From the Phone Screen to the Silver Screen

Summary

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Everybody’s Business: "From the Phone Screen to the Silver Screen"

Podcast by Bloomberg & iHeartPodcasts | Hosts: Max Chafkin & Stacey Vanek Smith
Date: June 5, 2026

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Episode Overview

This episode explores the surprising resilience and transformation of the summer movie season in 2026, highlighting how new talent and unconventional hits are redefining what draws audiences back to theaters post-pandemic. The show also discusses changing etiquette inside theaters and the broader experience economy. The first half covers breaking international and economic news, notably the prolonged US-Iran conflict and its global market implications.

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Key Segments & Insights

1. Economic Fallout of the US-Iran Conflict

Guest: Javier Blas, Bloomberg Opinion Columnist
(Starts at 02:05)

Discussion Points

• Conflict Duration & Economic Surprises
  • The Strait of Hormuz has remained closed far longer than expected, yet global oil prices are relatively contained.
  • China’s drastic reduction (40%) in oil imports played a pivotal, unforeseen stabilizing role.
• Strategic Oil Reserves
  • Western nations tapped strategic oil reserves much faster than in previous crises, helping stabilize markets.
  • The oil industry is more flexible/sophisticated than in previous decades, able to adjust production/refining quickly.
• Broader Impacts
  • Despite no full-blown crisis, US gas prices remain above $4/gallon, impacting inflation, interest rates, and political calculations.

Notable Quotes

• “It will imply an economic shock of the size that the central banks will have to intervene... I cannot see this lasting 60 days... The White House will call it over a lot earlier.” — Javier Blas on his earlier predictions (04:25)
• "We do not understand how China is exactly doing it, and we don't understand the motivations of Beijing to do it other than probably self-preservation." — Javier Blas (06:28)
• "It's like the numbers don't make sense... I cannot account for when you put it together..." — On confusion within the oil industry over Chinese import cuts (09:41)
• "In some ways, Beijing is bailing out President Trump. And then the question is why? And in exchange for what?" — Javier Blas (11:10)

Timestamps

• 02:05 — Setting up the current state of the US-Iran conflict
• 04:24 — Revisiting Javier’s initial predictions
• 05:09 — How the oil market and China’s imports changed everything
• 10:00 — The knock-on effects on US policy, markets, and political calculations

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2. Summer Movie Season: A New Golden Age?

Panel: Max, Stacey, Lucas Shaw (Bloomberg media/entertainment), plus NYC moviegoer vox pops
(Segment begins at 17:40; main discussion at 20:00)

Discussion Points

• Moviegoer Trends
  • Audiences are returning to theaters, particularly young people and families.
  • Movie-going is still hampered by high costs—many opt to wait for streaming releases.
• Box Office Surprises
  • Low-budget horror films Backrooms and Obsession, from first-time YouTube-rooted directors, have combined to earn $266 million.
  • These films defied franchise-dominated trends and outperformed established studio releases.
• Hollywood’s Shifting Calculus
  • Horror remains the only non-franchise genre consistently performing well.
  • Not all hits are original IP—video game adaptations and social media-origin stories are ascendant.
  • There’s a resurgence of the "middle class" of movies—solid hits that aren’t mega-franchises.
• Industry Take
  • While blockbusters and sequels still dominate, the success of new blood hints at creative renewal.
  • Studios and theaters have a fresh opportunity to engage young audiences by focusing on the in-person, group experience.

Notable Quotes

• “For a long time, as fewer and fewer movies get made... the big franchises, the sequels, mindless recreation... was taking over the industry. And then this summer, you have two pretty unknown directors... It seems kind of exciting, like this new kind of creative possibility.” — Stacey Vanek Smith (23:01)
• "Backrooms opened north of $80 million... more than doubled A24's previous biggest opening." — Lucas Shaw (21:48)
• "Is it this sense of more sort of mid sized movies? Is that what's ultimately like helping the box office numbers?" — Max Chafkin (25:46)
• "I do think that there are different types of stories breaking out... some are original, some of them are IP. And it's exciting just that people want to go to the movies at all." — Lucas Shaw (25:36)

Timestamps

• 18:22 — NYC moviegoers share what they're excited to see
• 20:12 — Lucas Shaw joins, analyzes the horror boom and YouTube to Hollywood pipeline
• 21:08 — Why Backrooms and Obsession became runaway hits

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3. Theater Etiquette in a Post-COVID Era

Panel and Vox Pops
(Main segment at 26:47)

Discussion Points

• Phone Use in Theaters
  • Phone use is up; audience tolerance varies—quick photo, ok, but scrolling at max brightness remains taboo.
  • Behaviors (clapping, gasping, boisterousness) are heightened, perhaps from pent-up energy post-COVID.
• Comparisons to Live Theater
  • In live theater, phone use is still much more frowned upon (notable example: Rosamund Pike’s onstage frustration in London).
• Industry Perspective
  • Theaters need to position themselves as real-life gathering spots, creating experiences appealing enough to pull people away from their devices.

