The Best RB and WR Prospects in the NFL Draft! Superstars, Steals and Sleepers (03/19 Fantasy Football Podcast)

Summary

Fantasy Football Today: The Best RB and WR Prospects in the NFL Draft! Superstars, Steals and Sleepers

Release Date: March 19, 2025

In the March 19, 2025 episode of Fantasy Football Today, CBS Sports delves deep into the top running back (RB) and wide receiver (WR) prospects in the upcoming NFL Draft. Hosted by Adam Mazer and featuring analysts Dave Richard, Jamie Eisenberg, and special guest Mike Renner from the Pushing the Pile podcast, the episode provides comprehensive insights into which rookies could dominate fantasy leagues in the upcoming season.

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I. Introduction and Guest Welcome

The episode kicks off with Adam Mazer introducing Mike Renner, a CBS Sports draft analyst and host of the Pushing the Pile podcast. The hosts engage in lighthearted banter before diving into the core content.

Quote:

• [03:07] Dave Richard: "Thanks for having me on. Excited?"

---

II. NFL Draft Prospects Overview

A. Quarterback (QB) Trade Updates

The discussion begins with recent quarterback developments:

• Vikings and Aaron Rodgers: The Minnesota Vikings have reportedly decided not to pursue Aaron Rodgers, opting to retain their current QB, JJ McCarthy.
• Titans and Cam Ward: According to Mike Renner, the Tennessee Titans are comfortable selecting Cam Ward as the first overall pick in their mock draft.

Quote:

• [04:42] Adam Mazer: "The Vikings are reportedly not pursuing Aaron Rodgers anymore. They're going to stick with JJ McCarthy."

B. Comparing Cam Ward and JJ McCarthy

Dave Richard provides a nuanced comparison between the two QBs:

• Cam Ward: Praised for his creativity, arm strength, and ability to operate from outside the pocket. Described as having a "higher grade" and being more physically robust.
• JJ McCarthy: Noted for his precision ("lasers") and efficiency from tight pockets but considered more of a wild card compared to Ward.

Quote:

• [05:11] Dave Richard: "They're vastly different players. Cam Ward, you see much more creativity with his arm... I have a higher grade on Ward considerably."

---

III. Running Back Prospects

A. Evaluating the RB Class

Dave Richard highlights the significant improvement in this year's RB draft class compared to last year, emphasizing depth and top-tier talent.

Quote:

• [08:12] Dave Richard: "This year's class is much better. It's so much deeper. Top-end talents are better. It's just night and day in my opinion."

B. Key Running Back Prospects

1. Top Star-Level RBs:

   • Genti, Marion Hampton, Dylan Sampson: Considered the frontrunners with star potential.

   Quote:

   • [13:49] Dave Richard: "I think there's three guys that I'm like, I would bet good money they're stars... Genti, Marion Hampton, and Dylan Sampson."

2. Quinchon Judkins vs. Trayvon Henderson:

   • Quinchon Judkins: Viewed as having greater bell cow potential, capable of carrying the load for his team.
   • Trayvon Henderson: While talented, seen as better suited for specialized roles rather than an every-down back.

   Quotes:

   • [31:14] Dave Richard: "I got Judkins higher and I think it's, I just see more bell cow potential with Judkins."
   • [29:26] Jamie Eisenberg: "I like Judkins a little bit more than I do Henderson."

3. Caleb Johnson vs. Quinton Judkins:

   • Caleb Johnson: Concerns about his ability to make consistent plays and handle tacklers.
   • Quinton Judkins: Praised for his physicality and ability to break tackles, making him a more reliable fantasy option.

   Quote:

   • [22:01] Dave Richard: "Quinton Judkins can make a guy miss... He's a much more punishing runner."

C. Dynasty League Perspective

Jamie Eisenberg emphasizes the benefits of the deep RB class for dynasty leagues, highlighting the abundance of valuable players available in the middle rounds.

Quote:

• [10:03] Jamie Eisenberg: "This is excellent news for dynasty leagues because you will find players that you'll be happy to draft when you're in the middle of round two, maybe even like the beginning part of round three."

---

IV. Wide Receiver Prospects

A. Evaluating the WR Class

Dave Richard assesses the WR draft class as solid but notes a lack of elite top-tier talent compared to last year.

Quote:

• [08:50] Dave Richard: "Last year was much of a more of an outlier in terms of how good it was... This year's class... it just lacks like the real guy at the top."

B. Key Wide Receiver Prospects

1. Ted McMillan, Matthew Golden, Luther Burden:

   • Ted McMillan: Described as a high-volume, possession-type receiver with consistent target opportunities.
   • Matthew Golden & Luther Burden: Praised for their athleticism and potential to become significant contributors.

   Quote:

   • [12:13] Dave Richard: "Ted McMillan is a high volume, low explosive play wide receiver... Luther Burden is probably going to get volume just in terms of screens."

2. Travis Hunter's Position and Ranking:

   • Versatility: Potential to play both RB and WR depending on team needs.
   • Ranking: Placed behind top WRs like Harrison and Neighbors but ahead of certain prospects like Odunze.

   Quote:

   • [12:13] Dave Richard: "I would put him probably ahead of Odunze behind Harrison and Neighbors."

3. Jaden Higgins:

   • Positioned as a reliable option, similar to Michael Pittman, with good hands and route-running abilities.

   Quote:

   • [44:19] Dave Richard: "I love Jaden Higgins... He could be like a Michael Pittman."

4. Ellic Ioman:

   • Classified as a Day Two WR prospect with exceptional athleticism but requiring development in route running and ball-handling.

   Quote:

   • [47:53] Dave Richard: "He's the most projectable athlete in this draft class at the receiver position... he's a lottery ticket."

---

V. Team Needs and Player Fits

The analysts discuss how team-specific needs will influence where prospects land, particularly for versatile players like Travis Hunter. Fit within a team's offensive scheme is crucial for a player's fantasy success.

Quote:

• [25:30] Mike Renner: "Wherever they end up is going to determine clearly based on stylistic differences which team is going to prefer that type of player for their system."

---

VI. Fantasy Football Implications

With a deeper RB class, fantasy managers can expect more value in the early rounds, potentially drafting multiple RBs within the first three rounds. The WR class, while not as stacked at the top, offers substantial depth for mid to late-round picks, making it advantageous for dynasty and standard leagues alike.

Quote:

• [08:12] Dave Richard: "You'll probably see that reflected in where they come off the board... double-digit running backs through the first three rounds."

---

VII. Listener Questions and Q&A

Throughout the episode, the hosts address questions from listeners regarding specific prospects:

1. Jaden Milroe:

   • Discussed his potential as a rusher-friendly QB, though concerns about his passing accuracy remain.

   Quote:

   • [39:35] Dave Richard: "I worry about his accuracy, the small hands thing... his pocket presence is rough."

2. DJ Giddens and Damian Martinez:

   • Damian Martinez: Highly regarded as a physical RB with top 100 draft potential.
   • DJ Giddens: Viewed as a solid day three running back.

