← Eye On College Basketball
Eye On College Basketball
’25 Summer Shootaround: Cameron Boozer isn’t Cooper Flagg, but he might be almost as good for Duke this season
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- [00:00]
Gary Parish
This show is sponsored by Liquid iv. Hey there, it's Gary Parish from the Ion College Basketball Podcast and I sure hope you're enjoying your summer as much as I'm enjoying mine. Few days at the beach, weekends on the golf course. Needless to say, it's important to stay hydrated, and a great way to do it is with the Orange Vanilla Dream Multiplier from Liquid iv. This nostalgic vanilla flavor with notes of candied orange can help keep you hydrated better than water alone. And my favorite thing about Liquid IV is how convenient it is to throw a stick in your pool bag, throw another in your golf bag, then just tear, pour and enjoy. Liquid IV provides three times the electrolytes of the leading sports drink. There are eight essential vitamins and nutrients. It's always gluten free and sugar free options are available. Savor the last bits of summer with Liquid iv. Tear poor Live more Go to Liquid icon and get 20% off your first order with code I. That's E Y E at checkout. That's 20% off your first order with code I and@liquidiv.com avoiding your unfinished home.
- [01:00]
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- [01:22]
You know there are a lot of passions. Some days it's sports, other days it's cooking or music or just diving into a great documentary. The thing is, whatever you're into, it's on Prime. Amazon prime isn't just about fast delivery though. Getting stuff the same day is pretty great. But it turns out it's so much more. Prime video, Amazon music, the whole range of services. It's like a hub for all kinds of curiosity. Prime helps people stay connected to what matters and keeps the journey of exploration going. Whether it's watching something inspiring, listening to a new artist, or getting gear delivered fast to chase a new hobby, prime makes it easier to dive in. So yeah, whatever you're into, it's on Prime. From streaming to shopping, it's on Prime. Visit Amazon.comprime to get more out of whatever sparks interest. Amazon.comprime okay, before we get to talking.
- [02:19]
Matt Norlander
About the Duke Blue Devils, here's your last reminder for the bonus shoot arounds the auction episodes you see right here, top right of the corner QR code. If you're watching on YouTube, go ahead, push through that. You'll have the link to all three auctions. And yes, if you are listening to the show, this is your last reminder that in the episode description or go to my Twitter feed, Gary Paris's Twitter feed, the Ion College basketball podcast Twitter feed. You'll see links there for all three Tiltify auctions. There has been some schools that have been bidding on all of them, which I love to see. But if a school wins two of the auctions, we're not getting, you're not getting double the episode. So it will go to the next best winner in that case. But we're excited. Go bid. We're trying to raise as much money as possible for St. Jude, so get that done. Deadlines Thursday, 5 Eastern, 6 Eastern, 7pm Eastern, p.m. eastern at our Tiltify auction pages and then we will reveal the winners later this month. Now let's get to the Duke shoot around episode. Welcome back to the pod, everyone. Today's summer shoot around episode is about the most prominent program nationally in the sport, the Tour Duke Blue Devils. I'm Matt Norlander, your host, and I'm joined here by Brendan Marks of the Athletic, who is based in the Triangle area and knows the Duke program very well. If I wanted to bring someone on outside of say, GP or John Shire himself, Brendan is the guy to do it. Duke always ranks among the most buzzworthy teams in the sport heading into every season because in the words of Pete Gillen, obviously, Duke is duke. They're on TV more than Leave it to Beaver reruns. GP's got him ranked number nine in his off season top 25 one. That's why they're lined up here. Brendan, thanks for coming on, bud. You ascended Machu Picchu earlier this summer. I assume today's show is number two on your list of off season highlights.
- [04:23]
Brendan Marks
It might be number one. It might Topmashu Picchu. Yeah. Unless you're, unless you're gonna give me some scars on my feet too, Norlander. Then this is up there.
- [04:30]
Matt Norlander
Did you get scarred up?
- [04:31]
Brendan Marks
Oh, absolutely. Still have the scars. Probably will have the scars for quite a while.
- [04:35]
Matt Norlander
Yeah, well, that's how scars work. But hold on, hold on, hold on. You were wearing shoes though, right?
- [04:40]
Brendan Marks
Yeah, but it's like, you know, it's 50 miles over four days at like 15,000ft of elevation, so you get a gnarly blood blister. It's sticking with you for the five Days.
- [04:49]
Matt Norlander
So did you know what you were going into? When you know, you make the decision, you and your bride. We're going to go. We're going to scale Machu Picchu. You do your research, but did you really have a true indication before you did it of what was waiting you?
- [05:03]
Brendan Marks
I had some idea, but definitely not the full gamut. My wife is like a marathoner, so she just did Boston this year. She PR'd at Boston. You know, she does whatever, 30 to 80 miles a week. And she said it was harder than running a marathon just in terms of, like, your body is so exhausted. Like, the. The elevation is serious. The terrain is not typical. Like, it's changing from desert to mountain to rainforest. So it was much harder than I thought. I thought it was going to be hard, and it still, you know, kicked me in the tail.
- [05:33]
Matt Norlander
We'll get to Duke in just a second, but I actually want to ask. So when you're scaling Machu Picchu, which I'd love to believe I'll one day do, but I'm just never going to do that. Is it a situation where there are hundreds of people doing this and you see a lot of the same faces over three or four days? Are you, like. Are you in the midst of a hiking process where, like, at any given point, you know, 100 yards in front of you, 100 yards behind you, you're always seeing people, or is it a little bit more isolated than that?