Notable Quotes

• “I will take my phone out to take a picture of the title and then put it away.” — Moviegoer (27:17)
• “I'm really upset when people beside me... are like, max brightness phone use.” — Max Chafkin (27:24)
• "As long as studios make the right movies and theaters create experiences that kids actually want to be at." — Lucas Shaw (29:18)

Timestamps

• 27:17 — Moviegoers discuss evolving in-theater habits
• 29:27 — Discussion of phone etiquette vs. experience economy

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4. Art Heists and the Shadow Market

Guest: Matt Campbell, Businessweek Correspondent, Author
(Begins at 33:54)

Discussion Points

• Fresh Jewel Heist at the Louvre
  • Recent major robbery in France; authorities closing in on perpetrators, little info on artifact recovery.
• Art Theft Industry
  • Both opportunistic and commissioned thefts are common; robust global "dark supply chain."
• Cambodian Looting (New Book Highlight)
  • Industrial-scale theft of priceless sculptures moved from Cambodian ruins to New York and prestigious institutions like the MET.

Notable Quotes

• "What is kind of amazing is the frequency with which [art theft] happens... Every time there is an armed conflict... the museum gets cleaned out." — Matt Campbell (36:17)
• "This is a story that begins in... jungles in northwest Cambodia... and ends at the corner of Fifth Avenue and 80th street." — Matt Campbell (38:03)

Timestamps

• 33:54 — The latest French art heist examined
• 37:09 — Cambodian art looting and America’s role

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Memorable & Amusing Moments

• The running joke on “nacho” (Not A Chance Hormuz Opens) and political wordplay on Middle East crisis acronyms, poking fun at policy predictions. (12:12)
• Max’s speculative defense of George Santos’ "insider trading" on prediction markets: "Maybe this is an emotional hedge... it's a win either way." (32:16)
• Lucas Shaw’s "official" title as Bloomberg’s "party pooper" tied to LinkedIn. (20:15)

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Essential Quotes & Segment Map

| Segment | Speaker | Quote | Timestamp | |---------|---------|-------|-----------| | US-Iran Oil Trade | Javier Blas | "We do not understand how China is exactly doing it... probably self-preservation." | 06:28 | | Summer Movies | Stacey Vanek Smith | "It seems kind of exciting, like this new kind of creative possibility." | 23:01 | | Theatrical Etiquette | Max Chafkin | "I'm really upset, like when people beside me ... are like, max brightness phone use." | 27:24 | | Art Heists | Matt Campbell | "What is kind of amazing is the frequency with which this happens..." | 36:17 |

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Episode Takeaways

• Geopolitics & the Economy: The persistence of global shocks (with unpredictable actors like China) means assumptions from previous crises don’t always hold.
• Entertainment Is Evolving: The movie business is bouncing back, but with new rules—YouTube-to-Hollywood pipelines, the rebirth of "mid-sized" hits, and evolving etiquette in public space.
• Cultural Value: Art and artifacts remain at risk—not only from thieves, but from global demand and shifting cultural priorities.
• Experience Economy: Despite tech, the urge to gather in person—at movies, concerts, and events—is alive and driving business resurgence.

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For more context and behind-the-scenes coverage, subscribe to the Everybody’s Business podcast, and catch Matt Campbell’s book for a deep dive into the world of global art theft.

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Transcript

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Bloomberg Audio Studios Podcasts, Radio news.

[C]

I will take my phone out to take a picture of the title and then put it away.

[A]

Definitely put it away and don't look at it.

[B]

I'm really upset like when people beside me or something are like max brightness phone use. So this is everybody's business where we assure you we are not going to have a trillion dollar ipo. I'm Max Chapkin.

[C]

And I'm Stacey Vanek Smith and today

[B]

summer movie season is red hot. New talent, big risks and strange behavior in the movie theater.

[A]

One of the strengths underpinning what we often call the experience economy, which is going to concerts and sporting events and anything kind of out of the house is okay. Kids in particular spend so much time on their dev, but movie theaters would seem to have an opportunity to create and pitch themselves as opportunities for friends to gather. Right?

[C]

But first we are checking in on the war with Iran and we have the great Javier Blas with us.

