Faith Matters: Jeff Strong — Un-Sifting the Saints

Released: January 25, 2026 | Host: Faith Matters Foundation

Episode Overview

This episode centers around the question: “Who is the Church for?”, challenging the notion of “sifting”—the idea that church communities are or should be necessarily exclusive, separating the "wheat from the tares." Jeff Strong returns to discuss findings from his major survey of Latter-day Saints, exploring how different spiritual types—Seekers, Protectors, Cultivators, and others—experience the same church culture in profoundly different ways. The conversation moves from data-driven insights into church culture’s strengths and weaknesses, into frameworks for spiritual difference, and ultimately into how communities can balance belonging, standards, and transformative, Christlike love.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Church Culture: Strengths and Weaknesses

Timestamps: 05:03 – 11:24

• Survey Data on Belonging and Tension
  • 43% of respondents feel significant conflict at church
  • 60% don’t feel a sense of belonging
  • 61% are uncomfortable with church culture
  • 68% said church is only “somewhat” or not Christ-centered
  • 40% of respondents are in a faith transition (transition not strictly defined)

“I think it's some kind of significant change from the norm ... movement through the stages of faith, stepping back, or stepping forward.” — Jeff Strong (04:48)

• Strengths Identified

  • Community, belonging, support (55%)
  • Service and helping others (40%)
  • Faith/spiritual growth (40%)
  • Unity (33%)
  • Kindness and compassion (significant share)

• Weaknesses Identified

  • Judgment and criticism based on differences (44%)
  • Rigid expectations/groupthink, lack of critical thinking (37-32%)
  • Exclusivity and unyielding tradition (32-29%)

“Judgment, conformity, exclusivity, over-reliance on traditions and fear … can contribute to exclusion, inhibit healthy adaptation and growth.” — Jeff Strong (09:51)

• Main Pattern: Weaknesses are “inverted” strengths—the same elements that create belonging can become sources of exclusion.

2. Is Community Unity Always Double-Edged?

Timestamps: 11:24 – 18:51

• Tension: Is tight community inherently exclusive?
  • Are doctrinal alignment and unity worth the trade-off of excluding those who differ?
  • Is the church for a “devoted, exceptional group … or all God’s children?” (12:12)

“This is the question that we're wrestling with right now … who is the church for and which church is it supposed to be?” — Jeff Strong (13:36)

• Discussion of "sifting" (separation as testing) and the problematic “don’t let the door hit you” attitude toward those who don’t fit.

“At its worst that mindset [sifting] would suggest don’t let the door hit you on the way out. I’m really troubled by that perspective … I don't think it comes from Christ.” — Jeff Strong (16:16)

3. Is the Church a Business or a Family?

Timestamps: 17:09 – 18:51

• Comparison of church culture with business culture
• “Get the right people on the bus” (Jim Collins’ “Good to Great”) vs. the gospel’s aim for all
• Key Distinction: The church is not meant to serve only the “upper 10%”—the “plan of salvation is not designed for the upper 10%."

4. Differences in Christ-Centeredness: Clashing Perceptions

Timestamps: 18:51 – 24:54

• Striking Data:
  • 27% of Faith Matters audience feels church is Christ-centered; 73% in a more traditional sample say the same
  • People with opposite views sit in the same pews
• Why the gap?
  • Varies by experience of belonging: “It’s really hard to believe the church is Christ-centered if you feel outside.” — Tim (20:15)

Survey: What’s Important To You vs. What’s Expected?

• Survey of 14 common church behaviors (e.g., serve the poor, keep commandments, attend meetings)
  • Top personal value: “Care for the poor and needy”—LAST in cultural expectation
  • Cultural priorities: “Stay on the covenant path,” “Follow church leaders,” “Attend the temple,” etc.
  • “Personal” and “cultural” priorities almost completely inverted

“The number one most important thing … was to care for the poor and needy. And that was 14th or last on the culture list.” — Jeff Strong (22:37)

5. The Impact of Culture on Difficult Doctrinal Issues

Timestamps: 24:54 – 30:07

• Experiencing genuine belonging helps people process doctrinal or historical challenges more resiliently
• Faith communities nourish commitment beyond intellectual agreement—“the fruits that you’re experiencing in the gospel today” help tether people through difficulties

“The experience I’m having in the church is … tethering ... not the historical narrative.” — Jeff Strong (26:08)

6. A Framework for Spiritual Differences: Six Segments

Timestamps: 31:24 – 38:46

The Six Spiritual Segments (Survey Typing)

• Seekers: 30%

  • Want direction, help, to contribute
  • “Seek, be, and do good” (bumper sticker)

• Cultivators: 20%

  • Want truth, meaning, personal growth
  • “Love and lift individuals”

• Protectors: 20%

  • Value clarity, certainty, order
  • “Obey, defend, and build the church”

• Avoiders: 15%

  • Need autonomy, inner integrity
  • “Go my own way”

• Connectors: 15%

  • Seek belonging, shared identity
  • “Strengthen the community”

