2025-2026 Big 12 Season Preview - Will Houston get back to the title game? Can Kansas bounce back?

Summary

Eye On College Basketball: 2025-2026 Big 12 Season Preview

Podcast: Eye on College Basketball
Date: October 24, 2025
Hosts: Matt Norlander & John Gasaway (filling in for Gary Parrish)

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Overview

Live from Big 12 Media Day in Kansas City, Matt Norlander and John Gasaway deliver an in-depth, on-the-ground preview of the 2025-26 Big 12 Men's Basketball season. They break down the league’s key storylines, dig into team-by-team analysis, debate player and coach outlooks, and preview one of college basketball’s most loaded conferences. Major topics include Houston’s shot at redemption, Kansas’ bounce-back potential, and the new wave of freshmen stars set to dominate both the league and NBA draft boards.

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Main Discussion Points and Insights

1. State of the Big 12: Media Day Vibes

[01:44–06:52]

• Hosts highlight the energy and organization of Big 12 Media Day in Kansas City.
• Norlander reflects:
  “This might be the best media day you could be at… national championship coaches, hall of famers, and maybe the top two picks in the NBA draft. It hits you, you’re talking to the possible face of the NBA someday.” [06:14]
• Both praise the unique opportunity to interact personally with coaches and players.

2. Top 5 Storylines in the Conference

1. Can Houston Get Over the Hump?

[06:52–14:19]

• Houston lost the national title game after leading by double digits in the second half.
• Kelvin Sampson’s calm but determined approach:
  “He doesn’t need to retire with a national championship... but absolutely he wants to get it. There’s a certain confidence with him right now.” [08:15 - Norlander recounting Sampson’s words]
• Gasaway has Houston preseason No. 1:
  “Splitting hairs, I’ve got Houston No. 1 and Purdue No. 2. This Houston staff, their culture, everything there… they’re my preseason pick.” [12:38]
• Emphasis on Houston’s resilience and culture, highlighted by player routines and their 34–4 Big 12 record since joining the league.

2. The Big 12 Player of the Year (POY) Race: DeBanza vs Peterson vs Toppin

[17:01–21:36]

• The POY race features preseason favorites:
  • AJ DeBanza (BYU freshman)
  • Darren Peterson (Kansas freshman)
  • JT Toppin (Texas Tech, reigning POY)
• Norlander on DeBanza:
  “He is going to be a monster... capable of winning games in a variety of ways.” [18:45]
• Matt on Peterson:
  “You talk to Bill Self about him… never coached a freshman like this. He’s gonna put the ball in that young man’s hands and ask him to get Kansas back.” [20:10]
• Gasaway adds:
  “This could also double as the National Player of the Year race.” [21:28]
• JT Toppin gets respect but trails the two freshmen on most preseason ballots.

3. Can Kansas Bounce Back Strong?

[21:42–24:56]

• Gasaway ranks Kansas No. 7 nationally, second in the Big 12:
  “It’s hard to resolve around the idea that KU would go three straight seasons not making a Sweet 16 or being a top-4 seed.” [22:51]
• Peterson’s arrival sparks optimism, Bill Self’s motivation noted:
  “He hears what people are saying… has the program slipped? And he wants to stop people from asking those questions.” [24:11]
• Debate over depth and talent compared to past KU teams.

4. Texas Tech’s Leap: Final Four Contender?

[26:13–28:19]

• Focus on Grant McCasland’s coaching growth following last year’s Elite Eight loss.
• Norlander:
  “He actually watched [the loss] the night of the game, and says he goes back to it all the time… just trying to learn from it. That’s really impressive.” [26:46–27:42]
• Praises McCasland’s overachievement at every D1 stop.
• Texas Tech’s depth beyond Toppin: Chris Andersen, Luke Bamboy, Tyree Bryan, Lawan Watts.

5. Is the Big 12 Still The Best League?

[29:21–31:30]

• Can the Big 12 retake the mantle from the SEC?
• “It’s a three-league race: SEC, Big Ten, Big 12. I think the Big Ten will rank No. 1 in the metrics at the end, but the Big 12 wouldn’t be a surprise...” [29:25, Gasaway]
• Norlander gives the Big 12 roughly a 40% chance of being No. 1 in computer rankings, but says it will be “the most entertaining league” regardless. [30:12–31:26]

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Team-by-Team Projections & Deep Dives

Preseason Rankings – Consensus Top 9

([33:09–47:43], see table for team order) | Norlander | Gasaway | |------------------|--------------| | 1. Houston | 1. Houston | | 2. BYU | 2. Kansas | | 3. Texas Tech | 3. Arizona | | 4. Arizona | 4. Texas Tech| | 5. Iowa State | 5. BYU | | 6. Kansas | 6. Iowa State| | 7. Baylor | 7. Baylor | | 8. Kansas State | 8. Cincinnati| | 9. Cincinnati | 9. K-State |

BYU Is a Popular Sleeper

• Norlander moves them to No. 2 due to off-season talent upgrades and last year’s stretch as a top-10 team.

Baylor’s Complete Roster Reset

• “Baylor does not return a single player that played for them a season ago. It’s wild.” [38:33]
• Both hosts praise Scott Drew’s positivity and adaptability.

Kansas State’s Underrated Star

• PJ Haggerty (transfer from Memphis) might be the league’s most overlooked preseason All-American.
• “He had one of the greatest individual seasons in Memphis history... Tang thinks he'll reenter that (All-American) conversation pretty quickly.” [43:48–44:36]

Other Teams Discussed

• Arizona: Jaden Bradley, Toby Iwaka, Braden Burries as key pieces [36:20].
• Iowa State: Returns more minutes per game than any other Big 12 team, core of Tamen Lipsey, Joshua Jefferson, Milan Momcilovic [37:55].
• Cincinnati & West Miller: A tournament-or-bust year after dismissing Jizzle James [41:01].
• TCU/Oklahoma State/West Virginia/Colorado/Utah/UCF/Arizona State:
  Lots of coaching pressure at the bottom (Bobby Hurley, Johnny Dawkins potentially on hot seat) [45:34–47:14].

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Key Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Houston’s dominance:
  “34–4 over a two-year span in the Big 12… you’re not supposed to do that. Nobody’s supposed to do that.” [14:56 – Norlander on Sampson]
• Peterson’s expectations at Kansas:
  “Bill has coached the No. 1 pick, coached an MVP, but he doesn’t mince words: he’s never coached a freshman like Darren Peterson.” [20:10 – Norlander]
• On Baylor's rebuild:
  “They’re really just plugging numbers into an algorithm… it’s almost completely backwards [recruiting].” [39:42 – Norlander on Scott Drew’s approach]
• On the transfer scene:
  “There was a Baylor—Cincinnati trade: Celestine went from Baylor to Cincy, Skillings from Cincy to Baylor.” [41:35]
• On why the league will entertain:
  “Whether it’s the best or not… it’s the most interesting: national champs, rising stars, two NBA top picks.” [31:23 – Norlander]
• On preseason awards voting logic:
  “There is no scenario where you watch a season of Big 12 basketball and decide Darren Peterson is the best player in the league but someone else is the freshman of the year. That’s stupid. I will not stand for that.” [54:02 – Norlander, classic rant]

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Predictions & Awards

NCAA Tournament Bids

[52:34–52:38]

• Both hosts think 9 Big 12 teams will dance:
  Houston, BYU, Texas Tech, Arizona, Iowa State, Kansas, Baylor, Kansas State, Cincinnati.

Preseason Conference Awards

[54:40–57:35]

• Player of the Year / Freshman of the Year

  • Matt Norlander: AJ DeBanza (BYU)
  • John Gasaway: Darren Peterson (Kansas)
  • Both: “If a freshman wins POY, he's also FOY, period!”

