Sweatpants (Are Not) Forever

Summary

Fashion People Episode Summary: "Sweatpants (Are Not) Forever"

Release Date: May 20, 2025
Host: Lauren Sherman
Guest: Designer Scott Sternberg

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Introduction

In this engaging episode of Fashion People, host Lauren Sherman dives deep into the latest happenings in the fashion industry alongside her guest, renowned menswear designer Scott Sternberg. The conversation spans significant industry shifts, including high-profile appointments, brand strategies, red carpet fashion, and the evolving landscape of menswear.

Pierpaolo Piccioli's Appointment at Balenciaga

The episode kicks off with the major announcement that Pierpaolo Piccioli has been named the new Creative Director of Balenciaga. This transition marks a significant shift in the brand's direction.

Lauren Sherman ([06:21]):
"Pierre Paolo Piccioli is the new creative director of Balenciaga. This decision was made in the last couple of months and wasn't something that happened prior to Demna being announced at Gucci."

Scott Sternberg ([06:21]):
"I think he's wonderful. He has great taste and a clear point of view. His work at Valentino was especially laser-sharp after Maria Grazia left."
07:23

Scott praises Piccioli's capabilities but expresses concerns about the simultaneous leadership changes across major fashion houses, suggesting it creates a sense of vulnerability within these global brands.

Scott Sternberg ([07:23]):
"The overall effect of all this movement at the same time... makes them all feel very vulnerable and too similar."
07:23

Lauren counters by highlighting Piccioli's strengths and the potential loyalty of his existing clientele from Valentino transitioning to Balenciaga.

Lauren Sherman ([12:57]):
"I think his clientele will come with him from Valentino. Even if they are still buying Valentino, sure, they will come to Balenciaga."

However, Scott remains cautious about the broader implications for the fashion industry, pondering whether these changes signify a cyclical correction or the beginning of an industry decline.

Burberry's Strategy and Challenges

The discussion transitions to Burberry, focusing on the company's collaboration with Highgrove Estate and the performance of their iconic trench coats.

Lauren Sherman ([20:03]):
"The collection is really beautiful... but having everyone in Burberry feels overplayed. What do you think Burberry should do moving forward?"

Scott Sternberg ([20:03]):
"Burberry has franchises other houses would envy, but infusing them with energy and making them culturally relevant is tough. Their house check feels overplayed, and the pricing of their trench coats is a barrier."
22:27

Scott critiques Burberry’s merchandising strategy, emphasizing the need for innovation in their iconic pieces to maintain relevance and appeal. He suggests that Burberry should reinterpret their classics in more exciting ways or perhaps diversify their offerings to attract a broader audience.

Cannes Film Festival Fashion Highlights

Lauren and Scott then reflect on the Cannes Film Festival, commenting on standout and underwhelming styles.

Lauren Sherman ([30:11]):
"Rooney Mara and Joaquin Phoenix were the highlights. Their chemistry was electric."

Scott Sternberg ([30:21]):
"Rooney looked amazing in a white Givenchy dress, and Joaquin in a Givenchy tuxedo was equally impressive."
31:15

They praise the couple's fashion choices, noting how their outfits complemented their dynamic presence. Additionally, they discuss the challenges fashion brands face in standing out amidst the plethora of high-quality red carpet looks.

Addressing Menswear Fit Issues

A significant portion of the conversation addresses the widespread issue of ill-fitting men's clothing and offers practical advice.

Lauren Sherman ([31:40]):
"How can more men wear clothes that fit them? It's a huge epidemic of pants and jackets not fitting properly."

Scott Sternberg ([32:32]):
"Proportions are everything. Tailoring and understanding the silhouette are crucial. Off-the-rack options often fall short, so investing in a good tailor is essential."
33:42

Scott emphasizes the importance of personalized tailoring and understanding one’s body proportions to achieve a well-fitted wardrobe. He highlights that while fashion might seem straightforward, the intricacies of fit and proportion require attention and expertise.

Sweatpants and the Entire World Brand

Towards the episode's conclusion, Lauren brings up the topic of sweatpants, referencing a New York Times article titled "Sweatpants Forever," and discusses the resurgence and challenges of the Entire World brand.

Lauren Sherman ([43:48]):
"Are there any sweatpants that you would recommend? Especially considering the nostalgia around Entire World."

Scott Sternberg ([43:51]):
"I wish I had recommendations, but I don't currently own any sweatpants. They’re just not a focus for me."
43:55

Despite his limited experience with sweatpants, Scott shares insights into what makes a good sweatpant, drawing from his time with Entire World.

Scott Sternberg ([44:36]):
"The perfect sweatpant starts with sublime fabric and a silhouette that drapes well. Seasonal variations are crucial—winter sweatpants are fleece, while spring/summer styles are loopback."
44:36

He underscores the importance of fabric quality and design versatility to elevate sweatpants beyond mere loungewear.

Conclusion

In this episode, Fashion People offers a comprehensive look into current fashion industry dynamics, from high-stakes creative appointments to practical fashion advice. Lauren Sherman and Scott Sternberg provide valuable perspectives on maintaining brand heritage while innovating and addressing everyday fashion challenges.