• Explorers: (minor, unquantified)

  • Seek spiritual intensity
  • “Seek spiritual encounters”

• Leadership Overrepresentation: Protectors are about 20% of members but estimated 90% of church leadership

“We have a protector-dominated culture in the church, but the vast majority of members are not in the protector segment.” — Jeff Strong (38:21)

7. Who Thrives and Who Struggles?

Timestamps: 38:37 – 44:05

• Most Comfortable: Protectors, Connectors (especially those who value rituals and tradition)
• Most Struggling: Seekers and Cultivators—often out of sync with the predominant “protector” culture

Illustrative Story: Cultivator vs. Protector Leadership

• A member requests compassionate intervention; leader initially reacts defensively but later repents and helps—a model for spirit-led, humility-driven reconciliation

8. Fear vs. Faith: The Root of Church Cultural Tension

Timestamps: 45:06 – 49:35

• The Role of Fear:
  • Church history and external pressure have fostered a “protector” culture—defensiveness, “soldiers” for a “war”
  • But, “Fear is not what Christ taught”—the gospel is over 170 times rooted in “fear not.”

“If you approach the world with fear instead of faith in your heart, you will have a radically different approach to everything.” — Jeff Strong (49:13)

9. All Segments Needed—But All Must Be Rooted in Christ

Timestamps: 49:56 – 51:14

• Paul’s Doctrine of the Body: All “types”—cultivators, seekers, protectors, etc.—are vital, but each has strengths and pitfalls
• Untethered Cultivator: Disruptive, rebellious
• Untethered Protector: Pharisaical
• Goal: Each “segment” functions best when guided by Christlike humility, love, and the Spirit

10. Memorable Story: The Masters Track Meet: Embracing All Racers

Timestamps: 51:17 – 59:43

• Jeff shares an emotional remembrance of attending a Masters track meet with his son Zach, witnessing a 100-year-old finishing last—but receiving the greatest ovation

“Much of what we seek from church is similar. A community and a mission that matters. A place where we belong, where we give and receive light ... a place where soil embraces and nourishes the seeds.” — Jeff Strong (53:00)

• Moral:
  • The track meet wasn’t about picking winners/lowerers, but celebrating the human spirit—the church must not become “soil that is hard and unyielding, focused on itself,” indifferent to seeds trying to take root.

“If you think the track meet is to pick winners and losers instead of realizing it is a celebration of humanity, your whole approach will be fundamentally different.” — Jeff Strong (58:37)

11. Doctrines, Standards, and the Need for Love

Timestamps: 59:44 – 62:52

• Argues the solution is not to loosen or eliminate standards, but to balance them with equal measures of love

“We have to make sure our love is as high as our expectations.” — Jeff Strong (60:41)

12. Redefining The “Problem” of Disaffiliation

Timestamps: 62:52 – 65:40

• Disaffiliation, per Strong, is not the ultimate problem; lack of community and inability to talk across differences are more pressing. Alienation even exists within families and close friendships—addressing this requires cultural change, not just policies.

“What I think this is about is creating a community where more people can stay and want to stay ... where there is less divisiveness and tension between those who stay and those who leave.” — Jeff Strong (64:15)

Notable Quotes & Moments

• On Culture as Soil:
  “I began to see Latter Day Saint culture as soil which grows faith when it's rich and nourishing but when it's compacted and unyielding, it doesn't.” — Jeff Strong (51:31)

• On Fear:
  “Fear is not what Christ taught. … Over 170 times in the scriptures, the idea of fearing not was mentioned or taught.” — Jeff Strong (48:21)

• On Differences:
  “Differences can't be the problem. The problem has to be: how are we responding to those differences?” — Jeff Strong (11:27)

• On Love vs. Standards:
  “We have to make sure our love is as high as our expectations.” — Jeff Strong (60:41)

Important Timestamps

• Strengths/Weaknesses of Culture: 05:34–11:24
• Tension Trade-Offs & “Sifting”: 11:24–18:51
• Difference in Christ-Centeredness: 18:51–24:54
• Experiencing Church Amidst Tension: 24:54–30:07
• Spiritual Segments Framework: 31:24–38:46
• Who Thrives & Struggles in Church: 38:37–44:05
• Protector Culture & Fear: 45:06–49:35
• Balancing All Segments: 49:56–51:14
• Track Meet Story: 51:17–59:43
• Love & Standards: 59:44–62:52
• Redefining Disaffiliation: 62:52–65:40

Tone

Warm, probing, reflective, and deeply personal. Jeff Strong and the hosts (Aubrey, Tim) speak candidly and compassionately, with humility and humor, while grappling with challenging and sometimes painful realities in church culture.

Summary Takeaway

This episode offers crucial insights for anyone concerned about belonging, difference, and "losing" members in faith communities. It’s not about lowering standards or ignoring gospel ideals, but about raising love to meet the standard—cultivating a culture where all can belong and flourish, no matter the pace or path of their race.