← Eye On College Basketball
Eye On College Basketball
Michigan, Zona, Iowa St, Duke = 4 best unbeatens; 💰UK = CBB’s most disappointing; Darryn Peterson back; whiparound winners/losers; CFP cmte stinks compared to NCAAT
01:32:05
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- [00:01]
Gary Parrish
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- [02:01]
Matt Norlander
Hey there.
- [02:01]
Gary Parrish
I am Gary Parrish. Welcome back. See CBS Sports I own college basketball podcast where we sometimes discuss camel fighting, dodo birds and leaky black. Matt Norlander is here with me. You watch it on YouTube. Be Brandon Davies. Smash that like button. If you haven't yet subscribed to the CBS Sports I own college basketball podcast, please do that. Wherever you subscribe to podcasts like Apple, Spotify, let's get into it. I want to start right at the top by acknowledging it was a terrible weekend to be a building truster. Inherently, I'm a building truster. We've been over this. But this weekend. Two of the most trustworthy buildings in the Big Ten, if not the entire country. Man, you, you couldn't, you couldn't trust them no further than you could see them. Final score Iowa State 81 Purdue 58 Inside Mackie Arena Final score Duke 66, Michigan State 60 Inside the Breslin Center. I repeat it was a is a bad weekend to be a building truster. Norlander, you wrote about the Blue Devils perfect 100 record and I thought made a fine point that while highlighting that you know John Shire lost all five starters from last season's team but has already established this team brand new team in many ways to elite status over the first five weeks of this season. So let's talk Duke Michigan State first. Then we'll get to Iowa State Purdue. Like you noted, if you think what John Shire is doing is easy just because he has all of the resources in the Duke brand, look no further than Kentucky this season or North Carolina last season. Those are also big brands with lots of resources. Those teams did not do so well. This isn't as simple as the 38 year old Duke coaches making it look, is it?
- [03:47]
Matt Norlander
No, he actually makes it look very easy. And on a weekend with just as expected, a buffet of results that we will get get to over the next however long this podcast takes. Hopefully not too too too long. But obviously there's a ton to get to Duke. Ascending to where it has ascended to I think is worth noting because it would be all too reasonable for Duke to have reached this point. We're now five full weeks into the season and if it had gotten taken out on Saturday or at some point before, if it had one or two losses, no one would have faulted Shire. This was not the preseason 1, 2, 3, 4 or 5 team in America. As a reminder, and yet here is Duke. I am not yet ready. Although if they can win again in a couple of weeks against Texas Tech, maybe I will be ready then. I'm not yet ready to say that this team is.
- [04:35]
Can be as great as last season's team was because last season's team with five NBA picks in the National Player of the Year and Cooper Flag with one of the three or four best one and done seasons we've ever seen.
- [04:45]
From a Ken Palm and Metric standpoint, that was really one of the three best teams we've seen over the past 25 years in college troops. Albeit it didn't win the national championship. But when you take in the entire season's worth of data in, its efficiency was outrageous. Somehow this team has now at least approached the table, if not yet sitting down at it. As it pertains to the specific game on Saturday. What I found most impressive was if you listen to the Friday show, you'll know that I had to go and bring my little guy to his first rec basketball game of the season. So as I'm trying to go back and forth between both games. Quick aside YouTube TV, can we get it together please? I need to be able to multi view Iowa State, Purdue and Duke, Michigan State. So I was flipping back and forth as this thing was going on. Not ideal, but as the first half was, was playing out, Boozer was shut out. I was like, okay, he had what, two points, five or six boards. Okay, maybe that, maybe Michigan State's found something here. It wasn't that whatsoever. Boozer found his way. He finished with 18, 15 and 5, 18, 15 and 5. Had the majority of his points in the second half. Had what, 8 or 8 or 9 snags in the second half as well. His fifth assist was the most important one because he gets the ball in the paint. The double team, as expected, just swarms and then bada boom, Caleb Foster flares. There's no one on him. And then after Isaiah Evans hits the big three to get the Duke win over Florida four days later, it's Caleb Foster that gets the big three to hit the to basically clinch the game. On the road for Duke and playing in a style that I think Michigan State for the most part was playing the way that it wanted to play in terms of win in the 60s make it grueling that you know, that fan base that was as you would expect Breslin to be for a top 10 matchup. It was everything we wanted it to be. But Duke finds a way to escape with the win they have now won. For the first time in program history, Duke has defeated three consecutive non conference ranked opponents in three successive games. That had never happened in the non league portion until when it transpired on Saturday. They had done it Once previously in ACC play back in the back in the 2010s I believe. But yeah, it's been, it's been really, really impressive on Duke's end there. I thought fears who had 13 assists not hitting a bucket from the field also played a part. They need a little bit more on him. MSU did. Cohen Carr didn't really step up. Carson Cooper had a good game. Jackson Kohler had himself a nice night. But when it got down to it in the final few minutes, it was Duke that, you know, made the Plays found a way to win. And as I wrote in the column near the end, I don't know if they've truly learned how to full on win games. They have just, they are adapting immediately in terms of how not to lose them and that's an impressive deal and we'll see if this can keep up because the one thing last year's team didn't have that this one might have is a closer's mentality. You'll recall a number of times the game was in, you know, Cooper Flag's hands and for a variety of different reasons. A very few losses for Duke last season, but when they did lose, they tried to set up something for Flag and then that went awry. That has not played out yet with Duke so far this season. Really, really impressive stuff in Breslin on Saturday afternoon.
- [07:49]
Gary Parrish
Me, that's among the most impressive things that they've done last season, if I remember correctly. It became like a talking point, like Cooper kept dribbling it off his foot or just bouncing it into people. He was just turning it over, you know, in a way that was squandering, you know, late game possessions. Duke has been in.
- [08:11]
A handful of, of of games where it's like we're at the under four and this could go either way, including Saturday. And they take control every time. They make the big plays every time. And it's not the same person every time. It can be Cameron Boozer, but it can also be Isaiah Evans and it can also be Caleb Foster. So they were terrific. I agree with you. Like if I'm Tom Izzo, you tell me I can keep it in the 60s and have a shot to win. Let's go, let's pick it up there and, and play it and see, see how we can close it out. But when your star point guard is gonna, you know, go o of 10 from the field, that's going to be hard to overcome. He's now got two games like that this season against high major competition. Os seven fears against Arkansas, then oh, a 10 against Duke. Your fear for that's not intentional. If you get into the bracket, you know, in a single elimination tournament and he delivers one of those, then that's how a promising season could, you know, get cut short pretty abruptly to Boozer. You mentioned 18 points, 15 re stuff coming in the second half. It circling back to the anonymous quote from the NBA executive where said, hey listen, Cameron Boozer, he just dominates lesser competition. That's all he's doing is dominating lesser competition. I was thinking about it this Weekend I had a lot of travel stuff. I had a lot of time to just think, what if everybody is lesser competition.
- [09:36]
Matt Norlander
Very much. It very well might be, yeah, maybe.
- [09:39]
Gary Parrish
He does dominate lesser competition. But what if every single person he plays is. Is lesser competition? And the executive also reportedly said.
- [09:51]
Every time he's played against quote like sized bigs, he can't finish on Saturday. Keep in mind after earlier, just let's keep it simple on Saturday. Carson Cooper, 611, 245, Jackson Kohler, 6 9, 245. Those are like size bigs. And Cameron Boozer again, 18 points, 15 rebounds. He once again looked like the best college basketball player in the country.
- [10:17]
Matt Norlander
Yeah, no, his, his ability to adjust in game. That third foul that Boozer got was a stupid foul. His stupidest foul yet in a college uniform. He knew it immediately. He reached in on Kohler, didn't need to got the slappy slap and he had his. He had found number three within, I want to say the first three minutes of the, of the second half and then for him to turn it on was really, really impressive. And, and it wasn't all him. He's still going to be by far the biggest statistical contributor. But, but impressive stuff there. Michigan State, unfortunately, you know, it just Izzo can't get past duke. He is 3 and 15 lifetime. Now, there's only one team ever that has played at least three games at Michigan State in men's basketball and won all three and not taken a loss. It's Duke as a function of this win here. But Michigan State still quality team, still has a case to be top 10 overall, but Duke gets it done. Mighty impressive start there with the Blue Devils. You got anything else on them or you want to pivot to? The other thing?
- [11:13]
Gary Parrish
I notice as I'm, you know, going through resumes and which I know you did as well, you know, as it relates to Duke, as of this morning, there are exactly two teams with four Quadrant one wins. Four leads the country. Only two teams have them. It is the two teams that played inside the Breslin center on Saturday. Duke has four, Michigan State has four. Which means Duke is the only undefeated team in the country with four quadrant one wins. Let's get to Iowa State and Purdue because that was bananas. 81:58@ Mackie. Obviously, Purdue will not remain number one in the country when the AP poll updates on Monday, but as of this moment, Purdue is number one. When that game was played, Purdue was number one. And what that means is that Purdue has made history on Saturday because literally no number one ranked team in the history of the Associated Press Top 25 Poll has ever lost a game at home by more points than the point number of points. Purdue lost to Iowa State to at home on Saturday. There is a another match. Yukon was ranked number one. I believe it was 1995. Villanova went to UConn, won by 23. Special shouts to my friend and colleague Steve Lapis. He was the architect of that. But like I said on CBS Sports Network Saturday when I was in studio, you don't ever expect Purdue to lose at Mackie, period. But to to watch that happen.
- [12:45]
I mean they just pulled away and stayed away and.
- [12:51]
That was the most impressive victory we've seen anybody record the season. And I think it's possible you and I could be talking on selection Sunday and that will still be the most impressive win anybody has all season. In fact, I not only do I think it's possible, it's obviously possible, I think it's likely.
- [13:08]
Matt Norlander
I mean we'll see if someone can win at Cameron or someone can win at Michigan's home floor by 23. That's true. That's true. We'll see. But yeah, it's. Or is Purdue going to be a one or two seater? Is it going to be a A five seed and then we'll see. But there's a definitely a chance that, that it remains the most impressive statistically. By the way, in addition to what play out there.
- [13:30]
By the end of the season, I'm sending it right back over to you. Result more about Iowa State or Purdue to you?
- [13:37]
Gary Parrish
Iowa State. I mean Purdue's gonna be fine. Like that was a stinker from Fletcher, lawyer from Trey Kaufman, Wren.
- [13:46]
Matt's gonna go back and watch that and it's going to drive him crazy. But that core and that coach and that program have too much built up for me or anybody else with a brain to be too skeptical of them right now. That was an awful performance. I don't think they'll have another one of those. And, and I. It really doesn't make me think that differently about them. It makes me adjust where they are in the top 25 and 1 because results are results. But do I think much differently about Purdue today than I did two days ago? No, not really.
