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- [00:01]
A
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- [01:03]
C
Hello and welcome to Fashion People. I'm Lauren Sherman, writer of Buck's Fashion and Beauty Memo Line Sheet, and today with me on the show is Chris Black, podcaster, writer and founder of new clothing line Hanover. We discussed last week's Chanel show, Dario Vitale's alster from Versace, and why Chris would ever want to do such a crazy thing and start a fashion brand.
- [01:29]
Happy Monday everyone. Coming at you early because I recorded early. As you will hear later on in the episode, it's a very fun week in New York and now I am back in Los Angeles. I am recording this before Marissa Meltzer's party on Saturday in New York, but I'm sure I had a great time. I think I'm gonna wear this red vintage like 80s ish blazer that I got in San Francisco a couple weeks ago. The police come. Wouldn't that be funny if the police showed up? Maybe not, but I don't know. I think it would be kind of funny. Anyway, let's just hope it's not on page six on Monday. In other news, today's line sheet unveils more details on the exit of Dario Vitale at Versace. I also have a little ditty on Romy Mars. I have a Saks Global update and plenty more. Enjoy this convo with Chris. We are very happy for him and buy something from his life.
- [02:30]
Chris Black, welcome back to Fashion People.
- [02:33]
D
Oh, I'm happy to be here. Lauren. It sounds like you've been podcasting as much as I have. You're losing your voice a little bit. Partying.
- [02:40]
C
It was. It was worse yesterday.
- [02:42]
D
Really I feel okay. So you've been, you've been out on the town, you've been chatting.
- [02:46]
C
If, if you want to stay out on the town, meaning like still going to bed at 10:30, but going out to dinner with people, sure, that counts.
- [02:54]
D
That's technically out on the town.
- [02:56]
C
Unfortunately, I have to stay out past 10 tonight because your launch party for your brand is at 10pm Chris, you're a 43 year old man.
- [03:08]
D
I think that as a, as a person and as a brand, I. I really appreciate a real party. I think we've lost. I think we've lost the zest for life when everything is from six to. With like past snacks.
- [03:24]
C
I was going to suggest five to seven.
- [03:26]
D
No, I want. I mean, look, I don't say I pass 10 normally, but this is an encouragement for people. Maybe you get a babysitter, maybe you get a bag of cocaine. Whatever you're interested in, we offer. We're offering a very serious bar. You know, there's a.
- [03:38]
C
Where playing. Where is the party?
- [03:40]
D
It's at Tiwa. Oh yeah, yeah, the gallery in Tribeca.
- [03:44]
C
Very nice, very chic. It's going to be super crowded.
- [03:48]
D
I hope so. That's kind of the whole point that I'm excited.
- [03:52]
C
I wish, I wish we were able to record this after. But you're going to Tokyo next week. Is that, is that a known thing? If this will be published on Monday.
- [04:00]
D
No, I'm going to Tokyo. So we have the party tonight and then Saturday is open for like shopping, like where you can come like shop the collection. And then Sunday morning I go to Tokyo for the first time alone. So I'm very. I'm not taking.
- [04:15]
C
Are you going there for some pressure?
- [04:17]
D
No, I'm just going. I'm just going. I've never been. I'm not taking anyone's lists. I'm kind of going. I'm letting go and letting God on this one.
- [04:26]
C
You don't want Dan Fromer's list.
- [04:28]
D
Dan Fromer's list would probably be too thorough for me. I mean, David Marks. I'm gonna hang with David. Mike Nouveau is there. My friend Brooks that worked on him. There's people there, so I'll be fine. But I'm just.
- [04:40]
C
You're. You're gonna have a great time. This is. It's funny that you. So are you gonna work on anything else? You're not gonna work while you're there? You're just gonna hang out?
- [04:48]
D
No, I'm gonna work. Of course, yeah. I mean, I have to. I record how long Gone no matter what. So I have to get up. If I have to get up at 5:00am, I think, yeah, at least twice while I'm there, which is fine. I'll be up anyway.
- [04:58]
C
I can't believe you've never been there.
- [05:01]
D
I can't either. It's, I would say embarrassing is the word I would use. I always thought like a brand would invite me and they never did. And now it's like, okay, it's time to go.
- [05:10]
C
I assumed some hotel had invited you.
- [05:12]
D
Oh, for this? Yes. That's what's happening. Yes, for sure. But there's no other person going. Like, it's not. Yeah, I'm like, I'm going to go.