- [05:56]
Brendan Marks
No, it's so. It's so protected that there are a lot of these, like, tour groups that basically take you, and there's a lot of permits you have to get to actually be able to go and do the hike leading up to it. So we were a part of a tour group. We had 10 people in our tour, but there were other groups with us. So, like, at the various base camps, we would stop and we would see, you know, 50 or so other people. We'd see them basically every night. But when you're out there, it's basically just you and these other, you know, eight strangers and your guide, so you can really enjoy the nature. Like, it is pretty quiet. There was a few times we had a group of Europeans behind us who had a speaker, and they were playing, like, dubstep the entire time, which was not the vibe, but we still had a good time. But, yeah, you're mostly isolated except for, like, those big meeting points.
- [06:35]
Matt Norlander
Dig it, man. That's. That's awesome stuff. Glad you got to experience that. And now look at us talking about Duke. Yeah. Before we look ahead. Let's, let's scan backward. Last season's duke team went 35, four lost in the final four in be honest, in choke like fashion. But it was comfortably number, comfortably the number one team at KenPom. Also number one, Evan Mia, but it was number two at Torvik. It wasn't number one across the board in metrics by the end of the season. It wasn't number one in Massey or anything like that. It did have the number one pick, the number four pick, the number 10 pick, the number 33 pick and the number 49 pick in its starting five. That's a rarity, but not ultra rare. There's been no shortage of teams over the past 60, 70 years that have actually had their entire starting five drafted. Just not something we get every three or four years. Duke had it last year. Cooper Flag, wherever you want to slot him, he's one of the five best freshmen of the century joining Anthony Davis. So I think is number one, Zion Williamson, probably number two. And then I'm open to the flag at three. I think that's probably where he is along with, you know, Carmelo Anthony, who wasn't a first small American won the whole damn thing obviously. And then Kevin Durant was also awesome. But you know, Flag was beyond expectations. You assembled a list earlier this summer about the top 25 team. It's, listen, it's, it's list building season. That's we know what this is. I've done it. You've done it. Your team at the Athletic has done it. You had Duke, last year's Duke team as the number 11 team of the past 25 years. Regardless of anything. Jim Root of 3 Men Weave, who was just on obviously with the Florida episode, he ranked the best non champion specifically of the past 25 years. And he had Duke fourth of the best non champions. He had 2014-15 Kentucky, which I think objectively has to be the best non champion of the past 25 years. Then he had 0405 Illinois, 2021 Gonzaga, which I really appreciate. And then 2024, 25 Duke, you had Duke 11 overall big picture just beating out 2009, 2010 Duke at 12, which I think you actually overrated. And then you had Duke 2018-19 Virginia at number 10. Stand up for your decision. Last year's Duke team, I think you should be able to make the argument it was definitely one of the 10 best teams of the past 25 years. But they didn't crack your top 10. Brendan.
- [08:49]
Brendan Marks
Yeah, they're right on the cutoff for me. And you know, I think probably to some extent I was, you know, muting them just so I didn't be subject to recency bias. But I think you look, you, you look at obviously the metrics were what they were. They had the second best Ken Palm net rating in the Ken Palm era. Obviously like you mentioned, we're number one in a lot of, you know, know, preseason predictive polls at the end of the season, had their entire starting five drafted. Offense and defense, both top five won. The ACC won the regular season and the tournament, beat teams by an average of, you know, 20 plus points per game. You know, the thing for me that I did doc them for obviously is not making it to the national championship game. That was one of the things that I held in high esteem while I was making my rankings. And the other thing is they had a season long issue that they never really corrected. You know, I was talking to John Shire at Peach Jam. Do you know how many like one possession games Duke won last year?
- [09:38]
Matt Norlander
I'm gonna say not a single one.
- [09:40]
Brendan Marks
Not a single one.
- [09:41]
Matt Norlander
Exactly.
- [09:42]
Brendan Marks
And so you know, you look at what they did against Kentucky, against Kansas, against Clemson and then ultimately against Houston. You know, same script, just different games. And so I did held that, hold that against them. Obviously the strength of the ACC was what it was. I don't know that you can really dock them for that, but it wasn't like they were going up against some gamut. So for me 11 felt fair. I didn't want to give them too much credit. You know, had they won it all, I think we're probably talking about them as, you know, one of those top five teams with like 09 Carolina and 2012 Kentucky. But anyways, I landed on 11.
- [10:13]
Matt Norlander
Yeah, this is what Brendan had in order, best teams of the past 25 years. Number one, 2000, 2001 Duke, fairly loaded team. And the number two, 2011, 2012 Kentucky. I think I would go Kentucky one and then Duke two. But those would be my top two. He's got number three at UConn, 24 champion at number three. Number four, 2014, 15 Kentucky. That one lost Kentucky team. I think that's fair. 0809 Carolina at number five. 0708 Kansas at number six. I'm in large agreement with a lot of the 1718 Nova which was a beast at number seven. Yep. 21 Baylor, which beat obviously Gonzaga, which is undefeated going into that and romped him. Yep. 0607 Florida at number nine. Ironically enough the year before the Florida team wasn't as good of a seed but that's the best Florida team to finish in Ken Palm ever. But I think the 0607 team was better. And then 1819 Virginia, then we mentioned 2425 Duke 20092010 Duke and then 2425 Florida, last year's champion at 13 overall. Intriguing list to certainly look back on. And yeah, it's, it's fun to build these things out. But yes, you definitely get to a point where you are splitting hairs and Duke not having a good accident. It helped their numbers, you know, their dominance, the amount of 20 point plus wins they had, you know, among the best we've seen in the sport over the past two and a half decades. But it ends without a national championship and ends without a title game appearance. Let's, let's flash back to sorry Duke fans, we're going to cover everything here. Got a lot of good to say but let's go back to the loss to Houston and what that was like to witness up close. When Duke makes one basket for this second half of the second half, they lose 70 to 67. They're outscored in the final 10 minutes, officially 25:9 by Houston which had defeated a number of Houston has done this for years now where they will just strip your soul and eviscerate it right in front of you on the floor. That they have done that time and time again and then ironically enough did it to themselves in the title game against Florida. We've already covered that on the shooter rounds. Take me back to your perspective and just to see Duke again lose its latest and last single possession game, they give the ball to Flag who for as brilliant as his freshman season was, he had a number of opportunities to win games for Duke last season. And every single I think this is correct, you can fact check me. The Kentucky, Kansas, Clemson and Houston losses. Every single one of those losses involved handing the ball to Cooper Flag to go and win the game. And in those four specific instances it did not happen.