[D]

The state of Hormuz remains closed. China has reduced its oil imports. We don't know if there is a deal under the table between the Communist Party in China and the White House. So here we are 40 days later than my 60 days Armageddon. They are all still around.

[C]

The conflict, the fallout and what things look like 100 days in. That is coming up after the break.

[B]

Javier Blass, Bloomberg Opinion columnist Stacey he joined our show three months ago. Basically six days into the conflict between the US and Iran. the time, pretty much everybody assumed that it couldn't last that much longer. We're three months in now. Strait of Hormuz is closed. Fuel prices are much, much higher than they were. And a question that you and I, and pretty much everyone I know has been asking is, is this normal? Is this, is this just the way it's going to be? Are we going to be paying 450 for gas? And, and this kind of tension in the Strait of Hormuz forever?

[C]

Yes. And, you know, it seemed the conflict's gone on so much longer than I think anybody thought it would, and gas prices have obviously gone up quite a bit. And there has been a big economic impact, but maybe not the economic impact we would have thought six days into the conflict. So we wanted to have Javier back to talk about what's happened up until now and what he sees happening right now, because it feels like we've been hearing the conflict's about to end for 100 days, roughly. Hi, Javier.

[D]

Hi. Thank you for having me again.

[C]

Thank you so much for being here. Max and I have talked so many times about the conversation that we had back in March when the conflict with Iran had just happened. And we wanted to bring you back to talk about the economic fallout where we are now, especially since back then, I think we, we didn't know where our economy would be. But you had some idea of what you thought might happen if the conflict dragged out this long. And we have a clip of that here.

[D]

It is on a truly worst case scenario, what I will call a really worst case scenario. I think that we go north of $200, we will need massive demand destruction. It will imply an economic shock of the size that the central banks will have to intervene, et cetera, et cetera. It's very ugly. But that's one of the reasons that I cannot see this lasting 60 days. I think that the White House will call it over a lot earlier.

[B]

All right, so I feel like.

[D]

So I was very wrong.

[B]

Maybe kind of.

[C]

I don't know if you were wrong.

[B]

Well, Javier, take us through kind of the thought process back then and kind of what your evaluation of where we are today is.

[D]

Well, you know, I thought that the conflict was not going to last more than a couple of months, 60 days, because I thought that by that time oil prices will be much higher and that will be game over. The bond market will take over all military planning and the war will have to come to an end. Here we are about 100 days into the war and oil prices are below $100 at the time that we are recording, and the conflict is on a ceasefire, but the Strait of Hormuz remains closed. I think that there are a couple of things that have surprised me. One is how much China has reduced his oil imports to the tune of 40% below what it was importing last year. And that has freed a lot of oil for everyone else. We do not understand how China is exactly doing it, and we don't understand the motivations of Beijing to do it other than probably self preservation. They don't want a massive oil shock. But we don't know there is a deal under the table between the Communist Party in China and the White House, and we don't know exactly how the Chinese are doing it. The other thing that surprised me is how quickly the rich countries, the us, Canada, the Europeans, Japan, also used their strategic petroleum reserves and they put a lot of oil into the market from those emergency stockpiles. For example, at the first Gulf War, when Saddam Hussein invaded Kuwait in 1990, it took the rich countries more than six months to decide to use their strategic petroleum reserves. So six months is a lot slower than the two weeks that it took us. Perhaps. The other thing that has surprised me is that, and it will be obvious, but it doesn't become obvious until later, is that the oil industry of 2026 is a lot more sophisticated, flexible than it was 25 years earlier in 2000. And that flexibility has helped to mitigate problems. For example, very early, the biggest problem was heavy fuel oil for ships and jet fuel for planes, because a lot of that comes from the Middle East. From inside the Strait of Hormuz, we were having a shortage. But the global refining system, and particularly the American refining system, literally flexed and was able to increase the amount, the proportion of jet fuel that comes out of every barrel of oil, a few percentage points. So here we are 40 days later than my 60 days Armageddon, and we are all still around. Please do take my comments with, with a pinch of salt.

[B]

Can I push back on this? I feel like Javier is being a little too hard on himself and like this idea that, okay, we thought it would be the end of the world, but it's, It's. It's actually fine. It's not fine. I mean.

