ATF Rules Update

Summary

EVERYTHING GUNS PODCAST
Episode 77 – "ATF Rules Update"
Hosts: David and Jody Smith
Date: May 11, 2026

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Episode Overview

This episode of "Everything Guns" kicks off with a comprehensive update on new ATF rules and gun-related legislation, then swings into recent gear and accessory finds, followed by analysis of real-world self-defense scenarios, and concludes with discussion of recent range drills and state gun law updates (Virginia and Texas). The tone remains conversational, good-humored, and peppered with real-world advice, friendly jabs, and practical insights.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. ATF Rules & Legislative Updates

[03:48–17:50]

• DOJ Suing Over Gun Laws:
  The DOJ is suing Denver over its assault weapons ban and Colorado over its magazine ban—seen as moves to protect gun rights and potentially set legal precedent.

  • “The DOJ is finally going after some anti-gun states to protect the rights of American citizens.” (A, 03:48)

• ATF 4473 Form Changes:

  • Sex Box Revised: Non-binary removed; options are now male or female. “Basically what you put down on your birth certificate...pretty simple.” (A, 06:01)
  • Shortened Form: Streamlined from 6–7 pages down to about 4 or 5.
  • Clarification on Transfers:
    • Language updated to clarify transfers (gifts to non-prohibited people are OK; straw purchase definitions clarified).
    • Removed question about intending to sell or dispose of the firearm.
  • Marijuana Question: Reflects new federal scheduling, removes references to medical marijuana, softening previous prohibition based on state-legal use.
  • Shipped-to-Home Option:
    • New section hints at possible direct shipping (within-state) if background check and ID check still occur—hosts are skeptical this will survive public comments.

• Bump Stock & Pistol Brace Rules:

  • Bump Stocks: Removed from prohibited list, partially undoing 2018 changes, but not fully reverting automatic weapon language.
  • Pistol Braces: Removal of SBR classification for most brace pistols, effectively nullifying the Biden-era brace rule. “NFA owners...removes SBR classification for most brace pistols. Moots the Biden era brace rule. And that's effective now.” (A, 11:10)
  • Engaged in Business Expansion Rule: Repealed.
  • Youth Handgun Safety Posting Requirement: No longer required for FFLs.
  • CLIO Notification (NFA items): No longer required to send notification to local law enforcement.

• Other Notable ATF Proposals:

  • Electronic processes standardized (fully electronic 4473).
  • Interstate NFA transport simplified (no longer requires prior approval in many cases).
  • Joint spousal registration for NFA items allowed (no trust needed).
  • Reduced reporting for low-volume FFLs.
  • Clarification: errors on paperwork less likely to be prosecuted as “willful” violations.

• Perspective:
  Out of 34 ATF-related changes, only about 6 have been signed into effect—rest are out for public comment. Overall, hosts see this as positive progress but stress the fight is ongoing.

  • “There's some positive movement... still a long fight against all these other states and everyone else but at least we got some positive this week.” (B, 17:45)

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2. Guns & Gear

[18:06–25:05]

• Shoutout & Gift Boxes:

  • Appreciation for listeners leaving five-star reviews and a note gift boxes will be delayed due to a family medical issue.

• Magnetic Optic Mount Review:

  • New mount allows easy installation/removal of a red dot optic on older, non-optic-ready guns—uses magnetic attachment and requires changing rear sight.
  • Price: $450–$600 range (“That's higher than I thought it was going to be.” – B, 21:20).
  • Hosts praise retention of zero and ease of use, especially for those with legacy guns.

• Skinner Sights Product Line:

  • Listener from Australia raved about Skinner peep sights; hosts highlight their versatility and affordable prices (apertures starting at $11, base models at $95+).
  • “Skinner Sights...American made...if you don’t want a red dot or...what do you call those things…” (A, 23:18)
  • Also highlight lever-action and scope mounts as especially good value.

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3. Use of Force Scenarios

[26:24–36:24]

Oakland Store Altercation

• A shoplifting incident escalates into a fight, then to a shooting.
• Clerk/owner and shoplifter exchange blows, bystanders try to de-escalate; as the shoplifter pretends to reach for a weapon, the clerk shoots.
• Justification Discussion:
  • Hosts agree the initial use of force by the clerk is justified given the perceived threat, though question the wisdom of following the suspect outside.
  • “He was acting like he had [a gun] and the guy wasn’t gonna wait to make sure.” (A, 28:20)
  • “Once you break contact, don’t go back out and re-engage unless there’s a reason.” (A, 34:49)

Houston Home Invasion

• Homeowner wakes to find a masked intruder, gets into physical altercation that spills outside.
• Homeowner briefly retreats, then re-engages with a firearm, shoots suspect (who later dies).
• Use of Force Legal Analysis:
  • Hosts agree initial confrontation fully justified—Castle Doctrine applies everywhere on Texas property, though hosts disagree jokingly over the exact details.
  • Second confrontation after the break carries more legal risk (“Once you break contact, don’t go back out and re-engage unless there’s a reason...” – A, 34:49).
  • Also stress importance of having a firearm accessible to avoid unarmed confrontations.

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4. State Gun Laws: Virginia & Texas

[36:45–51:50]

Virginia ([36:45–47:47])

• Recent laws driven by Democratic majority:
  • No NICS bypass with concealed carry.
  • 21+ for purchases (with military exceptions).
  • Open carry legal at 18+; concealed carry permit at 21+, recognizes all state permits (but under-21 permits not recognized).
  • New “assault firearm” ban starts July 1, 2026, bans public carry of semi-auto rifles (detachable mag, pistol grip/stock, threaded barrel, etc.), fixed-mag guns over 15 rounds—vague and likely to expand.
  • Grandfathering in place but likely to end.
  • Universal background checks required for private sales.
  • Localities can add restrictions (parks, government buildings).
  • Red flag law in effect.
  • Three-year prohibition on ownership for misdemeanors/domestic violence post July 2026.
  • Magazine ban for new purchases (>15 rounds), but existing mags grandfathered for now.
  • “Ghost gun” ban.
  • Application process: 45-day processing, must demonstrate handgun training/competence.

Texas ([48:02–51:50])

• Constitutional carry for adults 21+ (and now 18+ due to court rulings).
• Permit system still exists for reciprocity and 18–20 year-olds.
• Prohibited places: schools, polling locations, courthouses, airports, racetracks, bars.
• Open carry of handguns allowed, but must be in a holster—law is vague on what counts as a holster.
• Open carry of rifles still permitted as long as not “calculated to alarm” others.
• Five-year wait post-misdemeanor family violence for firearm rights restoration.
• Some confusion and humorous commentary over local interpretation and peculiarities.

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5. Range Drills & Training

[51:50–55:40]

• Mozambique Drill Recap:

  • Two to the body, one to the head—ran from concealment at three, five, and seven yards. Most shots were under two seconds; hosts critique each other's draw speed and focus.
  • “I was consistently well under two seconds on mine from a side holster.” (A, 52:35)
  • Emphasis on the importance of practicing index and transition shots. Drills were more challenging when timed.

• Upcoming Drills:

  • Discussion of advanced drills inspired by competition shooters Hunter Constantine and drills from Tier 1 Concealed (like 10 consecutive 1.5 second headshots at 10 yards).
  • Planning to include audience-suggested drills in future episodes.