- [14:19]
Matt Norlander
I think it's more about Iowa State than Purdue as well. Let's give the Cyclone some real love here as we talk here on Sunday. Iowa State is number two at Ken Palm. That is a program record. It had never been higher than fourth at Ken Palm and that happened earlier this calendar year. It was last season in January. I fact that I fact checked that with Mr. Pomeroy himself who did me a solid as he was walking his dog on Saturday. Thank you Ken for that. Iowa State is also the only school ever, and I mean ever, to have multiple wins over the number one team by at least 20 points. They did this to Houston in the Big 12 tournament and the not so distant pass as well. Good on you Cyclones. You snapped a 36 game non conference home winning streak for Purdue. It was the longest in that program's history. That's now out the window. This was the first time that Iowa State, period had ever won a road game against the number one team. And boy did you make it memorable because that was done in emphatic, emphatic fashion. Right now, Iowa State as we head into Monday, Iowa State in the country, the entire sport, point differential per game is 30.0 flat. That is best in all of college basketball. Field goal percentage best in all of college basketball, shooting 54.9% from the field. Number one in turning you over 26.5% of the time when an opponent brings the ball up the floor, they're giving it away to Iowa State. That's more than a quarter of the possessions. Again, that is best in the country. Number three in field goal percentage offense is Iowa State, 43.8% from beyond the arc and it is top 10 in points per game. Just a tick under 95 points per game. I told you to watch out for the turnovers in this one. We left on Friday. That wound up being a big part there. Iowa State was averaging 27 and change off turnovers. They only got only got 17. But they forced Purdue into 15 turnovers in this game. That was five and a half more than Purdue was averaging. Iowa State also got 34 paint points. They're one of the best teams in the interior in the country. And they held Purdue to 30 points under its season average and 22% below what it had been shooting from 3 point range in this game. It was mighty, mighty impressive. I think the fact that Iowa State by function of having essentially 70% of its roster be either juniors, seniors or grad students. Now Purdue was also plenty old on its own as well. But I think in that building on that stage, in a big moment, Iowa State's the most experienced collective team that came back in the Big 12. I think that really showed up and was a significant reason why this team is a national title contender. You could have made that claim before this. Now it is Irrefutable. After this big ups to TJ Altzelberger. This is the kind of win where outside of just us talking on a college hoops pod about this, this one really should be the win. In addition to everything that we've seen him do since he got the job and they had a very high profile season last season. He gets into the tournament with regularity with really good seeds. GP this kind of win when you are smoking Purdue teams are not supposed to do that in Mackie. They went in and did Elevates Altoberger's status as a coach in the sport. It elevates Iowa State as a program just in general and puts them into that upper echelon tier. I think you can make a case right now if you wanted to tear out the sport, we can get to this in just a little bit. Whether you want to make that four, five, six teams deep. However it is Iowa State's in that tier and resume versus overall, how good is the team? Might be two slightly different things, but after all I've seen with Iowa State and I saw them in person in Las Vegas, the lowest I will let you sell me on Iowa State as a team. Team quality is 3 in the country and frankly you can make a very good case at two right now after they go in and get the best one of the season and I just read off to you all the statistical stuff they're doing. It's not just one or two things. They are either the very best or top three in like five or six categories on both ends of the floor. Awesome elite team. Lipsey obviously came back. He didn't even need to have a huge game. Momcilovich is shooting GP he's 53.6% from three point range this season. He's averaging 18 and change. He had 20 on Saturday. All around. Incredible, incredible stuff. Iowa State has a very good chance to be the best team in the Big 12 this season.
- [18:16]
Gary Parrish
Yeah, I, I, I would just double down on a lot of the points you made. The experience matters. I mean this is year four for Tame and Lipsey and not just year four as a college basketball player. Year four at Iowa State. Right. So there's a lot of teams that have like seniors and fifth year guys and older guys but like they just got to their campus. Tamon Lipsey, this is year four at Iowa State. Milan Manchilovich, this is year three at Iowa State. Joshua Jefferson, this is year two at Iowa State. All three of those guys started last season so they have real roster continuity from a team that was good. And a program that has been consistently good. I guess it gets overlooked because Iowa State's not Kentucky or Kansas because, you know, they're not loaded up with projected lottery picks or one and done guys, But TJ has completed four years at Iowa State. He's made the NCAA tournament every season. He's never been in danger of really missing it. He's gone to two Sweet 16s, and he has really figured out a balance of keeping the players that matter to you and then supplementing things throughout the transfer portal. So they bring back Lipsey, Momcilovich, Jefferson. Okay, three starters. Now what do we do? Let's go get Blake Buchanan out of Virginia. Yes.
- [19:35]
Matt Norlander
Right.
- [19:35]
Gary Parrish
And he had, like, two monster dunks, you know, on. On.
- [19:40]
Matt Norlander
On.
- [19:41]
Gary Parrish
On Saturday that, like, you know.
- [19:43]
Matt Norlander
Yeah. In addition to that, I just. I want to say Buchanan, either three or four of his baskets came in moments where if Purdue thought it was going to have a window to maybe start cracking back into it, he made sure that wasn't going to happen.
- [19:54]
Gary Parrish
Right. So I think he had, like, I don't know, 12 points, nine rebounds. He was solid. Then you go get an international prospect, that's your starting lineup, and now you're 9 0. You've got wins over two teams that were ranked in the top five in the preseason. I know St. John's has fallen out of that, but Purdue and St. John's were both top five preseason AP pole. Iowa State has now beaten both of them. And I think that that experience, like Mackie's amazing and that. That could get to anybody, and it often does. But these guys, Lipsy, Mom, Chillovich, Jefferson, tj, They've played and coached in Allen Fieldhouse. You know, they, they, they. They've seen what it looks like. They know what it sounds like, and they're equipped to handle it. And I don't want to be hyperbolic or get caught up in the moment, and I don't mean this exactly the way I'm gonna say it, but in some ways, I think what happened Saturday was as big as a Sweet 16 appearance.
- [20:54]
Matt Norlander
In.
- [20:54]
Gary Parrish
In many ways, it's like a program changing thing in. In this way. Remember last season? It's like we all knew the SEC was good, and we're talking about the SEC is good. But then it got to the SEC ACC challenge, and they just blitzed them, and it was like, oh, buddy, what are we watching here? And you had to, like, take a closer look. And then you take that closer look and you're like, hey, this might be the Best conference we've ever seen and then in many ways proved to be. You can go to Sweet 16s, but 15 other schools are always there with you. Nobody does this to a number one ranked team. Nobody does this at Mac Urina. And when you go and. And you check both of those boxes, it makes everybody, you and I included, take a closer look and start really digging into everything. And I think this time two days ago, college basketball fans, even people who follow it closely, was like, yeah, Iowa State, good team, but I don't know if they've got the ABC whatever to do all of these. Now I think that's all off the table. Wherever you want to rank them now, rank them. But when you talk about them, talk them out of. Talk about them as a team that, yes, could win the Big 12 could, yes, go to the Final Four for the first time since 1944. And based on what we've seen through nine games this season, yeah, they could win the national championship too.
- [22:09]
Matt Norlander
Yeah. Just a few more things from me and then we can keep it moving if you want. I see the chat, you know, chiming in on, you know, Houston and the like. Houston could be the best team in the Big 12. Guess what? Arizona could be the best team in the Big 12. Iowa State could be the best team in the Big 12. BYU could be the best team in the Big 12. Kansas just got Peterson back. We'll get to him before the show's out. And look pretty damn good against one lost Missouri team and ran them out. Texas Tech was dominant today as well. Oklahoma State still hasn't lost a game. The Big 12, as I said, I said it a week ago on the pod. And then I changed my mind. After a couple of bad losses by the Big 12 midweek, I'm now fully back on. The Big 12 is the best league in college basketball. I think the data is going to frankly bears that out as well. The SEC had a miserable weekend. The SEC at best is third and really, I think it's fourth at this point. Whatever. That's a different discussion altogether. My point on Iowa State is it. It has shown us in the metrics actually speak to this, that it is the best team in the Big 12 to this point. You can make a very good case for Arizona. And guess what, Zona fans, we're going to get to you in just one second. But it was mighty, mighty, mighty impressive. You just can't undersell what ISU did. Purdue only made four threes in this game. They will. Purdue will not have a game the Rest of the season in which it makes five or fewer triples against an opponent in that building, it will not happen. Iowa State got out of there with 11 threes going in. Both those teams are averaging better. 10 made threes a game. Iowa State hit the number. Purdue didn't come close. The game wasn't even close. And then Iowa also, by the way, got a win over the weekend. And that just sets up a real, that sets up a very, very good game. Now Iowa State will be favored and all that, but Iowa getting off to a relatively decent start under Ben McCollum. Happy for them on that. And then my last thing on this is Iowa State just lost its coach in football to Penn State. I know it's a little bit of a dagger after Penn State had a winding, winding search to me kind of reminded me a little bit of the way that Louisville actually wound up getting Pat Kelce. We'll see if it can go that well for Penn State the way it seemingly is going that well for Louisville so far. But for those fans to get this kind of win in a high profile spot after you lose a beloved coach who at a certain point, you know, you have a big enough school come along, you've been there forever, you can't say no. I totally get it. At least the hoops team showing up in a big way and giving them reasons to have some real happiness after the down. The downside of losing Matt Campbell.
- [24:12]
Gary Parrish
Yeah, I thought the, I thought Jamie Pollard was good. Talking about it like he wasn't. We were done wrong or lack of loyalty. He was like, you know, Matt Campbell doesn't know Iowa State anything. And they, they seemed prepared for that moment. And like, I guess all's well that ends well for Penn State. But that was a wild coaching search and I'll let the COVID three guys speak to it. But like Matt Campbell, it's. I went and googled like some preseason rankings of coaches like we do in basketball and he was like top 15 in most of these things. So to have a winding and weird coaching search that lands with a guy who at least, you know, five months ago was considered a top 15 coach in a sport. Like that's a. I guess all is well that ends well. But we don't need to spend much more time on the Iowa State football coaching search. Hey. So Iowa State and Duke had the most impressive wins of the weekend. I think that goes without saying. But Arizona and Michigan, the two teams that I have ahead of them in the top 25 and 1, were also impressive. We're going to touch on those results next. Then we'll argue about who should be number one right now. But first, let's get a word from our partners.