• Transfer of the Year

  • Both: PJ Haggerty (Kansas State)
    • “Consensus second-team All-American is an option, you take him.” [57:15]

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Notable Timestamps

• 06:01 – Introduction of this year's top storylines
• 08:15 – Houston’s quest for a title, Sampson's focus
• 14:56 – Houston’s incredible Big 12 record, Sampson’s scheduling philosophy
• 17:01 – The Big 12 Player of the Year race heats up
• 21:42 – Kansas’ bounce-back and roster deep-dive
• 26:13 – Texas Tech’s March heartbreak and McCasland’s evolution
• 29:21 – Is the Big 12 still the country’s best conference?
• 34:01 – Hosts reveal and debate their team rankings
• 43:48 – Kansas State’s PJ Haggerty love fest
• 52:34 – Tournament bids: 9 is the consensus over/under
• 54:40 – Player, Freshman, and Transfer of the Year picks and the annual Norlander rant

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Tone and Highlights

• The hosts are energetic, occasionally irreverent, passionate for inside jokes (e.g., Norlander's “dead arm” story at [03:13]) and committed to both sharp analysis and high entertainment value.
• Memorable banter includes light ribbing about the voting process and Norlander’s hilarious frustration over possible ballot anomalies.

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Summary Table: Top Projected Teams (Preseason)

| Rank | Matt Norlander | John Gasaway | |------|----------------|---------------| | 1 | Houston | Houston | | 2 | BYU | Kansas | | 3 | Texas Tech | Arizona | | 4 | Arizona | Texas Tech | | 5 | Iowa State | BYU | | 6 | Kansas | Iowa State | | 7 | Baylor | Baylor | | 8 | Kansas State | Cincinnati | | 9 | Cincinnati | Kansas State |

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For Listeners

If you’re seeking the most up-to-date and comprehensive breakdown of the Big 12 as it enters its deepest, most talent-packed season in years, this preview is required listening. From on-the-ground Media Day color to deep roster dives, award debates, coaching hot seats, and NBA lottery projections, Norlander and Gasaway have you covered.

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[End of episode content. All timestamps above in MM:SS format. Ads, intros, and outros omitted.]

Transcript

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[Matt Norlander]

Hey there Gary Parish. Welcome back to The CBS Sports IO college basketball podcast where we sometimes discuss camel fighting dodo birds and leaky black. Matt Norlander is here with me. If you're watching on YouTube, you know what to do to that. Like button shouts to Brandon Davies. And if you haven't yet subscribed to the CBS Sports college basketball YouTube channel, please also do that while you're here. Let's get into it. We are in Kansas City. We are T Mobile Center. Yes, we've been here for Big 12 media day and we figured this would be a perfect opportunity to continue our series of conference previews that we've been doing for the past week or so. It's a Big 12 preview. Norlander. Today we've talked to. Oh man. Kelvin Sampson, Bill Self, Scott Drew, Tommy Lloyd, Grant McCasler. Perhaps the top two picks the 2026 NBA draft. Yeah, that's A.J. deBonson and Darren Peterson. Just I'm a veteran of Big 12 media day.

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Are you?

[Matt Norlander]

I'VE done this before.

[John Gasaway]

How many times?

[Matt Norlander]

I can never keep track of stuff like that, but a bunch he doesn't know. Quite a few. I know I was here last year and I know I was here before last year.

[John Gasaway]

Really? Okay.

[Matt Norlander]

But this was your first time, your first experience of Big 12 media day. How did you enjoy it?

[John Gasaway]

I enjoyed it plenty. If you are listening to the pod, go to that YouTube page. Sincerely, subscribe and watch us, because we got GP and I here. Parrish doesn't have use of his left arm. So this is a podcast with tremendous potential.

[Matt Norlander]

What do you think happened?

[John Gasaway]

I don't know.

[Matt Norlander]

Let me tell you what happened. Norland and I went to dinner last night. I had a very mediocre burnt end sandwich.

[John Gasaway]

Correct.

[Matt Norlander]

All right. And it was a perfectly good night. And I went back to my hotel room and I watched the end of the NBA doubleheader and I got some work done. And then at some point, I laid down and went to sleep.

[John Gasaway]

Sure.

[Matt Norlander]

And when I woke up this morning, I couldn't move my left arm. I can't. That's it. That's as far as it goes. That's as far as it goes.

[John Gasaway]

We have a dead arm situation here.

[Matt Norlander]

I'm now.

[John Gasaway]

Dead arm. You got a dead arm situation.

[Matt Norlander]

What goes around comes around.

[John Gasaway]

But I believe Parrish, by the way, he teed me up and then he just took his own story. So we're one for one. We're back as strong as we ever were. What I was going to say was we had this awesome backdrop, by the way. Shouts to Gigi and Greg. They're our amazing team. They're behind us, they're off camera. Gigi made sure we had this awesome backdrop here just for the pod. Big 12, tremendous. As good, if not better than any media day setup I've ever been a part of. Wanted to mention that had never come out here. This is my first time ever to Kansas City, and that's one of my biggest takeaways, was just how well run this whole event is. We're here in the. What they like to say, the bowels of the arena. But everything that was out in the main bowl, everything, they ran it. It was wonderful and I had a really, really good time. And frankly, this is our first together. Hope it's not our last. And we've got a three camera situation going on right here. This is a high level podcast production. We're face to face. We're sitting on a 45 degree angle. We got our computers. This is your Big 12 preview. This is different from all the other ones. This is the benefit of coming to one location together, being face to face same day. So you're getting this on the feed. A little removed from when we're taping it, but we're all too happy to do so and happy to dive in and mostly give you a lot of. With the Big 12, as we did with the ACC, Big East, Big Ten and SEC.

[Matt Norlander]

I love being here just because it's an opportunity to see everybody again.

[John Gasaway]

Yeah.

[Matt Norlander]

You know, we're spending real time.

[John Gasaway]

That's great.

[Matt Norlander]

Like the best.

[John Gasaway]

I'm jumping real quick here because I didn't want to not mention this. It is so good just to see not just the players and we'll get to them, but just to see the coaches. Everyone's in a good mood. No one's lost a game yet. Some of these guys, we see plenty of these guys in the summer, but sometimes we don't actually see them because they're in one gym, they're in one state while we're in another, and we're just like crossing paths, walking through the hallways. Got to spend time with Clark Kellogg. Saw a number of folks in the media we haven't seen that ran into Seth Davis. It was wonderful just to catch with folks in general. So I'm right there with you. Just, it's. This is a very, very productive trip. Not just for the interviews, we're happy to drop those in the podcast feed, but just to press some flesh and to get to see these folks again. Because you and I both know it's October 22nd as we tape this. A lot of these guys on November 22nd, they're just going to be going through some different stuff. I thought they're not awesome to talk to. They are, but their mindset right now is not what it's going to be four weeks from now.

[Matt Norlander]

Yeah. And so, yeah, just spending real time with Bill Self, real time with Kelvin Sampson, real time with Tommy Lloyd, T.J. otzelberger, just a fun day. And I really do think this might be the best media day that you could be at because you've got national championship coaches, hall of Famers, future hall of Famers, and then again the two young men who might be the top two picks in the NBA draft. And, you know, it gets referenced sometimes, particularly back home, how I did that. Sit down with Derrick Rose at Central Barbecue once upon a time. And it did occur to me today that we were having those moments. Like you sat down with A.J. i sat down with Darren Peterson, and it wasn't Lost on me that in that moment I was talking to somebody who really could be the face of the NBA someday. Either one of them could be.

[John Gasaway]

Yes, no, without a doubt. And that is a big time storyline. We're going to get to that. But let's get to. Let's get to the top five storylines here. Going in, by the way, on this one. GP and I collaborated, but I'll read them off. Team up. We'll go back and forth here. I think we do agree that the number one storyline in the league this season is can Houston go from national title game loser to national championship winning team? Can they go from one possession away to getting it done? You talk with Kelvin on Cam. I want to hear about that. Because the other interesting thing about this is we just did all these. I didn't hear what GP and Kelvin talked about or GP and Tommy Lloyd. He didn't hear what I chatted over with Jerome Tang, although I did tell him that the Tang appearance on the pod was awesome, in addition to some other players there. But I did get to talk to Kelvin with Clark in the hallway for just a little bit. And an amazing storyteller. And he is. He's ready. I mean, I know he's ready, but what were your takeaways from your chat with him? And I know you don't have Houston preseason number one, but with what they're capable of and just how he's wired, I mean, it's hard to walk away from a day like this, GP and not think like there's one coach who's actually like built to withstand getting that far and then got to climb all the way up that mountain again. You were right there. You were one step, one shot away, and then you tumble all the way back and now they're going to do it again. I think Calvin's built to do it.