- [05:18]
C
Are you going to have to write about the hotel, though?
- [05:21]
D
I'm going to write about the whole experience. Because I, I honestly think it's crazy to have not been to Japan after.
- [05:27]
C
I mean, I'm not crazy. I'm not like your demographic, like, has been to Japan at least 15 times.
- [05:33]
D
I'm not a Japan. Like, I'm not a crazy worshiper. Like, I'm not like obsessed with it the way some people are, but I do appreciate the attention to detail and how that they sort of outdo everyone at their own game. I think that's a very interesting, like, layer of the whole thing.
- [05:49]
C
Yes. When I had David, I haven't listened to him on your podcast, but when I had him on mine, he kind of scolded me when I said that and said, you know, that's only a very small group of upper middle class people who act like that. But like the, the, the grand appropriation or whatever.
- [06:09]
D
But I don't, I, that's the thing. I don't even consider that appropriate. Like, if you put that much time and effort into learning how to make pizza or learning how to make a cortado or whatever. To me, I just respect the effort and the time put in. I don't think of it as anything, anything negative.
- [06:22]
C
No, I mean, you could use the word appropriation positively.
- [06:26]
D
I don't think you can. In 2025, I think, I think if technically the definition might be able to be used that way, but I don't think we're allowed.
- [06:34]
C
Okay, so you are here, ostensibly, as we would say in Puck, to talk about Hanover. And we're going to do that. First of all, let's just say it's hanoverusa.com hanover-usa.com hanover- USA.com Are you a little nervous about the SEO? Because when I googled it, it's going to take a minute.
- [06:57]
D
That's. I mean, look, I think that, sure, it's like, annoying, but also, that's not my department. And second of all, I think that the. I think people are pretty savvy these days and know how to find it, if you know. But obviously you want to be number one. I don't know if we'll ever be number one, but, yeah, we'll do our best.
- [07:13]
C
Okay. We'll talk more about how you came up with the name and stuff shortly. I want to go through a couple of news items. One little thing about this URL, I just want to. I said this on my Friday podcast also, I just want to once again say to the New York Times they need to link to people's websites if you're writing, if you're writing about them. Because let me just say this. They own an entire business that's based on affiliate marketing. Do not act like this is an ethical thing. They could, they could have linked to your site and I'm very annoyed about it. That's just my one comment.
- [07:49]
D
No, no, no. I mean, I think that obviously is annoying. I also think it's just kind of funny. I, I don't, I don't. I, I. Forcing people to take one extra step to do something I feel like is obviously you want a seamless experience, but I also think it's kind of funny to make anything a little bit harder for people because our lives are so easy now.
- [08:08]
C
Yeah. Speaking of difficult, it was very, very hard to get down to the subway.
- [08:15]
D
To see the Chanel show physically. Like, you mean. What was the issue?
- [08:20]
C
Well, because so what I realized is Tom Ford did a subway show and it was in the same. It's like an unused Ziplori. And I'm sure other people have done events there and things, but it just takes a long time because you have a, you need. They needed to check our IDs. And then B, there's just not that many people that walk down subway steps. So, like, it just took a bit. It was. I'm not complaining. I just needed a segue. It was worth it once I got down there, but. And also, it didn't take that long cause I arrived on time when they told me to.
- [08:55]
D
And who is the last person did they hold it for? Anyone was Sofia Coppola. Cd.
- [08:59]
C
You know, I don't know if Sofia Copolo was at my show. She may have been at the second show because there was a 3pm and a 7pm like a dollar AP Rocky and Margaret Qualley came To both. But not. Not every celebrity did. I did.
- [09:14]
D
Look, if they're paying me that much, I'll be at both, too. That's not. That's not a problem. That's not a problem.
- [09:18]
C
Exactly. What did you think of the show from your perch?
- [09:23]
D
I mean, I think a, you know, 3, 500 I love New York shirt is funny and cool. Like, I don't. I don't think.
- [09:29]
C
Awesome.
- [09:29]
D
It's like, I think the subway thing is cool. I don't know what people are so upset about with that. It's like the people at this show have never even taken this. It's like, dude, relax. It's like a New York. It's an iconic New York thing. Obviously. It's. I'm just like, there were. There's human on the floor. It's like, dude, shut up. Like, relax. It's like this is a fantasy. This whole thing is. Is not serious. It's like, this is a backdrop. This is something people recognize. The clothes are always Chanel. I don't really. I'm not super invested either way, but I think that, like, it's cool to do something like. Also, I think that there was a point where brands like that would try to do the most far flung thing possible. And I thought. I think that is so weird. And I think doing something in New York downtown is always going to be cool and more accessible and more interesting to me.
