Fashion Neurosis with Bella Freud

Episode: Abiodun Oyewole
Date: February 4, 2026

Episode Overview

In this rich and heartfelt episode, designer Bella Freud welcomes poet and activist Abiodun Oyewole, founder of The Last Poets, to "lie on the couch" and explore the connections between fashion, culture, and identity. Their conversation begins with style and profoundly expands into Oyewole’s personal journey—childhood, family, self-naming, revolution, creative origins, encounters with icons like Nina Simone, and the ongoing legacy of poetic activism. The dialogue vibrates with humor, wisdom, candid reflection, and deep reverence for Black culture, music, and the power of words.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Clothing, Identity, and Cultural Representation

[01:13–02:35]

• Oyewole describes wearing a dashiki, emphasizing his commitment to Afrocentric attire as a statement of cultural pride and resistance to Western sartorial norms.
  • "A tie...is a phallic symbol and I don't think I need to wear a penis around my neck to show that I'm a man." (Abiodun Oyewole, 01:38)
  • Expresses dismay at how many Black men have "grown addicted to the suit and tie," seeing it as a denial of African heritage.

2. The Origin of "The Last Poets" Name & Its Political Roots

[02:35–07:08]

• Oyewole gives the poetic origin of the group’s name, referencing South African poet Koperetsi Kgositsile and the anthology "Black Fire".
  • Recites the passage from "Towards Walk in the Sun" that inspired the name.
  • Shares a moving memory of hearing South African students quote the poem during a tour.
• Explains that the name was chosen as a definitive, revolutionary statement.

3. Formative Childhood & Family Dynamics

[07:08–17:27]

• Born Charles Davis, in a home for unwed mothers, experiencing both neglect and deep love from his biological mother’s sister (Aunt Vivian/"Aunt Beanie").
  • "Every time I'd see her, it would be—the room would be full of light. It was like the sun would just shine all over the place." (Abiodun Oyewole, 08:14)
• Tells the story of his mother entrusting him to her sister out of profound love, recognizing that the best environment for him was not with her.
• Reminisces about his non-connection with his mother’s new husband, leading to the adoption by his aunt.

4. Artistic Influence and Cultural Reverberation

[19:30–26:07]

• Reflects on hearing his own work in unexpected places—clubs, fashion, and on TV—and the initial friction over Bella Freud using The Last Poets’ name for a sweater.
• Describes positive resolution, mutual respect, and the enduring global impact of The Last Poets.
• Recounts his amazement at being revered by legendary musicians on a Soul Train cruise:
  • "I was treated like I was the Pope of poetry." (Abiodun Oyewole, 25:11)
• Shares a vivid story performing "Coming to America" aboard the cruise, using the setting to recall the Middle Passage and the traumatic history of slavery.

5. The Journey to Self-Naming & Reclaiming African Roots

[30:48–37:42]

• Describes the pivotal moment at age 15 when a spiritual encounter led to the name "Abiodun Oyewole":
  • "He gave me a black stone to hold in one hand and a white chalky stone to hold in the other ... Then he says, well, your name is Abiodun Oyewole." (Abiodun Oyewole, 33:09)
• Transitioned from “Chuck” to “Abiodun,” asserting sovereignty over his identity and inspiring others.
• Discusses the erasure of African names and culture through slavery and the importance of reconnecting.
  • "This is the only slavery that's recorded on the planet where our identity was totally erased." (Abiodun Oyewole, 38:32)

6. Early Poetic Education & Performing without a Mic

[39:37–44:57]

• Talks about vocal training from his adoptive mother, who made him recite the Lord’s Prayer so loud she could hear it upstairs.
  • "She said, don't you yell the Lord's Prayer... just put the air in the stomach... open your mouth." (Abiodun Oyewole, 42:08)
• Shares an anecdote about performing "When the Revolution Comes" acapella after someone tried to sabotage his mic.
  • "I just belted it out ... I bet that'll learn you. I don't need a mic." (Abiodun Oyewole, 44:37)

7. The Political Birth of The Last Poets

[45:04–54:24]

• Formed on Malcolm X’s birthday, 1968, their work reflected the temperament and urgency following the assassination of Dr. King.
• Details their first poem, the influence of Black Power, and the significance of performance as group action.
  • On "Are you ready, niggers?": "By the time we got to the middle of the stage, the entire park was singing... It was a moment that I remember forever." (Abiodun Oyewole, 56:01)

8. Imprisonment, Artistic Growth, and Prison Education

[57:19–69:32]

• Was in prison when the first Last Poets album was released; recounts the irony of hearing his own lines quoted by inmates who didn’t know his identity.
• Wrote letters for other inmates, maintained respect for his Klan-robbery conviction, and finished a college degree at Shaw University while incarcerated.
  • "I'm not going to serve time. I'm going to get time to serve me." (Abiodun Oyewole, 60:09)
• Tells the story of his royalty money funding his tuition, and his emotional struggles with relationships affected by his imprisonment.