[D]

Well, no, you are right. I mean, it's not fine. We are still trading close to $100 oil. Gasoline retail prices in America are well above $4 a gallon, so significantly higher than they were before the war. And what really surprises me is that I thought that this have to go really for a long time to create significant pain. But you think of what I was saying and I was probably on the moderate camp of price increases, et cetera, et cetera. And it has turned that even that moderate camp was too, too harsh, expecting too much of a price increase. But to me, if I have to put it down to what has been the biggest difference of what I was thinking when we spoke to today, I will say China. That came as a big surprise. I will have never thought, you have asked me the last time I was in the show, do you think that China can say, reduce imports by 4 million barrels a day? Basically that's a 10 year low. They're importing less oil than they were importing during COVID That puts things into perspective. I asked a very senior contact in the oil industry. It was a big gathering of oil traders analyst executives in London these past few days for a conference. I asked one of the, the persons who typically you will go and say, do you know what's happening? And this person said to me, it's like the numbers don't make sense. I cannot account for when you put it together. It's like how this is happening.

[C]

It sounds like we all should be thanking China for really stepping up and helping the global oil market.

[D]

The reduction in imports started a bit earlier than the trip of President Trump to Beijing to meet President Xi. But everything could be negotiated in advance and then finalized in Beijing. But I mean, we can think about a counterfactual, okay, what will be happening if China was buying the same amount of oil as before, we will be short of another 4 million barrels a day. So we will need to be on much higher prices because we will need to destroy some demand, which means much higher prices for gasoline in the United states, probably above $5 a gallon, which means that the Fed will be under pressure to increase interest rates, which means that the rally in Wall street probably will have already ended. Which also means that President Trump will be really under pressure to cut a deal with Iranians and the Iranians will have the upper hand on the negotiations. So in some ways, and the way that some people in the oil market see it is Beijing is bailing out President Trump and then the question is why? And in exchange of what? Because in the oil market, everyone, including myself, is as conspiracy theorists and nothing comes for free. We have no proof whatsoever. I should make that very clear. And there is also a very good reason why China could be doing this on their own motivation that really reduced the threat of inflation. At home in China reduced the threat of an economic slowdown around the world, which is something that the Chinese authorities don't want. Because the Chinese authorities, they do need that their economy is healthy for a healthy economy in China, they need a healthy global economy because a priority is to create enough jobs every year to absorb all the young people that is coming to the labor market in China. So maybe they are doing it because that's what rational thinking in Beijing says that they need to do, regardless of President Trump.

[B]

So we need to talk about cuisine, in particular, Mexican cuisine. You know, about a month ago, six weeks ago, I can't remember. You sort of. I don't. I don't know. I don't know if coined is the right word, but maybe popularized the term nacho.

[C]

I was like, why is Max asking about Mexican food?

[B]

Tex Mex, I suppose. Nacho. Not a chance. Hormuz opens. This, of course, is the, you know, much anticipated sequence, sequel to Taco. Trump always chickens out. The theory, Javier, is basically what that, that the Iranians are going to have a very strong incentive to keep their leverage. The Strait of Hormuz is still open. Trump has basically, since this conflict began, been saying it's going to reopen tomorrow or maybe it's already open. At various times, he's. He suggests it's already open or that it's going to open naturally. How long do you think nacho continues to be true?

[D]

I don't know. I do think that both sides want a deal. It feels to me that the landing zone of a deal is becoming clear. Both sides are gonna have to give something. The main problem is both sides need to sell the deal to the domestic audience. President Trump needs to convince a lot of Republican senators and his right wing that this is a good deal, even if he has to give something to the Iranians. The Iranians also, the negotiators, need to convince the most conservative sector of their political system that doing a deal with America, particularly doing a deal with President Trump, who has reneged in the past of deals, makes sense, et cetera, et cetera. I think that President Trump believes that he needs to get a deal and reopen the state of Hormuz. And I think that the Iranians are also under pressure. One of the things that we don't know because we don't really have access on the ground with proper reporting is what is really happening on the Iranian street, Or what we get is some indications that unemployment is rising, that food inflation is skyrocketing, general inflation in the economy is increasing. And the Iranians don't want to emerge from this having won the battle and keeping the Strait of Hormuzei closed for three more months and then realizing that you know, down the road later this year, they have another popular uprising because the economic situation, the domestic economic situation has deteriorated to such a point. So the Iranians, I think that they are also going to be cautious. They want a deal also, but they want a deal that they cancel to their domestic audience as a victory. When does SRI do Hormuz reopen? I don't know. But can the White House and the Islamic Republic reach a deal that both sides cancel as a victory?

[B]

Javier, how many days? So give us a number so that in that many days we can have you on the podcast again.

[D]

Oh, you want to embarrass me or

[B]

allow you to gloat?

[C]

Oh, yes.

[B]

There's upside here to this.