- [12:50]
Brendan Marks
Yeah, the Kansas one, you know Con Can Apple got involved too. But yeah, I mean Flag was involved late game in all of those situations. You know, for me I had a really interesting perspective. We have a whole team at the Athletic who's at the final four. And so my job was to try and find something unique. And so with about four minutes to go I got up and I went and sat in the Duke fan section. So I was in the same row as you know, Mike Krzyzewski and you know, a few rows Behind John Shire's wife and Cooper Flag's parents, Kelly and Ralph. And so watching their reactions turn in real time from like basically stomping on a grave to like, hold on, wait, we're in the grave now. And seeing them go from like so demonstrative to wait, hold on, this can't actually be happening to us was very, very strange. And like I personally have always been fascinated like since he retired by like the Mike Shashevsky fan experience. Like I think that that is just, I, I'm drawn to it. And so seeing him go from like standing and cheering, smiling back to like steely jaw clenched, unflinching, he was the first guy out of there. I mean like a lot of them stayed. You know, Cooper Flag's parents sat there, John Shire's wife sat there, Nina King, like a lot of people sat after the result was finally and just sort of watched and tried to process it. I don't even know if coach K waited for the final buzzer. I mean Cooper Flag shot, hit, rim, he was gone, he was out of there. And so. But I think in terms of just the overall game, the one thing that I hadn't felt for Duke all season, that I did feel in that moment, Houston very much felt like man versus boys in those final, you know, the second half of the second half, especially those last four or five minutes, it felt like men against boys. Felt like people who knew what to do versus people who were, were happy to be there and almost expecting to keep going, you know, as far as like the game itself. I thought that like you can credit him or not, I thought John Shire came, he danced with the ones who brought for better, for worse. I thought Caleb Foster was fantastic in the first half. He really limited Houston second chance points, was effective on the boards, was getting out in transition, had a couple of assists. I think he had three or four first half assists and I don't know that he played at all in the second half. You know, I thought that that was an interesting decision. Come on. Malawatch was obviously struggling. You know, Malik Brown was banged up. Patrick and Gong but was her was struggling as well. That was a fast paced game for him, which is saying something against Houston. Like I just didn't know like where else you go if you're John Shire. And then obviously yeah, that last play with Cooper Flag, I can't fault you for going to the national player of the year, but if you go back and you watch that play, the spacing was not great. There were supposed to be options for Flag if You go back and look at the replay, there really wasn't anything for him. But, yeah, I agree with you, Matt. I think it's one of the most. You know, I think it's an all time collapse. It's an all time choke job. And that team, you know, wherever you want to rank them, they're going to go down as one of the three or four best teams in the last 25 years not to win at all.
- [15:35]
Matt Norlander
Yeah. Before we circle back to Shire and Duke, I actually did have. What's interesting is I wasn't. I wasn't there with you, but we. We had some. Some intrepid reporters on the scene, and we have. We have audio of Shashevsky in the stands, see what he was saying just before that game ended.
- [15:53]
Brendan Marks
Defense.
- [15:53]
Matt Norlander
Okay. Okay. Come on, Duke. Okay, we got two more. Let's go. Okay. And then let's go, dude. Come on. Yeah, he was in it. He was into it. He was invested emotionally.
- [16:07]
Brendan Marks
High energy.
- [16:08]
Matt Norlander
Come on, dude. Yeah, High energy, no doubt about it. Yeah. He had to get the hell out of there once he knows. He knows the deal there. John Shire, through three years, you know that part of this is a function of coaching at Duke, but he now has two. Well, like, year one, you get blasted by Tennessee, whatever. You know, for the most part, he did a good job in year one. Year two, you get. You get past Houston. So many, like, interconnecting threads with all this, but you get past Houston in the sweet 16 because Jamal shed goes down with a brutal injury. And then you get bounce with authority by NC State, your rival in the Elite Eight. So then you had to stew on that. And I remember talking to Shire in the preseason last year about all that stuff. And then, like, for as annoying as that was in year three, you make the Final Four, which is an accomplishment unto itself, but you suffer, I think probably one of the five worst semi national semifinal losses of this century. When you really look at how talented Duke was and you go back and you watch the end of that, and it was. Yeah, it was bizarre. Just, you know, having been there courtside, watching it up close, and for. You know, you went into this. You went into the Duke section, because at the time you decide to do that, it looks like Duke's going to win.
- [17:26]
Brendan Marks
You know, when I did that, like, yeah, like, it's.