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Notable Quotes:

• Scott Sternberg (07:23):
  "The overall effect of all this movement at the same time... makes them all feel very vulnerable and too similar."

• Lauren Sherman (12:57):
  "I think his clientele will come with him from Valentino. Even if they are still buying Valentino, sure, they will come to Balenciaga."

• Scott Sternberg (20:03):
  "Burberry has franchises other houses would envy, but infusing them with energy and making them culturally relevant is tough."

• Scott Sternberg (32:32):
  "Proportions are everything. Tailoring and understanding the silhouette are crucial."

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Timestamp References:

• Introduction: 00:00 – 03:27
• Pierpaolo Piccioli's Appointment: 03:23 – 09:36
• Burberry's Strategy: 12:57 – 27:02
• Cannes Film Festival: 29:36 – 41:56
• Menswear Fit Issues: 31:40 – 34:24
• Sweatpants Discussion: 43:48 – 45:43

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This summary captures the essence of the "Sweatpants (Are Not) Forever" episode, highlighting key discussions and insights shared by Lauren Sherman and Scott Sternberg. For a more in-depth understanding, listening to the full episode is recommended.

Transcript

[Lauren Sherman]

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[Scott Sternberg]

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[Lauren Sherman]

The vet bill for whatever your pet.

[Scott Sternberg]

Swallowed after you yelled drop it.

[Lauren Sherman]

Hello and welcome to Fashion People. I'm Lauren Sherman, writer of Puck's Fashion and beauty Memo line sheet and today with me on the show is designer Scott Stone Sternberg. We're talking best and worst dressed at the Cannes Film Festival, Pierre Paolo at Balenciaga, turning around Burberry and sweatpants. Happy Tuesday everyone. I hope to see you tonight for Puck Stories of the Season Emmys event in Hollywood. I am going to be interviewing Parker Posey. I probably will not get a party girl reference in there. I apologize. I'm going to try Matt Bellany, our author of what I'm Hearing and the host of the Town the Great Ringer podcast and he is also the chief architect of this whole thing. He is interviewing John Mulaney for a live recording of the town. So if you. I hope I see you are you. I guess you'll listen to it later. Anyway, this week online sheet you can read more about Pierre Paolo Piccioli's appointment at Valencia. I'm really trying, people. A preview of Chanel's latest financial report which is being announced this week. It's the 2024 numbers, my best dressed take from Cannes Film Festival, which Scott and I are going to get into here. But I have something a little more in depth and a whole lot more. So let's just get going with Scott. I know that's what you want me to do. Scott Sternberg, welcome to Fashion People.

[Scott Sternberg]

Lauren Sherman. Thank you.

[Lauren Sherman]

What's going on?

[Scott Sternberg]

I just got back from New York, so I'm a little groggy and jet laggy.

[Lauren Sherman]

I know that a mutual friend of ours saw you there. So I heard you were in New York.

[Scott Sternberg]

Yeah, we had a nice, nice dinner.

[Lauren Sherman]

I think you may. Oh, it was someone else that you ran into. I don't know if you had dinner with this person, but I think you may see this person at the Puck Stories of the season event tonight, which you are now on the hook to go to because I am mentioning it.

[Scott Sternberg]

I will be there. I don't know who you're talking about. You're being cryptic. But I'm excited to see Robert Chu. Oh, yeah?

[Lauren Sherman]

Did you run into him? Yes, he'll be there. It's okay. He'll be excited that I mentioned him.

[Scott Sternberg]

Fantastic.

[Lauren Sherman]

I don't know who the mutual friend is, but we can discuss offline.

[Scott Sternberg]

Yeah.

[Lauren Sherman]

How was New York? Was it muggy and yucky and you wanted to get back?

[Scott Sternberg]

It was a rough week. I had a shoot a day and I had the dog. I couldn't find anybody to watch him and it was rainy and muggy and I hate to sound like a whiner, but it was not New York's best moment for me, to say the least.

[Lauren Sherman]

The best New York is when the weather is bad because it reminds you why you don't live there.

[Scott Sternberg]

Oh, yeah. I mean, listen, and then the flight back is great because you're home, but I'm going back in less than a week, so.

[Lauren Sherman]

Me too.

[Scott Sternberg]

Oh, nice.

[Lauren Sherman]

Yeah, I'll see you there. We are having another event there that I think you were not overlapping, but I'll. I'll give you the details offline. Be fun. So we are here to talk today. This is a big news day in fashion. This on Monday morning. The announcement that was kind of brewing for the past week, people sort of knew that Pierre Paolo Piccioli. Is that how you. I need to find out how to pronounce it. Actually. Piccioli is the new creative director of Balenciaga. This was something that had sort of been brewing and I heard something early last week. Then it started to seep onto the Internet rumor mills and by the end of last week, it seemed pretty sure that he was. From what I know, this was not something. This is the last couple months this decision was made. It wasn't something that happened prior to Demna being announced at Gucci. So it's not like he's been waiting in the wings, which is interesting. And I have a lot more in line sheet on Monday and probably will do a little follow up on Tuesdays depending on what happens. But what's your initial reaction to this?