- [25:18]
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- [26:24]
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- [26:56]
Gary Parrish
Duke had the most impressive wins of the weekend. But Arizona and Michigan were, oh, were both also impressive. Final score Arizona 97, Auburn 68 final score Michigan 101 Rutgers 60 Tommy Lloyd's Wildcats added a fourth win over a top 35 Kin Palm team and also a fourth 40 point win on the season.
- [27:20]
Or no, I'm sorry, I've got that wrong. Tommy Lloyd's Wildcats. They added the fourth win over a top 35 Kim Point team, Kim Pom team Dusty Maze Wolverines added the fourth 40 point win of the season. They've got four of them through eight games. Norlandy Learner Talk to me about what Arizona and Michigan did and then let's talk big picture stuff.
- [27:38]
Matt Norlander
Yeah, we listen. Michigan mutilated Rutgers by 40 plus. It's just Michigan's thing now. It obviously should factor into the conversation we're gonna have in just a couple of minutes here, but it's Rutgers a non factor. I didn't watch any of the game. They, they won Rutgers. It's terrible. Michigan just kept pace with what it's been doing. There actually is something to be said for just curb stopping the teams that you're supposed to eviscerate in Michigan continue to do that. Arizona on that court that I am loving. Apparently it's not every Arizona fan loves it, but I really do.
- [28:09]
Gary Parrish
I love it. I love the. The thought.
- [28:13]
Matt Norlander
Is it a thought typeface?
- [28:14]
Gary Parrish
The typeface?
- [28:17]
Matt Norlander
Yeah, I think it's.
- [28:18]
Gary Parrish
When I turned it on last night, I same thing. I got out of studio, got back to the hotel, turned on a game and I was like, I like that court.
- [28:26]
Matt Norlander
Yeah, I like it with the, the, the big, the big cactus. What's that called? There's another name for it there. A Yuka, something like that. I can't remember. Anyway, it looks awesome to me. I love the way the floor looks and I love the way Arizona looks. Arizona, there's a. If you're watching right now, I think that just is a. That's a popping, popping floor right there. Good job by Arizona. The team is continuing to take care of business. Auburn, which got this huge game out of Tahad Pettiford and then there was, you know, some brief encounter with Keyshawn hall and Pettifer going into a timeout and whatever, you're on the road. It's a tough environment. I'm not going to make too much out of it. But you know, you see teammates kind of drawing at each other a little bit. That's just, just generally sports. But I couldn't help but notice that Arizona is the bigger story here. Auburn, you know, it goes on the road, it's got a really tough assignment and it beat St. John's and NC State in two different spots and then goes and gets. Arizona gets plucked off. It's got a game with Purdue coming up in. In less than two weeks, Arizona was. I thought this was the most complete game the Wildcats played this season. You had 18 from Pete, including five assists. You had Braden Burris, he had 16 and he was 7 of 8 from inside the three point arc. I thought that was actually a really important progression game for him. Jane Bradley, good again, he had 16.
- [29:42]
Who else did you have? Oaka. He only had six. But I'll tell you what, I'm just a big Oaka fan. I like what he brings to them. Anthony Del Orso off the bench had 11, crevice had eight. But yeah, well rounded performance overall by the Wildcats. And keep in mind as they put on this performance, this was near the end of Saturday night after we'd seen a lot of impressive stuff, some for some other teams including the two that we just talked about to start the pod early in the day and they were determined not to lose pace and they didn't do it whatsoever.
- [30:07]
Gary Parrish
I got this from CBS Sports Research last night. Michigan, the previous five seasons had played 165 total games and won exactly two of them by at least 40 points. This season, Michigan has played eight games and won four of them by 40 points. So they are just absolutely annihilating everybody other than tcu. TCU can play with them apparently, but everybody else is, is, is struggling. So let's focus on these four undefeated teams for a second because I did move them to 1, 2, 3 and 4 in the top 25. And 1, with all due respect to Yukon, which is clearly awesome and would possibly still be undefeated if it weren't shorthanded when it, it welcomed right. Arizona to town. Right. But for, for the sake of this conversation, let's take UConn and, and set them over here because right now there are four undefeated teams in the country with net ratings above 30 according to Kenpa. And those four teams are Arizona, Michigan, Duke and Iowa State. Vandy, by the way, is close, is close to that, but not quite there. And unlike Arizona, Michigan, Duke and Iowa State, Vandy doesn't have like a signature win. Yeah, if you define that as a win over, let's say a top 35 Kim Pom team. By the way, Duke has three of those. Arizona has two, Iowa State has two. Michigan has one. So of those four teams, Michigan's got fewer top 25 King Palm wins, but they've got more beat your brains out of your head wins than anybody else in the country. So again, let's focus on those four. I know you think Duke has the best resume. I don't disagree, but I wasn't compelled. But I was not compelled.
- [31:58]
Matt Norlander
Disagree, by the way, but I, I think Duke has the best resume. Keep it going.
- [32:02]
Gary Parrish
Yeah, yeah, I, I don't necessarily like, if you just wanted to frame it like Duke has more Quadrant one wins than any other undefeated team, you could just say that. And it's true. We could argue it a million different ways. I just wasn't going to drop Arizona from number one in the top 25 and one after they beat Auburn by 29 points.
- [32:20]
Matt Norlander
Totally.
- [32:21]
Gary Parrish
I've got it. Arizona 1, Michigan 2, Duke 3, Iowa State 4 and then UConn at number five. But would you agree with me that if you wanted to just die on a hill you could make an argument for any of those four teams to be number one in any human ranking right now?
- [32:39]
Matt Norlander
Oh yeah, for sure. Because two different things here. First of all, that's an awesome top five. And then by the way, Gonzaga is rating as the top three team in some metrics as well. But they've got the loss in Michigan so they got to be removed from this conversation at this point. We're going to get to Gonzaga and just a little bit by the way. And we're going to get to you Kentucky. I think Michigan is the best team in college basketball on Sunday December 7th slash Monday December 8th. That's who I think is the best team. I've seen them in person do things I've never seen at a multi team event before in the regular season. They continue to pace with that by doing what they did against Rutgers. Right now, Michigan also ranks number one at kenpom, KPI, the Net, Torvik.
- [33:23]
They are just that. They are the team that from a metric standpoint rates number one. For me, that's the best team in the country. And then I, I think I'd go Michigan one.
- [33:36]
I think I'd go Iowa State two. I think I'd go. It's interesting. I think I'd go Arizona three, Arizona one. By the way, dude, Auburn had 25 foul shots. Arizona had 12. So it was sub 13 in foul shots on its home floor and still won by 29. It did that because it forced Auburn to a horrific shooting night 2163 from the field. So I would go Arizona 3 and then I would go Duke 4 in terms of if I was doing a power ranking. But when it comes to the resume, two different things. And guess what folks, we have so much road to go so we don't even have to spend too much time on this. That's a good thing for college hoops. To me, Duke has the best resume that is also backed up by wins above bubble. It's backed up by Evan Mia resume quality heading into Monday as well. Strength of record does give it to Arizona at one, Duke at two. But for me, Duke is the only team with four with a 40 record against quad one. It's got a combined 50 record in quad one and two. The only other team that is true of is Michigan and so, given what Duke just did on the road against Michigan State, you can say, well, look what Michigan did against Gonzaga, and a neutral. I get it. Splitting hairs. I think Duke's got the best resume, and I think Michigan's the best team.
- [34:56]
Gary Parrish
So ESPN had an interesting graphic towards the end of the Arizona Auburn game. They were, like, in total fill mode. We've all been there. Game gets out of hand, and now we're just talking. This is where they say, gp keep it. We're gonna keep your mic open. You ready to podcast that when the game gets like this? So here's the graphic. And I don't know that I had ever heard this. Tell me if you've ever heard this. You've probably had it in the stupid court report. But it was like 11 minutes in, deep into the court report, and I can't make it that far. Here was the graphic. ESPN.
- [35:31]
Flash it up on the screen. That 15 of the past 20 national champions were both undefeated and ranked in the AP poll at the end of November. Did you know that? I mean, that's a weird way.
- [35:44]
Matt Norlander
I got brought up on an HQ hit I did a few days ago. So, I mean, it kind of makes sense. Really good teams get off to really good start, to be really good at competition. It doesn't always happen, but it happens more often than not, right?
- [35:53]
Gary Parrish
I mean, 75 of the past 20 national champions were on deep on the morning of December 1st, still undefeated and ranked in the AP poll. All right, so.
- [36:07]
Arizona, Michigan, Duke, Iowa State, the teams we've been talking about, they all qualify.
- [36:13]
Vanderbilt, Purdue, Michigan State and Louisville also qualify. I believe Those are the eight teams that were, on the morning of December 1st, both undefeated and. And ranked in the AP poll. Do you believe our national champion comes from that list?
- [36:29]
Matt Norlander
I believe our national champion will come from the top 12 of tomorrow's AP poll. Tomorrow is week six of the regular season AP poll, and every national champion for the past 23, 24 years has been ranked in the top 12 of that poll. All eight of those teams will be in there. Plus we get another four more. It will bear out yet again in 2026.
- [36:46]
Gary Parrish
That's. You sound like a politician on. On a Sunday morning show.
- [36:52]
Matt Norlander
No, I'm giving you additional context and statistics on that. So we'll not just be those eight, it will be additional four that will come because we have seen that at an even longer clip than the one that you just gave me. It goes back even further than the stat you just gave me. So, yes, look at the top 12 on Monday morning. And the national champion will come from that group of 12 that you gave me.
- [37:09]
Gary Parrish
Senator Norlander, I asked a very specific question, and the question was this. On the morning of December 1st, there were eight teams that were undefeated and ranked in the AP poll. They were Arizona, Michigan, Duke, Iowa State, Vanderbilt, Purdue, Michigan State and Louisville. 75 of our past 20 national champions have been undefeated and ranked. On the morning of December 1st, we had eight teams this season qualify. I just gave them to you. The question is, do you believe our national champion comes from that list?
- [37:38]
Matt Norlander
I think there's a 75 chance it does.
- [37:41]
Gary Parrish
You just can't answer a simple question.
- [37:43]
Matt Norlander
I did answer it.
- [37:44]
Gary Parrish
It's. How about this? Let's go with a yes or a no.
- [37:47]
Matt Norlander
You answer it first. It's your question.
- [37:49]
Gary Parrish
No.
- [37:50]
Matt Norlander
Okay. Who's gonna win it?
- [37:51]
Gary Parrish
I don't know. But I mean.
- [37:54]
Matt Norlander
No.