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• “Number one podcast in the world. Yep. Voted on by us. 2 to 0.” (A & B, 00:09)
• On new ATF rules: “There's some positive movement. At least we got some positive this week.” (B, 17:45)
• On the legal maze: “A lot of these rules, not only just Virginia, these other states are ultimately unconstitutional. But there’s no consequences.” (A, 45:35)
• On gear innovation: “You get a mount and an optic. Yeah, it’s in the range of other optics.” (A, 21:24)
• On use of force: “Once you break contact, don’t go back and re-engage unless there’s a reason that you need to.” (A, 34:49)
• Banter over technicalities: “I work on missile systems. I’m smarter than I sound.” (B, 45:19)
• On shooter's mindset: “You’re not focusing on the target. You’re on a spot on the target. You’re trying to focus on the dot. You gotta focus more on the spot on the target.” (A, 52:49)

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Timestamps of Major Segments

• 00:16 – Episode Overview/Roadmap
• 03:48 – National news: DOJ vs. state gun bans
• 05:18 – ATF 4473 & rule changes
• 11:02 – Bump stocks, pistol braces, and NFA clarifications
• 17:40 – Summary and future outlook on ATF rules
• 18:06 – Guns & Gear reviews start
• 26:24 – Use of Force case: Oakland shoplifting/shooting
• 30:35 – Use of Force case: Houston home invasion
• 36:45 – Virginia laws update begins
• 48:02 – Texas law recap
• 51:50 – Range drill debriefs, Mozambique and upcoming challenge drills
• 54:55 – Call for audience interaction/future plans

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Overall Tone & Takeaways

David and Jody bring an expert but accessible approach: technical details made digestible by humor, side stories, and banter, with a strong pro-Second Amendment stance. The episode is rich in actionable information—both for staying legal and staying sharp as a responsible gun owner.

Listener Tip:
For more info on the 34 new ATF rules or links to products like Skinner Sights, refer to ATF's website or the show’s future notes.

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End of Summary

Transcript

[A]

Yeah. Pointed at you.

[B]

Get this thing going.

[A]

Welcome to Everything Guns, episode 77.

[B]

Number one podcast in the world. Yep.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

Voted on by us.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

2 to 0.

[A]

All right, so let's just give an overview of today's podcast. We're going to start off with some gun news and most of it's going to be related to the new ATF rules that just came out. Some of them have already been signed and most of them though are out for public comment. So we'll kind of get into those and what those do. Then we're gonna hit some guns and gear. Got a new optic mount that's magnetic that we're going to talk about. And then we talked about that garment bag from Skinner sites.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Last week I got an email from Dave from Australia about their actual sites that they've got. So we'll go talk a little bit about their sites and the cost of those. Pretty good deals on that. No, those are all American made. So we'll get into that a little bit. A couple of use of force scenarios. One out of Oakland and then the other one's out of Houston. One's in a convenience store. I sent you a video on that.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And the other one's out of Houston is a home invasion that we're going to talk about. We're going to hit Virginia state laws, hopefully. David did some research this time, mostly. Are we going to hit any more Texas stuff?

[B]

Yeah, yeah, I got that too. Oh, good deal. Look at you.

[A]

And then just a. Just a little bit of talk around a range drill. We're going to try to add a new segment at the very end. Talking about a drill that we do while we're at the range. And we did the Mozambique drill this past weekend, so we'll kind of talk a little bit about that. The goods and bad.

[B]

Yeah, we didn't do the Tom Cruise port drilling because you had to have two targets for that one.

[A]

Oh, yeah, I didn't think about that. We should have. We had plenty of targets.

[B]

We could have done that.

[A]

Yeah, we should do that. Oh, well.

[B]

But that's got another drill for next time.

[A]

Now we ought to do the four circle drill. Isn't that what you said?

[B]

Man, that dog loud. She's loud over there.

[A]

She'll go to sleep every minute. Yeah, we'll do the four circle drill at least sometime.

[B]

That's one I'll just mention, one that was on tier one.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Hey, how old are you? Hunter Constantine.

[A]

Oh, that dude.

[B]

Yeah, he's a warm up drill for him.

[A]

Oh, this Is gonna be hard.

[B]

Drill the dude. You know that big guy, the real. The big guy. I mean, quick draw, fast, good shooter. He couldn't do it.

[A]

Yeah. And then surprise. Yeah.

[B]

It's just one round.

[A]

What is it?

[B]

Dude? You gotta do it 10 times though. It's one round, 10 yards headshot 10

[A]

times in a row in a zone

[B]

or is this a No, a zone. Yeah.

[A]

Is there a time limit?

[B]

You have to do this 1.5 seconds. Oh, I could do that. Yeah, he could.

[A]

1.5 in a headshot 10 times in a row. In an A zone. Headshot 10 times a row. That's tough. 1.5, 10 times in a row.

[B]

I could get it.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah. Definitely could have get a zone in the chest area.

[B]

Oh, crap.

[A]

Yeah, that's easy. Yeah, heads on. That might be tough.

[B]

He was really good on his ties. He got such a fast draw. I thought I did some.

[A]

He did. For concealment. Yeah.

[B]

Oh my gosh.

[A]

I'm about to do some dry fire this week.

[B]

He was. He was mainly like 1.3 seconds.

[A]

We'll talk. We'll talk about that. Yeah, I'm definitely going to do some dry fire this week.

[B]

I was doing some not really dry fire as much as draw practice. Yeah, more it is. I'm drawing. I got to get into my.

[A]

Are you getting your.

[B]

We talk about the drill? Yeah. Working on my index.

[A]

Yeah, that's what I was trying to think.

[B]

We'll talk about when we get to the drill.

[A]

All right. Let's just move into some new stuff. And like I said, this is really going to be more geared toward the.

[B]

You already said all that. Go.

[A]

All right, so this.

[B]

First quit saying what you're going to say.

[A]

So this is a little bit of good news. We've got. The DOJ is finally going after some anti gun states to protect the rights of American citizens. I don't know why they're not doing this more often, but they're suing Denver over his long running ban on so called assault weapons. And also they're suing Colorado itself over the magazine band stuff. So.

[B]

Yeah, there's no podcast. Maybe an attorney general or something like that? No.

[A]

Yeah, yeah.

[B]

And she was talking about the Colorado and they're why they're. Sorry, I don't understand.

[A]

Oh my God.

[B]

Anyway, that's your phone series.

[A]

Always listening.

[B]

How's she not understand me? Anyway, so they're talking about. They're doing this serum. Some of these stakes. There they are. What's the word I'm looking for?

[A]

Trying to get some Precedence in the court system.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Where if there's a. District courts don't have any cases related to some of these bands, they're trying to get these on the books so they can start getting some of these district courts and appeals courts where there are different differences in.

[B]

In. Oh, this is riveting. Yeah.

[A]

In the judgment. So the Supreme Court will take some of this thing.

[B]

Well, we had a decent Supreme Court, then we would have this problem. But I mean it's all these states are just going completely against what the Supreme Court rulings are. Quit watching the walls, you'll be all right. It ain't gonna come to get you

[A]

something stuck on his foot.

[B]

He's struggling. All right.

[A]

But yeah, so we got that. So to get to the ATF stuff. So there's some draft changes first. So there's some draft changes to the 4473. And I'll talk some more about 4473 changes in a minute. But this first one is the marijuana question, which also is going to open the. And they also got some changes that might open the door to some direct gun shipping.

[B]

Mary Jane.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So wacky weed.

