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- [00:01]
Lauren Sherman
This episode is brought to you by ebay. We all have that piece, the one that's so you. You've basically become known for it. And if you don't yet fashionistas, you'll find it on ebay. That Miu Miu red leather bomber, the Cousteau Barcelona cowboy top, or that Patagonia fleece in the 2017 colorway. All these finds are all on ebay, along with millions of more main character pieces backed by authenticity guarantee. Ebay is the place for pre loved and vintage fashion. EBay Things people love this episode is brought to you by State Farm. Knowing you could be saving money for the things you really want is a great feeling. Talk to a State Farm agent today to learn how you can choose to bundle and save with a personal price plan. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there. Prices are based on rating plans that vary by state. Coverage options are selected by the customer. Availability, amount of discounts and savings and eligibility vary by state. Hello and welcome to Fashion People. I'm Lauren Sherman, writer of Puck's Fashion and Beauty Memo line sheet and today with me on the show is Grow Curtis, editor in chief of Icon America. We're talking Jonathan Anderson's appointment at Dior Celine under Michael Ryder and we also pose the question, have we reached peak Kardashian? Happy Tuesday everyone. By the time you read this, I will be in Copenhagen for the Global Fashion Summit where I'm interviewing Sebastian Kopp, the co founder of Veja, about building a socially responsible brand without advertising that you're socially responsible. It's not easy, but they've done it in a really interesting way. I'm going to try to make sure the interview is available to Fashion People listeners as well. So stay tuned for that. And I'm also going to check out some stores when I'm there, go to some panels, see some people, et cetera. Definitely want to go to Pico, the scrunchie and hair tie store. I feel like I'm missing out that I haven't been there yet. So very excited for that. This week in Line sheet I'm getting into the business of Kardashian Jenner Inc. And more specifically their relationship with another family, the Greeds who run Popular Culture, a holding company that includes Good American Frame and a bunch of other stuff. Anyway, be sure to check that out and on Tuesday I will also have a requisite Conde update. Plus, Sarah Shapiro is around with a fabulous, fabulous look at the DTC darlings of the 2010s. Sort of where are they now? If you will. This was inspired by Everlane's new Everlane's new clean luxury campaign, as well as everything that transpired last week around Rhodes selling to elf, which I'll remind you, Rachel Strugatz broke that news. But that had me thinking hard about glossier. And I thought it would be fun, and Sarah thought it would be fun to kind of look at that first generation of disruptive brands and see what they're up to and which ones survived, which ones are thriving. It's an interesting mix and says a lot about the state of consumerism. But today, with Grow, it's all about Jonathan Anderson. So let's get going.
- [03:18]
Grow Curtis
Grow.
- [03:18]
Lauren Sherman
Curtis, welcome to Fashion People.
- [03:20]
Grow Curtis
Thank you for having me.
- [03:22]
Lauren Sherman
Thank you for being here. I'm so excited. It feels like it's long overdue, but you have a lot going on. So before we start, let's talk about who you are and what you do.
- [03:31]
Grow Curtis
Okay, so Gro Kernis, apparently editor in chief of Icon America and freelance stylist and consultant. I've been doing this for quite some time now. 15 years. Before icon America, I was at V and V Man as editorial and fashion director. And before that, I was freelancing in London, Paris, and eventually got my job in New York. So it's been quite a ride so far.
- [04:03]
Lauren Sherman
And when did you launch Icon America? Just a couple of weeks ago. Right?
- [04:08]
Grow Curtis
Exactly. May 7th, our first issue. The concept is a biannual book, so. So every six months, Spring, summer, fall, winter. And it's been interesting because times are really rough. I have friends of mine who worked in an industry saying that it's last time they remember it's been this hard was in 2008. So times are really tough. But we are trying our best to launch a product that's interesting enough to stand and fight against these times.
