable Quotes & Lighter Moments

• On the ever-present heat:
  "Should we just become more copacetic about being sweaty?" – Max [12:48]
• On the surreal scene in London:
  "Everyone seems to have a tiny fan, like an electric fan, and just kind of blast. I saw a woman with like a fan this big on the subway yesterday." – Noreen [13:33]
• On parks as the last communal refuge:
  "There are tons of parks out there. You can go running, you can socialize..." – Max [27:13]
• On bubble wrap as a wellness hack:
  "This is like the original TikTok." – Stacey [25:35]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• [01:08] – Heatwaves, fun canceled, grid strain setup
• [04:04] – Noreen Malik on grid stress & impacts
• [09:41] – Are consumers now competing with data centers?
• [13:45] – “Shouldn’t the new users pay?” (energy infrastructure)
• [16:19] – Ben Steverman defines the “fun shortage”
• [19:42] – Is fun becoming a luxury good?
• [24:13] – Loss of fun and political anger
• [25:35] – Popping bubble wrap in the studio
• [29:40] – Underrated stories: Trump’s Freedom Fuel, building evacuation

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Takeaways

• America is facing compounding summer crises—climate-driven energy strain and a real shortage in accessible, social ‘fun.’
• The AI and data center boom, while powering economic growth, is worsening grid stress and fueling cost battles between private industry and the public.
• “Fun” is being priced out for many, with screen-mediated experiences replacing real-world socialization and potentially changing the fabric of society in subtle but important ways.
• Even small, playful acts (like popping bubble wrap) matter for morale and connectivity—a lighthearted reminder within a weighty episode.

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This summary captures the core conversations and themes. For listeners and business watchers, the struggle isn’t just to keep the lights on, but also to hold onto joy and connection in an era when both feel more rare—and more valuable—than ever.

Transcript

[A]

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[B]

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[C]

Bloomberg Audio Studios Podcasts, Radio News.

[D]

Stacey, I'm a little concerned. This studio that we're recording this episode of Everybody's Business in is, I'd say it's like 69, 70 degrees or something like that.

[C]

It's very cold.

[D]

It's cool. Maybe too cool.

[C]

Well, that's a good point. We are in New York where there have been lots of heat warnings and we have gotten a lot of encouragement to temper the coolness of our at home use.

[A]

Yeah.

[D]

Both for our grids and also for the data centers. We don't want to stop the AI companies from doing their the important work of building chatbots anyway. We'll have Noreen Malik, energy reporter with Bloomberg, taking with us to take a deep dive into the state of the world's energy grids and why combo of heat and the AI boom are putting them under strain.

[C]

Exactly. And another thing that I should say about this weather is it's really hard to get out and enjoy the summer when it is this hot. And as a matter of fact, this is not an isolated issue that we are having in this country. Apparently here in the US we have a fund deficit.

[D]

That's right, Stacey. Fund traders on Wall street have been, have been, you know, ringing the alarm bells. The fun markets are scarcity. Yeah. There's not enough fun in the world.

[C]

We're short on fun.

[D]

Getting more expensive. Sorry for all the Wall street metaphors. We're legally required to do that. But in any case, we have Bloomberg reporter Ben Steverman here to talk about why. Basically all of the fun things that one might want to do in the summer, go on a trip, go to the beach, send your kid to camp. They're all getting harder and more expensive. It is a bonafide fun Shortage.

[C]

Yes, fun. It's not for everybody. Can you afford fun, Max? It has been very hot here in New York.

[D]

It's hot now as we record this.

[C]

It's hot now. It's been hot like over the Fourth of July. I was invited to a barbecue. It got canceled for heat, which has never happened.

[D]

Everything is getting canceled for weather, Stacy, even for a brief moment now. I was out last week. You and Brad Stone were doing the Lord's work here on the Everybody's Business podcast. Even the Great American State Fair was briefly evacuated.