[Matt Norlander]

100% and I think he knows he's got a team that can do it and also knows that he's had teams in the past that could have done it, including the one last season. I mean, it wasn't just that they were in the national title game. They were up 12 points in the second half. Like, you know that there was a moment on that Monday night where if you were watching that game, you assumed Kelvin Sampson was about to win a national championship. The Houston Cougars were going to be your champions. And then Walter Clayton happened and everything else. But it was interesting because Calvin said, yeah, I've gone back and looked at it. Not like watch the whole game, but I have gone back and looked at like from 16 to 12, from 12 to 8, these little four minute spots. What happened? What happened? How did we go from up 12 to now we're only up 8. What happened? And he said he went back and looked at all of that, but he's not getting caught up on it. Like the idea that he's walking around burdened every day because he let a national championship slip away, for lack of a better phrase, just not, not his reality. He said that he doesn't need to retire with a national championship. Like it's not if he retires and he doesn't have one, it will not be something that, that burdens him every day of his life. But absolutely he wants to get it. And I think there's a certain confidence with him right now where he knows that yeah, it's not the same team, but it's a team that is. And I don't want to put words in his mouth, perhaps not equally equipped to try to go do the whole thing, but can you go do the whole thing? Yeah. And he's going to take a shot at it. Fanduel's got an offer. You don't want to miss this NFL season. New customers can bet just $5 and get 300 in bonus bets if you win. That's right, pick a bet, bet five bucks and if it wins, you'll unlock 300 bucks in bonus bets to use all across the app. You can build parlays, bet player props, ride the live lines. Whatever your style, fanduel has you covered. The NFL season is here. The only question is, are you ready to play? Visit FanDuel.com I that's eye to download the FanDuel app today and get started.

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[John Gasaway]

This podcast is going to publish on Friday. If some early birds are getting to it, I think you're going to listen before my preseason top 101 teams finally publishes, I'll say right here, Houston is my preseason number one. I settled on that a few weeks ago, but I ultimately, like I landed on it, you know, with finality, you know, maybe two weeks or so. And it's splitting hairs. I've got Houston one and I've got Purdue number two. I've got the Johnny's on the back end of the top 10 GP's. Number one team, of course. Here's who they add back. Emmanuel Sharpe, who we saw walking around saying, Milos Usan walking around today. Joseph Tugler, our preseason defensive player of the year. We actually just introduced that award for the first time this season. That published earlier this week. They bring in Chris Cenac. And talking to Kelvin about cnac because he's a five star player, traditionally he has not brought in these kind of players. He's really excited. But as we got to talking about Tugler, he's like, oh yeah, he's getting a learning lesson every single day because Tugler's abilities are just insane. He called Tugler the crazy glue that plugs every single hole that we could possibly need. So they bring back plenty of pieces. I'm going to buy in on USAM being one of the best guards in the country, Tugler being maybe the best defensive player in the country. That staff everything there. They're my preseason pick. You know, it's very, very close. They finished top two at Ken Palm four seasons in a row. But yes, the story of Houston within the context of the Big 12, but also within the context nationally, a very famous, borderline infamous finish. And I am very intrigued to see if they can do it. And then just keep this in mind. A year ago Houston started. Do you remember? They were four, three. They started. So the win loss was kind of like, we'll kind of wait and see.

[Matt Norlander]

Guess what?

[John Gasaway]

They lost two games the rest of the season. So if we have some hiccups, Houston is going to go play in the players era in Vegas. I'll be out there to see the Cougs up close and personal. Don't go overreacting and I promise not to. Unless they pull like a Yukon in Vegas and go, maybe then I'll overreact. But I think what Kelvin told you, I think there's a very real potential that there's some bumps in the first month of the season. They won't flip out over that. They won't stress. There is a process and if that were to happen, I wouldn't be surprised whatsoever if then we got to the middle of February and we looked up and Houston had lost like one or two games since then. We know they're capable of doing it.

[Matt Norlander]

Just a couple more thoughts on Calvin. He made some interesting points. One just about the culture that they have established there and maintained despite roster turnover. He said this morning because his wife's out of town and he woke up in Houston this morning and he said this morning he Woke up at 4:30, took the dog out, went walking and then came back took the dog out again. Eventually got into the gym at 5:15 around 5:30 and said his players were already in there working and he was like, that's the stuff. That's the good Stuff. I asked him about being 34 and 4 in the Big 12 because that's what they are. Since he moved that program from the American to this conference, which is outrageous. Even when Bill is stringing 14 straight Big 12 regular season titles, you're not supposed to go 19 and one in the league. 34, four over a two year span. So I said, how do you make sense of it? And he said, when you frame it like that, you can't make sense of it. I don't even know how. I'm 34 and four in the big 12. You're not supposed to do that. Nobody's supposed to do that. He said. But the thing that people always get backwards is I don't talk about coaching in the Big 12 ever because I don't coach against the conference. I coach against teams. Now I was in a conference and sometimes those teams were Memphis and East Carolina and now they're Kansas and Texas Tech, but it's just teams. I'm just trying to figure out how to beat this team in front of us. And that's the way I've looked at it forever. Whether I was in the American, the Big Ten, the Big 12, wherever I worked, I'm just give me the schedule and it's got teams on it. I'm not playing a conference, I'm playing teams that come from these conferences. And I just. He just seems to look at it a totally different way and whatever he's doing, it's clearly working because barring a surprise and there's obviously other legitimate title contenders in this league. But, but barring a surprise, they're. They're the pick. They should win it. And if they do, it would be.

[John Gasaway]

A third straight and Usanne is going to be in that conversation, potentially be the lead player of the year. Wouldn't surprise me. But let's go to storyline number two. AJ DeBanta vs Darren Peterson vs JT Toppin for Big 12 Player of the year. We will get. Don't spoil it yet. We will reveal each of our picks at the end of the podcast. Parrish. Don't spoil it yet. So let's talk around the storyline without revealing who you actually have decided. Here's one spoiler. We don't have the same pick. You sat with Peterson. I sat with the Bansa and Toppin. Don't spoil. Don't spoil. Don't spoil. I'll lift up your left arm so bad. No, I think this is going to be one of the dominant storylines in the conference and a dominant storyline nationally. Real quick for me on Debanta and Toppan obviously if you're watching listening you can go back and intake those interviews in our podcast feed on YouTube or wherever you listen and get your pods. Toppan super humble and I think he is maybe slightly, a little bit undervalued just because in the context of these incoming freshmen one and done players, Braden Smith, preseason national player of the year, all that stuff. Toppen was an outright beast and basically in my estimation went from a guy who was outside the all American conversation period to in a three, four week span becoming one of the three or four best players in the entire country and vaulting himself into that first team All America status. I will not under undervalue or underrate him. I'll get to see him in person when Texas Tech plays out Illinois in the second week of the season. I'll let you speak on Peterson I did sit down with Debanza. I do think he is going to be a monster this season who is capable of winning games for BYU in a variety of different ways. I don't think they're necessarily going to ask him or he'll be a guy who drops 35 plus six times a season. If he does it, I won't be stunned. But they have too much offense. I mean maybe BYU GP is able to average.

[Matt Norlander]

He's got 30, doesn't he?

[John Gasaway]

I know, I know he did. But as he told me like and I do believe him when he says he's like we lost the game. Like you know what does it mean to ease and he took, he took the Nebraska exhibition as though it was a real, a real deal game. But his defense and KY Kevin Young who sat down with me said I do think that he can be the best defender in the country. A lot of coaches say that about a lot of high level defenders. The Bancet is actually long enough and physically gifted enough.

[Matt Norlander]

But just because you're long enough physically enough doesn't mean anything.

[John Gasaway]

Correct.

[Matt Norlander]

It means you're, it means you've got.

[John Gasaway]

The stuff to do it got to do it doesn't mean you will see if like, like Tugler is undeniably insane. Well, if the Bance is going to be that committed to it, we'll see. But I do think that he is going to have just a variety of different games where and we talked about this a little bit at dinner last night. Be it Peterson, Debanza, you can throw a boozer in. I just think the freshman class and some other dudes that are awesome as well. AMET Mikel Brown Jr. Go down the list. We could have an amazing, amazing year for freshmen. I'm fascinated by this player race and this trio. Whoever else emerges is interesting. Quick, from you on Peterson. What do you take away from that interview? I talked with him outside of. Outside after with you, and hard not to be impressed by what he is and what Bill Self said about him.