[A]

Yeah. The first change to the drug is the. So let's just talk about the 4473.

[B]

Did you do the marijuana?

[A]

No, I did not. The first changes to the form is the removal of the non binary under the. Under the sex. So now it's going to be changed to just male or female. So that was that.

[B]

What's that got to do with marijuana?

[A]

I'm just, I'm going through the changes in 4473 form. So. And it's also going to be a bit shortened and simplified. So I think it's. I can't remember six or seven pages now and it's going. It's going to move down to like four or five pages. So it's going to reduce that too. As well. So that's going to be good. But you're going to only have the two choices, male or female. And that's, that's not going to ban anybody from being able to get a gun. So it's basically what you put down on your birth certificate is male or female. That's what you have to put on this form. It's pretty simple things. Simple, yeah, seems simple. So it's not going to keep anybody from buying a gun.

[B]

Won't be simple, but it should be simple.

[A]

Yeah, it's going to. In the current form, the 4473 asks the potential firearms buyer, whether they are the actual transfer buyer of the island. The question, the way the question is worded makes it seem like you cannot legally buy a gun from another person. So that's going to be taken away because that's never been law. So that's good. So basically, you know, when you ask that it. If you're the actual transferee or buyer, it. The way people read that is they can't buy that for a family member or they can't buy that for someone else. And you can. It's not a straw purchase. A straw purchase is when you knowingly buy. Purchase a firearm for someone that you know, can't purchase one for themselves. So, so they're, they're changing that. So that's good.

[B]

That guy want me to buy a gun for him to. Because just mainly, I mean he was not prohibited. He didn't want to do a background, you know. God.

[A]

The ATF added a section that asked about the purpose of the fire of the firearms transfer. The new options are transfer for oneself, where the transfer uses their own money to purchase the firearm as a gift for someone who is not prohibited person. So that's. I think that's a good change. Take some of the ambiguity out of it. Question 21B has also been removed from the 4473. That question asks if you intended to sell otherwise dispose of the firearm listed on the form. And you're supposed to answer no on that question. So your background check goes through. But this is not illegal to sell a privately on firearms.

[B]

So whatever I want to.

[A]

Yeah, so they're taking that question out. So again, that was kind of related to a straw purchase, which is not what this was meaning. And question 120, question 21F has also changed. This question is largely remained intact with one big caveat. The old question used to imply that using marijuana for any reason, including medical use, even if it was criminalized in your state, would disqualify a potential buyer from purchasing gun. The new question removed references, removes references to medical marijuana. And a lot of that is due to. It's got rescheduled from a Schedule 1 to a Schedule 3 controlled substance federally. So it's different now than what it was. It's much less restrictive. The ATF Form 4473 removes the checkbox to specify if a firearm is a long gun, handgun or other. The O form also had a redundant box with a federal firearms license. So you had to write the type of firearm being transferred. Yeah, I do that. The new form eliminates the redundancy most exciting thing about the new form is the options at the bottom of page three where the option allows the FFL to choose an option for non over the counter transactions. So this option covers ordering firearms online and have them shipped to the guns buyer's door without the need to go to the gun shop. So I don't. I hope that goes through. I'll be shocked if it does. They already do one of the suppressor companies, silencer shop or one of the I can't remember which one it is already does this. It just so basically if you order one it has to be in the state. So if somebody ordered one for me and they live in the state I can send it to their door. They still have to go through the next background check and all the all that and yet to be able to make sure their identification is correct. But that's pretty neat too. So shipped to home is going to be interesting to see how the comments come along on that one. Some other news, the bump stocks have been removed from the definition. So now many are that is language has been chained pulled out of the text. So back from the 2018 language where he was being where you couldn't buy bump socks. That has now been removed. I don't think they've gone far enough on that. They didn't go back to the pre pre definition of of automatic firearms, but they did at least remove the bump stocks from that. So at least we got that done. Let's see.

[B]

So we thought we'd start the podcast off boring today.

[A]

This is boring. This is news of what the ATF has done. Okay, I can go through. Let's see.

[B]

Here we go. Passed out the repeal bucket.

[A]

So this is the repeal the 2023 pistol brace rule.

[B]

So that's, you know, you don't have to read the title.

[A]

So NFA owners can. And so that's been removed. Removes SBR classification for most brace pistols. Moots the Biden era brace rule. And that's effective now. So that's already been signed.

[B]

Oh that's good.

[A]

The bump socks good again.

[B]

Yep.

[A]

And like I said, the bump stock is.

[B]

I had to go buy another brace

[A]

in the bump stock removal language has been removed.

[B]

That's.

[A]

That's, that's now the repeal of the Engaged in Business Expansion Rule has been removed. So yes.

[B]

I don't know guns on gunbroker because they put that in place.

[A]

Yeah. Oh yeah. The Repeal of the 1998 FFL Youth Handgun Safety posting requirements been repealed. I have to have a sign if you go in my office where I do my FFL transfers and stuff, there's a sign on my wall with this little poster for youth handgun safety. So I'm glad they're removing that. I think it's silly to have to do that.

[B]

It is silly.

[A]

Yeah. Removes an old posting requirement. ATF now treats that as unnecessary. Of course it's unnecessary.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Recension cleanup of related guidance tied to the above rules. Final rules.

[B]

What did you just say? Did you say lady guidance or what?

[A]

Related lady guys withdrawals or revises guidance doc that depend on the brace, bump stock and engage in the business rules. And then there's some minor conforming repeals and cross reference fixes. Sunset of certain temporary Biden error enforcement policies codifies that some temporary enforcement postures tied to those rules are no longer in effect.

[B]

Is it codified or codified?

[A]

Yeah, it is. It's one of those Modernizes the electronic systems authorization of fully electronic form 4473. I use electronic form quite a bit. Hey, I did my renewal application for my FFL so I got that in the mail. So sit in, filled out the paperwork, paid my $90 fee for renewal and send it on back to the atf. And I also sent a copy to the sheriff's office because they got to get a copy of it and I

[B]

thought I had more stuff on Texas

[A]

modernization of the FFL Easy check verification system. So that's good. That's in the 90 day comment window we got. Let's see the electronic retention formats been changed where it was you had to keep them forever. Now I think it's like 20 years. 20 or 30 years. I can't remember how long it is but it's. That's open for rule. Let's see do we want to go through all these no alignment records formats for frames and receivers rule. So prepares language to mesh with the forthcoming frames and receivers rule. Hopefully that comes out soon. They haven't come out with that new frame and receiver rule yet but I expect that back when I was at shot show they said that was going to come out in March. Well we're now in May and hadn't come out yet. So we'll see interstate NFA transport relief. So you know before you had to get. Before you could travel with a NFA Harlem you had to get permission from the atf. And this would remove prior approval requirement for most interstate transporter of NFA firearms replacing it with a more flexible standard. So I always thought it was stupid that you would have to do that joint spousal registration for NFA outs so you don't have to get a trust. Now you can get a joint spousal.

[B]

Yeah, got it.

[A]

So for your troll bear novel for any NFA item. Because I can't leave my NFA item out when I'm gone.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

If my wife. Because my wife can't have access to it. She has access to it. That's a felony. Which is stupid. So I had to keep it locked up in a safe that she can't get to.

[B]

That's crazy.