[C]

It sounded like it got pretty dramatic. Here's some tape. It sounds like a little more like War of the Worlds than a heat related evacuation. But apparently this is where we are in this world. But also, of course, this heat has huge implications beyond just this. We've got so much pressure on our grid right now. Both the heat wave, which has been going on all across the US but also data centers, and this is not just isolated to the US this is going on all over the place. And we are really lucky to have Noreen Malik, an energy reporter at Bloomberg who is based in London, dealing with heat of her own. Noreen, thanks for joining us.

[E]

Thanks for having me. Those screams sounded like they were watching a World cup game. I wasn't sure what was happening.

[D]

Well, yes, Andy, that was the sound of Belgium destroying the United. No, just.

[C]

Oh, Noreen, first of all, before we kind of dive into the particulars of this, talk to us a little bit about this summer so far and what we've seen in terms of weather and electricity and some of the challenges that are coming up.

[E]

Yeah, we've definitely seen some severe heat already on the east coast especially. And even when it wasn't that hot. And I mean like in the 80 degrees, low 80 degrees, we started to see signs of stress on the grid, especially around like Northern Virginia, which is part of a 13 state grid that stretches from like Chicago roughly to like North Carolina, the northern edge of it, and up to New Jersey and includes Washington, D.C. so we've seen stress more frequently in the last couple years, especially because you have a lot of data center demand growth there. It's growing so quickly that it is kind of like keeping an elevated demand around the clock. And then anytime you get a weather event, even if it's not that extreme, although in D.C. and Virginia it's like a swamp even when it's like 80 or 70 degrees. So I would consider that extreme. But you do see a significant ramp up in grid stress. And how this is manifested is you'll see like emergency postings on the grid operator saying this transformer, which is meant to like keep Voltage like flowing smoothly on a grid at safe levels. You'll start to put out alerts saying stress is popping up here and there. And then last week during the heat wave, we had PJM, the 13 state eastern grid, operate in an emergency situation. It was a low level emergency. It's meant to put everyone on, on like the right foot, like, hey, shore up your supplies, stop maintenance. Kind of like everyone has to be ready to serve demand. And even then you saw like power prices like jump to like hundreds of dollars or thousands of dollars per megawatt hour at a time when it's not supposed to be that stressed. These are becoming more frequent.

[D]

Noreen, you talked about the kind of how the grid operators experience these moments of stress. Like what does it mean for like a regular power consumer? Like, so I assume got these messages in New York, you know, that you get text messages from your utility saying like, you know, turn the air conditioning up or 78 degrees, which is kind of like that's like a standard thing they put out, it seems like every summer. But like what, what happens for consumers both in terms of kind of like what they're being asked to do, what they're paying outages, they might experience, that sort of thing.

[E]

Yeah, I mean we've definitely seen grid operators ask consumers to voluntarily conserve more in recent years. It really started in California in 2020 when they had blackouts. After that, Texas in 2021 when they had blackouts. And on the east coast, like New York and New England, they'll ask like utilities will say, like, hey, there's going to be high demand just in case, like power supplies on the east coast are constrained and much of the US are constrained because there's overall higher demand. So what it means is for consumers is one, you have to more proactively think about it. There are solutions. Like some thermostats will automatically like smart thermostats will automatically like pre cool your home so that like when it's like the middle of the day and there's a lot of solar, for instance, you can take advantage of like cheaper prices and pre cool your home. So there is like a behavioral change that is starting to happen. And it depends like utility by utility. What happened during the heat wave was like the grid operator was like, hey, like in New York State, the grid operator was like, supplies are straight tight across the entire grid. They put out an order to utilities and the utilities will ask skyscrapers in Manhattan to curtail. Now these guys, when they curtail, they're getting, getting often paid to like Dim the lights and run fewer elevators. But as a consumer, the programs aren't as developed. They're starting to increase. But like, you're not really getting compensated, so you're voluntarily doing this.