- [04:50]
Lauren Sherman
Yeah, it doesn't seem easy. Well, okay, let's chat about more about what you've done with the first issue a little bit later. Cause I just was blown away. I love the COVID so much. But first, I wanted to get into the news of the day, which was. I didn't even wake up to it. I saw it last night on socials. To Jonathan. Mr. Jonathan W. Anderson, posting on his social. It's a great privilege to design the men's and women's collections. The House of Dior. I'm gonna have a big piece. So Jonathan Anderson, officially, after six months of waiting, has been actually really. The first time I heard of this was in October 2024. But I think I first Dane to mention it. In January 2025, six months of waiting, he was announced to be the men's and women's designer of Dior. The first person to ever design both collections. He will be in charge of 10 collections. On top of his four, he designs for JW Anderson. On top of two, he designs for Uniqlo Gro. What was your reaction this morning or this evening whenever you saw the news that. Jonathan, is it.
- [06:10]
Grow Curtis
I mean, you know, first of all, it's worth explaining that when you attend fashion shows and when you, if you're lucky enough to sit in the front row, what we do in between the shows, and sometimes we wait for 45 minutes or one hour, we talk, we gossip, we exchange informations. So this particular information, as you said, has been around, I feel forever. And that's what we do. You know, someone has lunch with a CEO or deputy CEO and you know, hush, hush. You can hear really good informations during the shows when you're waiting for the actual show to start. I was pretty excited because Jonathan, I feel, is one of the biggest talents in the industry, not just talent of his generation. I think he's more than that. What he did with Loewe is fascinating. He was deeply involved in everything. I remember doing a special project for V Man magazine when I was there with Loewe and I know how involved he was in the actual casting, in approving the images. So I mean, he is pretty much hands on guy. And what's very intriguing to see is how he handles such a big beast. I mean beast in the most positive way. That's Dior because we're talking about menswear, womanswear and couture. Three almost different universes inside of this huge galaxy of lvmh. I think it's one of the biggest challenges in recent fashion history. Don't you think so?
- [08:00]
Lauren Sherman
I think it's the hardest thing that any designer has ever tried to do. I think it's. And honestly, I have a huge amount of confidence in him. I'm a massive fan. Not only as, like, even if I didn't like the clothes, I would appreciate it, but I also am like personally a fan of his and think he's. I've been buying stuff since 2011, since he did first started doing womenswear. I'm just a massive fan. I think he's, like you said, more than a generational talent. He is gonna go down in history. And I also think this is the hardest job that you could give anyone at this time in the trajectory of the luxury Industry at this time in the trajectory of lvmh. This is a person who, it's interesting at the beginning, Marc Jacobs, John Galliano. John Galliano design Dior. Marc Jacobs designed Louis Vuitton. Jonathan. I think I always assumed he would end up at Louis Vuitton.
- [09:02]
Grow Curtis
Me too.
- [09:03]
Lauren Sherman
It felt like the more natural thing for his way. But, you know, things don't always work out the way people expect them to. But when Mark and John Galliano started in the late 90s designing the stuff, their job was halo, only you just do the Runway. And Mark changed that a bit when he started to do the designer. The artist collaborations and his Louis Vuitton stuff became really commercially viable, especially the resort wear stuff. But by the time Mark and John Galliano Left in the early 2010s, it was a totally different business and it needed different types of people, much more commercially driven. Enter Maria Grazia Church and Kim Jones at Dior. Enter Nicolas Gascare and Kim and Kim Jones Louis Vuitton, actually. Kim Jones is the core. Yeah. And he was at LV with Mark for a while too. I think Kim Jones was the sort of next generation designer, if you want to really look at something. Someone after John and Mark, where he was really product driven, he's a great designer, but it's really about the product. And Virgil was really about the product. Demna is really about the product. Demna is a little bit of a hybrid. But Alessandro Michele also really, truly about the product. This next generation of designers are coming in where Alessandro, Demna, Virgil, all these people, Maria Grazia, Kim, they made these businesses ginormous huge. And so now you have to be. You essentially have to be like Eddie Slimond, I would say. There's an executive said to me once, he's really a CEO designer and he loves controlling everything. And he could do one of these big houses because he wants to control it all. But I would say that with Jonathan, he's going to have to manage these giant teams of people, be creative, also manage up to Bernard Arnault, Delphine Arnault and all manage across to every single person. You know, there is a CEO who essentially does women's at Dior. The person who runs marketing is essentially the CEO of marketing. It's a giant business. And so he is going to have to cut through all of that to get his idea across. And I for one, am so pumped to see it happen.