[A]

But now there's a registration. You can do a joint spousal registration instead of having to create a trust. Which trust used to be the way to go, but now it's not. It's not the easiest thing do now they removed the CLIO notification requirement for NFA forms because it was silly to begin with. Anytime you get an NFA item, you had to send a letter to the chief law enforcement officer that you were doing that. They most of me know what that was meant or didn't even know you

[B]

had to do that.

[A]

Streamline machine gun transfers between SOTs. These are all still open for comment. Let's see. Reproduced reporting burden for low volume FFLs ease some of the reporting record keeping requirements for low volume lines. I wonder how many what low volume is. I would probably be like probably yeah.

[B]

Low volumes when we can't hear.

[A]

I mean I got a bunch more of these man. I still got a whole bunch of these to go.

[B]

Oh man.

[A]

Let's see. Let me just look through some of them.

[B]

Oh yeah, look through them while we on the podcast. That's good.

[A]

Update to the adjudicated as a mental defective. So it's my.

[B]

How many. How many listeners do you think we've lost so far?

[A]

Oh man.

[B]

I mean just today just list. I wouldn't think anything. Okay.

[A]

Clarification of the willfully standard of for FFL violations which is going to take away some of the. If somebody makes a paperwork error in their FFL paperwork where it's. That's not going to be considered willful. Let's see. I'm looking to see if there's anything that you might be interested in clarification of the readily readily convertible language for certain parts. Let's see. Clarification for record keeping obligations for consignment and auction sales alarm alignment of NFA regulations. Never going to stop.

[B]

It's never going to stop, is it?

[A]

There's like 34 of them.

[B]

I know but let's not go through

[A]

all 34 alignment with Bruin era case law on public carry and sensitive places. So it's going to be interesting how they go about that one because right now all these states are putting Basically everything is 17 minutes into this, we're

[B]

still talking about this. I told you I was going to go through these. This is all the news I had. I didn't know we do all of them.

[A]

Let's see.

[B]

Oh, silence is good. Yeah, the silence is good. What else you got? What else you got? Anything else in the news we need to discuss? I told you it was all gonna be. So now you have nothing else in the news.

[A]

Okay, just let me just individual the immediate finals is the brace rule. The bump shot language near term clarified interstate transport and updated mental health disqualifications. That's what's coming up. So there's 34 rules. You can go to the ATF site and kind of look at them or you just look up.

[B]

Well to summarize all that there's some positive movement.

[A]

But out of the 34. Yeah, out of 34 only about six of them have been signed. Right.

[B]

And hopefully we can get through. But it's, it's positive. It's better than what we've been been saying. We're still still a long fight against all these other states and everyone else but at least we got some positive this week. All right, most other weeks.

[A]

Let's move on to some guns and gear. Mainly gear today. So I've got a couple of things. This segment brought to you by Clear Creek Shooting for all your firearm needs check out clear creekshooting33.com yeah, I was

[B]

going to talk about my mechanic MC9LS a little bit. We've already talked about this idiot. Just joking.

[A]

Go ahead. You want to talk about the Zulu stock again?

[B]

Oh yeah, that too. But I didn't shoot it this week. All right. What you got?

[A]

Your wife shot mine though. She, she liked it.

[B]

I should have taken not taking ours.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. So this first item. Oh before I get into that. So we, you know we, we mentioned last time we give us a five star review. You get a little gift box. We still got a couple available. Just be aware that it's going to be a few weeks before those get shipped out. My wife just had some surgery to get a new hip so it's going to be a few weeks before she's been able to get that stuff made. So if you've got, if you've already gave me your sent me a message that you did the five star review. Just be patient. It's going to be a couple of weeks. Yeah. And thank you for the review. So I got one guy sent us a six star review. That's pretty cool.

[B]

Number one podcast in the world, baby.

[A]

Yep, in the world. I think we surpassed Joe Rogan's numbers this past week.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, we were. If we were adding them up, we probably did.

[A]

Oh yeah, yeah. I would imagine so. All right, this first item is a little magnetic mount. And this is for. I'm going to take that bottle away from a dog.

[B]

You think?

[A]

Yeah. Hey, she's chewing on it.

[B]

Quit chewing on the bottle.

[A]

All right, this first little device we. You came across it a few weeks ago and sent it said you want to talk about it.

[B]

Let me see this. We're like NRA show or something. This is the one that we saw.

[A]

No, no, that one was just a magnetic mount but it didn't cover the fronts. The rear side though.

[B]

You sure?

[A]

I think you had to remove the rear side for that one. Or fit.

[B]

Yeah, the one you're going to. But I could.

[A]

No, I think it was exactly opposite but whatever.

[B]

Well, I was only in one arm at that point.

[A]

Oh yeah, he was struggling with it.

[B]

I don't think I was struggling but

[A]

I've seen a couple different type of magnetic master. This one.

[B]

Yeah, go ahead and talk about it.

[A]

This one leaves the. What it has a. Has a rear side in place and just fits over the top of the rear side. Now you have to replace it with this mount rear side but it works with your front side. So. But there's no milling and this is only made for guns that don't have cutouts for.

[B]

I mean like my DS or something.

[A]

Yeah, your X is the bursts that we got Glocks that don't have already that are already optic ready.

[B]

It wouldn't work my burst. I got the low profile size on my bursa.

[A]

Anything that well, you have to change out the side.

[B]

Changing a low profile I didn't see.

[A]

I'm just telling you you would have to. It's a magnetic attachment that fits.

[B]

You got burst on a long time.

[A]

I need to mine out. You can remove it and then you can use your. Use your iron sights or pop it back on. Yeah, it does have a bit of a higher profile than what your normal size would. Just the way the way it mounts. Looks pretty cool.

[B]

It looks nice. Looks like it holds zero pretty good from one of the videos but like

[A]

I said it is designed for older.

[B]

What's the price on that?

[A]

It is got about it. It varies between 450 to 600.

[B]

Okay. That's higher than I thought it was going to be.

[A]

It's a little expensive.

[B]

That's higher than I thought.

[A]

But you get a mount and an optic. Yeah. So. Yeah, it's in the range of other optics. Yeah.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

And the other thing we talked about, you know, I was talking about the, the garment bag from Skinner sides and I gotta. Could you. I sent you that email from Dave, didn't I? Yeah, yeah, like I should attach the picture to the. To the show notes.

[B]

Oh, no, don't tell me what to do. It doesn't take you to do all that. Oh, here we go. You don't have your web. Oh, that's good stuff. Now we gotta wait for you to type it in.

[A]

I thought I had it ready.

[B]

The Internet out here sucks. Yeah, it's gonna take forever, so.

[A]

Oh, it popped right up. Hey, we gotta do this in my. That's why I said we'll do this in my camper.

[B]

You got your new camper. We can get the beginning of our. Of our fly fishing. Camping.

[A]

Yeah, my first camping trip scheduled for this weekend.

[B]

I went fly fishing the other day. Yeah, man, I had one. I brought. I was bringing him halfway in. I had him, had him hooked good. And I got lazy. He starts coming toward me and I wouldn't stripping good enough. I didn't keep tight enough lying on him because I go, barbless hooks ain't got off, man. I swear. It was a good try. It's a good sized trout too.

[A]

Oh, I'm sure it's probably the biggest one you ever caught in your life.

[B]

It was gonna be pretty big. Big.

[A]

That always works.

[B]

I could tell when it jumped and I thought row then man, I got lazy. Got lazy with it. Lost it.