[D]

But then there you brought up the data centers, Noreen. And so how much of this is that, like, we are getting our electricity prices jacked up or being told to like, turn our, make our homes too warm? Because, like some meta engineer is doing a really awesome prompt right now on, you know, on Claude or whatever. Like, do we have any sense of how impactful these data centers are? I mean, I know that it's a subject of a lot of controversy and you have the industry is pushing in one direction, politicians in the other. Can you just sort of break it down for us or at least break down the different points of view on this?

[E]

Yeah, so as you said, this is super controversial and there's a big battle being fought over even just the perception of this. The truth is there is not much transparency. What we do know is I've talked to several like CEOs of like utilities and PJM and traders and across the gamut to understand this. And anytime you plop big demand into any area of the grid, if it's like Virginia or Ohio, where there's a lot of like people already living there and the grid may already be tight, then yes, it's going to overall increase prices. There's no way around it. I found it interesting in Europe, like when I went to like Finland or Lisbon for conferences. It is a natural assumption or it's, it's taken for granted that they bring in data centers. Your power prices are going to go up. That's like a given in the us this is like a battleground.

[C]

So does that mean that like we are competing against tech companies for energy because consumers are never going to have as much. But is, is this what's happening? Are like tech companies competing with regular consumers?

[E]

It's more like this grid had so much slack on the system, like 30, 40% spare capacity. And data center demand growth is the fastest growing demand. That's why we're like focused on them instead of like EVs and other electrification that takes like a decade to ramp up. So much has come online that it's like eaten up all the excess supply. And so now the grid is under stress in a couple of short years. We're facing a shortfall next year if things don't turn around in terms of demand projections. So on that level, it's not that the household is competing with it, but somebody has to pay for the new supply. And that's the battle that's being fought out is like, who's gonna pay for the new power plants needed for data centers? Because right now all costs are socialized. Like every time you build transmission lines and in some states you build power plants, it depends on your regulation. Then every consumer pays for a split of it. And so this is like, federal regulators are weighing in, and in the next, like, month and a half or so, we're going to see the grid operators share with the federal regulators how to split the cost and how to make sure data centers pay for it.

[C]

I know that utilities tend to be more expensive in other countries. I know you are. You're in London. And I believe utilities are more expensive there. And I know in, like, continental Europe, they're more expensive. Is the US Moving more towards a European model where energy just costs more because more things are kind of baked into those costs, or is this a totally different situation?

[E]

I think there's a lot of the same stressors. The difference with the US Is there is plentiful gas. And it feels like a lot of the push towards zero carbon energy is, like, not really being talked about, even though the hyperscalers say they're really committed to it. So the US does have a lot of energy. It's a matter of delivering it to the right places and then maybe increasingly converting it to electricity. In Europe, they seem to be very committed to zero carbon energy and trying to, like, take a more considered approach to, like, how do you integrate them, these data centers? They want them for digital sovereignty, for national security, economic reasons, but they also really want it to be clean energy. So on that level, like, that's where they bifurcate is like, can you have a US that's very fossil fuel and increasingly fossil fuel focused, like, pursue that strategy and, like, keep prices low for everyone versus, like Europe, which sees, like, its advantage as solar as keeping prices lower, plus batteries. So I think the problem statement is the same across them. They're moving at different paces. And so what happens in the US could become lessons learned for Europe. Like, people are moving much faster in the US with the data center boom, and that's making all the difference right now.

[D]

Should we just become more copacetic about being sweaty?

[E]

Yeah, I don't know. I mean, in New York City, I don't know if you've noticed. I've never paid attention to the dew point, but the dew point has been a big issue the last few years.

[C]

What is the dew point?

[D]

It's like, it's like humidity.

[E]

Oh, yeah. It's like. It's not humidity. It's like the temperature of like when sweat evaporates is higher. So even if it's like humid and the temperatures aren't that high at like 70, the high dew point makes you feel like it's 90. So that has gotten worse. And that is like a whole other level of suffering we've seen in New York, in London. I've seen something I haven't seen anywhere, which is like everyone seems to have a tiny fan, like an electric fan, and just kind of blast.