[D]

I think that the day is coming closer. I don't know how many days. I mean, you have listened to President Trump. He has been saying that tomorrow we were going to have a deal and that Tomorrow was about 50 days ago. So I'm not going to do the same thing. But it does feel this time that both sides are very, very, very close. A few more days, perhaps a couple of more weeks. Certainly before the end of June. There you are.

[B]

Love it.

[D]

Certainly before the end of June. I will be here in September.

[C]

Well, Javier, we cannot thank you enough for talking with us. Really fascinating conversation. So thanks. And yes, we're, we're looking forward to having you back.

[D]

Thank you. Hopefully not in September. Thank you so much.

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[C]

Max. We live in a world that is really good at telling us what just happened, but not always so great at explaining why it matters.

[B]

That's what we do every Friday on everybody's business each week. Stacy. We take the biggest stories in business markets. And the global economy and slow them down, adding the context you need to actually understand what's going on.

[C]

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[B]

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[C]

so, Max, it is almost summer. Technically, it feels like summer.

[B]

Weeks away. We are weeks away.

[C]

Weeks away. Weeks away. Which means summer movies, which is. I know you go to movies with your kids quite a bit. Is there anything that you guys are excited to see?

[B]

Stacey? I have not gone to an adult movie since a movie for adults since Oppenheimer, which was like three years ago. So it's been a while.

[C]

Well, this is a really extraordinary summer for movies. So we sent our producer, Jasmine J.T. green, out into the wilds of New York into Central park to ask people about whether they are going to the movies and which movies they're going to.

[B]

What summer movies are y' all watching or you're really interested in checking out?

[C]

We saw the Mandalorian and Grogu, which we really enjoyed. And also want to see Spider man

[D]

is the Odyssey coming out this summer? I definitely want to see the Odyssey. I'm really excited to see the Odyssey Obsession.

[A]

We've been just down the rabbit hole of things, theories and things like that, what people think, how people interpret it. And then the backrooms movie is one we're dying to see.

[B]

It seems like this summer everyone is going back to the movies and people are really excited about a lot of big films. Have you been big movie watchers? I started going to the theater again last year. Right. It's almost like enough time passed over

[A]

Covid that I got more excited to

[B]

go out of the house to see movies. Starting around last year.

[C]

I love going to movies and I always have. So more movies, better. Going to the movies has just gotten really expensive. So I'm just like put off of going like when movies come out and stuff to the theaters because it's so expensive and then you pay $20 for like snacks. It's just like, yeah, I'll wait for it to come up on like prime.

[B]

So we heard two movies there that I just wanted to call out. Backrooms and Obsession, both new horror movies. Backrooms directed by Kane Parsons. Obsession directed by Curry Barker.

[C]

Both very young first time directors, both

[B]

very young, both coming out of kind of the YouTube world and probably most importantly, both massive hits. These two movies have earned $266 million combined despite having very, very inexpensive budgets and kind of growing out of, you know, like lo fi, YouTube work here

[C]

to discuss these movies and the summer movie season and also some theater etiquette. We have the great Lucas Shaw who covers media and entertainment here at Bloomberg. He is also a self proclaimed party pooper.

[B]

Lucas, hello.

[A]

Good to see you both.

[B]

What is the part you're a party pooper? What are you talking about?

[A]

You're familiar with the Bloomberg message 9? Oh yes, bio on a message I years and years ago. Cause I never understood why one needed to have that years and years ago. Just named a professional party pooper and people seem to like it. So I also applied it on LinkedIn.

[C]

Have people reached out to you on LinkedIn asking you to destroy a party?

[A]

They have not asked me to destroy a party, but people have referenced it somewhat often in LinkedIn messages offline, which is always weird.

[B]

Well, I'm happy to be part of that tradition. Lucas also writes a screen time newsletter for Bloomberg which you should subscribe to. Lucas, just to start like these two horror movies, Obsession and Backrooms. Do you have any sense of why they've sort of been the hit that they are and how unexpected was this?

[A]

Well, horror is a genre that has worked for decades and I think especially in the last couple decades as Hollywood has become kind of obsessed with the big, big blockbusters and I think become even more risk averse because it's gotten more and more corporate. Horror is the one genre other than sort of the big family animation, big action superhero type movies that studios will consistently make because people will show up to the theater to watch them. Right. So having these breakout horror movies is like not altogether shocking. The YouTube origin story of it all, a little more surprising. I mean we've seen examples of it. I think what is really tripping people up is that they're both happening at the same time. Right. Like what, what surprised people with Obsession was not so much how it started, but that its grosses went up in weekend two and weekend three, which is very unusual for a movie. And what surprised people with backrooms I think was just how big it was. You know, it opened north of $80 million, to put that in perspective, was released by A24. A24. I don't think it ever had a movie cross 30 its opening weekend. So it more than doubled the biggest opening A24 had ever had. So it's like a, it's one of those things where it's a lot of trends that have been happening. Horror movies, YouTube to Hollywood, A24, like all that. But it happened. You had sort of them all piling on one another at the same time. And it happened at the same time that a Star wars movie was kind of a disaster. And so it sort of reinforced this. This perception that youth tastes have changed and that Hollywood must heed and take notice. And I think there's some. Definitely some truth to it. And then obviously, some kind of overreaction, extrapolation.