- [10:17]
C
I thought it was fabulous. I mean, the clothes have just so you know, Chris changed a lot in the last two seasons because of the two last.
- [10:26]
D
But people seem to like him.
- [10:27]
C
He's amazing.
- [10:29]
D
But. But do you think this is a situation where people want it to be good? So it is.
- [10:32]
C
No.
- [10:33]
D
Okay.
- [10:33]
C
No, I really don't. Look.
- [10:36]
I am not. I do. I can get a little fawning if I really like something because I hate everything. But I truly, really don't like most stuff and find a lot of problems. And his first show I thought was great. And I thought this show was fabulous. There were a lot of. There was a lot of criticism online and I addressed it on Thursday. Kind of follow up to my, to my report. But there was criticism that it didn't, like, have a theme. This isn't. This isn't supposed to be like a concept show. It's about the metier, whatever. Like, it's about the fabric and materials. And he just decided to make a bunch of fabulous stuff that showed that off. And he's cool. And I think he's making the thing that he's doing that I wrote about and a lot of other people have. He's putting Chanel in the fashion conversation. Chanel used to just be this thing where you went to these crazy ass shows with the grocery cart and it was super fun. But, like, do I remember any look ever?
- [11:38]
D
No.
- [11:38]
C
Do I remember a look from the Egyptian show that I went to at the Met? No. Like, do I remember any of the looks of any of the shows I ever went to? No. But he is making it so that Zara's gonna knock shit off. There is gonna be other people copying him on the Runway. I bought my first Chanel jacket two weeks ago at Re See because I was like, this is gonna look. I'll look cool because I have the hair of the models. And now like a Chanel girl.
- [12:08]
D
We all want to look like Chanel girls. But I think that the, I do think the, the theme conversation themes are awful in every realm of our life. I don't know why any woman want that. Like, why don't you let somebody just do their thing? That's always going to be more interesting to me. And maybe it's bad and maybe it's good, but at least it's not unnecessarily constrained for no reason.
- [12:29]
C
Yeah. And I think people are. Are just trying to pick it apart because it is so fun and great and joyful and all of that stuff that no fashion is. I said this to a friend of mine who I was messaging with who's really in the industry, and I said, I am just so sick of like, going to a show and having to, like, think about it.
- [12:51]
D
Yeah, sure.
- [12:52]
C
Like, it's my job, but at the same time, I want to just enjoy it. And there are very few shows that I like. When a show has, like, a lot of interesting ideas and you can see that and you're still entertained by it. But a lot of shows are just. They're joyless. They don't have any. There's no fun and there's no. It's not exciting. And I think what he's doing is making it really fun and exciting in this way that is very real to our generation and all that stuff. Like in, in the piece that I wrote, I went to the after party, which was amazing because it was mostly private clients. And I talked to some of them and got some, like, color about how they're feeling about it. And I think they are all like, it's new and it's so much cooler than it used to be. But I also. They want to be. They want to get in it. And do it.
- [13:44]
D
Like you're saying. You're saying. It's not turning off those people. It's making them excited, too.
- [13:48]
C
It's not. I'm sure there are some that are like, I want my old lady clothes still. And I'm sure they provide those.
- [13:55]
D
I was about to say you can still get those. That's the. That's the thing.
- [13:58]
C
But I think I left the party at, like, 9:30 because I was tired. And. And also I was like, I don't. I'm not going to drink at this part. Like, I'm not going to party at this party. I just need to leave. But Mattu is walking up with some other dude, and he just, like, is walking up, trying to get in. There was no. Like, he didn't have an entourage. He didn't have a PR person with him. He's just a guy. And I think that's the interesting thing. You can't be.
- [14:23]
Like, a silly diva celebrity fashion designer anymore. Like, it's not. There's just no who.
- [14:31]
D
That's both positive and negative, I would say, only for the spectacle of it all is always so entertaining.
- [14:37]
C
True.
- [14:37]
D
And I mean, like, I. I think, like, you know, throwing a phone at somebody or whatever is wrong, but I think it is also entertaining, especially if the. The clothes are good. You know what I mean? Then you earn that right. But, you know, I was saying this.