[C]

It's. They take with them everywhere.

[E]

Yeah. On the subway, I saw a woman with like a fan this big on the subway yesterday or the tube yesterday.

[D]

Normally I just made a gesture as. As large as a basketball face like a basketball. Yeah, basketball.

[E]

Yeah. It was surprising. I had no idea how she fit it in her bag. So that might be what our future looks like is that everyone just carries like a personal fan now. So the argument is like, shouldn't the new users be the ones paying for the new infrastructure instead of having the average American make that sacrifice of feeling hot and icky.

[D]

Noreen Malik, thank you for joining us.

[C]

Thanks, Noreen.

[A]

Thank you.

[E]

Stay cool.

[A]

Modern enterprise has a lot of moving parts. Comcast business helps you orchestrate it all with SD WAN working at scale to keep 150 hospital locations connected and working as one. Plus SASE and Zero Trust Security, protecting financial data across a bank's 2,000 branches, and AI powered networking that optimizes traffic across five continents. No one does business like Comcast Business.

[F]

Max.

[C]

We live in a world that is really good at telling us what just happened, but not always so great at explaining why it matters.

[D]

That's what we do every Friday on everybody's business each week, Stacey. We take the biggest stories in business markets and the global economy and slow them down, adding the context you need to actually understand what's going on.

[C]

And if you want even more of that reporting and insight, a Bloomberg subscription gives you unlimited access to the journalism behind those stories.

[D]

Subscribe [e-mail] podcastoffer I was reading the pages of Bloomberg recently. I learned some disturbing news. We've been talking about all sorts of sort of supply constraints and shortages, tariffs, war, oil prices, tariffs, the oil price, the chip shortage, and so on. There is a shortage I think we were all aware of, but I had not. No one had put their finger on

[C]

Tell me what a fun shortage.

[D]

A shortage of fun.

[C]

There's not enough fun in Your life.

[D]

There's not enough fun in this world, at least according to our guest, Ben Steven, who is a reporter here at Bloomberg, who joins us now. Ben, how are you?

[G]

I'm doing great.

[D]

Ben, what is the fun shortage?

[G]

What are you talking about when I'm talking about. My definition of fun in is shared experiences with others.

[C]

So that is a good definition.

[G]

Vacation with family, going out on a Friday night with friends, just even small talk with strangers, kind of interacting with people in your community. You know, if you talk to happiness researchers, the fun that really matters, that changes your life is not like scrolling through TikTok. In fact, that makes you just more bored and like.

[D]

And more unhappy.

[G]

Yeah, like fun. Fun needs to be shared to actually be something that's lasting and fun.

[C]

Okay, so I was laughing when you said happiness researchers, but your article has a lot of data in it. So how do you know there's a happiness shortage?

[G]

Well, first of all, if you just ask people about their life satisfaction, and there's a world happiness report that a bunch of academics, like serious people put together every year from more than 140 countries, if you ask people about their happiness in the United States, our happiness has gone down steadily for, like, 15 years. Oh, most of the rest of the world is actually getting happier, despite the fact that they are online just as much as we are in most countries, in a lot of countries. So something's going on there. Like, when you analyze how Americans are spending their days or time, we're interacting face to face a lot less than we used to.

[C]

True.

[G]

And we're looking at screens a lot more. I spent a lot of time this year, you know, last couple months, just sort of looking at what are the places and. And activities that actually bring people together and get them out in the world. Like, how do you get people out of their homes? How do you tempt them to, like, go do things together? And I really believe that the supply that's available of fun activities, the industries that provide it, the supp is shrinking and the demand is at a peak.