   Quote:

   • [41:51] Dave Richard: "Damian Martinez is a physical runner... he's a top 100 pick."

3. Matthew Golden vs. Others:

   • Debates on whether Golden outperforms peers like Igbuka and Burden, with differing opinions on flexibility and production capability.

   Quote:

   • [46:14] Dave Richard: "They're all different types of wide receivers... I'm trending towards Burden because he's more dynamic."

---

VIII. Conclusion

As the NFL Draft approaches, the Fantasy Football Today team emphasizes the importance of understanding player roles, team fit, and positional depth to make informed decisions that can secure fantasy league dominance. With a robust RB class and a competitive WR pool, fantasy managers are encouraged to strategize accordingly to capitalize on both elite talents and valuable sleepers.

Notable Reminder: Adam Mazer encourages listeners to participate in the ongoing bracket challenge, though promotions and advertisements were omitted from this summary as per guidelines.

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This episode serves as an invaluable resource for fantasy football enthusiasts aiming to fine-tune their draft strategies by leveraging expert analysis on the upcoming NFL talent pool.

Transcript

[Adam Mazer]

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[Dave Richard]

This is Fantasy Football Today from CBS Sports. Wanna play? Can you believe this? No, I can't. It's time to dominate your fantasy league. Off to the races. He's at his feet. This is gonna go the distance. Now here's Some combination of Adam, Dave, Jamie and Heath.

[Adam Mazer]

A little over a month away from the NFL Draft starts on Thursday, April 24th. Right now it is Wednesday, March 19th. Checking the date. And we welcome you to Fantasy Football Today. Here I am, Adam Mazer with Dave Richard, Jamie Eisenberg. We have a special guest, the guy who knows so much about these prospects going to educate us today. He is the host of the Pushing the Pile podcast for cbs. He is a CBS Sports draft analyst. He is Mike Renner and it's a first time on fft. Welcome to the show, Mike.

[Dave Richard]

Thanks for having me on. Excited?

[Adam Mazer]

Yeah. I don't know what you did, but you made Jamie leave and now he's back. Hey, you got a problem with Mike, Jamie?

[Mike Renner]

No, no, I was just adjusting something, so.

[Adam Mazer]

All right. Oh, we got a question from the chat. Who's the new sexy mustache? How's that mustache working out for you, Mike?

[Dave Richard]

I just shaved yesterday. My girl loves it, so that's all that really matters.

[Adam Mazer]

Wow. Yes, that is. That is true. So tell us about the Pushing the Pile podcast and what you're doing there.

[Dave Richard]

Me and Kyle long two days a week. We're doing all things free agency, off season, team building sort of stuff now. But during the season we do obviously a lot of like, skill and like player analysis because that's Kyle's specialty for the line of scrimmage. And my specialty obviously, because I've been a draft guy for as long as I had to.

[Adam Mazer]

There you go. Good morning, Dave.

[Jamie Eisenberg]

Good morning, Mike. You played how. What level of football did you end up playing?

[Dave Richard]

I did not play any football. High school didn't have football, so I'm not.

[Jamie Eisenberg]

I think you played. I am so sorry.

[Dave Richard]

I did not.

[Adam Mazer]

What about you, Dave?

[Jamie Eisenberg]

What level.

[Adam Mazer]

What level did football did you play, Dave? I.

[Jamie Eisenberg]

Let me. I was the starting right tackle for the Sigma Alpha Mu beer bowl team, 1994. I'll let you know. I gave up one sack all season. We had. It was a one game season.

[Adam Mazer]

Oh, was my brother on that team?

[Jamie Eisenberg]

No, he was one of our coaches though.

[Adam Mazer]

He.

[Jamie Eisenberg]

But you know your brother, he's smaller than you, so he's not going to go and deal with the big guys on the offensive line.

[Adam Mazer]

True. It's true. All right, Mike, let's get to. Let's get to the content here. Just a couple of NFL items here. The Vikings are reportedly not pursuing Aaron Rodgers anymore. They're going to stick with J.J. mcCarthy. And we got a report from Jeremy Fowler of ESPN that the Titans are pretty comfortable taking Cam word Cam Ward first overall. It's obviously not set in stone. We'll see what happens. But how would you compare cam Ward to JJ McCarthy with McCarthy having been the fourth quarterback selected last year?

[Dave Richard]

They're vastly different players. I think the biggest strength for Cam, I think both guys like have outside of structure play as like one of their calling cards. They both can create in that manner. But I think with Cam Ward, you see a much more creativity with his arm. He layers the ball better, he throws with touch a lot more. With McCarthy, it's a lot of lasers, but I think he also operates from tight pockets better. Not that Cam Ward can't, but like that was J.J. mcCarthy's best skill set. Was that everything collapsing on him behind that Michigan offensive line, he was still able to throw darts on the football field. Little skinnier. Cam Ward's a little built a little bit better, you know, breaks a little more, tackles can escape pressure a little bit better. But I have a higher grade on Ward considerably. McCarthy was much more of a wild card. You've seen Ward play a ton of football and in a drop back, heavy passing offense where it's kind of all in his shoulders. With McCarthy, it was always, man, they didn't trust him to throw down the stretch last year. It was always kind of like, what does it look like when it has to be all him? And so that remains to be seen and loves to get the chance this fall.

[Adam Mazer]

You have Cam Ward going number one overall in your latest mock draft, which I think was published yesterday two days ago. So everyone go check that out. Just Google Mike Renner mock draft and you will see Cam Ward number one overall to the Titans. Today we're going to focus a lot on running backs and wide receivers. Jamie. There was also a report on NFL Network that Pitts Pittsburgh is comfortable starting Mason Rudolph at quarterback.

[Mike Renner]

You buy that negotiating ploy one on one? No, I don't buy that. I mean, they, they have somebody that they seemingly trust. I mean, it's a smart move by the Steelers to bring back Mason Rudolph because he's won some games for them and can, you know, probably be a cap backup. But if that's their game plan to go from, you know, what they had last year, which was obviously not the most sound plan of Justin Fields and Russell Wilson to Mason Rudolph, then they're, they're going backwards, you know, so hopefully they have some sort of answer for their future. But this is not something I think that Steelers fans want to see. It's not something fantasy managers want to see. I think you know, find, find some long term solution as opposed to just keep putting band aids on the spot.

[Adam Mazer]

All right, listen everybody, if you have 5 seconds, go to your web browser, type in CBSSports.com FFT F as in Frank, F as in Franny, T as in Thomas. CBSSports.com FFT you're going to join our bracket challenge. Okay, I think we're closing in on a thousand entries right now. The winner is in the podcast league and gets one year free of Paramount plus second and third place. Don't get in the podcast league, but you get a month free of Paramount plus just go to CBSSports.com FFT you have until Thursday afternoon to submit those brackets when the games start. You're done, but we're done. But you know, you've got time. Cbsports.com FF tape. All right, so again focusing Mike on running backs and wide receivers. Let's start with the running backs. How would you compare this year's class to last year's class?