- [17:30]
Matt Norlander
It's. It's a. It's a. It's a wise decision in the moment, but it becomes even better after the fact when you're actually amid the throng as. As the dark Skies really, you know. Yes. Symphony of death comes, comes storming in there. So now this Duke, and we'll get to the Duke team upcoming here, but I'll go pick picture on Shire here, like how he handles this kind of loss. I'm sure he's had some important conversations and reflections that at some point he'll open up about whether it's, you know, in the coming months or some years down the road. Who knows what's to come with Duke, but overall it's, for me, it's an A. Through three years, he is 89 and 22. So he is tied Brad Underwood and Brad Stevens for the most wins by a first time Division 1 head coach through three seasons. 89 is the record. He would have the record had he gotten past Houston. That didn't happen. He's eight and three in the tournament with a final Four. Each of his first three teams have been better than the previous one. So there's been an uptick. Now keeping that up in year four is going to be difficult to do, obviously, but I think you eliminate that as the bar. The bar now for year four is can Duke meet or become near the level that it was in year three, be the clear cut, best team in the acc, be a number one seed and make another final four run. That's. That to me keeps the trend line moving up there. Recruiting wise. He's had the number one class, the number one class, the number two class and the number one class over the past four seasons since he's been officially the head coach. I give him, I give him an A. You don't necessarily have to grade him if you don't want, but how would you encapsulate how Shire has handled such a high pressure job? And to this point it's hard to see it reverting the other way. He is the rare example in all of American sports where he has replaced the guy and just passed the test with flying colors on a level that few other coaches can ever match.
- [19:22]
Brendan Marks
Yeah, no, I completely agree with you on the grade. I give him an A. But as far as like you're talking about the secession, you know, there were, I remember thinking back to like the plan, you know, the one year of basically apprenticeship with Kashevsky's last year, John Schreib being in meetings, having those calls, being able to basically say on the job like, okay, you did this why? Or you're going to do this why? You asked this guy to do this, how come? Why him? The benefit of that has proven to be profound and so you look at him again, you mentioned the recruiting. I think that was the thing that I had the most confidence in when he got the job, that, that that was going to keep going. He was one of the best recruiters in the country as an assistant. That's obviously maintained. You know, again they're going to have another freshman, you know, late in head class. I actually think one thing that he's done a really nice job of is pivoting away from the freshman and learning to plug holes in the portal. That's not something that Duke ever traditionally had to do. But you look, they've gotten some guys, Sion James last year. Malik Brown is obviously going to be a big player this year. They've gone out in the portal and they've gotten guys getting Dominic Sar this year. Not a portal guy, but another unique avenue to try and, you know, bring in talent to Duke. So I think he's done a great job in terms of like building the rosters X's and O's wise. Last year was by far the best season that he's had. He's gotten a lot more creative. Did a lot of five out offense last year. You know, this year's team is different and we can talk more about this, but I think they're going to run some more like big to big stuff. I think we'll see a lot of like four or five stuff with Cam Boozer and Patrick Nganba and then in terms of just like being in that position, like assuming the mantle, you know, like year one I thought was like a really steep learning curve for him. And like you think, I don't know if you remember this, Matt, but like there was a game at Virginia that Duke played and Kyle Philipowski got hacked.
- [21:01]
Matt Norlander
I remember this game right.
- [21:03]
Brendan Marks
And you know, Duke goes on to lose that game in overtime. The ACC comes out after the fact and is like, yeah, you know, our bad basically. And you know, I really think that was a turning point for John Shire. It was basically like, okay, this, this Mr. Nice Guy thing, you know, I can still be Mr. Nice Guy, but to some extent, like I've got to stand up, I've got to have my guys. And you know, he got a tee for the first time last year. I think he's really grown in terms of like filling out his staff. He's had a lot of turnover and he keeps bringing in talented guys. Evan Brad's from Utah Jazz. Like getting an NBA assistant to come on your bench I think is impressive. So yeah, I mean for me it's an A. It's just a question, like you said, of can you keep making these deep runs? You know, as far as last season is concerned, I forget who it was somebody at Duke I was talking to and they were like, that might wind up being John Shire's 1999 Duke team where this was the one. It got away from you. But it doesn't have to be, you know, sort of this fatal blow. I think he's going to keep making runs. I think he's, you know, one of the five or ten best head coaches in the sport right now. And like when you're talking about guys who are going to be one of the faces of college basketball for a while, he's in that conversation now.
- [22:07]
Matt Norlander
Now that's interesting. Is John Shire right now one of the top 10 coaches in the sport?
- [22:15]
Brendan Marks
Do you count roster construction as a part of that? I do. And in that vein, although when we.
- [22:22]
Matt Norlander
When the three man weave guys are on here and rank the SEC coaches and boy was that fun to see the blowback on that. They intentionally did not include roster building on that because coaches are in situations sometimes out of their control to a certain extent in terms of how much, how many resources they have. So some coaches are more benefited than others. So they, they removed it from that. If you include roster management, I think it's undisputable. If you give John Shire, you know the exact, there are 79 high major teams in college basketball. If you give him the 40th best roster in college basketball.
- [22:58]
Brendan Marks
Right.
- [22:59]
Matt Norlander
Simulation. Would he be a top 10 coach over a five year span?
- [23:03]
Brendan Marks
No, I don't think so.
- [23:04]
Matt Norlander
But he knows, you know what? I think I would. He's still young in that framing. Brendan. I think you can fairly say that through three plus three years. In three plus years Shire is a top 15 and there is a difference between 10 and 15. But I think if you actually teased out the names and did that I. You can't put them top 10. You even get into questions like, you know, is John Shire a better coach than Todd Golden? Is there a case for that right now? There isn't like golden who doesn't have as many NCAA tournament. Golden didn't have an NCAA tournament win before the season, but he does have the national championship now on his resume. After sur the toughest conference in a single season in the history of the sport there. Is Shire better than Rick Barnes? Is he better than Matt Painter? Is he better than. I'm just vamping here but like, is he better than say like pound for pound Coaching. Is he better than Scott Drew? Is he better than Greg McDermott? I'm not saying yes or no to any of these, but you, you really flared something new with me there. I don't know where he lands. I know Duke fans would very much stand in defense of him like being like maybe even knocking on the door, top five status. I think that's just way too aggressive. But, but he is, put it this way, if there's a tier one in that tier one is Hurley, Elf, Patino tossing another name or two in there that you want and then tier two Samson, tier one and then you get to tier twos and those are your izzo, Izzo, Pearl, Painter, go on down the list. Yeah, if Shire's either on the back end of tier two or near the top of tier three, that's how I would frame him right now.