[Matt Norlander]

He's an impressive young man. You know, he's got a lot on him right now. I talked to him a little bit about that. Like, you know, most of us go through life and we don't get compared to Kobe Bryant. You know, you can Google. I told him this. I said, I don't know how often you Google yourself, but I googled you a lot. And I can run into things that say you're Kobe Bryant. I can run into things that say you're the best incoming freshman since Derrick Rose. I can run into things that compare you to a Porsche 911. Like, it's all out there. And he was like, yeah, it's surreal. He's like, the one I'm not comfortable with is Kobe because he's one of my goats, and I don't think I belong in that conversation. But he's very aware of who he is. And honestly, you touched on it, but it's exactly right. Talking to Bill Self about him is more interesting than talking to Darren about himself because Bill has coached the number one pick of the draft in Andrew Wiggins. He's coached a MVP in Joel Emb, and he doesn't mince words when it comes to Darren Peterson. I've never coached a freshman like this. He said it on camera. He said it off camera. He's going to put the ball in that young man's hands and ask him to. To get Kansas back to a good place or a better place than it's been the past couple of years. And there's a lot of reasons to think he's. He's capable of doing it again. I won't spoil, but this is something I don't think I've ever done. And maybe this just hammers home the point we're making, because I think this Big 12 player of the Year race could also double as the National Player.

[John Gasaway]

Of the Year race, right?

[FanDuel Announcer]

Yes.

[Matt Norlander]

It could be the National Player of the Year race.

[John Gasaway]

Totally possible.

[Matt Norlander]

J.T. toppin is the reigning Big 12 Player of the Year, and he's back in school and on my ballot, he was third.

[John Gasaway]

Okay.

[Matt Norlander]

He was third in preseason Big 12 player of the Year because I think the two freshmen are just special, special specials.

[John Gasaway]

A little bit. We'll reveal who we have picked on that. Let's go to storyline three and stick with Kansas there. Can Kansas bounce back in a big way? And by big way again, this is you can go [e-mail] and NADA will drop this in the episode description on YouTube and in the audio feed. I have Kansas number seven in the country. I have Kansas as the second team in the pecking order in the Big 12 largely because I am that much of a believer in Daron Peterson. He ranks at we haven't released this yet as of when this episode is going to run, but we're going to have our top 101 players list come out next week and really gearing up for college hoops season. And I'll just tell you, I've got Peterson either one or two. I don't know if he'll be one or two on our ultimate list, but he's going to be no worse than three and I think he's going to be that good, that valuable. I think his volume and usage is going to be so high that I am going to put stock in the idea that Bill Self is not going to have three subpar years for his standard. For the Kansas standard. This could be a big whiff by me. You won't find anyone that's ranked Kansas higher than me. No metric, no human, no nothing. I've got him seventh overall, second in the Big 12. Regardless if I'm right or wrong, that is going to be a big thing that really lingers out there because yeah, there are some pieces that return and I can't wait to see what Flori Badunga does. I think he's going to make a really big bounce. Marco Jackson, is he going to start? Is he going to come off the bench? I know Melvin Council has really impressed Bill at this point, but what is Kansas going to be? Because that fan base, understandably so, has been irked now they've got one of the best coaches ever on the sideline there. It's hard for me to resolve around the idea that ku would go three straight seasons not making a sweet 16, not being a 1, 2, 3 or 4 seed, not being a team that finishes 1, 2, 3 or 4 in the league. So I'm going to buy in that that's fixed because of Peterson more than anyone else. Where do you come down on ku?

[Matt Norlander]

I have them closer to where most people have them.

[John Gasaway]

Mid teens nationally.

[Matt Norlander]

Yeah, you know, mid teens and you know, fifth, sixth in the Big 12. We'll go through the order in a minute. When you look at the roster like and you start comparing them to other great Kansas rosters, I don't think it measures up top to bottom. But the one young man is obviously special and there's enough talent around him for them to be really good. I do think it's a bounce back season on some level. And talking to Bill again, he really wants that. He will remind you that, you know, we were a four seed. Like, you know, we didn't, we didn't sneak in.

[John Gasaway]

Correct.

[Matt Norlander]

We weren't, we hadn't been to Dayton yet.

[John Gasaway]

KU standard. Right.

[Matt Norlander]

But like his standard is higher and he holds himself to that standard as well. And I don't know, he didn't say this exactly, but I don't know that it's a coincidence that the worst two years for him then quotes around worse coincide with these health struggles. Yeah. And again, he's had the second procedure. He looks good. He says he feels better than he's felt in years. And more than that is he seems really motivated. Like he hears this stuff. He's not the type who hears it and then calls you and cusses you out. Those are other guys. But he hears what people are saying. Has Bill Self slipped as the program slipped and he wants to stop people from asking those questions.

[John Gasaway]

No doubt. Quick, quick little update on KU's roster. We mentioned Badunga, Marco Jackson, Jaden Dawson, transfer from Loyola Chicago. Keep an eye on him. I mentioned Melvin Council, who's going to be a player that I think you're going to see start day one for the Jayhawks. Paul and Bia, an international player. We also covered a lot of this on the KU Specific shoot around episode over the summer. On its surface, it's a roster that I understand why a lot of people have not projected KU to be a team that finishes top three. Maybe not even top four in the league, not top 15 in the country. Again, Self is a hell of a coach. I don't think he's lost that ability and I do think it's on the table for Peterson to be one. Just a heck of a player. Storyline number four. We'll keep it moving here. Texas Tech. Texas Tech. I talked with Toppan. I'm actually interested to see if you talk with Grant about this as well. They had the most dramatic swells of any team, any team in the second weekend of the tournament last season. When you look at what happened with the Arkansas game and then the Florida game, can they go from the doorstep of the Final Four to actually making the jump and doing that is toppin for as talented as he is. And he's not going to have to do it all himself. But if he's going to be a first team All American, he's going to have to. If he's going to be at that level, then that's going to give Texas a second chance. If he falls short of that third team not even being a top 15 player, it's hard for me to see them breaking through on that. Your thoughts on McCaslin's Red Raiders and what did he tell you during your sit down?

[Matt Norlander]

Well, I talked to him specifically about the Florida game in the Elite Eight and he was because I've had conversations with coaches. There are some coaches who lose a game like that and they never go back to it. They can't.

[John Gasaway]

But it feels like it could be wrong to me. It feels like maybe it's a new some are still like that. But I feel like more and more coaches are willing to at least. This is just anecdotal, me talking to some guys and it does not surprise me that Grant's willing to go and take a peek at it and look at it and see, look under the hood. There's nothing to be afraid of on the tape. We lived it. Like, there's nothing wrong with like going through that another five, 10, 15 times.

[Matt Norlander]

Well, he like actually watched it the night of the game, went back and rewatched it that night and says he goes back to it all the time and is really like trying to learn from it. And I said, well, what have you learned? And I thought this was interesting because he had a very specific answer. He said, I don't think I handled my offense, defense, substitutions. Like when you get into those types of situations where you're subbing for offense, defense. And I've never really done that and I don't think I did it well. And I have now. Like he, he seemed to suggest I played through that and if we played that game again and we were in those same situations again, I would do things differently because of what I've learned by watching what I did. And I think that's just, that's really impressive. I mean, this is an accomplished coach, multimillionaire, like one of the best in the country. I mean, ranked second in the coaching rankings at Ken Palm in part because he's been a head coach at the Division 1 level for nine years and has exceeded preseason expectations according to Kenpom, every single season.

[John Gasaway]

That's awesome.

[Matt Norlander]

Yeah, and so that's a good nugget.

[John Gasaway]

I actually didn't realize that he had that every single season. He's outpaced an output.

[Matt Norlander]

He starts here and he ends up better every year without exception, no matter where he's been, the coach. And that's the good stuff. That's when you know, like, there's some substance here. And so how do you get that way? You don't ever think you've got it figured out. So this is a man at, I don't want to say the low point of his coaching career, because I'll let him describe that. But you're, you know, maybe a few baskets away from a final four and then it's just over. You can hide from that if you want to, or you can get right in front of it and try to learn from it. And his approach has been to try to learn from it.