9. Poetry, Legacy, and Mentoring

[69:32–75:12]

• First inspired by Langston Hughes and began writing poetry to impress women ("I still do that.").
• Poetry as a means to connect deeply with the pulse and needs of the people.
  • "The poet really doesn’t tell you anything new. The poet tells you what you think you know, but they just make you see it in a way that you’ve never looked at it before." (Abiodun Oyewole, 71:12)

10. Encounters with Nina Simone, Artistic Temperament, and Gift Versus Giver

[72:59–84:07]

• Supported Nina Simone in concert—shares anecdotes of her legendary brilliance and unpredictable temperament, including dodging a thrown glass of cognac.
  • "If he’s married, tell him fuck his royalty check. If he’s not, we can talk about it." (Nina Simone, 75:55)
• Nina’s husband warned Oyewole: “If she and I are in the same place at the same time, there’s gonna be a fight.”
• Oyewole’s theory: "Appreciate the gift. Do not get caught up with the giver. You might just hurt yourself." (Abiodun Oyewole, 84:07)

11. Fashion, Attraction, and the Power of Imagination

[84:33–86:50]

• Lauds women who express culture through dress, emphasizing modest hints over overt exposure.
  • "Give me enough so that my imagination can soar... Give me a dress that's got a split down the side where I can just see a little bit of your leg." (Abiodun Oyewole, 85:35)

12. Poetic Community: Nurturing the Next Generation

[86:50–97:04]

• Hosts open salons featuring poets, rappers, singers, philosophers:
  • "Kendrick Lamar... Sharif Simmons... Aja Monet is the first woman I’ve actually put into the group... Jessica Care Moore..." (Abiodun Oyewole, 87:27–89:26)
• Encourages a global poetic fellowship focused on uplifting humanity.
• Shares the importance of honoring resilience and history, e.g., the Black Statue of Liberty legend.

13. Final Reflections: Humanity, Love, and the Essence of Revolution

[97:04–97:57]

• Oyewole’s enduring message: life is about love, community, and “humanity versus inhumanity.”
  • "There are two tribes on the planet. There’s a dog tribe and there’s a God tribe. And I’m a member of the God tribe.” (Abiodun Oyewole, 96:41)
• Deep mutual appreciation between Bella and Abiodun, closing on their friendship, collaboration, and the psychological layers of fashion, identity, and art.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Cultural Identity:
  "I don't want that culture to die. I don't want that to be dismissed. And I want to always be able to represent that particular attitude of my life." (Abiodun Oyewole, 01:51)

• On Revolutionary Artistic Names:
  "If these folks are going to say they're the Last Poets, that's like saying this is the last... it’s a definitive statement." (Abiodun Oyewole, 22:08)

• On His Prison Reputation:
  “Who else is in here for robbing the Klan? They respect you.” (Abiodun Oyewole, 63:05)

• On Gifts and Genius:
  "Appreciate the gift. Do not get caught up with the giver. You might just hurt yourself." (Abiodun Oyewole, 84:07)

• On Imagination & Fashion:
  "Give me enough so that my imagination can soar." (Abiodun Oyewole, 85:35)

• On the Essence of Poetry:
  "If you’re a poet and you don’t provoke thought, you’re not a poet. Stop saying you’re a poet." (Abiodun Oyewole, 71:44)

• On Community & the Next Generation:
  "It’s my responsibility to try to bring the young people along." (Abiodun Oyewole, 90:27)

• On Humanity:
  “There are two tribes on the planet. There’s a dog tribe and there’s a God tribe. And I’m a member of the God tribe.” (Abiodun Oyewole, 96:41)

Timestamps for Major Segments

• [01:13] — Clothing, Afrocentric pride
• [03:11] — Origin of "Last Poets" name
• [07:23] — Early childhood, family love & trauma
• [19:30] — Artistic influence, The Last Poets’ cultural echoes
• [30:48] — Name change, African heritage
• [39:42] — Vocal training, performing without a mic
• [45:25] — Political beginnings, first Last Poets performances
• [57:19] — Prison, writing, and self-education
• [69:46] — Langston Hughes and the poet’s calling
• [72:59] — Nina Simone stories
• [84:33] — Fashion, attraction, women’s dress
• [86:50] — Mentoring new poets and poetic community
• [96:41] — Closing thoughts: Love, God tribe

Tone

Respectful, direct, and occasionally humorous, the episode oscillates between reverence for tradition and frank, sometimes biting social critique. Both Bella and Abiodun approach style, politics, and personal history with warmth, candor, and deep human curiosity.

For Listeners Who Missed the Episode

This episode is a masterclass in personal and political history, an intimate testimony of Black American experience, poetic activism, and why what we wear is never just about fashion. Bella Freud and Abiodun Oyewole's exchange will resonate long after listening—a reminder that style, naming, and poetry are acts of both resistance and love.