- [24:41]
Brendan Marks
Yeah, I agree with that, I think, but I do, I will say this. You know, last year I, through years one and two, I don't know that I would have had him that high.
- [24:48]
Matt Norlander
Agreed.
- [24:49]
Brendan Marks
I think last year offensively what they did was really creative a lot of times and they leaned on a lot of stuff and they were happy, very NBA. Like, like if they found an action they like, they'd spam you. And I think that's what you got to do to win at this level. So yeah, I would say probably more in that like 12 to 15 range. But again like his ability to make the best use of his resources, like you look at some of these other blue bloods who have not maintained after the guy left. You know, I do think he gets a lot of credit for that. Like if you put him in the same place at Syracuse, for example, I think he's, he's probably having more success maybe than they've had since Jim Bayan was gone.
- [25:28]
Matt Norlander
I think that's entirely, entirely fair. I think he does need to work on some of his end game stuff and that's both opinion and also shared opinion from other people in the sport that you know and he would, John would even acknowledge this. He's extremely, he's a very self aware coach when it comes to this and holds himself to a pretty high standard. You mentioned like, you know, no more Mr. Nice Guy, super easy guy to talk to. But also this kind of always gets tossed out and sometimes can become a cliche. But I'm just telling you, and knowing him and knowing the people around him, Shire is way more competitive than he let show. Like he's pretty maniacally competitive. He's not Chevsky level. Shashevsky was almost pathologic logical when it came to that, but he's pretty up there and how he, how he learns from last year. Also, you know, with, you know, when it comes to end game scenarios and having different personnel this season and all that, I will be interested because I think it's a fair criticism at this point to say if Duke is in a one possession game with less than a minute to go at this point, you know it's not more likely than not to necessarily win the game. That's evidenced by the results we've had despite having in most instances a pretty noticeable talent advantage. So one clear knock on him, but otherwise he's been, he's been tremendous so far and I do like how he has been able to and empowered to and sought out what you referenced there. Like Evan, Brad's NBA assistant played at Belmont. There's been a few players like that. He just hasn't or a few guys like that. He has not felt that he has had to continue on the Duke way and only bring in Duke guys. And I think that's been, that's been pretty clear and obvious there. Let's keep it moving, Brendan. We're going to take a break after that. Who's gone, who's back, who's new? We'll do a roster rundown, we'll look at the non conference schedule, we'll do all that. But first let's take a quick break.
- [27:11]
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- [29:45]
Matt Norlander
2025, 2026 Duke Men's Basketball Blue Devils look like this back Isaiah Evans, Caleb Foster who combined average what 12 points a game last season. Patrick Ngongba, you know a bit player who is going to see his his role increase this season. Malik Brown suffered through some injuries. If he can stay healthy he is going to probably be one of the five best defenders in the sport. Darren Harris expected to see his usage jump. They are replacing the likes of Flag and Canipple and Tyrese Proctor and Sion James and come on Malawat, that was the starting five. Mason Gillis also gone after his one and done season transferring from Purdue. They've got freshman coming in, most notably Cameron Boozer number three in the country at 247 Sports behind Darren Peterson and AJ DeBance. Those are considered the big three freshmen, but I think we are set for a massive year of freshmen. His brother Kaden Boozer, at 247, was ranked 23rd in the country. Nicholas, is it Kamania Kamenia? What?
- [30:40]
Brendan Marks
What?
- [30:40]
Matt Norlander
What?
- [30:41]
Brendan Marks
It's how many?
- [30:42]
Matt Norlander
How many? Nicholas, how many are 15th in the country at 247? Sports Sebastian Wilkins is 45th. Those are the freshmen, the four freshmen. And then Dame Saar, who is of Italian and senegalese descent. He's 19. He's a slender 6, 8 wing, played in FC Barcelona system the past three years. He is on the roster because Cedric Coward, who wound up being a lottery pick and initially committed to duke and within 72 hours of publicly committing to Duke, knew behind the scenes that his stock had spiked so heavily that he had no choice but to go into the draft. That was a wise decision in talking to scouts and evaluators. Sar could be a very important and impactful player. Coward probably would have been the better player overall, slightly, but Sar's got some interesting potential there. And then they've got a couple of transfers, a guy from Princeton and a guy from Rice who were just bit players. We'll see whether or not they actually wind up being impactful or not. Thoughts on the roster? You were recently at an open practice. Let's. Let's save all things Cam Boozer for after this. I mean, inject whatever you want, but I want to do a specific campuser segment. You recently took in a Duke practice. What'd you see there? And yeah, leave no words unspared here. Just your thoughts on what Duke has this season versus what it had last season. What should be better, what can't be better.