[D]

So you go through a lot of this in the story, but bars and restaurants on the decline, lots of sort of outdoorsy things are popular, but also constrained in terms of supply. There's more people playing golf than, like, what in the. Sometime in the last, like, 15 or 20 years. And yet the number of golf courses is going way down. The number of bowling alleys is going down. Like, a lot of these places where people congregate, where people have fun, there are fewer of them. And, you know, Supply and demand. The natural sort of consequences of that is a lot of them are getting more expensive. So you have this sense that like, if you want to go on vacation, you want to send your kid to a summer camp, you want to go to a show, you're going to be

[G]

spending a lot of money, you want

[C]

to go on a road trip, even just something as simple. Or take your kids to whatever, a amusement park.

[G]

Yeah, exactly. I was surprised to learn that it was like, there's no beachfront hotels being built in America today. A new one just opened and it was like such a rare event that Bloomberg did a story about it.

[C]

Where was it?

[G]

Florida, I can't remember. But like, it's so hard to build new stuff. And because of interest rates, well, construction costs have gone up, interest rates have gone up. There's also just like a lot of the places you would want to put this stuff is already taken up because maybe a billionaire owns, has built a mansion there. There's just like we are geographically constrained and then we're also financially constrained in terms of how much fun we can provide people.

[C]

Our producer Jasmine made an interesting point that it seems like fun might be becoming kind of a luxury good. And you make this point in your piece that like a lot of sort of entertainment and diversions are free, but they tend to be on screens. And then a lot of the kind of experiential stuff that gets you out in the world, get you interacting in real life is costing more. Is there, is there something to that? Is there like a K shaped fun economy?

[G]

Yes, I think there definitely is. Like you have people at the top who actually can afford 600, $700 a night for the vacation rental that used to cost $350. Like I've seen this happen with like the beach locations that I used to love. And like, they're just so expensive. So you have to cut, either cut your vacation in half or just pay through the nose. But there are people in this, in America today who can afford that. If you look at just the amount of wealth that's been created in the last decade, there can do that. And then the people who get squeezed out, I think are first of all lower income or even middle class people, but then also young people who are at the beginning of their career and they're like, well, I can't go out and pay $20 for a cocktail. I we're going to stay home and like, you know, watch Netflix or whatever instead.

[D]

So one thing that I was wondering as I was reading this story is Kind of like, how do you untangle trends? And there are fewer bowling alleys, but I'm guessing there are more gyms, there are fewer bars, but there are more coffee shops than there were 20 years ago. And so is it that we have like fewer of these, you know, like third place type places or that they're just changing?

[G]

That's a really good question. I think that they, to the extent that they're changing, they're changing to places that allow less kind of face to face and community time together. So talk about coffee shops. We've had this shift in coffee shops from like Starbucks, which was never a very social place, into the.

[C]

It was more social.

[G]

It was more social than the drive through coffee shop, which is the new trend now.

[D]

Well, and that's the thing. Even Starbucks, there are tons of Starbucks, but many of them look like what you just described. They're basically drive through windows.

[G]

People just order on their phone and they, they don't even interact with the person behind the counter. There's more gyms, there's more fitness centers. But, like, are you interacting with that many people? Some people do, some people don't. But nightlife in America per capita is like a third of the size it was when I was born in the late 70s. Like, that's incredible that we've lost that much of sort of bars and clubs where people just kind of let loose and had fun. Yeah.

[D]

I just wonder if we're more talking about drinking. Oh, like, yeah, like drinking is like, are we. Is this just like a, a way of, of talking about the decline of alcohol consumption or something like that?

[C]

Max wants to have a beer and go bowling. I think this is, this is what I'm hearing because a lot of these

[D]

new places, like a lot of what you're describing is sort of like drinking culture. And a lot of the new places are like, not about drinking in one way or another.

[G]

I see what you're saying.

[D]

Yeah.

[G]

I mean, the weird thing about that is that drinking is actually like, has declined a little bit among young people recently, mostly because I think they're doing edibles instead. But it's actually at a. Like, we are drinking a lot. We're just drinking at home.