[A]

All right. So I went to, you know, after I got the email from Dave. He's talking about how good their sights are and he's got a rifle he put some of their peep sites on and pricing on. These are not bad at all. I mean you get some nice pricing on the. On the sides, the peep sides. If you don't want a red dot or, or what do you call those things?

[B]

Oh my God. You need some new brain exercises.

[A]

Yeah, I gotta do something.

[B]

Goodness.

[A]

Yeah, these are pretty neat. You know, they're supposed to. With the peep sights you can get, you know, fine.04 aperture all the way up to 0.155. And those are just 11 bucks for that. And then you get Skinner sights. Check them out. I mean, they're American made look well made. They got optics and everything. You can different type of optics. So I think it's worth a look if I can get this to pull up on my. Oh my gosh. Yeah. So they do have some scope mounts and other types of optics available as well.

[B]

Did you say what the prices were on this?

[A]

Some of those.

[B]

It varies.

[A]

I mean depending on what you want. The picatinny rail with the integrated peep starts from 95 up. Looks pretty good. Skinner Express sites starting at $95. You got an express site with a scope mount priced at $149. So I mean not bad pricing on some of this stuff. If you look at it, they've got a red dot SKO mount for $20. I mean pricing wise they look. It looks really good. And you can put some of these on some liver action rifles or some. Here's a two piece solid steel scope mount for a lever nature lever lever action rifle from 15 up. So good stuff. Check it out. Skinnersights.com and we're not a sponsor of them and just thought it was pretty

[B]

cool stuff on that. We're not a sponsor of anybody. I'm Clear Creek shooting. Oh yeah?

[A]

Yeah. So nobody else wants us to be

[B]

as far as even though sponsor us or they're not. We're not a sponsor of them.

[A]

That true? We. Yeah, yeah that's true. All right. You got anything in guns and gear?

[B]

No.

[A]

All right, let's move on to some use of force.

[B]

No, we talk dry fire stuff later.

[A]

Yeah, we'll talk about that. We'll talk about the drill and then what we're going to do next.

[B]

That too. I want to do that. I'm gonna do that too.

[A]

One drill.

[B]

Hunter Constantine. 10 yards headshot.

[A]

You've already said that.

[B]

I wouldn't try that next time. Yeah, I ain't no way. I get that 10 times in a row.

[A]

No, no, I don't think you do it once.

[B]

I can get it once out of 10. Yeah, I think.

[A]

Yeah, I'd say you probably get it five out of 10. I gotta work in a second half.

[B]

Yeah. And I could maybe had a fast smooth draw too. And it was. He was 1.3.

[A]

I haven't done a lot of concealed care work though. My problem. I've been doing a lot of drawing from.

[B]

There's a decent shot at 10 yards.

[A]

Oh yeah.

[B]

The credit card size headshot.

[A]

That's almost 30ft.

[B]

Yeah. Is it three was 3.12. No, that's meters.

[A]

30ft.

[B]

Yeah. We're talking about yards. Aren't we? We're not working meters at work, so. Yeah, my bad.

[A]

All right.

[B]

Yeah, it is 30.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, the size of a three yard credit card. 30ft.

[B]

Three feet to yard.

[A]

Oh, my gosh,

[B]

man. I didn't do brain exercises.

[A]

Dumber by the second.

[B]

Only when I'm with you.

[A]

All right, let's move on. So this is a use of force out of Oakland. And this is. You can find this one on the active self protection YouTube site. So this is. You got a guy that's been accused of doing some shoplifting. So the store clerk and I. This guy had to be the owner because he was mad. I don't think it's just a clerk. No clerk's gonna let it go. As aggressive as this guy was, he

[B]

wasn't gonna let it go. And he just.

[A]

He was asking guy if he took something. He kept wanting to look in his bag and ended up the guest guys getting a fight. And I think the store clerk really threw the first punch.

[B]

Oh, he did. So the guy comes in the store, walks around. Looks like he either picked something up or put something down. Guy tries to grab the bag from him, pushes him, pushes him down. The store clerk gets back up, runs. He throws a punch. They start fighting. Some. Some guys come in, try to break it up. It gets broken up.

[A]

Yeah, Blue shirt guy was trying to de. Escalate the whole thing.

[B]

The whole time, the other guy walks out. The guy. And when he's. When the guy that stole something and walks out, he grabs something else, walks out.

[A]

The.

[B]

He's still there at the door because one of the other. The one guy is trying to help calm everything down.

[A]

Blue shirt guy.

[B]

Yeah, he's picking stuff up.

[A]

Yeah, he's.

[B]

He's putting stuff up. Hey, let's. Let's calm down. And the other guy's still standing there. He's getting on him. And then at some point, that guy, the. The thief is at the door. He starts kind of digging through his bag.

[A]

Hey, I got something. You want to see this? I got this for you.

[B]

Yeah. And that's when. That's when store clerk, owner, whatever, he. He responds to that quickly.

[A]

Yeah. Pulls a gun, starts firing.

[B]

Yep. Starts shooting at him. Before. Before. You don't say. I don't ever see a gun. Now, the other guy may have seen a gun from the. The guy that was accused of stealing the shoplifter. My guess, he saw something or knew. And I'm sitting there, dude, I thought he's gonna let him shoot him.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But he didn't let him shoot him.

[A]

He.

[B]

He.

[A]

If he didn't have a gun, he

[B]

was acting like he had one, and the guy wasn't gonna wait to make sure. So.

[A]

And that's kind of what the. The. What I want to talk about is, okay, do we think he was justified to use lethal force even though that guy didn't show? We didn't see a gun we couldn't

[B]

see, but he may have. But I don't think. I don't know stories on it. So we don't know.

[A]

Yeah, I think it's practicing.

[B]

He knew there was a problem.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And he. He responded to that problem, and he protected himself. So it's. It's really a gray area on.

[A]

Well, I think if you looked at it from reasonableness, if you didn't go to court and he was a jury.

[B]

If I looked at it trying to pull a gun. He's about to pull a gun on you, so you better do something, because I'm watching it the whole time he's about to pull a gun and thinking that. And now he didn't have. Either did and we didn't see it or he didn't have enough time because those store clerk started firing bullets.

[A]

Yeah, I think the store clicked. Was justified. I think there was.

[B]

Then they kind of spill to the outside. You still hear gunshots going off. So I don't know what was going on out there. So we can't really say, hey, he should have stopped. We don't know what was going on. But he probably shouldn't have followed him out.

[A]

Probably shouldn't have followed him out.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Probably should just let him go.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But I think his actions in the store.

[B]

I think so.

[A]

Were justifiable. Now, the. The first fight was. Was not a deadly use.

[B]

Nobody. Nobody. I just.

[A]

They just got into a scuffle over.

[B]

Over stuff and got broken up. So.

[A]

Yeah. And it was over. They were sitting there talking to each other. The store clerk was telling guy, oh, you just show me what you had in your bag.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

He just kept saying it. And the guy said, I'll show you what I got. I'll show you what I got. Yeah. And it just escalated from there.

[B]

Okay. Then it went bad there. Yeah.

[A]

I don't know if anybody got hurt. Like I said, there was. Yeah.

[B]

I don't know.

[A]

Couldn't find any.

[B]

Guy missed. If he didn't, he was about maybe five yards from him.

[A]

And there was one guy in the store that was just kind of casually walking around like it's no big deal. This happens every Day he was.

[B]

He wanted Doritos, man. He didn't have time to worry with

[A]

that blue shirt guy, you know, he. He got out of there for all that happened.