[Scott Sternberg]

Listen, I think he's wonderful. He's fantastic. He has great taste. He has a clear point of view. I love what he did at Valentino, especially after Maria Grazie left. It became so laser sharp. I think the meh is more of zooming out. Like the overall effect of all this movement at the same time, I don't think is a very good look for all these big global businesses and brands. To me, it just makes them all feel very vulnerable and too similar. You know, you start to question, like, what really are these houses about? If these codes are just floating between them freely all the time. But I just quickly scanned Vanessa's piece in the Times and she made some good points. I mean, you know, he's talented. Let's see. It's just the whole picture of it is a little. Is a little odd to me.

[Lauren Sherman]

Yeah, I won't be reading Vanessa's piece until mine is published because I don't like to be. I don't like to get other people in my head. But the thing, this is what I use the word gentle because it's like this is the end of this and this designer musical chairs thing, as you know, this happens every decade or so. It feels more pronounced now because there are more brands, there's more money and it's much more. The information's more instantaneous. So we process it more quick, quickly. But this was sort of a very gentle end to that. This round of chairs. There's obviously Fendi is still open, but that doesn't really. And it's interesting that he was very much top of mind for Fendi up until probably late last year. So I think he is, you know, he's a couturier he's an incredible dressmaker. I've been to his couture shows, which is. I haven't been to that many and I feel really lucky. He's. He is truly a remarkable designer and I think you're right about taste. One thing I was talking about with an executive over at Kering is that he is actually very good at image as well, which is something that is, it's not missing at Balenciaga, but it. He'll be able to create a new visual identity pretty quickly. And also, I mean, the biggest thing to me is that his clientele will come with him from Valentino. Even if they are still buying Valentino, sure, they will come to Balenciaga. I think that you're right though in that this isn't something. It's not going to move the markets and maybe it wouldn't have anyway because Balenciaga is like an under $2 billion a year business. But it's not, it doesn't feel like the future like Jonathan Anderson and Matthew Blaz Blasi feel like the future. And if they do, well, it could mean something big. But right now it still feels like is the industry in a sort of pattern and there's going to be movement at the end of this year and move into a new phase or is the industry starting to enter its decline? And that's a question for me.

[Scott Sternberg]

Yeah, listen, it's cyclical, so it's probably on that arc of the circle, right. Which is going down because it's necessary. There has to be some sort of correction. It's been kind of obscene just how much fashion is part of culture and it doesn't necessarily equate with what the output is. Right. I think both of us probably get more excited about idea driven designers where the ideas aren't as much about clothes necessarily, but about clothes and where they fit in society now. So like Mucha and Jonathan Anderson and Demna and to some extent Matthew, but he's sort of in the middle. To me he's really a materials aesthete, artisanal sort of guy. Like Peter Raph is more of the idea guy. But it's interesting to go for Balenciaga, which was an idea driven brand kind of by off of that, a meme kind of driven brand, really a luxury merch business, I would guess to whatever this is going to sort of trickle down into in terms of the ideas that Pierpaolo's putting out there, it will certainly be beautiful. The couture will certainly be, you know, stunning. And I I love all that. I think that's great. And maybe all those ideas will Demna Darkness will translate over to Gucci, but I have a feeling he'll pull the rug out from under us and surprise us all. Cause that's part of his playbook. But you know, all the best. It's just the overall effect is. And maybe I'm a cynic, you know, I'm in it, we're in it. But the overall effect is a little bit of a bummer to me. Somehow it's not so exciting. Like, I would have liked to see Junya or Mark, you know, like somebody really who. Like Junya especially. Really a thinker in there. If you're gonna go, I don't know, go somewhere or Jun Takahashi or Chitoseabe, you know.

[Lauren Sherman]

Yes, yes.

[Scott Sternberg]

Jun would be amazing.

[Lauren Sherman]

Yeah. That's one that I've never understood why he hasn't. But maybe I do think there's something to not wanting it. And some people coming from a culture that like very. I don't know of any of those Japanese designers who have taken one of those jobs.

[Scott Sternberg]

Kenzo.

[Lauren Sherman]

Kenzo, yes. Well, Kenzo was Kenzo. Right?

[Scott Sternberg]

It was Kenzo. That's right.

[Lauren Sherman]

Yeah.

[Scott Sternberg]

Sorry.

[Lauren Sherman]

But yeah, it's a good. I mean, it's a. It was in. He was in the system at least.

[Scott Sternberg]

Yeah. Parisian brand.

[Lauren Sherman]

Yeah.

[Scott Sternberg]

Different thing, different time.

[Lauren Sherman]

But yeah, I think it's all. Look, I think one of the big things is that Valentino was most successful when there was a really robust accessories program supporting Pierre Paolo and. And Maria Grazia when they were together. Because she's a great accessories designer. I think what Valencia Aga has done the last two years and the CEO, the deputy CEO, the woman, Natalie Nathalie Ren. I'm just not trying.

[Scott Sternberg]

Crashing and burning.