[D]

And if that doesn't sound great.

[G]

Yeah, so I've written, I've written about that too. Like, Americans drink something like only 15% of their drinks are actually out in public. And if you look at like Spain, it's more than half. So like, people don't. Aren't drinking together. They're not getting together. For this kind of shared experiences. Now, nightlife is an obsession of mine, but I was surprised to see sort of the same trends when we're talking about golf or country clubs or things that I'm, like, not interested in, you know, like pickleball, too. Like, pickleball has gotten so much more popular, and I think that's mostly about demand, but then it's crowding out basketball and golf, which are also getting more popular. So what I think is new in this piece as well is them saying that I do think that there is evidence that people want to get out. Like, there's this assumption, I think, among some of the people who focus on our loneliness epidemic that it's all kind of our fault and that we just are stuck on our screens. We can't get out anymore, and we don't want to go out. We just want to stay there because it's safe or something. But, like, I'm looking at a lot of this data on travel trends and fitness trends and things like that, and people do seem to want to get out. It's just that when they go out or when they look for a vacation spot, they're just hitting these constraints and these barriers.

[C]

What is the problem here? So we're having less fun is like, why is this bad? What happens when we lose fun?

[G]

There were a couple studies out of Europe that were really intriguing to me. They analyzed the closure of pubs in the UK And Bartabach in France. Bartabac are like.

[D]

I don't know if you're like, a bar, coffee shop, but you can also, like, buy cigarettes. Cigarettes there.

[G]

And you can, like, make a bet.

[C]

It's like a bodega meets a coffee shop.

[G]

Yeah. So in the villages and towns where those closures have happened, right wing voting goes up over time. Much of, like, conservative voting. I mean, like, the nationalist rally party, like the. The far right, gets many more votes in the decades after that happens. And what's going on there? I don't know. Like, you could have different theories, but one is, like, people are just interacting less face to face. They feel less connected to communities. They also feel more left behind, I think, in those communities. And you kind of wonder, is that something like that happening in America, too? We're kind of shrinking into our homes. We feel less connected. We feel more left behind. We get angrier. We're like, you look at, like, consumer sentiment data, which we've talked about on this podcast, like, people are really kind of mad. Not just sad, not just unhappy, but, like, angry. What's going on there. And I think it might be that we're just like having less enjoying. We're enjoying our time together less and we're spending less time together.

[C]

After I read your article, Ben, I was thinking and I was like, what's something that like you can do in the office that's fun? Cause I feel like a lot of us are in offices. And I also, I appreciated the rigor you brought to your article. Like, you know, and so I, I started to look around and see like what actually measurably increases fun that can be done like inside in an office now. And I did discover this, this study from the 90s about bubble wrap. And apparently, yes, this is like the original TikTok. You pop bubble wrap, your like level of stress and anxiety goes down and your feeling of well being goes up. So I actually, so that we could increase the joy in this room, Daisy,

[D]

is like finding opportunities that we did not even know you could open. Like a franchise where people get together and instead of drinking or dancing or bowling or drinking, you know, whatever, they just pop bubble wrap.

[C]

Well, we can see if it works. I mean we're like together face to face. There's not a screen. So we can see if it actually works.

[D]

Ben. Ben's face. This is a lot of. Oh, he's really going to town on the bubble wrap. I've never seen anyone hot bubble wrap. It's such a. Both of you just very systematically. Well, I'm going one.

[G]

It's like the way I eat corn.

[D]

You know where I find fun is in parks and the like. And I know that the parks are more crowded and everything, but they're still

[C]

barely touched your bubble.

[D]

There are tons of parks out there. You can go running, you can socialize us.

[G]

I keep hearing you could bring bubble

[C]

wrap to the park.

[G]

We're going to be less depressing. I was just going to say that. Like, I keep hearing horror stories about how crowded the national parks are, but

[D]

I think that's true for the like,

[G]

the glamour parks, the like, you know,

[D]

Grand Canyon and so on. But there are like little smaller state and local parks that are, I don't know my experience anyway.