[C]

I mean, what I found exciting about this was kind of what you touched on, which is that, you know, for a long time it has started to seem like as fewer and fewer movies get made, that it seems like, you know, the big franchises, the sequels, so many sequels, and this kind of like, mindless recreation of, you know, stories was kind of taking over the industry. And then this summer, you have two pretty unknown directors. I mean, in the case of backrooms, it was a series of YouTube videos this young man had been making for years. But it seems kind of exciting, like this new kind of creative possibility and that maybe the movies haven't become totally corporate.

[A]

So we're gonna get to the end of summer, end of the year, and the biggest movies, for the most part, are still gonna be sequels and remakes and the like. Right? You know, the highest grossing movie of the year so far is Super Mario Brothers Galaxy Movie, which is a sequel to a movie based on a video game. I think most people assume that the highest grossing movies of summer will either be Toy Story 5, which, as the numbers suggest, is a sequel, or Spider Man. I forget what the addendum is to this one, but we're up to like nine Spider man movies at this point. Or the Odysse maybe, or maybe the Odyssey, which.

[B]

Well, that is some old IP The Odyssey.

[A]

Well, that's the thing is people liked. There's like this new trend where people don't call movies based on. People like to call movies based on books original. And it's like, no, no, no, no. Like the book is the source material.

[C]

Homer begs to differ.

[A]

What the movies had missed. I think the last few years coming out of COVID where the grosses were down, was sort of like the middle class. The numbers didn't always bear this out. I tried to, like, crunch it, and I couldn't quite figure out why the movies were down. It just felt like goes down. But it felt like you either had really, really big movies or nothing else. And this year we've had movies like Michael, devil wears Prada 2. Now these horror movies project Hail Mary, like a solid class of movie that are blockbusters, that are not billion dollar movies like Super Mario Brothers or Toy story, but are making anywhere from 200 to 600. Michael's probably going to get to eight or nine. So that's maybe a weird example, but that are some of which are original. And you know what? The IP people are interested in change a little bit. Right. Video game adaptations didn't work until the last few years when finally they did. And maybe it's that the movies were better or maybe it's that Hollywood got that enough people had grown up with video games that they wanted them backrooms. Is IP right? It is a YouTube series that someone adapted. So I just. To your initial question. I do think that there are different types of stories breaking out. Some of them are original, some of them are ip. And it's exciting just that people want to go to the movies at all.

[B]

Yeah. Is that. Is it that. Is it this sense of more sort of mid sized movies? Is that what's ultimately like helping the box office numbers? Because the box office numbers, you've alluded to this, they've been really good.

[A]

The best since 2019, which was the biggest year ever, really. I mean if you're adjusting for inflation and all that stuff, it gets more complicated. But the numbers have been consistently down since the pandemic. Obviously 2020 and 21 were basically awash. Cause theaters were close, were part of it. And there weren't a lot of movies and production had been disrupted. And then we had strikes. And there were a lot of reasons why people thought last year was going to be the year the movie business was back. This is the year where we're sort of the closest to what it had been pre pandemic. And there's hope that it will sustain throughout the year. This weekend we have Scary Movie, whatever it is, I think seven that people are actually expecting to do really well. There's a Toy Story movie later this month and you just have every. It feels like every weekend there is something big.

[B]

So one of the things that's come up amid this, this sense that that theaters are back, that the movie business is back, the box office is back, is sort of indications that behavior is changing. You know, a lot of people did not go to the movies for a few years during COVID And this came up in the tape you just heard. Let's just play a little bit more. I've just been noticing people have been taking their phones out a lot more in the theater. Is that something that y' all have been noticing too? Or are you phone users?

[C]

I will take my phone out to take a picture of the title and then Put it away.

[A]

Definitely put it away and don't look at it.

[B]

I'm really upset, like when people beside me or something are like, max brightness phone use?

[D]

No, I do not take my phone out in the theater. I've noticed though that people are engaging more like clapping or laughing or like I watched the drama and people were all like gasping. Have you ever confronted them?