- [31:56]
Brendan Marks
Yeah, I mean, I don't know that the offense can be better than it was last year. I mean, Cooper Flag doing everything, you know, effectively being Duke's point guard again, leading Duke in every major statistical category, becoming the first freshman in NCAA tournament history to lead team to March Madness while also doing that. I they are not going to be that good offensively. They just can't be. I do think one thing, I mean even just from going to the open practice that is evident that they will do, and this is very intentional from John Shire is they're going to be gigantic again and they're going to be monstrous defensively again. You're talking about a situation where they're probably not going to have a starter under 6 foot 4 or 5 with Caleb Foster at the point. You know, they're going to be big, they're going to be versatile. I don't think that they have amazing depth. I think they have good depth. I don't know that it's incredible. But yeah, I think the thing that I took away immediately was the defense is much further ahead than the offense. The offense is a little bit sloppy at times and again, they're still working through a couple of things. Malik Brown was not back. Was not. He's able to practice in terms of non contact stuff, but he's not able to play in any of the scrimmages. The five on five stuff. You can see the incision on his shoulder where he had shoulder surgery. Like you said, he needs to be healthy for them to be the best version of themselves. Patrick Nganba, to me, is the guy who's maybe one of the most interesting in the roster. I was very, very pleasantly surprised by him at the end of last season, especially in the ACC tournament. You know, he came in last year, had some injury issues in high school, needed to get in shape, a lot of conditioning stuff he had to do over basically the first half of last season. But by February, March, he was a guy who, especially in the ACC tournament, was able to give Duke minutes. I thought his footwork is impressive. I'm looking at him as Duke starting five and you know, I mentioned this earlier, but I think there's going to be a lot of interesting stuff between him and Cam Boozer. Four or five passing. Boozer's such a good passer. Like having him as an offensive hub makes so much sense, you know, and. And look, Duke got back. You know, sometimes it's not the guys you get, it's the ones you keep getting back. Isaiah Evans and Caleb Foster, who I think if you had asked me the first week of March if either of those guys would have been back, I would have said absolutely.
- [33:58]
Matt Norlander
Both were extremely, extremely heavily rumored to be leaving Duke in the portal and neither of those left. Correct.
- [34:04]
Brendan Marks
And so I think that's a huge coup for John Shire. I mean, for Caleb Foster especially, he was basically unplayable in December, January of last year. Just completely void of confidence. And he looked fantastic in the scrimmage. His body is completely refined, very toned. And again, getting back to being like that aggressive driving score first player that he was in high school when he was a top five, top 10 recruit before he sort of took a stock hit his senior year. But you know, for me, Caleb Foster is the guy Duke season depends on. You know, that Isaiah Evans is going to be able to shoot it. You know, Cam Boozer is going to be sensational. You know, they're going to have size at the five within Gangbun Brown between Caleb Foster And Kaden Boozer at point guard. Those two guys kind of are the, the swing factor for me in terms of Duke ceiling. If Caleb Foster is a 43 point shooter and he can direct an offense and initiate sets and he doesn't get rattled, I mean, again, I thought he was great in that Houston game. Didn't play a lot in the second half. If he can be that guy, there's no reason Duke can't make another Elite Eight Final Four run. If they don't, I don't know that Kaden Boozer is ready to be point guard one from day one, but one of those two guys is going to have to emerge for this Duke team to hit its ceiling. There's a lot of talented pieces, but you need someone tying it all together, in my opinion.
- [35:16]
Matt Norlander
Yeah, with Duke, what we have right now is a team that is probably not going to be preseason top five, which happens every so often, but it's, it's not, it's not considered, you know, a near sure thing. But at the same time, obviously, Duke is Duke, you know, come on, come on, Duke. And they've got enough intriguing talent to validate preseason top 10 status. Again. GP has them at number nine. Here we go. Evans and Foster. I'm going to say they have to make the jump and have to means if they don't, then Duke might not be the best team in the ACC and find itself a lot closer to where they were in year one under Shire, as opposed to the past two seasons. Evans has to grow into an authoritative scorer type. See how much muscle, you know, you saw him in person. We still got, you know, we still have, you know, two and a half, almost three months before the season starts. How much more muscle can he put on? He's, you know, has been a little bit of a string being there, but can he jump and make a. And make a serious impact there? Foster is. Yeah, he's. He's going to have to be a guy who is dependable and can't just get lost in the mix and become Duke's fifth or sixth or seventh best player, at least in my opinion. If Duke's gonna match at ceiling, I think we are in agreement. In agreement there. How SAR mixes in with all this is also intriguing to me. I think there's a situation in which maybe whether it's in Gangba, whether it's sar, maybe one of the transfers, someone's not going to be immediately impactful in the first month of the season. Who will emerge by the time we get to middle of January? And will that make Duke an even stronger team? I'll be interested in that. Let's get to Campuser, who should be Duke's best player, has a chance to be an all American. Has a. Him and his brother have a run of winning dominance at the height granted at the high school level. But, you know, you talk to NBA people and sometimes they put a ton of stock into this kind of stuff where they were as. As winning of a duo and their teams won at a rate that is near unmatched over the past, you know, generation or so. So they come into a Duke situation where until the 11th hour they were thought to be going to Miami. And they're not. They're. They're here. They're in Durham. Cameron is literally, you know, we know his father. He's literally named after the building, all that stuff. What are, what should be, what is a reasonable expectation for Boozer? He's the number three prospect in the class. If you told me he was the best freshman, I wouldn't be surprised whatsoever. What did you see with him in person and how much of what Duke does on either end of the floor starts with him?
- [37:59]
Brendan Marks
Yeah, we did an exercise at the Athletic last summer when Cam Boozer, AJ Devonson and Darren Peterson were still all in high school. And we asked, you know, a bunch of coaches and scouts and evaluators, you know, in terms of college, who do you think is going to be the best freshman? And then long term, who would you take? And thought it was pretty telling that Boozer was the favorite in college, but was, you know, very. Was not even really in the mix to be the best pro long term. But I agree with you. I think he could be. Of those Big Three freshmen, like, if you told me he was the most productive, I wouldn't be surprised. Although I do love Darren Peterson. He's going to be there everything offensively, but it's a tricky situation because you're coming on the heels of Cooper Flag. It is going to be impossible to replicate what Cooper Flag did just in terms of every single major statistical category. I mean, Cooper Flag was the centerpiece of everything that Duke did. And while Boozer will be that, I just think it's an unrealistic expectation that he's going to be, you know, of the same caliber impact, like a unanimous national player of the year kind of guy. I do think that he has the potential to be ACC player of the year, all American, all those things. You know, to me, the thing that is going to be interesting comparing him to Cooper Flag is Like the body type is different.