[Dave Richard]

So much better. It's just, it's so much deeper. Top end talents better. It's just night and day in my opinion. This year's class, like last year my RB5 was I think Ray Davis. And this year there's probably like at least 10 guys I would put ahead of Ray Davis, you know, in terms of grading scale that I would take before him. So it's a very, very good class. You'll probably see that reflected in where they come off the board. I expect that over the first three rounds we'll see because he double digits could very well see double digit running backs through the first three rounds.

[Adam Mazer]

How about wide receiver? Same question. Comparing last year to this year.

[Dave Richard]

So this isn't a bad class by any means. Last year was much of a more of an outlier in terms of how good it was. I was raving about, you know, not only the top three guys but like the second tier of guys that I had with like Brian Thomas Jr. Lad McConkey. I would put them as like the top tier of this year's class that you see with like Ted McMillan, Matthew Golden, Luther Burden. So like it's not great, it just lacks like the real guy at the top. I think Travis Hunter is close to that. But the evals of him and where he's going to play and what you're going to do with them obviously all over the map whether it's wide receiver or cornerback. So that's a much bigger question mark. But I think he could be. I watched his tape and I'm just like, this guy has rare, rare ability to just catch the football. So it's. The depth is okay, though. I think rounds two and three in this year's class are actually not that bad. And I could see a number of guys emerging from this class in rounds two or three. So it doesn't have top and talent, but. But it is. The depth is still there. It definitely isn't one of Those, you know, 2016, 2017, 2018, those years that were just like lean at wide receiver. It isn't like that at all.

[Adam Mazer]

Dave, how do you see it? You know, Dave, Jamie, why don't you guys get in there, talk about as we approached, you know, dynasty, drafts and whatnot, running back and wide receiver.

[Jamie Eisenberg]

This is, it's excellent news for dynasty leagues because you will find players that you'll be happy to draft when you're in the middle of round two, maybe even like the beginning part of round three. Like, there are enough players because you didn't even ask them about the tight ends. And we just really scratched the surface on the quarterbacks. Not that the quarterbacks are anything to write home about, but it's deep. You saw it at the Senior Bowl. There wasn't a single prospect at the Senior bowl that I think is like a lock to be a first rounder. Let me double check. Yeah, like, as far as receivers and running backs go, I don't think there's a first rounder that was at the Senior Bowl. But you saw a lot of guys that could go anywhere from round two to round five in the NFL draft. And in a dynasty draft, you're going to see them get picked and people will be excited about them.

[Mike Renner]

They're good.

[Jamie Eisenberg]

They're going to stick around in this league for a while. I think there's a lot of talented, solid running backs and wide receivers with some with elite traits, obviously that can make fantasy managers happy for a long time. This is a good thing for Dynasty.

[Mike Renner]

I want to go back to Travis Hunter with Mike just because, you know, you said about his receiving skills. Do you see him playing receiver or do you think it's dependent on where he goes?

[Dave Richard]

It's definitely dependent on where he goes. And with the NFL, it's like, it's kind of like that with a lot of positions. Right. A lot of guys who can especially like, you know, off ball linebacker versus edge rusher. It's like, what do I need? And so if a team needs a wide receiver, I'd be hard pressed to see you not evaluating him as wide receiver. One this draft class, right. And so at that point it just comes down to it's like if it's the New England Patriots that draft him, he's playing wide receiver, right. They have two corners, they're not adding a third and having a moonlight on offense with that. So it will be team dependent but for him I am like he said he wants to do both and if you want to do both the NFL level it's going to mean like limited time at both which I think is the scariest thing like if you're drafting fancy is that if he does both he wants it'd be like a 60 split at both positions. You just can't do 100 the way he would want at both positions.

[Adam Mazer]

How would you rank him with Harrison, Neighbors, Odunze, Travis Hunter we're talking here.

[Dave Richard]

I would put him probably I would put him ahead of Odunze behind Harrison and neighbors. I had a neighbor at Austria had a neighbors Harrison and then a Dunze but just like I thought Neighbors and Harrison were just like special year on year dudes, they don't come around every single year. Hunter's not quite to that level but I think he's a very, very good wide receiver and I think much more physically gifted than Roman Duns. They Roman don't say very polished. But Travis Hunter can do things athletically that Rome just couldn't.

[Adam Mazer]

I'm going to go on a little detour here. You feel in bounce back seasons, bounce back is funny. Rebound, I don't know. Good seasons for Marvin Harrison Jr. And Roma Dunes after kind of disappointing rookie seasons I think.

[Dave Richard]

So I probably worry a little bit more about a Dunze just because who knows what that offense is going to look like. But I trusted with Ben Johnson figuring it out. He very well could be like their Amanra St. Brown and just play the slot and get 160 targets in that offense. So with Marvin Harrison like it's going to come around. It was just a lot of stuff. A lot of the lack of production was him not being on the same page with Kyler Murray. I think the rapport aspect once that gets down, if you just like watch all his targets, there's so many, they're just like they're not connecting. Once that happens, I think he's immediately, you know, 12, 1300 yard range.

[Adam Mazer]

All right. I like the optimism. I like the optimism. So speaking of optimism, I want to ask you and then I want to get Dave and Jamie's take on it. How many stars do you think we have at running Back and wide receiver at the NFL level. It's a difficult question, so I apologize for that. But how many, how much star potential do you see when you look at these players running back?

[Dave Richard]

I think there's three guys that I'm like, I would bet good money they're stars. And then like obviously any guy after that, like I said all the way to my top 10, if you get to the right situation, I think it'll work out. But these three guys, I think no matter the situation, I for sure feel good about them. Producing Session Genti, which I don't think I'm breaking any ground there, or Marion Hampton from North Carolina. And then I see Dylan Sampson in that tier. I think he is at his age because he's, I think the youngest guy in the entire draft class, turns 21 like next September or something at his age to produce the way he did at Tennessee, with an offensive line that wasn't great against SEC competition, going for over 100 against Bama and Georgia and the way he runs with the vision he has. This reminds me so much of Bucky Irving last year. But like with better physical tools, like he has more explosiveness to him, a little more size to him that I think he's going to be a bell cows who are running back at the next level. So those three I just feel really good about now. Like, if you told me Quinch on Judkins was too. If you told me, you know, Trayvon Henderson was a number of these other guys in this draft class, I wouldn't doubt it. But those are the three. Like I feel good about being that at the tight end position. I feel at the top two, I'm 100 on board with top two being guys the next level, Colson level and Tyler Warren. I think there's probably going to be one more that emerges out of it, out of that like second group of guys. It's just a really, really good tight end class wide receiver is much more difficult. I think I feel good about Ted McMillan being that guy. I really do. I think he's fits perfectly in the volume mold of a possession type of wide receiver who can get like 150 targets. He could be like a Michael Thomas in an offense where you're just really featuring him. It's not really sexy, explosive production, but he just can consistently get open and be reliable. Burden's probably going to get volume just in terms of screens, kind of the same way like Meek Neighbors did as a rookie where he's just like, you'll give him the scheme Targets right out the gate. Just give him touches any way, shape or form. Kind of like you know, even like a Debo Samuel in that kind of role where you just want the ball in his hands because he's the best in this class with the ball in his hands after that. That's really it though. I mean, obviously about Travis Hunter, I feel good about him but like every other single guy after that I think it's gonna matter where he ends up. I don't feel anyone else being able to really rise above in this draft class of receiver.