- [37:54]
Gary Parrish
Yeah, I'm gonna say yes. I'm gonna say yes. But I. I lose on here. Houston, you lose Yukon. I don't like losing Kelvin Sampson and Dan Hurley.
- [38:05]
Matt Norlander
Yep.
- [38:06]
Gary Parrish
But I would say yes. You know what you can do?
- [38:08]
Matt Norlander
You can use the 12 from Monday's AP Top 25, and both those teams are going to be in it. Come join me, buddy.
- [38:16]
Gary Parrish
I can do it with eight. I don't need 12.
- [38:20]
Matt Norlander
Okay.
- [38:21]
Gary Parrish
I can do it.
- [38:22]
Matt Norlander
See how that goes for you.
- [38:24]
Gary Parrish
I can do it with hate, but I'm gonna need Purdue to get. I'm gonna need Purdue to get his together, but I can do it with eight.
- [38:32]
Matt Norlander
Exactly. Exactly. By the way, Arizona. Arizona fans, like, I see there's one or two of you in the chat here. Like, you're way too emotional about this. You have an awesome team. It has a top two resume. It's a top three, top four team in the country. Like, there's a lot of people that believe in your team. Stop being so in your feels over this. Okay? Just because I don't think that Arizona is better than Michigan right now, or I think Duke has the better resume than Arizona. Just some weird, weird vibes out of here.
- [39:01]
Gary Parrish
Just.
- [39:01]
Matt Norlander
And that's not all of them, but there's just. There's a few that feel like they need verification or validation. They're all very good. The margins between these teams are so narrow. And we're five weeks into the season. Arizona could well be the best team in the country a week from now if they go smash Alabama and we see some. Some letdowns from some other teams there. So plenty of room to grow. Even still, it's really Impressive what Arizona has been able to do. And by doing what it did against Auburn, it's just only reinforced that. So don't get. Don't get too bent out of shape just because the entire world doesn't unanimously agree that Arizona should be the number one team with the number one resume. After five weeks.
- [39:33]
Gary Parrish
Arizona, I got you ranked number one, baby.
- [39:36]
Matt Norlander
There you go. Go to your guys.
- [39:38]
Gary Parrish
If you want somebody who believes in you, look over to this side of the screen.
- [39:42]
Matt Norlander
And by the way, to all the Iowa State fans that want to be number one, look at the guy who doesn't believe in you right there. Duke fans, Michigan fans, look who does not believe in you. That's an Arizona guy right there.
- [39:51]
Gary Parrish
This is the one who. This.
- [39:52]
Matt Norlander
There you go there. Yeah.
- [39:53]
Gary Parrish
Arizona fans, if you. If you. If you don't like what he says on Mike, you should hear what he says off Mike.
- [39:59]
Matt Norlander
Who you point at to gb, by the way. That's the wrong direction.
- [40:02]
Gary Parrish
Yeah, it's the right direction.
- [40:03]
Matt Norlander
When I'm looking at me, you know, you're. Yeah, you're pointing to Jerry Parrish. That's who you're pointing to.
- [40:10]
Gary Parrish
Okay, is this the right way? Because I need to know when I can point to you. Is this the right way?
- [40:14]
Matt Norlander
You can watch back and see if that proves to be.
- [40:16]
Gary Parrish
I don't have time to watch back.
- [40:20]
How many hours you think are in the day?
- [40:23]
Matt Norlander
I'm gonna go 24.
- [40:24]
Gary Parrish
I think that's the right answer. Trivia time. How many hours are in the day?
- [40:29]
Trivia time. How many hours did I sit on a tarmac Friday night?
- [40:32]
Matt Norlander
That's tough.
- [40:33]
Gary Parrish
Oh, it was tough. Are we ready to move on?
- [40:37]
Matt Norlander
Yeah. I think we solved everything there.
- [40:39]
Gary Parrish
I think. I think everything's solved.
- [40:40]
Matt Norlander
Fans, you are. You are Kentucky. You have been spared for 37 and a half minutes, and it's. It's time.
- [40:45]
Gary Parrish
Oh, yeah. But we're about to ask big, tough questions about your stupid team. Oh, we're about to ask big, stupid questions about your stupid team. Yeah. We got to get to Kentucky next. Things have gotten really bad in Lexington. Mark Pope's Wildcats lost by 1 million points in Nashville to Gonzaga. There were lots of booze. They were loud. Get away from our partners, and let's dive in.
- [41:10]
Matt Norlander
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- [41:26]
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- [41:27]
Matt Norlander
Give it a try@mintmobile.com Switch upfront payment.
- [41:31]
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- [42:08]
Gary Parrish
Final score Gonzaga 94, Kentucky 59 Yikes. Kentucky now 5 and 4 overall.04 in quadrant one with zero wins over teams in the top one hundred and eighty five of the net. Best win at home over Tennessee Tech, which is 188th in the net. All five of Kentucky's wins fall in quadrant four.
- [42:33]
Is Mark Pope gonna pull out of this or are we gonna have to hear his own fans boo him all season? Because that sucks. That's mean.
- [42:41]
Matt Norlander
It's deserved. He would. He would agree with it, by the way, that it's deserved.
- [42:44]
Gary Parrish
I mean, it didn't hurt Gonzaga.
- [42:46]
Matt Norlander
We will get to you before we get out of this segment here, but we have to talk about Kentucky. Frankly, maybe it's an upset that it took us this long to talk about Kentucky. It did happen Friday night. This is the most significant result of the weekend, I think behind Iowa State doing what it did at Purdue. And if you want to make the case that it's actually Kentucky over Iowa State because Kentucky still hasn't beaten a high major team, I'm not here to tell you you're necessarily wrong. The dispiriting thing about this was you come off the ugly but close home win Tuesday against unc and then you turn around and just get slice and dice by Gonzaga. Like down early, down big body language was bad. You had Boogie Cousins tweeting the team doesn't play like it has heart. That's a paraphrase. I don't have the tweet up in front of me right now, but you've got a very prominent alumni taking a social media before the game is over. Poke is asked about it in the post game press conference Afterward, as he should. And then he had a good line. I'm pissed at the coach too, but I sent it out on Friday and I mean it. Kentucky is the most overrated, overpaid and disappointing team in college basketball through the first five weeks of the season. There have been some other disappointing teams. None of them were ranked in the preseason top 10 that have the most expensive roster in college basketball. That's where we are with this and it is, it is wild to see how violently this is swung on Pope at this point. Jalen Lowe did return. Non factor. He's going to have to ease back in, whatever that means. Ortega away had 16 points but if you watch the game like they it was, you know, not effective. Didn't. Didn't even matter. Cam Williams started zero points. There's a thought that there's just too many guys in the rotation. Saw Greg Anthony made a point on tnt. I guess it would have been late Friday. I think maybe it was Saturday where he was essentially saying when you have a rotation that you want to make 10, 11 deep and now you're paying all these college players all this money, there's certain expectations and role allocation and what you're asked to do, settling into a role versus what you think you're going to do given how much you might be paid relative to the rest of the rest of your teammates or rest of other friends you might have in college basketball that are on other teams and you believe you know what they're being paid. It was, it was a, it was a good point by, by Greg. I, I think that he can, I think he can turn it around. Our poll from earlier in the show was which team has the best resume and Arizona beat that narrowly over Duke. And I know we've got a current one here that we'll have to get to in a few on will Kentucky make the tournament in 2026? I'm interested to see what our live viewership votes on that. Yes or no? I would say this is probably me just leaning into my, my priors and, and some confirmation bias. I would still say yes. This is a guy who was very wrong and had Kentucky number three in the preseason. I might have been right about Michigan, but man was I wrong about Kentucky and everyone was wrong about Kentucky. They do get Indiana at home in a week. You would think that they can get that win, but we'll see they get St. John's at the CBS Sports Classic in Atlanta or Catlanta. Those are the two non conference games of note left. Got to pick those off and then you'll have playing the SEC to uplift. But as I referenced previously, the SEC is down. So maybe that helps you because the collective talent in the league and team quality isn't as good as it was. But you'll still have like, lower end quad one opportunities and the Quad two games might not be as hard this season as they were last season. I think that's going to prove to be true. But it's a major, major, major issue and to me.
- [46:28]
Maybe the biggest story in the sport through the first five weeks of the season.
- [46:31]
Gary Parrish
I think the point Greg made about paying too many guys is an interesting point and something I've had other coaches talk to me about a million. I think we're still so early in this that anybody insisting they know how to do it and, and if you don't do it this way, you're doing it the wrong way. I think that's crazy. I sort of appreciated when I was at Big 12 media day, Big 10 media day. I mean, I talked to coaches who have won national championships and they acknowledged a little uncertainty about how to program build, how to roster build, how much the portal, how much to use high schools, how much does roster continuity matter? We're all learning as we go. But one thing I have consistently heard from, I don't know, a handful of guys I respect is that it's cool if you got all the money and you can just go out and pay everybody but you, you probably don't want 11 millionaires on your team. You know, like, you probably, like in the NBA, it's a different deal because it's just that. But in college, this is all new. And when somebody signs for $800,000, they don't think they're doing that to play 11 minutes in a game. And I'm not saying that's an issue or the main issue at Kentucky, but it's got to be on the list of stuff somewhere that's causing problems because they look like a team with no heart and no chemistry. That's what they look like. You know, the sort of, the, the whole college cliche thing for decades has been, you know, play for the name on the front of the jersey and, you know, I, I don't think you had to have to grow up in Big Blue Nation to care about Kentucky once you get there. Like, up until a few weeks before he was getting ready to move to Kentucky, John Wall thought he was going to play college basketball in Memphis. All right? Then he went to Kentucky and he became a Kentucky legend. And I know cares deeply about that place. So the idea that you can't in the Nil era or in the transfer portal era have a roster filled with people who care about where they're at. But it does not look like that's the case at Kentucky. It looks like they spent $22 million on, on some talented dudes, but they don't have a basketball team and they can't shoot 31.9 from 3 on the season. That now ranks like in the 230s in the country. It's a mess. And the whole SEC thing aspect of this, it can cut both ways. On one hand you can say, listen, we're going to the sec. And so, you know, right now all of our losses are good losses. I mean, they're not good. Our coach is getting booed out of the building.
- [49:09]
Matt Norlander
They're the good teams. I know what you mean.
- [49:11]
Gary Parrish
But they're good teams, right? So look, it ain't like we take it a quadrant 4 loss or something like that, and we got all these opportunities in front of us, and so we're fine. Like, that's one way to look at it. The other way to look at it is you can't beat anybody any good. And in the sec, you don't have to play a lot of teams that are good. So who are you? You better figure it out because you can think it won't get worse than it got on Friday night, but it can.