[Lauren Sherman]

I'm not trying. Who was just named deputy CEO. She's. She's the chief merchant. She's created this accessories program around Demna that feels of Demna but is separate. And I think if they're able to sort of manage that around him and manage the. The menswear part is the piece that I think is challenging because he was. I don't know. I have no insight into whether or not Valentino Menswear performed very well. I bet suiting was. Did okay, but I don't think that's his strong suit. He did some amazing. Actually he did some amazing collaborations with Undercover for men's that were awesome. But I think generally the. The market, the critical response to the menswear wasn't as strong and It's a big menswear business, so I think that's gonna be a challenge. And yeah, I think, look, I thought Peter Mueller would be great because I love him and I think he's interesting and I am a consumer of his clothing, so I was excited for that. But that said, he's great where he's.

[Scott Sternberg]

At, what a good match. You know, like, this idea of people staying somewhere for a long time to me is kind of radical and refreshing.

[Lauren Sherman]

Yes.

[Scott Sternberg]

And to your other point, listen, I think, I think a lot of the job of this working can't all be on a creative director or in a bunch of design jobs. It's really a merchandising exercise and extrapolating a set of ideas. And this isn't cynical, but I think part of it, whether it's from a design perspective or a kind of culture driven perspective, the creative director's job is to kind of create a whirlwind of something we all want to be a part of. Right. Like, and even me, who's a cynic at this point, like, I wanted some Matthew Bottega something. I needed something, right? I needed. When Bodhi first came out, I needed to get a little bit of that. I wanted to be a part of it. And I think that's really the job in the first, you know, year. And who knows? I mean, he's great. He can, he can do it. Go Pierre Paulo.

[Lauren Sherman]

Go Pierre Paulo. Congrats. I'm happy for him.

[Scott Sternberg]

Yeah.

[Lauren Sherman]

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[Scott Sternberg]

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[Lauren Sherman]

Ebay is the place for pre loved and vintage fashion. EBay, things people love. I'm Emma Greed and I've spent the last 20 years building, running and investing in some incredible businesses. The more success I've had, the more people started coming to me with questions. How do you start a business? How do you raise money? How do I bounce back from failure? On my new podcast, Aspire with Em. Agreed, I'll be answering these questions and more through weekly conversations with the small, smartest minds out there. Listen to and follow Aspire with Emma Greed, an Odyssey podcast. Available now wherever you get Your podcasts. So, moving on to another brand that seems to be keeping its creative director, Daniel Lee, at Burberry. The CEO, Joshua Schulman, did an interview with WWD where I don't know if he said he's staying. I didn't see that in quotes, but that was the headline. He's staying. I went to this event at. Which was. The event was very interesting at Flamingo Estate on Friday night. They had a dinner, I think, at the store somewhere with, like, really fancy people afterwards. But there was a kind of a casual event with Burberry at Flamingo Estate, but it was for their collaboration with Highgrove, which is the summer house estate of Charles and Camilla, which. Which. The reason I need to tell you about this is a. I mean, you've been to Flamingo Estate a million times. It's so beautiful. And I had a really nice time.

[Scott Sternberg]

Was it a Flamingo event or a Flamingo? Richard just rented out his house.

[Lauren Sherman]

It was connected to Flamingo. The gift was a Burberry Flamingo Estate box, essentially, with a Flamingo Estate charcoal soap that says Burberry. Because I handed it to my husband and I said, do you want this or should we give it to someone? And he took it, and now it's in our shower. And I was like, what? Oh, fine. And then some honey that is flavored rose, so I won't be partaking in it. But that was specific for Burberry. And then the book, the Flamingo Estate book. So. And Richard was there, and the person that he gets to cook a lot, who I have a mutual friend with, who's apparently amazing, was there. Like, they had amazing stuff. It was a really lovely, lovely event. And the funniest part of it that someone mentioned to me is that there. It's like King Charles Estate. And then Meghan Markle had all that stuff with Flamingo Estate and all this. Everyone who thinks that there was some sort of conspiracy behind this, I don't think that Highgrove had any idea about any of these guys. It was just Burberry being like, it's a garden. It sounds lovely. But the thing that was interesting to me and what I wanna know from you, as a designer and a product guy and a creative director, everyone was dressed in Burberry. They were gifted. A lot of people were gifted. The collection's really beautiful. It's like painterly. Can get a trench with, like, a painterly silk lining, that type of stuff.

[Scott Sternberg]

I'm looking at it right now.

[Lauren Sherman]

Yes, it's cute. But. But the other thing was they just had everyone in Burberry. And my whole thing is that I think what Josh Shulman should be focusing on is make everybody think they need a trench in the same way everybody thinks they need a Montclair puffer. And the Burberry trench in some ways is even more versatile because you can wear one in all different weather. And also it's just like a classic thing. And if you're not going to buy it full price from them, buy a vintage one. And I don't know, I love them. But what is your opinion about like what should happen with Burberry and how they should approach this? Because they, they are like the market is responding favorably to everything. Right now he's in cost cutting mode. But they had one of the little anecdotes in the earnings report was that the, they had double digit increases for like wholesale interest in the collection, that type of thing. So they are turning a corner. Whether or not that will be like a year long corner or a five year long corner is another question. But what do you think Burberry should be?