[John Gasaway]

And he thinks that he has, roster wise. We also sat down with Chris Andersen. He's listed as Christian, but we talked before. He actually likes to be going by Chris. He'll be a big player for them as well. Luke Bamboy from VCU is going to be a guy that has high impact. Tyree, Bryan, Lawan, Watts were also a couple other guys that Toppan and Anderson pointed out there. Red Raiders, I would say, don't sleep on them. No one's really sleeping on him. But that is a team that is if they won the Big 12. I don't have them projected to do it. I don't even have them in my top three. I just wouldn't be surprised if they did it because of what you mentioned with McCaslin last storyline here. Can the conference. Can the Big 12, can it wrestle back the title of being the best conference in men's college basketball? Quite clearly. The SEC had that a year ago. I sat down with Brett, your mark. We talked a lot about big picture stuff in college athletics. But he did get onto the topic of the Big 12 and he said, you know, this is the best basketball league, which he's the commissioner, of course he's going to say. He should say that. And if you went back the past 12 years, overall, the Big 12 has been the best league eight or nine of those 12 seasons.

[Matt Norlander]

There's a way to frame it. If you want to make the Argument Big 12's best conference, you can do it.

[John Gasaway]

You can. It wasn't last year, but it has been, and that's frankly irrefutable. Can it get back this season? We both think that it's Going to be a three league race. SEC, Big Ten, Big 12. If you made me guess, I actually would guess the Big Ten will rank number one in the metrics at the end of the season, but the Big 12 doing it wouldn't be a surprise whatsoever. Just keep in mind there's a top six and then after that we're going to figure it out. And that would be Houston, Kansas. This is my order. Houston, Kansas, Arizona, Texas Tech, byu, Iowa State. Then we see what are your thoughts on, on the Big 12? And just toss me, toss me a percentage here because I know you like your numbers. What percentage would you give that the Big 12 actually does rate number one at the end of the season?

[Matt Norlander]

40%. Okay.

[John Gasaway]

Yeah, I think that's healthy.

[Matt Norlander]

Yeah. Less than 50 because you're competing with the SEC 10. You're only competing with the SEC. The ACC can't sniff that.

[John Gasaway]

Yeah. And we don't think the biggies can get into that conversation.

[Matt Norlander]

So this is, we say power five in basketball, power four in football. There are really three leagues in men's basketball this season that stand out above all others. And I can honestly see them finishing in the computers in any order. 1, 2, 3. In any order. But I will say this regardless of whether the Big 12 is the best conference this season, I think it's the most interesting. Yeah, it's the most interesting because you've got the man who coaches told us in the candidate coaches series they expect to be the next first time national champion. You've got him with a preseason top five team coming off a trip to the national title game. You've got a two time national champion in Bill Self trying to bounce back and get that program back to where it was. You've got Scott Drew, future Hall of Famer, national champion, trying to rebuild from nothing. Zero players returning in Waco, and then again Maybe the top two picks in the NBA draft turning a Big 12 freshman of the year race into a Big 12 player of the year race, into a Wooden Award race. I don't know if it'll be the best league, but it's going to be the most entertaining. I think that's clear.

[John Gasaway]

Yeah, it's going to be a really, really entertaining league. I'm intrigued to see where it is here.

[Matt Norlander]

This is a real good story about.

[Warby Parker Announcer]

Bronx and his dad Ryan, real United Airlines customers.

[Matt Norlander]

We were returning home and one of the flight attendants asked Bronx if he wanted to see the flight deck and meet Kathy Ann.

[FanDuel Announcer]

I got to sit in the driver's seat.

[John Gasaway]

I grew up in an aviation, family and seeing Bronx kind of reminded me of myself when I was that age.

[Matt Norlander]

That's Andrew, a real United pilot.

[John Gasaway]

These small interactions can shape a kid's future. It felt like I was the captain. Allowing my son to see the flight.

[Matt Norlander]

Deck will stick with us forever.

[John Gasaway]

That's how Good leads the way Carolina.

[John Henson]

Basketball isn't just a program, it's a legacy. I'm John Henson and we'll be the host of Tar Heel 247, a UNC basketball podcast for fans who bleed Carolina blue. Each week I'll be joined by players, coaches and insiders for real, unfiltered conversations about the team, the tradition, maybe some funny stories and everything in between. No filters, no fluff. Just hoop talk. The Tar Heel way. Subscribe now to Tar Heel247@ UNC Basketball Podcast or wherever you get your podcast at. We will have a good time. Let's get ready to go.

[Cash Siyanajad]

What's up everyone? It's the counselor of Cash Siyanajad from the Early Edge, a daily sports betting show powered by Sportsline and part of the season CBS Sports Podcast Network. If you're looking for the best bets, picks and analysis for the day in sports, we're your one stop shop. We're locked in every day with NFL bets and player props, college football picks and so much more. Download and follow us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify and anywhere podcasts are found. Subscribe to the SportsLine YouTube page to watch us live at 10am Eastern Time every weekday. Make sure to turn on those notifications so you don't miss a single pick all season long.

[John Henson]

Good luck.

[John Gasaway]

Since it's just you and me and we're not. Well, I'm saying we're not screens apart here. Let's just make the immediate transition. I know nada's got us cover after the fact with the breaks and all that. And let's go to our projections of how we have each team finishing overall. I can't see your list and you can't see mine like we normally do, so I'll read off my top eight in order here. I've got Houston 1, Kansas 2, Arizona 3, Texas Tech 4, BYU 5, Iowa State 6. I have all of those in my preseason top 20. And then I've got Baylor 7, Cincinnati 8. I'll do a couple of notes on a couple of those teams in just a second, but GP that was my order. Thoughts on it? And if you want to read me off your top eight, I don't know where we land the same overall, but we obviously Got to dive into at least Arizona, Iowa State, Baylor and UC before we move on to the bottom half of the league.

[Matt Norlander]

You're obviously higher on Kansas. I am than most. We've acknowledged that. I don't see the roster getting them to that place. But it's Bill Self and there was a time not too long ago where you just trust Bill Self to figure it out.

[John Gasaway]

Quite literally, he would have been given the benefit of the doubt because they kept winning every single year.

[Matt Norlander]

So yeah, there was a year where he lost all five starters and like had a number one team in the country again. All right, so if anybody can exceed expectations, it'd probably be the guy who's won two national championships in Lawrence. We've got the same top seven, just in different orders. Okay, so I went Houston one. We both go Houston one. I went BYU two.

[John Gasaway]

Okay.

[Matt Norlander]

I just for like the last eight weeks, I forget exactly what the. How I had it all framed up. But at one point, let's call it eight weeks, 10 weeks, there was a period in time where they were playing like a top 10 team in America. Right. And I think the roster upgraded. The starters that they lost were replaced by, by people I think will be better this season than the people who played those positions last season at BYU. So I'm really high on them. I've got them second. Texas Tech 3, Arizona 4, Iowa State 5. I've got Kansas at 6, but I don't have much difference between say Arizona and Kansas in the top 25 and 1. But when you start shaking it out, it goes Arizona 4, Iowa State 5 Kansas 6, Baylor at 7, Kansas State at 8.

[John Gasaway]

We'll get to the Wildcats in just a second there. Real quick on Arizona's roster, I think Jaden Bradley might be the best all around player that we didn't put on our preseason all American team. I've got sky high expectations for him. Saw Toby Iwaka walking around today and I mean, just a couple of these guys walking around, it's just ridiculous how well built they are and how athletic they are. They're obviously key returnees. Kohape, Braden Burries are big time guys that are incoming into the program. A couple of awesome freshmen who aren't going to get as much attention going into the season. But if you told me burry's had like seven or eight games of 20 plus points for Arizona, I totally would believe you. Pete at one point in his recruitment was viewed as, you know, a top three, top four level guy. He didn't wind up there in the rankings but he's, he's a really, really.

[Matt Norlander]

Really stars of the U19 team that won a gold medal in Switzerland. And that team was coached by Tommy Lloyd. Yes, I talked to Tommy today about that specifically. Like, can you do you gain something for that? He's like, yeah, we got like three weeks together. You know, we got like that real and like all the off court stuff. Sure. But like we ran a lot of stuff with USA Basketball the same way we're going to run it with him in Arizona. So he got like a, you know, an early course in what it's going to look like.