- [11:44]
Grow Curtis
Me too.
- [11:45]
Lauren Sherman
I cannot wait. I'm gonna have a big story in line sheet on Thursday about how it's gone so far and the good and the bad. And I am just so excited for this. And as much as the way they dragged out the announcement was tough for I think everyone involved and super unfortunate. And I hope they learned a lot from it.
- [12:08]
Grow Curtis
It got tiring.
- [12:10]
Lauren Sherman
It got so tiring. And, you know, no one deserved it that way. But what I would say is I'm more excited than ever to see what happens next.
- [12:20]
Grow Curtis
Oh, absolutely. And I mean, it's just the fact that he will have to navigate a very sensitive politics of ldmh. And also the fact that, as we all know, Dior is a crown Jew for Monsieur Arnault. And, you know, the royal intrigue, the royal court drama that he will for sure face is a challenge on its own. Not to mention, as you said, huge teams. I mean, you know, people maybe think, oh, it's like, you know, 10 people in each team. No, those teams are huge. Every single department is huge. So to do that, I mean, I'm a huge Jonathan fan. I adore him. I think I'm going to be praying for him, just for his sanity to manage and then to produce something that's going to be both commercially viable but also inspiring for us editors. I mean, wow. It's definitely the toughest job in the industry right now.
- [13:25]
Lauren Sherman
It's crazy. I'm so. I honestly just talking to you about it, got really pumped in a way that usually I'm not that enthusiastic, but for some reason I'm just like, this is big. And also there's so much happening in the industry. He and Matu Blasey, those two things are going to change the trajectory of the industry.
- [13:49]
Grow Curtis
Oh, yes.
- [13:50]
Lauren Sherman
If it doesn't work, that's going to be one thing. If it works, that could mean something else. And because luxury is at. It's about to enter a new phase and they are going to be the ones that guide that. And the executives that they work with, Lena Nair and Delphine Arnault. It's a really exciting time to be doing what we're doing, and especially for you, because I go to a good amount of shows and I'm around, but you go to everything. So it's going to be fun for you.
- [14:26]
Grow Curtis
I go to everything. And I mean, it's funny you mentioned that, but I really think in last couple of years, I mean, even a decade now, CEOs have been driving the wheels, they've been operating the machine. I think we have to switch to a narrative where designers are the ones in control because we hear a lot about merchandise, merchandising, Constantly. I think you have to let designers create dreams, create some magic, and all good will come from that. But when you have too many CEOs, CFOs, CMOs in the room with the designers, it's not very easy to actually create something. So hopefully, as you said, Matthieu and Jonathan will will kind of shift the conversation and claim what they should claim. Creative direction of the brand.
- [15:27]
Lauren Sherman
For sure. And I think, look, this is not the business that. And one thing I noted in the Delphine Arnault statement, she mentioned creativity. And that is something. I probably said this a million times on this podcast. European executives, part of their sort of talking points is always about creativity, whereas in the US it very much isn't. And I would say in the last five years, because the business got so big, or even 10 years, I think the executives in those companies have started to operate a lot more like American executives, brand managers from conglomerates. And absolutely, to an extent they have to, because the businesses are so giant. But I would say a really good example. Yes, to an extent. And I. I think a really good example of someone who has done it very well. There are two in the US and they're both French guys. Patrice Louvet, who is the CEO of Ralph Lauren, is. He comes from pac cpg Consumer Packaged Goods. He is a brand manager. But he has understood how to manage that brand in a way that it still feels creative. But could they have more interesting Runway concept? Sure. But I have, I always have a great time. I'm a big fan. But I think they've done an incredible job with the merchandising, with the marketing in recent years because he's managed to understand. He understands his brand first. And I would say Pierre Roussel, who worked at LVMH forever, his management of Tory Burch in the last five years, same thing. It's like brand first, creativity first. If you invest in that, you get more on the outside. Not to say it's not been. It's been hard for these companies, but I think that I hope that this is a return to that, because I think that the luxury brands got so big and so comfortable that they lost the plot for a little bit. And it would be great to return to that. Let's make something that people actually want to buy, not just stuff that they think they have to buy.