[Scott Sternberg]

Yeah, it's so loaded. I think, listen, I think they have a set of franchises that other houses would be envious of. Right. But how to kind of infuse those with some energy and infuse that energy into the larger culture, that's a real tough thing. You can't totally control the cultural dialogue. It's sort of like surfing a wave. Right. And what I've seen from Burberry is some great vibes on their social channels. Right. They're picking up some British humor and, and the visuals look good and the feeling is modern. Right. But I think what you said about the trends. Yes, sure. But that's a long lead. One that's not something you do with a few product placements and a phone call that's like TV and film and that's going to take time to kind of seep in. I think to me their biggest challenge is their house check is so played out and it's a big franchise. But I see it everywhere, all over their site and it doesn't feel appealing. It feels played out. And maybe this is my age again, but I see Burberry London and it should have one less zero on the price point. It's really hard for me to see a $700 bikini and a tan house check from Burberry. It just, it's a merchandising issue. It's not hard for me to see a collaboration that's super craft driven and artisanal that Did a play on that check that was all made by hand, and it was $10,000 or something. But I don't think that franchise is being handled correctly personally. And even from a trench perspective, they're quite expensive. I don't see the kind of entry level. So it's hard for me to totally, fully accept Burberry at the price point that it's at. That would be my first comment, you know, just based on the heritage and history of. Of the house, at least in the last 40 years. But that being said, I. And I think, you know, as a fashion brand, it's always a little odd. I think Christopher Bailey nailed it, and you didn't realize he was nailing it at the time, but it just felt right. And he was. Really. Well, because it wasn't like everybody was wearing it. That's the thing. Right. But at least in the States, Becky.

[Lauren Sherman]

Malinsky claims that people were wearing the dresses.

[Scott Sternberg]

Maybe. I don't know. The men's shows were so good. And I had a porsom bag. I got a Barney's. You know, I wanted to. Because I wanted to be part of it. Like, it's the same thing where you want to be part of it, and it's, well, merchandise on the business side. So enough of us have things that we can buy to be part of it, and it drives the business. But what he was doing was what, at least at the time, the Playbook was great. There was a different distinct narrative every season that could play out across a global network of stories and wholesale partners, and it kept things going and sold all those franchises. And I think Daniel Lee's amazing. What he did at Bottega was incredible. That vibe shift, that tonal shift, I don't quite. I'm not quite seeing it at the Met, it felt heavy and plodding and not modern. And I didn't know what all that velvet stuff was. And it also felt too, like everybody was matchy, and I just didn't get it. It felt like somebody's trying to make Burberry happen too hard. So, you know, I actually think it's a product thing. I just trolled the site this morning because you told me we were talking about it, and I just don't see a lot of stuff. I don't know who's buying this stuff at that price point. The wit I'm seeing in the content, I'm not seeing in the small accessories. It's not quite come together. It just feels too serious or something. I don't know.

[Lauren Sherman]

To a steerer, I think that the Czech. The tartan or whatever. It's a really good point because I want everybody to want a Burberry trench. And there was a check that they did that was a little different that I linked to in Mondays of a trench that I thought was really beautiful. But, yeah, I think the other thing is that a lot of people are gonna come through secondhand for this, which is fine. But the only way that's fine is if you have a product at full price that is also desirable. So maybe the customer first buys a trench on Etsy that's probably fake or something to get into it, and then is. Trades up and that part of it, if you don't, you're right. And also, if they had a trench that was, I think $1,100 at this point would be. If that was what it was. That's actually. People would buy that. It's when you start to get into. I think everybody right now is just like, oh, my God, everything is $4,000 that is designer. And if you are buying that stuff. A friend of mine wanted to buy a Miu Miu dress that was cotton. It's $4,000.

[Scott Sternberg]

It's bonkers. It's bonkers.

[Lauren Sherman]

It's a tiny little. And it's sold out. I mean, they probably just had one each, but. Or two of each, but it sold out. She couldn't even buy it because I was like, if you can get it for. I guess if you can get it for 2300 and you're going to wear it every day this summer, it's okay, but it's getting nuts.

[Scott Sternberg]

This is what's. What happens to our brains. No, it's. It's pretty. It's pretty silly. And listen, I think Burberry, yeah, at the high end, with the right level of craft or artistry or collaboration or whatever, can command super high prices. But a trench is, for better or worse, somewhat of a commodity culturally. And from a merchandising perspective, at this point, it's not something they can own anymore as their own. Or if they're going to own it, they need to wildly reinterpret it at the high end in much more exciting ways. Like Montclair does. I mean, the genius program still, I think about some of those. But Pierre Paulo, when he did that, that was sick. So good. And the presentation of it was so good. And it was. It stuck. So I think that's where the job is. And so when I see, like, shows and I see red carpet, it's like, I don't Even think you should be playing in that field as much like play with these, play with the iconography in the franchises outside of the traditional fashion and kind of celebrity, you know, mediums, platforms and you know, come at it from the outside even more. I think that would be my marketing approach at least.