[John Gasaway]

That's good stuff. Motea Krivas, by the way, he's back, he's going to be healthy. Could be an immense, immense piece defensively for Arizona. Keep on scooting down there. We've talked about Houston, we've talked about ku, talked about Texas Tech, talked about byu, Iowa State. I sat with TJ earlier. They bring back Tamen Lipsey. Expected to start. If you listen to the interview, you know this. He's expected to be able to be back and playing for them to start the season, which is going to be huge. But it won't just be him. I'm big on isu, generally speaking, because I think Joshua Jefferson is going to make a huge, huge pop this year. You've got Milan Momcilovic, those are the Core 3, really. And then they've got some freshmen they're going to keep an eye on, see if they can develop into some supporting players. And then Mason Williams from Eastern Washington, Dominick Nelson from Utah Valley also will factor in. If you wanted to take a look at the ISU roster and say, hmm, I don't know. I was wrong on ISU a year ago. I apologize to TJ on camera. He wasn't expecting. When I was saying he was like, you don't have to do this, I was like, no, I'm going to own up to it. I had you like outside the top 20. It was a bad whiff. I'm not going to make that mistake again. They've got something cooking there. Quick thoughts on the clones?

[Matt Norlander]

Well, I think they return more minutes per game than any other Big 12 team. And so like, this is a league where multiple schools are literally returning nobody. And TJ once again is returning a good portion of a team that was good. I don't ever try to make it more complicated than that. Has this guy proven to be a consistently good coach? Yes. Has the players he's relying on proven to be consistently good college players? And Successful ones. Yes. All right. I assume it'll go that way again, although the Lipsy injury. Good to know. He's expected to be back for the opener, but anytime missed this time of the year is not great time.

[John Gasaway]

All right, next three teams. I think we both have Baylor at seven. So we'll go Baylor then we'll take talk Cincinnati, my eighth team and GP's got K State at number eight. So let's touch on all these three here. Baylor does not return a single player that played for them a season ago. Which is wild to think that a national championship winning coach would ever be in this position when not taking a new job. That's exactly where they are. You and I got to spend some time with Scott Drew. Does he ever have a single bad day? I mean it's just unreal. It's always a bucket of sunshine with him and it was great to see him. I got the to talk to Dan Skillings on his team formerly at Cincinnati and just heard from the people around the program that they actually. It's kind of amazing how well their team is gelling considering these dudes did not know each other six months ago. I'll trust that Drew figures it out. But I do think if we're being fair, shouts to huck and all that stuff. I think Baylor could probably. I think their best case scenario is five if it's all clicks and their worst case scenario in a 16 team league is maybe 12. Like it is a wide. It is a wide variety. You and I are optimistic overall but. But we'll see how the pieces fit. How was your chat with Scott?

[Matt Norlander]

Just like every other one. Always great? Yes, always wonderful. Like I just really like him, you know, like he's. We asked coaches, the type of coaches they would like their sons to play for and I could see my son split spending time with Scott Drew. Yeah, it's unusual. Like he's had incredible challenges throughout his career starting right from the jump at Baylor and this is a new one. Like he's never gone through this before. Our friend CJ Moore at the Athletic had done a really nice piece, I think earlier this month maybe on just how they went about rebuilding this with the general manager and how a lot of they're really just plugging numbers into an algorithm and seeing what it spits out and then going and looking at the players that it spits out that the recruitment is almost completely backwards. So I talked to Scott a little bit about that. Like, you know, you, I assume you're the type who like to sit in living rooms and get to know people and you don't really doing that anymore. And he's like yeah, you know it's different and you know I prefer getting to know people. I like people. But you know this is a new challenge and we'll see figure it out. He does have another five star freshman and that's the Bansa and Peterson are so good. We just don't even talk about these other guys like Kohlpi, Chris.

[John Gasaway]

Yeah.

[Matt Norlander]

And then there's one at Baylor. Tunda. Yesifu.

[John Gasaway]

Yes.

[Matt Norlander]

Who is six five guard. The all time leading scorer in California high school basketball which is ins.

[John Gasaway]

That's an insane. It's a big state with a ton of amazing players.

[Matt Norlander]

I went through it so Barna surprise once again.

[John Gasaway]

Yet another one and done. Lottery pick from Baylor.

[Matt Norlander]

Yes.

[John Gasaway]

Yes. Cincinnati West Miller doesn't have jizzle. James, they were expecting to have him. He was kicked off the team and so that kind of resets them a little bit here. But keep it just watch for D D Thomas. He could be the guy who isn't expected to be preseason big 12 first team maybe not second team. That really emerges as a major factor there. Playing alongside sincere Harris. Legit two way player Kirk Krysa got one more year his involvement there. I also like Jalen Haynes. Jalen Celestine. Speaking of Baylor, he's making the trades almost like Baylor. It's not almost like they practically did. Baylor and Cincy traded players. Celestine went from Baylor to Cincy and then Skillings went from Cincy to Baylor.

[Matt Norlander]

That is the other thing we see like here I saw the big Tim media day.

[John Gasaway]

It is like you're like wait, you're in that uniform.

[Matt Norlander]

Why?

[John Gasaway]

What are you doing?

[Matt Norlander]

Didn't you used to wear this uniform? Hey, your old coach is right here. Your new coach is right there.

[John Gasaway]

There's a lot of. There was also. There was. There's one person who's an SID now but they were at another school and I didn't realize they had the job so I did like a triple take. I was like, okay, this is just how things work here now. Big, big year for West. Miller quite clearly on the hot seat. Might need to I would think needs to make the tournament in order to hold on to his job. I do like Cincinnati to make the NCAA tournament. Let's transition to K State. Jerome Tang, he raved to me about their guard depth six deep and thinks that they're going to be able to go sometimes. Maybe he's going to want to go for four Guards at a time. Now he did say, we got some size. Like some of these guys are really 6, 7. So guard wings, you've got K State 8. Overall I've got them one lower, so I've got them nine. I came away inspired from my talk with Tang. If you want to listen to it. I'm not going to repeat everything we talked about. But he did say only for our podcast. He revealed that last year in November, because actually he said the staff had talked about like, don't bring this up at media day. And then he said, I love the podcast, so I'm going to give you this. He said his staff approached him and basically it was like actually the issue with why we're not working here right now as a team and it's going sideways. It's actually you. And he basically was like, hey guys, it sounds like the issue is me and no one's going to tell me, so if it's me, just tell me it's me. And they basically said, yes, but here's how it is. And as I told Tang, a lot of head coaches wouldn't want to be told that and a lot of staffs would never admit to it. Really speaks to the trust there. I do expect a big bounce back here, of course, led by PJ Haggerty. It's taken us way too long to mention his name. He is also absolutely, if KSA can get to the tournament and be that team that cracks in the top six, you better believe that he is capable of actually stealing player of the year in this league and being a first team All American. If it all comes together and he's a guy who can average 22 points, six and a half assists, six and a half boards, that is on the table. If it all clicks and Tang is thrilled about him.

[Matt Norlander]

He's the reigning American Athletic Conference player of the year after having what was quite literally one of the greatest individual seasons in Memphis basketball history. Like, that's a place that Penny Hardaway played there. Derrick Rose played there, you know, and he had one of the greatest one seasons in history. We bumped into Jerome last night at dinner and he was. He's real high on Hagerty and it is like people have forgotten he's one of the 10 best players in the country last year. He's a consensus second team all American. And everybody automatically threw Braden Smith first team because he was back. Everybody automatically threw J.T. toppin first team because he was back. But the one all American from last year who got left out of that conversation kinda is PJ Haggerty. And you talk to Jerome Taine long enough, he thinks he'll reenter that conversation pretty quickly.