- [17:34]
Grow Curtis
Exactly. I mean, you know, part of the problem is that, like, if you go to, I don't know, I go to Via Monte Napoleon in Milan and I go to 10, 15 stores with a friends or with my family. And like every single brand has a white shirt or every single brand has a biker jacket and they all look the same. And that's the problem with like CMOs and CFOs and CEOs coming in and saying, oh, you should do this or you should do that. No, I think the point of luxury and the point of fashion, if you ask me, is it has to be about seduction, it has to be about mystery, it has to be about dream. Because otherwise you find yourself buying factory goods for masses. I mean, no one wants to know how the sausage is made. You know what I mean? Like, we need mystery, we need seduction. And that can only come through creativity and freedom.
- [18:30]
Lauren Sherman
I love that this episode is brought to you by Amazon Prime. From streaming to shopping, prime helps you get more out of your passions. So whether you're a fan of true crime or prefer a nail biting novel from time to time, with services like Prime Video, Amazon Music and fast free delivery, prime makes it easy to get more out of whatever you're into or getting into. Visit Amazon.comprime to learn more. Do you love movies, books? All things pop culture? Same on for the Love, we talk with incredible guests like Stanley Tucci, Yvette Nicole Brown, Maddie Corman, even the queen of comfort food herself, Ina Garten. We celebrate the stories and creators that bring joy to our everyday lives. Come hang out for the Love is wherever you get your podcasts. Speaking of creativity and freedom, other than Jonathan at Diorman in which do you think he's gonna change it back to Dior Homme?
- [19:45]
Grow Curtis
I think so. I think so. I was thinking about it.
- [19:49]
Lauren Sherman
I would advise. I would advise anyway, who knows? But in July during Couture, Michael Ryder is going to debut at Celine. I believe that's gonna be women's and men's. That's what I was told from people at the company.
- [20:06]
Grow Curtis
That is correct.
- [20:09]
Lauren Sherman
Last week there were some images that went around the Internet. I wrote about it a bit in line sheet. It looks like it's men's fall 2025. So I don't think that. I know Michael started a while back, but I don't know if it would be a studio collection or not. But look, it looked to me it looked like a great bridge collection. It was oh yes, Eddie, but preppier and more preppy and more caliber. I mean Eddie is preppy. It was bougie in the way that all Celine should be bougie. And I thought I liked it. But I am so excited for Michaels. I sound like such a rah. Rah girl today. Don't worry, everybody.
- [20:56]
Grow Curtis
I love it.
- [20:58]
Lauren Sherman
There's gonna be a lot of questioning things in Thursday's line.
- [21:03]
Grow Curtis
Cheaper winter is coming.
- [21:04]
Lauren Sherman
Yeah. But honestly, I'm so pumped for both of these things. Like, I don't. I can't even explain to you. I'm so excited. Cause I'm such a fan of Michael's and was a big fan of what he did at Polo. And this is a person who look like you look at the transformation of Polo in the last 10 years. That is not easy to do. This is a company that someone. Ralph Lauren. Michael used to work at Ralph Lauren. He designed the Polo collection. Ralph Lauren. Someone described this company to me once as a place where you had to have a meeting about getting something changed on a business card. Like, it's just. There's a lot of. And there's a, there's a lot of attention to detail because it is such. You have to protect the brand. The fact that he managed to enliven and like make Polo into something that people were buying secondhand but also buying full price in a really exciting way. I went to a swim party yesterday for 4 year olds and there was a cool mom there who has nothing to do with fashion with a polo cap on. Like they're. All the kids in New York are wearing vintage Polo. That is an incredible feat. And I am just so excited. I am hoping that it's a sort of takes the best of what Eddie did, the best of what Phoebe did, and makes it totally him. Because the whole thing about Celine is it is a bourgeois brand. It's crazy.