- [49:38]
Matt Norlander
Yeah, it definitely can. Also, like, the ironic thing about this roster is they don't shoot well. From three. It almost. A lot of the components, a lot of the players, the way they play, not all of them, but. I don't know, it feels like. It feels like a John Caliperi orchestrated roster in some ways to me, which is not what I expected, to be honest. We'll see if they can snap out of the funk on the Gonzaga end.
- [49:59]
Gary Parrish
Just real quick on this to that point, then I'll jump right back out. But okay.
- [50:04]
As intentional as it appears, Pat Kelsey built his roster to put shooters around Michael Brown. It doesn't look like that same intention was. Was used at, at Kentucky. Like, okay, how are these, like the first. The first question I guess on some level is like, is this person good enough to play for us, help us? And then it's like, okay, we got these people. How do we fit them together? And at Louisville, I think Pat did an incredible job of figuring out how that fits together. At Iowa State, I think they figured out how that fits together. I know Purdue just got blasted But I think Matt's done a great job of figuring out how things fit together at Kentucky. It doesn't look like there was a lot of. I shouldn't even say that because like Mark's a smart guy. I'm sure there was a lot of thought.
- [50:49]
Matt Norlander
Oh yeah, no doubt. Was a lot of thought.
- [50:52]
Gary Parrish
I shouldn't say it that way.
- [50:53]
Matt Norlander
Yeah, I know. Okay.
- [50:54]
Gary Parrish
It just doesn't appear to fit together well. So maybe the thought was incorrect.
- [50:59]
Matt Norlander
Yeah. And this is just. You're going to get this every year with the X number of of teams, let alone high major team. You're going to have a lot of inspiration and optimism in the off season given the pieces you got what they did and just not everyone can win all the games. Some teams are just not going to work. We'll see if Kentucky can actually work. I know Pope. At least I don't. I say I know I got to spend some behind the scenes time with this team earlier this season and it does seem like a group that does really like each other with a staff that's really well connected to the group. Now can they figure out what's going on here? Because time from an at large perspective, time literally is running out right now. Kentucky, they got time, but it's not that much time. 148 in KPI and resume strength one four eight. It's better and strength. The record, they're 113 and wins above bubble they're 72. That's still well out of the insta play tournament picture. Let's be clear. But they're gonna have to really turn it around. Gonzaga, good on you. You get destroyed against Michigan became the first team ever, ever to lose by 30 plus against a ranked opponent. And then in the next game against a ranked opponent, win by 30 plus. No team had ever boomeranged or pendulum swung like that ever before. And you know what few told me in Vegas was kind of ringing in my ears as I watched this game play out where he was really at a loss for. You know, who are these guys that showed up in our Gonzaga uniforms and played there? Like I don't know those people. That's not who we are. And, and how we bailed on our entire game plan. 10 minutes in. Just weird stuff. He had never taken a loss like that. He goes until two hours ago like we were one of the five best teams in the country. Well, again they look like one of the five best teams in the country. They ranked third at Ken Palm right now. Wins over Oklahoma, Creighton, Arizona, State to be determined if any of those are going to be and tournament teams. But nonetheless they are high majors. No, they have the neutral over a good Alabama team and now they, they just vaporize Kentucky and so that's, that's notable. We'll next see Gonzaga this weekend against a good opponent in ucla, but we'll, we'll take that as it comes and address the, the Bulldogs further there. Just a very, very inspiring performance from them. I didn't want to just toss them aside when we're talking Kentucky. It is a very good sign for Gonzaga that it was able to turn around and do this. Even if Kentucky's a wounded animal, has an identity crisis, all that, whatever, you could have done that and won the game by nine. You didn't do that. 94 to 59 and it was a no doubt about wire to wire kind of thing. Really impressive for a few fuse guys.
- [53:10]
Gary Parrish
Yeah, this is one of those because I saw a little bit of this when I posted the top 25 and one on Saturday morning. It's like, yes, everybody's impressed by what the Zags did. That is one of the most respected programs in the sport. But the story was Kentucky. And so I ended up writing entirely about Kentucky. And you have some Gonzaga fans that are like, well, what about us? Like, we know who you are, we know what you did. But when the Kentucky head coach, who is also the captain of a national championship team, is getting booed off the floor in Nashville because you're beating the brains in that, that's the story. Last thing on Kentucky, Ortega away like he's just points down, rebounds down, stills down, field goal percentage down, three point field goal percentage down. Preseason SEC player of the year feels a little RJ Davis in the sense that like you have this all American level season, they bring you back for a big paycheck. And I don't know that one has anything to do with the other, but.
- [54:17]
If he was supposed to take a step this season while Kentucky did the same, that that's not happening.
- [54:23]
Matt Norlander
All right, you want to take a tour, do a little weekend whip around here and, and take a scan of what we saw here Friday, Saturday and even into Sunday.
- [54:32]
Gary Parrish
Yeah, let's bounce around the other notable results from the weekend and we'll start it with Darren Peterson returning to Kansas rotation. Before we do it, let's get one more word from our partners.
- [54:43]
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- [54:54]
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- [54:58]
Gary Parrish
Things are getting a little out of hand. Well, you think?
- [55:00]
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- [55:12]
Gary Parrish
All right, Norlander, let's whip around the rest of the weekend. Let's start with Darren Peterson making his return to KU's rotation. Last week. I told everybody, relax, relax. There's no sensible reason to believe Darren Peterson is done playing college basketball. Earlier this afternoon, he played college basketball. 17 points in 23 minutes. Kansas beat Mizzou 80 to 60. Are we done with the DP conspiracies now?
- [55:37]
Matt Norlander
Hopefully so, yeah. 17 points, 23 minutes. They really play much in the second half. They didn't need him to. Trey White was the other big step up guy in this game. Mark Mitchell cannot do it all himself from Missouri. If you're a Missouri fan, you know, you get this game against Kansas, you're just glad the border war is back. Although it, it is a Packers Bears situation, I admit, but you can't even keep it more competitive than this. Peterson, you know, he stepped on the floor and you know, he didn't have one, you know, one of his top two games or anything like that by any means, but his presence on the floor just changes everything about Kansas. Happy to see him back. He did make, I don't know if you saw. I. It was brought to attention to me by a Kansas fan that he made a little bit of a video where he just spoke on the injury and how he'd never sit out. Did you happen to see that or.
- [56:19]
Gary Parrish
No, I didn't see it. But like that all made sense to me.
- [56:22]
Matt Norlander
We were in the podcast, was in the video like it kind of. It ended with me talking about how people thought he might be trying to load, manage. And then I say something like, I actually don't think that's fair to Darren Peterson. I'd like to actually hear from him first. And then he had this. He wasn't like face camera, like mood lighting, but he was sitting in, I think a training room, a locker room, and just kind of talking about the past few weeks and, and this was in advance of the game that really, I think that's really what allowed people to have some real hope even more than three or four hours before they Played on Sunday that he was coming back, come back. He did. And let's hope it's for good because frankly, he's an amazing talent. And I would like to see Darren Peterson play in every single game for the rest of the season.
- [56:57]
Gary Parrish
Yeah, it was six to 14 from the field, three of nine from three in limited minutes. But it was unnecessary to use him any more than they did. We don't have to spend any more time on it. I just was like, if he didn't want to play college basketball, he, he, he would have never enrolled. He has a hamstring injury. If you follow the NBA, you know, this is how they deal with hamstring injuries. They, they just, they take, they always take longer than you think because they're trying to be more careful than, than most fans think that they should. So if this is where I think there was a little bit of a breakdown between people who follow the NBA closely and people who follow college basketball solely because if you follow the NBA at all, you, you know that you hear hamstring and it's like, probably won't see that person for at least three weeks and, and possibly much longer. So Darren Peterson is back. That's a good thing. Louisville 87, Indiana 78. Isaac McNeely, 5 of 9 from 3. He had 15 points. The Cardinals shot above 40% from 3 on 31 attempts. This, of course, after they had really struggled from the field earlier in the week against Arkansas at Bud Walton. What'd you make of what you saw from Pat Kelce's team?
- [58:06]
Matt Norlander
Just a really nice impressive win. Louisville had five in double figures for the first time this season. They also got off to a 160 start. So if you eliminated the first six minutes of the game, which you can't do. Indiana was essentially able to be level with Louisville for the rest of the way, but they got off to a big lead in that race, and Indiana was not going to catch up with its strides to get there. And so it takes the loss. Conwell had 21, de Vries at 26, but, you know, and Debris is a really good player. He could be one of the five best players in the Big Ten this season. We'll see. It's certainly on the table, but they're going to need more than that. I'm still curious on where Indiana is going to land. I know going into the season, I think you and I were relatively close on, you know, I was basically, I think they're going to be on the fence, like one way, this way, and they're the last team in the field one way, that way they're going to be going and heading to the, to the NIT or the crown or whatever the hell they got to play in. And, and I still haven't moved off that too much back to back losses. The Minnesota one was a little bit of an out of body experience in the negative for Indiana. But if there was ever a day, I mean truly, if there was ever a day to get off to an awful start on the hardwood and get beat by Louisville, it was on Saturday. Because Indiana wins the Big Ten football champions. Kurt Signetti continues to author one of the most unlikely coaching stories in the history of American sports. And I'm sure there was a good portion of Indiana fans that went to that basketball game to start left disappointed and didn't give a flying F about it because they were elated and are still elated if they happen to also take in this podcast in whatever form. That's an incredible thing for the Hoosiers who are now obviously the number one team in the College Football Playoff and have a buy. I'm amazed by what Kurt Signetti has done. And so Darren Devries actually is in the rare position of being an Indiana coach, particularly in a year one where, let's be clear and don't get me wrong on this, like once we get to the end of the College Football Playoff and get whether Indiana wins it or however that goes, once that's fully in the rear view, Hoosier fans are going to be plenty dialed in and have a lot to expect. But he is, he's been given plenty of grace here in year one and so this was as overshadowed of a ranked loss that Indiana could have ever asked for, literally ever, because Indiana football is never this good.
- [60:12]
Gary Parrish
Yesterday was one of the rare days where we basketball crew in studio and also the college football crew in studio. So we were all together, you know, for much of the day and we watched the Big Ten championship game together. You know, you've been in there, there's like 12 TVs and it was on one and we had basketball in the others and blah blah, blah. But we were sort of talking like what, what is the basketball version of Signetti? Because this is crazy. And the best I could come up with is maybe a Division 2 coach you've never heard of gets the Penn State basketball job and in year two has it as the number one overall seed in the NCAA tournament.