[John Gasaway]

He is. He is just so high. And he's. He's the biggest player overall. He's going to be ultra valuable. But it's not just him. They do bring back David Castillo, who's obviously big, and then the other transfers coming in, Nate Johnson, Marcus Johnson. They've got a lot of guys who, unless you're a super diehard, you're not going to know. But he's. I'll tell you this. Talking to Tang now versus talking to him a year ago when they had all this hype and he was excited, there's just, it's. I get, I get a different read off of him. And I do, I do think that they've got a really, really healthy chance at being a top half of the league team. That said, I technically do have them 9. I'll read my 9 through 16. GP will read through his. So I've got k State at 9. I got TCU at 10. I have Oklahoma State at 11. And I think I am lower on the pokes than maybe the average voter or coach in the league. I have West Virginia at 12. And then I'm being entirely transparent. I would actually draw a line. And then we get to the bottom four. UCF, then Arizona State, then Utah, then Colorado. What's your nine through 16 look like?

[Matt Norlander]

I had Cincinnati at nine.

[John Gasaway]

So we're same group in the top nine.

[Matt Norlander]

Yes, we have the same group in the top nine. And that's where I think the break is.

[John Gasaway]

Yep.

[Matt Norlander]

And then I go TCU 10, Arizona State 11, West Virginia 12, Oklahoma State 13, UCF 14, Colorado 15, Utah 16. And so what's most interesting about that group of schools is that there's some thought that Bobby Hurley at Arizona State needs to be better than this.

[John Gasaway]

Talked with me on the show, like, just. And I so appreciate this. I'm in the last year of my contract. We talked a little bit about that. He. Everyone knows the score and knows the deal at Arizona State. If Arizona State finishes where you and I both have them, they will have a new coach next season.

[Matt Norlander]

And the truth is, like, he kind of had this feeling coming into last season and I was at an Arizona State game, I think in February, and the vibes then were not good. Like, it didn't. If, if you were betting on that night, I think they lost an overtime game to Texas Tech.

[John Gasaway]

Yes. Yeah.

[Matt Norlander]

If you were betting that night, you would maybe bet that Bobby's not back, but he is. But clearly he enters the season with with real job pressure. And then does Johnny Dawkins have job pressure at ucf? You would think yes. And then though Ted is, I don't think at risk of being removed necessarily, but you just wonder like, you know, age state of the program, is it possible that he could walk away at the end of this thing? I'll let him make that decision, obviously. But to me, the most interesting thing about the bottom part of the Big 12 is that you've got multiple schools, maybe three, that if they don't finish better than they're expected to finish, they could all three have different coaches.

[John Gasaway]

They could. Colorado from a roster standpoint is interesting in that they actually do return some players that were able to produce. Colorado wasn't that good of a team. It beat, remember it beat Yukon and Maui last season. And in that moment it's like, okay, my Colorado will be something finish below.500. And he's got this mix of international players, a big freshman class coming in, just a couple of pair of transfers. Overall, they're projected low. Boyle's a really good coach. We could whiff this could be a classic case of a team pick 15 or 16 and they manage finishing ninth. What do we know in the preseason we get that all the time.

[Matt Norlander]

They do bring back three of their top seven scores, but it's three of the top seven scores from a team that went 3:17 in the Big 12. So you tell me what that's correct.

[John Gasaway]

As for Utah, coached by new coach Alex Jensen and just for full transparency, as you, if you listen to the feed, there's just so much passing through here. We can't possibly get to every single coach. All these players, some of these coaches run late in other spots. The Big 12 has partnerships with every media company which is unlike any other league. So we did get to talk to Jensen this year. You know, look forward to getting to know him as the season goes along for year two. But I just got to see how it works. It worked amazingly for Kevin Young at BYU in year one. Now Utah brings in alum and see if it can have the NBA connection as well. Jensen developed a really, really solid reputation as a longtime high level assistant. Learned from Rick Majeris, played on the Utah team that made the final four in 98 we see there, but it's just, it's a whole boatload of transfers there. And then UCF like Baylor does not return a scholarship player who had menaced last season. We'll just have to Wait and see on that. I think it's objectively fair to project those kind of teams near the bottom of the conference. Only two more that are three more we haven't dove into. The horn frogs of tcu, Oklahoma State with Steve Lutz and West Virginia with Ross Hodge on tcu, Jamie Dixon's track record. Big picture at the program is it's pretty damn impressive. Now they can go through these ebbs and flows, these ups and downs. I don't have TCU making the tournament, but they bring back a bunch of supporting pieces so we see who makes the jump. David Punch, Micah Robinson, Jace Posey, Malik Diallo, they're all back. Ashton Simmons coming off a redshirt. Keep an eye on him. Could be a guy that really pops there. And then they bring in a variety of players. Jaden Pierre from Providence is probably the most notable one. I didn't feel comfortable slotting TCU into a bottom four spot, so I didn't put him there. And then as for West Virginia, Ross Hodgson, I got to catch up with him off camera. Got a really impressive group. They were aberrationally good in their, in their scrimmage. They just played against Maryland. Even Ross admitted like it was, it.

[Matt Norlander]

Was like, like we shot it crazy.

[John Gasaway]

We shot it crazy. And if you tell me we can be a lot of what we were there, I'll be interested to see. They said Honorhoff has looked as good, if not better than anyone on the roster. He likes how Eagle Trayson Eagle staff who was the player last year at North Dakota, the only player to go for 50 plus in a game. He actually likes how he's adapting the physicality. He really challenged him. Keep an eye on him, but we'll just wait and see. Just so West Virginia Fans know this GP but Hodge, he had like a good five, six year run when he was under McCaslin at North Texas and now they're in the same stat. Like he had opportunities to essentially triple if not quadruple his salary to go be a head coach at the power conference level. Stay true to that school, became the head coach of North Texas. Look how it works out. 45 years old, he's running West Virginia's program right now. I'm intrigued by them. And then Oklahoma State. I will tell you this. I talked with Steve Lutz off camera. He is quietly confident in his team and in talking to some folks in the Big 12, I do think there's a chance that if there's a team that's projected somewhat comfortably outside the NCAA tournament picture Going into the season, I had one person in the Big 12 say they think that the Cowboys are the most likely team that punctures into that preseason top six. He actually thinks. He thinks it's them more than anyone else. The biggest name to know is probably Anthony Roy, who didn't qualify to be the nation's lead but was leading the nation's. He led the nation in scoring. Got her playing for Doug Gottlieb at Green Bay. Elite, elite shooter. Look for him. Isaiah Coleman, Lutz told me, has actually had some amazing moments here in the past few weeks at Oklahoma State. Take it away with any of the teams that we just talked about.

[Matt Norlander]

Yeah, well, like Roy is the name at Oklahoma State. I mean, who knows if that 25.7 points per game is going to translate to the Big 12. In fact, probably not, but still, it's just another interesting talent in the league. We've got returning all Americans. We've got, you know, one and done lottery picks. And then we got the guy who quite literally led the nation in scoring last season had he qualified for it.

[John Gasaway]

Yeah, just a super, super fascinating league. We'll wrap up with this. I actually think we're doing. Pace wise, we're doing okay. We're a little past what we thought we'd be, but we're doing okay. We're not even getting into the fact that I might have adopted a puppy. A Big 12 media day one. That's for another show because we do want to wrap this up. We got to get to dinner here soon. We got to get out of these suits here. You might need to find a sling for your arm. Okay. Over under NCAA tournament bids for the Big 12. I am going to. And I think we kind of spoiled this earlier, but it's okay. I'm going to set it at 8.5. I'll go first. I'm going to go over repeat myself here. Here's who I have going. Houston, Zona, Kansas, Texas Tech, byu, Iowa State. That's top six. I got them. And then I will go over because I do think I'll have Baylor, Cincinnati and I think Hagerty is good enough. I think Kansas State breaks through and those are my nine. Something tells me, do we have the exact same nine? Do you agree?

[Matt Norlander]

I agree. We have nine. And it's the exact same nine. And we did it independent of each other.

[John Gasaway]

We did it. We did it totally independent of each other. And then we'll wrap up with our preseason predictions are conference awards here. I thought, I thought that we would have the Same picks. We do not. So let's first go with player of the year. Actually I say first we're going to probably do these jointly because as you and I completely agree on this and it doesn't happen often, but if you're going to have a freshman be the player of the year, it also has to be the freshman of the year. But you and I know there is a. There is a universe that is conceivable in which like Peterson wins one and to Bancet wins the other, which is insane. But it could happen.

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[Matt Norlander]

Well, that will be.