[B]

No, but I'll just like give them a bad glance or like a evil look or something. So it's like, why are you doing

[C]

this now when you're seeing like especially like a scary movie and there's like a group of like 13 year old teenage boys, like talking and laughing and like throwing popcorn at people like from the seats, it just kind of takes you out of the film and you're more like, where are your parents?

[D]

Please, I want to watch the movie.

[B]

Lucas, have you been hearing about this phone thing? I mean, it sounds like the new etiquette is like, it's okay to scroll. You just gotta keep the brightness really low. Is that kind of your understanding of the. Of where the norms are today?

[A]

The honest answer is I don't know. I do feel like what people. You know, there has been a little bit of research recently to suggest that. That young people are once again interested in going to the movie theater. I have not stress tested the research enough to feel confident one way or the other. I would say that, you know, one of the strengths underpinning what we often call the experience economy, which is going to concerts and sporting events and anything kind of out of the house is okay. Kids in particular spend so much time on their devices. They do, you know, these, these moments that can make them gather. IRL are important. Now granted, if anyone's ever been to something like Coachella, they are there, you know, at something in person, but they're still using their phone to, you know, tape all the time. But movie theaters would seem to have an opportunity to create pitch themselves as opportunities for friends to gather. Right. As long as studios make the right movies and theaters create experiences that kids actually want to be at.

[C]

I thought maybe we're at a moment with our phones because also, you know, Rosamund pike, the actress, she's performing a play in the West End in London. She was giving this very impassioned speech in her play and she looked over and someone was deep in their phone sending a text. And so she has called this out and it's caused this kind of conversation about people taking out their phones too much in the live theater. Do you think this is something that will have a reckoning. Or is this just.

[A]

I feel like that's taboo in live theater. I don't know. I mean, I don't go to live theater.

[B]

More taboo than in movies, for sure.

[A]

Yeah, I certainly, certainly go to a few every year. And it's pretty rare to see someone just going on the phone all the. Or certainly not having the phone out, taking photos.

[B]

I have seen Stacey. I wasn't following this. Did she break the fourth wall during the show to, like, tell this guy to turn his.

[C]

No, she did not. I think she was like a pro and like, did her thing, but I guess she was. She called it crushing.

[B]

Lucas Shaw, thank you so much for being here.

[A]

Thanks, guys.

[C]

Humans will never be more intelligent than AI.

[E]

There's going to be two types of companies.

[B]

Those are great at AI and those that went out of business because they weren't.

[C]

How do we build a future that is human centered? I'm Rana El Kalyubi, and on my podcast Pioneers of AI, we answer that question and. And so many more. As an AI scientist, entrepreneur and investor, I know what it takes to build AI that works for everyone. Every week I sit down with the pioneers shaping our future.

[B]

And we take you behind the scenes

[C]

of the AI that's transforming our lives. Find Pioneers of AI wherever you tune in. So, Max, it is time for our underrated story and we have a very special guest for that. But first, first we had to do a small addition because some. Some news broke.

[B]

Yeah, this was like a stop the presses type moment here at Everybody's Business Stop production. So NPR reported that there is a new potential insider trading scandal in the world of prediction markets. This one involving George Santos, former U.S. congressman. All in all, very interesting character. Stacey, real quick, here's what happened. Santos recorded a video in which he said that he was going to be at the State of the Union address. And the allegation is that he then bet against himself. So he, he.

[C]

Right. This was a bet that was on Kalshee. Right. And the bet was like, will Santos be at the State of the Union address?

[B]

He said that, hey, looking forward to seeing everyone tonight at the State of the Union address. And then the accusation is that then he went on Cal sheet and placed a bet that he would not be at the State of the Union address and he did not go to the State of the Union address. Santos has said the basis of this accusation is preposterous. I look forward to supplying any information asked to me to any agency that inquires. I think this is Very funny, Stacy. Partly because if it were true, it would be just a very clumsy instance of insider training. But also, is it possible that Jorge Santos was hedging, that he wanted to go, he wanted to be there to support President Trump and to be part of history. But as an emotional hedge, which we've talked about this on the show, sports gamblers do it all the time. He placed a bet and he made a little money and it's probably not enough to make up for the not being there, but that's my theory.

[C]

So your theory is that he thought if I get to go to the State of the Union, it's a win. If I don't get to go to the State of the Union, I'll make a lot of money on call sheet because the odds are really high that I will be going to the State of the Union because I recorded a message saying that I was on my way there. That's very generous. Honestly, I think that's a very generous

[B]

read in a generous mood.

[C]

Well, I really, I think the Santos camp thanks you. Thanks you for that. Although then also it's illegal.

