Emergency Episode: Everything and Nothing Has Changed For Trump's Tariffs

Everybody's Business – February 20, 2026
Host: Stacey Vanek Smith
Guest: Jonathan Lieberman, President of New York Customs Brokers

Episode Overview

This emergency episode responds to the breaking Supreme Court decision striking down former President Trump’s global tariffs mechanisms. Host Stacey Vanek Smith speaks with Jonathan Lieberman, a seasoned customs broker specializing in seafood imports, to unpack the immediate fallout, legal ambiguities, and operational chaos following the ruling—revealing that, despite the historic verdict, little has changed for importers on the ground.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Role and Stakes for Customs Brokers

[01:50–03:21]

• Customs Broker Defined: Jonathan describes brokers as the “glorified middlemen” for importers, analogous to accountants or lawyers in their respective domains.
• Seafood Imports: His firm mainly moves high-value seafood; a shipping container can range from $100k (shrimp, salmon) to $500k (lobster tails, Chilean sea bass).

2. How Lieberman Heard the News

[03:36–04:26]

• Supreme Court Alert Ritual: Lieberman set up real-time news alerts, including a “Judge Dredd” soundbite (“I am the law”) to signal Supreme Court updates.

“As soon as the Supreme Court published the news and their opinion on the matter, I had a sound bite pop up on my phone saying, ‘I am the law.’” — Jonathan Lieberman [04:12]

• Immediate Response: Initial shock, then immediate action: downloading the opinion and notifying clients within minutes.

3. What the Supreme Court Decision Actually Changes

[05:32–07:55]

• Legal vs. Operational Reality:
  • Legal: The Supreme Court ruled Trump’s tariffs, imposed through the IPA, were unlawful.
  • Operational: No immediate change. Customs has not updated tariff codes. The Federal Register is silent. President Trump himself claims “nothing has changed,” but announced a new 10% global tariff under Section 122.
• Tariff Layering:
  • Importers potentially face both old tariffs (reciprocal duties, Section 301 for China) and the new emergency 10%.

  “At the end of today, absolutely nothing has changed.” — Jonathan Lieberman [05:32]

4. Refunds, Uncertainty, and Legal Limbo

[07:55–12:20]

• Refund Dilemma:

  • Common sense and legal precedent (“if something was done illegally, I go straight to jail”) suggest importers should get reimbursed.
  • However, as Trump points out, the Supreme Court’s opinion is silent on refunds; the administration is prepared to fight payouts in court for years.

  “President Trump has already said that… he’s going to be fighting this in court for the next five years.” — Jonathan Lieberman [08:35]

• Administrative Overload:

  • If refunds become possible, brokers would need to file amendments for tens of thousands of entries—a “year’s worth of work” to redo, on top of everyday business.

  “Unfathomable amounts of work that I don’t know how we’re going to complete in a timely manner.” — Jonathan Lieberman [11:28]

• Implementation Kicked Down the Road:

  • The Supreme Court punts implementation to the Court of International Trade (CIT); until CIT and Customs act, the pre-existing state of play continues.
  • “State of limbo” for clients, who are already flooding Lieberman with refund questions.

5. Personal Impact and Industry Turmoil

[12:20–13:53]

• Disrupted Work-Life Balance:
  • Lieberman laments that after 12 uneventful years, his 13th year “is an entirely different career.” Now, he’s “playing lawyer… trade consultant… therapist” for clients.

  “Now in my 13th year… I’m playing lawyer, I’m playing trade consultant, and I’m also half the time playing therapist for my customers.” — Jonathan Lieberman [13:28]

6. Looking Ahead: 2026 and Beyond

[13:53–16:30]

• Short-term:

  • Expect the emergency Section 122 tariff to be layered on for (up to) the next 150 days—no Congressional oversight required.
  • Ongoing legal ambiguity; refunds for possibly $130–250B in over-collected tariffs may require years of litigation—potentially by importers themselves, one by one.

• Long-term:

  • If the Court of International Trade enforces the Supreme Court’s decision, reciprocal duties under IPA cannot continue; but actual refunds remain in limbo, and political resistance looks stiff.

“President Trump made it pretty clear: ‘I’m not giving back money. Oh, because they didn’t say it in the Supreme Court opinion, we’re going to, it’s going to go through the courts for the next several years.’” — Jonathan Lieberman [15:38]

Memorable Moments & Notable Quotes

• On the Absurdity of the Situation:

  “If I do something illegally, I go straight to jail. But in this case, we’re being told by the Supreme Court that what was done was incorrect... But refunds? Unclear.” — Jonathan Lieberman [08:19]

• On Client Frustration:

  “While I’m on the phone with you, I’ve missed two calls from customers. And they’re all asking the same thing… ‘When can I file for refunds? And what does this mean tomorrow?’” — Jonathan Lieberman [10:31–10:39]

• On Administrative Nightmares:

  “We have to refile all of the entries that we filed since more or less April of last year… many, many, many thousands… tens of thousands.” — Jonathan Lieberman [11:07–11:21]

• On New Tariffs:

  “Immediately, right off the bat… they’re going to start charging an extra 10% using Section 122… for 150 days.” — Jonathan Lieberman [14:17]

Key Timestamps

• 01:50–03:21: Jonathan Lieberman explains customs brokerage and seafood import economics.
• 04:12: The “Judge Dredd” soundbite signals Supreme Court decision.
• 05:32: “At the end of today, absolutely nothing has changed.”
• 07:55–08:45: The refund and legal limbo explained.
• 10:31: Clients calling urgently for answers.
• 11:21: Scope of the administrative task if refunds are allowed: “tens of thousands” of filings.
• 13:28: Lieberman on his new, chaotic role.
• 14:17: Immediate 10% emergency tariff outlined.
• 15:38: Trump’s stance on refunds and ongoing court battles.

Conclusion

Despite the Supreme Court’s dramatic decision, the reality for importers is “everything and nothing has changed.” Tariffs aren’t repealed overnight; bureaucracy, presidential countermeasures, and legal inertia ensure a long, chaotic road ahead—one that will keep brokers, importers, and businesses guessing for months (or years) to come.