- [22:34]
Grow Curtis
It's.
- [22:34]
Lauren Sherman
It's preppy, it's bougie. And I hope he just like totally goes for that. What are you excited about?
- [22:43]
Grow Curtis
I mean, listen, first of all, like when you work as a stylist or a fashion editor, you always get these in house lookbooks from which you can select the clothes for your shoots. And I remember this was pre Covid when I noticed a huge, huge shift in Polo lookbooks that I've been looking. And you know, mind you, these are lookbooks of like 80 or so pages because there is a lot. And I loved the styling, I loved the pieces. And I remember emailing the PR saying like, wow, like, what's going on? So that was my first kind of contact with Michael's world. And then fast back to Celine. I remember in January I had a little preview with Celine PR team in their HQ and they showed me the collection that basically the studio has been designing and doing. But they said that overall direction and a bit of supervision came from Michael. And what I saw is like a very recognizable Celine silhouette from Eddie, but much more relaxed.
- [23:55]
Lauren Sherman
Yes, totally. That's what I saw also.
- [23:58]
Grow Curtis
Exactly. And I find that to be, as you said, very bougie, very preppy. Because, listen, Eddie Slimond is my og. I adore him. I remember as a teenager, my first. First money from my aunt and uncles. I went to a store and I bought a pair of Dior Homme jeans. He's my God, and I think he needs to go to Armani. But this is another discussion we have to have.
- [24:23]
Lauren Sherman
Yes.
- [24:24]
Grow Curtis
He's so, so similar to Mr. Armani.
- [24:26]
Lauren Sherman
I'm pro. I'm pro that.
- [24:28]
Grow Curtis
Right? He can. He can deal with it.
- [24:31]
Lauren Sherman
Yeah.
- [24:31]
Grow Curtis
I mean, imagine that classic Armani tailoring with Eddie stuck. Amazing. So what I'm trying to say is, like, I love Eddie, but I'm very, very excited about Michael simply because, listen, some of the Eddie's cuts are. Are quite radical. You know, like, I'm. I'm not a big guy, but I'm like, I'm 37, but if I go to Celine's story, it's very difficult for me to find something. And I'm like, I'm between medium and large. So, you know, the cuts are beautiful, but they're very unforgiving. So I'm super excited for kind of like this new era of Celine. I think he's going to stick to the codes, as you mentioned, a little bit from Phoebe, a little bit from Eddie, but also making it very, very Michael. And I think it's exciting to be in fashion right now, even though times are tough. With Matthew, with Jonathan, with Pierre, Paolo, with them now with Michael. I mean, we have so much in store for us.
- [25:35]
Lauren Sherman
It's true. Especially there are three out of five of those things. As a consumer I'm really excited about. There's so much. You should come back in the fall and we'll talk more once we see some of. Some of this stuff materializes. But I. Yeah, I'm really excited. And I also think what Phoebe Filo is doing in very quietly still, but refining what she's working on, I think that has really changed the conversation. She's so directional, and she really does sort of push other designers to do certain things.
- [26:13]
Grow Curtis
And she's a designer's designer. She is the one like what Helmut. What Helmut Lang was back in the 90s, beginning of 2000s, she took the throne. So people are definitely following what she's doing and sometimes imitating, sometimes copying but.
- [26:31]
Lauren Sherman
Yeah, it's out there and sometimes moving it forward. And that is what it is. I'm about to head out to Copenhagen for this conference where I'm interviewing Seb, one of the co founders of. Of Veja. And I am going to wear this Phoebe suit that I got that I have literally worn. I've got it in February during the shows because it's so much cheaper there and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, and it was worth it, blah, blah. It's the only thing I'll buy. Blah, blah, blah, blah. Great excuses. I've worn it for almost every single event that I've done this year. Every dinner, every conference, every stage thing. And it. I feel amazing in it. I love it. It was totally worth it. And the. It's interesting. I'm gonna go to. I'm gonna do some shopping when I'm there and I got a list and I was looking at the. @ MF Pen, which. Do you know this brand?