[Mike Renner]

Even Golden.

[Dave Richard]

I, I just, I think Golden's a number two at the next level. I see him more as like a Jordan Addison. And again if Jordan Addison was in like a less pass heavy, happy offense, Jordan Addison wouldn't necessarily be as relevant. Right. Like he wouldn't be putting up big numbers. So that's how I see golden. But the 40 blew my mind. I'm still like a 40. Truth around him that I think that that was mistimed. I just never saw 429 on tape. So if he really is like physically developing and is running 429, well, he could be in that level too.

[Adam Mazer]

Yeah, Golden I thought pretty interesting. He had 987 yards and nine touchdowns, which is not really amazing production when you consider they played 16 games, they threw for the six second most touchdowns in the, in the nation, the fourth most yards in the country. So I do have a follow up question. I want to know how much you care about raw stats. It's almost like the, one of the last things we look at, I feel like when we talk about prospects is combine stuff. It's, it's, you know, route running. It's all this stuff and then like what about just raw stats? I do have to take a break. I also want to hear from Dave and Jamie about who you guys think could be as you sit here right now, who you think could be stars at the next level. Let's take a quick break here. Come back with more thoughts on this draft class right after this.

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[Dave Richard]

Seek guaranteed [e-mail] guarantees. What's up, everyone? It's the counselor of Cash, Siya Nejad from the Early Edge, a daily sports betting show powered by Sportsline and CBS Sports. If you're looking for the best bets, picks and analysis for the day in sports, we're your one stop shop. We are locked in with bets every day for the NBA, March Madness, golf, soccer, and so much more. Download and follow us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify and anywhere podcasts are found. Plus, subscribe to the SportsLine YouTube page to watch us live at 10:00am Eastern Time daily. Make sure to turn on those notifications so you don't miss a single pick all season long. Good luck.

[Adam Mazer]

Okay, so a little bookmark there on the raw stats and how much they matter here. But Dave, Jamie, Dave, you can go first. Who are you looking at in stardom, by the way? Dylan Sampson was kind of a interesting pick. We got to come back to that one. I hadn't really heard that running back's name in that discussion. But Dave, your thoughts on this?

[Jamie Eisenberg]

Well, where is the line on like superstar?

[Adam Mazer]

No, superstar. Not superstar. I, I, I, you know, I was gonna say superstar and I was like that's too high of a threshold. Just a star like a pro bowler and not one of the alternates who came in after three guys, you know, left the Pro bowl because they wanted to golf, you know, like a legit.

[Jamie Eisenberg]

Like a regular pro bowler.

[Adam Mazer]

Yeah, Like Aaron Jones are better prime. Aaron Jones?

[Jamie Eisenberg]

Yeah. I, I think you're looking for a name better than that, but he's a star. I mostly agree with what Mike said. I do like golden more than he does. I wonder if a booker could end up being like one of those better in fantasy than in real life type of wide receivers, if that makes any sense. Or maybe, maybe I should say more popular in fantasy than in real life. I think he can just be a solid year over year contributor. It's really the only name that, that Mike said that or Mike didn't say that. I would say as far as someone who could be a very good contributor at the next level.

[Adam Mazer]

Jamie, no one said a quarterback yet in this conversation. I don't know if that was just because we were supposed to focus on running backs or receivers or we don't think any of the quarterbacks are going to be stars. But throw it over to you, Jamie.

[Mike Renner]

Pro bowl alternates, they will definitely be Pro Bowl. I do want to ask Mike because one guy that that stock has fallen from the combine is, is Caleb Johnson, who I, you know I was excited about prior to the combine and still have some interest in again, you know me, a lot of it is is based on where they end up. But your thoughts on, on Caleb Johnson because like Dave, I agree with a lot of the names that he said as well.

[Dave Richard]

Yeah, I was actually low on him even heading into the combine and probably even lower after because I thought he would be faster. I thought I saw at least a guy who was like a high four four smooth. Like he's a very smooth easy runner. I just worry about his ability to really consistently make guys miss very much a linear one cut, get up the field. No real fat to his game, no real creativity to his running style. So he's got like NFL ready traits. NFL ready for an outside zone heavy scheme. There's a handful of those in the NFL anymore. It's not like you got to be able to do a lot of different things today at the running back position more often than not. So kind of reminds me of like a Tyler Algier where it's like if he goes to the right spot and it's outside zone and you're featuring him, yeah, it'll be great. But I don't think he's transcendent in his ability to like rise above poor blocking.

[Adam Mazer]

So what's interesting about Caleb Johnson and again you're this is all in the eye of the beholder. Some of or some of it is anyway. But like if we compare Caleb Johnson out of Iowa to Quinshawn Judkins out of Ohio State, they have basically the same measurements, about 616 foot, about 224 pounds. Judkins ran a 4, 4, 8, 40. Johnson ran a 4, 5 7. Judkins ran a 1.51 second 10 yard split. Caleb Johnson ran the slowest 10 yard split of all the running backs who participated in that at the combine. And I watched them a lot, both of them this morning for a while and I actually felt like Caleb Johnson if, if you hadn't given me any of those numbers. I felt that he looked faster than Judkins. I was not super impressed with Judkins. So how do you see it between those two?

[Dave Richard]

I 100 agree. I, I write down every year before the combine just like my predictions for 40s for like most of the top guys at most positions. And I had Caleb Johnson running faster for than Quinton Judkins now and I think like that 10 split, like he has better burst on a 1 cut from standstill than that. It kind of reminds me of when Dalvin Cook coming out ran like not that fast in the 40, but then he went on like sports science or whatever with John Brinkus and had like the fastest standstill acceleration. Like he was just able to from, you know, an athletic running back position, accelerate better than other guys could, but not from a track stance. So I'm not too worried about that with Dylan Sampson. It's more between those two guys. Quinton Judkins can make a guy missing the hole quinch on. Judkins can like really lower shoulder and run through a tackle, whereas Caleb Johnson kind of has to bounce off with his legs. He's not that kind of guy. Like he has to like take an arm tackle. He can run through that but not going to really not a real punishing runner the way Judkins can be and definitely doesn't have the sort of shake to his game that Judkins does.

[Adam Mazer]

Okay, so let me get back to that question about the raw stats and where on the list of traits does, does that factor in for you? How much does it matter?