- [14:52]
I was in Chicago on Tuesday to see the Snow Cap show, and I was talking about Olivia Dean, the. The singer. And Jake Linderman had not heard of her. And I played it, and everyone in the room was like, I saw her in snl and it was so nice because she was having fun. She looked like she was having fun. And I think it's a very similar thing where it's like, you. The music. I really love that song. I think it's a smash. But then when you see her do it and you see the joy, you're like, oh, I'm sold. I'm 100% sold. And this sounds like a very similar situation.
- [15:21]
C
Yes, I agree. I think there is something about. We think too much about everything, and we. You need to just have fun. And there are ideas. He's doing stuff with ideas and all that. But, like, it just is a little more. It. It feels less like homework.
- [15:37]
D
Well, it's like hiding. It's like hiding the. You know, like hiding the spinach in something, you know, but, like, it's. It's. If you have fun and people are there that. I mean, that's why I'm having a party for Hanover. It's like, because I think people should have fun at whatever you're doing. And that's really the point, because it is a social gathering, you know. I agree.
- [15:58]
C
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- [17:09]
Did you see this thing about.
- [17:12]
Versace.
- [17:15]
And, and Dario Vitali getting, like, fully fired after one collection because he used to work for Mucha Prada?
- [17:23]
D
And.
- [17:25]
Look, I think that. I think that guy is good. And those clothes were cool. But also, this is the pettiness I want. It's the same thing. It's like, this is, like, good. This is called power and, and, and using your power. And I think that's like, unfortunately, he's the victim of that. And he was good. He was probably only going to get better. But, like, this is. This is more interesting than designers getting new jobs all the time. You know what I'm saying? It's like, it's. But there's some downsides, I guess.
- [17:52]
C
Well, look, it's going to be a great, great story someday. It's already a good story. I've already gotten one story out of it Monday in Monday's line sheet. First of all, you're totally right that, like, from my reporting, this is what he was told was gonna happen if he took this job. Cause, you know, he used to work in Muumu.
- [18:12]
D
Yeah.
- [18:12]
C
He went to say, I'm leaving. And they said, we're buying this company if you take that job. We're gonna fire you. And that is what happened. So he took the risk. Everyone at the company took the risk. It was really fabulous and fun. I need to figure out if they're going to sell the collection. I think they already did. So that's over, and they're going to have to sell it. The campaign looked incredible. It was, like, the best campaign of the season. Everything. Like, I think you're 100% right that, like.
- [18:41]
They did what they said they were going to do. And there's something sort of fabulous and exciting about that. And. And. But also, yeah, do I think he's going to land on his feet? This guy's fucking good.
- [18:52]
D
Yeah, he'll be fine.
- [18:53]
C
He's going to get a job. I don't know where, because there, like, really aren't any. Maybe whoever gets his job, he can take their job, which could happen. And if it's the person that, like, a lot of people think it might be, then I could see that happening. But, yes, it's not like, Sabado Desarno, God bless. But, like, is not going to get a big creative director job again, whereas this guy is, like, he's the real deal. And the other crazy thing was, you know, I do these. Have you ever done these backstage interviews at fashion shows? I assume not.
- [19:23]
D
No. No.
- [19:24]
C
It's like, the worst. It's the worst.
- [19:27]
D
Fashion most closely resembles sports to me, those settings.
- [19:31]
C
Yeah, it's true. And in that way, it's kind of fun. Like, I love going backstage at Prada because Much and Raph are there, and they are sort of kind of going back and forth and battling a little bit and also talking about the collection. It's really exciting, but it's also scary because there are millions of people, and I'm constantly worried that, like, someone's gonna fall on her and kill her. Like, it's, like, really crazy.
- [19:55]
But I would say, like, backstage. I waited to do the backstage. It was really calm, but, like, probably 25 people did it. He was amazing. Like, usually the designer, there are very few. Like, I love going back. Mattu is really good. Raph and Much are really good. Demna's good. Like, there are a few designers who are really great at it.
- [20:18]
D
Most of them, I mean, that.
- [20:20]
C
It's super tough.
- [20:22]
D
That's. Yeah. I mean, that's a part of the job that I think most people are the least interested in at that level.
- [20:28]
C
But he was amazing. And I was like, this guy, I think he has it. I hope he gets a great job, and I wish him the Best. And I also wish the product group the best and all the people at Versace the best.
- [20:38]
D
Well, it's kind of a, it's a classic you with the bull and you got the horns situation.
- [20:43]
C
Yes.
- [20:44]
D
Which I think is. We've seen this play out many, many times. It's not an unheard of thing.