- [27:26]
Grow Curtis
Yes, of course.
- [27:28]
Lauren Sherman
Such a big fan of it. Yeah, it's this. It's based in. It's a Stanish brand. This guy, he was in the LVMH prize. I re. I went through the LVMH prize and he was like, I think I might be to. He like, it's a decent sized business, but it's really nice. Mostly menswear, but really affordably priced. A lot of dead stock fabric is how he's managed to keep the prices pretty good. But also they have a huge women's collection that I'm gonna. I'm gonna go and shop it there. It's like the pants are €200. It's amazing. But the thing was, when I was looking at it, I was like, oh, this is not. It doesn't look like a Phoebe copy in any way, but it feels very like. I'm not going to buy 15 pairs of Phoebe filet trousers. I have one pair.
- [28:19]
Grow Curtis
Oh, my God.
- [28:20]
Lauren Sherman
Maybe I'll buy another pair in a year and a half or something.
- [28:23]
Grow Curtis
Yeah, the price is insane.
- [28:24]
Lauren Sherman
Yeah. But I can buy a pair too, of the. These trousers he did that are like, of the same idea but not a copy. And I think that's where I think she's. It is an exciting time. It's a really tough time. It's not gonna get easier financially. China is tough, but I think it's exciting what we have in front of us. So the other thing I wanted to chat to you about is I did a piece in Monday's email about the Kardashian family and Their various businesses. I sort of do these check ins with them every six months or so because they have all these different companies. They essentially run a strategic group or a private equity firm with all these different businesses. The focus is very much on skims. But I had heard some stuff in the market about the Kardashians have built many of their businesses with the greeds. Jens and Emma greed and sort of. Are they going to keep working together? They're all very focused on skims. Skims isn't going away. Their partnership in skims is not going away. Going away. They need to land the plane with skims. They need to ipo. You know, they do. They do next year or two and. But you know, will they ever open a business together again? I don't know. But it was an interesting sort of talking to a bunch of people involved and then also people in the sort of financial. The investment community about it. It was just like very interesting look. But thing I keep coming back to is the Kardashians have just. And especially Kim Kardashian, again, have totally blown me away in terms of their ability to develop. It's like one part art project, one part business venture.
- [30:15]
Grow Curtis
Yes.
- [30:15]
Lauren Sherman
And I remember when the Barbara Kruger W magazine. So that was probably 2010 with Kim on the COVID and I thought, yeah, this person is. Yes, this person is not going away. No, like a. I was. Kudos to Stefano and I think that. I think it was du jour did something with her soon after in CR fashion book as well. Like, though Karine, like really were willing to go there with Kim long before Kanye endorsed her or whatever.
- [30:47]
Grow Curtis
Oh, completely.
- [30:49]
Lauren Sherman
The last year I've kind of been like, okay, where does this evolve to? Because skims is such a great business. It needs her, but it doesn't need her. If that makes sense. Like in my mind, so many people I know, she's a very. What is the word? A person who you either love her, you hate her. Polarizing individual. There are many polarizing.
- [31:17]
Grow Curtis
Yes.
- [31:17]
Lauren Sherman
Many people who have no time for Kim Kardashian who. Who wear a lot of skims because it's a great product and they've done a good job managing it. I am just curious, do you think we have finally reached Pete Kardashian or do you think it just will never end because they are so smart about how they evolve things.
- [31:36]
Grow Curtis
Listen, every time in the past 15 or so years when I talk to myself, okay, this is it. They managed to surprise me. I don't think we are seeing an end. I think we're just seeing another reinvention, another transformation coming soon. And it's very interesting because it's easy to hate Kardashians, right? They give you all the reasons easily. But also when you meet them, they're very, very charming. They almost like hypnotically charming. So they have that charisma and that aura around them. And there is like so many of them. And now, I mean, with the kids, like the next generation, it's just coming. I don't think we're seeing an end. I just think we're seeing a potential change. But their ability to surprise always leaves me like gasping for air. So, no, personally, I don't think it's the end.