[Lauren Sherman]

Yeah, the, the thing that I keep thinking with Daniel Lee is give it one more season because I did think this past collection was much improved in terms of. It felt like, gave me a sense of the Christopher Bailey era. It looked like it was designed for Anna Wintour, which, you know, and, and fine. But I think the thing that I keep going back to is I don't know who Daniel Lee is. I, I know what that Bottega was which was so sharp that I bought it ended up becoming too trendy for me. But I bought something from the pre collection that was. I ended. I actually just sold it. It was this great collar before everybody was making those collarless jackets.

[Scott Sternberg]

I saw that. I made you try that on for me.

[Lauren Sherman]

That blazer's good. I sold it. It was too stiff. I never wore it. But what he did, it was very clear. And that was probably a mix of him and the team, but it was so clear ultimately.

[Scott Sternberg]

Yeah, there was this sort of bougie, 70s, early 80s Italian lady walking to, you know, get her nails done vibe. Like it was, it was cool and weird and obtuse and specific. The Burberry stuff. Now I don't know. I just don't. Again, like he's super talented, but it doesn't feel of the moment. I don't know. And I don't know what moment it's going for.

[Lauren Sherman]

No. Exactly. This episode is brought to you by Amazon Prime. From streaming to shopping, prime helps you get more out of your passions. So whether you're a fan of true crime or prefer a nail biting novel from time to time, with services like Prime Video, Amazon Music and fast free delivery, prime makes it easy to get more out of whatever you're into or getting into. Visit Amazon.comprime to learn more.

[Scott Sternberg]

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[Lauren Sherman]

So moving on to can Cannes Film Festival. It's been a little. A little boring without the nudity. I was actually, when I first heard that they were making the dress code even stricter, allowing no nudity and no long trains, I was actually, like, secretly kind of liked it because I just. I'm like, give them. Give people a box. Give people restraints. But what I will say is it's been a kind of a. Other than Rooney Mara and Joaquin Phoenix.

[Scott Sternberg]

How good?

[Lauren Sherman]

I can't handle it. It was so good.

[Scott Sternberg]

My girl Rooney, she looked amazing.

[Lauren Sherman]

But he also looked.

[Scott Sternberg]

I agree.

[Lauren Sherman]

What happened? He suddenly is like a top 10 in terms of attractive Hollywood actors.

[Scott Sternberg]

Well, first of all, his weight was going back and forth for roles he was taking. So he was like, you know, for the joker, he. It was. Well, for the joker, he was like nothing. And then he was getting pudgy for something. For Bo is afraid. So I think he's found his happy body medium. But no, he looks great. He's attractive. And I think the two of them together, they're so into each other. They, like, they're electric.

[Lauren Sherman]

You can feel it. Yeah, you can. There was like a photo of them walking and I was like, I know, I know. And then I tried to look it up and you couldn't find it forever. And I was just like, I don't understand.

[Scott Sternberg]

Yeah.

[Lauren Sherman]

They are seriously my number one couple now. I can't take it.

[Scott Sternberg]

I know. I'm obsessed. And the thing about Rooney is, like, she always gets photographed looking so serious and, like, daggers at the camera. She's actually quite a smiley, sweet person. And when you see those off photos, like you're talking about where she's just beaming with Joaquin, you really get a sense of her. The clothes even look better. Yeah, but, yeah, no, I. She was. She was top five for me for sure.

[Lauren Sherman]

I'm so into it. She was wearing white Givenchy. He was wearing a Givenchy tux. Really quickly, can we talk about how. How can more men wear clothes that fit them? Because it's a huge epidemic of, like, pants not fitting and jackets not fitting. As someone. You're a menswear designer by trade. How do you. And also you fit a lot of. When you were doing Band of Outsiders, you were dressing a lot of guys who. Short, tall, whatever. Not like, mostly shorter guys, but guys who weren't. It's not Joaquin Phoenix at this moment in time fit like anything is going to fit that guy. At this point, I don't know what happened. It's Very. I'm very taken aback by. But generally, what are some rules for people?

[Scott Sternberg]

Listen, it's really challenging with Band. It worked from a celebrity dressing perspective. The severity of the silhouette and fit sort of created a box around who would come to us for clothes. And generally, you know, we would really only work with who it made sense to work with. You know, Tom Brown. Sometimes it goes the other way and it looks completely ridiculous on the wrong guy.

[Lauren Sherman]

Yeah.

[Scott Sternberg]

And sometimes it looks really hot. But it's tough. You know, you think men's dressing is so simple, but proportions are everything. And especially if a guy has a long or short torso, it really starts to get confusing. And anything off the rack has to really be rethought. Like where a jacket breaks on. A guy with a short torso could really make or break that. That kind of look. It's. It's just all about. It's all about tailoring and silhouette. And as fat men's fashion has gotten more fashion with a capital F, it's like, even harder. Right. Because there's just. There's. There's big ideas out there for guys. You know, get a good tailor on site and, you know, don't try to wear a sample off the rack. That's my. That's my suggestion.