[G]

Yeah, I mean, I think, you know, we had a party two weeks ago at our apartment. Like just hosting a party or going to a house party. Like there's nothing better than, than that in my opinion.

[C]

Well, Ben, thank you for coming to talk about fun with us. I feel like the discussion got very heavy, but it was really fun.

[G]

It was, it was fun to see

[D]

you guys because they're we're socializing.

[C]

Yeah, that's true. With bubble wrap.

[E]

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[H]

Summer is here at Orderly Meds. We know this time is a reminder that life is a full of new beginnings. Whether you're celebrating the nice weather, starting a new chapter, planning a vacation, or simply looking ahead to what's next, this season can be the perfect time to invest in yourself and your health. If you've struggled with weight loss and are curious about GLP1 medications, orderly meds can help you learn about your options. Through a simple virtual process, you can connect with licensed medical professionals who can determine whether treatment may be appropriate for you. Getting started is fast, convenient, and happens online from the comfort of home. This summer, consider a new approach to feeling your best. Visit orderlymeds.com podcast to learn more. That's orderlymeds.com podcast orderlymeds.com podcast because every new season is an opportunity to take the next step forward, Compounded medications are not FDA approved, eligibility required and determined by a licensed provider. Individual results may vary. Website for details.

[C]

Max Chaffkin it is now that time in the show when we have fun and talk about our underrated stories of the week.

[D]

You know, they don't have to be fun, Stacy. They can be serious. But.

[C]

But that's true.

[D]

But this story I found at least a little bit amusing. So I don't know if you've been paying attention to President Trump's Truth Social as closely as I do, but he has been touting a new effort to lower gas prices. We've been talking about gas prices on this show all the time. Even a big issue right now because as the sort of tensions in the Strait of Hormuz heat up again, and it appears, at least as we're recording this on Thursday, July 9, that the Strait is once again closed. But. But don't worry, we have a new effort touted by the White House and President Trump coming to the rescue. Let me just play you a little, okay?

[B]

I saved money.

[D]

I had to go back in and get my change.

[C]

I thought gas was more Expensive, but it's not. So thanks, Trump, for saving me some money.

[D]

We're here at the first Freedom Fuel Network gas station right here in Philadelphia, leading the charge to lower gas prices. $3.47. That's for our 47th president, President Donald J. Trump. Freedom Fuel.

[C]

Stacy, what is Freedom Fuel? Please illuminate us. Wait, no one knows. What is this? Is this like a state sponsored gas station?

[D]

What is this? Is according to the White House, a new company that is operating a private company that operates 25 gas stations in Pennsylvania and New Jersey that is selling gas for $3.47, which they say is lower, between 40 and 50 cents lower than the average price in Philadelphia. In Pennsylvania and New Jersey, the state prices, it's a little bit like the Mamdani grocery store thing, but with gas.

[C]

Oh, right. We should say that Mamdani has talked about opening state sponsored grocery stores with lower food prices. And so this is like sort of

[D]

an equivalent, sort of a cross between that and the one we talked about a couple of weeks ago, that is in Atlanta. It's sort of a cross between the state sponsored grocery store and Trump Steaks or like one of, or Trump cologne which we have discussed on this show before. One of these kind of like Trump branded products. This is sort of Trump branded gasoline priced at a very trumpy price of $3.47 because he is the 47th president. And it is also to sort of I guess say that like the Trump administration is doing its part to lower gas prices. There are a whole bunch of issues here. One of which is these prices, although low, are basically the same as the price at Costco right now. In the area, in the areas BJ's, there are other gasoline discount that, that sell gas for a very similar price. So I think it's, it's being oversold to some extent. There are also some questions about who exactly owns this thing. So yeah. So unlike with the state sponsored grocery stores in New York or Atlanta, the Trump administration, the White House has said there is no, there are no subsidies going and this is a totally private thing. Does raise a question given that President Trump has a very large portfolio of private businesses, many of which have, have done very well during his presidency. Who own, who owns.