[B]

Well, yeah, he was. He done picked up the stuff for the guy and he walked out.

[A]

Yeah. Still trying to calm things down. And the shoplifter pushed him, much like that. No, he did not. So I think a good use of force.

[B]

Oh, yeah, I think so, too. What else you got?

[A]

This next one is out of Houston. I think it was out of Houston. Yeah. This is a home. This was a home invasion. So you got a guy that wakes up, finds a man in his house wearing a mask, and what do you think?

[B]

Houston? Yeah. Well, there's a Houston, Alabama, by the way.

[A]

Well, it's not Houston, Alabama.

[B]

Well, that's why I asked.

[A]

I would have said Houston, Alabama.

[B]

Well, you didn't know. You said it was Houston. I asked if it was Texas.

[A]

Moving on. Man wakes up and finds another man in his house wearing a mask and gloves. So they get into a physical fight that somehow another moved outside.

[B]

Well, that signals a problem, don't it? Yeah.

[A]

You think

[B]

mask and gloves on ass, they probably not. Right.

[A]

He's probably not there to do anything nice. But anyway, so they get into a physical fight. They. This fight goes outside.

[B]

What kind of the fight you get in?

[A]

I guess that's a legitimate question.

[B]

All right, go ahead.

[A]

They get into a fight that ends up going outside and then fighting. At some point, the homeowner went back inside, and then the criminal, you know,

[B]

he returned

[A]

to the backyard for a second confrontation.

[B]

He left and then came back. Yeah, let him.

[A]

Came back a homer, went inside and then come back outside.

[B]

So they know each other.

[A]

I'm wondering. The homeowner then got a gun and shot the criminal, who then ran off again. But they found him dead a little bit later.

[B]

Well, he didn't come back.

[A]

I don't know. Charges have been filed. But let's talk about this from a use of force standpoint. So we got the first physical altercation to what happened? Well, you got a guy, he's asleep. Somebody breaks into his house. There was no forced entry, so they think he just came through a back door or some door or he had a key, I don't know. But he got in the house. There were other people in the house as well. So there's a couple of kids in there and another person. So I think the homeowner definitely had a legitimate reason to be concerned with this.

[B]

Well, somebody comes in, like, with a mask and gloves.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. So you get an initial fight. You know, they get. They get outside the guy, they. They separate. So this is where I think the guy should have stayed in the house, locked the doors, called the police instead of going back out and confronting the home invader a second time when the home invader came back. So I don't know why he went outside, but he did. And at this point, they get into another altercation, and he uses. Begins to use lethal force outside. Now, Castle doctrine in Texas, you should know, since you did, though, the. The research I would imagine takes into is in effect outside your home as well.

[B]

Yes, absolutely does. Perfect.

[A]

Yeah, yeah.

[B]

No doubt you would have known that.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You got. You got 25ft on the side of your curb that you can use Cancel doctrine in Texas.

[A]

No, I don't know.

[B]

I'm just joking there. I don't know about that. Oh, no.

[A]

Oh, my God.

[B]

I made that up. But, yeah, I mean, he's in his backyard. Yeah, he's good.

[A]

His yard. If he's got outside buildings and things like that in Texas, it. It goes. There's some locations to where Castle doctrine only applies to your. Inside your domicile, your main domicile. This is out in your garage.

[B]

We're not lawyers, by the way, so we are not.

[A]

And apparently some of us make up stuff when we don't know it because they didn't do the research they should have done over the last two weeks.

[B]

You didn't tell me to do research on Castle doctrine. I told you do it on Texas because you. I got Texas stuff, man. Calm down. I got it.

[A]

Castle doctrine didn't come up when you did your research.

[B]

Let me look at my notes.

[A]

Oh, my gosh.

[B]

Now you continue on. I'll look at my notes.

[A]

So we got a homeowner.

[B]

This.

[A]

I think it was a legitimate use of force because you had somebody attacking him in his. In his home. But I think he could have avoided that use of force when he went back in and not come back out to re engage. I think, unless there was some reason for him to come back out re engage, which I didn't see any of the reports, man.

[B]

I don't have hardly anything of text. I thought I got more stuff than that.

[A]

So I think he made a mistake there. I don't think it's going to end up costing him. They didn't say whether or not he's been charged yet or not. The home invader has not been charged. I think he passed away.

[B]

I might not be charged dead man. I doubt he's charged with. I might be mistaken.

[A]

He might have been charged. He might have been taken to the hospital. I can't remember for sure now. Either way, he was in the wrong. I. I think the homeowner will be okay legally, but I think you got to be careful with that. Once you break contact, don't go back out and re engage unless there's a reason that you need to. And I don't know if there was a reason in this case. So hopefully he won't be facing any charges from this. Houston's a little bit on the liberal side, so, you know, you could be. You got to be careful with that even in Texas. So that's my take on it. I think it's going to be okay, but probably shouldn't have gone back out to re. Engage that. Yeah, that situation.

[B]

Yeah, I think it's all right. All right.

[A]

I think he would definitely been justified if he had his gun. I would say he needs to be a little bit more. Have a gun a little bit more readily available to when he wakes up and someone's in your house. You can get to a firearm without having to do a physical confrontation with somebody, because that would have been definitely a justifiable use of force. If you use your firearm inside the house and not getting to a physical confrontation with somebody. Would you not agree with that?

[B]

I would agree with that.

[A]

All right. That's what. That's what I had for use of forces. It's a little difficult finding some use, of course, use of force cases this. This week. So.

[B]

Yeah, I couldn't find any.

[A]

Be shocked if you even looked.

[B]

I did not. If I had something. What a back on. Oh, I got it right here.

[A]

All right. Do you want to move on to the state gun laws? You want to do Virginia first? You want to get some Texas stuff?

[B]

We probably do Virginia. I ain't got a whole lot on Texas, apparently.

[A]

All right, let's.

[B]

Let's talk what I do with that whipping?

[A]

You know, Virginia just had all those new gun laws put in place by what's her name, Spanberger, the new governor there.

[B]

They had a new governor, Kid, I'm just joking. I got you. I got you.

[A]

Before you jump into the Virginia stuff.

[B]

I got it.

[A]

Virginia, you cannot bypass the Knicks background check with their concealed carry permit. And they rank 31st in the US for gun ownership. So they're at 44.6% of households having at least one gun, which is, you know, when you look at the votes that they have, they're. They're pretty much Split with just a little bit of majority being on the Democratic side.

[B]

So I can tell you, up until this last election, they had some pretty good gun laws. Up until. But now they're, they're struggling just for reciprocity. They recognize every state even now. Yeah, yeah, every state. Which is surprising. Yeah, I'm sure that'll change when they.

[A]

I'm surprised that. Yeah, I'm surprised that wasn't one of the things that got changed.

[B]

That's good. So the minimum purchase age is now 21 with exception for military or law enforcement training. Oh, speaking of, you know, we go back to that every time, but yeah,

[A]

so, you know, recognizing the permits and everything. One of the things we didn't talk about the attempt on Trump at the White House Correspondents dinner. Yeah, but you know, they've charged. One of the things Piro was saying was, well, this guy broke all kind of laws just bringing the gun across state lines. He had a shotgun and a pistol.

[B]

You can take shotguns across state lines. Right. He didn't break any laws.

[A]

This is so irritating when we have supposedly Pro2A people that don't know the laws and rules. They've charged him. Now bringing it into D.C. might have been a crap.