[Lauren Sherman]

I think everyone should talk to Seth Rogen because he. His clothes always fit on the studio. They look amazing. And the costume designer is making. It's mostly custom, but I think he works with Wendy and Nicole, the stylist. He always looks great. And he's not like, he's just a dude. His clothes fit him.

[Scott Sternberg]

Yeah. And he looks good. It's not boring. But he's also, like, not going to. He's just. Listen, he's going. They understand his personality or he knows how to say no. You know, when it starts to be this mismatch between the two is when it gets cringy. And it really does get cringy.

[Lauren Sherman]

So anything it can. That you really loved or really hated.

[Scott Sternberg]

Okay. I love Jennifer Lawrence in that kind of plise Dior. Same kind of. You know, when she pulls that hair back and that little chignon and has a red lip, like kind of that Oscars moment. She looks perfect. Conversely, she looked like Dorothy Spornak on the line with the Golden Girls. In the soft look with the skirt for the press thing. It was shocking. Right. So that was a good sort of do's and don'ts moment. Isabelle Huppert is always, like, tops at Ken. Like, she's the.

[Lauren Sherman]

She's the one in the green Balenciaga.

[Scott Sternberg]

Yeah.

[Lauren Sherman]

Yeah.

[Scott Sternberg]

There was a couple other things. She's always. Somehow she's completely covered up, but she looks. And she's not young and she looks so sexy and sick every time, you know, I want to get poor Emma Stone out of that Vuitton contract. It's so depressing. Jesus Christ.

[Lauren Sherman]

This one was. There's no excuse because the, the thing I will say is that the Vuitton stuff has gotten a little. I, I think has improved dramatically over the past three or four years. Where, where there are some beautiful things and, and there are. Jennifer Connelly could have probably worn that dress and looked cool. I, I mean, I'm being generous, but I thought that that mint green dress that Emma Stone wore that broke for the Oscars, I like that. I can handle it.

[Scott Sternberg]

But that wasn't very Even house coded, though. That could have been from five different houses. There's that whole world of stuff. It's that more. It's more Balenciaga, actually. It's. It's part of the, it's part of the red carpet rotation and that's fine. But it's very. It's the Vuitton red carpets of overall. Emma Stone back in the day, Michelle Williams was sort of caught in that loop. I'm sure it's a big check that's hard to say no to. But it's weird to me because on the house end, it's. There's not really brand codes that are being kind of cultivated or fostered. And on the side of the celebrity, it just feels like a miss. It's like, I want, I want more for you, Emma Stone, you're so cute and your hair looks really good right now. Like, go somewhere else. Go other. Eat also. You just feel like a billboard. And we get it, get it, get your money. But like, I don't know.

[Lauren Sherman]

Well, it's a challenge because I don't think Nicolas Gasker, he obviously engages and cares. He has these deep relationships with certain people. And I think when he has the, when, when it's the right person, it can kind of work. But it's also kind of comes back to like, what are these houses for? And what should they focus on? I think Balenciaga has actually done a really incred job in the last two years of doing traditional red carpet. But somehow. And the construction, you can just tell is so good, but somehow twisting it just a little bit that it doesn't feel totally separate from what Demna does. And I don't think, I think the Vuitton has gotten Better. And you're right. The stuff that I think is better, like what A lot of the stuff the Heim sisters have been wearing more recently is not of Nicolas Gaskerre. Like, it feels separate and so. And it was interesting. Cynthia Revill wore Givenchy. She used to be have a Vuitton contract to the Met, and she looked incredible. And she actually had pulled off a lot of the Vuitton stuff. I mean, she just looks amazing. She works with Jason Bolton. I think they have a really good relationship, and she just kills it. But I do think it comes back to this idea of, like, what should it be? And it's interesting. I think Celine does a very good job at the. This is. I mean, this is such a backhanded compliment. But of the generic red carpet stuff, they had a Alexa Chung wore this Celine dress that I was like, if I was going to do some. If I had to do something like this, it's what I would want to wear.

[Scott Sternberg]

Yeah. No. And then this. Listen, even the ready to wear in the store, it's the same thing where it's exactly how that you want that vintage piece to be reinterpreted. And it's. It's really so, so good. What I miss is. And this is not nostalgia. This is just something I always loved about fashion, is that relationship between a designer, Givenchy, and an actor, artist, Audrey Hepburn, whatever it is. And there's more modern examples of that. Albert and Natalie Portman or Emma Stone. At the time, they really felt like. Or McKelly has this with his women. Like, it really felt like there was a dialogue and a real kind of alchemy of ideas and body and design coming together. And a lot of what this feels like is just sort of just like this slapping on these rails of samples and just slapping stuff on it. Listen, this is not to insult the designers, because there's good stuff, or the stylists, because they're working their butts off and they're doing a great job, but there's just something missing from it.

[Lauren Sherman]

Yeah. It is so challenging to get this stuff right. And so I will say Givenchy in the early Sarah Burton era has really nailed it. I thought Diane Kruger. It was interesting seeing the Runway look on someone. I thought she looked fun.

[Scott Sternberg]

Which one was that?

[Lauren Sherman]

She wore the, like, yellow blazer dress with the big bow.