- [60:49]
Matt Norlander
Basically something like that. I mean, Brad Stevens taking Butler to back to back national championship games out of the Horizon League when Stevens was working at Eli Lilly is from a coaching perspective, I think that's the analog. Someone asked me this on Twitter on Saturday night as well. The basketball one. I think I've even said on the show, Indiana had the worst winning track record of any power conference team ever. Well, Northwestern, some people were pushing back and saying Nebraska because Nebraska has never won an NC Tournament game. Northwestern has won an NCAA tournament game. But actually it's conference championships or lack thereof is even worse. I mean this, that program had nothing for 70 years. It would be like Northwestern getting to Selection Sunday and being the number one overall seed. It is unthinkable for us to ever get to that point. He's pulled it off with Indiana and it's, it's a really, really awesome thing. I obviously had that Saturday night whole weekend. It was, it was a mandatory three, four screen kind of weekend. And I was of course dialed into the football as much as the basketball on Saturday.
- [61:41]
Gary Parrish
I don't, I don't live in the football world so like I don't know those people for the most part, but I can imagine somebody like Kurt Signetti coming into the basketball world. Like imagine a Division 2 coach getting a bad Big Ten job and go talk and talking about Google me, I win. Like imagine how many text messages you would get about that guy from other coaches. Like, who does this guy think he is? I know that was going on among college football coaches, like, who does this guy think he is? And he appears to be just as awesome as he says he's. He's the rare combination of somebody who knows he's awesome and is actually just as awesome as he appears to believe he is.
- [62:19]
Matt Norlander
A little bit of. Not exactly the same on camera appearance, but a little bit of a. They won the game and he's walking off the floor. A little bit of a J. Wright non reaction when they beat Ohio State. It's like the biggest one in the history of the program. I thought that was pretty.
- [62:30]
Gary Parrish
Everything about the guy is, is hilarious to like. I think it was pregame interview at Penn State maybe. Did you see this one? I could be conflating stories now, but.
- [62:41]
Matt Norlander
Yeah, because I want to say, I want to say that Jenny had that on cbs.
- [62:45]
Gary Parrish
It was something. And it was something along the lines of he was asked about, you know, and you know, the Penn State's never won or Indiana's never won here or hasn't won here since, whatever. And he's like, this team's never played here. It just was like that's the end.
- [62:58]
Matt Norlander
Actually. I mean it's also true.
- [62:59]
Gary Parrish
Yeah, this is a brand new team game. This team's never played here. We'll be fine. And then they go. Of course they go win the game. Just an awesome story man.
- [63:06]
Matt Norlander
Just really, really good stuff. If you want it more of college football obviously head to the COVID three if we have time. We're running long. I did have a thought or two on the, on the cfp, but we might have to bypass that. We still got more stuff to talk about. Illinois beats Tennessee 75.62 so Illinois is now 2 and 2 in non con games this season against top 15 opponents. It's got the win over Texas Tech and then it's got the win over Tennessee. The losses have come against Alabama and Yukon. It's a really, really strong four pack frankly. Illinois, how about this? It was the first surprising stuff here. This was in Illinois's notes. Illinois. It was their first ranked versus ranked win in non conference play since 2008. No, sorry. Illinois's fewest points. Let me correct that. Illinois's fewest points allowed in the top 25 non conference ranked on ranked game since 2008 against Missouri. It was their but it was their first ranked on ranked win since the 2024 NCAA elite eight. They didn't get one at all last season even in Big Ten play. That was surprising to me. They held Tennessee to just 62 points which I thought was notable. Keaton Wagler had his best game in an Illinois uniform which I think you get these, you get the win and you get stuff like that. That's when you're an Illinois fan you're like okay, you know, maybe we can really be in that top three, top four consistently in the Big Ten when we get there. 16 and 11 for him. Hit some shots from beyond the arc. Really impressive. There's. I want your thoughts on Illinois real quick and then I also want your thoughts on Tennessee because.
- [64:26]
I'm not, I'm not entirely sure what to make of this team. I saw them 10, you know the whole Vegas cliche, 15 round heavyweight battle, blow for blow, the whole thing. They beat Houston and since then it's, it's, it's like, it's like the the Avengers meme like you be to Houston but at what cost? Everything. Because they have lost every everyone since then. They lost to Kansas and Vegas. They lost at Syracuse by two and then they lose to Illinois. That's the worst loss by margin of the three. I get the sense that Tennessee is going to be one of those teams where when we get to selection Sunday, we're going to look up and say, oh, it's got the win against Houston and then it's going to pull off like two or three really good road wins in SEC play. But it's also going to have a collection of losses where we don't know if this is one of the 10 best teams or is somewhere outside the top 20. I'm just getting a little bit of uncertain readings off of the balls right.
- [65:16]
Gary Parrish
Now on Illinois, like I don't have anything new to say about them. That's a team that I think is going to be in that 10 to 20 range in the rankings much of the season. Clearly they're a factor in the Big Ten. Good enough in theory to win it. If I were putting Big Ten tiers, I'd probably have Michigan and Purdue in tier one and then Illinois would be somewhere in tier two. But you know, Brad's got another uniquely built, very good basketball team and I know Tennessee has been struggling, but to go into Tennessee like that, I know, not at Tennessee, but in Nashville and, and handle the Vols. That was impressive stuff for, for ut. It's wild. Like you don't expect to beat Houston and then immediately can't beat anybody, but that's where they're at. Back to back to back losses. Kansas, Syracuse, Illinois. I'm a data sorter, you know that about me. So I went over to bartorvik.com I just said, all right, let's start with the Kansas game. Let's run it through the Illinois game. What are we looking at here? And you touched on it. It's offense. I mean they're not good anywhere in this three game stretch. That's why they're on a three game losing streak. But 103rd in adjusted offensive efficiency, 55th and adjusted defensive efficiency. So Tennessee in its best years under Rick has been one of the more physically dominant, overwhelming defensive teams in the sport. In this three game stretch they've, they've done none of that. And then what has been a little bit of an issue there, particularly with, you know, early tournament departures, they can sometimes struggle to score and in this little three game stretch they're struggling to score.
- [66:56]
Matt Norlander
We don't have to spend too much time on St. John's Ole Miss. I do want to know where you have them. It was a hideous game game. I mean repeat performance from the St. John's Arkansas instead of a tournament, just non display from beyond the Ark. Let me bring this up here. 6, 6 of 38 combined from both these teams from beyond the arc. It was not a good game. St. John's get to win which is important. Chris Beards Mississippi Rebels are 5 and 4 and have lost. There's actually a couple teams now that are riding like four and five game losing streaks. We'll get to a couple of those before we get out of the show here. So that is going to the wrong way in a hurry. And the only halfway decent win is against Memphis. And credit to Memphis they got the win over Baylor on cbs. The third game of our triple header. Tigers absolutely needed that one and they got it. So at least they got that. But that's. I mean they're not even a top 60 team. That's. That's the revs best win. Where do you have the Johnnies and any quick. I mean there's. I don't know if there's a ton to take away from this game. It was on a weekend filled with so much must watch sports. This one was maybe the most unappealing of anything I watched.
- [67:54]
Gary Parrish
Yeah it's just something that happened and like you mentioned Ole miss four game losing streak. Now they started the year 24th at Kinpom and have slipped down to 53rd. So that's going the wrong direction with St. John's I've got them. Let me double check here. I believe 22nd in the top 25 and one that feels about like where they belong. A a top 25 team but probably closer to 25 than. Than 10. You'd agree with that for sure.
- [68:27]
Matt Norlander
I think I still have them in the top 25 realm I think but man that was like they got the win but it was ugly. I could be talked out of it pretty, pretty easily. By the way our live poll Josh sent in the numbers. Will Kentucky make the tournament? 56 say no more than half and all the others say yes. Let's tour through. Let me tour through a few things here and then tell me what stands out to you.
- [68:49]
Had some undefeated teams go down over the weekend. We had USC blew an 18 point lead at home. This one like totally gets lost in the mix. But they blew an 18 point lead at home to Washington. That gave the Huskies their first win of the season against the high major program. And actually the Big Ten. I had this up in the Indiana section. I think the Big Ten had four ranked teams lose on the same day for the first time since I believe 2009. Now you gotta have four, four ranked teams period to even qualify that and it could have been worse but it wasn't. They had four lose so USC is knocked out. Hans Steinbeck, by the way, really, really, really good freshman. His numbers are very good. If Washington actually can make some inroads, they could really have something there because they're in the Pacific Northwest. They haven't been a big team so far. He's not getting a ton of love, but he is going to be taken in the first round. Also, Colorado got clipped on CBS Sports Network at Colorado State. It's a pretty good watch. How do I know? We were decorating our tree and my littlest guy was more invested in the Colorado. Colorado State game than putting on the school made ornaments. But it was a, it was a good time. I actually tried to get him watching you in studio and I was gonna, I was gonna text it to you, but. And I swear this is, this is not an intended shot because it's not. By the time the studio stuff came on, then he went back to head footing on the tree. I was hoping to get him watching you and send it, but he was just watching the hoops. And then once it.
- [70:06]
Gary Parrish
He didn't need me. He didn't, he didn't need me. If he ever needs me, just FaceTime me. I'll talk to him whenever he wants.
- [70:13]
Matt Norlander
Rams are off to a nice start, by the way, under Ali Froakman. Yes, Right. Good stuff. We'll see if they can continue. Mountain west had a solid weekend overall. Virginia Tech ended George Mason's undefeated bid. So they get the win there. LSU went down big against Texas Tech. Admittedly, I was all dialed in on Bears, packers, but I did have that game on the screen and I was following along even though there wasn't a lot. At one point in the first half, I want to say Tech was up by like 16 and McCaslin's mother effing his guys in the huddle. I was like, this is hilarious, man. They're going to cruise to one here. But that's what coaches do. Like, I totally get it. A major readjustment and a wake up call there for, for lsu. If there was one more undefeated, I might have lost it when that happened. But I don't think another undefeated fell there before I get some other results. Any takeaways from what I just gave you?
- [70:57]
Gary Parrish
Well, the USC one was like, I mean, you're gonna lose games in the Big Ten, particularly on the road. I don't have USC schedule in front of me, but a typical Big Ten schedule, you're gon. And you're at Mackie, you're at the Breslin center. You're at Michigan and good luck. So when you are ranked, your opponent isn't, you're home, your opponent isn't, you're up team 18, your opponent's down 18. This is all basic stuff, but you got to knock that out.