[C]

Do we know what does the company have a name or do we know?

[D]

Freedom Fuel, Stacey?

[C]

Oh, Freedom. It's like Freedom Fuel Inc.

[D]

It's like Freedom Fries, but for your gasoline. Stacey, what's your underrated story?

[C]

So my underrated story sounds hyper local, but I would argue is of national Concern, which is that earlier this week in New York, there was a building that was evacuated in midtown, right by Grand Central Station, right in the center of New York, the. A very dense part of New York. Apparently, they were retrofitting this building. It's a building that's been there forever, I think, since the 60s. And they were changing it from an office building to an apartment building, and they started to see it buckling, and they. They realized the core of the building was, like, buckling. And so they evacuated everyone. They evacuated all these people around the streets, and there was all this worry that the building was gonna collapse.

[D]

I mean, that's really scary. This is like nightmare fuel. A building collapse is not too.

[C]

It's a really dense area. Absolutely. Here is where what I think is really interesting. So this is the. Was one of the largest ever building conversions. And of course, here in New York, we see this, but this is happening all over the country, which is the need for office space is just decreased a lot, and the need for housing has increased a lot. So one of the big solutions that was supposed to sort of solve these two issues was like, well, why don't we take all these empty office buildings and just turn them into apartment buildings? And, of course, it's turned out that that's a lot harder than you might think, because office buildings are built, like,

[D]

they have a lot of depth, and they are weird. They're weird because of the. Because of shapes are weird. The point you're making, like, you end up with these bedrooms with these spectacular, you know, all glass walls, essentially, and then internal rooms, kitchens and so on

[C]

that are basically dark, enveloped in darkness. And so I. I think this is potentially an issue here that, like, what sounds like perfect solution to these two really difficult problems. And here in New York, you see empty storefronts all the time. And it's heartbreaking because the housing's so expensive. There's all this open space. But I think the conversions are more difficult than people are letting on. And I did hear from a couple of real estate people in New York saying that this is a really bad sign, that investors are watching this and wondering if this means that this solution, which seemed pretty perfect, might be in for some trouble.

[D]

Okay, so here's my pitch for you, Stacey. Okay, this data center, boom. It cannot go on forever. I mean, we are living through the most clearly a bubbly moment in AI and one way or another, we talked about it with Noreen, you know, the electricity prices. One way or another, we're not going to need all these data centers. So maybe people could live in them.

[C]

People could live at the data centers in the data.

[D]

We'll take out all the chips and just build housing.

[C]

How is this a solution, though? Because I don't think they have any windows in a theater.

[D]

Yeah, I mean, no, some drawbacks, undoubtedly.

[C]

It just, you know, it's like when they do wear like convert warehouses into apartments sometimes, like, they're really awesome and they have really high ceilings. But also you're like, this feels like a warehouse.

[D]

This show is Produced by Jasmine J.T. green and Stacy Wong. Magnus Henriksen is our supervising producer. Sam Rogich handles engineering and Dave Purcell fact checks. Special thanks to Jeff Muskus, Julia Rubin, Julia Press and Maria Ling. If you have a minute, please rate and review the show. It'll mean a lot to us. And if you have a story that should be our business, email us@everybody's bloomberg.net that's everybody with an S. Bloomberg.net Thank you for listening and we will see you next week.

[F]

The Wired newsroom is known for award winning reporting on how technology shapes our world. On WIRED's Uncanny Valley, we take that curiosity even further. Each week, journalists from Wired break down the biggest stories in tech while speaking directly with the people building, challenging and reshaping the future. Is the AI boom sustainable? How do you protect your privacy in an age of constant surveillance? Uncanny Valley tackles the questions driving today's tech debates and lighting up your group chats. Listen to new episodes every Thursday. Wherever you get your podcasts.