[Dave Richard]

Yeah, I'm just in terms of like yards, catches, rushes, that sort of thing. I like, I like wide receivers and tight ends that are featured, you know, whatever the offense is. I like the guys, I trend towards the guys who are getting featured in their offense. And if they're not getting featured in their offense, is it because it's an Alabama situation where there's like a bunch of other guys who are better than them or as good as them that are taking targets away from them or is it just because, you know, or why is it. But I like guys who are getting featured in one way shape or form at the running back position. The stats, I'm more looking for broken tackles. Truthfully, I'll look at broken tackles per attempt before I'm looking at just raw numbers. And again, like you want guys that get featured at the running back position, but it's not as big a deal just because philosophically some teams will never do, some teams will never have a bell cow. It just isn't in the cards. And at running back collegiate level, like they cycle through a lot more. So that's kind of how I factor in raw production. I, I, you obviously want it, but it's not the biggest deal for Guy just to have it.

[Adam Mazer]

All right. By the way, if you're in the chat right now and you want to hear about some players, you know, fire away. We'll probably get to that a little bit later. I guess we should probably not skip over Ash and Genti Jamie Is there any doubt that even in a Super Flex league, Genti should be the first pick in drafts, or do we have to see where he goes?

[Mike Renner]

I mean, I, I think you have to see where he goes, but it's very, it'd be very surprising that he's not going to be a featured guy right away. You know, we could have something similar to like Bijan Robinson, where he's going to share if he's in the wrong system, you know, and they love the guy that they had previously, you know, so we could get a little bit of a sluggish start, but it'd be, it'd be shocking that he's not going to be impressive at some point early in his career, you know, whether it's, you know, early in his rookie season or, you know, by, by year two. So, yes, he should be number one in, in those formats. Unless you're, you know, just a team that's stacked at that position and needs quarterback help or wide receiver help. But I mean, just based on talent, he seems to be the, the likeliest to hit and hopefully be the superstar, you know, not just the star, not just the Pro bowl alternate, you know, somebody that can be at his position hopefully for many years.

[Jamie Eisenberg]

So what are the teams that could use a running back in your mind, Jamie? The, the ones that have the open, the, the help wanted, sign out for an RB one.

[Mike Renner]

You know, I mean, it's, it's like, you know, we've talked about maybe him going to Chicago and just the, the fit there in Ben Johnson scheme. Like, I don't think DeAndre Swift is the type of guy that's keeping him off the field, you know, so it's, it's any of the teams that we've mentioned in the last couple of weeks, you know, Denver, Chicago, the Raiders, Dallas, still for sure. You know, I don't, I don't buy the two guys that they brought in as being, you know, speed bumps to that situation.

[Jamie Eisenberg]

It would be unlikely. But Cleveland, do you. Cleveland's a team that could use an RB1.

[Mike Renner]

Yeah. Unless they trade back into the first round. I'd be surprised, right?

[Jamie Eisenberg]

No, I, I agree. They're not going to take Jantion too. I'd be shocked if they did that.

[Adam Mazer]

Do you see superstar Mike and Janti?

[Dave Richard]

I do. The combination of just contact balance and then his speed. I mean, he can really hit breakaway runs. I'm not really worried about size, obviously, like, he's short, but it's not like he's small. And there's not tread on this guy's tires. He wasn't even like a starter in high school. It's kind of late to the game and split time his first two years at Boise State, so yeah, I would. There's really no reason to think he's going to be anything other than the student. I even see him like as probably a guy who's more ready to produce like high volume at the NFL level. They even like Bijan was coming out.

[Jamie Eisenberg]

Yes.

[Adam Mazer]

Wow. Okay, so this is a great graphic that we have here. Most rush yards in FBS. FBS last season. Ash and Genti with 2,601, which is incredible. Genti after contact. Genti had more yards after contact than any other running back had rushing yards, period. Cam Scatter Boo would be third on the list here after Genti and Genti after contact. That is, that is unbelievable. And then Omari and Hampton would be fourth. So. Yeah. Do you want to talk more about Dylan Sampson here? Because that was one of the three guys you talked about. Could be stars at the running back position. And I don't know, I guess I'd call him a little bit, A little bit of a sleeper.

[Dave Richard]

Yeah, he was, I mean he was Tennessee's offense this past year. When he went down against Ohio State, it was over that game. You know, he is obviously slighter. 5 11, 200. You know, he's on the shorter or on the smaller side. Excuse me for running back, but he's still young. I mean at 20 years old, was again, I think he's the youngest guy in this draft class or if not by like a month or so, he's not the youngest. You can expect him to still get stronger, still probably put on some more weight to handle the rigors of the NFL. But I see a guy that could run between the tackles at that size. I mean, very reminiscent. Like I said, Bucky Irving, Aaron Williams, similar running style where they're built so compact and low to the earth that they can just bounce between holes so easily. The lateral agility you see consistently. And then at that size, he doesn't run timid. You know, he runs into guys chest, he will lower shoulder. Like to me running back when projecting the NFL from college, the NFL, it's not as much about size as it is how you run. So the guys that are 220 but are scared to like really hit a guy, it doesn't really matter. Like Marshawn Lloyd last year was one. I was just like, I. I think it can be no more than like a third down back because he's just not going to want to run between the tackles. Dylan Sampson is going to want to run between the tackles. You saw that consistently at Tennessee. That was kind of a lot of what they did was just a lot of like one back power and stuff like that. So I just think he's got a real dynamic game and we've seen a lot of guys be very successful. You know, it's kind of undersized guys with good speed. The Jameer Gibbses, the James Cooks, Bucky Irving's. I think, you know, Bucky Irving did have speed, but like, I think he can be the next in that mold.

[Adam Mazer]

Hey, Dave, who's your favorite Ohio State running back?

[Jamie Eisenberg]

I like Judkins a little bit more than I do Henderson. I think that he, he reminds me, and maybe this is a stretch, but he reminds me a little bit of Joe Mixon. Just his ability to be certainly an 1A back. But he's patient, he's strong, he's got good balance. I don't like how much he runs to contact. I'd rather him try and lean on his agility a little bit more. But I think he could eventually be a three down player, maybe without the top end speed, but that's still somebody who can go into the NFL and handle a lot of work. He did great at Ole Miss before he went to Ohio State and then he did great at Ohio State. I'm not taking anything away from Henderson. I think Henderson's really good too. I just like Judkins a little bit more.

[Adam Mazer]

Man, I just wonder with Judkins if he didn't have that game against Notre Dame. 11 carries, 100 yards, two touchdowns. He also caught a touchdown. What his stock would be Henderson, like, for what it's worth, you know, they were teammates. Henderson averaged 7.1 yards per carry last year, Judkins 5.7 yards per carry. Judkins does not really make a lot of big plays. In his career. He's had 13 carries of 30 or more yards. Henderson's had 20 carries of 30 or more yards on about 140 fewer carries. I think even more than that. I'm a Henderson guy, so mark me down, he's the smaller guy. If you don't know, Henderson's the smaller guy. He's 5 10, 202 pounds. Judkins, 6 foot 221 pounds. So they're very different running backs. Henderson did not have more than 12 carries in any game last year, although he, in his career he's had like nine games with 19 or more carries. Something like that, but not last year. He's had some injury issues but I, I don't know, like it's like David Montgomery versus Jameer Gibbs or something. I'm gonna go with Henderson, Jamie Henderson or Judkins.