- [71:30]
You know, Mus is somebody who understands the value of, of having your program, him on. On the radar. You know, like, I know there are coaches out there who will say things like, I don't care about the rankings. I don't look at this. I don't pay attention to that. But, like, Musk pays attention to everything. Like, like Musk knows when his team is in the top 25 and one and when it's not. He knows when his team's in the AP poll and it's not. And he values that type of stuff. And this is the type of loss that rips that away. We could be talking about undefeated USC gp. Where do you have them? You got them in the teens now, and instead you. You just give that one away and it. It cost you some stuff. It's just early December stuff, you know, not the biggest deal in the world, but it's a deal. And that was. That was a. That was a bad loss.
- [72:15]
Matt Norlander
I think my favorite thing that would.
- [72:17]
Gary Parrish
Be clear, not because they lost to a bad team, but because you were up 18 at home and you need.
- [72:21]
Matt Norlander
To knock that out. Yeah, no, it definitely negates some stuff. My favorite thing from the weekend I got. You were stuck on the tarmac, so I don't even think you got a chance to watch much of this, if any of them. It was Crosstown Shootout. Xavier beat Cincinnati. Trey Carroll, who looks like he fights in the army alongside Aquaman, apparently his nickname on the team might be Aquaman. He started his career. He was on. He was a Final 14. He was on the FAU Final 4 team. And. And he goes for 30 points, 7 rebounds. Before I keep going, were you. Were you like. Did you get to see any of it? Or were you like, tarmac, Helen? You missed it and all that stuff.
- [72:55]
Gary Parrish
Stuff, Bro, I spent all night in the airport Friday night. I did not see any of it. And if I. I didn't see any. Friday night was ridiculous. I won't bore you with the details, but no, I did not see this game.
- [73:09]
Matt Norlander
Okay, Josh, if you just played it, replay it again one more time for me here. He. Not only does he go 30 and seven, this is one of three times he did this. So you see him celebrating. He's going. He is full on pantomiming, zip Them up. This was not even the biggest zip. I think he might. Does he do zip them up at the end of this one? No, I don't think he did, dude. It was full on screaming, zip them up. When he. I said, this isn't. This is incredible. This guy, like you would have thought. He was born and bred in Cincinnati and made to hate the Bearcats. And once you put on that uniform and play this game, you are 79.74. A really, really good game. An awesome showing. I desperately looked. No one captured the video that I could find. Maybe it's on. Maybe it's on YouTube. I couldn't find it. But he does the post game game, okay? And he's. He's a wild man. He just.
- [73:54]
Gary Parrish
He's.
- [73:55]
Matt Norlander
He's just. He's beside himself because he's the. He. He took over the game. It was incredible. And then in the post game, he goes, yo, I got my wife. My wife up there. We're gonna go have pizza tonight, man. Shouts to minute made pink lemonade is my favorite drink. And it was just compared to the maniac that I saw losing his mind three minutes before. It was an incredible, incredible. Just juxtaposition. Shouts to Trey Carroll. I mean it. Instant legend status at that program in that city. You win that game. Oh, by the way, Xavier has won four in a row. Richard Pitino, he knows the deal. He shows up to the local spot. Maybe it's called Dana's. I'm not quite sure. I've yet to get to Cintas, and it's a major career regret to this point. I will get there eventually one day, but I think the whole deal is when you're the Xavier coach, coach and you get a big win, you crash the post game festivities and then you say, drinks on me. So he dropped a few thousand dollars on the. On the folks there in Cincinnati. Really cool scene. A little bit buried because it was Friday night, but this was way, way better than anything that was happening with Kentucky Gonzaga.
- [74:59]
Gary Parrish
GP Glad you talked about Trey Carroll the way you did because it emphasizes the point I was making earlier. Kentucky did spend a lot of money on a roster, and it looks like. It looks like they lack chemistry and lack a lot of the other stuff you need to be a great college basketball team. But don't think for a second that there aren't transfers that can't really become a part of it very quickly. And Trey Carroll is an excellent example of that. That guy was an owl eight months ago. Okay? The guy was an owl eight months ago and had possibly never been to Cincinnati in his life. All right, I don't know whether that's true or not, but it's possible. And. And you. You saw that. You saw that not only was he caring deeply about in city rivalry, but he was referencing stuff from the past that suggests he's done his homework. I love it.
- [75:59]
Matt Norlander
It was so good. I mean, because the studio guys. And we got. We'll keep it moving. We're gonna wrap here in a second. But the studio guys, they saw, like, how, how demonstrative he was. Like the zip them up was two. Holloway doesn't have anything on him. He really doesn't. And so I think they were gonna. They were. They were leaning into that in the immediate postgame interview. And they're like, all right, what do you got ahead for you? He goes, oh, no, I got my wife in the stands. Like, we're going to get pizza. I'm not getting in no trouble tonight. And it was just. It was a really, really cool television moment. I need Xavier to be good because Trey Carroll is now one of my favorite players in the sport. I love the fact that, like he stated, FAU after Dusty left and now he gets this moment. Totally deserves it. Keep it moving. Just a few more. The Ohs. TCU beat Florida and Wisconsin and then lost at home to Notre Dame. Not great. But here's even worse. Marquette is 5 and 5. It lost by 20 at Wisconsin. To be expected. Oregon has lost five in a row. Got dropped at UCLA. Oregon is now 4 and 5. Not good. On the better side, Seton hall and Arizona State went to Maui and they're actually doing well. Even they did well there and they're doing well after Seton Hall. One at K State. So seating all seven and one. K State is now five and four with four straight losses. It looks adrift as a program. Gotta admit, I'm a little stunned by that. Even if they were let down last season, I didn't think it'd be a repeat. We're heading that way. Arizona state hit 13 threes and beat Oklahoma and Phoenix. That's a good win for asu. And Bobby Hurley picked at the bottom of the Big 12. Guess what? ASU is 7 and 2. Good on you guys. And then the only other things from Sunday, SMU won over A M in overtime. Got a big time performance from one of its guys. Guys, that's a what, eight and one. Nine. One team now. Good on. Good on smu. Nebraska is still undefeated. Handled. Creighton doesn't have a signature win yet. But it's quietly getting it done. Hoiberg doesn't have Connor siege and he's out for the year. That's notable. And then the late Sunday game. That or I say late. It was one of the latest tips of relevant games. Carolina did not have an issue with Georgetown. They win. They win big. Another good result for UNC and for the ACC. So big weekends for the big 12 in the ACC. Specifically bad weekend for the SEC which is. Which may not produce double digit bits this season. We'll see. That's all I got for you. All right.
- [78:03]
Gary Parrish
Let's look ahead to the next couple of days and then we'll get out of here on Monday. I should tell you, you ain't really got nothing to worry about. All right. There's no ranked teams currently ranked teams on the schedule. Very few games. Great night to catch up on the Diddy documentary on Netflix.
- [78:19]
Matt Norlander
Oh, buddy, I won't be watching that but okay.
- [78:21]
Gary Parrish
Him man. I don't like to judge a man from a distance. It sounds like this did he was a bad guy. It sounds like he's a bad guy.
- [78:30]
Matt Norlander
Is this you're finally coming coming to this realization?
- [78:33]
Gary Parrish
No, I mean I think I've realized it for a little while. But it, it really, it really crystallizing for you. It's crystallizing for me. I don't, I'm not usually comfortable judging a man I've never met. Right. But it doesn't look like he's a good person.
- [78:47]
Matt Norlander
Person.
- [78:48]
Gary Parrish
It does not look like he's a good person. On Tuesday, Illinois at Ohio State, Penn State at Indiana and then the big one, Florida versus Yukon at Madison Square Garden. Are you going to be at MSG on Tuesday?
- [79:01]
Matt Norlander
I will be at MSG for the Jimmy V. I'll do what I do every year for the Jimmy V. I'll be there taking both games. Get home really late. But we'll, we'll be here for you Wednesday morning for, for a recap on that. But yes, Florida Yukon is the late tip. I do appreciate the fact that we get byu, Clemson. All things considered with Clemson, you know, Tigers are seven and two. We'll see. I mean I don't know. It's the banta though. This was supposed to be someone else. Doesn't matter now. But I remember they're trying to get someone else to get BYU to play and they couldn't get it down. Then Clemson stepped in. It's the Banza on at the world's Most famous arena 6:30 tip there. So I will be for I'll be in the building for both of those. We'll have. We'll have plenty of stuff to talk about on the Wednesday show.
- [79:37]
Gary Parrish
Best I can tell is did he just sort. He lost his way, man. He lost his way.
- [79:42]
Matt Norlander
You might be being too kind to him. This is entirely your call. I don't want to go long. Do you want to end the show or do you want to get five minutes off your chest about the joke that is the College Football Playoff selection committee?
- [79:54]
Gary Parrish
I'll get five minutes off my chest. I tweeted earlier today from, you know, LaGuardia.
- [80:01]
Matt Norlander
That actually makes it better that you were. That you were at LaGuardia. This was happening because I was on my couch just taking in the inevitable clown show that was the College Football Playoff committee.
- [80:11]
Gary Parrish
I was in Manhattan less than 24 hours, and so I was watching the selection show from LaGuardia and tweeted, they better be glad I don't still do this polar text.
- [80:23]
Matt Norlander
Well, that. Which gets me to. You sure you can't bring it back one more time?
- [80:27]
Gary Parrish
Oh, I could.
- [80:29]
Matt Norlander
They take it, too. And by they, I mean, like, you know, you pop in and say, you know what, you want me to throw out a little polite tax situation here? They take it in an instant.
- [80:37]
Gary Parrish
Just come out of retirement. Listen.
- [80:42]
I have no issue with Miami over Notre Dame for the last spot. What amounts to the. The last at large spot. I do think, given how close the resumes are, the head hit, hit the head should probably be the determining factor. And obviously Miami owns that. But Miami has always owned that. And for them to flip it at the last minute is worthy of the mockery that it is getting. And they can mealy mouth it all they want to, but I would have more respect for them if they would just admit the truth. Because here's the truth. Here's the truth. You know what they decided to do either late last night or early this morning, admit that they've had it wrong and they've got to flip it right.
- [81:28]
Matt Norlander
But that's not what was said by Hunter Yuricheck on Sunday.
- [81:30]
Gary Parrish
No, because he. These guys, man, they. They have a hard time it. They have a hard time sitting in that chair and answering questions honestly. If he'd have just been honest. That's what they did. They just decided, hey, guys. All right, Mike's off all the bikes off. We're gonna get killed tomorrow if we have Notre Dame in above Miami and people are going to scream, head to head. Head to head. Head to head. So let's fix that. And I think they got it right. I think they got it right at.