- [20:50]
C
It, it was, it was exciting, though.
- [20:52]
D
Yeah.
- [20:53]
C
I, I, when someone at the company was like, a memo just went out. I was like.
- [21:02]
D
Did you see the actual memo?
- [21:04]
C
I did, yeah. It's not anything to write home about, but I was just like, this is, I mean, this is my favorite time of the year.
- [21:15]
D
Sure.
- [21:16]
C
I was annoyed that I had got up at 5am to write Thursday's column and then we scrapped it. I'll use it another time. But.
- [21:26]
It was a fun day, that's for sure. And I'm excited. And everyone should check out my further reporting and coverage. You can't get anywhere else on Monday.
- [21:33]
D
You can't get it anywhere else.
- [21:35]
C
You know what I did, though, that I, I had to reschedule with you to come see Hanover. But the good thing was the timing. I, I canceled everything else yesterday except to go see your collection. And that was completely like, I, it gave me a time limit of how much I could write for Versace because I was like, I have to get to Chris. And I actually, actually got. They're a half an hour early by.
- [22:00]
D
Accident because, you know, I needed, I needed that. So. Thank you.
- [22:04]
C
So tell me, why did you want to do a fashion brand, Chris?
- [22:08]
D
I mean, I, it's sort of, I mean, honestly, it found me to some extent. Like, I think I, I, you know, if, if you're in this business at all, you think about this all the time and then you talk to people that do it and they discourage you from doing it because it's a nightmare. It's, you know, hard to make money, blah, blah, blah. But I think once I honed in on the price point situation and how important that was to me and, and I think what that could lead to, I got really excited about it and that's what kind of kept the, the fire burning.
- [22:37]
C
So tell us about that. It's all made in America, but it's also all under 300, which I don't understand how that's possible. So maybe you could talk about a why under 300 for this stuff? I assume if you're gonna do knits and stuff, it'll be more.
- [22:49]
D
It'll go up eventually. I mean, I think under 300 was completely arbitrary. That's just where we landed. You know what I mean? That wasn't like, a number or a goal we set. The USA thing is partly because our production partner is in LA and, like, they know how to do it, and, like, they are willing to do the work of going to five different places to get one pair of jeans done or whatever. You know what I mean? So it's like, I think part of it was the access to that. And I. I think that the maiden USA was also sort of like, I always wanted to do that, but then when it really started taking shape, it was like, oh, we. We can actually do this, like, based on what the product we're making and what. What you want to continue to do. It's like making 100 cotton T shirts and, you know, jeans with Cone Mills denim is not rocket science. It's just, like, there's a way to make it look good and feel good. That takes time.
- [23:37]
C
Yeah. So, like, as a person, that as an arbiter of taste, someone would say.
- [23:45]
D
Somebody.
- [23:46]
C
I wouldn't say it, but. No. Here's the thing about you.
- [23:50]
D
Oh, great.
- [23:53]
C
You have a very. And I thought that Max Berlinger did a great job in the Time story saying this. And you also are quoted saying it. You have a very clear idea of what you like and what you don't. And I come to you for advice a lot. Like, not just for Dan. I'll be like, do you think that, like, remember when I wanted to buy. You probably don't remember this, but I bought a Virgil sweatshirt. I don't remember that sweatshirt that I was gonna wear with my Celine pants. This is, like, 2017.
- [24:22]
D
What did I say?
- [24:24]
C
You approved it, but I ended up not keeping it. I did send it back. It was like a. Do you remember his, like, Working girl sweatshirt?
- [24:32]
D
Yeah, yeah, of course. Look.
- [24:35]
C
But you're the only person who I trust to tell me the truth about stuff like that. Cause, like, I trust that you do actually know what's cool and what, like, certain people will look dorky in or will look cool in, and you just have, like, a very clear sense of what's appropriate, if that makes sense.
- [24:55]
D
I'd like to think so. I mean, I think that's the whole reason to make this. I don't. I'm not like, a fashion designer. I don't. You know what I mean? Like, that's not what I consider myself. I don't. I. I barely consider myself, you know, whatever, Chief Creative officer, whatever my title is on paper, you know, but it's like, it's More just like, can I do it? Like, can I do it? Can I make a T shirt that I want to wear and guys in Dallas want to wear and my peers want to wear and make it the right price and make it in this country and make. Make. Make the color great and make the hand feel great. Like, can I do it?
- [25:28]
C
So how did. Why is your T shirt better?