[Mike Renner]

I lean Judkins right now, but for me it's going to be the fit. You know, I think wherever they end up is going to determine clearly based on, you know, some of the stylistic differences, you know, which team is going to prefer that type of player for their, their system. And hopefully it's a fit as opposed to trying just to take who they may think is the better long term talent and trying to fit that player into their, into their own offense. So there's, they're going to be ranked very closely I think on a lot of pre draft lists for, for fantasy purposes. But yeah, I would lead judge just slightly right now.

[Adam Mazer]

Mike, what's the right answer?

[Mike Renner]

Just to be different from you, of course.

[Adam Mazer]

What do we got Mike? Who do you like?

[Dave Richard]

I got Judkins higher and I, I think it's, I just see more bell cow potential with Judkins. With Trevan Henderson, I, I never see him really being the featured soul back of an offense. He's too slight. He's not a grind out, tough yardage sort of back. He's a home run hitter and that's great. But home run hitters oftentimes don't get 20 carries a game at the NFL level. And especially with how good he is as a pass protector, it almost like hurts his value fantasy because he's not going to play early downs when he's so good on third downs and pass pro that he's going to be saved for those sort of downs because at £200 I just didn't see and with his injury history, I'm not sure he's a guy who's going to be really, really heavily featured. Whereas Jugkins, with his size and what he did at Ole Miss, just basically carrying the load for them week in and week out, I think he has more bell count potential.

[Jamie Eisenberg]

To Jamie's point, it comes down to like what a team needs and you know, if there's a team that needs a third down back out there, then Henderson's going to be the guy because I think he can play in that role and he might have to prove it, Adam, that he can handle three downs before he becomes a workhorse. I, I don't know if saying that like Camaro went along the same path is a fair thing to say, but you think about how Alvin Camara, just like his biggest splash was first made, I feel like it was made as a pass catcher out of the backfield and he just kind of worked his way into being a feature back in New Orleans much faster than anybody thought. Henderson could pull off the same thing. It's just a matter of getting that opportunity.

[Adam Mazer]

Yeah.

[Mike Renner]

These are the type of guys though, that if they go to established backfields or, you know, as a number two guy, like, we're going to get frustrated a lot.

[Adam Mazer]

Yeah. Like, I, I don't know about year one for Henderson because I'll give you two comparisons. Both guys who weighed in at 199 pounds and Henderson 202 pounds. James Cook and Jameer Gibbs. So I just think James Cook just showed his talent and eventually he's not an every down back. They. He's not a third down back now. Right. So like he's, he's a first and second down back. He doesn't get the full workhorse, you know, role that we like. But he's so good and so efficient and he's on great offense, which helps. And then Gibbs was second fiddle to Montgomery. Then Montgomery got hurt in Gibbs's rookie year and Gibbs kind of took off. So I could see that kind of start for Henderson where he, maybe he doesn't get that much work as a rookie, but if, you know, he was like the number one running back prospect in the nation, he's totally so dynamic. That's the kind of player I want to bank on. So put me on Henderson Island. Okay, there we go. And let's go over to wide receivers. We've talked a lot about running backs. We're not going to get to all of the good ones. And I do see that we have questions in the chat. So let's talk about McMillan. And is he. He is, from what I gather, unless Travis Hunter plays wide receiver. McMillan would be your number one guy, Mike. And what do you think his upside is again?

[Dave Richard]

I think it's like a high volume, low explosive play sort of wide receiver who's got to produce in the red zone. Like, he is so good at catch point, great ball skills. And I think what separates him from a lot of 6 foot 4 wide receivers is his ability to, you know, operate in short areas. He can run a whip route, he can run a comeback real efficiently, can stop on a dime. You know, most athletes that look like him, they end up on basketball courts. They're not playing wide receiver in the NFL. It's just a body type that is unique. But the NFL Level like it matters to have that sort of catch radius, to have that sort of size. So just a real fluid athlete that I think is just a really high floor guy, but maybe not the highest ceiling guy. He's not again a downfield threat. He's not an explosive type of guy. He might get more explosive because he is pretty skinny. And I think there is some meat on the bone there from a developmental standpoint physically for him, but just who he is right now, I think he's very much an NFL ready sort of possession number one type of wide receiver. Not necessarily like your Malik neighbors or even your Marvin Harrison Jr that came out last year.

[Adam Mazer]

And you know, what did you think of Luther Burden's pretty bad production? I know we asked you that question earlier about just raw stats, but I know, look, the passing game was pretty awful last year for them Missouri, so can we just excuse it?

[Dave Richard]

It's, it's so tough watching his tape because he is running all these like clear out routes from the slot. You know, running into cover two or cover four safeties. Just seems, it's like no one's ever gonna throw that route. It's, it's not so much stuff where it's like, man, you look at it and it's just never going to work out. And a lot of stuff is scheme production. Like if he didn't have the 2023 season though, I probably wouldn't be talking about this highly. But he did. And in 2023 you saw the full skill set. He was a guy I had like in my top five heading into this year. I thought he was that talented and just didn't get to show it. So a real physically gifted athlete. We were at like 4, 4, 1. He's got that level explosiveness to take the top off of defense, but then also just put the ball in his hands and he can create as well. So it's a skill set that's like obviously great for fantasy was having that sort of combination. And I just think that even if he's not a fully powerful outrunner, he can run a few routes and still produce. You can run like a slant in his sleep and get open. And this guy at his size, because he's very well built for a wide receiver, should translate well to the NFL even if the production numbers again don't really reflect it.

[Adam Mazer]

All right, let's talk about Luther Burden out of Missouri, slot receiver who went from about 1200 yards in 2023 to a little more than 600 yards in 2024. Uh, we're going to take a break, come back and answer some questions from the chat and just talk a little football here with Mike and Dave and Jamie. We'll be right back.

[Mike Renner]

Have no fear, March Madness is here.

[Adam Mazer]

Who could take home the national title?

[Dave Richard]

Will it be UCLA or maybe Notre Dame? It's anyone's game and we need to Talk now has got you covered. I'm Alicia J. Certified tall girl, social media manager and reporter for we need to Talk.

[Adam Mazer]

And I'm Ashley Nicole Moss, basketball analyst and CBS Sports host.

[Dave Richard]

Together, we're bringing you all the storylines that you need to know around women's sports and women in sports. Each week on we need to Talk Now. Make sure you download and subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Spotify or wherever else you get your podcasts. The phenomenon is back. The new season of Yellowjackets is now on Paramount plus with Showtime. Think about how screwed up we would.

[Adam Mazer]

Be if we had survived a plane.

[Dave Richard]

Crash only to end up eating each other. This place will follow us for the rest of our lives.

[Adam Mazer]

The only way to truly be safe is to be the only one left.