- [39:08]
Matt Norlander
Different.
- [39:08]
Brendan Marks
You know, he's 6 9, he's 250. He does have like some heft to him. And so is he going to see some time as a five and space the floor? I absolutely think so. His shot looks promising. He looked great at open practice in terms of being able to do a lot. Duke is going to let him handle the ball. He's going to initiate offense, he's going to bring the ball up the floor.
- [39:26]
Matt Norlander
Okay.
- [39:27]
Brendan Marks
I think he's going to be fascinating. You know, Evans was doing a lot more handling at the open practice than I expected. Like, you know, pick and pop with Evans and Boozer, like good luck. That to me could be really interesting. I think he's going to be like a nightly threat to be a double double. I think he's going to be like a 17, 18 point per game guy. I think he's probably going to have in the neighborhood of eight to ten rebounds a game. You know, defensively I'm interested to see how it looks alongside in Gangba. Like Malik Brown, as you said, is going to be one of the best defenders in the sport. So I think a lot is going to deal with him there. But offensively he's going to be the hub. You know, I see him at the nail being a passing hub, pick and pop, initiating stuff. He can score in the low post obviously, like he can score any way you need him to. He's a legitimate three level scorer. Hit his free throws in, you know, a semi noisy. Cameron, I think he's going to be like again, it's hard not to compare him to Cooper Flag just because of the immediacy, but I think he's going to be the next sort of, you know, top three pick who's come through Duke and has been a superstar and he has to be that guy. You know, I think he has to be the clear cut, best player on this team. If he comes out of the gate and he's maybe not efficient from three and teams can sag off him, that changes a lot for Duke. So I think he's going to be terrific. He has been, if you ask the staff, you ask people in the building, he's been even better than they thought he would be. Which is saying something I, I like even they say he's been improved from high school and you could certainly see that. The open screens. I think he's going to be again, he'll probably be the preseason ACC player.
- [40:57]
Matt Norlander
Yeah, he's got immense potential. He's a different player than Flag. I actually think that how he plays and I was not the open practice obviously he can his presence on the floor can bring a level of authority and intimidation that can match if not exceed what flat Flag was just so multifaceted with what he did. Insanely incredible competitor. I think boozers in that realm as well and I think it also like Caden doesn't project as a one and done kind of player. But those two having played together I I think it only helps Cameron's chances of being an extremely impactful player if Kaden can indeed be a be a truly impactful, you know freshman floor general right there and then. Duke's got a lot of very interesting pieces and how Shire and that staff choose to deploy them, how they, you know, who settles in to be the reliable starting five and how they interchange. I know you mentioned like we'll wait and see on depth here. True. I think in a in a best case scenario you could actually go nine deep. We'll see if they actually wind up if that actually winds up happening. But it wouldn't surprise me if Duke was if Duke wound up being nine deep and yeah this you know we've got him at number nine. GP does. I'm not sure we'll have them slotted but I would expect Duke for official purposes when the AP Top 25 preseason poll comes out in October, I would expect the Blue Devils will slot in somewhere in the top 10. Let's get to. Let's get to the regular season win total predictions and that means. Here we go. Time for a little music. Yeah, that's right, David. All right, non con schedule and ACC all together. You know how this works, Brandon, right?
- [42:38]
Brendan Marks
Yep.
- [42:38]
Matt Norlander
He's very familiar. Okay, so these are the games of no and normally I don't point out the mid majors but we have a notable mid major game. So Duke November 4th, I guess that's the second day of the season. They play Texas in Charlotte. Sean Miller, that game was scheduled under the previous regime. Sean Miller did not schedule Duke in Charlotte for his first game of his career. I think he was inherited. He inherited that. But a tasty little game all the same at army on November 11th at Army. Duke has played an army before under Mike Shashevsky. It's been a while. It might have happened in the 90s, I think I love that. And that's obviously Veterans Day. I might scoot over to see that. Duke has two road non conference games and John Shire has not shown any propensity to be afraid when it comes to scheduling. I think that's tremendous. And get getting Duke to play on the road against the mid major. Obviously the Army Mike's connection is obvious but that's awesome. They get Kansas in the champions classic on November 18th. That's at the Garden. They've got on Thanksgiving on CBS against Arkansas in Chicago. I believe. I believe that game will be the highest rated game of the regular season as a function of being on broadcast television on Thanksgiving. You know, coming out of football December 2nd they've got Florida and the ACC. SEC challenge are going to host Florida. They're at Michigan State. That is a return game. Long story short, the COVID season messed up some stuff. Duke and Michigan State were supposed to play that year. It didn't happen and Duke essentially still owed Sparty a road game of some sort. Shire made good on his word. They make it up here. They'll play in east Lansing the first week of December and then February 21st. Yes, Duke's going to do it again. I love this. And Shire told me that as long as they can do it, he's doing it every year. Play a February non conference game on a neutral floor in the lead up to March postseason play. That's going to BE Michigan in D.C. so those are your non cons. And then real quick on the 18 game. 18 game ACC schedule the new formula is that teams will play two other teams twice. Every other team once except one. No play. John Shire doesn't have to coach against Jay Lucas in year one. There will not be a Duke Miami game. Frankly I don't think we need a Duke Miami game in general. So North Carolina and Louisville are Dukes. Two, two plays makes sense. That's why UNC would obviously be that Louisville has a chance as a top 10 team. And then they are home against BC, Clemson, Georgia Tech, SMU, Syracuse, Virginia and Wake. They play on the road against Cal, Florida State, North Carolina State, Notre Dame, Pitt, Stanford, Virginia Tech. So I think that all told, I think the ACC will be a little bit better next season. But I think that's about as favorable as you could ask for if you're Duke. What is your prediction on how many wins Duke has heading into the 2026 ACC tournament?