- [25:32]
D
I mean, it's not. That's the thing. It's like. It's a. It's a preference. Like, all that is.
- [25:37]
C
But what is your preference? Like, what is good?
- [25:39]
D
I don't want. I don't like all that. Boxy is stupid. The little, thin, tight necks are stupid. Anything. I mean, James purse, the fabric is amazing. This is getting up to 300 for a T shirt. I. I think it's like, there's got to be a decent weight to it, and there's got to be a decent length to it. Those are the two things. Because I think that in. In if you're wearing a T shirt the way I do, and I buy so many vintage T shirts that I've learned this from that practice, basically, is like, if you want to tuck it in sometimes, if you want to wear it out sometime, you know, there's certain things that, like, are you going to wear it under an oxford shirt? Are you going to wear it? You know, whatever. But I think that we've just. There's. There's. It's too. It's all too fussy. You know what I mean? It's all too fussy. It's a little bit like, I don't need you to talk to me about the details of your neckline. It's like, does this look good? Do I like it? Do I want to buy it? It's very simple.
- [26:31]
C
The word fussy, I feel like I use a lot about food about. And it's the same thing with this Runway stuff. Everything is too fussy right now, and you need to just clear it out and do things that, like, look good and people want to wear.
- [26:47]
D
Yeah.
- [26:47]
C
And so the. With the jeans, though.
- [26:52]
Like, what did you do? Because you can't. I mean, you can just, like, take a pair of vintage jeans. But was it, like, a particular pair? Like, how did you figure out the fit of the jeans?
- [27:01]
D
I mean, I think that. That the globally men can agree that, like, the 501 is the best gene, or maybe the 505, depending on your flavor.
- [27:09]
C
Five. Yeah.
- [27:10]
D
You know, and those two. I mean, I have, you know, 50 pairs of those jeans that I bought you know, over the years. And I think there's a particular pair that I got at this store called Broadway and Sons in Stockholm, which is like, for my money, the best vintage jeans in the world. It's unbelievable. It's like a family owned. The dad started it like 50 years ago. It's really cool.
- [27:32]
And that pair, I've like, never gotten more compliments on anything in my life. And I wanted to do those stuck in my mind, but I knew they needed to be a little bit different because I think the thing with vintage jeans is that as much as you love the pair that you love, they never fit exactly right because they're old. Do you know what I mean? Like, there's something off, there's something here. You have to have it tailored. And the tailoring might it up a little bit. And I think because I've been wearing these Hanover jeans, the black ones, for the last couple weeks, and I'm like, oh, yeah, there's. It's different to wear new jeans. Like, it's different. It feels different. They fit a little bit better. Like they sit in the right place. You know, it's a slightly different thing when you're the first wearer, but I think this is Simply like a 501 with a little bit wider leg opening. And we made all the, we made all the buttons, we made all the rivets, and like, it's all, you know, it's as. As. It's as detailed as it needs to be, I think. But I was really. We did this like, suede patch on the back that I really love. It's like an embossed way patch that, like, the belt can go under. But yeah, I mean, I. I just think that, like, when I started really buying, like, cool jeans in the early 2000s, APC jeans were like 100 bucks. Like 120 bucks, you know, for like the raw. And those were the jeans. Like, that was it. You had to have those. But I. I think I also live through the denim wall trend, you know, the seven for all mankind paper, denim cloth, rockin Republic era. But I just think jeans, especially for men are just like, that's what I wear every single day. And I think there's a lot of guys that feel that way.
- [29:08]
C
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- [31:37]
So you mentioned the Dallas thing. How important is it to you that like normal guys wear this? Because I think that the thing that I liked about it, I bought. I bought two things. I believe Dan also bought a couple.
- [31:50]
D
Wow, look at the whole family. I love this. This is support I need.
- [31:52]
C
I got a red T shirt. I got a red T shirt, obviously. And then I got the New York vision or whatever.
- [31:58]
D
Yeah, yeah. Visualize New York.
- [32:00]
C
Visualize New York. Yeah, I thought that was funny. And I think Dan maybe bought button downs. Button downs, not button ups. I noticed. Very particular.
- [32:12]
But like, this is, I thought it was, it would look cool, but like it's not going to intimidate guys who aren't cool. It just seems like normal guy clothes.