[Dave Richard]

This season. The past will come back to hunt you. You really are insane. Yellowjackets new season now streaming on the.

[Mike Renner]

Paramount plus with Showtime plan.

[Dave Richard]

Let the buy.

[Adam Mazer]

Let them go. All right, let's see. First question will be from Mr. Papinski, which is a Nintendo reference. I played a Little Mega Man 2 yesterday, some Mario 2, which is terrible game. Mike, do you have a favorite old school Nintendo game?

[Dave Richard]

Ooh, gosh, what did I play? I mean, I was young when I played Super Nintendo, so I never played the original Nintendo.

[Adam Mazer]

How old are you? How old are you?

[Dave Richard]

34.

[Adam Mazer]

Okay.

[Dave Richard]

Donkey Kong. I was Donkey Kong. I loved playing Donkey Kong back in the day.

[Adam Mazer]

34. You know, the mustache makes you look closer to, closer to 40, I think.

[Dave Richard]

So it matures me. Thank you. I could use it.

[Adam Mazer]

Donkey Kong, Super Nintendo had that really good fighting game, I think that came with the system basically like that first, you know. Do you remember that game? It's like someone will know anyway. What do you think about Jalen Milroe? Where do you think he lands and where would you like to see him land?

[Dave Richard]

I'd like to see him land at running back or wide receiver. Truthfully, unfortunately not. So I just don't, I don't see it. I've never seen quite seen it. He had that one half against Georgia that like maybe you could squint. But I, I worry one about the accuracy, like the small hands thing. There's a reason why? Every guy who's had sub 9 chance has just not been an accurate quarterback at the NFL level. It's very difficult to grip a football. Footballs are big and they get bigger at the NFL. So I worry about that with him. And the pocket presence is rough, so. So like really his best upside, where I'd like to see him land is like Lamar Jackson's backup. Jalen Hurts is backup. Jaden Daniels backup. Like that's a team that has a run heavy first option at quarterback. Then your backup comes in as Jalen Miller and you can run the same run action stuff. That's his only path to success in my opinion. I just have not seen it as a passer though to really get excited about him. So I think he's like, maybe sneaks into Price, goes off the board somewhere in the third round, but maybe not even, maybe even false day three if he really is stuck on playing qb.

[Adam Mazer]

And Jamie, he's one of the more interesting fantasy prospects because this guy is, is an unbelievable rusher at the quarterback position.

[Mike Renner]

Yeah, I mean, just based on Mike's path, you know, could be what happened with Jalen Hurts, you know, went in the third round and you know, eventually got a chance to start and showed that he could play. And you know, hopefully that's the case for Milroe if you know, the right system, right players around him. You know, again, this is the type of guy I think will like better than NFL and reality will like, you know, just because of what he'll do with his legs. Because these type of guys, Anthony Richardson in some pockets of play and you know, Justin Fields and what he's shown at times, you know, these, these guys are better fantasy quarterbacks than they are reality in real life. But again, yeah, I don't see him starting week 1, 20, 25. This is more of a, you know, long term situation or you know, goes to right team and injury occurs.

[Adam Mazer]

Next question is from DJ Quill, dropping sick beats. Thoughts on DJ Giddens and Damian Martinez. Giddens out of Kansas State, Martinez out of Miami. Mike, thoughts on those two guys?

[Dave Richard]

I really like Martinez. I mean, Giddens is nice, got nice running back. I think he's more of like a day three running back. I think Martinez could sneak into day two Giddens, to me, I worry about him. Runs a little high. I just worry about that translating to the NFL. But he's creative runner, he's got good feet for his size. But Damian Martinez is the one where I'm like, he's running back six for me, I think he's a top 100 player on my draft board and I factor in positional value into that. So that's like, I think he should be a top hundred pick. And then if a draft, he's a physical runner. And for a guy who's big bruiser, like he has some real ability to find a hole and to hit it aggressively. I, I watch his tape and I'm just like, that's a guy who can run at the NFL level. I, I just see very much the traits it takes to succeed even if he's not a super explosive player. But I thought it was 40 at the combine was a lot better than I expected. In the low four fives there. I thought him more before six guy on tape. But that's, it's a real good time for him, man.

[Adam Mazer]

You know, Dave, it's so interesting because there's starting to be some buzz for Damian Martinez and Mike. Dave and I are both Miami guys, so we watched, you know, every play for Martinez. I never felt that way. I never saw it with him. I never felt like this guy's going to be a good NFL running back. I was actually quite honestly very underwhelmed by Martinez. Now that said, I did not watch any of his Oregon State tapes, so I do want to do that. But his senior year at Miami, I just, I don't see it.

[Mike Renner]

I don't know.

[Adam Mazer]

How do you feel about that?

[Jamie Eisenberg]

I think that he's got the power that you want and his speed, I mean, it's a detriment. He's not going to, he's not going to run away from people like Janti Will, but he's going to be, he's, he's capable of pushing the pile. We'll plug for Mike there and then also just being that physical early downs type.

[Adam Mazer]

Yes.

[Jamie Eisenberg]

Or you can have specialty for sure.

[Adam Mazer]

But do you see him, do you see him as a special running back on the next level?

[Jamie Eisenberg]

You see him special, but I think teams are teams that are looking for that type of physical running back. Obviously they're going to target, you know, a player like Genti first, but if they'll miss on Genty and a few rounds later, they'll go after Martinez.

[Adam Mazer]

Really pretty good class of physical running backs this year, I'd have to say.

[Jamie Eisenberg]

That's why he's RB6 and or, well, RB6 for Mike, I should say. But it's, it's not to slight Martinez. This is a really good class.

[Adam Mazer]

Jaden Higgins question. Nathan Arthur wants to know About Jaden Higgins, wide receiver out of Iowa State. Mike, what do you think?

[Dave Richard]

I love Jaden Higgins. I think he's pretty close to that tier. So I have McMillan burden, Igbuka golden, but I think he's close to Igbuka golden. In my opinion. I have him right behind those guys. Top. He's gonna end up top 40 player for me. Great possession type of wide receiver with a little more speed than I think he gets credit for. And I just think he's very polished, very consistent. The type of guy that translates well to the NFL, you know, just has a lot of things like that you. Things that you don't have to worry about when projecting to the next level. So I don't see necessarily, you know, an elite player, but he could be like a Michael Pittman. He could be in that caliber. A wide receiver who in the right spot if there's no other whiteouts, I think he could produce.

[Jamie Eisenberg]

So imagine Michael Pittman on a different team with a better quarterback. That's an opportunity that could hit Higgins. And I thought he looked great at the Senior Bowl. When I went back and I watched the film at Iowa State, he looked great there too. He. He's kind of the. The runner up to Ted McMillan. As far as if you're looking for a big, physical type of receiver, good catch radius, good hands, well, this is your guy. If you can't get McMillan, he can, he can deliver in that regard. He's young, he's 22. And I could see him like again, once again pointing to what Jamie said about, you know, where they land. That's what matters. He could end up being very good for fantasy if he just gets an opportunity to immediately be a team's wide receiver. Two and maybe develop into a wide receiver. One, he's someone to get fairly excited about, just doesn't have the speed. And that's common with guys that are as big as receivers like this.