[Scott Sternberg]

It was cold.

[Lauren Sherman]

Yeah. It was fun. And it was.

[Scott Sternberg]

She can do that. She's cool that way.

[Lauren Sherman]

Yeah. I just think she's nailed it. Like, she is. It is working on the red carpet. They're they're being very careful. They're picking the right people. And then they are also tailoring the stuff to fit and look good and all of that. But which is. It is just really hard to get it right. And especially at these bigger houses. I thought Dior this time you totally nailed it with the Jennifer Lawrence thing that, please say dress was incredible. And I thought she looked great. And then the casual thing, why it didn't so. But Dior, I thought Juliette Bonoche, she wore this hooded pants with a hooded top and it was beautiful. And I also found Natalie Portman's. It was very standard.

[Scott Sternberg]

But the little tiny thing.

[Lauren Sherman]

Yes. I mean, I thought she looked. I thought she looked great. And it's hard when you're, when you're doing. They'll probably do 100. 100 looks. This film festival that never ends, it's like, no, totally.

[Scott Sternberg]

I mean, but that's also like, you know, that's why the whole effort starts to become. For the big houses, go for it. You know, Kate and Laura at Rodarte here in LA working their ass off on all this red carpet stuff. I feel for them because they do these stunning pieces and sometimes they just get completely diluted in this sea of stunning pieces. And the Givenchy stuff, to your point, like that yellow concoction really stood out. I didn't realize that was Givenchy, but Rooney looked good at that Vogue World PR thing. Taylor Russell looks so good in that Runway kind of blazer dress. It's really sick. Yeah.

[Lauren Sherman]

Okay, moving on. I had one final question for you. The strategist did this and of course I thought of you. The strategist did this. So you had another brand called Entire World, which by the way, at my son's four year birthday party last weekend, one of the moms. I had an Entire World shirt on. It was one with a stamp. It was the black shirt with white buttons and it has the stamp. And she said, I still miss that brand. It is. The LA millennial woman was very into Entire World. So you had the second brand that was Fast and Furious and it was very well known, very known for its sweat suits, sweatpants. And there was this amazing New York Times article by our friend Irene Alexander called Sweatpants Forever. Everyone should read it. I linked to it in the newsletter on Monday. But this past week there was a strategist piece. But this dude was like, I tried all these sweatpants. The best ones that I've tried were a pair of $40 sweatpants from Uniqlo. But then the other things were just There were all these different ideas of which ones you should, what, which ones you shouldn't. And it was very funny because last night my husband was going through his clothes because I was like, you have too many clothes. You have to get rid of some. And he found some entire world item that he had never worn. And I hear this a lot. Like, Rebecca Ramsey, our friend who's a stylist. She has a white sweatsuit that she's saving that she hasn't touched. My question for you is, are there any sweatpants that you would. Because you probably have a bunch, and you probably have unlimited entire world forever.

[Scott Sternberg]

But I do not. I wish I did.

[Lauren Sherman]

Okay.

[Scott Sternberg]

But I have enough sweatpants to be wearing, and I have no clue.

[Lauren Sherman]

You don't.

[Scott Sternberg]

I could not tell you in the marketplace what. What to buy. I. I do have some stuff in the plastic. It's funny. I saw Jenny Slade at Irina's kid's first birthday a couple weeks ago, and she was like, I still have, like, five camisoles and matching underwear sets in the plastic. My neighbor Luke at Silvertop has Band of Outsiders polo shirts still in the plastic, which warms the cockles of my heart. But the last thing I want to look at or comp shot for right now, Lauren Sherman, is sweatpants.

[Lauren Sherman]

What makes a good sweatpant?

[Scott Sternberg]

I mean, my approach at entire world, it started with this fabric we developed in Japan, and it was just sublime fabric that took color really well because it was all about color. So then you kind of get a silhouette that drapes off of that. Ours were tapered at the bottom because it was kind of light and drapey. Depends what you're doing. A winter sweatpant and a spring summer sweatpant are completely, completely different things. One's a fleece, one's a loopback. Terry I For. For overall, the perfect, like, gray marl, like, vintage Russell Athletics kind of vibe for entire world. We use, we started with Nicole's root. Like vintage roots, women's or maybe they were men's that she wore that she was always wearing as a base, and then sort of adjusted those for the fabric and kind of tweak them from there. So maybe roots.

[Lauren Sherman]

Try roots. Let's ask Nicole. Or go to Canada. I don't know if they're shipping in the US at the moment.

[Scott Sternberg]

Oh, God.

[Lauren Sherman]

Scott Sternberg, thanks for being here.

[Scott Sternberg]

You got it.

[Lauren Sherman]

I'll see you later.

[Scott Sternberg]

Okay, bye.

[Lauren Sherman]

Fashion People is a presentation of Odyssey in partnership with Puck. This show was produced and edited by Mock Molly Nugent. Special thanks to our executive producers, Puck co founder John Kelly, executive editor Ben Landy and director of editorial operations Gabby Grossman. An additional thanks to the team at Odyssey, JD Crowley, Jenna Weiss Berman and Bob Tabador.