- [32:22]
D
But that, that was the entire Point. I mean, I think, like, our strategy is a little bit like, I want to go to Charleston and do a dinner with Brooks at one of his restaurants. I want to go to Austin and do something and buy George. I want to go to la. I. I want to do it in these. All these places. Because I think that's like, a lot of these cities are underserved in a way, and I also think that it is. I just really want it to be democratic. I. I just think that things have gotten too expensive and men have given. Been given too much, sort of.
- [32:54]
Like too much license to experiment to a point where it's like fashion has become like an identity for someone and that should just never be the case.
- [33:04]
C
Or. Or they wear Vori all day long.
- [33:08]
D
Yeah, yeah. I mean that obviously. I just mean, like, in New York, it's guys that have made buying expensive clothes their personality and they think that's interesting. And then in other places, I'm wearing vori head to toe and swishing, you know, to sweet green. It's like. I agree. It's. It's od.
- [33:23]
C
I don't think they're going to sweet green anymore.
- [33:25]
D
See the protein, they might want the protein. That's what I'm only talking about, the new protein.
- [33:30]
C
Have you had the protein meal? Cuz.
- [33:32]
D
No. Cuz I don't eat meat, so I don't. It doesn't.
- [33:34]
C
Doesn't it have like 100 grams of protein or so? It kind of.
- [33:37]
D
It's insane. It's insane.
- [33:39]
C
Kind of scares me.
- [33:39]
D
Yeah, it scares me too.
- [33:40]
C
Are you. You're. I feel like when Jason came on, we talked about the pro. You're not trying to get like 150 grams of protein or whatever. Right.
- [33:48]
D
I just don't think that, like, as vain as. As we all are, me included, and as obsessed with working out as I am, I think that, like, diet stuff is a very slippery slope. And, like, I'll. I'll be like, I'll do what I'm supposed to do within reason, and I'll live to see another day. Like, I'm not going to fudgeing count macros and have an app. I have to go out to eat too much. Like, my. Like, basically, if you really want to lock in on a certain level, you have to stop having fun completely. And I'm. I've already done that with drugs and alcohol.
- [34:19]
C
Yeah. And also, it's much more fun to be an exercise anorexic.
- [34:24]
D
Yeah, for sure. I mean, also, I think working out makes me feel good eating Sometimes makes me feel good, too. You know what I mean? It's like. It's part of the whole thing.
- [34:33]
C
I agree.
- [34:35]
I'm trying to think if there was anything else. Oh, how were sales the first day?
- [34:40]
D
Very good. Yeah. Very, very good.
- [34:42]
C
Were you surprised? Was it. Or have you. Are. Do you have Shopify turned on so you can see every sale come through?
- [34:50]
D
No, no, I was like. They were looking at yesterday. I was like, don't show me that. I don't care. Just tell me tomorrow. It's not. I mean, I think it's, you know what's great, you know, it is a good feeling. And I feel like I'm like this or I hope that I'm like this. Is that a lot of it is from people I know. You know? Like, a lot of it is people I know. Like, I'm offering, you know, and there's, you know, people that are, like, high profile, that are texting me about it, and I'm like, oh, let me send you something. No, I'll buy it. Like, I'm not. Don't send it to me. I'll buy it. And I think it's so nice.
- [35:16]
C
It's kind of like entire world in that way where. I mean, I. As you know, I don't take gifts anyway. But, like, I bought tons of stuff from there all the time because it was, like, not. It was pretty cheap.
- [35:28]
D
Yeah.
- [35:28]
C
So it was like, yeah, of course. I'll try this weird sweatshirt that Scott made or. Or this top that. I'm the only person that's gonna buy this and he's gonna have to drop it. But, like, it was. Because everything was, like, pretty affordable. So it's nice that you started that way.
- [35:45]
D
I think the sales. The sales are good. And what's really interesting is the jeans are number one.
- [35:49]
C
Oh, wow.
- [35:50]
D
Which is like a. I was, like, a little bit surprised by. But I guess that, like, that is something that people are always looking for. And I guess if it. If the price point is right, you're willing to try, you know, you're willing to try it.
- [36:03]
C
I feel like all the. You know, I work with, like, 15 straight men.
- [36:08]
D
Yeah.
- [36:08]
C
Who between the age of 30 and 50, they all should buy them. They're really good.
- [36:13]
D
We'll come. We'll do a trunk show at Puck.
- [36:16]
C
I kind of think you should. It's like, I was like, oh, this would work for most of them. Yeah, a couple of them. It's a little too preppy, but I think for most of them, it will. It'll. It'll really. I mean, the T shirts will still work, but like the jeans, I think that it. Across the board is going to be good. It's going to. It's like an everyman jean, which is. It's not too skinny, not too straight, not plead it, not fancy. I feel like it's going to be really good.