- [32:44]
Lauren Sherman
I love covering them and following them from a business perspective especially. And so I tend to agree. I do think businesses have ups and downs and it's just that the person is a business this time. So it's an interesting moment and it will be interesting to see when SKIMs, IPOs or if, if they do get bought by someone, they had a very high valuation. So in order to make everybody money who's involved, they're going to have to sell it. They were valued at $4 billion in, in 2023, I believe, or 2022, I think it was 23. So it's an interesting, it's an interesting moment for them. Everybody should check that piece out. Craftsman days are here at Lowe's with big savings on the tools you need. Save $100 on the Craftsman V26 Tool Power Tool Combo Kit now at $199 no matter what the project is. Craftsman's high quality, high performance products empower you to build on. Stop by your nearest Lowe's store and check. Check out the full line of Craftsman tools today, valid through 618 while supplies last selection varies by location. This episode is brought to you by Indeed. When your computer breaks, you don't wait for it to magically start working again. You fix the problem. So why wait to hire the people your company desperately needs? Use Indeed's sponsored jobs to hire top talent fast and even better, you only pay for results. There's no need to wait. Speed up your hiring with a $75 sponsored job credit@ Indeed.com podcast. Terms and conditions apply. So back to icon.
- [34:41]
Grow Curtis
Oh yes, my little baby.
- [34:44]
Lauren Sherman
Your little baby. So let's talk about these covers because these covers were and I'm just so sad I wasn't in town to oh.
- [34:53]
Grow Curtis
We had a fun celebrate.
- [34:55]
Lauren Sherman
It seemed really fun. But you had first of all like the level of photographers you Used it was really felt. I don't know, it was just really high level. And I just thought my favorite one was. Let me see who this cover was shot by. Malik. The Malik cover.
- [35:18]
Grow Curtis
Exactly. Malik. And you know, just the fact that, just the fact that I had John Galliano doing like extensive three full pages interview with Leon Dame as his muse. They talked about first time they met. Then Kim Jones said yes to interviewing Malik and they were talking about Senegal and Tarantino. And then Stefano and Domenico from Dolce Gabbana interviewed Kit Butler. They were talking about Steven Meisel. You know what, like, just to start with, I think like good magazine today or forever should be like a sassy dinner party, you know, where you have guests from all walks of life. You have like a priest and socialite next to each other. So like my, my way of thinking, it's, it's very personal because like I'm almost like a host of this dinner party. So I just wanted to invite people I kind of find iconic and people who represent something. For male models. We don't hear this term muse very often, but Leon Dame and John, Malik and Kim, Kit and Dolce and Gabbana, they're so connected and they work together on so many projects, shows and campaigns. I wanted to celebrate that. But also in the same time, I mean, with my team, I was like lucky enough to have really great people in a magazine, like Etienne Rousseau, who's like one of the best dressed guys in menswear universe, who has one of the most extensive wardrobes, who travels around with helicopter because he is one of the most famous fashion producers in the world. Then we talked about interiors with Ralph Lauren. We talked about Kit McNally about his memoir, then Mike Amiri about his business. So it's about, you know, collecting and connecting these extraordinary men and giving audience not just something to look at, but also like something to read. Emily Wilson did an excellent piece on Sam Lawrence who's like a chef and owner of this hotspot bridges in Chinatown. We did the story on hair transplants in Turkey. April Long did that. Great story. I mean we did a lot. Then there's like Robert De Niro, who is like our only celebrity cover, who talks about new projects and being American stuff guy. There is Emily McDermott with her art profiles on the Refikana doll. So it's a lot. It's a small team of people, but we kind of have same beliefs. And I'm lucky enough to have something that I think it's impossible to get these days. I have freedom. I really Have a Vittorio freedom to do what I believe in. I have publisher and team in HQ in Italy who believes in the product. So it's been very enjoyable experience even though the climate is very tough. I think in these times you can really create something hopefully, hopefully iconic.