[B]

Stacey, underrated story time. And as you said, we have a special guest. It's Matt Campbell, roving Business Week correspondent. He has a new book that's out this week, the man who Stole the A True Story of War Obsession and a Global Art Conspiracy. Everyone should check it out. Matt, what is your underrated story?

[E]

So I have art theft on the brain and my underrated story is from artnet about the efforts by police in France and apparently Belgium to track down the people involved in this jewel heist from the Louvre not long ago. And it kind of sort of sounds like the cops are beginning to roll this up.

[B]

Matt, refresh our memory for those of us who've.

[D]

Yeah.

[E]

So last year there was a brazen heist of some of the most valuable and historically significant jewels in the whole collection of the Louvre, which were just boosted out of the place.

[B]

And then they just like dropped some jewels like on the ground and the

[E]

crown was, yeah, got smushed. It was not the soup. It was not the slickest job, but they did get away.

[B]

So, Matt, the thing that I was surprised by, first of all, I was, I assumed this stuff was long gone. And also it sounds like maybe they'll recover some of these stones that were taken. Right. Or is there any hope of recovery of these precious artifacts?

[E]

That's always the question. So the police are being very tight lipped. It sounds like they have a pretty good idea of at least who the crew were, but that doesn't mean they know who the crew were working for, which is of course the more interesting question. And there's no indication that they have recovered the actual objects. And for me, with art thefts, which still happen all the time, like museums get hit constantly all over the world, particularly in Europe, the big question I always have is, well, where is this stuff going? Because you can't sell it on the open market. You know, you can't go to Sotheby's and say, here's this piece that happens to match exactly something that was lifted out of the Louvre last year. So there has to be a private buyer for it somewhere. And we don't know who that is.

[C]

So Matt, you've reported on art theft. You kind of know these pipelines. Is it normally the person who wants the jewels or the painting who commissions the crime? Or are there just people who. What is the way this happens? Is there like a, like a dark web Sotheby's?

[E]

I hope there's a dark web Sotheby's. That'd be a great story.

[C]

I do too actually.

[E]

But as far as we know, it's both. So there are opportunistic art thefts. There are also art thefts that appear to be commissioned by people who actually want specific items. But what is kind of amazing is the frequency with which this happens. You know, not only in peaceable places like Paris, but every time there is an armed conflict anywhere in the world, one of the first thing that happens is the museum gets cleaned out, archaeological sites get cleaned out, private collections get cleaned out. That is all going somewhere. And there's a very sophisticated supply chain that gets it to wherever it's going.

[B]

All right, speaking of that supply chain, as I mentioned, your book is out this week. It's about an art heist in Cambodia. Like a complex and very sophisticated network of basically looting. Tell us a little bit about the story and how you got interested in it.

[E]

The book basically tells the story of how this industrial scale art theft operation got going in historical sites in Cambodia starting in the 70s. And that's Angkor, Watts and all the other temples. People will have seen pictures of. Imagine like a tomb raider set up. That's basically what we're talking about.

[C]

What kinds of things are they taking?

[E]

These are huge, amazing thousand year old stone life size sculptures and also a lot of bronze which tends to be smaller. And thousands of pieces were taken, sold in some cases for you know, seven or even eight figure prices. And above all we now know and this is the story that gets told in the book Into New York City. That was the big destination. Private collectors here and also the Metropolitan Museum.

[C]

Oh, the Met. So actually your travels cause you're based in Singapore, right? And your art theft travels brought you to New York.

[E]

That's right. So this is a story that begins in very remote and landmine laden jungles in northwest Cambodia. And it ends at the corner of Fifth Avenue and 80th street, which is where a lot of these things did end up. Bought by the Met, bought by various wealthy private collectors in the US in some cases within a couple of years of being ripped out by former Khmer Rouge child soldiers, literally.

[B]

Matt Campbell, thank you for being here. The book is called the man who Stole the A True Story of War Obsession and a Global Art Conspiracy. Go to your bookstore, pick it up or Amazon. Matt, thanks a lot.

[E]

Any anywhere that sells books. The sale still counts wherever you get your books.

[B]

This show is produced by Jasmine JT Green, Stacey Wong and Miles J. Herzenhorn. Magnus Henriksen is our supervising producer. Sam Rogich handles engineering and Dave Purcell fact checks. Special thanks to Jeff Muskus, Julia Rubin Emery. If you have a minute, please rate and review the show. It'll mean a lot to us. And if you have a story that should be our business, email us@everybody's bloomberg.net that's everybody with an sloomberg.net thank you for listening and we'll see you next week.