- [36:45]
D
I just the, the way that people embellish jeans is so crazy to me. And it's just like the, the reason this garment has existed in popular culture for as long as it has is because of its simplicity. And once you start doing wild to it, it just sort of loses the form to me.
- [37:00]
C
Yeah. Final thing that we forgot to talk about before Hanover. First of all, Chris, I'm so proud of you. Congrats.
- [37:06]
D
Thank you.
- [37:07]
C
It looks good. I'm so glad it doesn't look bad cuz then it would be so awkward.
- [37:11]
D
I. Yeah, you're telling me. I mean, look, I'. The, the bad feedback is out there somewhere, but luckily it's not coming to my inbox or into my ears.
- [37:18]
C
You know, no one has said anything to me about it.
- [37:21]
D
I'm shocked. But that's great. But that would be more about them. They're. They're feeling about me, not necessarily the clothing, but still.
- [37:28]
C
But still, I'm shocked. You think that someone would be like.
- [37:33]
D
No, I'll take it. That's great. That's a good feeling.
- [37:35]
C
So. Hanover-usa.com check it out. You won't be able to crash the party because the party already happened on Friday.
- [37:44]
D
Yeah.
- [37:45]
C
Pre recording.
- [37:46]
D
Yes.
- [37:47]
C
Okay, final question. Have you seen this weird Justin Bieber merch brand that is like, I got. You should go see in Tokyo because they're doing. It's called Skylark.
- [37:58]
D
Oh, I'm, I'm very familiar. A guy I know is like his partner in it. So I've been familiar with it from.
- [38:02]
C
Can you please tell me what it is? And like, I. There was a GQ article that didn't really say anything and I was like.
- [38:09]
D
I'm not going to say that I understand what it is necessarily, but a lot of it is interesting because it's like they're doing like EVA footwear because that is like. Because one of the partners like has a factory. So it's very easy to make that stuff in the US with like a molded sandal or whatever, like a Yeezy slide or something. But I mean, to me it just looks like, it just looks like a very certain cut of simple stuff that him and his friends wear. It's. I Mean, the thing is, when you're a Justin Bieber, you can sell anything, anytime. And it's like, it gives your friends jobs, and it's like a reason to go to Tokyo and, like, your wife has this huge brand and she'll wear it, and then, you know, it's just so easy to do it and have it work. From a financial perspective, it's a little bit like, even if your interest is passing or fleeting, like, why not? Like, I know that's a. Maybe a bad attitude, but, like, I think that's the power of being that famous. Is that anything you want to try, you can try it, and most of the time, it'll be successful financially.
- [39:08]
C
Yeah. And look, this is America. All we care about is making money.
- [39:11]
D
100. But I mean, it's just like, I. I think that Justin Bieber, like, I don't know, it's. It's like these. You know, there's influencers that do the same thing, and they're. They're not. They haven't been around this long or, you know, Justin Bieber is known for his style. You know, whether you like it or not. That's something people talk about, I think. I think it's. It's hotly debated in a way that a lot of men aren't. I would say.
- [39:34]
C
Like, I think I don't think about it ever.
- [39:36]
D
I mean, I wish I didn't, but I have to, because I see it. You know what I mean? But it's like, it's. People talk about him or, you know, because he'll wear a beanie weird. Or he'll, you know, he'll do something that people want to talk about, whether it's good or bad. It's. He's doing something, like, weird that is his own.
- [39:50]
C
Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Well, on that note, Chris, thank you for being here. Congrats again. And I'll see you later.
- [39:57]
D
Yeah, I'll see you later. Thank you for having me.
- [40:00]
C
Fashion People is a presentation of Odyssey in partnership with Puck. This show was produced and edited by Molly Nugent. Special thanks to our executive producers, Puck co founder John Kelly, executive editor Ben Landy, and director of editorial operations, Gabby Grossman. An additional thanks to the team at Odyssey, JD Crowley, Jenna Weiss Berman, and Bob Tabador.
- [40:26]
E
Take the next 30 seconds to invest in yourself with Vanguard. Breathe in. Center your mind. Recognize the power you have to direct your financial future. Feel the freedom that comes with reaching your goals and building a life you love. Vanguard brings you this meditation because we invest where it matters most in you. Visit vanguard.com investinginyou to learn more. All investing is subject to risk.