- [45:29]
Brendan Marks
Brendan Marks all right, first of all, if the ACC isn't better this year, we've got a really really big problem on our heads. I've got, I've got Duke at 19 wins going into the ACC tournament. 19 wins. I've got them going 4 and 3 in the non con. So poor Texas. Porsche Miller. That's a really Tough start. I think they will drop that Arkansas game. I think Arkansas is better. I think they dropped a Florida at home and I think Michigan in D.C. in February. I've got them as losing that game as well. And then in ACC play, I think they split with Carolina and Louisville and then I'm gonna go ahead and give Will Wade a home win.
- [46:03]
Matt Norlander
Okay. Okay. What's that? So what's your win total?
- [46:08]
Brendan Marks
So 19 wins.
- [46:09]
Matt Norlander
No, no, no. 19 wins total. They're going. Hold on. They're going. Hold on. They're going to be 19 and 12. 31 game regular season schedule. No way. Hold on. No way.
- [46:22]
Brendan Marks
Did I do the math wrong? I might have done the math.
- [46:24]
Matt Norlander
You did the math wrong. Let's work. Hold on. We're gonna go with the Parish method. Let's work it back.
- [46:28]
Brendan Marks
Go ahead.
- [46:29]
Matt Norlander
Non conference schedule. Texas win or lose. When at Army? Win. Win Kansas.
- [46:36]
Brendan Marks
When?
- [46:37]
Matt Norlander
Lose at Arkansas, that's one loss. Lose against Florida, that's two losses and lose against Michigan. So you got three non conference losses.
- [46:43]
Brendan Marks
Yeah. And then winning at Michigan State.
- [46:46]
Matt Norlander
They win against Michigan State though.
- [46:47]
Brendan Marks
Yeah.
- [46:47]
Matt Norlander
All right, so three non con losses. You've got them losing at Carolina and Louisville. So that's five. And you've got, you've got NC State knocking them off. So that's six. So you've got them at 25 and six.
- [46:59]
Brendan Marks
Yeah, I guess that's fair. I was on the fence about Virginia at home. I do sneakily like Virginia. I think that Ryan Odom's done a nice job there. But yeah, I'll go. I have six losses.
- [47:08]
Matt Norlander
25 and six for Brendan. I will say ACC has to be better tricky ones on the road. NC State, maybe, maybe, maybe Notre Dame, man, their road games are theoretically they're, they got a nice road. The ones they have to play on the road.
- [47:33]
Brendan Marks
They, they have a history of losing against NC State, especially in Raleigh. They have a recent history of struggling.
- [47:38]
Matt Norlander
When they, when they make the west coast trip. Are they getting out of Stanford and Cal without a scratch? Would think. But you never know. Weird stuff happen. They gotta just cross country travel. I'm going to agree with you. I, I will say 25. And the way this schedule shakes up, I will say Duke is 25 and 6. So we are in agreement. This might be the first shoot around where both folks agree on the win total. 25 and 6, lose two in the non con. We'll see what those wind up being. But yeah, it's, it's, it's, it's a, it's an appropriately Aggressive non conference schedule. Shire basically has to do that with how the ACC has been. The acc went from 20 to 18 games with the mindset of it being okay, let's and they had spring meetings and you know, all the coaches were advised, hey, you're getting two games off your league schedule. They have to be replaced by like quad two or better opponents.
- [48:31]
Brendan Marks
Right.
- [48:31]
Matt Norlander
We'll see if that winds up being the case. ACC will be better next season. I I with the coaching turnover and the way some of these rosters line up, Brendan, I I find it hard to believe that the ACC will not be vastly improved. And so with that, yeah, maybe, maybe Duke takes an extra loss or two more than what it had last season when hello, they went 22 and one against ACC competition. Only loss was at Clemson at Clem.
- [48:55]
Brendan Marks
When Cooper Flag had a chance to win the game and slipped on the court when he was sick and they didn't have Mason Gillis in that game.
- [49:00]
Matt Norlander
So there it is. All right, that's, that's close to 45 minutes on Duke Blue Devil stock in the in the second week of August. I appreciate you you coming on. You can follow Brendan Marks on Twitter slash X at brendanr Marks. If you're watching on YouTube you can see the handle right there. Read his work at the Athletic does a tremendous job, but I really appreciate you coming on and talking hoops and helping our shoot around process here. Brendan.
- [49:24]
Brendan Marks
Yeah, of course. I love doing so in August and I'm excited for the season to get here. Thanks for having me.
- [49:28]
Matt Norlander
Me too, man. All right, if you have not yet bid, get it done tomorrow. If you're listening to this on Wednesday, tomorrow is the end of the auction. 5 Eastern, 6 Eastern, 7 Eastern. There are three separate auctions in this YouTube description in the episode description, if you're listening on whatever you know platform, you're listening on your phone, check the episode description we've put in the links there. The bidding has found some action here in the past 24 to 48 hours. We'd love to see it. Feels like there's an Alabama fan that is just determined to make sure the Crimson tie win at least one. But if you want to stop that from happening, you can. Reminder though, it's only one individual account so if you are rallying some buddies, have them Venmo, you, paypal, whatever and then make your bid there. Get it done. We'll have our winners by Thursday and those episodes specifically will run once the end of our scheduled episodes conclude later on this month. Appreciate you so much. Next up. Who's next? Ah, I'm not gonna spoil it for you, but we are gonna have the head coach of the program, who's Next? Join us for Friday, shoot our own episode. Till then, take care.
- [50:36]
Unknown
Paramount Podcasts.
- [50:39]
Matt Norlander
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