- [38:43]
Lauren Sherman
Yeah, I think it's interesting that they wanted to launch in the US and you should really quickly. Icon is published in several different markets, right?
- [38:56]
Grow Curtis
Exactly. So it started in Italy, but there is Spain, there is France and mind you, Italy has 8 to 10 issues a year. Spain has 12 issues a year with El Pais, France is 2 issues per year. For America, we are doing biannual, but ultimate goal would be spring, summer and fall winter. So four issues a year. But that heavily depends on advertising. Only when you see the numbers you can say, okay, let's move forward. But I've been very lucky to receive support from, you know, all the big guys. Prada, Armani, Dolce Gabbana, they all came in with advertising. Even though, you know, times for everyone are really tough and I'm really, really grateful. I think loyalty is the most important thing in fashion. And I think, you know, our industry tends to be, you know, somewhat nasty sometimes. But I think the ultimate luxury is being nice. I think self confidence comes from being nice, from feeling empowered by yourself. So that's my mojo. I always try to be nice. I don't believe in this 90s bitchiness, you know, semi illegal treatment of your employees. I think it's wrong, I think it's weak, you know, I think it shows human weakness. It doesn't manifest strength. Not for me at least.
- [40:36]
Lauren Sherman
I agree. I think that one of the great examples of using a. The being. Yes, of course, being nice and being open is another way to put it. I think if you look, I've noticed this Bottega Veneta campaign that came out last week has just. Which I loved. I thought it was amazing and I've written about it a couple of times. What I would say about the way Bottega has managed since Mattieu was there with Terry, who sort of runs a lot their comms and then their. Well, does run their comms, but also has a lot to do with the marketing side as well. I see that Bottega has invested in a lot of young media brands completely. And look, look at Bottega's numbers.
- [41:28]
Grow Curtis
Oh yes.
- [41:29]
Lauren Sherman
Not to say the big players, they invest in small media, niche media as well. But I would say that you can see that Bottega has made choices that are more daring in terms of the media that they partner with and earlier in the trajectory they've been a first mover. And I think of course it's about two's designs. Of course it's the moment we're living in where people do just want materials based in things that feel like they have substance. But it is also the fact that they are showing up in places that other people aren't. And so I think like the brands you mentioned, some of the brands that have supported you early, I'm sure that the next issue after everyone saw this, I'm sure so many just want to be in on it because it's so beautiful. But I do think taking those risks and putting yourself out there in terms of who do you wanna reach, like really thinking about that and it just as I was looking on your Instagram account before we got on, I noticed the part you did a partnership with Bottega in particular and I thought again, wow, they really like. They get it. And so kudos to that team.
- [42:53]
Grow Curtis
I agree.
- [42:53]
Lauren Sherman
Because it's not easy for anyone. But who had 19% increase in the US last quarter? Bottega Veneta.
- [43:02]
Grow Curtis
So think about it.
- [43:04]
Lauren Sherman
Yeah. So grow. I'm excited for you. When next issue will come out in like November, December or October.
- [43:11]
Grow Curtis
First week. October. We are closing already.
- [43:13]
Lauren Sherman
Cannot wait. Congrats.
- [43:16]
Grow Curtis
Absolutely. Well, we have to celebrate. Next time I see you on the circuit, you have to celebrate.
- [43:21]
Lauren Sherman
I'm going to be. I'm going to be in Paris for a total three days. So if let's just try to hang, I would love to see you and have a drink. We'll talk to you.
- [43:33]
Grow Curtis
Thank you so much for having me.
- [43:34]
Lauren Sherman
Thank you for being here and congrats again.
- [43:37]
Grow Curtis
Thank you. Thank you. Bye Bye.
- [43:40]
Lauren Sherman
Fashion People is a presentation of Odyssey in partnership with Puck. This show was produced and edited by Molly Nugent. Special thanks to our executive producers, Puck co founder John Kelly, executive editor Ben Land and director of editorial operations, Gabby Grossman. An additional thanks to the team at Odyssey, JD Crowley, Jenna Weiss Berman and Bob Tabador.