[B]

Yeah, probably so.

[A]

But not driving from California to, to D.C. that every state he went through is not a crime.

[B]

Right.

[A]

It's irritating.

[B]

So. All right, so public is going effective in on July 1, 2026 bands the carry of an assault firearm on public streets, roads, sidewalks or public parks.

[A]

Did they define what that is?

[B]

I want to tell you what they let me find it on.

[A]

Look at you.

[B]

I got, I got it. Let's see, key aspects of the definition of an assault firearm. Semiautomatic center fire rifles. Any semi automatic center fire rifle that has the capacity to accept a detachable magazine and has at least one of the folding, telescoping or collapsible stock. Pistol grip or thumb hole stock that protrudes beneath the action. Second hand grip or protruding grip for the non trigger hand. A grenade launcher. A threaded barrel. So it's in it. A threaded barrel capable of accepting a flash suppressor, muzzle brake or sound suppressor. So any one of those, if you just have just.

[A]

It's rifle but it does stay rifle. So yeah. So what about AR pistols?

[B]

That's, it's, it's got a pistol grip or something. Yeah, it's still going. My guess is. Let's see, excluded fires. The next definition generally excludes antique firearms, inoperable firearms or manually operated firearms. They also have Fixed magazine, let's say semi automatic center fire rifles or pistols with a fixed magazine capacity in excess of 15 rounds. Fixed magazine. That's so some of the compliant firearms that you know. So you get around to detach by making a fixed magazine and you basically feed it with a clip or something. So yeah.

[A]

Put a stripper clip in.

[B]

Yeah. So anything there they fixed magazine capacity more than 15 is. Is not illegal either.

[A]

It's not legal.

[B]

Not legal. Shotguns. Certain semi automatic shotguns with special features such as folding stock or spring tension drum magazine capable of holding 12 or more shells. So here's. They do have a grandfather clause that will go in to effect. But you notice that was they got rid of it.

[A]

Yeah. The next year they'll get rid of that.

[B]

As of 07-01-2026 they will have a grandfather clause. Let me see, let me go back to.

[A]

I guarantee you next year, the next, next year that'll be gone. They'll ban it where you can't.

[B]

So they also going to affect. 7-1-2026. Mandatory safe storage requires firearms to be secured in a locked container or rendered inoperable with a locking device if a minor is present. Universal background checks are in effect now reestablished by the Virginia State Police for private person to person transfers.

[A]

So they got to go through an FFL to do any kind of transfer?

[B]

Yep.

[A]

That's ridiculous.

[B]

So open carry is legal for individuals 18 or older who are not present, prohibited from possessing firearms. Concealed carry requires a concealed handgun permit. Now I go back to this public carry ban. It's still very vague of what they call an assault firearm because I think. I think it's more than rifles. So that's just. I was thinking that one definition was just raffles. I think there's more to it. It's very vague. It's hard to find how they're defining

[A]

that because I thought it ended up here hitting or anything as well.

[B]

Anything with 15 mag. 15 rounds or more for sure. So a concealed handgun may be carried in a personal vehicle without a permit if it is secured in a container or compartment. There's no state registry for firearms except for machine guns. Individuals subject to protective orders are required to relinquish firearms. So I mean somebody just make a protective order. So they are red flag laws in Virginia. Virginia has a substantial risk order process aligned for the temporary removal of firearms from individuals deemed dangerous to themselves or others local. There's a. If you go and look at preemption, it's all about. There is preemption laws but if you Go and look at these new rules. Localities are empowered to pass their own gun safety laws which may include restrictions on carrying in public spaces like parks or government buildings. So they're adding that in there. HB 1525 prohibits the purchase of certain firearms by legal adults under the age of 21. This bill includes an emergency clause making a law immediately rather than on July 1, 2026. So you can't purchase under the age of 21. The another bill outlaws carrying a transferring many types of common firearms on public property. This includes any semiotic, semi automatic center fire rifle or pistol to go back with a fixed magazine capacity over 15 rounds. This all takes effect July 1st.

[A]

Do they already have magazine capacity limits in Virginia? Is this something. Are they going to have it with this? Did that get removed from the bill? I know they had it in there. Begin.

[B]

You know they had it. No. So what they had was the. You couldn't. They prohibited the purchase of them. Now they're going to add it on there. So prohibits the purchase or sale of magazines with capacity of 15 rounds. Now they. Your grandfathered in. If you have these magazines, you can't purchase them in Virginia. But your grandfather then and probably until next year because there's no election. So they'll, they'll go in.

[A]

Yeah, they'll add possession as well. Gotcha.

[B]

So we already talked about the safe storage domestic violence misdemeanor convicts. Misdemeanor convictions for intimate partner battery after 7-1-2026 results in a three year prohibit prohibition.

[A]

Prohibition, Prohibition.

[B]

Prohibition. Thank you. I swear. Prohibition on purchasing or possessing fires. My goodness. What is wrong with me, man? I have a computer science degree. I have a college educated person and I couldn't say a prohibition computer science degree. I write software for a living. I work on missile systems.

[A]

You don't use your language.

[B]

Goodness gracious. You know I'm, I'm smarter than I sound.

[A]

Well, agree to disagree.

[B]

Ghost ban, ghost gun ban restrictions.

[A]

I get so sick of that crap.

[B]

See, let's go here.

[A]

What's irritating is a lot of these, a lot of these rules, not only just Virginia, these other states are ultimately unconstitutional. But there's no consequences. The Supreme Court is going to bring cases. DOJ or I say the DOJ is going to bring cases against these states. But it's going to take years to go through the courts.

[B]

So they are not a constitutional.

[A]

The Supreme Court just lets it happen even though they've got rulings in place, brewing Cargill, all these other rulings.

[B]

So to apply for Virginia CCO you must be 21 not disqualified by law. Submit and submit a completed application. You must demonstrate competence with a handgun, typically via a hunter safety course, NRA training or. You love this military documentation.

[A]

Oh my gosh.

[B]

First time applicants usually apply in person to the clerk. Nothing against court in their city or county of residence.

[A]

Nothing is military training.

[B]

But a lot of them don't do pistol training. I'm with you. There's a. Fees vary by locality, usually under 50 and the permit is process. How long do you think now you don't know. What'd you say? Permits process within 45 days. They have up to 45 days renewals can often be mailed and you can apply for renewal up to 180 days before the current permit expires.

[A]

That's pretty. My renewal for my FFL

[B]

as of May 2026. Virginia recognizes valid concealed handgun permits from all other US states.

[A]

Is that not going to change or

[B]

did you say to legally carry in Virginia, holders must have a valid photo ID, carry their permit and their issuance. State must allow 24, 7 permit verification. Virginia does not recognize permits from those under 21 or non resident permits unless specified. So. So if you have a valid permit but you're under 21, they don't recognize that.

[A]

How do we know if. If we have 24, 7 coverage to validate that up?

[B]

I don't know. I got a permit. Yeah, I don't know, but they.

[A]

That's interesting.

[B]

Yeah, it is interesting. What else? You want to know what else? No.

[A]

That's good man. Do you have anything?

[B]

I'm still on Virginia. I'm still on Virginia. Still on Virginia.

[A]

We still got that drill to talk about?

[B]

Oh yeah. My battery's holding up.

[A]

Yeah. It's gonna go dead on us. Yeah, probably so.

[B]

Probably. It ain't good. My MacBook's not charging.