[Adam Mazer]

All right, from Casey, is Golden better than a Buka and or Burden? So these are all wide receivers that you're going to see in the top five for a lot of people. Is Matthew golden better than a Mecca Abuka and or Luther Burden?

[Dave Richard]

Man, it's. They're all different types of wide receivers, I think. Burdens, again, more of the slot gadget scheme production guy. Igbuka is kind of your bigger slot, move them around, reliable, works the middle of the football field guy. Whereas Golden's kind of your full route tree runner on the outside. He doesn't have great size to win at the catch. Point he doesn't do really anything at an elite level. But I watch his game and I'm like, he really doesn't do anything at a poor level either. There's not a lot of holes to poke into it. So it's kind of a picker poison between those three. I'm a trend towards burden because I just think it's a little more dynamic the athlete he can be and he's got to get more chances then at the next level because of that. But if you want to order those guys, Golden, Igbuka, Burden, I'm not going to argue because again it's. They're more eye of the beholder. I see them all in a similar sorts here.

[Adam Mazer]

All right, and let's do one more question here. No love for. Oh wait, I gotta get my pronunciation guide for Ellic Iommen Iominer, no IO manner. I believe it is something like that out of Stanford and also Canadian FYI.

[Jamie Eisenberg]

And medicine at Alberta, Canada.

[Adam Mazer]

Yes. Six to 206 pounds, kind of a high ADOT guy in fact had a higher A dot than both Matthew golden and Teteroa McMillan. But Elik Ioman, er, I think your thoughts on him, Mike, he's really intrigued, man.

[Dave Richard]

If there's one guy who comes out of I think he's firmly like a day two guy. But if there's one guy who comes out of this looking like a, you know, like a DK Metcalf or Terry McLaurin where it's really just like, oh man, how'd that guy end up going where he went? I think could be a yominor because he's physically gifted. I mean he's a guy coming out of where he came from and then had an injury his freshman year at Stanford. That's why I didn't see the football field to immediately being their number one. And then this pasture just like quarterback situation is the only reason why he didn't put up big, big numbers. He's explosive and explosive out of his cuts.

[Mike Renner]

Former.

[Dave Richard]

You grew up a hockey player, so wasn't really a football player. But like you see his ability to really for a guy who's got a big body, who's cut up strong as an ox, like no fat on this guy, can run through contact and has some explosiveness to his game. I just didn't love his ball skills and I don't think he's like an advanced route runner at this point in time. But as far as like the athlete goes, you're not going to find a better projectable Athlete in this draft class on day two at the receiver position. He is just. He's unique in that regard. So he's a little up and down on tape. And again, for a bigger body wide receiver. It's kind of interesting that he does not catch as many balls that he should. But again, he's young, raw. I think there's a lot of reason to get excited about what that lottery ticket that he is could turn into.

[Adam Mazer]

Yeah, I think Ioman or had seven drops this past season. So that's been an issue for him. All right, Jamie, we got one more question here from you to Mike. Ask him an NFL question, whatever. Like a fantasy question about current NFL players. Whatever topic you want.

[Mike Renner]

Actually, I was going to ask about the. The quarterbacks prospects. Who's QB3 for you?

[Dave Richard]

Fine, QB3 for me. And this one's a little off the wall. I think this quarterback class, I have to like couch it with that because I don't love this quarterback class. So I'm just like search for any guy who I think can like play and start. So my quarterback three is Dylan Gabriel. I think he can start at the NFL level. I think he'd be like a Brock Purdy at the NFL level. So it's not like high. Again, I have one first round grades, Cam Ward. So it's just a guy who. I think if you threw him into the fire he wouldn't look terrible. Whereas the other guys, I'm not sure I can say that about after, you.

[Adam Mazer]

Know, top two and see Jamie, I'm. Because now you piss me off because he has one guy with a first round grade and yet Mike has Shadur Sanders going third to the Giants. And that is the last thing that I want to happen. And it could very well happen. But I just, I do not get it. I don't understand. These NFL teams have got to see what you see. Shoulder. Sanders should not be the third pick in the draft.

[Dave Richard]

You know, supplying demand does exactly.

[Adam Mazer]

Yeah, I don't know. But does that factor in when you're doing these mock drafts? You just look like, oh, the Giants need a quarterback. They're going to take the second best quarterback. But a lot of people just don't think he deserves to be drafted and that high.

[Dave Richard]

Yeah, I mean some, some of what I've heard too about the Giants and him for people. But also. Yeah, I mean it's also just like supply and demand now. I thought a quarterback would ultimately go higher than they did in 2022 just because of that reason. So maybe the NFL does learn the lesson in the past and especially in this class where, you know, from, from Sanders to Dart to, you know, McCord and shock, it's like it might not be the biggest thing. Biggest difference between those guys. Like, if you can get one of those in the third, why take one at three overall?

[Adam Mazer]

Yeah.

[Dave Richard]

But you know, I think the Giants are in a weird spot with ownership and how they look last off season, and I think they're going to want to really make a play here.

[Adam Mazer]

Yeah. For Cam Ward, please. All right, Mike, thank you so much. Appreciate your time. And again, everybody, please listen to the Pushing the Pile podcast. It's really terrific. Great insight. And of course, please join our bracket challenge. CBSSports.com FFT you've got one day. You got honestly about right, about 24 hours left to join this bracket challenge. CBS Sports.com Just call it the Gator.

[Mike Renner]

Invitational and get it over.

[Adam Mazer]

The Gator Invitational people to sign up. I was listening to Gary Parrish and Matt Norlander talking about I was listening to the on college basketball podcast. Auburn has lost three of their last four games. No team has ever won the national championship when losing three of their last four games going in. And the Gators are like, legitimately really good. But I'm not going to pick them. I'm going to pick Duke. So just so everybody knows, I'm picking Duke.

[Mike Renner]

I'm surprised you're not picking Florida. That's shocking.

[Adam Mazer]

Yeah, I guess they have somewhat of a tough road. I'm going to. I think I'm going to pick them to lose in the round of 32. I'm not even going to take them in the sweet 16 busting brackets.

[Mike Renner]

There you go.

[Adam Mazer]

Might be a little biased. Thanks for watching and listening, everybody. We will talk to you tomorrow with a mock draft review on fantasy football today.

[Dave Richard]

Foreign just because the 2024 NFL season is over doesn't mean that you're done with football. I'm Mike Renner, co host of the Push in the Pile podcast, part of the CBS Sports Podcast Network, and I'm here to help get you through the spring alongside my co host, former all pro guard Kyle Long. We're going to be diving into the combine, free agency and the draft because football season never sleeps. It's the offseason when championship rosters are built. So you gotta follow along, download and follow Pushing the Pile on Apple Podcasts, Spotify and anywhere else podcasts are found.