- [81:57]
Matt Norlander
The end, but they got some of it right. I think in all of it right they got that part of it right.
- [82:02]
Gary Parrish
Notre Dame, I mean that specifically. I think they got that part right at the end. But the, the path they took to get there was wrong.
- [82:09]
Matt Norlander
It.
- [82:09]
Gary Parrish
There is nothing that really matters that happened between Tuesday and Sunday morning to either one of those teams. And yet you flipped them at the end. That's ridiculous. If you want to talk about something else they got wrong. The idea that Ole Miss doesn't get punished for losing Lane Kiffin is just stupid. That's just dumb. And I, I my wife's an Ole Miss grad. I we care about Ole Miss. This is a big thing for my home state. I am thrilled that Ole Miss got a six seed and gets to host to Lane because that probably means the Rebels are going.
- [82:40]
Matt Norlander
That's annoying too because that's a regular season rematch. And they should have put jmu. They should have flipped JMU and Tulane to begin with. That's another. That's. That's might be like five or six down the list. But you just saw, you saw this matchup earlier in the season. Why are we getting it again?
- [82:53]
Gary Parrish
Yeah, because they don't have bracketing principles. They that prevent it the way the NCAA tournament would have.
- [82:58]
Matt Norlander
Apparently JMU was more deserving of the of the 11 than the 12 to begin with. But the committee put JMU at 12. Whatever. There's Paris, there's that. There's the fact that football is now caught up to basketball. In this regard. The SEC championship game doesn't mean anything.
- [83:09]
Gary Parrish
Literally.
- [83:10]
Matt Norlander
It was for one extra piece of hardware to go in Georgia's facilities and then a bunch of cardio for three plus hours. It did not matter the result because the teams would have been the exact same if they didn't play the game. Three loss Bama three loss Bama. I know they got the win in Georgia. Georgia three Las Bama is a nine seed. A nine seed in this and Georgia is the three. Regardless by even when by nature of winning the SEC championship game it the game did not need to be played and the seating wouldn't have been affected whatsoever. That's a joke. Everything you said about Miami, Notre Dame. It's also you do this to yourselves when you want to have a weekly TV show. When you feel like you have to do this every single week just for the six weeks leading up to the final reveal. And by nature of doing this and by changing your mind this is not the first time it's happening happened. I remember what was when TCU got screwed in the 14 playoff going back more than a decade ago. They did, they have a habit of doing this. It's all completely just a total, total joke. I mean it really is just a total joke. And if you're going to complain, not that everyone has, but some people are lamenting the fact that you have two group of five teams in a 12 team playoff. Guess what? Blame the commissioners. They're the ones who did this and they made the rules. You cannot invoke this and not kill the ACC. It is not JMU's fault or 2 lane's fault that the ACC sucked. And by the way, Duke on Saturday for the first time ever has saw his football team and its men's basketball program win against top 20 opponents on the same day had never happened. And so Duke winning the the championship in the ACC title game boots the ACC out of it. That's why you have two group of five teams. You agreed to the structure. So I don't if you're gonna bring in the fact that it's not like, well, these spots should have or could have gone to the likes of, of Notre Dame and Vandy or Texas. This was the, this was the agreement that the commissioners put into place. It's the ACC's problem, the ACC's fault. Man, it's amazing that they're this bad at a, at a bracket that only has 12 teams. It really is like it's you. It's really hard to mess up the process to this level. And I'm really like, I'm mildly fired up because I find it entertaining. And as I said earlier this week week, it actually is a net positive for college football, for the attention economy. The fact that you had Alabama, Miami and Notre Dame being the three schools fighting for two spots. You really could not ask for a better cauldron of three brands to be fighting and to get the most reaction controversy possible. And then my last thing on this is given that college football has a low game inventory, like the amount of data, it's not college basketball. You don't have 30 plus games going into selection Sunday. They really should be selecting the field once everyone has an even 12 number of game results in. And then you say here are the teams that are going to be in. Here are the contingencies. If these conference championship winners get in, how they would slot into the bracket. Okay. And then you have a second selection show. You really want to monetize this. Don't do any of them until the Tuesday after the the regular season ends. You do the one where everyone's in. Okay, these, we know these things are going to be in. We don't know where they're going to be seated. We know they're going to be in because we're evaluating everyone evenly. And then when you play the conference championship games, you get that additional data, then you can determine where you see and where you select everyone. But they don't want to do that. They want to imbalance everything and judge teams. Judge an Alabama team that now has three losses but doesn't get dinged whatsoever. Despite the fact that every other team that lost in a conference championships game scenario went down in the CFPS rankings. Bama was the one exception. It really is incredible that, that, that they're this inept at it. And I do wonder. This really is my last thing of them though.
- [86:30]
Gary Parrish
Done.
- [86:30]
Matt Norlander
I talked to Brett, your mark in Vegas, because he was there for the Big 12 thing with players era. And we were talking, we were talking about how the deadline for the College Football Playoff format had been pushed from December 1st to January 23rd. And he has since said this publicly as well. But we were in effect on the record when we talked. He said, I don't think like the deadline, you know, we're pushing it down, but I don't think this is going to matter. I think we're going to have a 12 team playoff again for the 2026 college football season. I can't help but wonder given everything that that's tied to this. Notre Dame said, screw it, we're not even going to play in a bowl game.
- [87:01]
Gary Parrish
Now.
- [87:01]
Matt Norlander
I do wonder if the noise level around this event will lead College Football Conference commissioners to actually accelerate that. And if we don't have a 14 or 16 team arrangement in 2016, I don't know if we will or we won't. But I think the temperature on that is different now than say 48 hours ago. That's all I got for you mentioned.
- [87:18]
Gary Parrish
Like if you really want to monetize it, I think that's part of their problem. They are monetizing it. That's why they have the weekly television show.
- [87:24]
Matt Norlander
That's exactly correct. But if you want to monetize it with actual credibility around it, that's what you should do, in my opinion. But whatever.
- [87:30]
Gary Parrish
They are trying to get every penny out of it, which I don't. I work for a television network. I'm not gonna start blaming television network for trying to make money like, you know, that would seem hypocritical for me, but I think them trying to monetize it in the way that they have leading to weekly television shows, it did get them put into a bad spot. If you didn't have a show last Tuesday or the Tuesday before, the Tuesday before, and you just popped up this morning, and here's our bracket. There's really not a whole lot to argue about. But because of the television show, and then them presumably realizing we've made a mistake with Miami, Notre Dame, and we've got to fix led to all of the criticisms that you're getting today to your point, and then we'll get out of here. It is hilarious to me that they created this thing. I mean, they fly people into resorts to sit around and actually knew how.
- [88:31]
Matt Norlander
Much money went into that, and they.
- [88:34]
Gary Parrish
Don'T know what they're doing. It's insane. It reminds me of the. You ever see the clip of Michelle Obama and she's like, your whole life, you just think these are the most important people in the world, and they all must be brilliant.
- [88:45]
Matt Norlander
It.
- [88:45]
Gary Parrish
And she's like. Then every once in a while, you know, you get to some of us, you get to a point where I'm paraphrasing here, but she's like, you get to these tables and you're. You're with these people, and the first thing you realize is they're not as smart as you thought. And that's what this is. You got all the smartest people in college athletics, and they developed a playoff system that. That they. They are. That they have to go back and change annually and they'll do it again next year. Remember, it used to be, what's the four highest rated conference champions have to be? 1, 2, 3, and 4 in the brackets.
- [89:15]
Matt Norlander
Second would add the buy if they didn't change it, by the way.
- [89:17]
Gary Parrish
And we did that last week last year, and they were like, well, this is stupid. And it's like, you guys, why. Why didn't you envision this might happen? So then they're like, okay, we gotta get rid of that. And that's how you get Ohio State being the 2 seed now, even though it doesn't win a conference championship. All right, so they fixed that, but now they've got this. Now they've got a group of five problem that they're gonna have to address.
- [89:38]
Matt Norlander
Well, they have. Well, they have an ACC problem. Again, it is not JMU or two Lane's fault that the ACC sucks.
- [89:44]
Gary Parrish
I know, but what you're already hearing is, you if you're only going to have 12 teams, two of them shouldn't be coming from outside of the traditional power structure. You're already hearing that.
- [89:52]
Matt Norlander
Of course. Yeah. Because that's the way college football has been minded for a long time. And I, I get that angle of it. But you know what? I'll, I'll celebrate the fact that we got these two and it's going to be a tall task, but man, it'll be so awesome if one of those two managed to actually win a college football playoff game. It would be incredible. It's a long shot, but, but. Right. It's not impossible.
- [90:07]
Gary Parrish
It's not impossible. And like I, that part of it doesn't bother me as much because it, it shows you if people care about the integrity of the regular season because that's something you always hear about anytime a playoff expands, it's going to mess up the. Well, this, this shows you that in this given year, obviously there's advantage to being 1, 2, 3 and 4. You get the buys. But there was also an advantage to being five or six because you get to play a group of five as opposed to, you know, in Alabama or you know, one of those big brands. So makes it more important to try to finish in the top six in most years. I know it's supposed to be the top five, but it, it enhances the regular season I think on some level. So that part of it doesn't bother me as much. But it is funny to me. They spent years trying to develop a system and the system they've developed is so clearly filled with, with flaws that.
- [91:02]
They weren't whatever enough to identify in advance. Maybe that's the nicest way to say.
- [91:08]
Matt Norlander
And then we'll love the games once they kick off.
- [91:10]
Gary Parrish
But I just, oh yeah, I can't wait for the games.
- [91:12]
Matt Norlander
Nice bonus. And entertainment on a Sunday filled with a ton of sports. GP it's been a fun show. I'm sorry we went long. I promise, I promise to our audience and maybe you want it but nine to minute Sunday shows not gonna be a thing. Common every so often maybe, but there was just so much to get to appreciate everyone that stuck around. Josh messaged us. This is one of our better Sunday live audiences I think we've ever had outside the month of March. So we appreciate everyone being invested in the. In the first Sunday of December.
- [91:38]
Gary Parrish
Shout out to Devin Downey. Shouts to Chester, S.C. shouts Terry Teagle. He's a legend. Huck Larnell. Thank you guys once again for watching. Listening to the Ion College Basketball Podcast. If you're not subscribed, please go subscribe anywhere you subscribe to podcasts Apple, Spotify. There's more of us than there are of them. That should be reflected in the comments. So do that. We'll talk to you again real soon. Till then, take care.
- [92:09]
Paramount Podcasts.
- [92:14]
Matt Norlander
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