[John Gasaway]

But it might. In fact it might happen.

[Matt Norlander]

If idiots are allowed to vote. It will happen because it makes no sense to do it that way. Oh Jesus. I had, I had one here.

[John Gasaway]

Did it happen?

[Matt Norlander]

No, it happened in Canada coaches this year. Do you even know what.

[John Gasaway]

Oh no. Oh well, I know what happened in this regard. Painter was picked to have the best team but Kelvin was the most likely coach to be the first time national champion.

[Matt Norlander]

That one.

[John Gasaway]

Yes.

[Matt Norlander]

I didn't get hung up on it. Whatever.

[John Gasaway]

Yes, but it's like. But they didn't line up.

[Matt Norlander]

Yeah, it doesn't line up correct. And, and you know.

[John Gasaway]

But that can happen.

[Matt Norlander]

That could happen.

[John Gasaway]

You can be the best team and not win the title so.

[Matt Norlander]

Well yeah, but even that they could happen in voting because a coach could just be like you take some. We had a bunch of Purdue's going to be the best team, a Houston's going to be the best team and then suddenly the people who thought somebody St. John's going to be the best team now they got to pick the next first time champion. So then they just shift their votes to Kelvin.

[John Gasaway]

Correct.

[Matt Norlander]

Right. So that's the way that happens. That's. That, that makes sense. I understand how that could happen. There is no scenario where you watch a season of Big 12 basketball decide Darren Peterson is the best player in the league but somebody else is the freshman of the year. That's stupid. I will not stand. I'm not standing for that.

[John Gasaway]

For content's sake. I'm rooting for it to happen. To see this man lose.

[Matt Norlander]

That's the type of stuff that makes me go crazy.

[John Gasaway]

I know. And that's why I want to say.

[Matt Norlander]

That is how I ended up riding the polar column for all those years. I just got mad one day, I just got mad and I said I can't stand for this idiocy anymore. And then I had a whole column.

[John Gasaway]

That being said, you had the same player of the year, the freshman of the Year. Who's your pick?

[Matt Norlander]

I went, A.J.

[John Gasaway]

Yeah. A.J. debanza.

[Matt Norlander]

I've just decided I'm gonna be ride or die on two things and fingers crossed because the world is pushing against me on both of these things. I've seen John's number one and I'm AJ Debanza, number one player in the country, number one pick in the draft. But I will tell you, I understand the Peterson stuff. And when I hear Bill Self talk about him, the way he so openly and comfortably talks about him, it make. You're going to say Darren Peterson and I'm not going to even try to argue with you.

[John Gasaway]

We do have a disagreement when the ironic part is he interviewed Peterson. That's my pick for player and freshman of the year. I interviewed Debance. That's his pick. I actually kind of like that it landed that way. And if we had done this like two weeks ago, I would have picked the Bansa. Now, the only reason why I'm taking Peterson and it is narrow, I ultimately, I'm going to ride with Mike. You're going with your St. John's Red Storm. I'm just going in on Kansas being top seven, top eight in the country and Peterson having the ball in his hands more than Debanza being as responsible, if not more than anyone like Debance is going to be playing with guys like Rob Wright could have a half dozen games where he goes for 20 plus, Richie Saunders could outscore AJ Debanza 40% of the game inventory, 50% of the game inventory this season. It's not unthinkable because I even asked Kevin Young, like, how's this role going to change? He said, really not that much. Well, Richie Saunders was one of the best scorers and shooters in the league last season. That's basically why. But it's. You and I both know that you could easily see my pick winning and I can easily see your pick winning. But we do as a function of this, have top in third. We don't even have Milo Suzanne at Houston as the pick. We don't even have the guy that I have for the transfer of the year as the pick. This is the most interesting league, but I would think it's going to wind up being one of these two players. But sometimes college basketball is not the NBA draft. It's not that they don't have to always line up. We just. But Wesley, would that be something? Well, it's not transfer of the year. I think we agree. P.J. haggerty, Kansas State. Got to be right. Yeah, yeah, he's got to be. We, we expect him to be a guy that averages again north of 20 a game. And if Tang is right and he is a guy that's not just doing that, but clearing six assists or so a game, he's going to be in the conversation for player of the year in this league as well. I think K State is going to have to be a team that jumps into the top five to validate at if we're going to see Kansas and BYU consistently in the top 10, top 5, top 15 of the rankings. But we agree transfer of the year, Hagerty at K State, I think in.

[Matt Norlander]

October we can reasonably name three different people for preseason player of the year, maybe even four. Yeah, I think there's only one sensible answer for transfer of the year right now. I can't tell you what it's going to look like in March, but when the consensus second team All American is an option, you take him.

[John Gasaway]

There we go. Live from Big 12 media day. That's a show we went 10 minutes over. But by the way, this, this just blew by. Thank you again to Kansas City, everyone with the Big 12, to our crew here. Gigi, Greg, Nada, who's uploading this, Debo, everyone back at Fort Lauderdale, who fed all these interviews. A really, really productive, worthwhile trip. We're just that much closer. I am so. I'm so ready for games and we have so many more podcasts to do before we actually play games there. But this was the last of our big conference previews. We will have next week. We will have a best of the rest. Look at all the other schools of note outside the Power 5 conferences. So wait for that to land in your feeds early next week.

[Matt Norlander]

I was gonna tap the table with my left arm like you were tap it, but I can't move my arm.

[John Gasaway]

We'll do that scene from McConaughey and DiCaprio.

[Matt Norlander]

That's all I got.

[John Gasaway]

Do the chest.

[Matt Norlander]

There you go. Right?

[John Gasaway]

There you go. My guy's playing hurt. It's been a long day.

[Matt Norlander]

I just went to sleep and I woke up and I couldn't move my arm. I know, man, it's tough and like, I hope you never get to this point.

[John Gasaway]

I'm going to, but I'm at a.

[Matt Norlander]

Point now where I can just hurt myself sleeping. Apparently.

[John Gasaway]

It happens, man. I don't know.

[Matt Norlander]

And I want to be clear. I was by myself. Yes, I was by myself.

[John Gasaway]

Okay, well, I'm glad for that. I just want to be clear, very clear on that.

[Matt Norlander]

Yeah, I was by myself, okay? But I woke up and I'm. If I had to pitch today, I couldn't. Not with this one. One.

[John Gasaway]

Yeah, well, you pitch righty anyway.

[Matt Norlander]

Yeah, that's a good.

[John Gasaway]

That's a shot.

[Matt Norlander]

Shouts to Devin Downey. Shouts to Chester, S.C. shouts to Terry Teagle. He's a legend. Hulk Larnell. Thank you guys once again for watching and listening to the Iowa College basketball podcast.

[John Gasaway]

There we go. I tried to get this guy to do no ties. It's either. It's either tie or nothing.

[Matt Norlander]

Yeah, the problem is you take off your tie before these cameras stop. You're messing up your microphone.

[John Gasaway]

Yeah, whatever. We're done.

[Matt Norlander]

If you're not subscribed, please go subscribe anywhere you can subscribe to podcast. Apple, Spotify. There's more of us than there are of them.

[John Gasaway]

Jerome Tang said it on the pod.

[Matt Norlander]

I saw the BYU cougar out there.

[John Gasaway]

Yeah, Kevin Young didn't know what we were talking about.

[Matt Norlander]

No, I saw the actual cougar.

[John Gasaway]

You saw the actual.

[Matt Norlander]

I wanted to go talk to it so bad. I had some.

[John Gasaway]

Oh, why didn't you?

[Matt Norlander]

I had some real questions.

[John Gasaway]

You know what that is? That's missed out on content. That we missed out on some real content. All right, that 2026, we get it.

[Matt Norlander]

Done, we'll talk to you again real soon. Till then, take.

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[Matt Norlander]

You can be.

[John Gasaway]

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[Matt Norlander]

Plus someone is trying to frame us until our names are cleared. More fugitives from interval like Bonnie and Clyde with better snacks.

[John Gasaway]

Espionage.

[Matt Norlander]

You still as good a shot as you used to be?

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[John Gasaway]

Is there love language?

[Matt Norlander]

We like to walk that fine line between techno thriller and romantic comedy.

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[John Gasaway]

NCIS Tony and Zea now streaming on Paramount Plus.