[A]

Right. Well, just, just give us. Did you have anything else on Texas from last episode?

[B]

I don't remember why we. What was arguing about on Texas?

[A]

We wouldn't argue about anything. You got about 10 seconds worth of stuff.

[B]

Oh, well, I got 10 more then. I don't know. We'll have 20 seconds on Texas then. Hold on, I got you. Let me get to my notes.

[A]

What are we doing next?

[B]

All right, as of May 2026, Texas maintains permissive constitutional carry laws allowing most adults 21 and older to openly or concealed carry handguns without a permit or training. While permanent carry is legal, license to carry are still issued for reciprocity with other states and for 18 to 20 year olds. So. Yeah, we talked about that last time. Due to some new rulings. You can, you can carry at 18. Let's see, there are some probate prohibited locations. Guns are prohibited in schools, polling places, courts secured airport areas, racetracks and bars. We missed the state.

[A]

We probably should have done Vermont before we did Virginia.

[B]

We already. I thought we did Vermont. I thought Vermont was one of our good ones. That was New Hampshire. That was a good one. I guess we got to come back to Vermont. Hey, good job. That's on you. We'll come back and get Vermont next time. So if you're opening. If you're open carry in Texas, it must be in a holster.

[A]

Where else would it be?

[B]

You can't just run down.

[A]

I think that, I guess they're saying you can't just stick in your pants or.

[B]

Yeah, now I'm wondering if they're. I wonder if they not allow an open carry of rifles. Now,

[A]

that's what it sounds like.

[B]

Because you had some of those protests and some of the marches with rifles.

[A]

That would have been good piece of information.

[B]

Is that so?

[A]

Yeah, that makes sense. So you can't open. Yeah, that's bullcrap.

[B]

Individuals with a misdemeanor.

[A]

This is Texas. Texas. See, that's bullcrap.

[B]

Individuals with misdemeanor family violence convictions may possess a firearm five years after completing their sentence different from differing from federal law. So it takes them five years to get that. That back. So that's a little bit of. I got a little bit more. Hold on. I got some more on it. Just give me a minute here.

[A]

Keep putting my dog to sleep. Oh, this is good.

[B]

Hey, don't worry. I got this. Here's the does my gun need to be in a holster? Question. If a handgun is partially or wholly visible, it must be in a holster of the Texas penal code now only uses the term holster. Before the 2021amendments, it's used the phrase shoulder or belt holster. The law does not define the word holster.

[A]

What about a rifle?

[B]

I. I don't have good Internet out here. I don't know. Oh, man, that have been a good one to know.

[A]

You just going to be quiet and not say anything else?

[B]

Oh, my. I thought you were asking questions.

[A]

I'm. I'm looking up.

[B]

I've already got through all my stuff here. I got through everything that I was going to talk about.

[A]

I wanted to ask. Yes, you can open and carry a rifle or shotgun in Texas without a permit. Texas law generally permits the open carry of long guns provided they are not displayed in a manner Calculated to alarm others. You must be. I got it right here. 18 years old to legally carry a rifle and it must not be carried in a prohibited location.

[B]

Hold on a minute. Here's what I got on that says Texas law does not specifically put restrictions on who can carry a license long guns such as rifle or shotgun. However, some people are prohibited from carrying or possessing any firearm by law. So there you go. I answered your question for you. Yeah, thanks.

[A]

I appreciate that.

[B]

Problem. I had it in my notes, man. You didn't give me time to find it. I got like notes everywhere.

[A]

All right, all right. I did, I did a lot of research. Did a lot better. All right, let's move on. Finish up this podcast episode with a little talk about the drill that we shot this past weekend at the range. And this is. It was just a, basically a, a two to the body, one to the head drill, sometimes called the Mozambique drill. Made I guess made famous from the Tom Cruise movie when he did that in Collateral.

[B]

I don't think it made famous from that.

[A]

Oh, it was popular. Made more popular from that. He did a good job in that drill. But. So we shot it from a couple of different distances. I shot it from. Not a concealed carry host, but I

[B]

shot it 3, 5, 7 yards.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

From concealment is what I did.

[A]

Yeah. And I was consistently well under two seconds on, on mine from the, from a side hoster.

[B]

So yeah, I think I was like, I was a little slower because my draw, my index was off terrible. So I was like right at two

[A]

seconds, you're, you're not focusing on the target. You're on a spot on the target. You're trying to focus on the dot. You gotta focus more on the spot on the target. So I was consistently.

[B]

Yeah, I gotta work on my draw.

[A]

Yeah, I gotta get that first shot

[B]

off a little quicker. Yeah, so that was my problem. My index was off, so I was a little, little slow.

[A]

I did have a few times at about seven yards where I would, when I would transition to that headshot, shoot a little high, go over the target.

[B]

Yeah, my griping was much better when I was off the timer. When I, when I wasn't on the timer, man, I was, I was shooting that good.

[A]

Yeah, it was a good, it's a

[B]

good drill timer a little bit.

[A]

I like shooting that drill, you know. Well, the different distances are nice. I like doing a close up drill with that. Just to be where you get that first two shots as quick as you can and then back up as you're backing up. Take that Head shot.

[B]

I was working my index last night, and it was. I was getting it. I got it much better. So.

[A]

So it's always good to do that at a couple different distances. I think we should have. I don't know why we didn't think about doing two targets to that drill.

[B]

I did, but I didn't. I just. I was wanting to do the one. I thought about the two, two target do. Do two, one, two, one. But then, you know, that's. That's six rounds there.

[A]

That's good.

[B]

Yeah. Math minor, baby. Almost a major. One more class. I had a major in math.

[A]

I don't have a major.

[B]

Computer science major.

[A]

I needed one more class in philosophy to get a. Get a minor in philosophy.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Should have done that.

[B]

Of course. That's.

[A]

What.

[B]

How long ago was that?

[A]

I graduated 93, 30 years ago. What? It's 26.

[B]

That's 33.

[A]

You said 30. I know, but that's.

[B]

I'm rounding it, man. I'm rounding down. That's your math matter. I'm rounding. Hey, I realized this is 20, 26, and that's 33 years. I realized that. All right. I was rounding the numbers. Okay, that's fine. I just. Going with a nice round number, but hey.

[A]

All right, good deal. It's been a while.

[B]

It's been a long time ago. All right.

[A]

All right, well, we're gonna do some more drills and try to talk a little bit more detail about them. We have a lot to talk about. We'll do this.

[B]

We're gonna do that 10 yard drill,

[A]

and then we'll do that four circle drill, too, and kind of talk about it. You can look it up. It's. It's a difficult. Very difficult drill to do.

[B]

Then we'll do the 7. 7 drill.

[A]

Yeah. Is that the one?

[B]

That's a tier one? There's something like that. 7. 7 shots, 21 yards. It gets. It's. It's a.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

That's where the mag drain. That's a difficult drill.

[A]

Yeah. So we're trying to do a few more of these while we're at the range, just to provide a little bit. If you got any. Any drills in particular you. That you do or you like, see us talk about, send us a text, send us a note, and we'll do that. And again, if you want a shirt, send me your address and shirt size, and we'll get you a shirt out to you. Like I said, it's gonna be a couple weeks before we get some of these orders out, but we'll try to get them out as soon as we we can. Other than that, that's all I got. You got anything else?

[B]

No, I don't have anything else. All right.

[A]

We are everything. Guns.

[B]

We're out. 55 minutes of you being boring. You suck.